# Do bodybuilders take sterioids?



## Alleyezonme (Feb 6, 2007)

To get as big as say ronnie coleman, does one need to take steroids? (i personally would never) but do alot of bodybuilders take roids?


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## kidbodybilder (Feb 6, 2007)

every one as big as him does


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## Arnold (Feb 6, 2007)

Alleyezonme said:


> To get as big as say ronnie coleman, does one need to take steroids? (i personally would never) but do alot of bodybuilders take roids?



to sum it up *every* IFBB pro bodybuilder uses many drugs including steroids.


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## ponyboy (Feb 6, 2007)

Simple answer:  Yes.  All of them do.  In fact, many of the people at your gym do as well.  Many weekend warrior type A guys do a cycle or two to get some more muscle without having to work for it.


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## musclepump (Feb 6, 2007)

ponyboy said:


> Simple answer:  Yes.  All of them do.  In fact, many of the people at your gym do as well.  *Many weekend warrior type A guys do a cycle or two to get some more muscle without having to work for it.*



That's the most insulting statement I've ever read from you. Do you think steroids are magic?


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## KelJu (Feb 6, 2007)

musclepump said:


> That's the most insulting statement I've ever read from you. Do you think steroids are magic?



I would have to agree. What do you think? Somebody shoots up and muscles magically appear. We aren???t talking about synthenol.


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## Doublebase (Feb 6, 2007)

no


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## Billie7 (Feb 6, 2007)

KelJu said:


> I would have to agree. What do you think? Somebody shoots up and muscles magically appear. We aren???t talking about synthenol.



Exactly!  I don't and never would do steroids, but to think you just use them and then muscles magically appear is just dumb!  You still have to work your butt of in the gym!


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## largepkg (Feb 6, 2007)

KelJu said:


> I would have to agree. What do you think? Somebody shoots up and muscles magically appear. We aren???t talking about synthenol.



I agree completely! Right or wrong, I've never worked harder than while on cycle.


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## NordicNacho (Feb 6, 2007)

I think when he said work at it is these guys hes talking about could get the same results if they would have done it naturally it just takes a bit longer and isn't as hard on the body.  If you know what i mean.


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## largepkg (Feb 6, 2007)

NordicNacho said:


> I think when he said work at it is these guys hes talking about could get the same results if they would have done it naturally it just takes a bit longer and isn't as hard on the body.  If you know what i mean.



If that's what he meant I disagree with it as well.


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## NordicNacho (Feb 6, 2007)

Steriods don't help you get bigger faster?  With proper exercise and diet


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## largepkg (Feb 6, 2007)

Of course they do. My contention is that some will not reach the size they have without them, no matter how long.


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## Rhyno (Feb 6, 2007)

heres some pic of jon harris WNBF title

http://www.liftforlife.com/jonharris1.htm

here are some pice of 2006 mr olympia

http://www.ifbb.com/ifbbpro/2006events/2006olympia.htm


is the size of the of the natural guys about as big as a man can get naturally or are they going for muscle symetry and definition, the reason i ask is that there is a huge difference between natural and unnatural and wanted to know if this was purely because of the medication they use.


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## slip (Feb 6, 2007)

you also need to look at strongmen, weightlifters, and powerlifters to see some big guys.

you talking big and ripped, or just plain big?

john harris is only 170lb on stage as stated in that article.  I weigh more than that, and im skinny.  Bodybuilding is about a combination of things, not just pure mass.


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## Rhyno (Feb 6, 2007)

slip said:


> you also need to look at strongmen, weightlifters, and powerlifters to see some big guys.
> 
> you talking big and ripped, or just plain big?
> 
> john harris is only 170lb on stage as stated in that article.  I weigh more than that, and im skinny.  Bodybuilding is about a combination of things, not just pure mass.



Iv seen those guys and they are huge and strong. I did not know that they did not use meds.

In relation to just big and ripped (natural BB) is that about as big as you can get.


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## assassin (Feb 7, 2007)

Do bodybuilders take sterioids? 

Ofcourse They Do,other wise they won't be that big .


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## mrmark (Feb 7, 2007)

It's fair to say that probably most or all professionals at the top of the game take roids. BBing, baseball, football etc...


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## mike456 (Feb 7, 2007)

taking steroids is pathetic.


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## Arnold (Feb 7, 2007)

mike456 said:


> taking steroids is pathetic.



why do you say that?


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## mike456 (Feb 7, 2007)

Prince said:


> why do you say that?




paying for drugs, and injecting drugs into yourself, and *risking* serious health effects, to do something that you can do without them with more hard work. It is just not natural. It is not  legal. If you get stuck and can't make any more gains, try reading and figuring out why, and than fix that. 

and yes I know steroids aren't just a magic pill that are going to make you huge without working, but it sure as hell makes it alot easier or else people wouldn't be taking them.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

Oh Shit here we go.....Ding .Ding. Ding. 

And in this corner,fighting outta Nonjuiceville,we have Mr."Taking roids is wrong cause it makes it alot easier"( @ a whopping 160 w/ten yrs of hard work under his belt) and over here ladies and gentleman Fightn for all the needle stabbin,oral poppin,Gh taking guys and girls of the free world....Yes yes yes Juiceman 5000........

 Lets get it on!!!!!!


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

I think this is debate thats been goin on for yrs amoungest the the weightlifting community.Just curious to see some thoughts from both sides.Some good intelligent ones not cause "Drugs are bad emmmmkay!"Ha


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## ponyboy (Feb 7, 2007)

Billie7 said:


> Exactly!  I don't and never would do steroids, but to think you just use them and then muscles magically appear is just dumb!  You still have to work your butt of in the gym!



Guys, relax - that's of course not what I meant.  What I meant is that there are lots of guys out there who want more muscle faster than their body should naturally add it on and do cycles to get bigger faster.  I'm not disputing you have to still put in the work.

However, I have FAR more respect for the guy who busts his ass for years naturally and builds his body up than a guy who does steroids.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

Besides the fact that he did it,so called naturally,why else do you respect him as opposed to the AAS user.
 I mean if there both going for the same goal,and one chooses one route and one the other,both giving it there all,obviously we know who's gonna win this adventure but why respect one more than the other?


