# Bodybuilding and milk



## rezkon (Aug 28, 2011)

Some people have told me that milk is bad when your bodybuilding due to the estrogen and other things can give you '' bitch tits '' But i dont know if i should trust as milk has alot of good things to help me bulk advice?


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## lemon_ (Aug 28, 2011)

I am also interested in this, but I also believe that if getting hormones from eating food in your blood was so easy there won't be pharmaceutical companies making injectables.


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## rezkon (Aug 28, 2011)

Good point but bodybuilding.com has done alot of milk ones and its all...well.. CONFUSING AS FUCK


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## theCaptn' (Aug 28, 2011)

There is a lot of goodness in milk . .. Just take into consideration the sugar factor


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## Kenny Croxdale (Aug 28, 2011)

*Milk Analysis*



rezkon said:


> Some people have told me that milk is bad when your bodybuilding due to the estrogen and other things can give you '' bitch tits '' But i dont know if i should trust as milk has alot of good things to help me bulk advice?



*rezkon,*

*Chocolate Milk Post Workout Beverage*

Research indicates that chocloate milk is a good post workout beverage.  It contains about the right carbohydrate to protein ratio (4 grams of carbohydrate to 1 gram of protein).  

*Caseinate:Whey Ratio*

The content of milk is approximately 80% caseinate to 20% whey.  In a post workout beverage, a better percentage would most likely be the reverse of that...80% whey to 20% whey. 

*Whey Protein Post Workout*

As your most likely aware of, you want to consume a protein that is quickly digested post workout.  

*Whey Digestion Time*

Whey is digested in about 120 minutes.  Less if you ingest a hydrolyzed whey protein. 

Caseinate Slow Digestion Time

Caseinate is digested over a longer time period, between 3-5 hours. 

That makes is a great protein before bedtime or during the day.  

*Caseinate Part of The Post Workout Beverage*

Reseach shows that adding some caseinate allows you to enhance your recovery from your workout much better.  

Combining whey and caseinate in your post workout beverage is a one-two punch combination. 

With that said, it's milk is still a good post workout beverage. 

*Insulin The Anabolic Hormone*

Insulin is one of the most anabolic/muscle building hormones in the body.  

*The Insulin Index of Milk*

The Insulin Index is the latest method of measuring foods that trigger the release of insulin.  

Milk is shown to be a very high Insulin Index food.  

That is exactly what you want in a post workout beverage.  It allows your to recovery faster and increase muscle mass.

*The Dark Side of Insulin*

As Jay Robb (nutritionist) stated, "Insulin is a Fat Maker..."  

*Insulin*

1) Blocks body fat from being burned as fuel. 

2) Increases fat storage when food are eaten that trigger high levels of insulin to be released. 

*Bodybuilders and Milk*

In cutting for contest, bodybuilders have screamed for decades not to drink milk in the cutting phase. 

*Empirical Wisdom*

Science now back up the bodybuilders statement. 

*Milk For Increasing Muslce Mass*

With that in mind, milk is a great food for increasing muscle mass.  However, it can also increase body fat. 

*Drink and Monitor*

If you want to incease muscle mass, add it to your diet.  And as with anything in your diet, see how it works for you.

*Gynocomastia*

I have never seen anyone get "bitch tits" from drinking milk.  

Kenny Croxdale


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## Tomn (Aug 28, 2011)

hey u got some good points there, thanks for the info


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## rezkon (Aug 28, 2011)

hey he does
So bulking.. its ok, cutting..its bad..seems pretty easy kinda...  
Btw Kenny Croxdale should had Yoda as a Reputation.


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## SilentBob187 (Aug 28, 2011)

High calorie fluids are going to be a horrible idea for a cut and acceptable for bulking.

The one thing I would argue would possibly be the importance of a quick digesting protein after you train.  Guys I know have the greatest gains using a slow protein like steak with potatoes.

Recovery is an all day thing.  That 'post-workout window' that they talk up and down was found in a study using older men who have inefficient digestive systems.


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## rezkon (Aug 28, 2011)

i am 17 at the moment how long do you belive i had after pre workout as im out of protein atm but i would like to know how quickly to get out off gym after workout


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## SilentBob187 (Aug 28, 2011)

rezkon said:


> i am 17 at the moment how long do you belive i had after pre workout as im out of protein atm but i would like to know how quickly to get out off gym after workout



If you're training 4-5 days a week I wouldn't stay in the gym for longer than an hour.  Unless you're tacking some cardio on the end of your workout or something.


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## Halo (Aug 28, 2011)

I drink the heck out of some milk big glass in the morning big one before bed too.  It's working for me.


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## big60235 (Aug 28, 2011)

Milk has a massive amount of quality nutrition in a 8oz glass. The fear of most propel in bodybuilding is the high sugar levels. If you are hooked on milk then I would suggest trying Almond milk, it has almost the same macro nutrient levels, but has lower calories because of the decrease in sugar. I go through about a 1/2 gal a day of the vanilla unsweetened Almond Milk Coconut milk is also very good but my wife hates the slight coconut flavor so I didn't last long in our place.


