# Cardio????



## DeadBolt (Oct 14, 2003)

I was wondering when everyone does their cardio?  I ussually do it rite after my workout b/c I am already in the gym, but I was wondering why people do it at different times in the day?  The only reason I can think of is for the reason I sometimes don't do it, I'm just to tired after a hard workout to do cardio.  Also can you guys tell me some pros and cons of doing it directly after the workout and hours before or after (seperate visits for lifting and cardio to the gym)?

Thanks


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## gopro (Oct 15, 2003)

The best time to do cardio for fat loss purposes is when glycogen and blood sugar are low. This would be first thing in the morning on an empty stomach or right after lifting weights. I try to do it first thing, but if thats not possible, it will be right after training.


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## shortstuff (Oct 15, 2003)

I find I get my best results with cardio when I do it first thing in the morning.  Post workout I am so drained from lifting that there is no way I want to be doing cardio, so in the morning I may be groggy but it wakes me I feel more energetic all day and then you are allowed to be in and out for your workout later that day.


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## Rocco32 (Oct 15, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> The best time to do cardio for fat loss purposes is when glycogen and blood sugar are low. This would be first thing in the morning on an empty stomach or right after lifting weights. I try to do it first thing, but if thats not possible, it will be right after training.



So if you do cardio after weights, how long are you at the gym on those days? Is it ok to go over an hour if your doing both?


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## gopro (Oct 15, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by rock4832 *_
> So if you do cardio after weights, how long are you at the gym on those days? Is it ok to go over an hour if your doing both?



My weight workouts last about 60-70 min. After workout cardio is high intensity and only lasts 15 minutes.


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## Rocco32 (Oct 15, 2003)

Good to know, thanks for the reply GoPro!


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## DeadBolt (Oct 15, 2003)

wow thanks for all the replies.

Now if I were to go in the morning how long should I go for?  Currently the few days I have time for after lifting I go for 15-20 mins.  And how often should I do it, every day I train?

Also, what should I eat after the cardio?  I currently eat before I go to class in the morning, 2 full eggs 3 whites, 1/2 cup oatmeal and a protien shake.

Thanks


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## shortstuff (Oct 15, 2003)

I would look to gopro but or some of the others around here but when I go post workout I go for appx 20-30 min max, because you are already in prime burning mode since you have burned through all your muscle glycogen stores while lifting, in the morning I would start at say 30 min and then after a few week reasses and then see if you need to adjust your diet or adjust cardio, adjust one or the other but preferably I would lok to your diet then to cardio.  Also, Start at say 3 days a week then reasses at after at least a few weeks.  It is all a matter of seeing what works for you and your bodym but cardio can not replace a good diet.


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## Skib (Oct 15, 2003)

i just started doing my cardio in the morning on an empty stomach and so far i love it... i've never felt so awake going into work at 9 AM... sometimes i feel guilty because my boss and co-workers still look like they just rolled out of bed and i'm bouncin' off the walls strikin' up conversations left, right and center 

i was thinking of doing it for 20-30 min 5 days a week (mon-fri) for 2 weeks... would this be a good idea? or would i be over doing myself?


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## DeadBolt (Oct 15, 2003)

Yea the only problem with me is I need to leave my house at 7am, and I currently wake up at about 5:30 am.  So I was thinking of maybe waking up running to the gym for 20 mins of cardio then coming home showering eating and school.  But if it takes to long to do the cardio and such in the morning I can't afford to get up earlier then I am now.   Thanks for all the posts so far.


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## vanity (Oct 15, 2003)

I agree with GOPRO.

Depends what your goals are though. If you want maximum fat loss, 1st thing in the morning is best.

If you want to build greater cardiovascular endurance then it would be better to do it an hour or so after a meal where you will be able to push harder.

Ultimately, only you can decide what the best time is for you. The important thing is to be consistent. Analyze your goals and then tweak the frequency and duration until you find what works best for you.