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## Pedro TT (Feb 7, 2007)

LT81 said:


> Besides the fact that he did it,so called naturally,why else do you respect him as opposed to the AAS user.
> I mean if there both going for the same goal,and one chooses one route and one the other,both giving it there all,obviously we know who's gonna win this adventure but why respect one more than the other?



Because no matter how much all the juicers try to sugarcoat it, its still a SHORTCUT. I remember when I first started out and saw all the big guys in my gym. I was in awe and looked up to them. As time went on I started to learn the reality behind how they made their gains. I'll never forget the day I went into the bathroom and almost stabbed myself with one of the needles these loosers had left in the trash. From that day foward I lost all respect for people who juice. 

Nowadays, when I see someone who is huge and throwing around massive amount of weight, I'm not intimidated or feel bad that I'm "only" benching 150lbs vs their 350 because I know the truth behind their training secrets. Dont get me wrong, I realize it takes hard work in the gym to acheive the kind of size alot of these guys acheive but the cold hard truth is that they have taken a shortcut no matter how you cut it. They accomplished gains that would of taken a normal person lets say 10 years of perfect eating and training in considerably less time while at the same time possibly being a little more less diciplined with their diet/training.    

Take the whole modern baseball steroid scandal. Imagine you worked hard and trained your entire life trying to improve yourself and the way you play the game. For all this hard work you set all kind of records for Home Runs, RBI's ect. All of a sudden someone who normally wouldnt stand a chance in hell of topping you comes along, takes a magic potion and destroys the records you set. Would you have any respect for the man who took the "different route" even though both routes lead to the same place? I sure as fuck wouldnt.


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## mike456 (Feb 7, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> Because no matter how much all the juicers try to sugarcoat it, its still a SHORTCUT. I remember when I first started out and saw all the big guys in my gym. I was in awe and looked up to them. As time went on I started to learn the reality behind how they made their gains. I'll never forget the day I went into the bathroom and almost stabbed myself with one of the needles these loosers had left in the trash. From that day foward I lost all respect for people who juice.
> 
> Nowadays, when I see someone who is huge and throwing around massive amount of weight, I'm not intimidated or feel bad that I'm "only" benching 150lbs vs their 350 because I know the truth behind their training secrets. Dont get me wrong, I realize it takes hard work in the gym to acheive the kind of size alot of these guys acheive but the cold hard truth is that they have taken a shortcut no matter how you cut it. They accomplished gains that would of taken a normal person lets say 10 years of perfect eating and training in considerably less time while at the same time possibly being a little more less diciplined with their diet/training.
> 
> Take the whole modern baseball steroid scandal. Imagine you worked hard and trained your entire life trying to improve yourself and the way you play the game. For all this hard work you set all kind of records for Home Runs, RBI's ect. All of a sudden someone who normally wouldnt stand a chance in hell of topping you comes along, takes a magic potion and destroys the records you set. Would you have any respect for the man who took the "different route" even though both routes lead to the same place? I sure as fuck wouldnt.


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## AKIRA (Feb 7, 2007)

I remember reading in Men's Journal and in Time magazine that regular office workers would take steroids, not work out, not eat right, and still show some sort of muscular change.  I didnt really read into it much, just read it and shrugged it off.

Next thing I know, two friends that didnt really have "office" jobs did a cycle, never did any hard work or hard eating and they both showed results.

Now thats some lazy shit..


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## mrmark (Feb 7, 2007)

I think there is also a degree of resentment because for those who are natural, to see the guys who may not necessarily put as much effort it, get the short term gains faster, kinda hits a nerve.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> Because no matter how much all the juicers try to sugarcoat it, its still a SHORTCUT. I remember when I first started out and saw all the big guys in my gym. I was in awe and looked up to them. As time went on I started to learn the reality behind how they made their gains. I'll never forget the day I went into the bathroom and almost stabbed myself with one of the needles these loosers had left in the trash. From that day foward I lost all respect for people who juice.
> 
> Nowadays, when I see someone who is huge and throwing around massive amount of weight, I'm not intimidated or feel bad that I'm "only" benching 150lbs vs their 350 because I know the truth behind their training secrets. Dont get me wrong, I realize it takes hard work in the gym to acheive the kind of size alot of these guys acheive but the cold hard truth is that they have taken a shortcut no matter how you cut it. They accomplished gains that would of taken a normal person lets say 10 years of perfect eating and training in considerably less time while at the same time possibly being a little more less diciplined with their diet/training.
> 
> Take the whole modern baseball steroid scandal. Imagine you worked hard and trained your entire life trying to improve yourself and the way you play the game. For all this hard work you set all kind of records for Home Runs, RBI's ect. All of a sudden someone who normally wouldnt stand a chance in hell of topping you comes along, takes a magic potion and destroys the records you set. Would you have any respect for the man who took the "different route" even though both routes lead to the same place? I sure as fuck wouldnt.



 Ok now tell us how you really feel,don't hold back,haha Now thats a good ethical and moral standpoint,glad to see we have some people on here that are like that.
 The only thing I've like to add that so called natural people,that I know,use the over the counter products looking to better themselves in whatever regard.Products like Superdrol,M1T,Hadrol 50 are prohormones now what makes this any different ,these things aren't natural.
 Yeah I know there over the counter(legal) vs. breaking the law.Ok you can't compare OTC products to AAS but what makes it any different.Not saying all natural people use but isn't it the same thing,in which your taking a shortcut.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

AKIRA said:


> I remember reading in Men's Journal and in Time magazine that regular office workers would take steroids, not work out, not eat right, and still show some sort of muscular change.  I didnt really read into it much, just read it and shrugged it off.
> 
> Next thing I know, two friends that didnt really have "office" jobs did a cycle, never did any hard work or hard eating and they both showed results.
> 
> Now thats some lazy shit..



 I highly doubt they showed some real results,did they work out before.I mean for a person thats never trained and starts training will get results faster than the experienced person.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

mrmark said:


> I think there is also a degree of resentment because for those who are natural, to see the guys who may not necessarily put as much effort it, get the short term gains faster, kinda hits a nerve.



