# how many sets is good for chest?



## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

after 8 yrs of lifting or better and only training chest 1 x a wk?


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## PushAndPull (Jul 31, 2010)

What have you had the best results with? For me personally, I keep it between 5-8 sets.


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## gtbmed (Jul 31, 2010)

Depends entirely on intensity, volume, etc.


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## BigBadWolf (Jul 31, 2010)

heres what works for me,with the presses,i keep it heavy going heavier each set with less reps till failure each set.
 5 sets BB benchpress 
4 sets incline BB press
4 sets cable crossovers from the bottom
4 sets cable crossovers from the top


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## cshea2 (Jul 31, 2010)

Do dips count as chest? Right now, I'm doing 3 sets Incline barbell, 3 sets flat barbell, and then 3 sets of dips. I find that even when I don't lean forward dips still hit my chest pretty hard.


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## BigBadWolf (Jul 31, 2010)

cshea2 said:


> Do dips count as chest? Right now, I'm doing 3 sets Incline barbell, 3 sets flat barbell, and then 3 sets of dips. I find that even when I don't lean forward dips still hit my chest pretty hard.


 yeah dips hit the chest indirectly, specially if your elbows arent pinned to your sides.


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

iam just curious on how many sets works for people, just to get the maximum growth, i should of explained myself a little better.


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

gtbmed said:


> Depends entirely on intensity, volume, etc.



This.

For instance, when I was doing full-body (actual full-body, all 6 planes of motion in one session) I might have done say 9 sets for chest-dominant in one week. With that amount my chest was never overworked because the sets were split up into 3 sets 3 times a week.

Now, I'm using very high-volume program I put together, 4 day split, in which I use 12 chest-dominant sets a week. That's not really a drastic increase, especially considering its volume. However, it's all in one session. On the other hand, the 3 day full-body split involved more training close to failure (e.g. 3 x 10 @ 11-12RM), whereas my current volume program is designed in such a way that I max out only on the first lifts for each plane of motion (5 x 5 @ 5-6 RM). After that, the sets and reps are very high, but the intensities are laid out so I (ideally -- sometimes fatigue from volume is inevitable, even if the weights are lighter) don't hit failure. It's sort of a way of CNS-safe form of intentional overtraining. Then there's tempo, rest intervals, and thanks to Gaz's recent post we now all know about tonneage!

There are far too many training variables to generalize target number of sets.


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## MDR (Jul 31, 2010)

I'm usually in the 12-15 set range.  I train heavy with low-medium reps during bulking, usually flat bench, incline and a stretching movement to finish, like d-bell flyes or cable crossovers.  I know this is more sets than most, but it's what seems to give me the most size and strength.  Of course all this varies when I'm not training for max size and strength.  Lots of people have great success with a smaller number of sets.


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

MDR said:


> I'm usually in the 12-15 set range.  I train heavy with low-medium reps during bulking, usually flat bench, incline and a stretching movement to finish, like d-bell flyes or cable crossovers.  I know this is more sets than most, but it's what seems to give me the most size and strength.  Of course all this varies when I'm not training for max size and strength.  Lots of people have great success with a smaller number of sets.



How often do you train chest-dominant lifts?


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

ok, what ever worked for each individual person, what they did to get the best growth they got out of training chest, in past or now. high intensity, keeping the session under 1 hr. what ever volume u used and all its variables, the best that you think worked for you to get good growth, and number of sets, reps and time frame while on a cycle.


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## Flathead (Jul 31, 2010)

I do a 2 day split each week, for example-

Wed:
Work up to a single RM (where I try to set a new PB), & then 4x1 @ 90% of that single RM. " BB flat bench"

Sat:
9x3 @ 60-70% of single RM. "This is where I rotate BB incline & decline bench"


So I average about 18-19 sets each week.


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## Gazhole (Jul 31, 2010)

Few sets of some type of bench usually works for me. Usually five reps, but thats just me. May not be enough volume for you if you're conditioned to more volume/bodybuilding type training.

I do think a less is more approach to training chest is the best route to take for basically anybody though.


