Formastane and the Ladies

[animale66]

Hello all -

I have a friend of mine who is female and a figure competitor. She's currently offseason with no specific plans to compete anytime coming up, but has recently come off birth control and has expressed concerns with her retaining a lot of water. I'm no expert mind you (I normally don't coach or work with a lot of girls), but given where she's holding water I'm suspecting her estrogen is a bit high (her ass, a bit on the upper arm, and seems to have a little sag in her triceps).

She's about 5'5 and ~30 years old. She's natural, and would like to stay that way. She's in good shape.

My thought is to put her on something mild like formastane (which is essentially an AI, but I've heard it has SERM like qualities to it) in order to take the edge off and get her motivated about the gym again. What do you all think? Do you have a better recommendation? Any special guidance on dosage for the ladies?

Thanks all!

 

[sassy69]

I'm gonna go w/ no. I don't know a lot about this particular AI, but generally these things exist for breast cancer treatment, frequently in post-menopausal breast cancer patients where the only source of estrogen is from aromatization of adrenal testosterone, or for men who are using a steroid that aromatizes to reduce impact of additional estrogen introduced to their systems. The issue tho, is, esp for women, this is an extremely aggressive approach to estrogen suppression. So what you're proposing to do is the following:

- she's recently off birth control - which means the source of what is frequently increased estrogen levels, is removed from her system. Normally an OB/GYN will tell you there can be up to 3 months of your body getting itself back to normal after being under the influence of a birth control. This is similar to what would be expected if a woman were switching a birth control - just takes a few months for the body to find its pace again w/ the different influence in place. In this case, it's the removal of an external influence. So it's just part of the deal - you need to allow some time for the body to readjust itself to it's new "norm". But the removal of BC from the picture, should actually be an improvement in the effects of estrogen once that transition period has passed. Since you don't note how long it has been specifically, I would still say give it a month or two things should settle down.

- But you are proposing to throw in an aggressive suicide AI. IMO this is introducing an extreme in the other direction which I expect will produce a reduction in the water retention, but will probably go further and remove the smaller degree of estrogen-driven water that is good for joint protection, etc. The result of this can actually be the extreme of "no water", where you start getting joint pain. And then she would still have to come off this AI and plan on experiencing yet another rebound, potentially even more extreme.

I would just try an OTC diuretic like Dandelion Root, watch the diet to remove sources of water retention (e.g. reduce salty foods, processed foods, maybe do a carb cycle or something that just keeps the carbs & salt under control so more water isn't introduced. And then just give it some weeks to work itself out. If there is increase in estrogenic effects while things are getting settled, you can also include OTC estrogen balancers like DIM, evening primrose oil, etc.

Generally, and especially for women, it is not easy to modulate estrogen "just a little", and most of the "anti-estrogens" out there introduce big swings when you come off. And obviously, no "anti-estrogen" is "maintenance protocol" to limit the effects of estrogen forever. Always best to just let the body get itself to homeostasis at the rate that it can accommodate.

 

[PK2]

Formestane is a hormone...
No Serm like properties..
Is an AI though, will help shed water..

 

[animale66]

Sassy - you are indeed a god on this board

Thanks - yeah, I know women are much more sensitive to compounds like this, so I'm glad I ran it thru you all. I think I'll definitely have her normalize for a bit before we try anything else. I'll do more research into the herbal solutions then and see about that route if it continues to be a problem for her.

For us guys, lethro is akin to pure grain alcohol when it comes to AIs while formastane isn't much more than a shot of Nyquil... weird how one little chromosome makes the difference.

 

[sassy69]

Sassy - you are indeed a god on this board

Thanks - yeah, I know women are much more sensitive to compounds like this, so I'm glad I ran it thru you all. I think I'll definitely have her normalize for a bit before we try anything else. I'll do more research into the herbal solutions then and see about that route if it continues to be a problem for her.

For us guys, lethro is akin to pure grain alcohol when it comes to AIs while formastane isn't much more than a shot of Nyquil... weird how one little chromosome makes the difference.

It's really more about the ratios of the sex hormones ... but it's also interesting how test seems to shut off pretty readily when exogenous test is introduced, whereas estro is just hard to control in any meaningful way - it always seems to come back w/ a vengeance (w/ the exception of those 'survival' conditions not being present - like ultra low bodyfat, very high stress, etc.).


But to what I said earlier, give it some time. Especially w/ estro, trying to force a near-term change usually costs you a lot more in the longer term. And then you start to fall into that cycle of .. I tried this.. it got worse, so now I'm gonna try this .. it got worse, .. so now I'm getting completely desperate and will do anything (ridiculous cardio, starvation diet, more aggressive drugs ranging anywhere from steroids to AIs to meth-level thermogenics & DNP). Just a little patience, let the body work itself out. The OTC diuretics (NOT used aggressively - water manipulation can also blow up in your face ..) and a little attention to diet to ensure you're not introducing shit quality carbs / fat / sodium.

 

[sassy69]

So what did you decide to do?