 Yeah I sense jealously in alot of people also.We're both going for the same thing but I choose to do something you won't and because of that I reap the benefits.And yes for the benefits I'm gonna suffer later on in life.And yes I'll see what taking a shortcut will do to me.Lets see some proof behind these bold statements.Some cold hard proof.
 And for everyone I'm talking smart,intelligent usuage not abusing or misusing like everybody who gets there info from the media likes to talk bout.And actually believe what there being spoonfed and brainwashed to believe.


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## AKIRA (Feb 7, 2007)

LT81 said:


> I highly doubt they showed some real results,did they work out before.I mean for a person thats never trained and starts training will get results faster than the experienced person.



The two guys that I actually observed first hand did have some workout experience, but not from Id say a year before they shot up.

One of them actually put on some mass.
The other just maintained what was shrinking.


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## AKIRA (Feb 7, 2007)

I guess I have good genetics, but my father said I dont.  He said he never got as big as I have and my mother's side of the family sure doesnt have large members, so I dont know. 

I would say that in my area, almost every person I know or know of who juices, never gets as strong or as big as me.  Ive got years of experience behind me and they dont.  That does actually make me feel pretty good. 

Of course, they dont take this shit seriously, meaning writing up programs, eating clean food, sleeping right, etc.  They are in for America's "I want it and I want it by yesterday afternoon" mentality.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

AKIRA said:


> I guess I have good genetics, but my father said I dont.  He said he never got as big as I have and my mother's side of the family sure doesnt have large members, so I dont know.
> 
> I would say that in my area, almost every person I know or know of who juices, never gets as strong or as big as me.  Ive got years of experience behind me and they dont.  That does actually make me feel pretty good.
> 
> Of course, they dont take this shit seriously, meaning writing up programs, eating clean food, sleeping right, etc.  They are in for America's "I want it and I want it by yesterday afternoon" mentality.



 See those are just kids in my eyes(regardless of age).And the people that make so called juicers look bad.Its funny cause they never amount to anything in weightlifting and never learn any true knowledge.When they come off they don't know how to train,and eventually just give up.Like every other so called has been that tries to talk to me about lifting."Ya,know kid when I was your age I used to work out all the time too,with arms like this"
 And thats when I usually laugh and keep quiet so they get the point that I really don't care,dipshit.


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## Witchblade (Feb 7, 2007)

I personally don't give a damn about whether someone uses 'roids, as long as he's honest about it. People get respect from me if they work hard, with or without anabolic steroids.

Jon Harris gets respect, but so does Ronnie Coleman.


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## StanUk (Feb 7, 2007)

Lets face it, there is no way Coleman (or a lot of bb'ers for that matter)could be as big as he is without roids, no matter how much time/effort he puts into his traning/diet he cannot naturally get that big without roids. period. So to the person saying taking roids is pathetic i disagree, i think some people take them without the proper education and therefore A: risk themselves more than they have to in terms of adverse effects on their health and B: Dont use them as efficiently as they could do and so in effect waste them. However to the pro bb'ers who are using them to give themselves that extra edge which they could no way get naturally, i say fair play to them.


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## Alleyezonme (Feb 7, 2007)

I dont know about you guys, but i would much rather look like those natural body builders then the contestants for mr olympia, or the women for god sakes, i wouldnt even touch one of those bit*hes, id probably get radiation posioning! And believe me its not like im against illegal drugs, i used to smoke weed for a good 2 years, almost everyday some weeks everyday, but then i gave all that up when i saw myself getting really lazy, and doing bad in school, and all the affects of it, so i guess what im saying is, you may think steroids are good right now because your seeing such great results, but you truly dont know how there going to affect you in the long run, you can dream and play it out however you want, but one day your gonna wake up and reality is gonna smack you right in the face, and well now its to late


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## StanUk (Feb 7, 2007)

Since when do steroids contain radioactive chemicals?  

You need to remember that a lot of pro's make a living through their bodybuilding, it is their whole life, they spend 90% of their life training/eating and making sure there resting. 

A lot of people probably wouldn't want to look like any of the pro's but the pro's are competing and they are more concerned about being the best as apposed to how attractive women find them. No doubt 20 years down the line they may regret what they have done if their health deteriorates due to streoid abuse.. but thats for another debate really.


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## Billie7 (Feb 7, 2007)

Witchblade said:


> I personally don't give a damn about whether someone uses 'roids, as long as he's honest about it. People get respect from me if they work hard, with or without anabolic steroids.
> 
> Jon Harris gets respect, but so does Ronnie Coleman.



I personally don't really care if they do roids or not, but I think the reason most don't openly admit it is because people will think that they didn't work as hard for it or had that magic pill and it made their muscles grow huge. They want credit for all that hard work, and admiting to steroids some how takes away from that, most people don't realize you still have to work your ass off to get that big.


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## LT81 (Feb 7, 2007)

Alleyezonme said:


> I dont know about you guys, but i would much rather look like those natural body builders then the contestants for mr olympia, or the women for god sakes, i wouldnt even touch one of those bit*hes, id probably get radiation posioning! And believe me its not like im against illegal drugs, i used to smoke weed for a good 2 years, almost everyday some weeks everyday, but then i gave all that up when i saw myself getting really lazy, and doing bad in school, and all the affects of it, so i guess what im saying is, you may think steroids are good right now because your seeing such great results, but you truly dont know how there going to affect you in the long run, you can dream and play it out however you want, but one day your gonna wake up and reality is gonna smack you right in the face, and well now its to late



Umm yeah I can tell by your post your a youngster....smoking weed not a good comparison to AAS use.Keep reading though,learning as much as possible


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## zombul (Feb 7, 2007)

I think the only way to settle this argument is the who wants it most theory.I think it's great that you set records and where all natural but I wanted it even more than you and was willing to run the risk of steroids.Coleman wants it bad, he busts  his ass and eats properly so he wants to be the best he can be and that includes juice.I don't see them as a short cut anymore than I see taking a protein shake as a shortcut because you didn't eat chicken instead.It's not a magic pill or needle so why would it be diffrent than creatine as far as a shortcut.Sure it gives better results but it's not doing the work for you.


