# SloppyJ's 1st Cycle.



## SloppyJ (Dec 10, 2010)

Well fellow IM readers the day has finally come. I started my cycle.  Here's a quick rundown:

Weeks 1-10 GP Test E 500mg
Weeks 1-4 GP Dbol @ 40mg
Weeks 2-15 Arimidex .5mg EOD
(Undecided) Week 9-12 Winstrol 50mg ED 
Weeks 12-15 Clomid 100/75/50/50

Starting stats: 6'1" 207 BF:11-12.5


I have extra arimidex, letro, and nolva just incase something goes wrong. I've done my research for over a year and finally pulled the trigger. All of my AI's and PCT are liquid. I am going to be eating at 500 cals over maintenence and start from there. Shooting for atleast 350g protein per day. 

I'm taking a multi vitamin, Hawthorne Berry, ALA, Coral Calcium, Omega 3,6,9, Liver care, and Melatonin at night. I'm rocking a mixture of Syntha-6 protein powder and NOW Unflavored isolate. I'm also taking White Flood pre-workout. I will begin creatine durring PCT. 

I was like a kid in a candy store yesterday. Got it right before I went to work out so I had to drop a few dbol's. My first pin will be on Saturday morning and then I will do it again on Tuesday night. Gunna do glutes first with 1.5" 25g. Still a little nervous. 


I'm sure it was just a placebo effect but I took 20mg of dbol yesterday before I hit the gym and did legs. I didn't take my pre-workout and I lifted really heavy. The pumps in my legs were different though. I seemed to get a little more pump. Even pumped up a little in some spots I normally don't feel. 

Please feel free to give me advice. I also want opinions on the winstrol at the end of the cycle. I've always wanted to try it and I feel like I want to run something for the two weeks I wait for the test to clear out before PCT. 

Shoutout to Rippedgolfer. I've been following his cycle since it's almost like mine. Very good info in there.


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## The Prototype (Dec 10, 2010)

Lol thx bro. Looking forward to seeing your progress. You've definitely done your homework. I did winstrol about five years ago by itself and it got me shredded. It'll probably be ten times better with test. Keep us updated and good luck.


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## BigBird (Dec 10, 2010)

Yup, especially due to the fact your BF is already at a good starting point (11-12.5%) the Winstrol should definately enhance your lean appearance. I was fairly ripped when I began a winny-only cycle and I went from fairly ripped to shredded in about 5 weeks at 50mg ED (split into two doses).

Maybe the 25ga. pin is too small and might be a struggle to push the oil through? I use an 1-1/2" 22 ga for glutes with no discomfort. I take about 30 secs to plunge the product but it could take you 60-90 secs to plunge through a 25 ga IMO.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 10, 2010)

BigBird said:


> Yup, especially due to the fact your BF is already at a good starting point (11-12.5%) the Winstrol should definately enhance your lean appearance. I was fairly ripped when I began a winny-only cycle and I went from fairly ripped to shredded in about 5 weeks at 50mg ED (split into two doses).
> 
> Maybe the 25ga. pin is too small and might be a struggle to push the oil through? I use an 1-1/2" 22 ga for glutes with no discomfort. I take about 30 secs to plunge the product but it could take you 60-90 secs to plunge through a 25 ga IMO.


 

I think i'd rather have it that way. Slow and steady wins the race. Besides I think I'm going to have my friend do the first one so I don't mess it up. I want to see how it feels to do it that way before I try it myself. I'm sure when I do it myself I'll move it around a little more. 

I want to try the winny so I know what it does. If it works like I think it will I want to incorporate it in a spring/early summer cycle for a little longer than 4 weeks. Maybe 6.


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## BigBird (Dec 10, 2010)

Spring/Summer is the Winny season for shredding up.  You won't be disappointed.  Be sure you're stacking it with something though b/c it shut down my libido completely.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 10, 2010)

BigBird said:


> Spring/Summer is the Winny season for shredding up. You won't be disappointed. Be sure you're stacking it with something though b/c it shut down my libido completely.


 

Oh yeah don't worry. I'm thinking about doing the same cycle again but with winny a little longer and maybe another compound. But that's the next one. I'm focused on this one now.


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## The Prototype (Dec 10, 2010)

When I was on the winny I went out on a boat with a bunch of people. I took my shirt off and this guy looked at me with wide eyes and asked how many days a week I workout. It got me incredibly lean but surprisingly, my face got bloated. But I think that was due to me drinking beer everyday back then. It's def good stuff. I'd like to do it again but my hair has been falling out quite a bit on this test so I'm sure the winny will make it ten times worse.


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## BigBird (Dec 10, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Oh yeah don't worry. I'm thinking about doing the same cycle again but with winny a little longer and maybe another compound. But that's the next one. I'm focused on this one now.


 
Funny but I'm the same way.  I'm always thinking of the next cycle even while I'm having a good time on my current cycle.  Decisions decisions.     I only did a 4week winny cycle but believe me I wish I had at least 2 more weeks b/c I was peaking during week 4.


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## nickalouch (Dec 10, 2010)

Sloppy J could you pm me with your sorce Im tired of the junk out there. Sounds like rippedgolfer found something good.


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## nickalouch (Dec 10, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> When I was on the winny I went out on a boat with a bunch of people. I took my shirt off and this guy looked at me with wide eyes and asked how many days a week I workout. It got me incredibly lean but surprisingly, my face got bloated. But I think that was due to me drinking beer everyday back then. It's def good stuff. I'd like to do it again but my hair has been falling out quite a bit on this test so I'm sure the winny will make it ten times worse.


 Hey rippedgolfer could you pm me with your source so tired of buying junk Thanks man


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## The Prototype (Dec 10, 2010)

nickalouch said:


> Hey rippedgolfer could you pm me with your source so tired of buying junk Thanks man



You don't want to ask questions like that around here. And no one here does gear. This is all hypothetical.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 10, 2010)

Thanks ripped. 

Keep this crap out of my thread please. 

 Back on track:

So the pumps are not in my head. Today I did bi's and a little forearm. I've never seen either one pumped up so much. No strength increase yet from the bol's. Stuffed a protein bar down my throat on the way back and now I'm going to force myself to eat. As much as I thought I would love all of the eating, it's already starting to piss me off.


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## BigBird (Dec 10, 2010)

If it's possible to OD on protein bars and shakes then I'll probably be the first casualty.  Thank God for chicken breast but holy shit: Chicken, broccoli, potatoes, protein bars, shakes but HOT DAMN I think I'm gonna OD.


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## The Prototype (Dec 10, 2010)

You jacked yet or what? Lol jk. Just curious, why are you waiting until tomorrow for first shot? I guess you are pretty open about using since you're letting your friend pin you. Just do the quad. It's ten times easier although glute is known to be more effective. Im gonna shoot you a pm now.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 11, 2010)

Yup it must have kicked in last night cause I benched 500 4x.... I wish

Yeah I'm a little open. Only a few people know and they are the ones that I trust so I'm not worried. So I did my first pin last night actually. I got home and my buddy came over. I said F it and just went ahead and did it. It wasn't half as bad as I thought. No pain on the inject but almost like a bee sting afterwards. And this morning it feels just like a bruise. 

I wanted to wait until today to do it because I want to be on Sat/Tue schedule with it.


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## The Prototype (Dec 11, 2010)

Nice. It's really not bad at all. I enjoy pinning now. Remember to do everything very slowly especially pushing the plunger down. It'll help with pain. I even push the pin in really slowly. Some people like to jam it in but I wouldn't do that in the event you hit a nerve or something. Massage the area, use a heating pad, take a hot shower or exercise the area works for me to keep it painless.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm not sure how fast he went in. I was trying to stare straight ahead and not laugh.(no homo.) I know it was a good 30sec on the inject. I also heated it up under hot tap water when it was in the syringe. He said it wasn't hard to push out even with the 25g. 

I'm either going to do my other glute or the opposite side quad next time.


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## bknoxx (Dec 11, 2010)

sounds good man hope u get the gains ur looking for gonna post up some pic's of progress ??


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## The Prototype (Dec 11, 2010)

Yes take some pre-cycle pics. I forgot to do that. Def a good idea.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 11, 2010)

Yeah I took some pre pics. I will probably wait until I have atleast a couple progress pics to post anything up.


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## theCaptn' (Dec 13, 2010)

nice cycle - I like the double dipping on the orals . . wet at the front end and dry at the back . .  Your other option is to add dbol at the back-end as well (instead of stanazol) - that would be a hell of a mass cycle.

Good luck


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## 10R (Dec 13, 2010)

good luck with your cycle dude, im doin the same exact one


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## SloppyJ (Dec 13, 2010)

theCaptn' said:


> nice cycle - I like the double dipping on the orals . . wet at the front end and dry at the back . . Your other option is to add dbol at the back-end as well (instead of stanazol) - that would be a hell of a mass cycle.
> 
> Good luck


 

The ol' double scoop. I thought about hitting the bol at the end but then I think when I started pct I would feel more let down when all of the water weight dropped off. But that would be one hell of a bulk. I want to hit the winny cause I plan to run it hard in the spring. Plus I'm sure I could stand to get a little more cut up at the end of this run.


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## Phetamine (Dec 13, 2010)

Are you going with the winstrol in the end?


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## SloppyJ (Dec 13, 2010)

Planning on it.


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## cavtrooper96 (Dec 13, 2010)

Looks like we finally have a newbie that did some research and planning. Reps to you. Do you have HCG? I strongly suggest that. Not NEEDED but helps. 

I would watch your BP and heart rate if you do some cardio while on Dbol and white flood. I did some Tbol on Ephedrine and ran 1 mile in 6:20 and then did some heavy cardio on the elliptical and almost hit 200 HR. That white flood with the Dbol can do the same. You may want to keep the hawthorne at 1500mg while on the Dbol and back to 1000 after. You might even look at some policosanol and garlic for your lipids. 

As far as the pinning, it will feel bruised for the first few times till you get used to it. Im guessing your doing 1cc per inject. It will get used to it real quick. Just dont put 3cc in one inject into your thigh and then go to the mall and walk for hours the next day. Talk about major pain. I havent pinned thighs since!

As far as the winny, do it if you lose some fat on the cycle. It is really at its best when you are really lean! Like for contest prep! Maybe go for some halos or more dbol the last 4 weeks.


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 14, 2010)

Best of luck bro. My cycle closely resembles yours as well. I'll be following along.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 14, 2010)

cavtrooper96 said:


> Looks like we finally have a newbie that did some research and planning. Reps to you. Do you have HCG? I strongly suggest that. Not NEEDED but helps.
> 
> I would watch your BP and heart rate if you do some cardio while on Dbol and white flood. I did some Tbol on Ephedrine and ran 1 mile in 6:20 and then did some heavy cardio on the elliptical and almost hit 200 HR. That white flood with the Dbol can do the same. You may want to keep the hawthorne at 1500mg while on the Dbol and back to 1000 after. You might even look at some policosanol and garlic for your lipids.
> 
> ...


 
Thanks man! I've done over a year of research and took the time to make sure I really wanted to do it. And when I do something, I really like to do it right. 

I do not have hcg. I thought about it but did not research it fully. I figured so many people have done cycles without it, I will be okay. I am looking into it for the next one however. I know the dosages and when to do it, just not how to do it.  

I am running NOW Hawthorne 550mg 3x per day. So thats 1650mg. I forgot to update but I also got some Liver Care (Liv 52 US Version) that I'm running also. I guess you can't be too safe. I will check out the supps you listed. 

Yes 1ml on the pins. It's not so bad. I was thinking of trying a quad tonight or even my other glute. I guess time will tell. I'll sit at work and think about that 1.5" all day and puss out.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 14, 2010)

Day 6 Update:

Something is happening. My leg press is up the most but everything else feels just a little easier in the gym. I added 20lbs to my squat today and got 540 on the leg press for a few more sets than normal. I could have gotten more but I stopped. Pumps are feeling better also. 

My nipples were feeling kind of weird today. I don't know if it's anything to do with the dbol but I'm going to start adex at .25mg EOD tonight after my pin. I know I stated I was going to do .5mg EOD but I think that might be a bit excessive at this stage in the game.


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## The Prototype (Dec 14, 2010)

I've noticed my nips are hard a lot. Even to the point where they kinda hurt. Fortunately, I haven't grown a pair of tits yet. I'll take a nolva from time to time when they get too hard or sensitive and that usually gets them in check.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 14, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I've noticed my nips are hard a lot. Even to the point where they kinda hurt. Fortunately, I haven't grown a pair of tits yet. I'll take a nolva from time to time when they get too hard or sensitive and that usually gets them in check.


 

Yeah that's kind of what's happening here. They don't hurt they just feel different than normal. I'd rather be on the safe side.


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## XYZ (Dec 14, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Planning on it.


 

You're going to waste it.  Sure your strength may go up some but you're starting BF is too high for the winstrol to do what it needs to. 

"cutting" orals, tren and mast shouldn't even be started until you're at or below 10% BF.  Then again, what the hell do I know?


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## theCaptn' (Dec 15, 2010)

cavtrooper96 said:


> As far as the winny, do it if you lose some fat on the cycle. It is really at its best when you are really lean! Like for contest prep! Maybe go for some halos or more dbol the last 4 weeks.


 
stanazol is still anabolic, more so that test -  you can use it to keep the gains rolling end of cycle if you keep your cals high. 

Gains will be dry as you said, I would not suddenly switch diet mid- or end cycle to a cal deficit - make the most of the gears and keep pushing for gains. Either the cycle is a bulker or a cutter - dont mix them up.

During pct keep your cals maintenence, then look into cutting to drop the BF - you want to cement in all those new gains.

Just my 0.02 mate.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 15, 2010)

theCaptn' said:


> stanazol is still anabolic, more so that test - you can use it to keep the gains rolling end of cycle if you keep your cals high.
> 
> Gains will be dry as you said, I would not suddenly switch diet mid- or end cycle to a cal deficit - make the most of the gears and keep pushing for gains. Either the cycle is a bulker or a cutter - dont mix them up.
> 
> ...


 

I didn't plan to switch to a cutting diet at the end. Thanks for the heads up though!

I decided I wanted to take something while I was waiting for the test to clear out and I knew I wanted to run winny in the spring. I figured I would give it a little test run now. That's all. Nothing more nothing less.


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## Life (Dec 15, 2010)

I like to increase about 500 above maintenance during PCT and switch to very low reps. It helps me maintain gains (And even put some on in most cases). If I'm thinking about cutting I'll do it before PCT and then again about four weeks after PCT.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 15, 2010)

Pin #2 Day 6

Just an update on my second pin. It went well I did left glute. I had help though. It was painless until a minute or so afterwards. We went really slow on the inject and left it in there for about 15sec after it was pushed all of the way down. I put a heating pad on it last night and it is kind of sore this morning. I'm starting to like the soreness though. I know what's making me sore and with each pin I get more ready for it to kick in. 

I started adex at .25mg EOD. 

I believe the dbol is starting to come on now. I wieghed in at 210 yesterday and my muscles feel and look more full. I had slight gains on my leg workouts. Today is chest I am excited to see what I can do. 


