# to cheat or not to cheat



## jhawkin1 (Apr 28, 2009)

That is the question!  I have been doing great on my cut, but lately have come up to times where I am starving (my body saying 'you need a refeed'!).  Now the time has come...We only usually do this once a month- go out to an all-you-can-eat buffet.  I would love to go, but not tempted to, but would maybe like to get my calories way up for one meal to keep my body guessing, as well as, to giving me energy for the rest of the week to make it through my cutting cycle as well as workouts.

What would you do?  How far back will one large caloric meal put me back?

Can one not refeed or cheat and have great success cutting at a normal pace under caloric maintenance?


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## C6zo6 (Apr 28, 2009)

jhawkin1 said:


> That is the question!  I have been doing great on my cut, but lately have come up to times where I am starving (my body saying 'you need a refeed'!).  Now the time has come...We only usually do this once a month- go out to an all-you-can-eat buffet.  I would love to go, but not tempted to, but would maybe like to get my calories way up for one meal to keep my body guessing, as well as, to giving me energy for the rest of the week to make it through my cutting cycle as well as workouts.
> 
> What would you do?  How far back will one large caloric meal put me back?
> 
> Can one not refeed or cheat and have great success cutting at a normal pace under caloric maintenance?



The idea of a re-feed is to not eat 7000 calories in one sitting...I personally think your looking at this the wrong way. 

Just because your on a cut, it doesn't mean you need to eat chicken breast and salad everyday. If you want to go out to a buffet, or have a cheeseburger every now and then that's fine. As long as your in a calorie deficit, you will lose weight. Honestly, it doesn't matter what you eat...Just keep your protein at 1g per lean body mass. 

Don't go to a buffet and splurge for no reason. If you want to, go ahead, but i don't see a reason for it. You can go a little over maintenance, but why set yourself back when you can simply just have a few high calories meals/snacks? If you have a craving for a doughnut, have a doughnut. Just fit it in to your total calorie budget. It really is that simple.


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## blueboy75 (Apr 28, 2009)

C6zo6 said:


> Honestly, it doesn't matter what you eat...Just keep your protein at 1g per lean body mass.


 
Im not sure if that is good advice


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## C6zo6 (Apr 28, 2009)

blueboy75 said:


> Im not sure if that is good advice



It really is. Obviously we're assuming trans fat free foods...Don't eat like an idiot. 

I would love for to explain why a cheeseburger, or pizza is bad when protein is sufficient and your calories are in budget. 

You will get no where.


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## Whatsaroid? (Apr 28, 2009)

C6zo6 said:


> It really is. Obviously we're assuming trans fat free foods...Don't eat like an idiot.
> 
> I would love for to explain why a cheeseburger, or pizza is bad when protein is sufficient and your calories are in budget.
> 
> You will get no where.



Great point, I was going to give the same advice.

To add I cheat once a week and eat whatever I want...mind you I've eaten 8 double cheeseburgers in one sitting a few times haha. Anyway I'm still lean as the rest of my week diet/workouts are on point.


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## C6zo6 (Apr 28, 2009)

Whatsaroid? said:


> Great point, I was going to give the same advice.
> 
> To add I cheat once a week and eat whatever I want...mind you I've eaten 8 double cheeseburgers in one sitting a few times haha. Anyway I'm still lean as the rest of my week diet/workouts are on point.



Thanks. 

Eight cheeseburgers, huh? Wow, that's a little much, but like i said it doesn't matter...It's an accumulation of calories day by day, week by week, month by month, year by year. So, if you eat 10 double cheeseburgers and it fits into your diet, their is nothing wrong with that...(Although, your bound to go over your calories for the day, unless these are some small cheeseburgers, or your not eating the bread, lol)

People have to realize that pizza, cheeseburgers, and other high fat food, *is food*...The only thing different about them, is that they put all this high calorie stuff together. 

Let me put it to you this way. Do you eat cheese? Yes. Do you eat carbs? Yes. Do you eat meat? Yes. *Well, then what's wrong with pizza? Nothing... *


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## QuestionGuy (Apr 28, 2009)

it wont do shit, other than give you a good time....there is days where i have four large cheat meals on consecutive days, and that just makes me gain a couple of pounds in water weight....