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## Jodi (Feb 7, 2007)

Who gives a shit if they use or not.  It's their choice and they have to live with their choices and not anyone else.  They know the consequences and the possible future problems but they still make the choice.  So be it.

Personally though, I do not find those that use AAS to be aesthetically pleasing.  I prefer the athletic look over the "big" look.  IOW - Harris over Coleman, any day!


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## Sweet_Dell (Feb 7, 2007)

Jodi said:


> Who gives a shit if they use or not.  It's their choice and they have to live with their choices and not anyone else.  They know the consequences and the possible future problems but they still make the choice.  So be it.
> 
> Personally though, I do not find those that use AAS to be aesthetically pleasing.  I prefer the athletic look over the "big" look.  IOW - Harris over Coleman, any day!



Totally agree and well said!!


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## Arnold (Feb 7, 2007)

mike456 said:


> paying for drugs, and injecting drugs into yourself, and *risking* serious health effects, to do something that you can do without them with more hard work. It is just not natural. It is not  legal. If you get stuck and can't make any more gains, try reading and figuring out why, and than fix that.
> 
> and yes I know steroids aren't just a magic pill that are going to make you huge without working, but it sure as hell makes it alot easier or else people wouldn't be taking them.



not natural, that is your argument? that holds no water, half of what you eat every day is not natural.

serious health risks? you can say that about any OTC drug, alcohol, tobacco, caffeine and many other substances. do you eat fast food because that has more health risks than using steroids.

you are buying into media sensationalism, steroids can and are used safely by many athletes, not just bodybuilders. do you watch football because they use them as well to enhance performance and speed up recovery time.

do you approve of woman taking birth control pills? because that is unnatural and it is a hormone as well.


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## KelJu (Feb 7, 2007)

mike456 said:


> paying for drugs, and injecting drugs into yourself, and *risking* serious health effects, to do something that you can do without them with more hard work. It is just not natural. It is not  legal. If you get stuck and can't make any more gains, try reading and figuring out why, and than fix that.
> 
> and yes I know steroids aren't just a magic pill that are going to make you huge without working, but it sure as hell makes it alot easier or else people wouldn't be taking them.



Dumbest shit I have ever heard.


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## Arnold (Feb 7, 2007)

people that think that way are ignorant (uneducated) on the subject. 

all they know is that steroids caused Lyle Alzado's brain tumor, and we know this because Lyle said it did. 

btw, I am not implying that there are no health risks in using steroids.


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## mike456 (Feb 7, 2007)

KelJu said:


> Dumbest shit I have ever heard.



I agree, explain why you take them.


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## Arnold (Feb 7, 2007)

I don't use steroids. 

I also don't smoke weed but I think it should be legal, safer than alcohol in many ways.


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## mike456 (Feb 7, 2007)

Prince said:


> I also don't smoke weed but I think it should be legal, safer than alcohol in many ways.



no that doesn't mean it should be legal that means alcohol should be illegal


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## Billie7 (Feb 7, 2007)

Prince said:


> people that think that way are ignorant (uneducated) on the subject.
> 
> all they know is that steroids caused Lyle Alzado's brain tumor, and we know this because Lyle said it did.
> 
> btw, I am not implying that there are no health risks in using steroids.



I think that is Exactly it!...People only know what the media puts out there, which is usually negative.  I don't know a whole lot about steroids, but I do know they are not as bad as most think.  I think most of the people who have had problems with them is becuase of Abuse, not just USE.


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## mike456 (Feb 7, 2007)

for the people that take roids:
post why you take them, and post what are the negatives (if you believe there are any)


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## musclepump (Feb 7, 2007)

There was a book once posted around here about this very subject.


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## ponyboy (Feb 7, 2007)

Billie7 said:


> I think that is Exactly it!...People only know what the media puts out there, which is usually negative.  I don't know a whole lot about steroids, but I do know they are not as bad as most think.  I think most of the people who have had problems with them is becuase of Abuse, not just USE.



The trouble is, just like any other drug, the gains you get from steroids can be quite addictive to people who lift.  It is very easy for someone to go from simple use to overdoing it because they want the gains it gives them again and again.  

I'd be interested to actually hear the story of anyone who has done just one cycle, what gains they made and why they did not do another one.  Any user that I know personally has done more than one, even if it is a year between them.


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## AKIRA (Feb 7, 2007)

Jodi said:


> Personally though, I do not find those that use AAS to be aesthetically pleasing.  I prefer the athletic look over the "big" look.  IOW - Harris over Coleman, any day!



That was something I have always heard girls say.  Girls would see muscle and fitness magazines and say:

"You want to look like that?  I like muscles, but not that much, thats just disgusting."

Ive heard more girls say that they didnt like the "huge" look than girls I heard say they did like it.

I workout to obtain a look above the average gym rat.  Not too big, not too small, just right.  Kinda like...ah nevermind.



LT81 said:


> See those are just kids in my eyes(regardless of age).And the people that make so called juicers look bad.Its funny cause they never amount to anything in weightlifting and never learn any true knowledge.When they come off they don't know how to train,and eventually just give up.Like every other so called has been that tries to talk to me about lifting."Ya,know kid when I was your age I used to work out all the time too,with arms like this"
> And thats when I usually laugh and keep quiet so they get the point that I really don't care,dipshit.



They really dont look at bodybuilding as a careful process.  Overtraining beyond belief, eat shit all day, etc.  The people I see most of the time can be labeled as "short cutting" Id say.  They can also be labeled as idiots too, but whos judging?


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## KelJu (Feb 7, 2007)

mike456 said:


> I agree, explain why you take them.



I don't. I am clean as a whistle, and every gain I have is natural. 
I tired a cycle once and hurt myself, because I wasn???t educated enough before starting them. It took me 8 months to get back where I was before I started them. 

I took them because I was close to my natural limit. I either had to gain some fat to get stronger or lose some muscle to get leaner. Like most of the people on this board that used them, they had trained for years before even considering AS. 