On a side note, I think I might be going too hard in the gym. I'm going 6-7 days a week. I workout only one body part per time though. I never work out the same body part more than once a week and a day or two of that is cardio. I'm thinking of going back to my MWF lifting and T-TH cardio schedule with weekends off for a few weeks to see how I react. It's just hard to stay out of the gym. Any thoughts?


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## Life (Dec 15, 2010)

I would cut back to four lifting and one cardio. MT-Off-TF-Cardio-Off is what I do. If three days works for you do that, stop with the 6-7 day BS.


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## BigBird (Dec 15, 2010)

Yeah, Life is right.  It would behoove you to cut back and add more rest days to your routine.  Otherwise you'll actually start doing your body a disservice by overtraining.  There is real growth that occurs during rest and recovery days.  Recovery is just as important as hard core workouts.  As long as you "leave it all" in the gym when you're working out, you'd be fine with 3 days off per week.  Maybe even hit abs and cardio on an Off day.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 15, 2010)

BigBird said:


> As long as you "leave it all" in the gym when you're working out, you'd be fine with 3 days off per week. Maybe even hit abs and cardio on an Off day.


 

Yeah I understand all of that. And that's basically what I'm doing now. I'll do chest, tris, bis, back, legs and shoulders all on different days. So that's 6 days. I might throw some random ab, forearm, calfs on these days also. Then if I want to go on the 7th day I just do cardio/ab/forearm stuff. 

During the week I go to the gym on my lunch break from work. I feel really rushed if I have to get 2 body parts done. This is why my schedule is setup like this. I think I get a much better workout when workout 1 body part at a time.


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## The Prototype (Dec 15, 2010)

When I started lifting, I use to go 6-7 days and hit every body part twice a week except legs. As I got older and got a career, my lifting time was limited but I still went minimum of 2-3 days a week. Take what I say with a grain of salt but for me, I have to lift a minimum of 4 days a week to see gains. I've tried the 2 and 3 days a week and I lost muscle and strength. I know some people say rest is important and it is but you have to find a good balance for your body. I worked out six days a week and saw awesome gains with no gear. Now days, I stick to 5 days a week hitting every body part once except bis and tris which I do twice a week. 7 days is too much. 6 is probably too much as well. 4-5 is probably a good number IMO. I don't care what the skeptics say about overtraining. I know mma fighters that train 6 days a week doing 2 and 3 a days. I know football players train minimum of five days a week also doing 2 a days. If you want to get in your optimum shape, you have to train hard and more days than not in a week. Do you really think professional and olympic athletes only train 3 days a week? Absolutely not. When they get prepared for a contest, they go full on nearly every day of the week. Just my two cents on that.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 15, 2010)

Ripped, I think we posted at the same time but I explained why I go that often in the post above yours. 

I agree with you. I've seen better gains sticking to my current schedule then going less often. Now this could be because I'm getting more exercise and therefore losing a little more weight but results are results.


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## The Prototype (Dec 15, 2010)

Just listen to your body. Obviously if your shoulders are still sore from chest day then do legs or bis instead. That is how I gauge how often I need to lift. Using gear shortens your recovery time so don't be afraid to go hard at it. I did for many years and the best gains I ever saw in my life was lifting six days a week using nothing but protein shakes. I also go to the gym during my lunch break so I feel ya on feeling rushed. Since you're only hitting one body part a day, you cam go the extra days. But if you do chest one day, domt do shoulders or tris the next day. Or if you do back, wait a day or two until you do bis. The message I'm trying to convey is to just listen to your body. It will tell you everything you need to know.


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 15, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> On a side note, I think I might be going too hard in the gym. I'm going 6-7 days a week. I workout only one body part per time though. I never work out the same body part more than once a week and a day or two of that is cardio. I'm thinking of going back to my MWF lifting and T-TH cardio schedule with weekends off for a few weeks to see how I react. It's just hard to stay out of the gym. Any thoughts?



I agree. Don't forget those compounds! I stick to an EOD routine based on lift-types (push, squat, pull, and lift) rather than isolating individual body parts. I only use isolation exercises to supplement my compounds for the day if I have time, ya know, to kinda tweek-out an idividual body part I want to focus on.

This works best for me for growth and bulking. My energy in the gym is usually higher, as I come in feeling fully re-charged. Just MHO.


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 15, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Using gear shortens your recovery time so don't be afraid to go hard at it.



Exactly ripped. You are augmented so this something to keep in mind. Maybe use a day on the weekend for a "free-style" day, you could use to spot-train areas you think need improvement.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 16, 2010)

Oh I do all of the normal compound exercises. My favorite being dead lifts. 

Today: I got a good night's sleep (8 hrs) but I still woke up feeling tired and just dragging ass. I had a PB&J and a Protein shake for breakfast and I feel a little better now. I'm starting to feel a little "fat." Maybe it's the water weight from the dbol. I'm not really sure. And since I just started my adex two days ago I'm sure it hasn't kicked in yet. I would normally wear a tighter shirt to work to show off for the ladies but not today. I guess this is what I signed up for when I decided to bulk. 

Yesterday after my chest workout, my legs, more specifically my quads, got extremely sore. I assume this is from tuesday's leg workout. This has continued into today and I think I will take today off from the gym and rest.


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## The Prototype (Dec 16, 2010)

The second day after the leg workout is generally the worst.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 16, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> The second day after the leg workout is generally the worst.


 

Ehh whilst eating my chicken breast and brown rice I decided to go hit shoulders today and quit being such a pussy. 

If it gets too bad Ill take a methadone or vicodin and sit on the couch with my Roor and some nugs.


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## hackskii (Dec 16, 2010)

Congrats on your first cycle, you did do your homework.
If you dont mind I subscribed to your first cycle and would like to toss some things out there.

Me personally I like the idea of one gear for a first cycle, I suggest this because some gears have diffrent sides than others.
I got panic and or anxiety attacks from the winstrol, and I put that down to being a DHT drug that actually is a CNS stimulant.
I love test based cycles and IMO they are the daddy.

Both test and dbol aromitize quite alot and at the end of your cycle you may want to bump up that adex some.
Estrogen support is important as estrogen is approx 200 times more supressive than testosterone, using an AI during the cycle tends to have an easier recovery post cycle.

If I may make a suggestion, powders are hyped alot by supplement companies yet whole foods is really where it is at.
Most whole foods offer a far higher nutrient profile and for putting on mass, nothing is better.
If you have to use the powders the post workout would be the best place.
Sure you already know this but just saying for others that may not know.

Gyno symptoms start out like either itchy, or puffy, but if you feel any pain up your AI dose.
When it feels like a splinter in your nipple, gyno will surely follow.
Guage your AI to how you feel and dont play with your nipples as this can elivate prolactin.

Keep the liver support to the end as this wont be a problem and the stress on the liver from the dbol can elivate IGF-1 levels so it would be better to skip that till after, it wont be needed anyway now.

Good luck


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## SloppyJ (Dec 16, 2010)

Thanks Hackskii that's informative for the newer folks. I've actually tried to get away from the powders as much as possible. I like them in the morning and before bed. I've changed lately though. Normally i would be pounding down a protein shake after I left the gym then eat a light lunch. Lately I've been skipping the PWO shake and going for more food. Today I have 6-8oz of sirloin steak and some whole grain pasta with some cheese for PWO. This is just as much protein as a shake and it's coming from a good food source. 

Thanks for subscribing. I'm trying to make my log pretty extensive to hopefully help answer questions people might have when searching. I know I used to read every log I could.


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## The Prototype (Dec 16, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> If it gets too bad Ill take a methadone or vicodin and sit on the couch with my Roor and some nugs.



Hook a brotha up. Why you holding back on me?


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## hackskii (Dec 16, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Thanks Hackskii that's informative for the newer folks. I've actually tried to get away from the powders as much as possible. I like them in the morning and before bed. I've changed lately though. Normally i would be pounding down a protein shake after I left the gym then eat a light lunch. Lately I've been skipping the PWO shake and going for more food. Today I have 6-8oz of sirloin steak and some whole grain pasta with some cheese for PWO. This is just as much protein as a shake and it's coming from a good food source.
> 
> Thanks for subscribing. I'm trying to make my log pretty extensive to hopefully help answer questions people might have when searching. I know I used to read every log I could.


 
Thanks for the welcome.
I have been around a very long time, I normally dont do American boards due to too many flames, but I like this one so far.
I am not new to boards and am a mod on a big UK board but this one is close to home.

PWO is pretty important for glycogen recovery, I stopped having powders and enjoy my food when I eat.

I didnt mention it, and you may not even need it till you are done, but I am a very big fan of HCG during the cycle.
Keeping testicular function makes recovery very easy, not only that but it keeps endogenous testosterone flowing, even in light of exogenous administration of testosterone.


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 16, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Today I have 6-8oz of sirloin steak and some whole grain pasta with some cheese for PWO.
> .



Now that's what I'm talkin about!

Damn Slop, you're making me hungry bro.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 16, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Hook a brotha up. Why you holding back on me?


 

Ripped, next time I got on vacation in FL I got ya! 



hackskii said:


> I didnt mention it, and you may not even need it till you are done, but I am a very big fan of HCG during the cycle.
> Keeping testicular function makes recovery very easy, not only that but it keeps endogenous testosterone flowing, even in light of exogenous administration of testosterone.


 
Yeah man everyone loves that stuff. I think I'm going to hold off on the HCG this go around but next time it's on my list. Can you do IM shots with it or is it all sub?




GreatWhiteTruth said:


> Now that's what I'm talkin about!
> 
> Damn Slop, you're making me hungry bro.


 

Ummmmm my whole workout I was thinking about this steak I'm eating right now. All of my co-workers say "Ohhh boy it must be nice to eat steak and grilled chicken everyday." I tell them I can afford it since I don't go out to lunch everyday and then the bar after work. Retards.


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## hackskii (Dec 16, 2010)

HCG can be either sub-Q or IM, they even have a sublingual preperation for the HCG diet but it is pretty weak but none the less...lol


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 16, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Ummmmm my whole workout I was thinking about this steak I'm eating right now. All of my co-workers say "Ohhh boy it must be nice to eat steak and grilled chicken everyday." I tell them I can afford it since I don't go out to lunch everyday and then the bar after work. Retards.



Haters gonna hate.



			
				hackskii said:
			
		

> HCG can be either sub-Q or IM, they even have a sublingual preperation  for the HCG diet but it is pretty weak but none the less...lol



I've been wondering this... Not to hijack this log or anything, more-so to add to it,  but which is better SubQ or IM? Pros and cons? Personal preference maybe?


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## hackskii (Dec 16, 2010)

GreatWhiteTruth said:


> which is better SubQ or IM? Pros and cons? Personal preference maybe?


 
Not a hyjack really.
Either or, the pro for Sub-Q is simple, smaller guage needle, more site injection sites, shorter needle, easier to measure using a slin pin, less money on needles, and less loss in the head of the needle using a slin pin.

Most bestest answer................Less scar tissue sub-Q


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 16, 2010)

hackskii said:


> Not a hyjack really.
> Either or, the pro for Sub-Q is simple, smaller guage needle, more site injection sites, shorter needle, easier to measure using a slin pin, less money on needles, and less loss in the head of the needle using a slin pin.
> 
> Most bestest answer................Less scar tissue sub-Q



Too easy. Thanks ski.Reps are re-charging.


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## hackskii (Dec 16, 2010)

GreatWhiteTruth said:


> Too easy. Thanks ski.Reps are re-charging.


 
Thanks

Its supposed to be easy.................


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## SloppyJ (Dec 17, 2010)

Update:

I feel really good today. I took the day off to rest and recover. I've had several people at work tell me I look "Bowed" up today and that I'm getting bigger. I went out for lunch and had sushi so I'm still doing pretty good on my diet on my off day and I don't plan to cheat at all. 

I took another dose of Adex last night. Yesterday my nips still felt a little sensitive. I dropped .25mg last night and no sensitivity today what so ever. I like the adex and so far I have had no sides at all. 

I do have a question though. I know it's not a big deal but I'm supposed to pin tomorrow morning. My friend who normally pins me in the glutes is out of town so I have to nut up and hit myself in the quads. I have to get up early tomorrow and go cut wood. I was thinking about pinning tonight so I could get the heating pad on it. I don't want to be sore all day tomorrow. How bad is it to pin about 12 hours off of schedule? Will this throw my blood levels off enough to mess anything up? I figure since the ester lasts two weeks so 12hrs isn't even going to do anything. I guess I think about things waaaay too much.


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## The Prototype (Dec 17, 2010)

That's fine. I have a M/Th schedule and I've pinned on W instead of Th twice already. It shouldn't be an issue with the long esters. Just make sure you take the dbol as scheduled bc it has a short half life.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 17, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> That's fine. I have a M/Th schedule and I've pinned on W instead of Th twice already. It shouldn't be an issue with the long esters. Just make sure you take the dbol as scheduled bc it has a short half life.


 

Shit I can pop pills all day. It's the needle thing that gets me


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## The Prototype (Dec 17, 2010)

I wouldn't sweat being sore. Test E really doesn't hurt. You will be fine. First one you'll be a little sore but you'll still be able to work out or do cardio with no prob. Now Sust is a different story. That put me out for a week. Probably b/c of the prop in it.


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## hackskii (Dec 17, 2010)

12 hours is nothing, even a day is nothing, in fact when I do cycles of 500mg test, I bang them all in one go, the stable blood level things is just BS.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 17, 2010)

Just hit the quad. Right in the middle outside. The burn on the initial push was really bad. I'm not sure what from but it wasn't very cool. I let a drop of gear run down the pin, is this what caused it? 

Other than that, I'd venture to say the post injection pain is little to non-existent.

Taking the entire day off from the gym really kind of sucked but I'm feeling good and I'm excited to go hit my back tomorrow. Hopefully my strength will be up. I will let yall know.


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## The Prototype (Dec 17, 2010)

Yes you should let a few drops fall down the pin then insert. It helps lubricate the pin and makes it easier to push the pin in. Nice job on the pin. It's a lot easier than the glute huh? I'll never go back to glute pins unless I have to.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 17, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Yes you should let a few drops fall down the pin then insert. It helps lubricate the pin and makes it easier to push the pin in. Nice job on the pin. It's a lot easier than the glute huh? I'll never go back to glute pins unless I have to.


 

Well I haven't done a glute shot by myself yet. So this was the first time pinning myself. I had to get my mind right before hand and relax a little. But overall it wasn't bad. 

Is it bad that I'm already looking forward to the next one?

It's funny to me. We're on here on a friday night when everyone else is out getting fucked up. I'm sitting here with a protein shake thinking about my workout tomorrow.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 17, 2010)

Okay so I'm quite reluctant to post progress pics on here because A. I'm a fatass. B. I'm no where near as big as many people on the board. But, however I feel like there are people out there just like me that this will benifit. 

So without further ado, here are the pics from the begining of week 2. Be easy on me!


