# Paleo-style eating: first impressions



## DOMS (Feb 20, 2014)

So...I've started eating a paleo-style diet. I should note that I started eating that way _before _I found out that it was a style of eating. I'd read so much on the ill effects of sugar and processed grains that I decided to cut back to next to nothing. But I knew I'd need carbs -- I'd already read about the downside to Atkins -- so I decided to eat fruit and vegetables. Then Dale and Capt'n turned me on to paleo. A friend gave me a copy of _Primal Blueprint _by Mark Sission. It's pretty much the paleo diet, but takes into account that we live in a modern world with modern considerations. In practice, it's a bit less restrictive than the paleo diet as outlined by Loren Cordain (who created the diet). Loren is a like a Shiite-Paleo Dieter (minus the suicide vest) and Mark is like a Catholic-Paleo Dieter (minus the child diddling).

I've been at it for almost six weeks, so my observations are just short-term.

First off, the fat continues to melt away. I've lost 8 pounds in the last 6 weeks. That includes posting higher numbers at the gym. I also drink plenty of water (I piss like race horse all day long). The point being that the loss has nothing to do with water or muscle loss. I'm willing to bet that I've lost more than 8 pounds of fat.

More important than that: eating has lost its urgency. I eat paleo-approved stuff all day long. I've only been hungry once -- just this morning actually. Then again, I just didn't feel like eating during the second half of yesterday. And that's the more important part. I used to crave all sorts of foods all the time. The physiological reason as given by Mark is that, because of over-consumption of carbs, the body goes into a vicious cycle of eating carbs -> high glucose (blood sugar) levels -> increased insulin production -> low glucose -> craving cabs -> eating carbs, ad nauseum. I can attest to this, anecdotally at least. Eating is no longer a driving force for me. I eat when I want to, which can be anywhere from two to eight times a day. Again, with that one exception, I haven't felt hungry since I started.

I don't count anything -- not calories or macros. I just don't care anymore. I simply eat the paleo-recommended stuff. Well...I do that about 85% to 95% of the time. I'm not abstaining from grains and sugar for ethical reasons, just personal health desires. So I don't beat myself up if I choose to eat a hamburger patty with a bun sometimes. And, just between you and me, I still sometimes eat Muddy Buddies or H?agen-Dazs ice-cream. Just don't tell anyone. I started at a much lower percent, but as I've eaten well, I find that it becomes easier.

I've also found that I'm less demanding when it comes to my food. For lunch today I ate a grilled piece of chicken (cooked plain, not even spiced) and slices of avocado. I would have never accepted such a "plain" meal before. But know I like it. _And I mean that_, I'm not forcing it down while regretting every bite, I really do like it.  I also tend to eat my veggies straight. I'll go through a tomato or bell pepper like an apple.

Another things is that I can quite eat the foods that I could before. I ate a bowl of cereal a week ago (it was Cinnamon Toast Crunch, goddammit!) and I felt sick afterward. The idea of eating another bowl of cereal does not sit well with me anymore. This I'm familiar with though. I've been here before when I ate clean (albeit on a diet with grains).

Lastly, I've found that getting up each morning is getting easier. I'm not exactly jumping out of bed, but I'm not dragging ass, either.

_Anywho_...that's just my observations six weeks into eating paleo. YMMV.


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 23, 2014)

It's good stuff. I'm starting a 4 week period of strict paleo starting tomorrow.


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## theCaptn' (Feb 23, 2014)

Good stuff DOMS!
I ate gluten and drank wine over most of dec-jan, put on 11lbs of bloat. It's taken me 3wks to shed it and a little more, but the 1st week was real hard getting back on track


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## _LG_ (Feb 23, 2014)

Lacto-paleo ftw


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 24, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Good stuff DOMS!
> I ate gluten and drank wine over most of dec-jan, put on 11lbs of bloat. It's taken me 3wks to shed it and a little more, but the 1st week was real hard getting back on track



4 tbsp of unmodified potato starch in water throughout the day will keep your blood glucose under control and mitigate a lot of the damage that comes with eating shitty food.  I take it every day.  It helps build a healthy gut flora, lot's of guys are doing it, especially type 2 diabetics.  My fasting BG runs 80 unless I am eating like shit, then it runs like 90. Before I started taking it my FBG ran between 99 and 105.  I have T2D clients taking it and most of them see a 30 point drop in their blood glucose within a couple of weeks with no other change.  It costs like $3.69 for 56 servings.  It's resistant starch so you can't digest it, it makes it's way to your colon where healthy bacteria ferment it.  Just don't heat it up or you will liberate the starch molecules.   It also crushes your appetite.


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## theCaptn' (Feb 24, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> 4 tbsp of unmodified potato starch in water throughout the day will keep your blood glucose under control and mitigate a lot of the damage that comes with eating shitty food.  I take it every day.  It helps build a healthy gut flora, lot's of guys are doing it, especially type 2 diabetics.  My fasting BG runs 80 unless I am eating like shit, then it runs like 90. Before I started taking it my FBG ran between 99 and 105.  I have T2D clients taking it and most of them see a 30 point drop in their blood glucose within a couple of weeks with no other change.  It costs like $3.69 for 56 servings.  It's resistant starch so you can't digest it, it makes it's way to your colon where healthy bacteria ferment it.  Just don't heat it up or you will liberate the starch molecules.   It also crushes your appetite.



So like a damage control during the festive season?


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 24, 2014)

Sounds great DOMS.
Don't know if I would have the discipline.
I do alright but my downfall is my daily non-diet, full 46g sugar 12 oz Mountain Dew.

The part about getting sick after eating something that just sounds so good is what happens to me when I eat fast food.
Smells great outside the Burger King, food Looks good, too. Tastes alright but not as good as you remember and the BAM...bloat, rumbling, toxic farts and blood stains in your underwear.

Keep it up and keep us posted.

Please get back to the child diddling in a suicide vest bit.


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 24, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> So like a damage control during the festive season?



Precisely, but you can take it all the time.  I do.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 24, 2014)

Lots of info on Raw Unmodified Potato Starch on the web...

One example:

http://freetheanimal.com/2013/04/resistant-assimilation-resistance.html


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## DOMS (Feb 24, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Good stuff DOMS!
> I ate gluten and drank wine over most of dec-jan, put on 11lbs of bloat. It's taken me 3wks to shed it and a little more, but the 1st week was real hard getting back on track



It's not an horrific thing falling off the paleo-bandwagon. So long as you get back on that is.

The crazy thing is about this is that I can hear my body talking to me. It tells me when I'm really hungry or not. What I need (fat, meat, veggies, fruit and water). It's like a voice that's been talking the entire time and that I'm just now able to hear. Strange, but true.

I also just made some home-made creme fraiche. It has to chill until tomorrow though...


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## DOMS (Feb 24, 2014)

Paranoid Fitness said:


> Sounds great DOMS.
> Don't know if I would have the discipline.
> I do alright but my downfall is my daily non-diet, full 46g sugar 12 oz Mountain Dew.



I got lucky. I eased my way into it before I knew what _it_ was. That included going cold turkey with caffeine (soda).