I have trained with people who have taken roids, and it is no shortcut, I guarantee you that. The side effects are horrendous. It is a trade off. 

Also, it sounds to me that the ones whining are a little jealous.


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## AKIRA (Feb 7, 2007)

KelJu said:


> Also, it sounds to me that the ones whining are a little jealous.



They are.  Ill bet they are jealous for the same reasons that people think (generally speaking) you take steroids, when you really do not.


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## Jodi (Feb 7, 2007)

AKIRA said:


> That was something I have always heard girls say.  Girls would see muscle and fitness magazines and say:
> 
> "You want to look like that?  I like muscles, but not that much, thats just disgusting."
> 
> ...


As far as most girls yeah, me, no I like a bit more.  I like muscle just not overdone.


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## AKIRA (Feb 7, 2007)

Jodi said:


> As far as most girls yeah, me, no I like a bit more.  I like muscle just not overdone.



You can actually put the shoe on the other foot too.

A woman who works out and develops a hard curvy body is sexier than a "skinny fatty" with a pretty face.

However...

Too big of a woman is in fact disgusting...but some guys like it, just as some girls like the huge look in guys.

It does boil down to preference, but as long as you have a nice body through hard work, youll have a better chance of finding more fish in your pond and have the pick of the litter.

Yes thats two adadges for the price of one post.


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## StanUk (Feb 7, 2007)

mike456 said:


> no that doesn't mean it should be legal that means alcohol should be illegal



Woo! Bet your a right party animal


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## fufu (Feb 7, 2007)

Pro bodybuilders must take large amounts of anabolic drugs to support the LBM they carry on their frames.


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## fufu (Feb 7, 2007)

Prince said:


> I don't use steroids.
> 
> I also don't smoke weed but I think it should be legal, safer than alcohol in many ways.


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## Pedro TT (Feb 7, 2007)

AKIRA said:


> They are.  Ill bet they are jealous for the same reasons that people think (generally speaking) you take steroids, when you really do not.



Oh yeah that it. I'm TOTALLY jelous of all the horrendous acne, ball-shrinking and sterilization associated with steroids. Oh and dont forget about those various long term health effects  

The muscles are totally worth it  

I personally have no problem with somebody juicing. The only reason I get worked up is when someone tries to explain to me that its all fine and dandy with it when in reality, its its common knowledge that juicing has potential for serious long term medical complications. Its like smoking....sure you MIGHT not get cancer, enphusema or any other smoking related illness but your chances of dying from them are significantly increased because you chose to smoke.


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## blueboy75 (Feb 7, 2007)

ponyboy said:


> The trouble is, just like any other drug, the gains you get from steroids can be quite addictive to people who lift.  It is very easy for someone to go from simple use to overdoing it because they want the gains it gives them again and again.
> 
> I'd be interested to actually hear the story of anyone who has done just one cycle, what gains they made and why they did not do another one.  Any user that I know personally has done more than one, even if it is a year between them.



I did a straight test cycle approx 13 years ago, I was 19 at the time.  I was heavily influenced by a competing BB friend of mine at the time who persuaded my to try.  I had made modest gains naturally up until this point from training hard for about 3 years.

At 19, I tried to mix a cycle and social life of clubs/drinking/poor diet together.  I am amazed looking back of the gains I actually made during this cycle considering how poor my diet/rest was etc.

Why I never did another cycle was due to experiencing significant bloat from the cycle - probably from poor diet, incorrect dosages and no PCT.

I also stopped training altogether about 2 years later and put on a significant amount of fat (especially around midsection and face).  Every ounce of muscle I gained from the cycle quickly disappeared.

5 years ago I took the initiative to get back into shape (naturally) and I can truly say im satisfied with my physique now (I could  lose a few pounds further around my midsection).  I am a big believer of muscle memory and I regained at least 40-50% of the size I had during my cycle.

Sure I think about  what it would be like to do another cycle, but  at 31 - my cycle days are over.


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## JonnyStead (Feb 8, 2007)

At 33 I'm sure I'm too old to start playing around with them. For me, if you want to use Roids, thats up to you - but I dont think there is a doubt that you are at least running the risk of problems in later life. For me thats the main reason I wouldnt touch them - there is no point looking strong now and needing a new heart at 55 - seems a bit like snatching defeat out of the jaws of victory to me.

The one thing that does concern me is referring to them as 'juice' . Juice implies that they are some kind of natural healthy option and I'm sure to the uninitiated the name kinda hides the risks you run by using them. I think we should all make sure (whether we believe in them or not) that noobs are advised of possible risks they run in using them. Just my two penneth worth


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## WYLER98 (Feb 8, 2007)

Who cares if a person uses Roids or not. Every action has a consequence. We all know what they are if you take Roids good or bad.

However, personally I don't use them. I get more satisfaction knowing that my gains are produced through normal natural practices that i can use for the rest of my life. Therefore I will be able to maintain my strength and size for the rest of my life (relatively speaking). 

Would you rather be Lyle Alzado (death due too steriod use) or Jack Lalanne (still kickin in his 90's)? It is a simple chioce for me. But, to each his own.


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## Witchblade (Feb 8, 2007)

mike456 said:


> no that doesn't mean it should be legal that means alcohol should be illegal


You've got to be kidding me, right?


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## musclepump (Feb 8, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> Oh yeah that it. I'm TOTALLY jelous of all the horrendous acne, ball-shrinking and sterilization associated with steroids. *Oh and dont forget about those various long term health effects*



Could you please name some scientifically proven (not this stupid media science) long term health effects associated with responsible steroid usage in adult men?

I'd love to see them because, again and again, science has proven that adult males can use supraphysiological doses of testosterone with absolutely no long-term or irreversible side effects.


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## musclepump (Feb 8, 2007)

JonnyStead said:


> At 33 I'm sure I'm too old to start playing around with them.



Mid 30's is probably the best time to start using AAS, actually. Assuming of course your training and diet are spot on.