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## The Prototype (Dec 17, 2010)

Looks good bro. You'll be jacked in 4-6 weeks. It takes a lot of balls to post your pics on here unless you look like mr fantastico or buzzard. Looking forward to seeing the progress. I wish I took some before pics but the pic I took was in week 4 so it wasn't a huge difference anyways.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 17, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Looks good bro. You'll be jacked in 4-6 weeks. It takes a lot of balls to post your pics on here unless you look like mr fantastico or buzzard. Looking forward to seeing the progress. I wish I took some before pics but the pic I took was in week 4 so it wasn't a huge difference anyways.


 

Thanks man. You're right it does take some nuts to post some pics. I just said screw it. If someone says something I don't really give a fuck.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 18, 2010)

Strength is going up. I got a few extra reps on my deadlift. Close grip pulldowns were easier. Shrugs went up. And I grabbed some 50's to curl just for the hell of it and to my disbelief I got 3 sets of 12. 

With all of this said. I had to lay on a bench after my deadlifts. My back was hurting bad. I tried to do some rows and couldn't stand it, I had to take a break. So I guess the back pump thing is legit with dbol. I'm going to keep working out to see if the back pump thing keeps showing itself. If it does I plan to take some taurine and potassium similar to my clen dosage of 4g T and 200mg P.


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## Creatineamonster (Dec 18, 2010)

Hey man I am no where near using anything but I really like learning about this stuff just wanted to thank you for being so open and sharing your "hypothetical" journey it is really cool to see how this is progressing good luck and keep up the hard work can't wait to see the final reasults.


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## hackskii (Dec 18, 2010)

Yah, nice openess to your use and journal.
I can see some flaws in training, and will comment once I get more distance with your journal.

I also would like to look at your diet as well, but in time, not now, when you have time boss.

How old are you by the way and how long have you been training?

What are your favorite exercises?
What are your least favorite exercises?

Just askin some questions for my benefit to get more understanding.

What rep ranges do you like and how many times do you do each body part?

Sorry for all the questions.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 18, 2010)

hackskii said:


> Yah, nice openess to your use and journal.
> I can see some flaws in training, and will comment once I get more distance with your journal.
> 
> I also would like to look at your diet as well, but in time, not now, when you have time boss.
> ...


 

Please critique the fuck out of me. I'm here to learn and grow. And you guys are welcome. Like I said I just want to help others through my experience. Yes, correct, this is all "hypothetical" what-if's..... 

Diet: 

645am: 3 whole "jumbo" eggs, two pieces of ham chopped up in the eggs, 1 piece whole grain toast w/ a little butter, + Protein shake= 2 scoops syntha 6, 1/2cup oats, Low fat yougurt, and fruit. 

10am:  1 Grilled Chicken Breast or steak, Brown rice

1130am: Preworkout drink with some kind of fruit. Orange, Banana.....

12pm: Workout

115pm: Two scoops unflavored protein isolate, 12oz Orange Juice, Grilled Chicken breast/steak, brown rice 

3:30: Protein Bar or PB&J on Wheat. 

6:30: Lean meat, Veggies (I try to keep carbs low at night.)

9pm: Casein Protein with peanut butter 

Honestly I try to stick to my diet as much as possible. The weekends are the hardest because I would like to sleep in. I shoot for atleast a gallon of water per day also. 

Im in my early 20's and I trained all the way through school playing football. I continued to workout in College which I'm still in. I've been training for around 9yrs. There have been breaks in there for a few months but really seriously for the past 3. 


Fav exercises: Deadlifts, Squat, Tricep overhead DB extensions, Dips, Leg Press, DB Curls... I have a lot.

Least Favorite Exercises: Incline bench, Pullups, I don't like these probably because I'm weak on them. 

For years I stuck with the ol' 3x10 kind of pussy shit not pushing myself. About 6 months ago I started doing pryamid 10-8-6 increasing weight as I go. I've been sticking to this mostly. Sometimes I do a light 12rep set to warm up and what not. And on bi's I normally just dominate them with all kinds of stuff. Heavy weight low rep, Light weight high rep, then I'll run the rack at the end. I stick to the pryamid for the heavier days like legs and back. 

Previously I mentioned I workout on my lunch break so I have a limited amount of time to get in and get out. So while school is out I've been in the gym 7x a week. Back, Bi's, Chest, Tri's, Legs, Shoulders and then sunday I normally only do cardio and abs. Maybe forearms. I also try to throw some cardio in on saturday. These are the only days I can spend however long I want in the gym. 

I guess since I'm home and don't have shit else to do with my best friend out of town I'll type out my normal routine. 

*Chest:*
Flat Bench Barbell: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Incline or Decline: "     "    "
Cable Cross Overs: 1x10 1x8 1x8 ( I keep the reps high here cause heavy weight hurts my shoulder for some reason. I'm looking at my form closely)
DB Press: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Pullovers: 1x12, 1x10, 1x8

*Tri's:*
Overhead DB Extension: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Close Grip Bench: "   "   " 
Rope push downs: "   "   "
V bar or Straight bar push downs: "   "   "
Non-weighted Dips to burnout: 3x10 

*Back:*
Deads: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
DB Rows: "   "   "
Closegrip Lat Pulldown: "   "   "
I call them cable "X's": 3x10
Seated Rows: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Straigt Arm Lat Pushdown: "   "   "
Back Extensions (Dbol sucks!) : 3x10

*Bi's:*
Dumbells Curls: 2 warmup sets then about 4x10
Preacher Curls: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Reverse Barbell curls: "   "   "
Standing High cable curls: 3x10
Then I just grab dumbells and go to town til I get tired. Then run the rack.
If i'm feeling froggy I might do some negatives on the curl machine. 

*Shoulders:*
Seated DB Press: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Simth machine Press: "   "   "
Rear Delt on Fly machine: 1x10, 1x8, 1x8
Front DB Raises: 3x10-12
Cable Side raises from low to high across body: 3x10
Then a shoulder machine to burn out: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6, 1 to failure

*Legs:*
Squats: Light warmup then 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
Leg press: "  "  " ( I normally do about 10reps of calves after each set)
Quad Extensions: "   "  "
Calf Raises: 3x12   I do them with a barbell like squats and on two other machines. so that might be too much.
Hamstrings: 1x10, 1x8, 1x6
I think I'm going to start doing DB Lunges also.



Wow this took a while to type. I know someone is going to disect the shit out of my routine and tell me how shitty it is. So let's hear it boys.  

What are your thoughts?


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## bknoxx (Dec 18, 2010)

looks pretty good im just starting leg's  but mines is pretty close to ur routine


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## DarkHorse (Dec 18, 2010)

I personally would not spend a whole training session on bi’s and then another session on tri’s. If you focus on compound exercises you will not need to spend so much time on your arms. I love compound exercises because your arms still get a workout. You can still hit your arms hard but I would not spend a whole training session doing so. Have you tried a 5x5 routine??


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## SloppyJ (Dec 18, 2010)

DarkHorse said:


> I personally would not spend a whole training session on bi???s and then another session on tri???s. If you focus on compound exercises you will not need to spend so much time on your arms. I love compound exercises because your arms still get a workout. You can still hit your arms hard but I would not spend a whole training session doing so. Have you tried a 5x5 routine??


 

Nope. And yes I have thought about this. I just like the way my arms feel after I beat the shit out of them.

Do you have a link to the 5x5?


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## DarkHorse (Dec 18, 2010)

Check this link out, it has a couple good articles.... Bodybuilding.com - What Is The Best 5x5 Workout That Will Produce Amazing Muscle Gain? - Workout Of The Week

5x5 works great for putting on mass and size. Since you are geared up you'll also lose some body fat. Also, like I said, I like compound exercises that target large muscle groups..... like back(you work your posterior delts and bi's as well), legs, chest(you work your shoulders and tri's as well). When you hit those large muscle groups your arms will come along with them. I also usually hit my shoulders and arms later in the week once I have completed/focused on those large muscle groups.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 18, 2010)

DarkHorse said:


> Check this link out, it has a couple good articles.... Bodybuilding.com - What Is The Best 5x5 Workout That Will Produce Amazing Muscle Gain? - Workout Of The Week
> 
> 5x5 works great for putting on mass and size. Since you are geared up you'll also loose some body fat. Also, like I said, I like compound exercises that target large muscle groups..... like back, legs, chest. When you hit those large muscle groups your arms will come along with them. I also usually hit my shoulders and arms later in the week once I have completed/focused on those large muscle groups.


 
Thanks for the link. What compound exercises am I missing? 


Is it me or does that BB.com 5x5 look pretty pussy? I understand the concept I just don't like how those two douchers laid out the workouts.


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## DarkHorse (Dec 18, 2010)

You already have the needed compound exercises, I would just add more sets and hit them harder. I know you don't like pull-ups and chin-ups, but those are a good judge of strength and work many muscles at one time.


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## DarkHorse (Dec 18, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Thanks for the link. What compound exercises am I missing?
> 
> 
> Is it me or does that BB.com 5x5 look pretty pussy? I understand the concept I just don't like how those two douchers laid out the workouts.


 
Yeah I don't like the way they have the routine set up either, but it explains doing five sets with five reps a piece. You can stick to your routine if you want, just add more sets with heavier weights.  When I'm geared up, the most enjoyable routine I like comes from Frank Zane. Some days you will need to spend a good quality ammount of time in the gym. Since you're greared up, you recover a lot faster, that's why I like doing my chest and back on day one, shoulder and arms the next day, legs and abs the following day, and then a day of rest(If you need another day off take it, listen to your body)..... Then repeat. I enjoy that routine the most and I have made excellent gains with it. As you can see, on day one I really focuses on those compound exercises. Then the next day, I really tear down what is left of my shoulders and arms.


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## Creatineamonster (Dec 18, 2010)

I am still very knew and could be way out in left field here but would,nt it be wise to stick with what he has been doing till his cycle is over. Then make changes to the routine. I Understand there are always things to change but I find it can sometimes screw with you ability to get the intensity and confindence needed to max out a workout which I am assuming is pretty damn important in order to get all you can out of the Gear. Again this may be a dumb newb statement/question but I am a dumb newb lol


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## SloppyJ (Dec 19, 2010)

Creatineamonster said:


> I am still very knew and could be way out in left field here but would,nt it be wise to stick with what he has been doing till his cycle is over. Then make changes to the routine. I Understand there are always things to change but I find it can sometimes screw with you ability to get the intensity and confindence needed to max out a workout which I am assuming is pretty damn important in order to get all you can out of the Gear. Again this may be a dumb newb statement/question but I am a dumb newb lol


 

Man I'm thinking the same thing. I "know" these workouts really well. I will be able to see what I'm getting stronger at and what I need to do better. I'm thinking about sticking to this through PCT then maybe switching to something else.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 19, 2010)

Update.


I can tell I'm gaining mass for sure. Today I had to stack a shitton (Yes, a shit ton) of wood. I always wear a red flanel shirt for such occasions. It makes me feel like a lumberjack. Well I reached down to get a log and ripped my shirt by my lat. I got pissed and then I smiled. 

Today was possibly the best workout I've ever had. I lifted so much more weight it was crazy. I went to do cardio and I checked the schedule for the next week. They are closed 3 days so I decided to get some Tricep work done after my cardio.

I knew I was going to go a little heavier but I was repping a 110DB for overhead tricep press. I FINALLY got to rep 225 on close grip bench. And I had to add a 45 plate to the stack for pushdowns. It was a fucking amazing afternoon, people were staring. And to top it off my boy that works the desk ordered lunch and bought me some crab.  

Jesus I can't wait for the test to kick in.


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## theCaptn' (Dec 20, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Looks good bro. You'll be jacked in 4-6 weeks. It takes a lot of balls to post your pics on here unless you look like mr fantastico or buzzard. .


 
 . .  on the road to jerkedness mate


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

Repping 225 on the close grip bench is impressive. I just started doing close grip. I'm only repping 135 lbs but I've been focusing on form more than anything.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Repping 225 on the close grip bench is impressive. I just started doing close grip. I'm only repping 135 lbs but I've been focusing on form more than anything.


 

Thanks Ripped. When I first started doing close grips seriously about 3 months ago I would do 135 for three sets of 10 focusing on form. I slowly increased weight from there. Yesterday something came over me. I've never been able to rep with 2 45's on and that's one of my goals deep down. I just made it happen though.  I'd like to thank protein shakes and Dbol for this ocasion. 

Tri's are my strongest body part though. I've always had big legs too. 



And Captn',

Don't know if that's for me or ripped but thanks either way.


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

I heard the close grip is great for increasing bench so I started doing them. I can't believe after almost ten years of lifting I never did close grip. I figured flat bench was so similar and I had so many tri exercises in my routine, that I would just skip it.  But my bench shot up the week after I did my first routine with close grip. Prob wasn't just the close grip but I started doing low reps so that helped, plus I'm sure the Test had a lot to do with it lol. Keep up the good work bro. Looks like you're making progress already. It's like watching your kid grow up, well that's if I had kids lol.


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## hackskii (Dec 20, 2010)

Just a couple of things that kind of jump out at me.
Me personally that looks like a lot of volume of exercises, and 7 days a week is a bit much as recovery takes time and you don’t look like you are giving yourself enough time to recover.

I would drop the isolation movements and focus on your compound exercises (multi-joint exercises), this will allow you to do less volume yet hit the same amount of muscles.

Perhaps try to hit glute hamstring tie in about twice a week like dead lifts and then good mornings on another day like legs.
The daddy of them all the squat, you are doing only 3 sets of and that is ok providing the intensity is there.
Leg extensions and leg press are secondary and probably not needed if the stimulation from the squat is there and the rep range is full.
So if your legs just don’t feel like you hit them then you can add in the leg presses to finish off the legs.
The extensions are just there for separation and probably should be done slow, strict and squeezing.

I notice you don’t have enough good fats in your diet, perhaps you can add some fish oils for excessive inflammation, aid in insulin sensitivity and these are just a great idea anyway for good health.

I do hamstrings on back day when I do dead lifts, myself and train one day then next day cardio or time off.

The whole game for training is simple, stimulate, then recover.
If you over stimulate then you need more time for recovery.
Consider it like this, your training is like digging a hole, the recovery is like filling the hole, the deeper you dig, the longer it takes to fill said hole.

Or another way to look at it is like taking sand and rubbing your hands together till you get raw hands.
What happens?
A callous forms on the hand.
Now if you kept doing that every day the callous would never grow as you have cut into the recovery by not letting your hands heal, not to mention your hands would never grow the callous as the stimulation exceeds the recovery.

A couple of things more as I see them, if you took more time, and intensity on the compound exercises and less energy on the isolation exercises, you would cut less into recovery and allow yourself to gain more gains on the exercises that count the most.
You get the big numbers on all the basic lifts, you will grow period.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

Thanks for taking the time to write that Hackskii. I kind of realized that today. My gym is closed for 3 days this week so I'm forced to get it all in, in 4 days. Today I did Legs and Shoulders. I concentrated on Squats and military press. I also did leg press, quad extensions, hamstrings and front raises. Overall I kept it pretty simple and went heavy.

Squat went 135x12, 225x10, 295x6
I finally got to 630 on the leg press for 6 reps. 
Military press felt weak today. Although I did 3 sets of 8 with 40lb DB's for front raises. 