Paranoid Fitness said:


> The part about getting sick after eating something that just sounds so good is what happens to me when I eat fast food.
> Smells great outside the Burger King, food Looks good, too. Tastes alright but not as good as you remember and the BAM...bloat, rumbling, toxic farts and blood stains in your underwear.



I went out to eat on a dinner date last Saturday. Poor choices were made. I suffered all the want until late Sunday night.



Paranoid Fitness said:


> Keep it up and keep us posted.



Thanks, man!



Paranoid Fitness said:


> Please get back to the child diddling in a suicide vest bit.



I try to make my writings fun for all.


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## DOMS (Feb 24, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> 4 tbsp of unmodified potato starch in water throughout the day will keep your blood glucose under control and mitigate a lot of the damage that comes with eating shitty food.  I take it every day.  It helps build a healthy gut flora, lot's of guys are doing it, especially type 2 diabetics.  My fasting BG runs 80 unless I am eating like shit, then it runs like 90. Before I started taking it my FBG ran between 99 and 105.  I have T2D clients taking it and most of them see a 30 point drop in their blood glucose within a couple of weeks with no other change.  It costs like $3.69 for 56 servings.  It's resistant starch so you can't digest it, it makes it's way to your colon where healthy bacteria ferment it.  Just don't heat it up or you will liberate the starch molecules.   It also crushes your appetite.



This...I will definitely look into.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 24, 2014)

DOMS said:


> The crazy thing is about this is that I can hear my body talking to me. It tells me when I'm really hungry or not. What I need (fat, meat, veggies, fruit and water). It's like a voice that's been talking the entire time and that I'm just now able to hear.



OK, now you're playing the crazy card. Hearing voices and everything.
One cuckoo truck on the way. 





Next, you'll be hunting mammoths.


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## DOMS (Feb 24, 2014)

Paranoid Fitness said:


> OK, now you're playing the crazy card. Hearing voices and everything.
> One cuckoo truck on the way.
> 
> 
> ...



There are plenty down at Walmart.


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## Anabolic5150 (Feb 25, 2014)

Very interested after reading your review of this DOMS. Think I will pick up the Primal Blueprint and see what it is all about.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 25, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Very interested after reading your review of this DOMS. Think I will pick up the Primal Blueprint and see what it is all about.



Link to purchase the ebook

http://www.ebooks.com/635441/the-primal-blueprint/sisson-mark/


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## DOMS (Feb 25, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Very interested after reading your review of this DOMS. Think I will pick up the Primal Blueprint and see what it is all about.



Just wait until you get into the science behind it. It'll make you nauseated.


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 25, 2014)

DOMS said:


> Just wait until you get into the science behind it. It'll make you nauseated.



I thought that was the fun part.


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## DOMS (Feb 25, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> I thought that was the fun part.



No doubt. But damn, I'm getting tired of the shit.

I take nothing at face value. I always do my research. So I went looking for the detractors of the paleo diet. The _vast_ majority of them turn out to be meat-is-murder vegetarians. If you search on YouTube for "paleo diet", the top item is chick from TED "debunking" the diet. She outright lies about a ton of shit ("Human haven't evolved any traits to eat meat") and by omission ("trying to prove that humans aren't carnivores", we're omnivores). A lot of anti-paleo sites are Hindu, PETA, or the like. Science be damned. The other group is that-isn't-what-paleo-humans-actually-ate naysayers. They blather on about how the diet is wrong based on historical stuff, but a lot of what they says is qualified with "not clear" and "uncertain" and "must haves" bullshit. Also, neither address even the short-term efficacy of the diet.

God, I fucking hate people like that. They have their shitty beliefs and want to push them on other people. It's all kinds of fucking wrong when religious people do it, but it's oh-so-fucking-okay when they do it. I really fucking hate people like that; dicks and hypocrites.


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## DOMS (Feb 25, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Good stuff DOMS!
> I ate gluten and drank wine over most of dec-jan, put on 11lbs of bloat. It's taken me 3wks to shed it and a little more, but the 1st week was real hard getting back on track



Uh-oh, Captn', they're talking about you.


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## flood (Feb 25, 2014)

DOMS said:


> So...I've started eating a paleo-style diet. I should note that I started eating that way _before _I found out that it was a style of eating. I'd read so much on the ill effects of sugar and processed grains that I decided to cut back to next to nothing. But I knew I'd need carbs -- I'd already read about the downside to Atkins -- so I decided to eat fruit and vegetables. Then Dale and Capt'n turned me on to paleo. A friend gave me a copy of _Primal Blueprint _by Mark Sission. It's pretty much the paleo diet, but takes into account that we live in a modern world with modern considerations. In practice, it's a bit less restrictive than the paleo diet as outlined by Loren Cordain (who created the diet). Loren is a like a Shiite-Paleo Dieter (minus the suicide vest) and Mark is like a Catholic-Paleo Dieter (minus the child diddling).
> 
> I've been at it for almost six weeks, so my observations are just short-term.
> 
> ...



Dammit DOMS my eyes keep drifting to you avatar and I can't finish the damn article....


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## DOMS (Feb 25, 2014)

It's shit like this.

The spokes-bitch for Dairy Australia said:



> "To get the same amount of calcium as one serve of dairy you would need  to eat 32 brussels sprouts, 21 cups of raw chopped spinach, 11 cups of  diced sweet potato, six cups of shredded green cabbage or a cup of  dry-roasted almonds," she says."Core food groups exist for a reason:  they provide vital nutrients in quantities that other foods can?t."



All the pre-dairy humans must've lived a life of osteoporosis.



> Zucco  also cites recent research which shows that rather than contributing to  obesity and cardiovascular disease, dairy products are linked with  weight loss and improved heart health.



Good fucking god. Don't get me wrong, I still include a little dairy (just sour cream and creme freiche) in my diet, but she's trying to make it sound like a health food.

The truth is that I didn't even think about calcium intake in my diet. I just figured that I'd be getting enough from the veggies and meats. I just knew that bitch was full of shit. Just more outright lies and lies by omission. The answer to the question of calcium in a paleo-diet is found here, BTW. To the article's credit, they do mention how it works in the next paragraph. The article is actually pretty good, so you should read the whole thing.

I don't have all the answers to everything, but I'm smart enough to know what I'm being so obviously jerked around.

And the US News & World Report ranking stuff? Can you say, "arbitrary"? It sickens me the shit that passes for news these days. Especially in my own country.


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## DOMS (Feb 25, 2014)

flood said:


> Dammit DOMS my eyes keep drifting to you avatar and I can't finish the damn article....



I've had that for so long that I don't even see it anymore.


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## Anabolic5150 (Feb 25, 2014)

Paranoid Fitness said:


> Link to purchase the ebook
> 
> http://www.ebooks.com/635441/the-primal-blueprint/sisson-mark/




Thank you!!



DOMS said:


> Just wait until you get into the science behind it. It'll make you nauseated.




LOL. I hope not.


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## theCaptn' (Feb 25, 2014)

Dairy fats highlight in my diet. Grass-fed butter, double cream, creme fraiche - it's all creamy goodness!


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## flood (Feb 25, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Dairy fats highlight in my diet. Grass-fed butter, double cream, creme fraiche - it's all creamy goodness!


