# PCT after 18 month blast/cruise cycle...



## dippa66 (Mar 13, 2012)

I need some help for my PCT after an 18 month blast/cruise cycle.

I'm sick of injecting, and I'm not getting the best results anymore, so I thought a nice long break would help.

I've got HCG, Clomid and aromasin.

Had my last shot of sus 18 days ago.

Only got the HCG 5 days ago, so I took a 5000u "booster" which has given me my balls back, but not sure when to start anything else, and is it different dosing after a long cycle?

Any helps would be appreciated


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## exphys88 (Mar 13, 2012)

Here's what I would do if it were me.  Some may disagree, and that's ok.

days 1-10  HCG 1000 iu EOD, 25 mg aromasin ED

4 days after last hcg shot:
Aromasin 25 mg Ed for 2 weeks, then 12.5 for 2 more weeks
Clomid 100 mg ED for 2 weeks, then 50 mg for 2 more weeks
Nolva 20 mg for 6 weeks

then wait a month and get your bloodwork done.  This is extremely important.

This is similar to what Dr. Scally does with his patients, plus aromasin.  There is tons of debate as to whether nolva is necessary or not.  My conclusion is that it definitely doesn't hurt to use it alongside clomid, but some are convinced that it won't help any.  I just have a lot of respect for Scally and listen when he gives advice.


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## independent (Mar 13, 2012)

I would love to see updates on your final outcome.


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## MattPorter (Mar 13, 2012)

exphysiologist88 said:


> Here's what I would do if it were me.  Some may disagree, and that's ok.
> 
> days 1-10  HCG 1000 iu EOD, 25 mg aromasin ED
> 
> ...



I like this approach alot --- I would just not use BOTH clomid and Nolva. I *might* low dose nolva at 10 mgs and use D-aspartic acid in conjunction with aromasin. 

Of course some IGF-1 during this time would not hurt

-Matt


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## Pittsburgh63 (Mar 13, 2012)

Hey brother.. this may help you out... Triptorelin

There's a log running on it currently if you're interested in checking it out.

http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/labpe-peptide/157393-triptorelin-nolvadex-pct-log.html


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## Drudkh (Mar 13, 2012)

Scally's protocol is: HCG 2500IU every other day for 16 days.  50mg Clomid twice a day for 30 days.  Nolva 20 mg every day for 45 days.  

Though its not part of Scally's protocol, I've seen it suggested to add letro at 1.25 x2 per week until the nolva is finished and then .625 x2 per week for two weeks and then .625 once a week for two more weeks.


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## exphys88 (Mar 13, 2012)

Drudkh said:


> Scally's protocol is: HCG 2500IU every other day for 16 days.  50mg Clomid twice a day for 30 days.  Nolva 20 mg every day for 45 days.
> 
> Though its not part of Scally's protocol, I've seen it suggested to add letro at 1.25 x2 per week until the nolva is finished and then .625 x2 per week for two weeks and then .625 once a week for two more weeks.



Correct.  I think Scally recommends against an AI though, not because it would negatively influence recovery, but because it creates a cloudy picture for blood work.


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## dippa66 (Mar 13, 2012)

Ok, thanks for all your input.

This is what I have come up with:

HCG 500 eod (dont have much) for 2 weeks

Clomid 100/100/50/50

Aromasin 25/25/12.5/12.5

Dont have nolva

How does that look?


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## exphys88 (Mar 13, 2012)

dippa66 said:


> Ok, thanks for all your input.
> 
> This is what I have come up with:
> 
> ...



that looks really good, if you have enough clomid, you could consider running it for 6 weeks.  Just remember to get bloodwork, some guys need another pct.


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## dippa66 (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks for the help!


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## Drudkh (Mar 14, 2012)

exphysiologist88 said:


> Correct.  I think Scally recommends against an AI though, not because it would negatively influence recovery, but because it creates a cloudy picture for blood work.



Hmmm. What does he mean by "cloudy picture for blood work?"  Perhaps he wants to observe estro levels normalize on their own.


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## dippa66 (Mar 27, 2012)

exphys88 said:


> Here's what I would do if it were me.  Some may disagree, and that's ok.
> 
> days 1-10  HCG 1000 iu EOD, 25 mg aromasin ED
> 
> ...



OOPPS I FUCKED UP!

Have been taking HCG, clomid and aromasin together, as per above doses.

Had last shot of HCG today, should I continue with the above doses of clomid and aromsin:

100 / 25 for 1 more week
50 / 12.5 for 2 weeks


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## SloppyJ (Mar 27, 2012)

How much more clomid and aromasin do you have left?


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## exphys88 (Mar 27, 2012)

dippa66 said:


> OOPPS I FUCKED UP!
> 
> Have been taking HCG, clomid and aromasin together, as per above doses.
> 
> ...



If you have enough, run it for 4 weeks.


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## SloppyJ (Mar 27, 2012)

IMO I don't think that a standard 4 week PCT is going to cut it for someone who has spent the last 18 months abusing gear. Let's be honest with ourselves here. If you can afford to run a shit ton of gear for 18 months then you should be able to afford $100 worth of PCT meds. 