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## SloppyJ (Aug 28, 2011)

Actually elevates IGF-1 levels. Take that how you want.


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## Kenny Croxdale (Aug 28, 2011)

*"Food is the ULTIMATE Drug." Dr Barry Sears*



SilentBob187 said:


> Recovery is an all day thing.



SilentBob,

Recovery does require time.  However, research shows you can enhance it if you are pro-active and ingest a high glycemic index carbohydrate with a quickly absorbed protein. 



SilentBob187 said:


> That 'post-workout window' that they talk up and down was found in a study using older men who have inefficient digestive systems.



*Post Workout Recovery For EVERYONE*

A post workout recovery beverage has been deomonstrated to enhace recovery for everyone, _especially athletes_.  

*Insulin Shuttle*

One of the things insulin does is shuttle nutrients to the muscles.  

*Insulin's Anabolic Effect.*

As noted, Insulin is one of the (if not the most anabolic hormone of the body).  Thus, spiking insulin after a workout is effective with increasing muscle mass. 

*Nutrient Timing*

One of the best easy to read research books on this is *Nutrient Timing* by Dr John Ivy (Exercise Physiologist/University of Texas).  

*Bodybuilders Injecting Insulin*

That one of the reasons some bodybuilders inject insulin post workout.  

Kenny Croxdale


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## SilentBob187 (Aug 28, 2011)

Kenny Croxdale said:


> SilentBob



High GI like potatoes.  A longer term sustained supply of aminos from a piece of meat will always be superior to a powder.  Meat has quick and slow proteins, not to mention cholesterol for hormone production after SFW. 

International Society of Sports Nutrition position stand: Nutrient timing should link to a fulltext of the study mentioned.

And I'm not disagreeing with you.  I'm saying that what you eat all day is vastly more important than your postworkout supplement/drink.  It matters very little if you have a 4:1 CHORO drink after you train if you're eating like sh*t the rest of the day.

Focusing on one aspect of a diet/training routine instead of the big picture is why so many people fail to achieve their goals.


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## keepitreal (Sep 10, 2011)

great details about milk kenny, 

I personally drink lots of milk and mix almost all protein drinks with it, only time I don't is if I've let my diet slip for the day on those I go with water just to trim off some calories

skim when trying to lose or maintain weight and whole when bulking is my norm

I know a couple guys that have done the gallon of milk a day thing both had pretty good results from it.  One of them was pretty broke at the time so milk was pretty much his main meal source.  Would I recommend this to everyone... NO but the hard gainer types may want to consider the gallon of milk a day


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## MakeItMethylated (Sep 10, 2011)

GOMAD ftw


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## ASU87 (Sep 10, 2011)

I have started drinking Smart Balance HeartRight fat free milk.  Only fat free milk that i I have tried that doesn't taste watered down.  I know some will suggest that the fat that milk contains doesn't need to be eliminated. I drink it for the other potential benefits of the plant sterols and omega 3s to help my cholesterol, plus the added benefit of 25% more protein and calcium per serving. It isn't cheap so i use it in addition to regular 2% milk.


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## .V. (Sep 10, 2011)

^^^
What Kenny Croxdale said way up there.

Don't forget in years past before the days of specific scientific supplements of this protein, that protein, this enzyme, that amino... carb timing, creatine, etc... some damn fine bodies were built on three squares and gallons of whole milk per day...and really, didn't those guys look better, more human than most today?  Well, in my opinion they did anyway.

Just remember the insulin response from the carbs in the milk.  Great for building muscle but over time, constant bombardment with insulin is not good for some of us.  I personally drink about 4 cups a day while trying to gain but when it starts bothering my MS (carbs, sugars, insulin spikes... bad for autoimmune conditions) I have to cut it out and increase my vitamin D supplements.


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## Kenny Croxdale (Sep 11, 2011)

SilentBob187 said:


> High GI like potatoes.  A longer term sustained supply of aminos from a piece of meat will always be superior to a powder.  Meat has quick and slow proteins, not to mention cholesterol for hormone production after SFW.



SilentBob,

*Milk*

The same pretty much applies to milk.  As you are probabaly aware, milk is composed of 20% whey and 80% caseinate.  

*Whey The Fast Protein*

Whey digestion time is approximately 120 minutes.  

*Caseinate The Slow Protein*

Caseinate's digestion time is approximately 300 minutes. 

That combining whey and caseinate in one pre and post workout beverage is now recommended.



SilentBob187 said:


> International Society of Sports Nutrition position stand: Nutrient timing should link to a fulltext of the study mentioned.



Great article.  Thanks.



SilentBob187 said:


> And I'm not disagreeing with you.  I'm saying that what you eat all day is vastly more important than your postworkout supplement/drink.  It matters very little if you have a 4:1 CHORO drink after you train if you're eating like sh*t the rest of the day.



*"Well begun is half done."*

Certainly, what you consume during the remainer of the day is important.  