Can you say Kerry Gold? I can get grass fed beef easy but grass fed butter is a Costco run, and even then....


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## theCaptn' (Feb 25, 2014)

Yeah I hear Kerry gold is the benchmark in the US.


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 26, 2014)

DOMS said:


> No doubt. But damn, I'm getting tired of the shit.
> 
> I take nothing at face value. I always do my research. So I went looking for the detractors of the paleo diet. The _vast_ majority of them turn out to be meat-is-murder vegetarians. If you search on YouTube for "paleo diet", the top item is chick from TED "debunking" the diet. She outright lies about a ton of shit ("Human haven't evolved any traits to eat meat") and by omission ("trying to prove that humans aren't carnivores", we're omnivores). A lot of anti-paleo sites are Hindu, PETA, or the like. Science be damned. The other group is that-isn't-what-paleo-humans-actually-ate naysayers. They blather on about how the diet is wrong based on historical stuff, but a lot of what they says is qualified with "not clear" and "uncertain" and "must haves" bullshit. Also, neither address even the short-term efficacy of the diet.
> 
> God, I fucking hate people like that. They have their shitty beliefs and want to push them on other people. It's all kinds of fucking wrong when religious people do it, but it's oh-so-fucking-okay when they do it. I really fucking hate people like that; dicks and hypocrites.



Yeah, the people who debunk it often erect huge strawmen or tackle issues that were resolved in the Paleo community 5 or so years ago.  If you want to have your head spin, check out this hour-long presentation by Robb Wolf here.  There is a lot of bull shit in what most people do as Paleo (I call it meat orgy paleo) and applying a type of logic in avoiding one food while ignoring it in other foods, such as phytates which are high in grains but higher in nuts.  IMO, the nuts and bolts of it are that there are evoutionarily novel proteins that humans can't digest in certain foods (Pasteurized dairy, grains, and legumes).  This means they can make it to the bacteria in your gut and change your microbiome in a bad way.  I have a blog I am publishing on this tomorrow, I'll post it here.  

It simply comes down to the point that you shouldn't be eating processed food.  About the only one I can think of that's healthy is Olive Oil because there is so much science behind it.  Everything else is up in the air, so it is basically eat at your own risk.  If you get a chance, read or watch some videos on Pottenger's cats.  It shows how processing food can have a dramatic effect on a species over the course of 3 generations.  The form of processing they use is cooking, so the results aren't directly applicable to humans as cooking was an integral step in our evolution, but it is a novel form of processing to cats that they would need to adapt to.  In his studies, they didn't adapt well, most were neurologically fucked up and by the 3rd generation a large chunk of them were sterile.


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## flood (Feb 26, 2014)

Dale - are you posting a copy of your blog article on this thread? If not will you link to it in this thread plz.


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 27, 2014)

Oops, forgot.  Here it is.

http://synergyhw.blogspot.com/2014/02/the-humans-guide-to-being-human-problem.html


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 27, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Dairy fats highlight in my diet. Grass-fed butter, double cream, creme fraiche - it's all creamy goodness!



That grass-fed butter makes a great anal lube.


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## DOMS (Feb 27, 2014)

I have another observation. This one needs to be handled carefully, as it's a subject that lends itself to inappropriate humor. So, we're talking about...dropping the kids off at the pool...taking the Browns to the Super Bowl...dropping a deuce...pinching off a loaf...losing some weight, and lastly..."I'm a girl, I don't poop!"

Okay...are we past that now? Can we do the serious stuff?

Alrighty then.

I've found that pooping on a paleo diet isn't like it was before. I sit, I make a deposit, I wipe once -- barely anything on the tissue, I wipe again -- completely clean, and then I finish up with a good hand-cleaning. And the poop is one solid log. I now spend just a bit more time on the pot than I do at the urinal.

Before I had to sit for a few minutes up to ten or fifteen. It came out in pieces and often with a lot of liquidity. And I had to use a quarter of a roll of toilet paper.

I've sometimes wondered about that. Why was that other primates, and many other mammals, defecate neat and discrete droppings, but humans didn't? Yes, I sometimes ponder questions like that, it's who I am.  I think I now know the answer. When we eat what were supposed to be eating, we poop like most other mammals.

Just more FYI (and TMI) for you fine people.

Peace, I'm out.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 27, 2014)

5-Ways-Your-Poop-Can-Advise-You-on-Health

Dropping Obama at the pool.


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## theCaptn' (Feb 27, 2014)

DOMS said:


> I have another observation. This one needs to be handled carefully, as it's a subject that lends itself to inappropriate humor. So, we're talking about...dropping the kids off at the pool...taking the Browns to the Super Bowl...dropping a deuce...pinching off a loaf...losing some weight, and lastly..."I'm a girl, I don't poop!"
> 
> Okay...are we past that now? Can we do the serious stuff?
> 
> ...



With high fats (60-65% cals) - it generally just slides out.

The major thing for me is zero farting... I still take a digestive enzyme and probiotics though, even though I eat a shit tonnes of fermented food. Probably 2lbs of sauerkraut lol... Love the stuff!


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 27, 2014)

DOMS said:


> I have another observation. This one needs to be handled carefully, as it's a subject that lends itself to inappropriate humor. So, we're talking about...dropping the kids off at the pool...taking the Browns to the Super Bowl...dropping a deuce...pinching off a loaf...losing some weight, and lastly..."I'm a girl, I don't poop!"
> 
> Okay...are we past that now? Can we do the serious stuff?
> 
> ...



Animals in captivity and not fed their natural diet often have major GI issues. The Paleo Manifesto by John Durant discusses this. As for why you likely experienced liquid shit...diarrhea is essentially an increase in intestinal permeability to flush bad guys out of the colon. For some reason, humans release the protein zonulin when gluten hits the intestinal wall. All humans experience it and no other primate releases zonulin. Over time, your microbiome gets out of whack and it takes longer to fix this intestinal permeability. The end result...the squirts.


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## DOMS (Feb 27, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> With high fats (60-65% cals) - it generally just slides out.
> 
> The major thing for me is zero farting... I still take a digestive enzyme and probiotics though, even though I eat a shit tonnes of fermented food. Probably 2lbs of sauerkraut lol... Love the stuff!



Now that you mention it...yeah, I almost never fart anymore.

I'm telling you, nearly every time I think about it, I find something else that the paleo-diet has made better for me.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 27, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> I still take a digestive enzyme and probiotics though, even though I eat a shit tonnes of fermented food.



I agree with the probiotics and digestive enzymes. I take min. 2000mg/day probiotics not to mention the occasional yogurt (not man yogurt).

I only fart in church and elevators.
OK, just elevators, I don't go to church.


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## DOMS (Feb 27, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Animals in captivity and not fed their natural diet often have major GI issues. The Paleo Manifesto by John Durant discusses this. As for why you likely experienced liquid shit...diarrhea is essentially an increase in intestinal permeability to flush bad guys out of the colon. For some reason, humans release the protein zonulin when gluten hits the intestinal wall. All humans experience it and no other primate releases zonulin. Over time, your microbiome gets out of whack and it takes longer to fix this intestinal permeability. The end result...the squirts.



It just so happens that I've just read about the lives of cows in high density feed lots in _The Omnivore's Dilemma_. That is some horrible shit.