Maybe you could start your weight workouts with around 10 minutes of cardio as a warm up ( don't do too much or you will be too tired to lift) and then on (rest days) when you're not lifting, maybe you could do longer and more intense cardio sessions.

Just a suggestion.


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## Tha Don (Oct 16, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by vanity *_
> I agree with GOPRO.
> 
> Depends what your goals are though. If you want maximum fat loss, 1st thing in the morning is best.




before breakfast or after?

i could easily do both

i'm aiming for maximum fat loss

peace


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## bigbrownbear (Oct 16, 2003)

Go pro said



> My weight workouts last about 60-70 min. After workout cardio is high intensity and only lasts 15 minutes.




Is this interval style training, 1 minute on 2 minutes off or just 15 hard minutes non stop.

Also do you take your Swole V2/v12/plasma expander after youve finished cardio or can u take it before.


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## naturalguy (Oct 16, 2003)

I disagree about doing cardio on an empty stomach first thing in the morning.

First off the advantage of cardio is not what you burn during the session, the amount of fat you burn during cardio is very minimal. What cardio does is raise your metabolism for the hours following cardio. In other words you are burning more calories throught the day.

Doing cardio on an empty stomach first thing in the morning is risky for losing muscle. You have just gone 8-10 hours without eating anything and now you are going to do a high intensity cardio session?

If you are going to do it in the morning I would reccomend a shake before hand of whey and a small amount of carbs. I personally bracket my cardio workouts with these shakes, before and after.


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## bigbrownbear (Oct 16, 2003)

I disagree and think empty stomach or cardio before brekfast is great.

I did 12 weeks of dieting over the summer (naturally) and only did empty stomach morning cardio every day for around 45 mins at a moderate intensity, along with 4 x weighttraining workouts. i went from 199lb 16% to 175lb 7%. My condition totally changed and i put most of it down to good nutrition. But empty stomach cardio was a staple of my plan.

If i was to do it again i would use glutamine, bcca's or whey isolate before hand, but i would never not do morning cardio before breakfast.


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## Rocco32 (Oct 16, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by naturalguy *_
> I disagree about doing cardio on an empty stomach first thing in the morning.
> 
> First off the advantage of cardio is not what you burn during the session, the amount of fat you burn during cardio is very minimal. What cardio does is raise your metabolism for the hours following cardio. In other words you are burning more calories throught the day.
> ...


So do you also disagree with doing cardio right after weights? Or is that different?


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## naturalguy (Oct 16, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by bigbrownbear *_
> I disagree and think empty stomach or cardio before brekfast is great.
> 
> I did 12 weeks of dieting over the summer (naturally) and only did empty stomach morning cardio every day for around 45 mins at a moderate intensity, along with 4 x weighttraining workouts. i went from 199lb 16% to 175lb 7%. My condition totally changed and i put most of it down to good nutrition. But empty stomach cardio was a staple of my plan.
> ...




Here is the problem with your cardio on an empty stomach, keep in mind there are many factors so it may not be this one thing but:

You started at 199 - 16%, which means your lean mass was 167 lbs.

You finished at 175 - 7%, which means your lean mass was 162 lbs.

You lost 5 lbs. of muscle, yes you lost 25 lbs. overall and must look much better however I wouldn't give up 5 lbs. of muscle. If you were to have a small shake before the cardio this would protect some or all of that muscle loss.


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## naturalguy (Oct 16, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by rock4832 *_
> So do you also disagree with doing cardio right after weights? Or is that different?




Ideally it's best if you can keep your cardio and lifting sessions separate however I know in todays hectic busy world, time is tight. If you have to because of your schedule then do it after training however I like to separate the 2. The only thing I like to do after lifting is down my post workout shake.


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## bigbrownbear (Oct 16, 2003)

i know i lost 5lbs of muscle, and thats why i would use the supp's listed or a little whey isolate before hand. i learned something there fore sure. And i use this approach when i do a.m cardio now whilst adding LBM.


