# excercises that widen upper back/lats



## OmarJackson (Nov 16, 2003)

what are the best excercises to widen the upper lats  for a more-impressive spread and a better v-taper.

also, are wide-grip pull-ups anymore effective than close-grips?


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## P-funk (Nov 16, 2003)

do a search for wide grip pull ups and use my name and you will find threads were I disuss the biomechanics of both wide and close grip pull ups.


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## ogabott (Nov 16, 2003)

wide-grip pullups for sure.... i like one-arm DB rows too.  streches the lats real good.


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## Arnold (Nov 17, 2003)

for lat width I would do wide grip pull-ups and pull-downs.

but do not neglect other parts of the back, rows are very important as well.


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## gopro (Nov 17, 2003)

BE THE ???WING??? MAN!

One of the most impressive things about a bodybuilder is the infamous ???V??? taper. The type of shape that makes it look like you can jump off a cliff, spread your lats, and use them to hang glide! Both in and out of clothes a wide back makes the waist look smaller and lends an aesthetic appeal to the physique like no other bodypart. If there is one muscle group that can make you stand out in a crowd, no matter which direction you may be facing, it is a well-developed back! Problem is, I see dozens of trainees toiling away in the gym, doing set after set on the lat pulldown machine, using a wide grip, a close grip, an underhand grip???pulling in front and to the back, and yet???so few people getting stuck in doorways! So what is the problem? Well, there are several:


WRONG EXERCISES: Although pulldowns are a great exercise, they cannot replace the true back builders like pull-ups, seated rows, barbell rows, T-bar rows, dumbbell rows, and even deadlifts. If these exercises do not form the foundation of your back routine, than you are doomed to be ???narrow??? forever!


BAD FORM: This is perhaps the most prevalent problem in faulty back training. Usually one or all of these mistakes are made when training back???a) Using too much weight causing all kinds of swinging and use of mainly the biceps, b) Failure to set the body correctly during the movement. You must keep your chest out, shoulders back, and a slight arch in your lower back. When you pull the weight you must squeeze your shoulder blades together and contract the lats, c) Not using a thumbless grip, which can cause way too much bicep stimulation.


LACK OF PULLOVERS/ STIFF-ARM PULLDOWNS: These exercises truly isolate the teres muscle, right under the armpit, and can make you look much wider in and of themselves. These two movements do not involve the biceps and allow you to truly focus on expanding you lats.

Here is a sample back workout:


Wide grip pull-ups- 2x 8-10 
Underhand grip bent rows- 2 x 6-8 
CG seated rows- 2 x 10-12 
Cross bench pullovers- 2 x 12-15 
Partial deadlifts- 2 x 4-6

Put these tips to work at your next back workout and you???ll quickly have a ???wider??? understanding of what it will take to get that V!


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## OmarJackson (Nov 17, 2003)

thanks gopro

that was a good reply

my back workout is similar to that, i do:

(2 to 3 sets of each)
wide-grip pull-ups
close-grip (nuetral-grip) pull-ups
BB or DB rows
HammerStrength row machine or CP cable rows
deadlifts
rear-delt flys
pullover machine

just wanted to make sure that i was on the right track.


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## prophet (Nov 18, 2003)

wow, lots of exercises yeahbuddy

mine is:

pull ups w/ weight.. shoulder width grip
deadlifts
bent-over rows

occasionally i finish with t-bar or seated row

3 sets each


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## derekisdman (Nov 18, 2003)

Best back ever right there imo.  Just insane.


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## OmarJackson (Nov 18, 2003)

> wow, lots of exercises yeahbuddy
> 
> mine is:
> 
> ...



yea i know, but the back is such a huge muscle, i really don't feel sore the next day only doing 3 excercises. also i meant to say i do rear-delt flys _or_ pullover machine. not both.


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## oaktownboy (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by derekisdman *_
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dorian has the best back.


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## Flex (Nov 18, 2003)

sorry to both you guys. don't get wrong, i love franco's lats and dorian's back is awesome. but let's get serious, you're forgetting the king of back.............

http://www.flexonline.com/mro/final_men_bb/pages/ddd0121.html


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

I just follow GoPro's back routine with power, rr, and SHOCK. Works great!!


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

I'm using gopro's too. Needed a change from my regular routines and I'm luving it! Thx bro!


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> I'm using gopro's too. Needed a change from my regular routines and I'm luving it! Thx bro!


How long you done GoPro's for?


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

I'm on my 4th week. So it's back to power week. I really like the change up from week to week.


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> I'm on my 4th week. So it's back to power week. I really like the change up from week to week.


Have your lifts gone up since last power week?


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by vanity *_
> Periodization is definitely the way to go.


I agree 100%. I love this program now!


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

I'll see tonight. Had a crazy as storm down here yesterday so i didn't work out last night.


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> I'll see tonight. Had a crazy as storm down here yesterday so i didn't work out last night.


Good Luck. I was pleasantly surprised to find most of my lifts increased quite a bit.


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

Hey Rock u a fan of the Icenwin Dale Trilogy or something?That was a great series of books. Salvatore is a great writer!


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> Hey Rock u a fan of the Icenwin Dale Trilogy or something?That was a great series of books. Salvatore is a great writer!


Most definately!! I've read all the books in the series, about 14 or 15 now. How about you?


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

Yep, I've read them all except for the last 2 books in the Path's of Darkness Series. They any good? I think he should have ended it at the Dark Elf trilogy.


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

Eh, good parts come and goes. I just like Drizzt! The newest book in the Hunter's blade trilogy just came out. Haven't read that one yet. Currently in the Sword of Truth series of books.


