# Does anyone Crossfit here?



## Double D (Sep 21, 2008)

I have been on this board for a while and know most of you guys. As far as I know no one on here does any sort of Crossfit. Just wondering if any of you have heard of it or even tried it....? I've been doing it for the past 7 months and I am in the best shape of my life.

Welcome to CrossFit: Forging Elite Fitness


----------



## bio-chem (Sep 21, 2008)

looks similar to the combat fitness classes at my gym Throwdown Showdown "The Return" - Sep 26, 2008


----------



## RasPlasch (Sep 21, 2008)

Only person I've seen doing crossfit on here is Doublebase


----------



## Double D (Sep 21, 2008)

Well its definitely nothing easy......


----------



## Ben dur (Sep 21, 2008)

i think i saw a youtube vid of some crossfit chick doing like 100 kipping pull ups in one set

not an easy task by any means

some of the crossfit people are pretty incredible


----------



## RasPlasch (Sep 21, 2008)

I tried one of there workouts at the gym awhile ago during the summer. 

It was something like...... Perform 10 thrusters with 65lbs then 10 pullups in rounds for 20 minutes without stopping. That was a pretty horrible workout


----------



## P-funk (Sep 21, 2008)

not easy does not mean that it is good.

it is not easy.....a lot of it is also not smart.

just because someone makes you tired doesn't mean that they can make you better.

it has some ideas that i think are okay, but they go about it in dangerous ways at times in my opinion.


----------



## Double D (Sep 21, 2008)

Oh well I dont disagree......but at the same time I do. I know you hate Crossfit.....but at the same time it is something you ought to try. Whenever it comes to something like clean and jerk for time its a bit much but I still do it. Its not for a rookie, but then again am I a rookie......? Crossfit is fun! Theres nothing I can do that is equal to this......I have tried many other workouts, but none are the same.........


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 21, 2008)

Malley said:


> Oh well I dont disagree......but at the same time I do. I know you hate Crossfit.....but at the same time it is something you ought to try. Whenever it comes to something like clean and jerk for time its a bit much but I still do it. Its not for a rookie, but then again am I a rookie......? Crossfit is fun! Theres nothing I can do that is equal to this......I have tried many other workouts, but none are the same.........



Ive had the same experience, nothing comes close to this shit, it is the real deal. I bodybuild on days off.
safety comes down to the athlete, if you train smart you can find your physical limits...all of them, if you are too worried or lazy to try then well...its okay to be a pussy.


----------



## fufu (Sep 21, 2008)

Nothing is ever as good as creating something for yourself IMO.


----------



## Double D (Sep 21, 2008)

Well what are you going to create that is going to be equal top this? Are you really going to do something that is going to be harder than this?


----------



## fufu (Sep 21, 2008)

Harder than what?


----------



## Witchblade (Sep 21, 2008)

Malley said:


> Well what are you going to create that is going to be equal top this? Are you really going to do something that is going to be harder than this?


Tabata.


----------



## Double D (Sep 22, 2008)

They use tabata in crossfits......

Besides that they are just fun.


----------



## P-funk (Sep 22, 2008)

fufu said:


> Nothing is ever as good as creating something for yourself IMO.



yea, that too....just download the workout of the day!  it is fine for everyone...doesn't matter who you are.....so much for individuality.


I am all for working hard and pushing yourself.

I am not for working stupid.


----------



## Double D (Sep 22, 2008)

Alright, tell me how I am working out stupid?


----------



## MCx2 (Sep 22, 2008)

I would imagine 30 rep sets of Clean and Jerks aren't the safest thing in the world. I cringe every time I see someone at my gym do 1 rep let alone 30. I can't imagine how much form breaks down for most when they become that fatigued.


----------



## Double D (Sep 22, 2008)

I do agree with that. I said that once I read it. I dont go crazy with things like that like alot of people do. However, I have one of my trainers check my form the entire time. If I start, "muscling" it up I rest. But I do agree with that, the clean and jerk isnt the best idea.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

P-funk said:


> yea, that too....just download the workout of the day!  it is fine for everyone...doesn't matter who you are.....so much for individuality.
> 
> 
> I am all for working hard and pushing yourself.
> ...



the WOD is for everyone. Each and every workout can be scaled to the individual. Grandmas do crossfit. Change load and intensity, not programs.

it doesnt matter who you are, human function is human function.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

ReproMan said:


> I would imagine 30 rep sets of Clean and Jerks aren't the safest thing in the world. I cringe every time I see someone at my gym do 1 rep let alone 30. I can't imagine how much form breaks down for most when they become that fatigued.



actually, form should improve as you fatigue. The poorer the form the faster you'll burn.
I love 135lb clean and jerk - 30 reps for time. I would not say my form is 100% but for sure at least 80-90%


----------



## MCx2 (Sep 22, 2008)

VILBAUGH said:


> actually, form should improve as you fatigue.