I never got the "cheat meal tho", I paractice the cheat meal heavily but it seems like it always sets me back mentally and it usually takes me a couple of days to readjust to my diet mentally.......Who the hell wants to eat a dry ass piece of chicken after a night of eating tasty food and cheesecake?


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## blueboy75 (Apr 28, 2009)

Whatsaroid? said:


> Great point, I was going to give the same advice.
> 
> To add I cheat once a week and eat whatever I want...mind you I've eaten 8 double cheeseburgers in one sitting a few times haha. Anyway I'm still lean as the rest of my week diet/workouts are on point.


 
So it is okay to eat cheeseburgers whenever you want as long as it fits in with your daily calories/macros?

Just because you can eat cheeseburgers and not have any adverse reactions it may not be the case for everyone else.

Regardless of the physical impacts (or lack of) I think it is a big psychological setback when cutting to consume regular cheat meals.


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## Built (Apr 28, 2009)

I eat cheat meals, refeeds etc all through my cuts. 

It's all about the deficit. If you maintain one and you hit your minimums for protein and fat, you're golden.


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## blueboy75 (Apr 29, 2009)

Built said:


> I eat cheat meals, refeeds etc all through my cuts.
> 
> It's all about the deficit. If you maintain one and you hit your minimums for protein and fat, you're golden.


 
no argument about the calorie defecit.  What I dont think I articulated very well is the mental effect for some people when cheating - particularly people new to dieting.

I find carbs and sugar are addictive - cheating and maintaining a deficit is near impossible for me. 2300 cals per day is almost impossible when almost half is consumed in one meal which does not provide a great deal of satiety.

Built - sorry I just cant imagine you chowing down cheeseburgers. im sure you distinguish between a cheat meal and a refeed.

High carb days I can understand, especially when carb cycling.

Eating junk food regularly even if its fits in your macros I just cant understand. As a seldom treat sure, regularly does not make sense. Just does not feel heathly to me.


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## Built (Apr 29, 2009)

I love cheeseburgers. Fries, too. 

Nobody gets fat or becomes unhealthy because they have a cheeseburger and fries at McDonald's once in a while.


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## jhawkin1 (Apr 29, 2009)

I've been doing this for awhile, and this is the first time I would not mind not cheating, so I think I might make the decision not to...I just wanted to get others perspective on refeeds- just one of those paranoid cutters who needs an out every once and a while.  

When I cheat, it actually makes my cutting diet that much better the next day because I know how I felt after that crappy meal I ate.   I just sometimes need that friendly reminder!   Thanks for all your great input everyone...now it all depends on how I feel today- tired of dieting- im cheating, not tired- stickin to my guns!


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## QuestionGuy (Apr 29, 2009)

jhawkin1 said:


> I've been doing this for awhile, and this is the first time I would not mind not cheating, so I think I might make the decision not to...I just wanted to get others perspective on refeeds- just one of those paranoid cutters who needs an out every once and a while.
> 
> When I cheat, it actually makes my cutting diet that much better the next day because I know how I felt after that crappy meal I ate.   I just sometimes need that friendly reminder!   Thanks for all your great input everyone...now it all depends on how I feel today- tired of dieting- im cheating, not tired- stickin to my guns!



Im totaly not like that.....for example, my parents had a BBQ at their house and invited all the kids, so i dont want to be the only one to act like a fool and not eat so i decided to use my cheat meal that day.....but the next morning i felt like shit because i had to go back to eating chicken, it usually takes me 2 days to mentaly recover from a cheat meal because once i eat, i just want more and more...


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## C6zo6 (Apr 29, 2009)

jhawkin1 said:


> I've been doing this for awhile, and this is the first time I would not mind not cheating, so I think I might make the decision not to...I just wanted to get others perspective on refeeds- just one of those paranoid cutters who needs an out every once and a while.
> 
> When I cheat, it actually makes my cutting diet that much better the next day because I know how I felt after that crappy meal I ate.   I just sometimes need that friendly reminder!   Thanks for all your great input everyone...now it all depends on how I feel today- tired of dieting- im cheating, not tired- stickin to my guns!



