# My Second Cycle....Advice Needed



## zyrtec7 (Nov 19, 2013)

ok. im 33 years old. right now im at 183lbs. 6ft
my first cycle was
Dbol - 50mg day 6wks
Test c - 600mg Week 14 weeks
Deca 500mg wk for 14 weeks

pct HCG and arimidex

i just wanna get big. what should my next cycle be. ive read a lot and people say to stay away from Tren.. my body didnt have any sides really from the first cycle. BP went up a little but just took a norvasc and i was good

i was thinking
Dbol 50
Test 750 16wks
Deca 600 16wks
Hcg throughout cycle

does anyone recomend a differnt cycle. please helo


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## Bobby L (Nov 19, 2013)

Sounds good I'm running anadrol, and 500mg test e


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## NoviceAAS (Nov 19, 2013)

Im a little nervous here. If you PCT'd with HCG and arimidex I tend to think your gear may not have been as strong as you thought, because a 14 week cycle with that dose of deca should have required a decent kick start to get you going again.  I guess we are all different but as I said Im leaning towards your gear not being quite on point.

regarding the plans for this second cycle  you probably dont need to run HCG throughout, just the last 4-6 weeks. And for me personally that ratio of test to deca would kill my erections. But thats just me.


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## pashapasha (Nov 19, 2013)

And can you tell us a about first cycle pct ? How was it ? Which days and what did you take mate?


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 19, 2013)

NoviceAAS said:


> Im a little nervous here. If you PCT'd with HCG and arimidex I tend to think your gear may not have been as strong as you thought, because a 14 week cycle with that dose of deca should have required a decent kick start to get you going again.  I guess we are all different but as I said Im leaning towards your gear not being quite on point.
> 
> regarding the plans for this second cycle  you probably dont need to run HCG throughout, just the last 4-6 weeks. And for me personally that ratio of test to deca would kill my erections. But thats just me.





i was thinking the same. it was a homebrew so makes me wonder if it was as strong as it said. next time im not going with homebrew


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## NoviceAAS (Nov 19, 2013)

zyrtec , Yeah the reason that came to mind was first of all I would have had a problem if I ran my deca and test so close, second Ive had bunk Deca and bunky test for that matter lol.     Try 700-750 test , 400 deca , a week. 50 mg proviron ED 12.5 adex ED for 16 weeks . End your deca 1 week before you end the test,  use HCG for the last 4-6 weeks of cycle plus the 2 weeks between cycle end and PCT .   PCT with nolva and clomid dosed at 40 mg nolva ED 2 wks 100mg clomid ED 2wks then 20 mg Nolva ED 2 wks 50 mg Clomid ED 2 wks.

 send me a pm when you get the time.


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## plazmic (Nov 19, 2013)

NoviceAAS said:


> Im a little nervous here. If you PCT'd with HCG and arimidex I tend to think your gear may not have been as strong as you thought, because a 14 week cycle with that dose of deca should have required a decent kick start to get you going again.  I guess we are all different but as I said Im leaning towards your gear not being quite on point.
> 
> regarding the plans for this second cycle  you probably dont need to run HCG throughout, just the last 4-6 weeks. And for me personally that ratio of test to deca would kill my erections. But thats just me.



I don't think that his PCT is indicative of under-dosed gear. At 6' and 183 lbs he could maintain with a tanked natural test level. My immediate thought was that the first cycle was overkill and the second cycle plan is more overkill. 

OP: If you want to grow big from your current state, eat bigger and don't worry about upping your hormones each cycle. Shit you could gain 20 pounds of pure lean mass naturally and fast as shit on moderate test alone... the dbol and deca just isn't necessary for you yet.


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## VictorZ06 (Nov 19, 2013)

No AI during first cycle?





/V


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 19, 2013)

VictorZ06 said:


> No AI during first cycle?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



didnt really need one. took some clomid here and there and arimidex..body seemed to handle it well


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 19, 2013)

i do eat a lot. im a freaking hard gainer and quick to lose it all. with what i took the 1st time i only really gained like 10-15lbs.. wonder if what i took was even dosed right.. idk.
i take in like 4k cal a day or at least try to. but im not really gonna start my next cycle till Jan. gotta check my blood work first and all that


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## OfficerFarva (Nov 19, 2013)

I really don't think you know what you're doing but good luck anyways.