As stated though i would always do cardio before breakfast. I also would never have carbs before hand and if I really wanted to get lean not have any carbs after either - just p/f


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## gopro (Oct 16, 2003)

To answer some questions above:

-My post workout cardio is a down and dirty 15 killer minutes...no intervals, just 15 ugly minutes of sweat

-You can easily prevent the loss of muscle from morning cardio through the use of BCAAs, glutamine, and a little fat...you can even throw in phosphatidylserine for cortisol blunting...alternatively, have a small whey shake...I prefer using the supps

-The "afterburn" for cardio is not that long...maybe 6 hrs. The afterburn from weight training can last 24!


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## Rocco32 (Oct 16, 2003)

Gopro, are you saying that you can use BCAA's, glutamine, and fat OR you can use a whey Shake. One or the other? And am I correct in assuming you should consume this PWO?


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## BabsieGirl (Oct 16, 2003)

I do cardio in the morning an hour after drinking my protein Shake(with water) Amino Acids and BCAA's during cardio & weight training
In the evenings I will do them after weight training for 25 mins. or so.


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## DeadBolt (Oct 16, 2003)

So if I were to start at like 6 am when my gym opens would 20 mins of cardio be ok to start with?  I have currently been doing 15-20 mins after lifting so I know I can handle that.  

And would it be better to take a small amount of whey before cardio then a full meal w/ glutimine afterwords or jsut go in on an empty stomach?  Sorry what are BCAA's?


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## naturalguy (Oct 17, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by DeadBolt *_
> So if I were to start at like 6 am when my gym opens would 20 mins of cardio be ok to start with?  I have currently been doing 15-20 mins after lifting so I know I can handle that.
> 
> And would it be better to take a small amount of whey before cardio then a full meal w/ glutimine afterwords or jsut go in on an empty stomach?  Sorry what are BCAA's?



20 mins. is fine however just make sure that you do it with enough intensity.

You should have a shake before hand, I would reccomend a whey shake with a small amount of carbs. If you do it on an empty stomach, you are more than likely going to lose muscle.


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## naturalguy (Oct 17, 2003)

BCAA's are Branch Chain Amino Acids.

These will help protect  muscle loss however you don't need to take an extra BCAA supplement if you are taking a good quality whey protein. The whey I use is 30% BCAA's.


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## Rocco32 (Oct 17, 2003)

I use optimum whey protein, do you know if that is good enough or should I suplement with bcaa's


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## bigbrownbear (Oct 17, 2003)

OK ive thought about this and the perfect scenario would be wake up and down one or combination of both 10g of BCCA's and glutamine, along with 5g of fish oil, 10-20 mins later your doing 45 mins low intensity cardio. and no muscle should be lost.


However having gopro advise 15 mins of hardcore cardio after a gruelling weights session sounds interesting to me..........crazy too.......but i love crazy.........i wonder can u do this to stay lean when building lean mass, or would this detract from muscle gain too much??????? 

GOPRO??????


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## naturalguy (Oct 17, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by bigbrownbear *_
> OK ive thought about this and the perfect scenario would be wake up and down one or combination of both 10g of BCCA's and glutamine, along with 5g of fish oil, 10-20 mins later your doing 45 mins low intensity cardio. and no muscle should be lost.




I don't know about perfect. You really don't want fat at this time as it takes a long time to break down. Also you are better off with a scoop of whey protein rather than taking a BCAA supplement as you will get more BCAA's in the whey plus all the other amino's. You would also ideally have a small amount of carbs at this time as well.


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## naturalguy (Oct 17, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by rock4832 *_
> I use optimum whey protein, do you know if that is good enough or should I suplement with bcaa's



Optimum is very high in BCAA content, no need for a separate BCAA supplement.


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## gopro (Oct 17, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by bigbrownbear *_
> OK ive thought about this and the perfect scenario would be wake up and down one or combination of both 10g of BCCA's and glutamine, along with 5g of fish oil, 10-20 mins later your doing 45 mins low intensity cardio. and no muscle should be lost.
> 
> 
> ...