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

You ever read any of the wheel of time books?


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> You ever read any of the wheel of time books?


No, who writes that? Whats it about?


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## Darkkmind (Nov 18, 2003)

Kinda hard to explain. The author's name is Robert Jordan . You should check it out. Just a warning this series is kinda drawn out. http://www.tor.com/sites/wheel_of_time/


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## Rocco32 (Nov 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> Kinda hard to explain. The author's name is Robert Jordan . You should check it out. Just a warning this series is kinda drawn out. http://www.tor.com/sites/wheel_of_time/


Thanks, I'll do that!


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## BlueCorsair (Nov 18, 2003)

Pullovers eh?

http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/LatissimusDorsi/BBPullover.html

This looks like a good example, but why the hell can't you lie on the bench in the same way one would for bench pressing?

Or is this example just messed up?


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## Mudge (Nov 18, 2003)

I lay on the bench normally, with some good arch in my spine. I am heavy enough that I dont slide off the bench but if you are 150 pounds and using a 150 pound dumbell, I could see it being a problem staying on the bench without hurting yourself.


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## BlueCorsair (Nov 19, 2003)

Cheers. I didn't relish the idea of only having my back on the bench, heh


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## Rocco32 (Nov 19, 2003)

What about the pullover machine? Is that good enough for pull-overs? I used to do it w/ free weights, but it hurt my left shoulder (couldn't go to far with it either) so I switched to the machine pull-over.


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## plouffe (Nov 19, 2003)

1 set wide grip pullups - failure
--
10 second rest
--
1 set of medium grip pullups - failure
--
10 second rest
--
1 set of medium grip pullups - failure
--
10 second rest
--
1 set of close grip pullups - failure
--


repeat once or twice - it'll shred your back. Great total upper body routine also.


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## Mudge (Nov 19, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by rock4832 *_
> What about the pullover machine? Is that good enough for pull-overs? I used to do it w/ free weights, but it hurt my left shoulder (couldn't go to far with it either) so I switched to the machine pull-over.



Probably about as good as doing it with a barbell, which is how it was done in the old days. Supposedly before bench was popular it was asked how much you could pullover, if you couldn't do 225 you were not a man (thats what I read). I do mine at the end of my chest workout and stick to 125 pound dumbells, nice slow reps and I do touch the floor with the dumbell.


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## Rocco32 (Nov 19, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Mudge *_
> Probably about as good as doing it with a barbell, which is how it was done in the old days. Supposedly before bench was popular it was asked how much you could pullover, if you couldn't do 225 you were not a man (thats what I read). I do mine at the end of my chest workout and stick to 125 pound dumbells, nice slow reps and I do touch the floor with the dumbell.


I do mine with back w/o along with stiff arm pulldowns. No way could I do it with a 125lb db! Maybe take the 12 part off I could do it.  (125-12=5lb).


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## Darkkmind (Nov 19, 2003)

My gains went up alot since my last 1st power week. was able to add 15 lbs to my deadlift. Bent row went up 10 lbs. Got in 1 extra chinup, I'm doing this behind the back(not strong enough to add any weight yet). And my CG seated row went up 20 lbs and I think i could have done more. Military press and upright row went up 10 lbs. And cheat lateral went up 5 lbs. All and all very happy with the routine. Can't wait till I get my Swole delivered to me. Ready to stack on more weight.


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## Rocco32 (Nov 19, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Darkkmind *_
> My gains went up alot since my last 1st power week. was able to add 15 lbs to my deadlift. Bent row went up 10 lbs. Got in 1 extra chinup, I'm doing this behind the back(not strong enough to add any weight yet). And my CG seated row went up 20 lbs and I think i could have done more. Military press and upright row went up 10 lbs. And cheat lateral went up 5 lbs. All and all very happy with the routine. Can't wait till I get my Swole delivered to me. Ready to stack on more weight.


That's great man! Let Gopro know, he likes to hear feedback on the routine. All my lifts keep going up also when power week comes around!

Be careful with behind the head pull-ups though! That is undue stress on your rotator cuffs! Keep it to the front and keep lifting for awhile!.


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## DeadBolt (Nov 19, 2003)

Ok are the underhand grip bent rows the same as the closed grip rows?  I was thinking of using the lever machine.  And also the CG seated row they the same as a normal seated row?


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## GYM GURU (Dec 25, 2005)

deadlift deadlifts & mo deadlifts will make the back thick quicker than almost all the other exercises. Bent over barbell rows & pull ups are the other two best exercises. Lat pull downs & one arm rows all help but DEADLIFTS r THE f#$%^ BOMB !  lots of squeezing , contracting & stretching the back.


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## min0 lee (Dec 25, 2005)

Bentovers !


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## fufu (Dec 25, 2005)

pull overs are horrible on my shoulders. I'd tried them once warming up with just the bar and my left shoulder make a loud crack and hurt for a couple days. but then again my left shoulder has always been screwy.


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## GFR (Dec 25, 2005)

rows and more rows
wide lat pullups are good also
dead lifts work the low back and are not a good lat builder IMO


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## IJ300 (Dec 25, 2005)

fufu said:
			
		

> pull overs are horrible on my shoulders. I'd tried them once warming up with just the bar and my left shoulder make a loud crack and hurt for a couple days. but then again my left shoulder has always been screwy.



yea i feel the same about pullovers, it doesnt feel right when i do them.  I think my arms are too short or my heads too big...


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## min0 lee (Dec 25, 2005)

ForemanRules said:
			
		

> rows and more rows
> wide lat pullups are good also
> *dead lifts work the low back and are not a good lat builder IMO*


I am with you on that.


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