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## Pedro TT (Feb 8, 2007)

musclepump said:


> Could you please name some scientifically proven (not this stupid media science) long term health effects associated with responsible steroid usage in adult men?
> 
> I'd love to see them because, again and again, science has proven that adult males can use supraphysiological doses of testosterone with absolutely no long-term or irreversible side effects.



http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/performance-enhancing-drugs/HQ01105

30 seconds on google got me that link. Sure I could find something which seems like its more medically sound but thats about all the information you need right there. 



> Anabolic steroids:
> Some athletes take a form of steroids ??? known as anabolic steroids ??? to increase their muscle mass and strength. The main anabolic steroid hormone produced by your body is testosterone.
> 
> Testosterone has two main effects on your body:
> ...




Like I said before, *I DONT CARE IF YOU PUMP THAT SHIT INTO YOUR BODY!!* I just hate it when all the juicers try to convince me that it isnt bad for you!!! I dont care if these effects are only temporary while on cycle.


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## largepkg (Feb 8, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/performance-enhancing-drugs/HQ01105
> 
> 30 seconds on google got me that link. Sure I could find something which seems like its more medically sound but thats about all the information you need right there.
> 
> ...




I don't think that we're trying to convince you they aren't bad for you. More like we're trying to enlighten the ones who believe all the negatives about AAS. MP was simply asking for scientific proof. Sure, abuse can be very bad for you but responsible use is what we're talking about.

I would never try to talk someone into taking AAS. I'm just the opposite. I want people to discover and research it for themselves. Then decide where to go from there.

"The sky is falling" mentality is the shit that pisses most of us off.


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## AKIRA (Feb 8, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> Oh yeah that it. I'm TOTALLY jelous of all the horrendous acne, ball-shrinking and sterilization associated with steroids. Oh and dont forget about those various long term health effects
> 
> The muscles are totally worth it



Not sure why you quoted me since I dont take roids.  I was stating that my size and numbers make people believe that I am juicing when I am not, hence the jealousy remark.

By the way, I developed acne on the top of my shoulders after 5 years of training and still no juice...so whats to blame for that?  Genetics?  Wrong soap?  Shitty shirts?   Why not?


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## NordicNacho (Feb 8, 2007)

AKIRA said:


> Not sure why you quoted me since I dont take roids.  I was stating that my size and numbers make people believe that I am juicing when I am not, hence the jealousy remark.
> 
> By the way, I developed acne on the top of my shoulders after 5 years of training and still no juice...so whats to blame for that?  Genetics?  Wrong soap?  Shitty shirts?   Why not?



To many man massages can cause shoulder acne.  What kind of oils are you guys using?  Best cure is to let the sun hit it and dry it out.


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## AKIRA (Feb 8, 2007)

NordicNacho said:


> To many man massages can cause shoulder acne.  What kind of oils are you guys using?  Best cure is to let the sun hit it and dry it out.



I didnt want to go off on a tangent by it.  What I was pointing out is that it could be acne or labeled as acne and guess what, a label of juicing comes with it.


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## largepkg (Feb 8, 2007)

AKIRA said:


> I didnt want to go off on a tangent by it.  What I was pointing out is that it could be acne or labeled as acne and guess what, a label of juicing comes with it.



Well, obviously you're a juicer. Stop denying it and accept what others believe.


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## Yanick (Feb 8, 2007)

I'm neither pro nor con steroid use. However two things irk me about steroids

1. When juicers enter tested contests after being off for a couple of months claiming to be 'natural'

2. The huge amount of misinformation that is prevalent amongst the media and the everyday layman in regards to steroids' effects.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9DSzeuFVJU&mode=related&search=


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## musclepump (Feb 8, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/performance-enhancing-drugs/HQ01105
> 
> 30 seconds on google got me that link. Sure I could find something which seems like its more medically sound *but thats about all the information you need right there.*



It is links like those that spread the misinformation. There's not one real study quoted in that entire thing! That link is absolutely USELESS.


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## ABCs (Feb 8, 2007)

This is the way I look at steroids... like drugs. They can be a good time used by the right person IN MODERATION. It's when they get in the hands of the wrong person and are abused is when everything turns to mush. And that's exactly why they are illegal.


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## LT81 (Feb 8, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/performance-enhancing-drugs/HQ01105
> 
> 30 seconds on google got me that link. Sure I could find something which seems like its more medically sound but thats about all the information you need right there.
> 
> ...



  Good in 30sec you found exactly what YOU wanted to hear on steroids.Look a little deeper into that info you got there son,there talking about mega high excessive dosages(Which is called abusing by the way).In this discussion everyone's try to talk about intelligent,responsible usuage.And it just seems that everybody aganist it has some off the wall type story of an abuser or something to that extent


   Damn could you imagine,if he was a user,everyone would say"See thats that ROID RAGE coming out"


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## AKIRA (Feb 8, 2007)

largepkg said:


> Well, obviously you're a juicer. Stop denying it and accept what others believe.



 I dont wanna


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## Pedro TT (Feb 8, 2007)

Yanick said:


> I'm neither pro nor con steroid use. However two things irk me about steroids
> 
> 1. When juicers enter tested contests after being off for a couple of months claiming to be 'natural'
> 
> ...



That news peice changed my opinions completely. I did more research after seeing that and as everyone stated before me, I have yet to find a totally unbiased research study stating that steriods when properly taken have no known long-term health effects.


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## Arnold (Feb 8, 2007)

ABCs said:


> This is the way I look at steroids... like drugs. They can be a good time used by the right person IN MODERATION. It's when they get in the hands of the wrong person and are abused is when everything turns to mush. And that's exactly why they are illegal.



I agree with the first part but not the second. 

Most drugs are illegal for political and financial reasons, i.e. steroids, that one was completely political. 

Bottom line, don't think the government makes drugs illegal because they care about your health, they don't.


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## NordicNacho (Feb 8, 2007)

Prince said:


> I agree with the first part but not the second.
> 
> Most drugs are illegal for political and financial reasons, i.e. steroids, that one was completely political.
> 
> Bottom line, don't think the government makes drugs illegal because they care about your health, they don't.


  

 Cigarettes are just one example.  Shit is addictive and kills way more people then any drug.  When sales go down they just add more nicotine.  How many people do you know that steriods killed?  How many from cigarettes?