As for the fats.... I take 3 fish oil caps per day. I eat a lot of meat. I guess I could throw some olive oil into my morning shake. It's hard for me man. I've always had to cut. Doing this high calorie stuff just feels so wrong to me but it's sooo right haha.


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## Life (Dec 20, 2010)

I think leg press is the most misused piece of equipment in any gym. I personally have never gotten much out of it even at 700lb+ executed correctly. I think you'd be better off adding front squats or replacing leg press with lunges. Lunges are a very under rated mass builder and IMO very integral to squat development.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

Life said:


> I think leg press is the most misused piece of equipment in any gym. I personally have never gotten much out of it even at 700lb+ executed correctly. I think you'd be better off adding front squats or replacing leg press with lunges. Lunges are a very under rated mass builder and IMO very integral to squat development.


 

I might agree with you. But my legs got very taxed from the 630lb today. I've noticed some development in different areas of my legs also. 

What do you prefer, Barbell Lunges or DB lunges? I remember in football I used to HATE barbell lunges. I've never really tried DB lunges though. I think I should add these in though. Maybe I'll rotate every other week between leg press and lunges.


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

Life said:


> I think leg press is the most misused piece of equipment in any gym. I personally have never gotten much out of it even at 700lb+ executed correctly. I think you'd be better off adding front squats or replacing leg press with lunges. Lunges are a very under rated mass builder and IMO very integral to squat development.



I like the leg press but my chiro tells me it's absolutely horrible for your spine. It puts a lot of pressure on your disks. He said he's seen more injuries from people getting hurt on the leg press machine than any other exercise, which I find ironic. I would think most people would get injured from squats


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## Life (Dec 20, 2010)

I prefer DB lunges, less strain on my back or at least it feels that way. Plus you don't have to re-rack the damn things, just let them fall. Unless you use straps like I do cause they're so fucking heavy. Do lunges for a while, watch your ass change


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> I might agree with you. But my legs got very taxed from the 630lb today. I've noticed some development in different areas of my legs also.
> 
> What do you prefer, Barbell Lunges or DB lunges? I remember in football I used to HATE barbell lunges. I've never really tried DB lunges though. I think I should add these in though. Maybe I'll rotate every other week between leg press and lunges.



I would start with low weight with the db lunges and work your way up. It's hard to keep your balance with heavier weight if you haven't done them before or in a long time. But you will def feel the burn after a few sets. I personally don't like to go heavy with legs. That's how I injured my back so I've been hesitant to really push my legs.


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## Life (Dec 20, 2010)

If you're performing squats correctly you'd have trouble getting into a position to hurt yourself. With the leg press the machines aren't built to any standard, you'll see all types of variations. Generally all of the pressure is applied to one specific area of your lower back. You'll see the tops of people's backs come off as they push with their feet so ALL of the weight is now in that spot on your lower back. You can load a leg press to hell and back with plates and throw them around because its a machine. You can't with a squat rack. Well you can but that's what natural selection is for.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I like the leg press but my chiro tells me it's absolutely horrible for your spine. It puts a lot of pressure on your disks. He said he's seen more injuries from people getting hurt on the leg press machine than any other exercise, which I find ironic. I would think most people would get injured from squats


 
I'm scared of those "Doctors" I know it's not true but I have a theroy that they fuck you up so you have to keep coming back. 



Life said:


> I prefer DB lunges, less strain on my back or at least it feels that way. Plus you don't have to re-rack the damn things, just let them fall. Unless you use straps like I do cause they're so fucking heavy. Do lunges for a while, watch your ass change


 
Yeah I'll throw the versa gripps on for that.


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

Life said:


> If you're performing squats correctly you'd have trouble getting into a position to hurt yourself. With the leg press the machines aren't built to any standard, you'll see all types of variations. Generally all of the pressure is applied to one specific area of your lower back. You'll see the tops of people's backs come off as they push with their feet so ALL of the weight is now in that spot on your lower back. You can load a leg press to hell and back with plates and throw them around because its a machine. You can't with a squat rack. Well you can but that's what natural selection is for.



Yeah I injured myself doing squats b/c I was young and eager and tried to squat way too much weight. Plus, I wasn't wearing a belt and probably wasn't using correct form.

J, I've had back issues for a long time. My chiro is actually a really good friend of mine but it def helps me. Makes me feel much more relaxed and the muscles in my back aren't so tense from lifting, sitting at a desk all day, etc. Most people are skeptical but I personally like it.


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## theCaptn' (Dec 20, 2010)

Life said:


> I think leg press is the most misused piece of equipment in any gym. I personally have never gotten much out of it even at 700lb+ executed correctly. I think you'd be better off adding front squats or replacing leg press with lunges. Lunges are a very under rated mass builder and IMO very integral to squat development.


 
Agree with the lunges, and I prefer the hack squat to the leg press . . this may sound arse-about, but Ive found this leg routine a good fkg mass builder:

Squats - at least 2 warm-up sets (8-10 reps). 4 working sets (6-8 reps).

Hack squats - 3 sets

Leg Extentions - 3 sets

Walking lunges to finish - about 20 paces (3 sets). 

All of this can generally be squeezed into 45 min, no need for any longer. My upper traps and rear delts are also fried pretty much after this as well


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

What's a good weight to start for the DB lunges? I've never done them (DB) before. You guys have my poundage for my leg workout. What do you think?


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## theCaptn' (Dec 20, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> What's a good weight to start for the DB lunges? I've never done them (DB) before. You guys have my poundage for my leg workout. What do you think?


 
might sound like a dumb answer, but whatever works! Just make sure you can hold you form properly - back straight, shoulders back etc


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## TwisT (Dec 20, 2010)

For lunges, I take a 45 plate and hold it over my head and do a lap on the indoor track. You will die, and 1 lap = 1 set. Goodluck!

-T


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> What's a good weight to start for the DB lunges? I've never done them (DB) before. You guys have my poundage for my leg workout. What do you think?



I would start with a 25 lb db and work your way up. I know it's not a lot of weight but do a couple of warm up sets with it to get a feel for it and to get your balance. Once you feel like you can do it with good form, move your way up. If you try to start with the 75 lb db, you'll probably fall over or lose your balance. Make sure you go all the way down to where your rear knee almost touches the ground to get a full stretch. I personally like to take a long step. If you have a large enough area, you can just walk around the gym doing it. Otherwise you have to stay in small area and do one leg at a time.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

Cool thanks for the info guys. I remember doing them in the squat rack at school and we'd have to alternate legs. It was no bueno. Luckily there is a "track" around my gym so I can walk around doing lunges. I might do an exercise on each side of the gym and just lunge my big ass back and forth.


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## Life (Dec 20, 2010)

I do two 55's but I started at 35's. TwisT is a fucking sadist but that shit he said is awesome for abs too. Look at his for example. TwisT how big is this fucking track? I do a set of 20: half way across the gym, turn around and back = 20 lunges. Like I said though I use straps most of the time and shouldn't, I just can't hold the damn things that long


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## TwisT (Dec 20, 2010)

Life said:


> I do two 55's but I started at 35's. TwisT is a fucking sadist but that shit he said is awesome for abs too. Look at his for example. TwisT how big is this fucking track? I do a set of 20: half way across the gym, turn around and back = 20 lunges. Like I said though I use straps most of the time and shouldn't, I just can't hold the damn things that long



1/8th mile. Try it, you will cry. 

-T


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

TwisT said:


> 1/8th mile. Try it, you will cry.
> 
> -T


 

Sweet Jeebus. That will turn boys to men. 

Have you ever counted how many lunges you actually do?


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## hackskii (Dec 20, 2010)

Well, it is all about stimulation in the end.
Squats and dead lifts boost testosterone levels, GH levels and stimulate the CNS.
This is good, and if the range is good, it works the whole body, even the core.
It is a natural exercise and to be honest the biggest legs I ever saw were guys that had a nice squat, not leg press, not extensions, but the squat.
Rep ranges will dictate hypertrophy depending on the person but the higher rep ranges tend to be more effective, with the exception of those guys that can fire all fibers when going heavy, but that isnt for the normal dude in the gym.
20 rep squats are killer, even work the diaphram, and will wind you no matter what.

Sprinters do squats, football players do squats, why?
Because it is the power out of the hole that matters in their sport.
Now granted this is bodybuilding but once the mass is there then the isolation exercises work well for seperation and isolation of lagging body parts.

Never seen a big squater with small legs.
Never seen a big dead lifter with a small back nor small traps.

Bro, if you focus on the lifts that matter and blow off the crap that doesnt, focusing on that that matters, better gains will ensue.

You can get condition too with stuff like clean and jerks, running stairs, etc.

HIIT, HIT, will get you into condition and you wont have to worry about the other fluff stuff.

Id like to comment more later on some stuff....lol....stuff....lol


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## Life (Dec 20, 2010)

I think the leg press is good to go to if you are stalled on the squat due to quads. Do leg press til you max out then switch back to squats and build back up, you will have broken through the wall you had before. Aside from that and rehab I don't see the use.

Squats, Good mornings, Deadlifts, Pullthroughs, Bench, Dips, Rows, Military press, lunges. If you focus on those I guarrantee you will grow the fastest you have ever grown. I know from personal experience. I was indoctrinated into training like a body builder by my trainer at the time and I was stuck in that mentality for a year and a half. When I switched to focus on the big four (Squat, dead, military and bench press) I experienced gains at the same rate as when I first started. Just my $0.02


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## The Prototype (Dec 20, 2010)

Some good info there by both Hack and Life


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## hackskii (Dec 20, 2010)

The common denominator here is compound lifts.

Im gonna grab some more beers, hell, I think I am going outside to have a smoke...........Wife hates that due to the illegality of this............lol
Nevermind................Will be back for some opinionated crap that is in my head........lol

Happy hollidays in early disposition............lol


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## SloppyJ (Dec 20, 2010)

^^ Hahaha

Damn yall have got me thinking about switching up my whole program here.

I guess the three days off at christmas I'll figure out what I want to do. It sounds badass though.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 22, 2010)

Update:

Did pin #4 last night. I went with the glute and it felt MUCH better than any of the previous pins. This would only be the second time I've hit that muscle. I guess my muscles are getting used to it. So that's good news. 

I took yesterday off. My whole schedule got messed up by a random drug test we had to take at work. Wow that was stressful. Good thing I had a plan. 

Today I did chest. I've been thinking about what you guys have been saying and I stuck to 4 exercises and got in and out of the gym. I did flat barbell bench, Cable flys, Decline Dumbell and the incline machine. 

I went heavier than normal on everything and the chest pumps I got today were some of the best I've ever had. The cable fly's got the blood flowing. On my last working set of flat bench I did 245x5. This is the heaviest I've ever done. I think I could have gone heavier too. 

Weight is at 213 after my workout. I'm looking better overall with more definition than before. I'm also more vascular. I upped the Adex to .25 every morning because on the EOD schedule I noticed my nips felt weird on the day I didn't take it. I think I'd rather be safe than sorry here. 

Tomorrow is back and light bi work then I'm taking 3days off for xmas. I'm sure I'll have no problem meeting my calorie goals. I plan to resume workouts on Monday.


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## bccs (Dec 22, 2010)

Bro, I wouldn't be worried about the drug test (at least if the only illegal thing in your system is the juice).  I really looked into this before starting my cycle and the 5 and 10 panel screen most places use don't include any steroids.


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## Hell (Dec 22, 2010)

Hell yea man!!


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## SloppyJ (Dec 23, 2010)

Oh im not worried about the gear.......


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## SloppyJ (Dec 27, 2010)

Time for an update....


Got the holidays over with and had a great time. But now it's back to the training. I did a pin on saturday morning in my quad, yes after Santa got there. I didn't push a drop out of the tip and I didn't have the burn that I've been experiencing.

I took three days off and finally got to hit the gym today with my buddy. I decided to do a different workout this week. 3 days lifting 3 cardio and abs and 1 day off. I decided to do this because I was fearing that I was over training. This way I can get more cardio in and rest. I noticed that I felt better with the rest this weekend. 

Weight is up to 216. Waist is just a tad smaller. Muscles feel awesome. I believe the test is starting to kick in. I had some very different feeling pumps today. They were incredible. My skin is more oily and I'm starting to get some pimples on my face. My hair is starting to thin in places also. I'm plateau'd out on strength increase since last time on bench. My tri's were stronger however. 

I also decided to go with the winny at the end of the cycle. These cute little yellow things are just begging to be ate. I'm debating between 4, 5, and 6 weeks.


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## The Prototype (Dec 27, 2010)

6 weeks fo sho! You'll love them. I know I did. how many days since your first pin? You'll know when the test kicks in. It's hard not to bc you'll feel your hormones changing. Is your libido up at all? How much did you gain with the dbol? When my test kicked in, I had a couple if small break outs on my face and it seemed like my hair was falling out. But the breakouts on my face may have been from me using body lotion on my face bc that's all I had at that time. Now I've been getting acne on my back, shoulders, and a little on chest. But I started accutane and using an anti bacterial soap which appears to have worked. You're only a few weeks in. Wait until week 6-7 and you'll feel a big difference. Jacked 24/7. But I felt the test kicking in in 10 days and slowly got stronger each week. Good work. Keep us posted bro.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 27, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> 6 weeks fo sho! You'll love them. I know I did. how many days since your first pin? You'll know when the test kicks in. It's hard not to bc you'll feel your hormones changing. Is your libido up at all? How much did you gain with the dbol? When my test kicked in, I had a couple if small break outs on my face and it seemed like my hair was falling out. But the breakouts on my face may have been from me using body lotion on my face bc that's all I had at that time. Now I've been getting acne on my back, shoulders, and a little on chest. But I started accutane and using an anti bacterial soap which appears to have worked. You're only a few weeks in. Wait until week 6-7 and you'll feel a big difference. Jacked 24/7. But I felt the test kicking in in 10 days and slowly got stronger each week. Good work. Keep us posted bro.


 
It's been 16 days. I know it's not in full swing yet but something's happening. And I was going to say that it could just be the dbol going crazy. I'm about to finish out on 40mg for the rest of the week and bump it to 50mg cause that's what my new dbol is. 

So far I'm going to say 12 pounds because I remember the scale getting down to 204 before it started going back up. Yes my libido is up, not that I get boners more often, but I think about rape fucking every hot girl that I pass in even more depth than I did before. I mean like tit's hitting me in the face and pulling hair..... okay we'll just say yes. 

Either way, I'm having fun and training harder then I ever have with results to show for it. I have noticed I'm in a better mood overall too. Even on cardio days.


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## The Prototype (Dec 27, 2010)

When your test kicks in you'll be spending a lot more time in the hot chick forum. I swear I always get side tracked. I'm trying to go to the anabolic section and see a hot chick. She's so hot I just can't pass without taking a look. Then fifty more pics of hot chicks come up. Next thing I know it's been 15 min. That Jamie Eason is unbelievable! When the test kicks in, there's a good chance you may become a sexual predator bc you'll be wanting to bang every girl you look at. At the super market, gas station, work, driving down the road, bars, etc. You're so damn horny, the typical 5 is suddenly an 8-9 and most def bangable. Roids are good for ugly chicks bc I'm sure they get banged a lot more. Kinda like beer but instead of getting beer goggles, you get test goggles and want to bang everyone. Good thing I have a girl. She's enjoying the extra attention she's getting. I just tell her it's from the ambien lol.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 28, 2010)

You're doing it wrong golfer! Youre supposed to tell her the ambien is why you fall asleep right afterwards! But yes I have been noticing my recent urge to bang anything with a vag. Well I guess the urge is more than normal. 