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## flood (Feb 27, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Oops, forgot.  Here it is.
> 
> http://synergyhw.blogspot.com/2014/02/the-humans-guide-to-being-human-problem.html


 From the article ->





> ...the American diet is about as diverse as a Ku Klux Klan meeting


lol copy that!


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## DOMS (Feb 28, 2014)

flood said:


> From the article ->
> lol copy that!



Twenty-five percent of everything in a grocery store has corn, or a derivative of corn, in it. Or so I've read.


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## DOMS (Feb 28, 2014)

There are times -- _very_ fleeting times -- where I think maybe I'd be better off being ignorant or just outright stupid.

I'd probably be happier, anyway.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Feb 28, 2014)

DOMS said:


> There are times -- _very_ fleeting times -- where I think maybe I'd be better off being ignorant or just outright stupid.
> 
> I'd probably be happier, anyway.



OK, become a liberal sheep, drink the Kool-Aid and collect public assistance. 
Happy, happy, happy.


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## Dale Mabry (Feb 28, 2014)

DOMS said:


> I'd probably be happier, anyway.



At least until you lost your leg to diuhbeetus...Or got cancer...or lost the function of the left side of your body from a stroke.


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## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

So I've just finished my seventh week on paleo (Primal Blueprint) and...

I've lost a net of 11 pounds. I've lost 14 pounds of fat each week, but I've also gain 3 pounds of muscle. It's been a crazy, phenomenal seven weeks.

I haven't shed weight like this since I was in my teens. It feels good in so many ways.


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## theCaptn' (Mar 9, 2014)

Great result doms - I can't remember, are you geared?


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 9, 2014)

Damn Doms, that is amazing!! Looks like I am for sure gonna have to give Paleo a strict run.


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## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Great result doms - I can't remember, are you geared?



That's a neg, Captn. I'm o'natural.


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## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Damn Doms, that is amazing!! Looks like I am for sure gonna have to give Paleo a strict run.



I'm not even strict. I'm, on most days, 85% to 95%. On rare days I'm as low as 65%. But those days are becoming so much rarer. When I do cheat, I often feel ill and my poop is less than perfectly solid.

I have never seen gains like this before. I'll reiterate: I do not count calories or macros. I just eat whenever the mood strikes me. Some days, I don't eat for up to 12 hours or more. Other days, I'll eat every few. My body really does talk to me like it never has before. Or, more likely, it's always talked to me but the overdose of carbs in the form of grains and sugar prevented me from hearing it. Those days are gone. Now it talks and I listen.


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## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

Oh, and just for a fuller picture, I'm doing the HSS-100 routine. My first full-on workout partner is a hyperactive 23 year-old. Neither one of us give the other guy a break in the gym. We've made amazing gains in the last four months. That routine is a crap-ton of fun. I just finished Phase 1 on Saturday. Monday is going to be a play day at the gym (going for PRs). I have to go to San Fran for a work for two weeks, but when I come back, it's Phase 2.


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## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

Dammit...

I didn't mean 14 pounds per week, I meant total over 7 weeks, or 2 pounds per week. Sorry about that.


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## theCaptn' (Mar 9, 2014)

DOMS said:


> That's a neg, Captn. I'm o'natural.



That's even more impressive! 

After a while you'll really notice when you eat some shitty food. Last night I ate these burgers at a friends place, pattys were processed and full of preservatives - felt ill for hours.


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## 1HungLo (Mar 9, 2014)

My wife and I just started Paleo today. I was hungry all day trying to figure out what I could or should eat. I'm really going to miss my carbs. We had oven roasted turkey for dinner and I sure missed the mashed potatoes and gravy, stuffing and dinner rolls. I sure hope I don't feel this hungry all the time.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 9, 2014)

DOMS said:


> I'm not even strict. I'm, on most days, 85% to 95%. On rare days I'm as low as 65%. But those days are becoming so much rarer. When I do cheat, I often feel ill and my poop is less than perfectly solid.
> 
> I have never seen gains like this before. I'll reiterate: I do not count calories or macros. I just eat whenever the mood strikes me. Some days, I don't eat for up to 12 hours or more. Other days, I'll eat every few. My body really does talk to me like it never has before. Or, more likely, it's always talked to me but the overdose of carbs in the form of grains and sugar prevented me from hearing it. Those days are gone. Now it talks and I listen.



Thanks for clearing that up DOMS, I need to clean up my eating a lot. Sitting at a soft 290 pounds, goal is 220. Paleo just makes sense after reading Primal Blueprint, I will start in the morning and so will my wife. Be ok if I hit you up with questions?


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## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> That's even more impressive!
> 
> After a while you'll really notice when you eat some shitty food. Last night I ate these burgers at a friends place, pattys were processed and full of preservatives - felt ill for hours.



Thanks, man.

I've never been spot-on enough on my diet to want to use gear. That may be changing though.

I'm still okay with main-stream beef, but I just can't do stuff like pizza anymore. Not a bit.


----------



## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

1HungLo said:


> My wife and I just started Paleo today. I was hungry all day trying to figure out what I could or should eat. I'm really going to miss my carbs. We had oven roasted turkey for dinner and I sure missed the mashed potatoes and gravy, stuffing and dinner rolls. I sure hope I don't feel this hungry all the time.



Like I said above, I've only been hungry once since I started paleo, but that was after a 20 hour fast. You just need to learn new meals and snacks. You can't reach for chips or rice like you used to. One of my new favorite foods is chicken with avocado. Both just diced and eaten together.

There are plenty of recipes online (including YouTube). Mark Sisson has some great books over at Amazon. The sauce book kicks ass. So much good stuff in there.

Let me know if you have any more questions.


----------



## 1HungLo (Mar 9, 2014)

Cool, thanks Doms.


----------



## DOMS (Mar 9, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Thanks for clearing that up DOMS, I need to clean up my eating a lot. Sitting at a soft 290 pounds, goal is 220. Paleo just makes sense after reading Primal Blueprint, I will start in the morning and so will my wife. Be ok if I hit you up with questions?



Most certainly! I'm not an expert of anything, I'm just putting what I know out there. If that 70 pound loss involves a high level of fat, then get ready for the fat to just melt off. I'm just going from 214 to down around 195 and that's what happened to me.


----------



## Anabolic5150 (Mar 9, 2014)

DOMS said:


> Most certainly! I'm not an expert of anything, I'm just putting what I know out there. If that 70 pound loss involves a high level of fat, then get ready for the fat to just melt off. I'm just going from 214 to down around 195 and that's what happened to me.



I'm ready to start melting it! Thanks so much!!


----------



## DOMS (Mar 10, 2014)

Bizarre...

I weighed myself on Friday and was 203, but I weighed myself this morning and came in at 201. I'm guessing that it has to be water loss. But I've eaten clean and drank plenty of water throughout the weekend. And there was no booze over the weekend.

I'll just have to wait and weigh again mid-week.


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 10, 2014)

1HungLo said:


> My wife and I just started Paleo today. I was hungry all day trying to figure out what I could or should eat. I'm really going to miss my carbs. We had oven roasted turkey for dinner and I sure missed the mashed potatoes and gravy, stuffing and dinner rolls. I sure hope I don't feel this hungry all the time.