Wanna explain the science behind that one?


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

ReproMan said:


> Wanna explain the science behind that one?



pick a heavy BB off the ground and try to "muscle" it overhead a few times, using a curl or whatever, you'll be toasted after a few.
cleaning and jerking when done properly are very efficient movements. the better your form is, the less energy you'll exert.
this efficiency can only truly be appreciated if you master the clean and jerk and likewise the snatch.


----------



## MCx2 (Sep 22, 2008)

VILBAUGH said:


> pick a heavy BB off the ground and try to "muscle" it overhead a few times, using a curl or whatever, you'll be toasted after a few.
> cleaning and jerking when done properly are very efficient movements. the better your form is, the less energy you'll exert.
> this efficiency can only truly be appreciated if you master the clean and jerk and likewise the snatch.




And the more fatigued you become, the more difficult it becomes to maintain said form. My original point was that a very select few perform the movement properly in the first place. Add a heavy dose of fatigue in there and you have a recipe for serious injury.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

ReproMan said:


> And the more fatigued you become, the more difficult it becomes to maintain said form. My original point was that a very select few perform the movement properly in the first place. Add a heavy dose of fatigue in there and you have a recipe for serious injury.



the same goes for any exercise, why is everyone so afraid of clean and jerks for reps? because there are people that do it wrong? 
this is one of the greatest exercises on earth, it should be a staple for all athletes. It should be promoted, not insulted.


----------



## fufu (Sep 22, 2008)

oi....


----------



## fufu (Sep 22, 2008)

VILBAUGH said:


> the WOD is for everyone. Each and every workout can be scaled to the individual. Grandmas do crossfit. Change load and intensity, not programs.
> 
> it doesnt matter who you are, human function is human function.



Some exercises aren't for everyone. There aren't magic programs that are for everyone. Crossfit isn't some divine messianic program that is great for everyone. People do have structural, neurological and muscular problems that prohibit them from doing alot of things. 

What the fuck, seriously, do you disregard all the science that has been done on program design and how to cater to specific individuals, is that now obsolete? 

So you like Crossfit, so what. Not everyone in the world has the same goals that cross fit will apply to.

By the way, I think you sound like a crazy person. Form gets better with fatigue? No, it doesn't.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

fufu said:


> Some exercises aren't for everyone. There aren't magic programs that are for everyone. Crossfit isn't some divine messianic program that is great for everyone. People do have structural, neurological and muscular problems that prohibit them from doing alot of things.
> 
> What the fuck, seriously, do you disregard all the science that has been done on program design and how to cater to specific individuals, is that now obsolete?
> 
> ...




you're right, Im generalizing, obviously if your specializing in a sport, or rehabilitating, training is geared toward that.

each workout can be scaled or modified to the individual. 
Fitness *is* for everyone, period.

it's not magic, just fundamental, thorough, and random.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

VILBAUGH said:


> actually, form should improve as you fatigue. The poorer the form the faster you'll burn.
> I love 135lb clean and jerk - 30 reps for time. I would not say my form is 100% but for sure at least 80-90%



form should get better with fatigue. this is the goal of the athlete and the reason for workouts like this. If the rep is ugly and unsafe dont count it. 
Work vs time, efficiency.


----------



## fufu (Sep 22, 2008)

Forcing an athlete to try to learn form through fatigue is ridiculous and unsafe. Why not spend the to time actually teach them the movement before you have them train to or near failure.

Just because they SHOULD use better form to accomplish the lift during fatigue doesn't mean that they will.

Have you ever stepped into a gym and seen people train near failure and see their form get worse and worse until it is hard to look? They aren't thinking "gee, if I was more efficient in my form I could be expending less energy to accomplish this exericse". 

Usually people have the motor pattern internalized or they don't. Your neurologic adpations to the movement don't just "kick in" once you get tired.


----------



## fufu (Sep 22, 2008)

VILBAUGH said:


> you're right, Im generalizing, obviously if your specializing in a sport, or rehabilitating, training is geared toward that.
> 
> each workout can be scaled or modified to the individual.
> Fitness *is* for everyone, period.
> ...