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

^^yeah iam getting everybodys data on sets ect, and trying to apply some sort of training to my chest iam at a sticking point and iam just very interested in wat others do. thnx gaz


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

unclem said:


> ^^yeah iam getting everybodys data on sets ect, and trying to apply some sort of training to my chest iam at a sticking point and iam just very interested in wat others do. thnx gaz



Maybe you don't need to assess your volume. Maybe choice of lifts is an option. There are the lesser-known plateau buster chest lifts. I've been using Dead Press as my primary chest-dominant lift for about 2 months and my chest strength and development has finally taken off after about a year of little progress.

Gaz wrote a great article on getting over bench plateaus on his site - getlifting.info.


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

cshea2 said:


> Do dips count as chest? Right now, I'm doing 3 sets Incline barbell, 3 sets flat barbell, and then 3 sets of dips. I find that even when I don't lean forward dips still hit my chest pretty hard.


 
 iam glad u mentioned dips as i havent done those in ages. thnx.


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

BigBadWolf said:


> heres what works for me,with the presses,i keep it heavy going heavier each set with less reps till failure each set.
> 5 sets BB benchpress
> 4 sets incline BB press
> 4 sets cable crossovers from the bottom
> 4 sets cable crossovers from the top


 
 your very well thick in the chest big so thats the sets i see alot. good post.


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

cshea2 said:


> Do dips count as chest? Right now, I'm doing 3 sets Incline barbell, 3 sets flat barbell, and then 3 sets of dips. I find that even when I don't lean forward dips still hit my chest pretty hard.



Bar Dips are chest-dominant, yes.

Bench Dips are in a gray area, though. I'd say they're tricep dominant, with little if any chest involvement because the origin of exertion is behind the body, so I can't imagine how the chest could do the pushing (like how hack squat mimics a deadlift, yet is quad dominant).


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

^^^ i love bench dips for tris, only thing is you need to plate load your quads. its a good point though.


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## BigBadWolf (Jul 31, 2010)

unclem said:


> your very well thick in the chest big so thats the sets i see alot. good post.


 thanks bro,i dont think theres any one type of training that works for everyone,ive seen guys get fking huge from weights id warm up with,and ive seen guys get huge from 3 or 4 sets of heavy stuff,i think the key to growth is finding out which works for any certain person.What workout you doing now for chest?I also switch my routine after 6 to 8 weeks.


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

unclem said:


> ^^^ i love bench dips for tris, only thing is you need to plate load your quads. its a good point though.



Take caution though -- this is a potentially dangerous lift for your rotator cuffs. I never had problems, but I've heard many people complaining about shoulder pain after bench dips.

It's a shame, though, because they're great for tricep development. This was the lift that gave me my first boost of confidence from arm size when I first started BB'ing. Within 6 months I was repping 3 plates in my lap.


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

Phineas said:


> Take caution though -- this is a potentially dangerous lift for your rotator cuffs. I never had problems, but I've heard many people complaining about shoulder pain after bench dips.
> 
> It's a shame, though, because they're great for tricep development. This was the lift that gave me my first boost of confidence from arm size when I first started BB'ing. Within 6 months I was repping 3 plates in my lap.


 
 very true but wat a pump, holly toledo. i love them. i use the hammerstrength version but i like bench dips better. sometimes just doing higher reps.


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

unclem said:


> very true but wat a pump, holly toledo. i love them. i use the hammerstrength version but i like bench dips better. sometimes just doing higher reps.



Oh man I forgot about the pumps from bench dips! I couldn't wait for it when I was about to do them.


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## MDR (Jul 31, 2010)

Phineas said:


> How often do you train chest-dominant lifts?



Once a week during a strength/power phase.  A lot of people go for the less is more idea these days, but I'm 43, so I guess I'm a bit prone to higher volume lifting.  Nothing wrong with less sets and exercises if it works for you.


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## Phineas (Jul 31, 2010)

MDR said:


> Once a week during a strength/power phase.  A lot of people go for the less is more idea these days, but I'm 43, so I guess I'm a bit prone to higher volume lifting.  Nothing wrong with less sets and exercises if it works for you.