You shouldn't avoid carbs, especially if you are training in the glycolytic energy pathway. Potatoes, and tubers are fine, as is fruit,


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 10, 2014)

DOMS said:


> Most certainly! I'm not an expert of anything, I'm just putting what I know out there. If that 70 pound loss involves a high level of fat, then get ready for the fat to just melt off. I'm just going from 214 to down around 195 and that's what happened to me.



I started fluctuating between 215-220 before Paleo 4 years ago and planned to go to 195, I hadn't been below 200 since college 15 years ago.  I'm currently at 185 and perfectly happy.  I also fast once a week for 18-24 hours.


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## 1HungLo (Mar 10, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> You shouldn't avoid carbs, especially if you are training in the glycolytic energy pathway. Potatoes, and tubers are fine, as is fruit,



Now that's interesting. The Paleo diet book my wife bought shows potatoes as being on the do not eat list. It says people living in the Paleolithic era would not have had the tools to dig them up with so they wouldn't have eaten them. 
I'm not yet familiar with the term glycolytic pathway, will they discuss that in the Paleo book? I mean I can figure out what it means by breaking glyco lytic down but I'm not sure I totally understand it. Can you elaborate on it? Thanks.


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 11, 2014)

1HungLo said:


> Now that's interesting. The Paleo diet book my wife bought shows potatoes as being on the do not eat list. It says people living in the Paleolithic era would not have had the tools to dig them up with so they wouldn't have eaten them.
> I'm not yet familiar with the term glycolytic pathway, will they discuss that in the Paleo book? I mean I can figure out what it means by breaking glyco lytic down but I'm not sure I totally understand it. Can you elaborate on it? Thanks.



Glycolytic means sugar burning, so higher intensity stuff such as weightlifting.  Prehuman ancestors likely ate tubers and dug them up.  Digging in the ground with a stick was certainly a step or 2 before developing atlatls and spears and hunting game.  So if you want to say that digging up tubers is too recent, eating muscle meats on the reg is even more recent so I'm not sure which book you have.  Some of the older stuff is kind of dated on the Paleo diet and I know a few people who have said certain thing were bad in teh past have rescinded a lot of it.  The Paleo diet isn't really about not eating foods that weren't available back then, olive oil wasn't available back then and is really healthy, same with broccoli.  The paleo diet is about identifying foods that may be problematic because they are novel from an evolutionary standpoint.  Potatoes are fairly innocuous, but if you eat white potatoes remove the skin.  The primary foods to avoid are grains, legumes and dairy as they contain novel proteins that we cannot break down, leaving long chains of peptides for bacteria in our gut to ferment.  Some people can get away with eating small amounts of certain grains, legumes or dairy, and some grains and legumes are less problematic than others.  Raw dairy also appears to be less problematic than pasteurized. I eat 2-3 sweet potatoes a day. The other things to avoid are seed oils like canola and soybean oil.  Stick to olive oil, coconut oil, and ghee.  Olive oil is ok because of it's strong track record in clinical research, those other oils are potentially inflammatory and have no scientific backing.


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## theCaptn' (Mar 11, 2014)

I found this on potato skins:

If the first thing you do before cooking a potato is peel off the skin, you're not alone. Although many people choose to peel the skin away from the potato before cooking and eating, leaving the skin on could be a healthier choice. The potato skin not only adds fiber and nutrients, but it also helps the flesh of the potato retain its nutrients.


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## 1HungLo (Mar 11, 2014)

Awesome, thanks for the info on potatoes guys!


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## theCaptn' (Mar 11, 2014)

Dale is saying remove the skin 1st, I'm hoping he can enlighten me


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## 1HungLo (Mar 11, 2014)

It makes sense to me to leave the skin on to help keep the nutrients in. I'm not sure if Dale meant to remove it before cooking or just to remove it before you eat it. What do you say Dale?


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 11, 2014)

The skin has problematic proteins that we have a difficult time digesting.  It also contains antinutrients that affect absorption of other nutrients.  Don't look at potatoes as a nutrient source, look at them as a starch source.  It probably won't kill you to eat the skin, I just avoid it because when you remove most other starch sources potatoes take center stage.


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## 1HungLo (Mar 11, 2014)

Great. Thank you Dale.


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## theCaptn' (Mar 11, 2014)

Dale is the skin problematic for sweet potato as well?


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 12, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Dale is the skin problematic for sweet potato as well?



Not that I am aware of.  Most eat the sweet potato skins.


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## theCaptn' (Mar 12, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Not that I am aware of.  Most eat the sweet potato skins.



The white ones with a purple flesh mashed with a little coconut oil ... Thanks me later


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## DOMS (Mar 12, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> I started fluctuating between 215-220 before Paleo 4 years ago and planned to go to 195, I hadn't been below 200 since college 15 years ago.  I'm currently at 185 and perfectly happy.  I also fast once a week for 18-24 hours.



I think this is where I'm headed.

I weighed myself again today and I'm still at 201. Crazy. That makes is a total of 13 net pounds lost, with somewhere around 4 pounds of muscle gained. I'm still a weak bitch, but I did a 1RM of squats at 360.


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## DOMS (Mar 12, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> The white ones with a purple flesh mashed with a little coconut oil ... Thanks me later



This almost sounds like a racist comment.


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 12, 2014)

I think I'll start a sticky for a Paleo thread if we can get more peeps to jump in.   I can post a bunch of blogs and stuff like that.  The human gut project is one of my faves, but there are tons and I have written a few blogs going behind the science of Paleo and tips.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 12, 2014)

I'd be interested for sure Dale, just 3 days into Paleo and hit my first carb fog but otherwise I feel great.


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## DOMS (Mar 12, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> I'd be interested for sure Dale, just 3 days into Paleo and hit my first carb fog but otherwise I feel great.



I'd also be down with a sticky.

What is a "carb fog"?


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## theCaptn' (Mar 12, 2014)

Sticky it is


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## theCaptn' (Mar 12, 2014)

I made this thread a sticky because the discussion is great for all levels of paleo dwellers.

Dale - I'd love to see a sticky covering your blogg and other resources!


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 12, 2014)

DOMS said:


> I'd also be down with a sticky.
> 
> What is a "carb fog"?



Brain fog from a lack of carbs.  When you remove carbs there is a small period of time where you are not yet metabolizing fat effectively due to high insulin levels and a lack of carbs in the diet.  Coconut oil is a good way to circumvent this issue.  So could eating Paleo friendly carbs like fruit and tubers.


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 12, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> I made this thread a sticky because the discussion is great for all levels of paleo dwellers.
> 
> Dale - I'd love to see a sticky covering your blogg and other resources!



I'll try to get on it this weekend.


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## theCaptn' (Mar 12, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Brain fog from a lack of carbs.  When you remove carbs there is a small period of time where you are not yet metabolizing fat effectively due to high insulin levels and a lack of carbs in the diet.  Coconut oil is a good way to circumvent this issue.  So could eating Paleo friendly carbs like fruit and tubers.