I even had a pimple on the backside of my head this morning? WTF? It's not a bad problem but I'm going to start washing my face more often.


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## Hell (Dec 28, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> When your test kicks in you'll be spending a lot more time in the hot chick forum. I swear I always get side tracked. I'm trying to go to the anabolic section and see a hot chick. She's so hot I just can't pass without taking a look. Then fifty more pics of hot chicks come up. Next thing I know it's been 15 min. That Jamie Eason is unbelievable! When the test kicks in, there's a good chance you may become a sexual predator bc you'll be wanting to bang every girl you look at. At the super market, gas station, work, driving down the road, bars, etc. You're so damn horny, the typical 5 is suddenly an 8-9 and most def bangable. Roids are good for ugly chicks bc I'm sure they get banged a lot more. Kinda like beer but instead of getting beer goggles, you get test goggles and want to bang everyone. Good thing I have a girl. She's enjoying the extra attention she's getting. I just tell her it's from the ambien lol.



You aint lying man.  Im just started week 7 of my first test cycle and im wanna get on everything and with authority like sloppy was saying!

Excellent log so far sloppy!  
I got my first test cycle log down in hardbody section if u wanna check it out. http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/hardbody/116479-hb1-gtg.html


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## SloppyJ (Dec 28, 2010)

I will look at it after I get back from the gym! I'm headed there now.


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## pitbullguy0101 (Dec 29, 2010)

awsome journal lots of great info from everyone what are you size stats. oh and more pics


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## SloppyJ (Dec 29, 2010)

Just when I thought my gains stalled, I had a very good day in the gym. I honestly HATE my training schedule this week. I'm working out MWF two body parts per day. I have to get this done in an hour on my lunch break. I felt extremely rushed today. I got 315 on deadlift 6x for my heaviest working set. That straight wore me out. However I cannot stress enough how awesome these versa gripps are. I got a new back belt also and I really like it. 

Question. Next week I'm going out of town to go duck hunting. I'll be gone on the day I'm supposed to pin. What would be my best option? Pin Tuesday (250mg) as planned and then pin thursday night and resume normal schedule on the following week? Or just pin 500mg on tuesday and resume to the 2x weekly the next week? It probably doesn't matter and I'm making too big of a deal out of it. 


Thanks for the props guys. Pitbull what stats are you looking for?

I also think I'm going to start eating more. Whether it be clean or cheat. I need the cal's. Going straight from a cut to a bulk is fucking with me. I'm scared of gaining too much fat and losing my progress. My weight has been at 216 for 4 days now. I did do cardio yesterday though.


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## The Prototype (Dec 29, 2010)

Just do it as close to the day you are scheduled to pin then resume as scheduled. I've pinned twice this cycle a day early. I think you're better off splitting it then doing it all at once since that's your schedule now anyways.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 3, 2011)

I finally feel like my size is catching up with my strength gains. The strength shot through the roof and the size wasn't as good. But now I'm feeling better about it. No doubt it's there though. I'm up to 219 today. Still waiting for the test to come on strong but I'm starting to feel a bit different. Pumps last longer while out of the gym, and my muscles actually look different. My bi's are much more full for instance. I'm also ramping up the food intake a little so that should help. 

The biggest improvement on my body is my chest. I naturally store fat on my chest so I really wanted to focus on bringing my chest out. Anyway, here is a new pic. I'm not sure how it stacks up against the other one or if I even look different, but I know I feel better. Based solely on the mirror, I feel like I have lost BF so far. Since I've been realizing this I have been trying to add some more cals into my diet. I'm trying to find that perfect balance.


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## The Prototype (Jan 4, 2011)

Looking good bro. Sometimes the scale just doesn't justify your gains. I've only put on between 12-15 lbs but on New Year's, I saw a bunch of my friends whom I haven't seen since pre-cycle. Some were taken back by how much bigger I got. I really don't feel that much bigger. All my clothes are a lot tighter but the scale can be very deceiving.  Maybe they were just drunk, but a few of my friends just kept repeating how jacked I looked. Let the mirror do the talking. Once the test kicks in, you'll know it. All your hormones change. My voice even sounds a little deeper lol. For some odd reason, test e hits me pretty fast, like in 7 days. I upped my test to 750 mg almost two weeks ago and about a week ago, my estrogen levels were off. My fingers were getting fat and I was retaining water. I even put on a few pounds. Started to get gyno flare ups again too. But I increased my adex and it seems to be back under control. Keep at it bro!


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## hackskii (Jan 4, 2011)

Well, chest will grow, so will delts, seems that there are alot of androgen receptors there.
I remember one cycle my shoulders exploded, I was not even hitting them that much.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 5, 2011)

I wouldn't argue with a bigger chest or shoulders. My shoulders are kind of lacking anyway. But they have been getting better.

Something different is going on for sure. The past 3-4 days my body has looked and felt 10x better. Muscles are much more full. I roll over in the morning and feel noticeably bigger each time. I get damn bicep pump from washing my face in the morning while I take a shower. Things like that. Strength is slowly rising even after the initial rush of dbol strength which was pretty god damn awesome. My appetite is picking up as well. 

Things are looking up boys. 

Oh and I just got a $2.50 raise! Jackpot.....is that a primo cycle I hear calling my name? lol


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## SloppyJ (Jan 14, 2011)

So it's almost the end of week 5 of 12. My weight kind of stalled a little bit because of a 4 day hunting trip I took where I couldn't eat right or sleep much. But now I'm back on track and increasing my cal's even more. I'm starting to eat a little dirtier just to make sure I got enough. 

I'm thinking about bumping my test up to 625 or 750. I'm leaning toward 750. I really want to blow up and that just isn't happening yet, I'm still hovering around 220. Maybe I should just wait it out? Tomorrow is my last day of Dbol also. I will take a break from the orals for 4 weeks then start Winny from week 10 through 14. PCT of clomid starts on week 15. 

I havent noticed much strength increase since the dbol (which was amazing) but my endurance is rising. Normally I work up to my heaviest set and only do one set. Yesterday I was able to squeeze another set of 4more reps out of my heaviest deadlift set. (Even though there was a flaming homo standing right behind me.)

Here's a pic from the other night. I'm getting to where I want to be but I'm still a ways out. Obviously I need to drop some fat after the cycle but I'm not stressing about that.


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## Hell (Jan 14, 2011)

Hell yea man...Looking good!!  I bumped my Test up top 600 last week on week 8 and im bumping it upto 750 next week on week 10.  My gf didnt see me for a week and stated that it looks like my shoulders have exploded.  All those deadlifts and standing overhead presses are paying off.

For all my heavy sets, I work upto my working set and then bang out 2 sets of them.

Eat Big, Train Big, Get BIG!!


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## Life (Jan 14, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I was able to squeeze another set of 4more reps out of my heaviest deadlift set. (Even though there was a flaming homo standing right behind me.)



So what you're saying is homos make you lift more. Interesting. Lifting weights = hypertrophy. Lifting weights + homos = homo hypertrophy.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 14, 2011)

Life said:


> So what you're saying is homos make you lift more. Interesting. Lifting weights = hypertrophy. Lifting weights + homos = homo hypertrophy.


 



No that's not what I'm saying. I tried out a new gym yesterday and let's say it's not the normal crowd I'm used to. I think I scared him just a little bit. Needless to say I'll stick to my old homoless gym. 

And Hell, since I start a new week tomorrow I think I'm going to go to 625 and then hit 750 the next week and ride it on out from there. I think with my size that 500 just isn't going to be as effective as it would be on a newb at 150lbs.


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## Life (Jan 14, 2011)

I'd just watch for estrogen related sides.


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## Hell (Jan 14, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> And Hell, since I start a new week tomorrow I think I'm going to go to 625 and then hit 750 the next week and ride it on out from there. I think with my size that 500 just isn't going to be as effective as it would be on a newb at 150lbs.



Hell yea man!!


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## SloppyJ (Jan 14, 2011)

Life said:


> I'd just watch for estrogen related sides.


 
Don't worry I will. I'm on .25 adex ED right now. I started higher than that but bumped it down a little bit. I have letro and nolva on hand incase shit goes crazy.


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## hackskii (Jan 14, 2011)

I think 750 for a first cycle is a bit much IMO.
You have two diffrent orals in there as well.
Just watch out for blood pressure issues, those can elivate quite high with androgens.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 14, 2011)

hackskii said:


> I think 750 for a first cycle is a bit much IMO.
> You have two diffrent orals in there as well.
> Just watch out for blood pressure issues, those can elivate quite high with androgens.


 
You think I should stick it out at 500 or go to 625? I haven't made the move yet. I'm just thinking about it. I'd hate for my gains to stall after the dbol washes out.


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## The Prototype (Jan 14, 2011)

Stick to 500 for now. It's always best to use the minimum and still see some gains. Give it until about week 8-9 and if things don't change, maybe increase to 600ish. I noticed a lot of estrogen related sides when I bumped mine. When your body has excess test, it converts it to estrogen so increasing your ai will probably be required.


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## hagaroids (Jan 14, 2011)

rip er down!


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## hackskii (Jan 14, 2011)

Well, generally speaking I find gains on test to be week 4 to about week 8 or a tad bit longer, but the sides including higher blood pressure and far more aromitization being higher at the end of the cycle.

Thing is gains do stall, and ramping up the dose can cause more gains, but at a higher percentage of sides.
So, for the 10% more gains (a guess), your sides are probably closer to 50% higher.

Gains come easy on gear, but so do the sides depending on the person.


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## Life (Jan 14, 2011)

I've been at 750 for four weeks now. No issues, but I've never had estrogen related sides.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 14, 2011)

I've had literally no sides except for my nips felt a little weird about 1.5 weeks into the dbol. At that point I started adex and no problems since. I'm still on the fence. I know what ripped went through and I don't want to do that at all.


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## Retlaw (Jan 14, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I finally feel like my size is catching up with my strength gains. The strength shot through the roof and the size wasn't as good. But now I'm feeling better about it. No doubt it's there though. I'm up to 219 today. Still waiting for the test to come on strong but I'm starting to feel a bit different. Pumps last longer while out of the gym, and my muscles actually look different. My bi's are much more full for instance. I'm also ramping up the food intake a little so that should help.
> 
> The biggest improvement on my body is my chest. I naturally store fat on my chest so I really wanted to focus on bringing my chest out. Anyway, here is a new pic. I'm not sure how it stacks up against the other one or if I even look different, but I know I feel better. Based solely on the mirror, I feel like I have lost BF so far. Since I've been realizing this I have been trying to add some more cals into my diet. I'm trying to find that perfect balance.




........  your pic gave me a chub !


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## The Prototype (Jan 14, 2011)

At the end of the day it's your decision. Just be aware of the potential sides that may or may not come. I could def feel the increase in test in my system though. Got bloated, started retaining water, got gyno flare up, etc. It was def a different level from what I experienced but everyone is different. Shit, 750 mg just may be your sweet spot. It wasn't for me so don't base your decision solely on what I experienced. Personally, i think you should stick out the 500 for a little while longer. You keep increasing your doses looking for a little extra and in a year or two, you'll be on 1,500 mg just to gain a few pounds. Slow and steady wins the race my friend.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 14, 2011)

Retlaw said:


> ........ your pic gave me a chub !


 
First off, you're a fuckin homo. 



rippedgolfer said:


> At the end of the day it's your decision. Just be aware of the potential sides that may or may not come. I could def feel the increase in test in my system though. Got bloated, started retaining water, got gyno flare up, etc. It was def a different level from what I experienced but everyone is different. Shit, 750 mg just may be your sweet spot. It wasn't for me so don't base your decision solely on what I experienced. Personally, i think you should stick out the 500 for a little while longer. You keep increasing your doses looking for a little extra and in a year or two, you'll be on 1,500 mg just to gain a few pounds. Slow and steady wins the race my friend.


 

Secondly. Thanks for the words. I agree that 750 might be too much. I think I'll stick at 500 for a little while longer and re-evaluate. This isn't going to be my last one. I will have many more opprotunities to find my sweet spot. And with nothing to base it on I won't know until it's too late. Plus with the winny in the end I don't want to push it too hard on my first run. It seems to be working good. I'm a little concerned about what's going to happen after tomorrow when I stop the dbol.


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## theCaptn' (Jan 14, 2011)

test is very forgiving . . you have AIs . . have AIs and your sides can be managed. 750mg aint that high, and over a short time period you'll be fine.

With your dbol about to end, guarentee things will stall until you add that stanazol ..  best time to up your test


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## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

And then there was the captn' hahaha

Damnit just when I was talked out of it.


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## theCaptn' (Jan 15, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> And then there was the captn' hahaha
> 
> Damnit just when I was talked out of it.


 
 . . ahh . . I keep forgetting its your first cycle, maybe listen to the old fart


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## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

theCaptn' said:


> . . ahh . . I keep forgetting its your first cycle, maybe listen to the old fart


 




I think I'll take a trip to 625 land and see what's going on up there. But that's as high as I'm taking it for this run. 

Off to the gym for leg day.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

Leg pic from today. Sorry for the shitty cell pic. And excuse the mess. That's my beat lab/dog kennel room/saltwater supplies. 

My legs have always been big but this is probably the biggest they've ever been. I was stronger today for sure. 

Squats:         
135x12
225x10
315x8
315x6

Leg Press:
360x12
540x10
720x8

Quad Extensions:
170x12
190x10
210x8

Claf Raises:
315x10x3

I pinned quads today about 2hrs before the gym and I love the burn after a deep set of squats or leg press. It's begining to get enjoyable. Anyway thanks for reading my newb log. I hope this will help people.


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## The Prototype (Jan 15, 2011)

Nothing for hamstrings? Try some leg curls, seated leg curls or lunges. Hamstrings are essential for quickness, if you compete in a running sport that is.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> Nothing for hamstrings? Try some leg curls, seated leg curls or lunges. Hamstrings are essential for quickness, if you compete in a running sport that is.


 

I knew I missed something. I hit hamstrings on the machine for 3 sets of 10. My hammies get hit with the leg press and dead's so I'm not too worried about them. Thanks for looking out though ripped.

The only running I'm doing is from the cops. I'm not in any sports any more. Im doing this strictly for me.


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## The Prototype (Jan 15, 2011)

I think hamstrings are underrated. Most people want big quads or calves. You never know when you'll have to run from the cops Slop. You're bound to get chased one day when you work the corner as a tranny lol. Jk bro. Nice work.


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## hackskii (Jan 15, 2011)

Dead lifts do hit hamstrings where it ties in with the glute.
Leg curls hit more calf to hamstring tie in, stiff leg dead lifts, good mornings hit the ham to glute tie in.
Couple sets of those a week with back or legs would be great.