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## NordicNacho (Feb 8, 2007)

lots of information here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic_steroid

cool links at the bottom


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## Spud (Feb 8, 2007)

NordicNacho said:


> Cigarettes are just one example.  Shit is addictive and kills way more people then any drug.  When sales go down they just add more nicotine.  How many people do you know that steriods killed?  How many from cigarettes?



What a stupid argument. How many people are killed in car accidents? How many people die at work? Should we just eliminate cars and working?


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## NordicNacho (Feb 8, 2007)

Spud said:


> What a stupid argument. How many people are killed in car accidents? How many people die at work? Should we just eliminate cars and working?



I can't believe you just wrote that


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## Yanick (Feb 8, 2007)

Pedro TT said:


> That news peice changed my opinions completely. I did more research after seeing that and as everyone stated before me, I have yet to find a totally unbiased research study stating that steriods when properly taken have no known long-term health effects.



I'm glad i could open your eyes on the subject just remember that lack of a properly executed long term studies does not mean they are good for you. If you dig around the anabolic section and read up on posts by Trouble!, you'll see that steroids affect way more than one's HPTA and muscular systems. A lot of the effects are unknown and one always needs to weigh the risk:reward ratio when trying to decide whether anabolics are right for him/her or not.


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## largepkg (Feb 9, 2007)

Spud said:


> What a stupid argument. How many people are killed in car accidents? How many people die at work? Should we just eliminate cars and working?



Dude, you really didn't just say that did you?


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## LT81 (Feb 9, 2007)

Spud said:


> What a stupid argument. How many people are killed in car accidents? How many people die at work? Should we just eliminate cars and working?



 Its pretty funny how the misinformed also post up some pretty idiotic analogies.Do you honestly think those are even comparable?


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## ABCs (Feb 9, 2007)

Prince said:


> I agree with the first part but not the second.
> 
> Most drugs are illegal for political and financial reasons, i.e. steroids, that one was completely political.
> 
> Bottom line, don't think the government makes drugs illegal because they care about your health, they don't.



Never said they ban them to protect us. I don't even trust the bastards (Reps and Dirty Libs) with my money, let alone my life. One things for sure, this steroid argument has been beaten to death.


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## LT81 (Feb 9, 2007)

ABCs said:


> Never said they ban them to protect us. I don't even trust the bastards (Reps and Dirty Libs) with my money, let alone my life. *One things for sure, this steroid argument has been beaten to death.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> Yeah cause people like to chime in on stuff that they nothing about..Its like me talking about quantem physics.....


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## KelJu (Feb 9, 2007)

LT81 said:


> Yeah cause people like to chime in on stuff that they nothing about..Its like me talking about quantem physics.....



Exactly! 

It is down right annoying how many people think creatine is a fucking AS. Plus, you have the people who think steroids are the devil, while they feed their kids garbage and put them in front of a game consoles with no exercise. I'll outlive most of those self righteous bastards, and look good doing it.


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## ABCs (Feb 9, 2007)

LT81 said:


> Yeah cause people like to chime in on stuff that they nothing about..Its like me talking about quantem physics.....



Very true. I have never taken steroids, but I sure don't mind when SAFE, level headed people take them to better themselves, not the people who take them to make up for a lack of willpower, diet, exercise or a combination of any of those. You feel me?



KelJu said:


> Exactly!
> 
> It is down right annoying how many people think creatine is a fucking AS. Plus, you have the people who think steroids are the devil, *while they feed their kids garbage and put them in front of a game consoles with no exercise.* I'll outlive most of those self righteous bastards, and look good doing it.



And that is frigg'n child abuse in my eyes. Some parents feed their kids garbage non stop and wonder why they're kids are obese lazy sacks of shit. It's like no one wants to think for themselves anymore... let the fucking government do it. Stupid people anoy me.


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## Spud (Feb 9, 2007)

NordicNacho said:


> I can't believe you just wrote that



I'm sorry, I was high.


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## LT81 (Feb 9, 2007)

Spud said:


> I'm sorry, I was high.



 Oh shit you smoke up and post also.I thought I was the only one w/ writer's block when it came to posting.....


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## Spud (Feb 9, 2007)

LT81 said:


> Oh shit you smoke up and post also.I thought I was the only one w/ writer's block when it came to posting.....



I am guilty of that for more than a single occasion.


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## tomevans (Aug 22, 2010)

while steroids are a shortcut, i fail to see how one can lack respect towards a bodybuilder/athlete utilizing anabolic steroids or any other performance enhancing drug/technique, and than say they have respect towards a member of the natural bodybuilding community, in that they do not take advantage of anabolic steroids or any other performance enhancing drug/technique, when the very same member of the natural bodybuilding community takes a supplement on an exactly paritous basis that a "non-natural" member of the bodybuilding community would utilize, with similar justification, in that one purchases/takes a dietary supplement with the intent of producing a desired effect, or, in the preponderance of cases, enhancing performance in some specified way, while a "non-natural" member of the bodybuilding community would purchase/consume a steroid/utililize other illegal or unnatural performance enhancing drugs/ technique, to produce a desired effect, either to or thereby enhancing performance. In our society we have come to equate legality with morality, however what we do not realize is that we live in a society which perpetuates unrealistic ideals of perfection as the basis for a foundation of success, and rewards those who will do anything to succeed over those who chose the path of doing that which is right, with the consequence of failure. Simply put, one takes a steroid with the same intent one takes any drug- be it a supplement, or an over the counter drug at your local shop rite pharmacy. Turn on your television, we push drugs- from allergy medicine to the greatest fat loss system ever invented. We are raised to have the desire for success, to strive for something greater than average- and we all cheat. Therefore, steroids should not be singled out as immoral over the usage of a supplement, or any drug for that matter, for we all cheat, we all lie, in some way. To summarize, one who takes steroids is a cheater and unnatural, yet one who takes a supplement on the same ideological basis, with the same intent, is within all ethical boundaries and considered completely natural ? Steroids are not the problem. The fact that in our country the greater majority of people would rather clean someone else's closet before they actually even bother glancing at their's, that's the problem. Everyone needs to get the fuck off their self righteous pedestals and start loving each other, because there is no such thing as a "natural bodybuilder", for the above reasons. Think of a bodybuilder as a piece of sculpture, and supplements/steroids are simply another tool of the sculptor, which should be utilized both within an acceptable range of usage to create a beatiful piece of art. No one criticizes a sculptor for using a specific style of sculpting, whereas bodybuilders who utilize steroids are criticized endlessly for their usage thereof. But, if steroid usage is no different from, say, Michelangelo going down to Michael's and buying a pre-sculpted figure, where all one needs to do is chisel it down to perfect proportions, then how can we consider the usage of supplements to be any different ?