Yes, this is a great way to stay lean while adding muscle. Even just 2-3 days per week is enough of this. Do not do it on leg day!


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## gopro (Oct 17, 2003)

My advice about morning cardio is this:

1- consume 5 g BCAAs, 5 g glutamine, and 1/2 tbsp of flax
2- do cardio
3- consume 30-50 g whey protein and small amount of carbs

Alternatively you can simply consume a carb free whey shake and do cardio minutes later, but my preferred method is the one above.


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## naturalguy (Oct 17, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> My advice about morning cardio is this:
> 
> 1- consume 5 g BCAAs, 5 g glutamine, and 1/2 tbsp of flax
> ...




Gopro,

      Gotta ask, why the flax at this time? Doesn't fat take a while to break down?


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## BabsieGirl (Oct 17, 2003)

I was told that flax and good carb is best after a work out.  As, your body will use it rather than store it.

I don't think I explained that right...I'll leave it to GP


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## DeadBolt (Oct 17, 2003)

Ok sounds good to me heh.

I use Opt Nut 100% whey and I ussually have a full shake w/ breakfast.  So instead of buying BCAA's could I just like split my shake in half and do half before cardio and half after?  Or would it be better to just take BCAA's serperate in the morning follow by a shake after cardio?  And also could I continue eating my typical full breakfast afterwards or should I change what I eat?


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## BabsieGirl (Oct 17, 2003)

I would still buy BCAA's for during your work outs and hard cardio sessions.

I would drink 8oz protein in am before cardio session...hour later....do your cardio.........then eat your eggs, yolk/carb and other supplements......


Uh..what do you mean by full breakfast?


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## DeadBolt (Oct 17, 2003)

For breakfast I ussually have 1/2 oats, whey, 2 full eggs and 3 whites.  Thats ussually at about 6:30 am.  If I were to start doing cardio in the morning I would be starting at 6 am and ending I guess 6:20-6:30am.

Now if I were to start taking BCAA's when would I take them in relation to cardio and lifting?  Sorry this one is totaly new to me.  I never knew that at different times of the day your body was prime for certain activities and such so I am just loving learning all about it.


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## BabsieGirl (Oct 17, 2003)

Me personally....I take BCAA's if I start to feel worn down during a work out or cardio session.  It picks me up.

I think you need more natural protein after your work out.  
Try
6 egg white
2 Yokes
Grapefruit 1/2
Sweet- n- low
8oz water 
Supplements

I would do your cardio for 30 min if you're not going to hit it hard.
Try...4.0 on tread for 30 min...incline at 5.


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## DeadBolt (Oct 17, 2003)

But if I were to take my glutimine wouldn't the grapefruit kill it?  Also by suppliments do you mean the whey?  I only take a multi in the morning.  

I will reply later on I gotta run.  Thanks for the help.


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## BabsieGirl (Oct 17, 2003)

I take my Glute in the PM before Bed....Sometimes if I forget to take it before bedtime...I'll take it immedidatly in the AM.....I'll scoop it up in a spoon...shake it off in my mouth..Swish it around with water......and swallow.....then drink my 8oz of protein etc....

I don't know how Grapefruit interacts with Glute.


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## BabsieGirl (Oct 17, 2003)

Opps....No...when I say supplements...I mean..protein pills, thermogenics...vitamins.....the normal drill


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## DeadBolt (Oct 17, 2003)

I think any heavy acid kills the glute.  But Im not to sure.

Is there like a certain brand I should stear clear from or a must have?  And how are the BCAA's taken (poweder, pill, liquid?)  I am assuming powder b/c gopro said 5g's.

So either morning or night with the glute & BCAA's, then a small protien shake, 30 mins cardio, then a meal w/ high protien.  I am gonna try it out to see if I can handle it or just stick to rite after the lifting.  Thanks


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## bigbrownbear (Oct 17, 2003)

OK its 7.30 am here in the uk and i ve just had 5g glutamine, 5g bcca's, 1 g ALCAR, 300mg Green Tea - 65% EGCG, 1 teaspoon of flax oil, loads of water and im ready to go.