Its not really quads that drive you when running, it is more hamstring glutes that do that and they have more fast twitch muscles.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> I think hamstrings are underrated. Most people want big quads or calves. You never know when you'll have to run from the cops Slop. You're bound to get chased one day when you work the corner as a tranny lol. Jk bro. Nice work.


 
Well if I ever do decide to hit a little tranny action. Ill just up my test to a gram a week and drop out all of my AI's that way I don't have to get a boob job! 

Thanks for the kind words bro.


Hackskii thanks for the info. I kind of figured that out on my own. Where the deads hit more towards my glutes and then when I was on the curls today I sat up and focused on using my hams to get it pushed back.


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## james-27 (Jan 15, 2011)

> drop out all of my AI's



How many AI's you on Sloppy?


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## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

james-27 said:


> How many AI's you on Sloppy?


 

Just adex .25mg ED. 

Seems to be working. 

When I first started I wanted to wait until I felt I needed to use anything before I started. About 1.5 wk's into the dbol and test my nips were a little sensitive so I started adex. 

I plan to run it at .25 all the way through PCT. I will taper it off by EOD and E3D doses at the end of PCT to avoid any rebound that could occur.


----------



## james-27 (Jan 15, 2011)

I'm going to be running 12.5mg ed of Aromasin. Like you I don't plan to start running it till I feel its needed. I'm doing a test e only cycle starting Monday. I may add in some d-bol or t-bol at the end of my cycle.

How long you plan on taking off before your next run?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

james-27 said:


> I'm going to be running 12.5mg ed of Aromasin. Like you I don't plan to start running it till I feel its needed. I'm doing a test e only cycle starting Monday. I may add in some d-bol or t-bol at the end of my cycle.
> 
> How long you plan on taking off before your next run?


 
PCT's over on April 16. I plan on starting my next in late June early July.


----------



## james-27 (Jan 15, 2011)

Right on brother! So whats your weight upto? You feel that your retaining any water? Oh how abt acne??


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 15, 2011)

james-27 said:


> Right on brother! So whats your weight upto? You feel that your retaining any water? Oh how abt acne??


 

I'm hovering around 220. I don't feel like I'm holding much water at all. No acne either. Maybe I'm a lucky one?



So I guess I'm bigger for sure. I went to a buddy's birthday party tonight and had a blast, even had a few brews and kicked back. Almost everyone I saw said "Man, you're getting big." My best "girl" friend even said your "Trapezius' are bulging." She's a kinesiology major so she knows what's up. Got two fine ass girl's numbers also. One said "I have the biggest crush on you, you're soo cute."   Fuckin whores.


----------



## theCaptn' (Jan 16, 2011)

and you didnt fuck either of them???


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 16, 2011)

theCaptn' said:


> and you didnt fuck either of them???



So disappointed in you. With all that tests running thru your system, you could have had enough for both ladies. I miss being young and single lol.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 16, 2011)

theCaptn' said:


> and you didnt fuck either of them???


 
Oh it's coming don't worry. (That's what she said?) When this bitch sends me pics I'll post em up for all to see. 



rippedgolfer said:


> So disappointed in you. With all that tests running thru your system, you could have had enough for both ladies. I miss being young and single lol.


 

It's the shit really. No one to tell me what to do. I can go to the gym whenever I want. But you have a steady stream of pussy. That's the only upside. 



I think all of the bitches smelled the extra test that's coming out my pores. I had em coming out of the wood work. "It's called sex panther. Illegal in 9 countries." hahaha 
Seems like I'm on this weird kick lately. Every girl I meet has a kid. WTF is up with that?


----------



## tomy2 (Jan 16, 2011)

looking great my friend .. and stop talking about bitches bc am fuckin horny to hell ..

which week are u in now ? 

when did u notice the biggest transformation in ur body dude ? was it week 6 or 8 ?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 16, 2011)

tomy2 said:


> looking great my friend .. and stop talking about bitches bc am fuckin horny to hell ..
> 
> which week are u in now ?
> 
> when did u notice the biggest transformation in ur body dude ? was it week 6 or 8 ?


 

I'm one day into week 6. This is by far the best week yet. I believe the test is kicking in and it's awesome. I can't wait to see what happens.


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 16, 2011)

How's the libido? Any atrophy yet? Next few weeks will be good for you. Also, cycles generally stall around Week 8 as your body tries to reach homeostatis.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 16, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> How's the libido? Any atrophy yet? Next few weeks will be good for you. Also, cycles generally stall around Week 8 as your body tries to reach homeostatis.


 
Honestly the libido isn't as good as it was when the dbol first came on but it's there for sure. My balls are smaller for sure. I'm almost at the almond stage which sucks but atleast I know it's working. Seems like they've been getting smaller and smaller for the past couple weeks. 

I hope to kind of confuse my body with the extra 125mg of test that I've added. Then when it gets used to that, WHAMMY it with the winny and finish strong.


----------



## tomy2 (Jan 16, 2011)

Mr golfer .. did u lose ur hair while on wenny ? what was ur maximum  dosage ?

as i know if u run it @ 100mg or less there won't be side affects .sloppyj Keep up posting if it works with u i really would run it to get red of some fat in my stomach .

and good luck ..


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 16, 2011)

tomy2 said:


> *Mr* golfer


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 17, 2011)

tomy2 said:


> Mr golfer .. did u lose ur hair while on wenny ? what was ur maximum  dosage ?
> 
> as i know if u run it @ 100mg or less there won't be side affects .sloppyj Keep up posting if it works with u i really would run it to get red of some fat in my stomach .
> 
> and good luck ..



No I didn't lose any hair on the Winny.  I ran it at 50 mg daily.  At 100 mg daily, you're bound to see some sides, or at least some sore joints b/c it dries you out.  100 mg daily is a pretty high dose for Winny.  Winny isn't a miracle fat burner.  If you have some fat around your belly, diet better and hit the cardio harder.  Winny alone isn't going to give you a six pack.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

Maybe it's just in my head but I believe that my strength is declining since dropping the dbol. Today was my first workout without it. It was chest day and I just didn't feel the same as I have been. Although, the pumps are getting better. 

I wonder if the test will ever catch up to the strength I had on dbol? Any one have an opinion on this? And if not, these next 4 weeks are going to suck until I start winny.


----------



## rockhardly (Jan 17, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> That's my beat lab/dog kennel room/saltwater supplies.



You're a reefer?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

rockhardly said:


> You're a reefer?


 
"Come to the darkside, we have shrooms" 

Just have a little nano. Bunch of inverts and LPS corals. Have a Clown and a 6 line Wrasse also.


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 17, 2011)

Give it another week or two. You'll know when the test is working. Doesn't sound like it's in full gear yet. If you don't start seeing results in a few weeks, it may be your test is underdosed or even possibly bunk. But before jumping to conclusions, I think giving it a little more time is best.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> Give it another week or two. You'll know when the test is working. Doesn't sound like it's in full gear yet. If you don't start seeing results in a few weeks, it may be your test is underdosed or even possibly bunk. But before jumping to conclusions, I think giving it a little more time is best.


 

Oh yeah I'm going to ride it out for sure. I don't think it's bunk from the atrophy I have. Maybe it just takes longer to kick in on a big boy like myself?


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 17, 2011)

Everyone is different. I've read where it didn't kick in until Week 5-6 for some people. Also, are you injecting deep into the muscle? It takes longer for it to absorb into the body if you aren't injecting into the muscle.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> Everyone is different. I've read where it didn't kick in until Week 5-6 for some people. Also, are you injecting deep into the muscle? It takes longer for it to absorb into the body if you aren't injecting into the muscle.


 
I bury a 1" in my quad and 1.5 in my glute. So I'd say yes. My legs are pretty big but I'm kinda sketched out to hit my quad with a 1.5 though. This is week 6 for me though.


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 17, 2011)

I don't know man. You should feel something by Week 6. I could actually feel my body shutting down and could tell my hormones were changing mid cycle. Might be time to check out a new source. Those norma tests are pretty damn good IMO. Kinda pricey but worth it. But if you can find a good reputable ugl, it'll be half the price of Norma.


----------



## Hell (Jan 17, 2011)

I'd totally up ur dose to 600 for the next 2 weeks and then maybe up it to 750 the following weeks.  Thats what I have been doing and its working great.

I have based my cycle from this, his sample 2 cycle, but i just statrted at 500 in stead of 600 and will end at 750 instead of 1 gram http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/104658-first-cycle-pct.html.


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 17, 2011)

Hell said:


> I'd totally up ur dose to 600 for the next 2 weeks and then maybe up it to 750 the following weeks.  Thats what I have been doing and its working great.
> 
> I have based my cycle from this, his sample 2 cycle, but i just statrted at 500 in stead of 600 and will end at 750 instead of 1 gram http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/104658-first-cycle-pct.html.



I think this may be a good idea. Bump it and see what happens. Since you're not really responding to 500, I'd personally go up to 750 and see what happens. You mentioned people are already noticing you're bigger so it seems something is working. Maybe your body to responds better to dbol than test for strength and mass?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

Hell said:


> I'd totally up ur dose to 600 for the next 2 weeks and then maybe up it to 750 the following weeks. Thats what I have been doing and its working great.
> 
> I have based my cycle from this, his sample 2 cycle, but i just statrted at 500 in stead of 600 and will end at 750 instead of 1 gram http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/104658-first-cycle-pct.html.


 

I already bumped it up to 625 this week. I'm only one shot in though.


----------



## Hell (Jan 17, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I already bumped it up to 625 this week. I'm only one shot in though.



Hell yea man!!

I just took my first shot of 750 last night, week 10 baby!!


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> I think this may be a good idea. Bump it and see what happens. Since you're not really responding to 500, I'd personally go up to 750 and see what happens. You mentioned people are already noticing you're bigger so it seems something is working. Maybe your body to responds better to dbol than test for strength and mass?


 

Yeah one of my friends sent me something that said "It was good seeing you the other day. I didn't think that was you at first. You packed on some muscle lately."

So I'd say it's working. And I can tell that something other than the dbol is working cause my muscles feel different than they did on dbol. More full and hard. 

I should have known, just like all drugs, my tolerence is retarded high. I've never been sensitive to anything.


----------



## tomy2 (Jan 17, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> No I didn't lose any hair on the Winny.  I ran it at 50 mg daily.  At 100 mg daily, you're bound to see some sides, or at least some sore joints b/c it dries you out.  100 mg daily is a pretty high dose for Winny.  Winny isn't a miracle fat burner.  If you have some fat around your belly, diet better and hit the cardio harder.  Winny alone isn't going to give you a six pack.



agree man but I don't no .. If i do cardio harder I would lose some of the 16lbs I gained  .. 

If I run wenny for 2 weeks I'll get into it harder concentrating more on cardio . would I get a good results ..  ?


----------



## cockerspaniels (Jan 17, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Well fellow IM readers the day has finally come. I started my cycle.  Here's a quick rundown:
> 
> Weeks 1-10 GP Test E 500mg
> Weeks 1-4 GP Dbol @ 40mg
> ...


 
How old are you son?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

cockerspaniels said:


> How old are you son?


 

Mid 20's.


----------



## 240PLUS (Jan 17, 2011)

no turning back now.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

240PLUS said:


> no turning back now.


 

Ehhh what? 

I dont plan on stopping I'm just trying to figure out what the deal is here with me not responding that much to 500/wk.


----------



## 240PLUS (Jan 17, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Ehhh what?
> 
> I dont plan on stopping I'm just trying to figure out what the deal is here with me not responding that much to 500/wk.



just sayin'


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 17, 2011)

240PLUS said:


> just sayin'


 

Are you talking about this cycle or like I fucked myself up cause I cycled in my mid 20's and I will need TRT? Cause if it's the later, I dont feel the same way.


----------



## 240PLUS (Jan 17, 2011)

I want to give Test E a day in court. I finally got some cash 'bout $400 and nobody's advertising it...it's all out of stock. Of all I've read about, Test E looks like the way to go for me..seeing that it would be my first cycle ever. Long lasting and once a week, you can't go wrong. Unfortunately it's test so I assume there will be sides. Anyways keep the party rockin.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 19, 2011)

Yesterday I did 1.5ml which would put me at 750/wk. I noticed my strength is back and maybe even a little more so today. But my weight is declining despite upping my intake even more. I'm down to 218 where as yesterday I was at 220~ Could this be the dbol leaving me? Oh sweet, sweet dbol don't go, not yet. 

Time to take a methadone or two and ponder. Atleast that will push my weight up a little bit and relax my cashed out back.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 21, 2011)

I was over at a chick's house last night and she happened to have a blood pressure cuff. 

151/78

I thought that was pretty decent considering im on 750/wk.


----------



## Hell (Jan 21, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I was over at a chick's house last night and she happened to have a blood pressure cuff.
> 
> 151/78
> 
> I thought that was pretty decent considering im on 750/wk.



I had mine checked the other day when I gave blood......
123/80 & my cholesterol is 174....Not bad....


----------



## brandon123 (Jan 21, 2011)

Your going to loose some of the water weight from the dbols.  Just no way around it.  However if u start to plateau, you might ought to up your calorie intake to adjust for the amount of weight u have added to your frame.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 21, 2011)

brandon123 said:


> Your going to loose some of the water weight from the dbols. Just no way around it. However if u start to plateau, you might ought to up your calorie intake to adjust for the amount of weight u have added to your frame.


 

I have been adding food slowly to try and have my body utilize it more effiecently as to not pack on fat. However I feel like im losing BF so I'm trying to up it even more. Maybe that's just the test doing what it does though. I figure I want to hit the point where I'm not losing and BF to ensure my body builds all the muscle it can.

Today I was just a little under 220 which is up a couple lbs this week. I think it just messed with my head when the dbol water left me. And now the test is in full swing and bridging the gap.


----------



## Livebig14 (Jan 22, 2011)

good log so far bro.  Looking forward to seeing the rest of it.  Ill be running my first cycle starting in June


----------



## klc9100 (Jan 22, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I have been adding food slowly to try and have my body utilize it more effiecently as to not pack on fat. However I feel like im losing BF so I'm trying to up it even more. Maybe that's just the test doing what it does though. I figure I want to hit the point where I'm not losing and BF to ensure my body builds all the muscle it can.
> 
> Today I was just a little under 220 which is up a couple lbs this week. I think it just messed with my head when the dbol water left me. And now the test is in full swing and bridging the gap.


 
next time, add EQ. maybe just 300-400 mg's per week. it's a slow gainer, but one of it's BIG upsides is that it speeds up & enhances proteine sythensis and nutrient uptake. therefore, you don't have to eat nearly as many calories to achieve the equivenent nutrition (thus, you will be leaner).


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 22, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> next time, add EQ. maybe just 300-400 mg's per week. it's a slow gainer, but one of it's BIG upsides is that it speeds up & enhances proteine sythensis and nutrient uptake. therefore, you don't have to eat nearly as many calories to achieve the equivenent nutrition (thus, you will be leaner).


 

Man I'm trying to figure out what I want to do in the summer. EQ, Deca, and Tren E are on the list. I've heard people were let down by EQ. I like Deca but if I'm going with a 19-nor I feel like it should be tren. And I want to use deca on a hardass bulk in the winter.