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## midwest216 (Aug 23, 2010)

At my age, I'm all for whatever you need to do to get it done. Shit anyone at top of their game is taking something and dont think their not! I'm 36 and I will take whatever at this point, hated being the scrawny guy or the guy "not" being asked " are you a football player, or dude you look like a NFL linebacker". I hear that atleast 3x a week at the bar I bounce at and it gets me stoked. NEVER Fucking NEVER will I drop below 250 lbs or go back to the scrawny fucker I was last year. Wont happen not on my watch and if the MORAL community has a problem with that.......look the other way. Go save some whales or something.


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## YeahYeahCabsHere (Jun 23, 2011)

Okay, I just stumbled upon this thread and I thought it looked interesting to ready different peoples opinions and they are all great opinions. Most of them sounded intelligent. I decided to reply back to post my opinion on the subject. 

      In my opinion believe that IFBB all do use steriods to acheive that physique. Anyone has to, no matter how well gifted you are in your genes(I dont use steriods and never will, I'm not trying to look freakishly I'm trying to look more like an athlete). Also, in my perspective IFBB deserves more respect because they are risking everthing they have and i dont want anyone say that they dont work as hard as a natural bodybuilder. Bodybuilding is their life. IFBB work more and more than a Natural BB, they have to. They bodies Metabolism of protein has them eating perfectly way more than any other person on the earth. IFBB also have to train immensely throughout the day. They put there whole life into it. Some Natural bodybuilders do the same but ultimately IFBB are risking their lives to acheive their goal. And overall that earns the most respect from me. Most people look up to the IFBB not Natural bodybuilders and thats IFBB'ers goal.
       On the same hand you have people using anabolic steroids in NBA NFL MLB etc..... they do not derserve the same respect from me because not everyone in sports is using steroids. Its just not fair. At least people in IFBB and WSM(Worlds Strongest Man) All take steroids. This is just my opinion


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## JCBourne (Jun 24, 2011)

ponyboy said:


> Simple answer:  Yes.  All of them do.  In fact, many of the people at your gym do as well.  Many weekend warrior type A guys do a cycle or two to get some more muscle without having to work for it.



Oh, your so so naive, if taking steroids and getting huge was so easy everyone would do it. It takes a proper diet and training and once you have those 2 key things it takes hard work and time *even *with steroids. It doesn't happen overnight. 



NordicNacho said:


> I think when he said work at it is these guys  hes talking about could get the same results if they would have done it  naturally it just takes a bit longer and isn't as hard on the body.  If  you know what i mean.



False. Once you reach your natural max potential, you will not get any  bigger without the use of AAS/PHs. You will never be as big as the body  builders naturally, it just won't happen.

FYI, steroids aren't cheating. For people who have spent years and years and have reached their potential and know what they are doing are just taking it to the "next level".


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## Bigred111 (Jun 24, 2011)

ponyboy said:


> The trouble is, just like any other drug, the gains you get from steroids can be quite addictive to people who lift. It is very easy for someone to go from simple use to overdoing it because they want the gains it gives them again and again.
> 
> I'd be interested to actually hear the story of anyone who has done just one cycle, what gains they made and why they did not do another one. Any user that I know personally has done more than one, even if it is a year between them.


 
I recently completed one cycle of gear-test and EQ.  My gains were great-up 12lbs and increased strength.  IMO what I thought was the best part of AAS was the increased energy, very focused with my job/lifting, obviously increased sex drive- I just felt great as a person, my relationship with my wife was better.  
Now with that said I have quit taking gear for the fact that it is so expensive and  I am on a tight budget.  I have been natural for 5 years with lifting and I have always wanted to try it once.  I would have continued if I had the funds but my priority is family first- trust me I did everything possible to try to find money to continue.  Now that I have been off for 5 weeks(also note I did not do PCT, big mistake) I have felt like shit, no energy, really dont care about working out anymore, etc...

I guess my point is when you see the results it is so addicting and all I could think about was my next workout and sex!!  I got trapped into that and now I am suffering.  Im not sure what side of the fence I am on with this.  The overall well being of life with testosterone is great and its to bad that with proper training and education, this drug cant be legal.


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## southpaw (Jun 24, 2011)

Wow...I'm new to this board but not new to bb, health, fitness, diet and exercise and there is a lot of contention on this thread.  For me, the first misnomer is trhat if you are not a huge bulging beast, you are not a bodybuilder, but I believe "bodybuilder" describes the dedication, discipline, regimen and focus an individual puts into developing their physique - as opposed the inches of ones calves, glutes, waist, chest, arms, neck, etc.  We all have genetic limitations and if great size is desired, then synthetics are the best way to break our genetic limitations.  I envy the 28 year old with a 29 inch waist, 45 inch chest and 18 inch arms, and weather he used synthetics to acheive his goals or not is no concern of mine because I know he worked his freakin ass off to acheive his goals.  I also envy the 45 year old 320 pound fat man that dieted for years, and worked his ass off to trim down to 180 pounds of lean muscle using only diet and exercise.  Both of these guys are bodybuilders and earned their stripes.  To be a competitor, genetics + discipline + synthetics + hard hard hard work = success.    It's all good.


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## SuperLift (Jun 24, 2011)

Does a bear shit in the woods?


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## WG 3.0 (Jun 24, 2011)

BBers taking steroids is a new one to me.


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## minimal (Jun 24, 2011)

whats a steroid


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