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## VictorZ06 (Nov 19, 2013)

zyrtec7 said:


> didnt really need one. took some clomid here and there and arimidex..body seemed to handle it well



Your gear must have been crap....1/2gr a week for 14 weeks of a 19 NOR like nandrolone most certainly calls for an AI...caber or prami would also be advised.  Most people running deca and test at the doses you stated for 14 weeks would more than likely been hit with different side effects without using the proper prevention tools.  And 50gr of dbol a day?  No heavy bloat/water retention?  We all work differently....who knows.





/V


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 20, 2013)

yea from what other people have told me, im wondering if it was not as strong as it said.
didnt really have any big sides


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 20, 2013)

VictorZ06 said:


> Your gear must have been crap....1/2gr a week for 14 weeks of a 19 NOR like nandrolone most certainly calls for an AI...caber or prami would also be advised.  Most people running deca and test at the doses you stated for 14 weeks would more than likely been hit with different side effects without using the proper prevention tools.  And 50gr of dbol a day?  No heavy bloat/water retention?  We all work differently....who knows.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





and no to what guy before said. i dont really know what im doing.. hince why im asking people who do.. how else gonna learn
and if i take all that again and this time it is as strong as it supposed to be. ill need what to run along with it
caber?
prami?
arimidex 0.5 eod??

just  wondering now if the first cycle was really as strong as it said it  was. i mean i did get bigger, but not as big as i thought. idk. 
not going back to that guy thats for sure


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## rage racing (Nov 20, 2013)

What kind of gains to you have from your first cycle?


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## NoviceAAS (Nov 20, 2013)

Zyrtec, Im glad someone else thinks the gear may not have been on point. Not having any sides, recovering easy with virtually no ?PCT all indicates to me the gear was way underdosed. That kind of doseage should have shut you down nicely. 

  You probably gained simply because you were training harder .   Hows about considering this your first cycle with some real good test ?


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 20, 2013)

rage racing said:


> What kind of gains to you have from your first cycle?





only like 12lbs
makes me wonder if it was even as strong as it said.


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 20, 2013)

NoviceAAS said:


> Zyrtec, Im glad someone else thinks the gear may not have been on point. Not having any sides, recovering easy with virtually no ?PCT all indicates to me the gear was way underdosed. That kind of doseage should have shut you down nicely.
> 
> You probably gained simply because you were training harder .   Hows about considering this your first cycle with some real good test ?



yea for sure. def not going back to that same guy


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## rage racing (Nov 20, 2013)

zyrtec7 said:


> only like 12lbs
> makes me wonder if it was even as strong as it said.


Well either your training sucks, your diet sucks or your gear sucks.......or all of the above. The Dbol alone shoulda put that kinda weight on you even if was pure water. Time to find a new source and start over. Throwing more gear in the mix isnt gonna do anything. Find a reliable source and run another basic cycle (500mg test a week/40mg Dbol a day) and see what happens. Gear is just a part of the puzzle. Diet, training and rest is the biggest part. Good luck brother.


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## Mike Arnold (Nov 20, 2013)

At 6 foot and only 183 lbs, the LAST thing you need is more gear!  I have known some pros who have run similar cycles.  In reality, what you need to do is learn how to eat & train for BB'ing because at 6 feet and 183 lbs, you haven't learned either...and both are of critical importance, as well as an absolute prerequisite for using steroids.  

The fact you are 183 lbs at 6 feet tall after running a big cycle like that is further proof you shouldn't be using steroids.  A beginner at your level of development should've gained between 30-40 lbs on that cycle...a minimum of 25 lbs...minimum, but you only gained 12 lbs.  This tells us you have no idea how to eat & train for BB'ing...because anyone who runs that cycle and does things correctly does not gain only 12 lbs.  That cycle would yield 12 lbs in water weight alone, especially without an AI, which you didn't use.

One of two things is going on here.  One, you either started taking steroids as soon as you began training, which you shouldn't do.  Or...if you did train for an appropriate period of time before beginning AAS (at least 2 years), you clearly have no idea what you're doing because no one who eats & trains properly for 2 years...even 1 year, will weigh only 171 lbs at 6' feet tall, which is what you weighed before your cycle. 

Either way, you have no business using steroids.  You are wasting your time.  What you should be doing is educating yourself about eating & training, which will enable you to achieve your goals and yield far more results in both the short and long-term.  Developmentally, 171 lbs at 6'0 is on par with a raw beginner...and no beginner should be using drugs.  