However, "What you eat all day is" not more important.  

*Heart Attack, A Hyperbolic Example*

Think of training as being somewhat like having a heart attack.  

When would be the most critical time do minimize the risk?  Before, during, immediately after or a few hours after?  

Obviously, if you knew you were going to have a heart attack, taking evasive measures prior, during and immediately after are going to minimize the risk.  

What you do in the hours after is important.  However, it not as important as what you do prior, during and immediately after it occurs. 

*Same With Training*

The same is true with training.  


SilentBob187 said:


> Focusing on one aspect of a diet/training routine instead of the big picture is why so many people fail to achieve their goals.



*Successful individuals do what other won't. *

Focuing on one aspect is one of the reason's individuals don't hit there goals.  I would say it the main reason.  

The main reason most individuals fail is that they aren't willing to make the sacrifices to get to their goal.  

*"What are you prepared to do?" *
(Sean Connery in The Untouchables, movie) 

Sean Connery's comment sums up why some are successful and some aren't.

Kenny Croxdale


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## Kenny Croxdale (Sep 11, 2011)

.V. said:


> ^^^
> What Kenny Croxdale said way up there.
> 
> Don't forget in years past before the days of specific scientific supplements of this protein, that protein, this enzyme, that amino... carb timing, creatine, etc... some damn fine bodies were built on three squares and gallons of whole milk per day...and really, didn't those guys look better, more human than most today?  Well, in my opinion they did anyway.
> ...


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## gymrat09091974 (Sep 11, 2011)

Here's my take on milk. Humans are the only mamals who drink milk after infancy. Not only that but we drink it from other animals. That doesn't seem natural to me. Just saying


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## Disturbed (Sep 11, 2011)

gymrat09091974 said:


> Here's my take on milk. Humans are the only mamals who drink milk after infancy. Not only that but we drink it from other animals. That doesn't seem natural to me. Just saying


 duh...they dont have any money.....seriously that therory really makes no sense,i know its not your therory,im not bashing you.there is a dozen reasons we drink milk and animals dont,...after infancy.


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## jonnybravoSA (Sep 11, 2011)

Humans are the only mamals that have evoled in such a way as to harvest milk making it available on a daily basis!


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## sofargone561 (Sep 11, 2011)

i baithe in milk


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## keepitreal (Sep 11, 2011)

gymrat09091974 said:


> Here's my take on milk. Humans are the only mamals who drink milk after infancy. Not only that but we drink it from other animals. That doesn't seem natural to me. Just saying



That's like saying I saw a dog eat some shit, must be natural, guess I'll give it a try too 

Many mammals after infancy will still greedily gulp down whatever milk they're given, so not sure where you get this whole unnatural idea, I've even seen that many mammals will steal milk away from younger siblings if the mother allows it, so unnatural no, lack of supply yes...

if we wanted to limit our diet intake to what we see consumed in nature there wouldn't really be any limit


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## SFW (Sep 11, 2011)

YouTube Video


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## Digitalash (Sep 11, 2011)

Humans are also the only animals that cook their food, just saying


milk ftw, I'm addicted to the stuff really. I don't feel I'm done eating until I drink some milk


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## keepitreal (Sep 11, 2011)

Digitalash said:


> Humans are also the only animals that cook their food, just saying
> 
> 
> milk ftw, I'm addicted to the stuff really. I don't feel I'm done eating until I drink some milk



good point... guess its unnatural to cook your food then too, guess I'll have to go vegan or something...


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## keepitreal (Sep 11, 2011)

*Milk it does a body good*

Does anyone else remember these commercials growing up? Maybe before some of your guys time 1992 lol






YouTube Video


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## keepitreal (Sep 11, 2011)

*milk does a body good*






YouTube Video


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## keepitreal (Sep 11, 2011)

YouTube Video


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## Merkaba (Sep 11, 2011)

Milk is a tool.  A hammer is a tool.  You can build a house with a hammer or bang yourself over the head with it.  Same thing.  If it's cheap and convenient and fits your timing/macs/calories...then drink it.  Of course, one can be concerned about the cows it comes from and what they ate or ingested or got shot up with.  Other than that, don't over think it.  Shit tap water is "bad" for you too.


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## ASU87 (Sep 12, 2011)

Here's something you may or may not know. It is difficult (impossible?) to drink a gallon of milk in an hour without throwing up.  Know anyone that has done it successfully?


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## keepitreal (Sep 12, 2011)

ASU87 said:


> Here's something you may or may not know. It is difficult (impossible?) to drink a gallon of milk in an hour without throwing up.  Know anyone that has done it successfully?



I've downed a half gallon in under an hour before, wouldn't even try a gallon though, someone out there give it a whirl and let us now lol


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## Digitalash (Sep 12, 2011)

seen many people try the "gallon challenge", projectile vomiting has always been the result

At the time I was drinking close to a gallon a day so I thought I could do it, made it to 3/4 and puked harder than I ever have in my life lol


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## SuperLift (Sep 12, 2011)

milk is great for getting extra calories!


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