Sure fitness is for every, and so are goals, and people have very different kind of goals. They also have different bodies. If every workout can be modified for everyone, it isn't a program, it is more of a philosophy.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

fufu said:


> Forcing an athlete to try to learn form through fatigue is ridiculous and unsafe. Why not spend the to time actually teach them the movement before you have them train to or near failure.
> 
> Just because they SHOULD use better form to accomplish the lift during fatigue doesn't mean that they will.
> 
> ...



absolutly, *never* would I attemp or advise any of the workouts with out first mastering a movement with a broomstick. I *never* said one should.

and again, it should be the goal of the athlete to use better form as fatigue sets in, and he will use better form, as he trains and gets bigger, stronger, faster. he will adapt. 

motor patterns for humans are the same. how you train those patterns, depends on the adaption.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

fufu said:


> Sure fitness is for every, and so are goals, and people have very different kind of goals. They also have different bodies. If every workout can be modified for everyone, it isn't a program, it is more of a philosophy.



definitly a philosophy, a method.

I like it fufu.


----------



## fufu (Sep 22, 2008)

You are backpedalling. First you said if form gets ugly during a set, don't count it, but continue with better form. Now you say, one should only do the movements once they have mastered it. If they have the form mastered form would be the same throughout the movement until they get too fatigued and their muscles can't move under the resistance anymore. 

Good form should be used regardless of how fatigued you are. If your form goes to shit, STOP. Otherwise you are risking injury.

Motor patterns aren't the same for everyone human. Where are you getting your information from? If motor patterns were the same for everyone biomechanics and kinesiology would be extremely simple, but they aren't. People move differently. There are myriad assessments for all sorts of movements, motor patterns deviate immensely. There is an entire industry based around this.

And if you are so vehement about never undergoing a movement when you don't grasp the form entirely, then why would you suggest training through form degradation?


----------



## P-funk (Sep 22, 2008)

are there positives to cross fit?

yes.

does it provide a training effect?

most certainly (it is very difficult metabolic work).


Is it the be-all-end-all of training?

NO.  It is one thing.  One concept.  It isn't the only thing.

The problem with crossfitters is that they come in and say (in a very cult like manner)....this is it...this is the only thing!  This is the best ever.

Like no one has ever done fucking metabolic work before?  Like no one has used circuit training at high intensities in order to force a training effect?

You have to really drink the kool-aid.

I just personally feel that there are:

a) safer ways to get the desired training effect and target the desired energy system (not that all of their workouts are dangerous).]

b) more things to focus on than just metabolic work.

c) there needs to be a proper screening of individuals as some are not prepared for those workouts either physically or biomechanically (lots of the shit I see on those sites with the squats is horrid)

d) certain exercises shouldn't be pushed to failure or done for high number of reps....again...there are safer ways to get that training effect.

e) again, just because someone can make you tired, doesn't mean they can make you better.......they are two different things.

f) I agree with FuFu.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 22, 2008)

P-funk said:


> are there positives to cross fit?
> 
> yes.
> 
> ...



back squat 3-3-3-3-3-3-3

clean and jerk 1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1

its not all met conditioning

how would you get the training benefits of 30 clean and jerks without doing clean and jerks??


----------



## P-funk (Sep 22, 2008)

why clean and jerk after the back squat?

what is the benefit of 30 clean and jerks....it is a power exercise.  you are working on rate of force development.  once you begin to fatigue, speed of repetition goes down, and the primary training effect is lost...technique starts to drop too.


----------



## Ben dur (Sep 22, 2008)

all i will say is that if your doing 30 reps, your certainly not bodybuilding anymore...

why dont you just do sprints...


----------



## Double D (Sep 23, 2008)

Alright, this has gotten  a long ways away from what I even started the thread for. Do I love Crossfit? Yup. Is it for everyone? Nope. You do have to have proper form with things like snatch or clean and jerk for time. Its not real often I do those anyways, because I dont feel like I can do it right whenever I get tired. But thats where I have one of my trainers there to watch form. Once it goes to shit, I stop. Pretty simple right? I think this thread is just like any other thread you see on any bb'ing website, only difference is someone would ask, who does 5x5 and it doesnt get the same attention that this draws. I am currently certified through crossfit as well. I have been through their courses and if you want some good down to basics shit, its definitly something to look into. I am also currently certified in; NASM, ACSM, and ACE (which is just a watered down version of NASM), but I say that just to counter with the fact I am no dumby. I know how to train and train others. I dont do crossfits with any of my clients, simply because if I needed to do that they could just get online and wouldnt need me. Besides I am not all about putting an 80 year old woman through Crossfit . At the end of the day its just like any other type of training, it has its positives and negatives. 

One last thing, I am not a fucking bodybuilder.......I hate the posing and all the last months of dieting to prepare. And 30 reps could have its place it all kinds of "bodybuilding" routines.....it just wouldnt be your staple.