I think it's wise to play around with both. I've used both extremely low volume and (currently) extremely high volume. All methods have worked well, though I'm  thinking by my results on this program so far I'm more inclined to volume. I've never gained like this.


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## PushAndPull (Jul 31, 2010)

Gazhole said:


> Few sets of some type of bench usually works for me. Usually five reps, but thats just me. May not be enough volume for you if you're conditioned to more volume/bodybuilding type training.
> 
> *I do think a less is more approach to training chest is the best route to take for basically anybody though.*



The bold is definitely true for me. My chest respones great to 5x5. Of course just because this works well for my chest doesn't mean that it works as well for my other muscles.


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## MDR (Jul 31, 2010)

Phineas said:


> I think it's wise to play around with both. I've used both extremely low volume and (currently) extremely high volume. All methods have worked well, though I'm  thinking by my results on this program so far I'm more inclined to volume. I've never gained like this.



Could not agree more.  I think everyone should experiment and find out what works for you personally.  Funny thing is-as soon as I feel like I've figured out the perfect way to train, I need to make changes because my body starts adapting, and I need to do something different to keep things fresh.  Seems like the only constant long-term is change.  Gotta love this sport!  I do lean towards the higher volume end of things as well.


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## unclem (Jul 31, 2010)

MDR said:


> Once a week during a strength/power phase. A lot of people go for the less is more idea these days, but I'm 43, so I guess I'm a bit prone to higher volume lifting. Nothing wrong with less sets and exercises if it works for you.


 
 mdr, iam thinking along those lines as well i think to get out of this sticking point, use different gear and due higher reps ive been doing 10-12 but 16-20 1 x a week might break through this bs. but i want to get a median through all the guys that posted up here. iam studying this thread very intensly. wrote down all sets so far from everybody then going to devide.


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## Gazhole (Aug 1, 2010)

PushAndPull said:


> The bold is definitely true for me. My chest respones great to 5x5. Of course just because this works well for my chest doesn't mean that it works as well for my other muscles.



Usually people overtrain their chests so much that cutting back a little bit makes growth explode. I don't know why people equate chest and back as equal, the back is absolutely massive compared to the pecs.

Volume-wise, i think this is the order of things:

Legs
Back
Chest
Shoulders
Arms

Yet most programs are:

Chest
Arms
Shoulders
Back
Legs

Almost completely in reverse! Its no wonder so many people have trouble growing. They're trying to do le mans on a scooter and taking the ferrari down the shops. Use the big muscles for the most work, and the smaller ones for less work!

Sorry, rant over, lol 

But yes, my chest also responds really well to 3-5 sets of 5. And generally i only do bench. Maybe 3x8 on DB Bench sometimes - INSTEAD of 5x5 on BB.


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## PushAndPull (Aug 1, 2010)

Gazhole said:


> Usually people overtrain their chests so much that cutting back a little bit makes growth explode. *I don't know why people equate chest and back as equal*, the back is absolutely massive compared to the pecs.



The problem is that these people don't really give much thought to working out. They don't equate shit. All they know is that chicks dig the show muscles (arms, chest, and shoulders).



Gazhole said:


> Volume-wise, i think this is the order of things:
> 
> Legs
> Back
> ...



Completely agree with the ordering. Beginners often times see some good initial growth. This of course is a bad thing since they now believe that they have a great routine. Stagnation inevitably follows and their typical response is to increase the volume, which of course is not the way to go. I often wonder why so many people want to be able to lift heavy, yet never do it? Seems like common sense. How do you get expect to be good at something if you never do it? I could rant on as well  but i'll leave it on this note. It's not all their fault, there is a ton of fucked up information out there to mislead them.


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## DOMS (Aug 1, 2010)

PushAndPull said:


> I could rant on as well  but i'll leave it on this note.



Quitter.


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## MDR (Aug 1, 2010)

Gazhole said:


> Usually people overtrain their chests so much that cutting back a little bit makes growth explode. I don't know why people equate chest and back as equal, the back is absolutely massive compared to the pecs.
> 
> Volume-wise, i think this is the order of things:
> 
> ...