I have said the following many times before, but I do so to illustrate a point.  When I first began serious training as an adult, I weighed 167 lbs at 6'1.  In gained 41 lbs in exactly 12 weeks (208 lbs bodyweight), with very little bodyfat accumulation.  My bench went up from 225 lbs for reps to 315 lbs for reps.  My deadlifts went up from low-mid 200's for reps to 405 for reps.  Everything else went up in strength similarly.  After 12 weeks of 100% drug-free training, I weighed 25 lbs more than you do now..and was probably much stronger, as well...and lest you think I have great genetics, I can assure you that I do not.  The only the reason for my tremendous progress, which slowed down significantly after that (I hit 230 lbs by the end of my first year, still drug-free) was because I was eating and training like a BBr should be eating and training.  My program was much more well assembled than your typical beginner's program, but I had been gathering knowledge for about 8 years prior, so that is why.  

The point is that you will never make good gains or get anywhere close to being _"big" _unless you learn to eat & train for BB'ing.  Many think they do, but they don't.  I can virtually gaurantee that you will hold yourself back...severely... unless you acquire the basic training & nutrition knowledge necessary for muscle growth.

As far as your proposed cycle is concerned, even if you decide to continue using steroids, which you shouldn't until you learn the basics, you certainly do NOT need any more gear.  In fact, you could contiue growing at that dose until you were very large...way past 183 lbs.  Do yourself a favor and learn the basics before using drugs.


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 21, 2013)

cant really argue that one. im thinking the gear was not what it said it was. yea i def could work on my diet better
not gonna do next cycle till that gets better anyway


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## Mike Arnold (Nov 21, 2013)

zyrtec7 said:


> cant really argue that one. im thinking the gear was not what it said it was. yea i def could work on my diet better
> not gonna do next cycle till that gets better anyway



The reason diet is so important is because steroids depend on food to grow muscle tissue.  most importantly, you neede a surplus of calories to grow...secondly, you need enough protein.  If you nail those 2 things, you will grow no mattr what.  now, a lot can be said for healthly eating and proper diet contrustion, but it doesn't matter how you assemble your diet and how healthy you eat if you re not eating enough.  You could be following the best diet in the world for your body, but if you are under-eating, you can kiss your gains goodbye.  On the other hand, even if you were following a total shit diet (which I don't recommend), but you were eating a surplus of calories, you would still grow.

Taking steroids is like making improvements to the engine of car car.  By doing so you improve its "potential" to go faster, but without gasoline, it won't move anywhere.  Food is your gasoline.  No food=no growth.


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## jay_steel (Nov 21, 2013)

i dont buy into the hard gainer bull shit. Sorry bro throwing flags on this one... I have been told this by EVERY one i train with. I am a hard gainer it just wont grow. Its lazy training and a lazy diet. You eat 4k of what?

Like I said this song has been sung to me many time. My first buddy went from 150 to 230 on gear with my help he was 6'2" this took him a year and a half. He did not have fun eating. Now hes brainwashed and tired of my asshole attitude so he got help from physique guys and lost his gains. I dont sugar coat it or give hugs to my friends i tell them there fucking stupid and follow my lead. I offend them and piss them off, but thats my personality if they dont like it they can stay skinny. 

My partner right now. All natural no gear. Cried about the same thing, I cant get past 180 and hes 6ft. Crys and crys bought some SDMZ i told him to shelf theat shit till april and let me teach him how to eat and train. Hes at 190 naturally now in two months. He swore he ate right, now I get texts from him daily cursing me out cause its hard for him to eat. I just laugh and say i thought you ate right before. My advice is learn nutrition or hire a dietician. That cycle should have got you 30plus lbs. 

I may not be as big as victor or mike and other vets, but keep in mind I have only been training for 2.5 years and maintain right now 9% bf at 209 and 5'8". My goal is 240, but learn to train and eat. stalk john meadows youtube channel and videos. I follow his training protocol works the best for me. I preexhaust my muscles before i train them. Then I go hit them heavy and force my self to push the same weight if i were fresh. I scream, cry, puke, bitch but i get the job done. Thats what it takes to get big. Not going to the gym and going through motions with a fucking smile on your face. 

So hit it hard brother and get big. 

My advice would be 500 test, 40 dbol, proviron and pct with some nolva. I like proviron over adex or asin because it makes me fucking hard and i dont ever have ai issues, proviron keeps my sides down low from dbol. I get hard as fuck but big as fuck from the dbol.


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## zyrtec7 (Nov 21, 2013)

yea, true, i would eat 6 meals a day. lots of carbs and protein to where i got sick of eating chicken,. gonna get back on a good diet before i start next cycle..
its true gotta have the gas


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