I wanna say thanks to Gopro - if anyone was thinking about using him as thier PT or advisor, then this is one thread that justifies why - does he have some gems - i wanna work with you soon GP. Thanks again.

Also if your gonna use BCCA just make sure you have at least 50% coming for from L-Leucine. I just formulated my own and have 55% L-Leucine and 22.5% Valine and Iso Leucine to give the best effect


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## Tank316 (Oct 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by naturalguy *_
> Gopro,
> 
> Gotta ask, why the flax at this time? Doesn't fat take a while to break down?


it slows down the absorbtion rate of the glutamine and the bcaas. during  intense excersise bcaas and glut are used a up right away, the flax slows the process up, meaning that catabolism of the muscle also slows up.


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## BlueCorsair (Oct 18, 2003)

Hmmm.... I've been observing this thread since the beginning, and I'm afraid I have a rather basic, quite possibly ignorant question.

With so many people (even here on the boards) praising cardio on an exmpty stomach, doesn't consuming any sort of calories before doing it render it less effective?

I mean, it's either empty stomach, or shove down a tablespoon of natural PB, and a whey shake? (I've no flax oil around the house at the moment - and are we talking a 20 to 40 gram protein shake?).

I'm a little confused here.

Also, I'm currently working on my mass program, so how many times (I'm sure this has been asked) should I do my pre-breakfast cardio per week? Two or three I'd think.

Any answer to either question appreciated.

How about doing cardio on an empty stomach, and then slamming down a nice whey shake after? It's supposed to stop catabolism after lifting weights, so shouldn't it have a similar effect after cardio?  I'd prefer not to eat/drink anything before hand, as my stomach doesn't handle rigourous exercise early in the A.M. unless it's empty...


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## Tha Don (Oct 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by naturalguy *_
> 20 mins. is fine however just make sure that you do it with enough intensity.
> 
> You should have a shake before hand, I would reccomend a whey shake with a small amount of carbs.



What carbs do you recommend?

Something like a bowl of oats

or something like a bananna/apple/wheat pitta?

or is there something better than all of these you can suggest?

damm its saturday morning i'm bout to do a cardio session, not 100% sure what to eat, prob just gonna have a shake and a little little bit of oats, dunno if that will be perfect but times running out and i have to do it soon, ain't eaten yet

peace


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## BlueCorsair (Oct 18, 2003)

I trust the pro's here, but in a strictly numbers sense, the cardio, if done after taking a shake/flax/pv + whatever else is only going to burn that off.

The only benefit would be the metabolism boost then, correct? I though the empty-stomach was advised because your body *had* to turn to fat for the energy. A quick protein shake immediately after 20 mins of cardio should suffice to counter-balance any negative effects on muscle shouldn't it?


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## naturalguy (Oct 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by BlueCorsair *_
> I trust the pro's here, but in a strictly numbers sense, the cardio, if done after taking a shake/flax/pv + whatever else is only going to burn that off.
> 
> The only benefit would be the metabolism boost then, correct? I though the empty-stomach was advised because your body *had* to turn to fat for the energy. A quick protein shake immediately after 20 mins of cardio should suffice to counter-balance any negative effects on muscle shouldn't it?



Cardio, especially if only done for 20 minutes, burns minimal fat WHILE you do it. The benefit of cardio is that it raises your metabolism for hours after it is done.


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## naturalguy (Oct 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by young d *_
> What carbs do you recommend?
> 
> Something like a bowl of oats
> ...



I personally go against the grain, I have a scoop of whey isolate (24 grms.) with 15 grams of dextrose & 5 grms. glutamine before and after my cardio sessions. I find this to be the best formula for me to help protect me from losing muscle and it gets my metabolism jacked. I do very intense cardio.


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## bigbrownbear (Oct 18, 2003)

Well My cardio session todays was an easy 5.5 miles jog in 45 mins keeping my heart rate 140 - i only jog/run on weekends, to keep me out of the gym. When i do cardio i never go above 45 mins, as ive experienced catabolism going above this. 