I would also agree on your order.  I think a lot of people lag on legs and back due to the fact that it takes real work to develop strong legs and back.  Many don't have the drive and determination to do so.

When I refer to my age, I am kinda mocking the fact that back when I started most EVERYONE was training with high volume.  These days there seems to be a lot more creativity and variety at work.  I applaud the fact that you have found something that works for you.  I have used similar workouts myself.  I just find after close to 30 years of training my body seems to adapt to whatever routine I am using fairly quickly.  I use multiple methods out of necessity.  Fortunately enough, I am able to make gains using both low and high volume methods.  If I was talking to a newbie, I would likely give them similar advice to yours, but I know Unclem has been training for a very long time, with a lot of success.

I also agree that over training is a huge problem for many lifters.  I think it's always interesting to hear what works for different people.


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## M-Rods (Aug 1, 2010)

Phineas said:


> Take caution though -- this is a potentially dangerous lift for your rotator cuffs. I never had problems, but I've heard many people complaining about shoulder pain after bench dips.
> 
> It's a shame, though, because they're great for tricep development. This was the lift that gave me my first boost of confidence from arm size when I first started BB'ing. Within 6 months I was repping 3 plates in my lap.


 
very true, i used to love dips but my shoulder just cant handle them any more, ive been trying pushdowns with a long bar and elbows flared trying to mimic dips


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## lifthvy (Aug 2, 2010)

MDR said:


> Could not agree more. I think everyone should experiment and find out what works for you personally. Funny thing is-as soon as I feel like I've figured out the perfect way to train, I need to make changes because my body starts adapting, and I need to do something different to keep things fresh. Seems like the only constant long-term is change. Gotta love this sport! I do lean towards the higher volume end of things as well.


 
^^^100% spot on


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## Energy (Aug 2, 2010)

One thing to consider is intensity.  Instead of focusing entirely on how many sets and repetitions think about other variables of training.

For example 8 sets with a 5 minute rest in between each set isn't as intense as 1 set of 2 different exercises (DB Flies followed by BB press) with only a 10 second break to absolute failure- that is intense in my opinon.


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## lewibnb (Aug 2, 2010)

i do 3 exercises for chest.
flat bench, incline and decline.

after the warm up, i start with a weight that allows me to get between 10 - 20reps.
i never count reps though, every set is a failure set.
i add 10kg each set and rep to failure.
my last set is when i do just 1 rep.

sometimes my total sets will equal as many as 20sets for chest, but total sets doesnt really mean anything since my last few sets are only 1's and 2's on each exercise.

every few weeks ill pre exhaust my chest with some flyes just to change it around abit.


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## unclem (Aug 6, 2010)

this has been a awesome feedback from everyone, i totally agree with gaz on the order of volume and alot of great info. i never , no matter how many sets, reps 1 hr 15 min is all i stay in the gym and thats on leg day because of deads otherwise its 1 hr or 45 minutes.


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## stylus187 (Aug 8, 2010)

unclem said:


> iam glad u mentioned dips as i havent done those in ages. thnx.


 I love doing dips, parallel bar, chair dips, weighted parallel. Am I one of the only people who truely understands the importantce of dips? so many people neglet them.


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## unclem (Aug 9, 2010)

stylus187 said:


> I love doing dips, parallel bar, chair dips, weighted parallel. Am I one of the only people who truely understands the importantce of dips? so many people neglet them.


 
 i already added them to my chest routine, and can see the middle of my chest seperate from the bottom half. i just totally forgot about them, plus with my new diet, my chest is poping. just being careful of my shoulders. iam going with 16 sets thats the only way my chest will pump up. i first tried 10 but that didnt cut it at all for me. i still had a chest that didnt get worked enough. now 2 days after chest it gets that pump feeling again for until my next chest day. insulin has alot to do with it. so iam pleased with the thread or i wouldnt remembered dips. now iam back up in weight where my trainer wants me until show time at 250lbs. thnx who ever brought up dips in the post. thnx everyone.


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