----------



## Hell (Jan 23, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Man I'm trying to figure out what I want to do in the summer. EQ, Deca, and Tren E are on the list. I've heard people were let down by EQ. I like Deca but if I'm going with a 19-nor I feel like it should be tren. And I want to use deca on a hardass bulk in the winter.



Ive been contemplating the same thing for my second Sloppy. I was leaning toward EQ but Ive read alot of the same things u mentioned. Im now planning on cruising on 250 test e for a little while, getting some blood-work done,  then upping then Test and adding some Tren A.The gf and myself are planning a mexico trip for June 1st so I want to be looking the best in my life for it.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 23, 2011)

Hell said:


> Ive been contemplating the same thing for my second Sloppy. I was leaning toward EQ but Ive read alot of the same things u mentioned. Im now planning on cruising on 250 test e for a little while, getting some blood-work done, then upping then Test and adding some Tren A.The gf and myself are planning a mexico trip for June 1st so I want to be looking the best in my life for it.


 

Yup im in the same boat. I have a lot of wakeboarding weekends planned all summer long and plan to spend a lot of time in the sun. I want to look amazing and just get in great shape overall. I too think I will be abusing the tren. 

I don't know if I like the ED injects though so I'm going to go with tren E.


----------



## klc9100 (Jan 24, 2011)

i want to try tren BAD, but the more i read about it, i'm scared of it.
i already have anxiety & don't sleep well. i can't imagine taking something that would make the 2 only real problems i have WORSE.


----------



## Hell (Jan 24, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> i want to try tren BAD, but the more i read about it, i'm scared of it.
> i already have anxiety & don't sleep well. i can't imagine taking something that would make the 2 only real problems i have WORSE.



Thats why Im getting some Tren A so if the sides are that bad I can just stop and they will go away unlike the Tren E. EOD pinning will be something knew but I'll live!


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 24, 2011)

EOD might be fun. Hell the days in between my injects I get all ansy in my pantsy and want to stick myself. But I think that will wear off real fast on ED or EOD regiment. But it kicks in sooner and it clears out faster. That might be the way to go now that I think about it. But If if did tren A, I'd brew it myself. Mad cheap that way, plus you know what you're getting.


----------



## brandon123 (Jan 24, 2011)

ED and EOD injects get old fast.


----------



## CG (Jan 24, 2011)

Hell said:


> I had mine checked the other day when I gave blood......
> 123/80 & my cholesterol is 174....Not bad....



Wait. Are you saying, you donated blood.. on ccle?

Sent from my SPH-M900 using Tapatalk


----------



## Hell (Jan 24, 2011)

Cgrant said:


> Wait. Are you saying, you donated blood.. on ccle?
> 
> Sent from my SPH-M900 using Tapatalk



Yep.....

Yea Sloppy, Right now I totally look forward to my twice weekly pins but with ed or eod, I agree with brandon that it will probably get old fast. Nobody said that it was easy to be jacked and ripped though!!

I was originally planning on a prop/tren cycle with some winny at the end but I got 4 unopened bottle of test e laying around so I will probably just stick with the test e and do the tren eod at 100mg to start off. Im gonna make a new thread to get everybody's input as im going to make my order soon.  

Hell~


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 24, 2011)

Send me a link when you do hell. I want to follow that one too.

As far as my test I'm not too impressed. I'm going to open up one of the clear vials I have and see if it's any different. Right now I'm using some amber colored GP stuff. Brandon was helping me with some domestic stuff to try. But I think I need to finish this cycle on GP just incase it finally does something and I like it. That way I know exactly what I got with the GP.

But I think I will try something new test wise next time just to see. I might go with the Norma stuff or something similar.


----------



## klc9100 (Jan 24, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Send me a link when you do hell. I want to follow that one too.
> 
> As far as my test I'm not too impressed. I'm going to open up one of the clear vials I have and see if it's any different. Right now I'm using some amber colored GP stuff. Brandon was helping me with some domestic stuff to try. But I think I need to finish this cycle on GP just incase it finally does something and I like it. That way I know exactly what I got with the GP.
> 
> But I think I will try something new test wise next time just to see. I might go with the Norma stuff or something similar.


 

i've always heard good stuff about gp's test. i've got some for my next run, but i've never tried it.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 24, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> i've always heard good stuff about gp's test. i've got some for my next run, but i've never tried it.


 
Test E? Is it clear or amber? My first batch was amber while a newer batch was clear.


----------



## klc9100 (Jan 24, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Test E? Is it clear or amber? My first batch was amber while a newer batch was clear.


 
neither really. it's kinda yellow, so i guess more amber-like.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 24, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> neither really. it's kinda yellow, so i guess more amber-like.


 
Yeah that's what I've been running.


----------



## bccs (Jan 24, 2011)

I have the same GP test and I'm also not very impressed, Their Dbol was great but since stopping it I kinda feel like i'm not on anything anymore...Its only been a week since stopping the Dbol so theres still a while to go before I will pass my final judgment on it.


----------



## james-27 (Jan 24, 2011)

The color of your test dont matter as different batch's are going to more then likely be different. Same goes for different brands. Lol unless its pink like I read a few days ago I wouldnt worry bout it.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 24, 2011)

bccs said:


> I have the same GP test and I'm also not very impressed, Their Dbol was great but since stopping it I kinda feel like i'm not on anything anymore...Its only been a week since stopping the Dbol so theres still a while to go before I will pass my final judgment on it.


 
Dude I feel the same way. But then I go to the gym and kill it and get good pumps. Then 2 hours later I think it's weak. 

It is picking up some since I bumped to 750. Try that if you have the test for it. 



james-27 said:


> The color of your test dont matter as different batch's are going to more then likely be different. Same goes for different brands. Lol unless its pink like I read a few days ago I wouldnt worry bout it.


 
Yeah I saw that too. I'm only thinking that it's a totally different batch and even oil so maybe that one is better.


----------



## The Prototype (Jan 24, 2011)

That Norma is gonna blow the GP out of the water.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 24, 2011)

rippedgolfer said:


> That Norma is gonna blow the GP out of the water.


 



Can't wait to try it!


----------



## bccs (Jan 24, 2011)

After this run of GP I think i'm going to homebrewing, I was thinking about getting HG but that shit is faked so much you never know what your getting...at least with homebrew you know exactly whats in it, not to mention its 1/10 the cost.


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 24, 2011)

what lot number do you have for the GP test?


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 25, 2011)

also what lot number did u have for the GP dbol?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 25, 2011)

bccs said:


> After this run of GP I think i'm going to homebrewing, I was thinking about getting HG but that shit is faked so much you never know what your getting...at least with homebrew you know exactly whats in it, not to mention its 1/10 the cost.


 

Unless you can test the powder you still have no idea what's in that shit.


----------



## bccs (Jan 25, 2011)

Powder is actually quite easy to test, just find the temperature it melts at...even small amounts of impurities can cause drastic changes in melting point.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 25, 2011)

bccs said:


> Powder is actually quite easy to test, just find the temperature it melts at...even small amounts of impurities can cause drastic changes in melting point.


 

Oh like coke! lol


----------



## bccs (Jan 25, 2011)

coke, test powder...its all the same to the DEA


----------



## hackskii (Jan 25, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> i want to try tren BAD, but the more i read about it, i'm scared of it.
> i already have anxiety & don't sleep well. i can't imagine taking something that would make the 2 only real problems i have WORSE.


 
That is not the only sides, elivated blood pressure is another issue with tren.
One tren cycle I was on put me in Stage II stroke range for BP.

Generally speaking a cycle of testosterone can slow after about 6 weeks or so, gains wont last forever.


----------



## XYZ (Jan 25, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I knew I missed something. I hit hamstrings on the machine for 3 sets of 10. My hammies get hit with the leg press and dead's so I'm not too worried about them. Thanks for looking out though ripped.
> 
> The only running I'm doing is from the cops. I'm not in any sports any more. Im doing this strictly for me.


 

3 sets of ten is nowhere near enough.  Where is the Stiff Legged Deadlifts, One legged romanian stiff legged deadlift, barbell hip bridge, swiss ball curls into a hip bridge?  THOSE exercises BUILD OAKS.  3 sets of ten hamstring curls is what my grandma does when she's on an unloading week.

To get the most out of your squat and deadlift you NEED to train your hamstrings often and hard.

Post up your current routine, maybe we can tweak a few things to help you out if you want.  You'd be suprised at how a few adjustments will make major differences.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 25, 2011)

CT said:


> 3 sets of ten is nowhere near enough. Where is the Stiff Legged Deadlifts, One legged romanian stiff legged deadlift, barbell hip bridge, swiss ball curls into a hip bridge? THOSE exercises BUILD OAKS. 3 sets of ten hamstring curls is what my grandma does when she's on an unloading week.
> 
> To get the most out of your squat and deadlift you NEED to train your hamstrings often and hard.
> 
> Post up your current routine, maybe we can tweak a few things to help you out if you want. You'd be suprised at how a few adjustments will make major differences.


 
I'm all about it man. 

*Chest*
Barbell Bench
Warmup
1x12, 1x10 1x8 1x6 or failure

Incline:
Warmup
1x10 1x8 1x8 or failure

High Cable Flys
3-4x12 increasing weight

Low Cable flys
2x15

I alternate Decline press or pullovers
Mostly 3x10 cause my chest is lit up by then 

*Tris:*

Overhead DB 
warmup then 
1x12 1x10 1x8  we only have 120lb DB's so I'm stuck there for the final set.

Close Grip bench (heavy)
1x12 1x10 1x8

Cable push down supersetted with reverse grip push down one handed:
3-4x12

Skull Crushers
1x12 1x10 1x8

Dips to burn out.

*Back*

Deads
Warmup
1x12 1x10 1x6 1x6

Rows sometimes DB sometimes Barbell in a corner
1x12 1x10 1x8 

Shrugs (heavy)
4x12 

Pull Downs
1x12 1x10 1x8

Back extensions with 35lb plate
3x10

Reverse cable cross overs? X crossovers? 
3x10 to burn out. 

*Bi's*

Preacher Curls, DB Curls, Hammer Curls, Reverse Barbell Curls, High cable curls

*Legs:*

Squats
1x12 1x10 1x8 1x6 1x6

Leg Press:
1x12 1x10 1x8 1x8

Quad Extensions:
3x10 increasing weight. Finally maxed out the machine at 230

DB Lunges: (Just added)
3x10 

Hamstring Machine
3x10

*Shoulders:*

Standing Barbel Press
1x12 1x10 1x8 1x6-8

Front Raises
Side Raises 
3x10

Reverse Flys (pec deck)
3x10



This is my basic workout. Sometimes I feel frisky and add some new things in but I normally stick to this. 

Please dominate my routine CT.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 25, 2011)

Oh and I forgot to update I broke open a vial of the clear GP last night just to try it out until my norma gets in (thanks ripped). 

And no injection pain, no soreness no nothing! Can't even feel it today. Im switching up my pinning schedule to MWF because of the amps.


----------



## XYZ (Jan 25, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I'm all about it man.
> 
> *Chest*
> Barbell Bench
> ...


 

I would split up the routine.  4 days of training.

Something like this:

1.  Primary Lower Body - Switch every week.  Week one Squat, Week 2 front squat, week 3 Deadlift.  Do 6 sets of one rep with 180 sec between sets.
2.  Barbell Hip Bridge 4x8 30 Sec.
2b Snatch Grip SLD 4X 10 120 Sec.
3.  Barbell Lateral Lunge 3x 8 90 Sec.
4.  Barbell Rollouts - AMAP
4b. Plank - ALAP

Take the next day off - You'll be spent, if you don't you'll burn out in 3 weeks.

1.  Primary Pressing Work - Switch every week.  Week one Bench Press, two - standing overhead press, 3 - Close Grip Bench.  Do 6 sets of one rep with 180 Sec. Between sets for Bench and overhead press, do 3 reps for Close Grip bench and keep adding weight in 5lbs increments until you're grinding out reps, then the exercise is over, should be getting 5-6 total sets.
2.  Pendlay Row - 4 x6 30 Sec.
2B. Clavicle Row - 4x12 120 Sec.
3. Standing overhead shrug 3x8 10 Sec.
3B. Straight Arm Pull Down 3x 12 10 sec.
3c. Barbell cuban with 1/2 bradford 3x 10+ 120 Sec.
4.  Kneeling cable crunch 4 x 10+ 60 sec.

take next day off

1.  DB bulgarian split squats 5x8 45 sec. for each leg
1b DB single leg RDL 5X8 45 sec for each leg
2. Lumberjack squat - 6 x 10 20 sec.
2b. swiss ball leg curl with hip bridge 6 x amrap 90 sec.
3.  barbell roll outs 10 sec
3b. mountain climber 10 sec
3c. plank hold/ swiss ball 10 sec
3d. hanging leg raise 10 sec
3e cable chop 2x12 120 sec rest


1.  Wide grip pull ups 5x6 10 sec
1b. swiss ball pull overs 5 x 10 120 sec
2. Incline dumbbell press 5x6 10 sec
2b. Dips 5x 10 120 sec.
3.  Barbell curls 3x8 10 sec
3b. Tricep pushdowns 3x8 90 sec.
4. Kneeling cable crunch 4x 10+ 60 Sec.


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 25, 2011)

whats the lot number on the GP test that you have buddy? also what was the lot number on the dbol? please i really wanna kno


----------



## hackskii (Jan 25, 2011)

CT said:


> I would split up the routine. 4 days of training.
> 
> Something like this:
> 
> ...


 

What is up with the low rep ranges?


----------



## pitbullguy0101 (Jan 25, 2011)

keep it up bro


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 25, 2011)

Thanks for your time CT!

I will have to look up a bunch of those exercises. 

Do you think it's smart to switch up my routine mid-cycle? Maybe start this during PCT and continue until next cycle? 

Endurance, I don't know the dbol stuff but it's legit as fuck. I threw the packaging away. I'll get back to you on the test.


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 25, 2011)

Just got done with my tri workout. Jesus was it nice. I don't know if I hit my stride or if it's the new vial of test but something's working. I fucking FINALLY broke 220. I'm sittin at 222 right now! 

120lb db overhead tri extension was cake. got it 10x with perfect form.
Dips came easy as pie
I maxed out the stack and threw a 35 plate on it for pushdowns. 


Endurance the lot number on the amber shit I have is: 422
And the clear: 402


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 25, 2011)

that is wierd becuz i have lot 402 test enanthate and its amber colored and not clear. i have test cyp which is lot 401 and that is clear.


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 25, 2011)

do u remmember the lot number on ur dbol?


----------



## 1mudman (Jan 26, 2011)

Good luck on the pinning. I only use 25's when i use 1/2cc of prop with some b-12 in the shoulders. Its just to small for large amounts, takes too much time and you get to shaken and the needle is moving around tearing shit up on the inside, maybe nick a vein or two.  23g 1" in the thigh is good if your not carrying a lot of fat on your legs. Yes I was a bruised up mess for a while and finally learned to lay that leg out straight and even and make sure it is good and relaxed and then just slide er right on in asperate and push in in slowly. Be sure to hold the skin tight between the needle and pull it straight out quickly.  The only times I have ever bled much has been when I brought the needle out at a wrong angle and to slowly and nicked a vein, one time I shot blood across the room. That was hard to explain to the wife!