If this were me, I'd run 6-8 weeks of clomid, aromasin and low dose nolva. I would also add in some sort of test booster just to try and hit it from all angles. 

To me this sounds like a last minute decision since you didn't have a lot of HCG nor did you have enough SERMs or AIs. If you're not willing to acquire the required meds and still want to run a PCT then just run it the best you can and take blood work starting one month after the end of your PCT. I would continue getting blood work done every month after that until you are back to where you need to be. Remember this will be a slow and extremely shitty process. But that's the price to pay for staying on for so long. There is a chance that you won't recover and you will need to be placed on TRT under doctor supervision. 

How old are you and how do you feel right now? Any sex drive? Do you have energy or are you lethargic all day?


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## exphys88 (Mar 27, 2012)

SloppyJ said:


> IMO I don't think that a standard 4 week PCT is going to cut it for someone who has spent the last 18 months abusing gear. Let's be honest with ourselves here. If you can afford to run a shit ton of gear for 18 months then you should be able to afford $100 worth of PCT meds.
> 
> If this were me, I'd run 6-8 weeks of clomid, aromasin and low dose nolva. I would also add in some sort of test booster just to try and hit it from all angles.
> 
> ...



This is  much better advice than what I gave.


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## JCBourne (Mar 27, 2012)

I agree with slopdawg above, a 4 week PCT isn't going to cut it after a 18 month blast/cruise. I would take (a least) 6 week PCT and also be getting some blood work done to make sure nothing is damaged or really out of wack. Don't cut short-cuts here, if you do you may end up with some serious consequences for the rest of your life.


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## SloppyJ (Mar 27, 2012)

I don't know brother. I've never tried to come back from a cruise. I have zero experience with it but that just makes sense to me. Longest cycle I came back from was a 20wk. I took 6 weeks of PCT and when I took blood work 2 months after PCT, I was g2g.


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## dippa66 (Mar 27, 2012)

SloppyJ said:


> How much more clomid and aromasin do you have left?



got a few weeks worth left
got plenty of HCG left too

Im 45, mood and energy levels are fine, libido starting to diminish though.
Have started igf-1 lr3 also.


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## GFR (Mar 27, 2012)

Post some pics, lets see the results of this great idea.


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## JCBourne (Mar 27, 2012)

I'd be scared to come off after 18 months honestly and I would be taking this very, very seriously and would not be cutting corners OP, but everyone does things differently. I'm more of a rather be safe and have the wife happy after a cycle!


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## BIGBEN2011 (Mar 28, 2012)

what the hell why you so scared take all you got see how you feel get bloodwork if you not recovered try some more pct stuff and if you dont or can not recover you are 45 so if you do not recover you would have no prob geting on trt.everybody recovers diff i can recover after 20 weeks the longest cycle i ever done i was recovered after 3 weeks after last pin shit had barley cleared my system no hcg or nothing just clomid 50mg a day for 2 weeks and a ai which i did  not really need.so every body is diff but like i said at your age trt is not the worst thing in the world you know.


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## dippa66 (Mar 28, 2012)

BIGBEN2011 said:


> what the hell why you so scared take all you got see how you feel get bloodwork if you not recovered try some more pct stuff and if you dont or can not recover you are 45 so if you do not recover you would have no prob geting on trt.everybody recovers diff i can recover after 20 weeks the longest cycle i ever done i was recovered after 3 weeks after last pin shit had barley cleared my system no hcg or nothing just clomid 50mg a day for 2 weeks and a ai which i did  not really need.so every body is diff but like i said at your age trt is not the worst thing in the world you know.




^^^ Thats what I reckon too, I never had problems recovering before, but never ran 18 months of blast/cruise either!


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## Saney (Mar 29, 2012)

The best thing you can do after 18months of Blasting/Cruising is to take (ONLY) Nolvadex @ 20mg ED for 2 months.. that will get you back to running normal again than any other product/combo of products.

Trust me, it's why i'm so Jerked and Tan


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## XYZ (Mar 29, 2012)

There was a study done on pub med not long ago and it was 12 weeks long with the following:

10,000ius HCG tuesdays and thursdays
75ius HMG ED
100mg clomid

Personally, I think 4-6 weeks of this would work.

Good luck.


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## Goldenera (Mar 31, 2012)

XYZ said:


> There was a study done on pub med not long ago and it was 12 weeks long with the following:
> 
> 10,000ius HCG tuesdays and thursdays
> 75ius HMG ED
> ...



Did this pub med study involve a 18 week aas cycle??  

That's way to much hcg and can do damage. 
Hcg info
http://www.elite-bodiez.com/forums/showthread.php?5684-HCG-Unraveled-Protect-The-(-Y-)


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## grootfac (Apr 10, 2012)

great,it is helpful.


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## nby (Apr 10, 2012)

How is this going TS?


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## dippa66 (Apr 10, 2012)

PCT update: I feel pretty good, got minimal libido, but dick still works. Lost a fair amount of size and strength though.
Still taking aromasin 12.5 / clomid 50, maybe continue for 1 more week then get bloods.


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## nby (Apr 10, 2012)

LH/FSH will still be unreliable though so take get some more bloods done 4-6 weeks after you stop PCT.