The EFA's before cardio i believe will also your tune body in to burnng fat quicker aswell as keeping you out of catabolism.

Im building Lean Mass at the mo and i do 3-4 x cardio on off days. But i will give gopro's recommendation and try 10-15 mins of hardcore cardio after a weights session on a non legs day - sounds awesome - be lean, muscular and ultrafit - thats what i call 21st century BB


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## Jill (Oct 18, 2003)

Im doing TP's carb cycling (5 meals) and dont like to waste my carb meals before cardio.  What I have is 1 1/2 scoops of protein and some efas, then do 30 min of cardio, weight train, then another 30 min of cardio (if i can!) then come home and have my carb meal(and protein of course!). Any suggestions?


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## naturalguy (Oct 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Jill *_
> Im doing TP's carb cycling (5 meals) and dont like to waste my carb meals before cardio.  What I have is 1 1/2 scoops of protein and some efas, then do 30 min of cardio, weight train, then another 30 min of cardio (if i can!) then come home and have my carb meal(and protein of course!). Any suggestions?




I would suggest that you do not do your cardio before lifting, it will affect your lifting and it is more efficient for burning fat to do it after. 

I am not allowed to comment on TP's carb cycling, which I don't know why it's called "TP's" because carb cycling has been around forever.


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## heeholler (Oct 18, 2003)

Lifting first will utilize your glucose for fuel, cardio afterwards will utilize fat burning after glycogen stores are depleted.


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## KittyCat (Oct 18, 2003)

I am wanting to double up on cardio daily, with one rest day per week- if I do cardio in the morning and at night, is it ok for it to be moderate intensity? Or should I just shoot for target HR!? I am looking at max bf loss and am carb cycling according to Jodi N TP's examples in the sticky forum n articles......


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## P-funk (Oct 18, 2003)

why two cardio seesions a day?   why not one lifting session and one cardio session?


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## Jill (Oct 18, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by naturalguy *_
> I would suggest that you do not do your cardio before lifting, it will affect your lifting and it is more efficient for burning fat to do it after.
> 
> I am not allowed to comment on TP's carb cycling, which I don't know why it's called "TP's" because carb cycling has been around forever.


I hear that a lot ! But honestly Ive been doing my cardio before weights for years, and it has never affected my weight training. Ive tried doing cardio after weights but am exhausted. Thats why Ive been spliting it up-30 mins cardio, weights, then 30 mins,  cardio. Think thats ok? Thanks for the above advice


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## KittyCat (Oct 19, 2003)

Thanks for the reply, P-Funk..I do lift as well as cardio, I have bf to lose at this time and am just maintaining my muscle, so I am really focused on modifying cardio and diet only. SO!? What in the world to do.. I love this forum because I can read and learn so much, and gain some motivation.


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## gopro (Oct 20, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by bigbrownbear *_
> OK its 7.30 am here in the uk and i ve just had 5g glutamine, 5g bcca's, 1 g ALCAR, 300mg Green Tea - 65% EGCG, 1 teaspoon of flax oil, loads of water and im ready to go.
> 
> I wanna say thanks to Gopro - if anyone was thinking about using him as thier PT or advisor, then this is one thread that justifies why - does he have some gems - i wanna work with you soon GP. Thanks again.



You are welcome. And thank you too.


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## BlueCorsair (Oct 20, 2003)

Regarding the flax, BCAA's + glut, is it possible to substitute another healthy fat in place of the flax? Perhaps natural PB, or something else?

Also, how long should you wait after consuming these before doing the cardio?

And are we talking monster HIIT, or regular. Personally, I'm a pretty slim guy (but would like to finish toning), and hardgainer of course, and I'd rather not risk flushing meager gains down the can with cardio.


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## once was fat (Oct 30, 2003)

Ok so my lifting usually last one hour and I do cardio for at least 30min right after.  I usually burn around 400 calories each time.  So am I losing mucle and is my weight routine useless.   I am trying to loose a good deal of weight, and my goal is to get cut instead of bulking up.