This stuff is amazing:

http://www.bulletproofexec.com/bulletproof-upgraded-mct-oil/


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## DOMS (Mar 12, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Brain fog from a lack of carbs.  When you remove carbs there is a small period of time where you are not yet metabolizing fat effectively due to high insulin levels and a lack of carbs in the diet.  Coconut oil is a good way to circumvent this issue.  So could eating Paleo friendly carbs like fruit and tubers.



Ah, good to know. I don't think I went through that because I really eased into low carbs. By the time I started paleo I was already more-or-less eating that way.


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## Ichigo (Mar 12, 2014)

I need to change my Die-t. Im going to get down with this.  Good info Doms.


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## DOMS (Mar 12, 2014)

Ichigo said:


> I need to change my Die-t. Im going to get down with this.  Good info Doms.



Glad to share, man!

I love this diet. I'm never coming off. The health benefits are just too great. I mean, I like the weight loss, but that's just icing on the cake.


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 13, 2014)

http://synergyhw.blogspot.com/2014/03/5-important-resources-for-undertaking.html

Blog on resources for implementation of the diet.


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## DOMS (Mar 15, 2014)

Now I know I'm not the only one.

A business acquaintance and I discovered that we both do paleo. During the conversation he mentioned how, after eating grain-free for some time, he realized that his body was talking to him. "I'm hungry. I want vegetables. No, I don't want spinach. I want a carrot." Stuff like that. Which is exactly how I am now. So it's something that you should look for after you start eating paleo -- it took about three weeks for me.


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## sewardfitness (Mar 15, 2014)

just stay high protein low carb and low fat


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## DOMS (Mar 15, 2014)

sewardfitness said:


> just stay high protein low carb and low fat



The paleo diet is not low carb, just FYI. I follow the Primal Blueprint and eat up to 150g of carbs a day. That's 600, or 30% of a 2000 calorie diet. And low fat is also crap.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 15, 2014)

6 days into Paleo and I feel great, have had zero hunger and being very strict and it shows. Brain fog is gone and it is nice to feel satisfied after a meal yet still eat what I want.


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## flood (Mar 15, 2014)

> Olive oil is ok because of it's strong track record in clinical research, those other oils are potentially inflammatory and have no scientific backing.


Good! Also, potatoes are in the nightshade family. http://www.thepaleomom.com/2013/08/what-are-nightshades.html


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 16, 2014)

DOMS said:


> Now I know I'm not the only one.
> 
> A business acquaintance and I discovered that we both do paleo. During the conversation he mentioned how, after eating grain-free for some time, he realized that his body was talking to him. "I'm hungry. I want vegetables. No, I don't want spinach. I want a carrot." Stuff like that. Which is exactly how I am now. So it's something that you should look for after you start eating paleo -- it took about three weeks for me.



That's how I'd describe it too, your body is sending signals that were being blunted and now they are coming through clear.  Your also likely re-establishing leptin sensitivity which is crucial for appetite control.




Anabolic5150 said:


> 6 days into Paleo and I feel great, have had zero hunger and being very strict and it shows. Brain fog is gone and it is nice to feel satisfied after a meal yet still eat what I want.



Sweet!


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 16, 2014)

flood said:


> Good! Also, potatoes are in the nightshade family. http://www.thepaleomom.com/2013/08/what-are-nightshades.html



Yup, but most people don't need to worry about them.  If you have an autoimmune condition or a fucked up gut you may need to avoid them for a while or altogether.


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## DOMS (Mar 16, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> 6 days into Paleo and I feel great, have had zero hunger and being very strict and it shows. Brain fog is gone and it is nice to feel satisfied after a meal yet still eat what I want.



That's good to hear. Just wait for that 3rd week or so.


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## DOMS (Mar 16, 2014)

Small update.

I'm down to 200 even. That's a net loss of 14 pounds (down ~17 pounds of fat and up ~3 pounds of muscle) is about 8 weeks.

The hard part so far is social eating. It's one thing to eat at a restaurant and try to find something close to paleo, but it's another when you go over to someone's house and they make you a dinner that's at or near 100% non-paleo. I'm not going to be that food douche that says, "I'm not going to eat your food" or "I brought my own" to a nice social dinner. So what I do is eat something paleo about 30 minutes before I leave. Then, at the dinner I take a small portions of several items and skip the worst of it. That way I'm genuinely eating, but not eating a full meal of it (often way too much). The downside is that it doesn't take much for me to have an upset stomach or bad toilet moment when eating that kind of food. But hey, sometimes being nice to your friends means that you suffer a bit. I mean, I'm not eating paleo because "grains are murder!", I'm just trying to be healthy. So it's all good.


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## DOMS (Mar 16, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> That's how I'd describe it too, your body is sending signals that were being blunted and now they are coming through clear.  Your also likely re-establishing leptin sensitivity which is crucial for appetite control.


 This sounds a lot like what I've gone through.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 16, 2014)

Got on the scale, down 7 pounds (mostly water due to the decreased carb intake) but pleased me none the less. I noticed that my midsection is tighter and I am a bit more vascular (again due to dropping water). The big thing for me is I am eating what I like, I am satisfied after a meal or snack and I am having zero cravings for the crap that made up the majority of my diet recently before Paleo.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 16, 2014)

Training question for any of you, are you still training as you did before starting Paleo? I ask because I have read what Mark Sisson wrote in the Primal Blueprint about training and it seems that he doesn't recommend a bodybuilding training style per say (unless I am reading him incorrectly). I am doing a modified push-legs-pull and want to get back to a modified DC style but just wanted some input from the guys following this thread.


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 16, 2014)

Depends on your goals.  I assume you are just training to be muscular and lean.  If that's the case, train anyway you want, just increase carbs if you are doing a ton of lifting and you see performance drop.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 16, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Depends on your goals.  I assume you are just training to be muscular and lean.  If that's the case, train anyway you want, just increase carbs if you are doing a ton of lifting and you see performance drop.



Thanks Dale, appreciate the response.


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## DOMS (Mar 17, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Training question for any of you, are you still training as you did before starting Paleo? I ask because I have read what Mark Sisson wrote in the Primal Blueprint about training and it seems that he doesn't recommend a bodybuilding training style per say (unless I am reading him incorrectly). I am doing a modified push-legs-pull and want to get back to a modified DC style but just wanted some input from the guys following this thread.



I've done _almost_ nothing differently in regards to training. I still go balls-to-the-wall at the gym. Hell, a friend of mine, who has weight issues, attributed the weight loss to the fact that I worked out. I pointed out that I worked out the same before and during paleo, and that the loss only happened after changing my diet. Also, I've been consistenly putting up higher numbers doing HSS-100 at the gym since going on paleo. Mark said that if you're going to do something like that then you should increase your carb intake. I didn't. I almost never go above 150g of carb a day. Most days I'm down around 100g. But...I need to point out that I don't do hard, consistent, cardio, such as long-distance running either.

Yeah, Mark doesn't seem to advocate crazy-level weight lifting. But I like it _waaay_ too much to stop. But I did cut back from 5 to 3 days. I should note that I just did a 1RM of squats at 365.

On a related note: just for giggles I weighed myself again this morning (when I weight, it's always first thing in the AM): 199.