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## Supertree (Apr 10, 2012)




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## GFR (Apr 10, 2012)

Where are your pics, you must be massive after 18 months of steroid use.


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## dippa66 (Apr 11, 2012)

I was, before PCT 
Dont know how to post pics


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## nby (Apr 11, 2012)

Upload them on Tinypic.com - you'll get a link something like [img ]http://i51.tinypic.com/abcd.jpg[ /img] (without spaces), post that here and it will show the picture you chose.


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## theboneman (Apr 11, 2012)

i just turned 45, and have tried every concoction there is, and after 6-months of steady p.c.t., still nothing, and thats with a zero sperm count, i ran test, doc prescribed for just a coulpe months shy of 2yrs. i have three kids and one was conceived on cycle, but i never thought we would be trying for another one, so i stopped running ancilleries and now it seems impossable to get back on, sloppy hit it on the nose !! after 18 months, a 4 to 6 week pct really aint gonna help much, MAYBE if ya was 27yrs old, but an old dog like me i think is gonna need jumping cables,.

for the record i used, hcg, clomid and nolvadex-d, in different combo;s and im taking some natural things test boosters and stuff thats supposed to have my body kick in, hey if you can help me with any ideas, thank you, hey dippa66, i didnt high jack your thread bro, was just trying to contribute, and maybe get some help seeing im in a shitty situation now.
later, bones


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## Robalo (Apr 12, 2012)

theboneman said:


> i just turned 45, and have tried every concoction there is, and after 6-months of steady p.c.t., still nothing, and thats with a zero sperm count, i ran test, doc prescribed for just a coulpe months shy of 2yrs. i have three kids and one was conceived on cycle, but i never thought we would be trying for another one, so i stopped running ancilleries and now it seems impossable to get back on, sloppy hit it on the nose !! after 18 months, a 4 to 6 week pct really aint gonna help much, MAYBE if ya was 27yrs old, but an old dog like me i think is gonna need jumping cables,.
> 
> for the record i used, hcg, clomid and nolvadex-d, in different combo;s and im taking some natural things test boosters and stuff thats supposed to have my body kick in, hey if you can help me with any ideas, thank you, hey dippa66, i didnt high jack your thread bro, was just trying to contribute, and maybe get some help seeing im in a shitty situation now.
> later, bones



Triptorelin


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## gm09 (Apr 12, 2012)

after pct try tribulus, d-aspartic acid, and zma. i started these 3 during the middle of my last pct and i honestly thinked it helped and im 25. at 45 these would probably be good for you to run when youre off cycle


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## theCaptn' (Apr 12, 2012)

Tribulus is a placebo. Works better on religious folks


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## dippa66 (Apr 23, 2012)

exphys88 said:


> Here's what I would do if it were me.  Some may disagree, and that's ok.
> 
> days 1-10  HCG 1000 iu EOD, 25 mg aromasin ED
> 
> ...



Just an update, everything is back to normal !!!
I think the above pct really worked a treat, I did exclude the nolva though, thanks


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## Digitalash (Apr 23, 2012)

that's good to hear bro, are you going on bloodwork or just how you feel? Might be a good idea to get bloods in a few more weeks just to be sure. 18 months and recovered though that's pretty awesome


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## nby (Apr 23, 2012)

Nice man! Got some bloodwork too?


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## airsealed2 (Apr 24, 2012)

exphys88 said:


> Here's what I would do if it were me.  Some may disagree, and that's ok.
> 
> days 1-10  HCG 1000 iu EOD, 25 mg aromasin ED
> 
> ...



I like this protocol. I would say the Nolva is definitely a plus. Nolva and Clomid synergize  to some extent. Guys who say you only need one aren't wrong. Guys who say it doesn't help to use both are mistaken in my humble opinion. I can probably find the support for that but I don't want to... because I'm lazy.


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## dippa66 (Apr 24, 2012)

I'll get bloods in a week or two.

This is my theory for PCT, and why some guys have such a hard time getting back to normal. Its not bro' science, its anecdotal evidence derived from many years in the medical field.

I think it beneficial, once you have finished your "cycle", to "cruise" for a few weeks to allow your test levels to drop to somewhere around the normal level, as in TRT.
We do this "weaning" type of cessation with many drugs.
After assaulting your body with massive amounts of any drug, your body can respond in the opposite when the drugs are ceased, and I think some are affected like this.

Your body likes homeostasis, it doesn't like too much of anything e.g. too much test, it converts it to oestregen etc.

What we do is put our body into extremes. Extreme amounts of test, then none!

I also think it would help in retaining gains, I'm only down @ 7lbs from stopping until now.

Anyway, its just a theory, and I know it has worked for me.


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## gm09 (Apr 25, 2012)

theCaptn' said:


> Tribulus is a placebo. Works better on religious folks



i think for a normal, healthy person that yea tribulus wont do a damn thing.  For a person who naturally has low testosterone (or low at the time due to suppression), maybe it will help.

in any case, might not help but it cant hurt


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## theCaptn' (Apr 25, 2012)

Placebos will only hurt your pride and your pocket!


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