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## Mudge (Oct 30, 2003)

I used to like doing cardio after weights, problem is that is the perfect time to get some protein/carbs into your system, so it is not 100% optimal for muscle gains.

Everyone is different though, measure yourself weekly, although sometimes water loss and such can be hard to judge in such a short timespan.


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## HoldDaMayo (Oct 30, 2003)

i've had my best fat loss doing weights 3-4 days a week in the evening and cardio and abs 5 days a week in hte morning...

splitting the cardio makes the morning workout less hassle and the weights I feel like I'm a monster, 100% focused on lifting heavy and hard... it's easier mentally to get 100% out of your weights and 100% out of your cardio if you are actually 100% when you do them.


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## Grant_73 (Oct 31, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> The best time to do cardio for fat loss purposes is when glycogen and blood sugar are low. This would be first thing in the morning on an empty stomach or right after lifting weights. I try to do it first thing, but if thats not possible, it will be right after training.


Wouldn't doing cardio first thing in the morning on an empty stomach breakdown your muscles?  And wouldn't doing cardio right after training be negative because you will miss the opportunity to take in a post work-out shake immediatly after training?


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## bigbrownbear (Nov 1, 2003)

Grant if u read the whole thread, everything is explained.


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## Grant_73 (Nov 1, 2003)

Why must sometime must I be so lazy?   Sorry for not reading it all.


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## Jodi (Nov 1, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by naturalguy *_
> I would suggest that you do not do your cardio before lifting, it will affect your lifting and it is more efficient for burning fat to do it after.
> 
> I am not allowed to comment on TP's carb cycling, which I don't know why it's called "TP's" because carb cycling has been around forever.


Probably because she's following what *TP* outlined in his article.  Carb cycling may have been around forever but TP's outline is his own.  Not saying others may not have tried similar approaches but she _is_ following _his_ article.


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## Jodi (Nov 1, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Jill *_
> I hear that a lot ! But honestly Ive been doing my cardio before weights for years, and it has never affected my weight training. Ive tried doing cardio after weights but am exhausted. Thats why Ive been spliting it up-30 mins cardio, weights, then 30 mins,  cardio. Think thats ok? Thanks for the above advice


 Never do cardio before weights.  You want to keep your glycogen stores to use during your lifting to max your workouts.  Then after your workouts you've depleated alot of glycogen and now you have a better chance of using fat stores for energy during your cardio session.  If you do it before your weights your just wasting away precious glycogen that should be used for lifting.


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## Jill (Nov 1, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Jodi *_
> Never do cardio before weights.  You want to keep your glycogen stores to use during your lifting to max your workouts.  Then after your workouts you've depleated alot of glycogen and now you have a better chance of using fat stores for energy during your cardio session.  If you do it before your weights your just wasting away precious glycogen that should be used for lifting.



Im not sure if this is a dumb question but what does glycogen do? I love cardio before weights.  Ive never felt week by doing cardio first. What do you recommend Jodi? Do you think I am still burning fat if I do cardio first?


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## Jodi (Nov 2, 2003)

No your probably not burning fat if your doing your cardio before weights. 

Carbs turn to glucose and then glycogen is produced by the liver and stored in muscle cells.   During your strenuous activity, energy is released in the muscles by conversion of glycogen to lactic acid.  So if you use your muscle glycogen before your weight training by doing cardio first, you are wasting your primary energy stores.


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## Jill (Nov 2, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by Jodi *_
> No your probably not burning fat if your doing your cardio before weights.
> 
> Carbs turn to glucose and then glycogen is produced by the liver and stored in muscle cells.   During your strenuous activity, energy is released in the muscles by conversion of glycogen to lactic acid.  So if you use your muscle glycogen before your weight training by doing cardio first, you are wasting your primary energy stores.


Appreciate your advice! Im gonna try switcing things around, and see if I get some better results! Weights than cardio. Your a great lady Jodi.


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