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## Anabolic5150 (Mar 17, 2014)

199! That's awesome DOMS!! I'm going to train as I like to, as heavy as possible and do cardio for health and fat loss as well. I just like training that way and I believe with a Paleo approach to eating and keeping carbs around 100g a day that I can get where I want to be. Thanks for the great feedback!


----------



## Dale Mabry (Mar 17, 2014)

I would definitely advise people who are going to train hard to get more carbs.  Hormonally, specifically with the adrenals and thyroid, it's a bad idea.  Eat organ meats, too.


----------



## DOMS (Mar 17, 2014)

Anabolic5150 said:


> 199! That's awesome DOMS!! I'm going to train as I like to, as heavy as possible and do cardio for health and fat loss as well. I just like training that way and I believe with a Paleo approach to eating and keeping carbs around 100g a day that I can get where I want to be. Thanks for the great feedback!



It's not much, but it's what I'm doing.


----------



## DOMS (Mar 17, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> I would definitely advise people who are going to train hard to get more carbs.  Hormonally, specifically with the adrenals and thyroid, it's a bad idea.  Eat organ meats, too.



What amount of carbs would you recommend for those of doing just weights (me)? Or those doing weights and cardio (Anabolic150)?


----------



## theCaptn' (Mar 17, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> I would definitely advise people who are going to train hard to get more carbs.  Hormonally, specifically with the adrenals and thyroid, it's a bad idea.  Eat organ meats, too.



Most days my carbs are from vege only so I'd say 20g and I train/cardio 5 days a week. I think by keeping your fat intake around 65-70% I don't appear to be losing any muscle. Gears help, and I have a weekly refeed around 300g of rice/sweet potatoes. I'm still 233lbs


----------



## DOMS (Mar 17, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> Most days my carbs are from vege only so I'd say 20g and I train/cardio 5 days a week. I think by keeping your fat intake around 65-70% I don't appear to be losing any muscle. Gears help, and I have a weekly refeed around 300g of rice/sweet potatoes. I'm still 233lbs



Thinking about it, isn't that what gluconeogenesis is supposed to be for?


----------



## theCaptn' (Mar 17, 2014)

DOMS said:


> Thinking about it, isn't that what gluconeogenesis is supposed to be for?



Exactly. My workouts are still intense high volume, but the intensity and endurance of my cardio is a lot lower which makes sense.


----------



## Dale Mabry (Mar 17, 2014)

DOMS said:


> What amount of carbs would you recommend for those of doing just weights (me)? Or those doing weights and cardio (Anabolic150)?



I'd go 200, 150g may be sufficient. If you start having trouble sleeping up them.



DOMS said:


> Thinking about it, isn't that what gluconeogenesis is supposed to be for?



Yup, and gluconeogenesis is hard on the adrenals as is heavy lifting.  If you are doing a lower volume total body workout 3x a week 150g would be plenty I think.  The other issue is that it's hard to get enough thiamin through this diet unless you house nuts and thiamin is really important for both carb metabolism and adrenal function.  More of a problem for the crossfit crowd or people training at higher volumes.  I do one exercise for 3 sets each of push/pull/knee dominant/hip dominant work each time I lift which takes about 40 minutes 3x a week.  If you are in this ballpark I would think 150g would suffice, I generally get around 250g and maintain 185lbs easily.  You could also cycle carbs as Capt'n does and carb up around workouts.


----------



## Dale Mabry (Mar 18, 2014)

Here is a 3 part blog Robb Wolf did on carbs and is pretty close to my thoughts on how you should tread with Paleo and carbs.

www.robbwolf.com/2012/12/19/carb-paleo-thoughts-part-1/


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## DOMS (Mar 18, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Yup, and gluconeogenesis is hard on the adrenals as is heavy lifting.



What's the physiological reason for that?


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 18, 2014)

Cortisol stimulates gluconeogenesis in the liver.  It's not necessary for gluconeogenesis, but if you are training hard and not eating carbs it is likely what will increase gluconeogenesis.


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## 1HungLo (Mar 18, 2014)

I've been weight lifting 5 days then cardio one day and I've been running 150g last two weeks and so far so good. Question though, how could increase carbs help sleep?


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 18, 2014)

A lack of carbs will throw off your adrenals and/or thyroid.  I think Robb Wolf covers it in that blog.


----------



## DOMS (Mar 18, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> A lack of carbs will throw off your adrenals and/or thyroid.  I think Robb Wolf covers it in that blog.



I've read that ketosis is good short-term. Do you agree? If so, what would the limit be?


----------



## Dale Mabry (Mar 18, 2014)

You can likely do ketosis long term if you aren't training glycolytically.  The only problem is certain foods will fuck up your digestion if you reintroduce them fast.  For what you are doing you could easily go 4-6 weeks at 20g-50g per day, but you have to keep protein low too, I think below 20% of cals.  There is an awesome book called The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate living that is solid but I can't remember what number they give.  This calculator seems accurate to determine macros.

http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/


----------



## theCaptn' (Mar 18, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Here is a 3 part blog Robb Wolf did on carbs and is pretty close to my thoughts on how you should tread with Paleo and carbs.
> 
> www.robbwolf.com/2012/12/19/carb-paleo-thoughts-part-1/



Good read. I'm going to re look at my carb intake. I'm a fan of backloading carbs - keeps your brain clear and optimised for earning cash


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## Dale Mabry (Mar 18, 2014)

DOMS said:


> What amount of carbs would you recommend for those of doing just weights (me)? Or those doing weights and cardio (Anabolic150)?





theCaptn' said:


> Good read. I'm going to re look at my carb intake. I'm a fan of backloading carbs - keeps your brain clear and optimised for earning cash



There's a great Paleo Solution Podcast with Kiefer on Robb's site.


----------



## Dale Mabry (Mar 20, 2014)

Alrighty, guys.  Here's a series I did called the Human's guide to being human that brings you up to speed on how our body operates.  Once you understand this you can begin to understand why the Paleo diet works.

http://synergyhw.blogspot.com/2014/01/the-humans-guide-to-being-human.html


----------



## theCaptn' (Mar 22, 2014)

I ate Chinese today, think it was laced with msg ... Urgh ... Felt ill for hours


----------



## Dale Mabry (Mar 22, 2014)

I don't even bother with chinese now.  I can definitely feel it.  Heart pounding and not even remotely filling.  Pass.


----------



## theCaptn' (Mar 31, 2014)

Paranoid Fitness said:


> Lots of info on Raw Unmodified Potato Starch on the web...
> 
> One example:
> 
> http://freetheanimal.com/2013/04/resistant-assimilation-resistance.html



Bump - I've started a trial of potato starch, look fwd to see the benefits


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## Dale Mabry (Apr 5, 2014)

Are your shits massive yet, Capt'n?


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 5, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Are your shits massive yet, Capt'n?



Lol no but the clean out wasn't fun. It's taken me 5 days to adjust. Now 20g AM/PM.


----------



## Dale Mabry (Apr 5, 2014)

What do you mean clean out?  Squirts?


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 5, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> What do you mean clean out?  Squirts?