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 24, 2008)

P-funk said:


> why clean and jerk after the back squat?
> 
> what is the benefit of 30 clean and jerks....it is a power exercise.  you are working on rate of force development.  once you begin to fatigue, speed of repetition goes down, and the primary training effect is lost...technique starts to drop too.




yeh, sorry, they are two separate workouts.

it is a power exercise, yes. Keep in mind that the workout dictates a 135lb load, and scaled as required. It isnt a heavy load.

dont you think as the athlete progressed, fatigue would lessen, technique would improve, producing a better athlete?


----------



## VILBAUGH (Sep 24, 2008)

also keep in mind, the workout does not intend for the athlete to perform 30 consecutive reps. hit three good ones, drop the bar, deal with your "fatigue" and continue, 
Work through for time and quality execution.


----------



## P-funk (Sep 24, 2008)

> dont you think as the athlete progressed, fatigue would lessen, technique would improve, producing a better athlete?



possibly.  but even still, rate of force development will decline after a few repetitions and that is what the lift is supposed to be training.

I think there would be better ways to get the adaptation you are seeking (metabolic/anaerobic work).....For example, a clean complex would be a way in which I would try to get a lot of metabolic work...I have someone start with the a power clean and then move to different exercises once those reps are completed....exercises which are less technically specific (to keep it safe) and don't have the goal of moving as quickly as possible.  So, it may look like:

4 reps per exercise without setting the bar down
Hang power clean (above the knee)
Front Squat
Push jerk
Bent over row
clean pull (from floor)


I just look at everything on a risk-reward basis.  I think the risk of doing high repetition cleans (or any exercise which requires sound technical proficieny) out weighs the reward; especially when I can use other means that have the same reward with less risk.

That is just my opinion/preference.


----------



## Double D (Sep 25, 2008)

I no doubt believe whenever people do something like clean and jerk for time.....the risk is much higher than reward, just got to be smart with things like that. Yesterdays was fun......1/4 mile run and max amount of pullups, as many rounds as you can get in 20 minutes. This is more of a positive one, rather than the clean and jerk.

Did anyone see the virtual shoveling, that was dumb. I passed on that crap. Still waiting for them to come back around to lunge 1/4 mile for time.


----------



## Double D (Sep 25, 2008)

P-funk said:


> 4 reps per exercise without setting the bar down
> Hang power clean (above the knee)
> Front Squat
> Push jerk
> ...



I did something very similiar with a client the other day......they were done after 20 minutes and 4 times through. But I believe I used 6 reps per exercise.


----------



## fUnc17 (Oct 2, 2008)

Jersey shore crossfit is pretty cool. Definately NOT the be all end all for an athlete. They have some pretty knowledgable people, even though I wouldn't want them training me or train like that very often, I think its great GPP for 95% of people.


----------



## Minhkey (Oct 4, 2008)

This seems way too intense for beginners and grandmas lol


----------



## Will Brink (Nov 6, 2008)

Malley said:


> I have been on this board for a while and know most of you guys. As far as I know no one on here does any sort of Crossfit. Just wondering if any of you have heard of it or even tried it....? I've been doing it for the past 7 months and I am in the best shape of my life.
> 
> Welcome to CrossFit: Forging Elite Fitness



Gang. CrossFit is a popular method of exercising these days and has generated many questions for yours truly. CrossFit is both popular and controversial.  Chris Shugart  is a well respected coach in his own right, who has done an extensive report on CrossFit, the good and the bad and the ugly. This is an extensive report, and goes into an amazing level of detail about CrossFit. He also interviews other respected coaches regarding CrossFit, as well as additional info, background, vids, etc. I was very impressed with this report from Chris and if you want to total picture of CrossFit, this THE report to read:

The Truth About CrossFit
by Chris Shugart


"Was I in the right place?" I asked myself for the second time that day.

The little street near Southern Methodist University in Dallas was an incongruous blend of old houses and new bars teeming with college kids. It was 9 p.m. and the sun had set, making it impossible for me to read the street numbers. Finally I pulled over next to a bar called The Green Elephant to look at my directions again.

And that's when I saw them, a handful of men and women lunging down a long corridor holding Olympic bars over their heads. A well-built young man held a timer and appeared to be either encouraging them or yelling at them.

I'd finally found CrossFit Dallas Central, one of 650 CrossFit affiliate gyms.

Later I learned that the athletes â?????? which included members of the SMU lacrosse team â?????? were performing what the owner of the facility called a "single-movement mindfuck." This group was on their 28th minute of overhead walking lunges, the only exercise in that day's workout. The record was 400 meters in 20 minutes flat. The sweat poured.

Earlier that day, at 6:45 a.m., I'd had the same experience, driving around an industrial-warehouse district in Plano looking for building numbers in the dark. That time, instead of lunging lacrosse players, I was clued in by a man running by my truck wearing a weighted vest. I followed.

Cont:

T-Nation.com | The Truth About CrossFit


----------

