# Always wanted to ask this - RE:  TDEE



## 41761911 (Mar 1, 2011)

I have always had this problem in the back of my head: (along with others...)

I understand that 13-15 x LBM gives approximate maintenance calories.  

Plus - using the Harris Benedict etc you can multiply BMR by 1.2 for sedentry, 1.375 for light/moderate exercise 3 times a week and so on to find TDEE.

But:  If my BMR gives 1750 cals/day.  Then, spending almost everyday studying/desk-jobing for most of the day, my TDEE would be around 2100 (1750 x 1.2).

However, I do Gym 3 days a week, and minimum 20 mins of moderate cardio every "off-day" [4 days a week].

So, if I only count cardio as "light exercise", would that make my TDEE 1750 x 1.375 = 2400/day?

OR

Would TDEE be 2100 + plus (say 250 calories burnt doing cardio that day) = 2350

Why is TDEE higher if you multiply BMR using the 1.2/1.375 etc - is this showing the "metabolic effect" of exercise?

I am 6ft (186cms), 180lbs (82kgs), around 19-20% BF (LBM = 145lbs approx)

Thanks for your time - this will probably show how stupid I am...

Best regards.


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## Built (Mar 2, 2011)

This is why you don't use a formula to determine YOUR maintenance calories. If you're not obese, maintenance is likely to be close to 15 times your bodyweight (not lean mass) in pounds, but that's just a ballpark. 

Track your intake, weigh yourself daily, and monitor the trend.


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## 41761911 (Mar 2, 2011)

Ok, wow.  Not lean mass!!  I must be drastically undereating.

Could I please confirm with you that if I weigh 180lbs, Maint = 15 x 180:  2700 approx.

So, then, to reduce by 1lb a week (approx) I need at the end of the day to have 2200 (either by eating that much, or by burning through exercise).

I have been eating around 2100, plus exercising on top of that.

Could that be explaining why I have not really been dropping weight?

Thankyou very much for your help,

Best regards


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## Built (Mar 3, 2011)

Yeah, 2700 ought to be about your maintenance - but if you're not dropping on 2100, your maintenance must in fact be lower than that. How long have you been dieting and how much have you dropped?


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## 41761911 (Mar 3, 2011)

Quick intro:  I went on holidays for 2 months (overseas travel), tried to eat healthily (some places like italy, paris and of course, NYC) were a little challenging.  

I got back home and tried to go straight to 2200 per day and did not drop, I actually increased weight - still 3 times a week weight training.  I was a little worried.  

I was last year bulking for 6 months to build my upper body strength and was averaging 2900 calories per day (3 days weights, little cardio).

After about 3 weeks of gaining weight, I changed my plan to the one I already posted and started to lose a little. (3 days weights, rest days 25mins cardio)

Week 1:  82.3kgs, 20%BF (Avg Cal/day = 1850)
Week 2:  82.4kgs, 19.8%BF (Avg Cal/day 1900)
Week 3:  81.9 kgs, 19.9%BF BUT - LBM dropped supposedly 1kg from the week before??!!? (Avg Cal/day = 1750-1800)

Week 3 was a little weird.  

This week, I made the changes you suggested to my plan, and am eating 2200 avg a day, then doing 3 days weights and rest cardio.

I measure again next Monday.

So, it seems my weight/BF % has not really started to gain momentum to the downside...

What do you think of this?  Thanks for following up on my situation and taking the time to help.

Best regards


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## Built (Mar 3, 2011)

You've dropped about a pound and because you're dieting, you dropped some glycogen. BIA interprets this as "you dropped muscle" and concludes you're fatter now. 

You aren't. 

I don't know why you're dropping so slowly, but hang tight; you may be holding some water.


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## 41761911 (Mar 3, 2011)

Ok, thanks.

I'll keep posting my progress.  

Sick and tired of water - we've had enough here in QLD to last a dozen life times.

Thanks


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## 41761911 (Mar 7, 2011)

Morning everyone!

Morning Built,​ 
I measured again yesterday....82.2kgs/180.8lbs, (supposedly, according to the elctronic pule thing - 19.7% BF).

Change on the week:  -0.2kgs/0.45lbs  AND -0.2% in BF.

Change on 25 days (3.5 weeks):  -0.3kgs/0.66bs AND -1% in BF. (But supposedly, LBM increased very slightly)

Talk about slow going!!  

Again, I am eating around 2100-2200 calories per day, then, I am doing gym for 30-35 mins (of lifting time, rest time deducted) 3 days a week, then 2x25 min cardio sessions (supposedly burning 250cals) and 1x40 min cardio (supposedly burning 400cals).

I eat very cleanly (no questions).  

Last year (while "bulking"), I went on a 2 week rest - eating at avg of 2300-2400cals per day.  I did reduce some fat...  

Could I be eating to little?  

Or, should I reduce my calories to 1900/day.  No cardio (or less cardio) and replace any lost calories with food to ensure that balance = 1900?  Would that up the metabolism?

I am truly lost - it is hard to keep going at it when the pay is extremely disproportionate!!  Maybe its just me??

Thanks for your help,

Best regards,


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## Built (Mar 7, 2011)

Thyroid. Please get yours checked - and by checked, I mean PROPERLY checked.


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## 41761911 (Mar 7, 2011)

ok.  that sounds worrying...


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## Merkaba (Mar 7, 2011)

Built said:


> This is why you don't use a formula to determine YOUR maintenance calories. If you're not obese, maintenance is likely to be close to 15 times your bodyweight (not lean mass) in pounds, but that's just a ballpark.
> 
> Track your intake, weigh yourself daily, and monitor the trend.




This is what I was going to say.  Don't over think this part. They'll be better things to over think.


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## Merkaba (Mar 7, 2011)

And how about you post up what you're eating to get those calories.


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## 41761911 (Mar 8, 2011)

Ok Merkaba (sorry for the delayed response - i'm down under)

Today:

*Breakfast: *
Quinoa (60gms dry) OR Rolled Oats (60gms dry) - 220 calories
2 large egg whites - 30 calroies
No fat yoggurt 100gms - 50 calories
15gms ON Natural Whey - 70 calories
*TOTAL:  370-400*

*Morning Tea:*
ON Nitro Core 24 - 1 serve - 200 calories
1 Small Pear - 50 calories
1 muesli bar - 150 calories
*TOTAL = 400*

*Lunch:*
250gms (raw weight) chicken breast no skin - 250 calories
2 slices rye bread - 200 calories
*TOTAL = 450*

*Afternoon Tea:*
ON Natural Whey 1 Serve - 130 calories
1 tablespoon olive oil - 120 caloeis
*TOTAL = 250 *

*Dinner:*
200-250gms cooked lean steak/chicken/pork - tonight, its steak - 400 calories
Half cup cooked basmati rice  OR 100gm steamed sweet potato - 100 calories
Green veggies (steamed broccoli, green beans etc)
Total:  500-550 

*After Dinner:*
1 Serve ON Casein Protein - 100 calories

*Today's DAILY TOTAL:  2150 (400+400+450+250+550+100)*

AVG = 2100-2200  (I rarely have a cheat meal)

I seem to be holding at the same weight range (81.9-82.3kgs) about 180lbs.

BF% - might as well not even count it as decreasing at that rate.

However, I did eat around 1750 calories for 3 days, and did notice a little drop in weight...

Obviously, I am either eating too much, or too little.  BUT, which one of these to go for is the $100000000000 question. 

Thanks guys for your help - it is really nice to be able to talk about this problem.

Best regards,


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## 41761911 (Mar 8, 2011)

bit of a pickle, hey?


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