You need to relax, food is food. It doesn't matter if you eat pizza or cheeseburgers on occasion...As long as your protein is in check and your still at a calorie deficit, it doesn't matter...

Look at it this way. *If you decide to eat a chicken breast sandwich at subway, compared to a slice of pizza.* Bread with both. Probably more carbs with the subway...(I don't even eat the crust on pizza) Then, both have cheese. Yes, more cheese goes with the pizza, but what's wrong with cheese? Low carbs, good protein...No big deal. (Only about 70 calories a slice of cheese) Then, you have your chicken breast on the subway sandwich. You have pepperoni on your pizza. The total amount of pepperoni shouldn't be more than 90 calories, your chicken breast will be about 120 calories. Therefore, when you calculate everything out, your getting about *the same amount of total calories for a 6inch sub at subway, compared to one average slice of pizza*...The only difference is more fat, less carbs for the pizza. I would rather have more fat from the cheese and pepperoni, than more carbs from the crappy bread at subway...

I forgot to mention sauce with with the pizza and sub. Your chances are better going with the pizza sauce. Pizza sauce is low in calories, especially compared to the typical mayonnaise people put on their subs...


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## Built (Apr 29, 2009)

Do you get the feeling that in their orthorexia, some people are afraid of food that tastes good?


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## the7zen (Apr 29, 2009)

C6zo6 said:


> You need to relax, food is food. It doesn't matter if you eat pizza or cheeseburgers on occasion...As long as your protein is in check and your still at a calorie deficit, it doesn't matter...
> 
> Look at it this way. *If you decide to eat a chicken breast sandwich at subway, compared to a slice of pizza.* Bread with both. Probably more carbs with the subway...(I don't even eat the crust on pizza) Then, both have cheese. Yes, more cheese goes with the pizza, but what's wrong with cheese? Low carbs, good protein...No big deal. (Only about 70 calories a slice of cheese) Then, you have your chicken breast on the subway sandwich. You have pepperoni on your pizza. The total amount of pepperoni shouldn't be more than 90 calories, your chicken breast will be about 120 calories. Therefore, when you calculate everything out, your getting about *the same amount of total calories for a 6inch sub at subway, compared to one average slice of pizza*...The only difference is more fat, less carbs for the pizza. I would rather have more fat from the cheese and pepperoni, than more carbs from the crappy bread at subway...
> 
> I forgot to mention sauce with with the pizza and sub. Your chances are better going with the pizza sauce. Pizza sauce is low in calories, especially compared to the typical mayonnaise people put on their subs...



The only downside is, for many people just a slice of pizza wont be very satiating when compared to a 6" subway sandwich...so they will go for more slices. Personally I would avoid non satiating food (could be a 6" sandwich or a cheeseburger in some case ) while trying to maintain a calorie deficit  (cheat or no-cheat).,,,,,just my .02cents


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## Built (Apr 29, 2009)

I don't worry about satiety on a cheat day - I just eat. 

That being said, I generally eat something beforehand, something with broccoli and protein, kinda helps move it through me if you know what I mean. If I overeat junk, I really feel like garbage. 

I still DO it mind you, but my delicate little bodybuilder metabolism doesn't seem to handle "normal-people food" very well anymore. LOL!

And with that, I am off to eat French food for lunch. Mom's seventy ninth birthday. I'm thinking "frites" and "madelaines".


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## nkira (Apr 29, 2009)

Chow Time!!


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## C6zo6 (Apr 29, 2009)

the7zen said:


> The only downside is, for many people just a slice of pizza wont be very satiating when compared to a 6" subway sandwich...so they will go for more slices. Personally I would avoid non satiating food (could be a 6" sandwich or a cheeseburger in some case ) while trying to maintain a calorie deficit  (cheat or no-cheat).,,,,,just my .02cents



That's when self control comes in...If you have enough self control to NEVER eat high calorie foods on a deficit, I'm sure you have the self control to have one slice of pizza over two...Think about it. 

Personally, i think people should eat what they desire. Just keep protein up. You can't tell me that you crave terrible food all the time...You can easily balance a high protein diet with foods that are 100% healthy...