A lot of gas, liquid and fibre, smelt like fermented grass


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## Dale Mabry (Apr 5, 2014)

Damn, you must have had some bad gut bugs if you got the squirts from RS.  When I started Paleo I had diarrhea off and on for almost 6 weeks.  Prior to that I only experienced diarrhea after drinking beer, particularly wheat beers, now I have no problem on that front ever.


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 5, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Damn, you must have had some bad gut bugs if you got the squirts from RS.  When I started Paleo I had diarrhea off and on for almost 6 weeks.  Prior to that I only experienced diarrhea after drinking beer, particularly wheat beers, now I have no problem on that front ever.



Well I am running proviron and I understand oral steroids effect gut health, I thought as it is not methylated it wouldn't be so harsh.

In saying that, I eat fermented foods and take probiotics. Have been for 6 months. Thoughts?


----------



## Dale Mabry (Apr 5, 2014)

Keep it up.  Probiotic foods are probably your best bet as they are the beneficial bacteria packaged with their food source.


----------



## flood (Apr 20, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Keep it up.  Probiotic foods are probably your best bet as they are the beneficial bacteria packaged with their food source.


Glad you're behind it too. I just got on to fermented food from Fallon's book, Nourishing Traditions. Also bone broth soup. I saw Paul Chek's lecture, bought his book... learned about gut health and parasites... and then I learned the majority of our immune system is in the gut. So damn much to learn - it never stops.


----------



## flood (Apr 21, 2014)

LINK          The risk of lead contamination in bone broth diets. 2013 study                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                     





> The preparation and consumption of bone broth is being increasingly recommended to patients, for example as part of the gut and psychology syndrome (GAPS) diet for autism, attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder, dyslexia, dyspraxia, depression and schizophrenia, and as part of the paleolithic diet. However, bones are known to sequester the heavy metal lead, contamination with which is widespread throughout the modern environment. Such sequestered lead can then be mobilised from the bones. We therefore hypothesised that bone broth might carry a risk of being contaminated with lead. A small, blinded, controlled study of lead concentrations in three different types of organic chicken broth showed that such broths do indeed contain several times the lead concentration of the water with which the broth is made. In particular, broth made from skin and cartilage taken off the bone once the chicken had been cooked with the bones in situ, and chicken-bone broth, were both found to have markedly high lead concentrations, of 9.5 and 7.01 μg L(-1), respectively (compared with a control value for tap water treated in the same way of 0.89 μg L(-1)). In view of the dangers of lead consumption to the human body, we recommend that doctors and nutritionists take the risk of lead contamination into consideration when advising patients about bone broth diets.


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## kyle_85 (May 4, 2014)

Tough as hell for me to keep strength up on a paleo diet.


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## Big Smoothy (May 18, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Keep it up.  Probiotic foods are probably your best bet as they are the beneficial bacteria packaged with their food source.



I just started back on sugar free yoghurt or Kefir.

Is one of these small "cups" from the grocery sore per day enough?


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## Big Wave Gabe (May 18, 2014)

Big Smoothy said:


> I just started back on sugar free yoghurt or Kefir.
> 
> Is one of these small "cups" from the grocery sore per day enough?



I'd say that one enough is pretty good.  Kefir is better than, say, Greek yogurt.  Also Kombucha is a great way to get probiotics and keep the gut biome healthy.


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## theCaptn' (May 18, 2014)

Big Smoothy said:


> I just started back on sugar free yoghurt or Kefir.
> 
> Is one of these small "cups" from the grocery sore per day enough?



Add in other fermented food like sauerkraut


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## Big Smoothy (May 19, 2014)

Big Wave Gabe said:


> I'd say that one enough is pretty good.  Kefir is better than, say, Greek yogurt.  Also Kombucha is a great way to get probiotics and keep the gut biome healthy.



Cheers Big Wave,

One more question.

I always avoid sugar.

Some yoghurt has the sugar in it.  Sugar negates the probiotic benefits correct?

Cap'tn, thanks for your response also.


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## Dale Mabry (May 20, 2014)

You want to eat a variety of fermented foods to promote a diverse microbiome.  The current thinking is that soil-based probiotics are likely the way to go here.  That would mean stuff like sauerkraut is better than yogurt.  Kefir is definitely better than yogurt if you're going the dairy route.  For dairy, raw, grass-fed organic is the gold standard but very difficult to find.  I drink kombucha, eat suaerkraut and relish, and take Prescript assist which is a soil based probiotic.  I have access to Raw Organic grass-fed kefir but have shied away from it, but that may change,


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## theCaptn' (May 20, 2014)

Prescript assist is highly recommended ... I'm also seeing the benefits of unmodified potato starch


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## Big Smoothy (May 20, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> You want to eat a variety of fermented foods to promote a diverse microbiome.  The current thinking is that soil-based probiotics are likely the way to go here.  That would mean stuff like sauerkraut is better than yogurt.  Kefir is definitely better than yogurt if you're going the dairy route.  For dairy, raw, grass-fed organic is the gold standard but very difficult to find.  I drink kombucha, eat suaerkraut and relish, and take Prescript assist which is a soil based probiotic.  I have access to Raw Organic grass-fed kefir but have shied away from it, but that may change,



Thanks, Dale. 

Kefir is common where I am at in Vietnam.

As for sauerkraut, just buy it in a jar. It's a sauce / relish right?  Shit I cannot even remember and I've eaten it.

So, buy sauerkraut in a jar and put it on some food that goes well with it?  

Good?


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## theCaptn' (May 20, 2014)

Big Smoothy said:


> Thanks, Dale.
> 
> Kefir is common where I am at in Vietnam.
> 
> ...



I am sure in Vietnam they'll have their own version of pickled cabbage or other pickled vegetables. Koreans have kimchi which is the same thing.


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## erj (May 29, 2014)

hmmm...might try this...deciding on what diet i really want to try


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## Big Smoothy (May 29, 2014)

theCaptn' said:


> I am sure in Vietnam they'll have their own version of pickled cabbage or other pickled vegetables. Koreans have kimchi which is the same thing.



Yeah, I presume they have this. I am eating 1 cup of yoghurt per day at the moment.


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## Swolen22 (Aug 16, 2014)

Are potatoes and rice paleo?


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## theCaptn' (Aug 17, 2014)

Swolen22 said:


> Are potatoes and rice paleo?



If you want to be anal about it, no but they are a clean source of carbs. Definitely acceptable under the adapted Paleo banner.


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## rambo99 (Aug 17, 2014)

Did I hear ANAL?


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## Dale Mabry (Aug 24, 2014)

Swolen22 said:


> Are potatoes and rice paleo?



Peel regular potatoes and opt for white rice.  Whether they are Paleo or not is irrelevant, they are healthy starch sources that lack the negative aspects of things like bread, etc.


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## Big Smoothy (Aug 25, 2014)

Dale Mabry said:


> Keep it up.  Probiotic foods are probably your best bet as they are the beneficial bacteria packaged with their food source.



I have a cup of Kefir everday in the morning (no sugar of course).


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## Dale Mabry (Aug 26, 2014)

Big Smoothy said:


> I have a cup of Kefir everday in the morning (no sugar of course).



I love kefir, I can get raw organic from grassfed cows in PA, which from what I understand is illegal.


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## adolfsmithzx (Jan 26, 2016)

hi 
you are write. it is a first impression


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