Live a little. Plenty of good foods out there to try. Don't be scared of food.


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## the7zen (Apr 29, 2009)

I 100% agree self control is the key here.
But it takes some time to build your will power against all those cravings...atleast in my case it did take some time.

To the original poster, just eat what you like and try to maintain your desired calorie limit...if you fail try it again with more will power


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## bigsahm21 (Apr 29, 2009)

I've never really "cut" but if I did I would cheat like a mofo.

Especially since if I did overeat huge, and gained a little weight over a day or two, I'm right back into a calorie deficit and losing weight...so really, who cares?  Is it really a big deal if it sets you back like two days?


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## C6zo6 (Apr 29, 2009)

bigsahm21 said:


> I've never really "cut" but if I did I would cheat like a mofo.
> 
> Especially since if I did overeat huge, and gained a little weight over a day or two, I'm right back into a calorie deficit and losing weight...so really, who cares?  Is it really a big deal if it sets you back like two days?



No, definitely not. 

I would rather keep my sanity. 

For the first time people are agreeing with me on the forums. Yes! lol


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## jhawkin1 (Apr 29, 2009)

I went to Sweet Tomatoes instead of a nasty all-you-can-eat chinese place- started with a few varieties of salad, had a little pizza, and a few brownies...     then at night I ate more pizza and italian ice-  now I feel awful, but I know that my energy will be restored for a good 2 weeks before I need to even THINK about going back to fuck around again- excuse my poddy mouth


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## nkira (Apr 29, 2009)

Yesterday, I was craving Pizza Hut's Pizza, so I went ahead and ordered one, but I made sure that I ate only 2 slices. Craving for take-away &/or junk food is fine just keep it in moderation & watch the macros.

Like Built said "Nobody gets fat or becomes unhealthy because they have a cheeseburger and fries at McDonald's once in a while."

Sooner or later almost everyone gives in to cheat meal. But with moderation you can keep eating it, not like other unhealthy people who refuse to take up exercising & healthy dieting and then are forbidden to eat all the food they love. I just don't understand how this people think that loading up with exotic medication is gonna help them more than exercise & healthy dieting 

The idea is to stay healthy so that you can eat all (In moderation off course) the food you love till your dying days.

 New research conducted by University of Kentucky claims that,

" there may be a biological indicator to tell us when we are working hard at resisting temptation and consequently when we are vulnerable to doing things contrary to our intentions.
A measure of cardiac regulation called "heart rate variability" (HRV) appears to be linked to self regulation.
The researchers conducted a two-part study in order to test their hypothesis. In the first, participants were instructed to fast for three hours in order to take part in what they believed was a "physiology of food preference" experiment. Participants' HRV was monitored while they were presented with a tray of cookies, candy and....carrots. Temptation, in this case, was indicated by giving into the tastier but decidedly less healthy snack of cookies and candy.
HRV as it turns out was considerably higher when people were working to resist temptation (eating carrots rather than cookies and chocolate) than when they were not, suggesting that HRV was mirroring the self regulation taking place.
In part two of the experiment, after resisting or giving into temptation, the authors had the participants attempt to complete difficult anagrams, some of which were impossible to solve. The authors measured how long participants persevered at the anagrams and as predicted, those who had exerted high self regulation by resisting sweets were more likely to give up earlier on the task.
Moreover, the people who had higher levels of HRV by nature, regardless of giving into temptation, were likely to endure longer at the anagram task.
HRV was not singled out as an indicator on a lark. Segerstrom and Solberg Nes noted that the brain structures involved in self regulation overlap considerably with the structures that control HRV which suggested that HRV would accurately reflect self regulation.
So, will we be wearing a cardiac monitor in the near future to gauge whether we are vulnerable in our self regulating abilities? It's doubtful, say the authors. However, when considering special populations with more serious consequences of self regulatory failure (say, alcoholics) HRV feedback could be helpful to determine when those critical relapses in regulation will happen.
Reference: Psychological Science "Heart Rate Variability Reflects Self-Regulatory Strength, Effort, and Fatigue." 

Source


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