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 26, 2011)

also i noticed that u were gna change ur pinning cycle due to the amps to MWF, you could however juss break open 3 and prepare your next pin as well (put 1.5 ml in each syringe). this way u wont have to pin ur self as much.


----------



## XYZ (Jan 26, 2011)

hackskii said:


> What is up with the low rep ranges?


 

Builds strength and size, the low rest between sets also helps keep you lean.


----------



## XYZ (Jan 26, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Thanks for your time CT!
> 
> I will have to look up a bunch of those exercises.
> 
> ...


 

Don't know?  Your call.  I wouldn't use it any more than 8 weeks.

I guess my original point was you're neglecting a large portion of your body and over training others.  Your bicep is one of the smallest muscles in the body and you are currently annihilating it, same with a couple of other muscle groups.  Your legs, back and chest should be the focal points, everything else is secondary.


Just my opinion from what you laid out.


----------



## klc9100 (Jan 26, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Oh and I forgot to update I broke open a vial of the clear GP last night just to try it out until my norma gets in (thanks ripped).
> 
> And no injection pain, no soreness no nothing! Can't even feel it today. Im switching up my pinning schedule to MWF because of the amps.


 
i'm not sure what this post means. can you explain, please?


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 26, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> i'm not sure what this post means. can you explain, please?


 

I have a few vials of GP test E. 2 amber colored 3 clear ones. I wasn't too happy with the last amber one I ran so I opened a clear one and that's my descirption of the clear test. Little/no injection pain.

To see if it's me or the test (The reason why I have to run 750mg on my first cycle) I have some Norma Amps coming. Therefore I'm going to switch my pinning to MWF because I don't want to pre-load pins.


----------



## klc9100 (Jan 26, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I have a few vials of GP test E. 2 amber colored 3 clear ones. I wasn't too happy with the last amber one I ran so I opened a clear one and that's my descirption of the clear test. Little/no injection pain.
> 
> To see if it's me or the test (The reason why I have to run 750mg on my first cycle) I have some Norma Amps coming. Therefore I'm going to switch my pinning to MWF because I don't want to pre-load pins.


 
gotcha


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 28, 2011)

Got my Norma's in. What a beautiful sight to see. Bout to hide one in my quad. I will be using Norma Test E from here on out to see if I can feel a difference.


----------



## Hell (Jan 28, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Got my Norma's in. What a beautiful sight to see. Bout to hide one in my quad. I will be using Norma Test E from here on out to see if I can feel a difference.



Hell yea man!!


----------



## endurance724 (Jan 28, 2011)

whats the lot number on ur normas? lol my bad im always buggin u for ur lot numbers, thing is i have a shit load of normas also, juss wna kno if u got the same batch. i havent ran them yet tho, i have 0912018 and 1004032


----------



## goods (Jan 29, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Got my Norma's in. What a beautiful sight to see. Bout to hide one in my quad. I will be using Norma Test E from here on out to see if I can feel a difference.




niceeee


----------



## hackskii (Jan 29, 2011)

CT said:


> Builds strength and size, the low rest between sets also helps keep you lean.


 
So, you are saying singles build size?
70% of your one rep max hits 90 percent of both slow and fast twitch muscles.

Depending on the muscle group, hitting fast twitch muscles wont offer you any more beneifts over higher rep ranges, and can compromise CNS recovery, and can increase your chances of injury, especially on cycle.


----------



## XYZ (Jan 31, 2011)

hackskii said:


> So, you are saying singles build size?
> 70% of your one rep max hits 90 percent of both slow and fast twitch muscles.
> 
> Depending on the muscle group, hitting fast twitch muscles wont offer you any more beneifts over higher rep ranges, and can compromise CNS recovery, and can increase your chances of injury, especially on cycle.


 

Yes I am, and they did for me. 

The rest of your post is wonderful.......but doesn't apply to everyone.


----------



## cutright (Jan 31, 2011)

I think you will be pleased with the Norma...that shit is awesome..I'm running it now..500mg 5 weeks then I went to 750mg. I had everyone asking me at week 5 what the hell I was taking because I grew so much...strength is unbelievable. I just ordered 50 more amps. I've got some GP but think ill sell that..I'm sticking with Norma. Goodluck bro!


----------



## SloppyJ (Jan 31, 2011)

cutright said:


> I think you will be pleased with the Norma...that shit is awesome..I'm running it now..500mg 5 weeks then I went to 750mg. I had everyone asking me at week 5 what the hell I was taking because I grew so much...strength is unbelievable. I just ordered 50 more amps. I've got some GP but think ill sell that..I'm sticking with Norma. Goodluck bro!


 

Yeah man I agree. That stuff is awesome. I already hulk smashed one amp trying to open it. But I think I have it figured out now. I have an opener but it's still a littler weird for me. 

I had to sit around all weekend and look at them. Today when I get off I get to do another one. I'm actually starting to love pinning. 

I've got a little head cold that came up and I feel like total shit. Maybe a little fever too. I will start winny at 50mg this week also. I will be running it for 6 weeks total right up until PCT. I will stop it about 2 days before PCT just to make sure it's out of my system.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 3, 2011)

God damnit. 

Not much to report. I got sick and snowed in. Haven't been to the gym in a few days. I have a Dr's appointment today to try and get some medicine so I can get back to it. 

Only workout i've gotten lately is some crazy ass snowed-in blizzard sex. 

Been almost one week on the norma. I like everything about it more besides the amps. Those suck. I've noticed a little more muscle fullness, increased aggresion, and some pimples on my face. I'm scared to weigh in at the Doc today. I've had ZERO appetite lately and haven't been eating enough. 

Any tips for eating enough while sick?


----------



## Hell (Feb 3, 2011)

If you dont feel like munching down on some dead cow or chickens, stick to some high calories shakes 2-3 times a day

Milk
2 scoops protein
fruit
olive oil or pb
yogurt
some oats

Mix and sip 
Easy 800+ calories a piece


----------



## hackskii (Feb 3, 2011)

Up the dose of vitamin D big time, this will cut the flu by 1/3rd.
Its responce on immune system is huge.
Basicly most people get the flu in the winter time when you get the least amount of sun exposure.
look around, Vitamin D defencies is one of the most common one there is, they just raised the RDA on that one as well.

Also, you can cut the flu down as well by taking bicarbonate of soda (baking soda), but get that at the health food store that says aluminum free.
*Using Bicarbonate Against the Swine Flu*
Sodium Bicarbonate | IMVA » Bicarbonate Treatment for Swine Flu (1924)

Sorry to hear chap that you are not doing well, also take some zinc as it also boosts immune system.

Did you know that 70% of your immune system is in the intestines?
Yep, also take some pro-biotics to give your intestines the flora it needs to fight against candida.....


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 3, 2011)

Hell said:


> If you dont feel like munching down on some dead cow or chickens, stick to some high calories shakes 2-3 times a day
> 
> Milk
> 2 scoops protein
> ...


 
That is my normal shake recipie minus the oil. But yes I will be sipping on those. I really feel like I need some solid food though. My stomach isn't messed up but I just have ZERO appetite. 



hackskii said:


> Up the dose of vitamin D big time, this will cut the flu by 1/3rd.
> Its responce on immune system is huge.
> Basicly most people get the flu in the winter time when you get the least amount of sun exposure.
> look around, Vitamin D defencies is one of the most common one there is, they just raised the RDA on that one as well.
> ...


 
Awesome info man. Thanks. 


Hopefully I can pick up some badass cough syrup and something else from my doc. They wont prescribe good syrup if you have high BP so I'm praying that isn't the case. That's really the only reason I'm going.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 3, 2011)

BP was 149/70 that's not too bad. 


I do have the flu and I'm down 5lbs. I think it's mostly water cause my veins are popping out pretty nicely. I also scored some tussinX which for those who don't know is the best syrup you can get. 

I'll report back on monday after I hit the gym to see what kind of stregth changes I've made. I also started my winny so I'm ready to see what that does to me. 

Stay tuned.


----------



## hackskii (Feb 3, 2011)

Dang dude, slamb some vitamin D, best thing you can do.
Cheep too.


----------



## Hell (Feb 3, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> BP was 149/70 that's not too bad.
> 
> 
> I do have the flu and I'm down 5lbs. I think it's mostly water cause my veins are popping out pretty nicely. I also scored some tussinX which for those who don't know is the best syrup you can get.



Snapped a pic of Sloppy when he wasnt looking...


----------



## GMO (Feb 3, 2011)

LOL...Yup, sloppy's sippin on the sizzurp


----------



## Retlaw (Feb 3, 2011)

GMO said:


> LOL...Yup, sloppy's sippin on the sizzurp




YouTube - Hole - Doll Parts (Live from Big Day Out 1999)

  How did i get here ?


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 5, 2011)

It's all gone and I'm back to the normal rotation of nugs. 

I really wanted to hit the gym today but I think I will give it atleast another day. I need another good day of eating before I can hit it hard. 



Hell, TAKE THAT PIC OFF NOW! I can't be having people know what I look like.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 5, 2011)

Updated pics. After I took these and compared, I'm enjoying the results. It's hard to judge yourself when you see yourself in the mirror everyday.


----------



## Retlaw (Feb 5, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Updated pics. After I took these and compared, I'm enjoying the results. It's hard to judge yourself when you see yourself in the mirror everyday.


  im sorry, but you must lift weights !


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 5, 2011)

Retlaw said:


> im sorry, but you must lift weights !


 

Ohh is that what I'm doing wrong? 

Shutup man tits!


----------



## vortrit (Feb 5, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Ohh is that what I'm doing wrong?
> 
> Shutup man tits!



Yeah, lift weights. Don't just pin gears and not workout or you'll get tits as big as RetLAW's.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 16, 2011)

Pinned my shoulder with a 25g 5/8 today and it sucked. Probably the most painful one I've had so far. I didn't heat up the oil and it was hard to push in with one hand so I was shaky. It BURNED, but now I kind of enjoy the feel. We'll see tomorrow if it's bad. Here's a shot from today. Shitty lighting. 

Only 1 more week of test left. I'm sad about it. I don't want it to end. The weight gains have stalled. But every day I look and feel better and better. I guess the sooner I get done the sooner I can start another one.


----------



## endurance724 (Feb 17, 2011)

my first and last delt injection hurt like a bitch lol, my hands were all shaky and the pin came out and i had to push back in. shoulder hurt for like 3-4 days


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 17, 2011)

endurance724 said:


> my first and last delt injection hurt like a bitch lol, my hands were all shaky and the pin came out and i had to push back in. shoulder hurt for like 3-4 days


 
Today it's no where near as sore as I thought it would be. I'm actually starting to enjoy the pain now.


----------



## klc9100 (Feb 17, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Today it's no where near as sore as I thought it would be. I'm actually starting to *enjoy the pain* now.


 
you freak - LOL.

what's your height and weight now?


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 17, 2011)

klc9100 said:


> you freak - LOL.
> 
> what's your height and weight now?


 

I'm going to roll with 6'2". And last time I weighed I was at 223. I've got a some excess fat but I can see my abs and obliques. I've gained weight and lost some pretty good body fat. I'm actually excited to start cutting after the cycle. It's almost easier not eating a lot of food than it is shoving shit in your mouth every hour. 

I feel like my weight is going down. But my muscles are getting much harder and bigger. This makes sense with the winny, but would it cause me to drop weight?


----------



## hackskii (Feb 17, 2011)

You will lose some water after you stop and suprisingly will look better with the water gone.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 17, 2011)

hackskii said:


> You will lose some water after you stop and suprisingly will look better with the water gone.


 

Yeah I expect that. Thing is I'm not done with the test yet. Can the weight loss be attributed to the winny? Possibly pushing excess water out?


----------



## hackskii (Feb 17, 2011)

Steroids dont lean you out, they allow you to not be as catabolic with reduced calories.

Muscle gain is another reason for being leaner, the requirement for fuel is higher with more muscle. Doing the same thing with more muscle burns more calories.

200 pounds at 10% bodyfat will burn more fuel than 200 pounds at 30% bodyfat.


----------



## XYZ (Feb 18, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Pinned my shoulder with a 25g 5/8 today and it sucked. Probably the most painful one I've had so far. I didn't heat up the oil and it was hard to push in with one hand so I was shaky. It BURNED, but now I kind of enjoy the feel. We'll see tomorrow if it's bad. Here's a shot from today. Shitty lighting.
> 
> Only 1 more week of test left. I'm sad about it. I don't want it to end. *The weight gains have stalled*. But every day I look and feel better and better. I guess the sooner I get done the sooner I can start another one.


 
Do you know why this happened?


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 18, 2011)

CT said:


> Do you know why this happened?


 

Probably say that it's the affect of me getting the flu and not eating worth a shit. 

Or am I missing something?


----------



## XYZ (Feb 18, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Probably say that it's the affect of me getting the flu and not eating worth a shit.
> 
> Or am I missing something?


 

It could be that and yes you're missing something.

Did you run this the entire 12 weeks as you have posted in your original first post of this thread?


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 18, 2011)

CT said:


> It could be that and yes you're missing something.
> 
> Did you run this the entire 12 weeks as you have posted in your original first post of this thread?


 

Yes test the whole time. 500 at the begining. Bumped to 750 around week 7 or so when I got some norma test. End of week 11 right now. So one more week left. Then wait for the ester to clear, stop winny, then PCT. 


Hit me. I'm anxious CT.


----------



## XYZ (Feb 18, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Yes test the whole time. 500 at the begining. Bumped to 750 around week 7 or so when I got some norma test. End of week 11 right now. So one more week left. Then wait for the ester to clear, stop winny, then PCT.
> 
> 
> Hit me. I'm anxious CT.


 
99.9% of people who cycle will stall at 8 weeks NO MATTER WHAT.  Your myostatin levels are out of whack. 

http://www.afboard.com/library/Meas...nd effects of testosterone administration.pdf


This study proves that unless you're going to stay on for good that after 8 weeks your cycle is going to stall.  Moral of the story is 8 week cycles or stay on for life.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 18, 2011)

CT said:


> 99.9% of people who cycle will stall at 8 weeks NO MATTER WHAT. Your myostatin levels are out of whack.
> 
> http://www.afboard.com/library/Meas...nd effects of testosterone administration.pdf
> 
> ...


 

Yeah I've heard that before. Thanks for the link, I'll scope it out. 

What do you think about longer esters like EQ? They will just start to fully kick in around then. I'm about to pull the trigger on Test, EQ for my next run.


----------



## XYZ (Feb 18, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Yeah I've heard that before. Thanks for the link, I'll scope it out.
> 
> What do you think about longer esters like EQ? They will just start to fully kick in around then. I'm about to pull the trigger on Test, EQ for my next run.


 
Long esters are fine, just start the gear a week or two before the actual cycle.

EQ - It's a strange compound, personally I think there are much better options for bulking or cutting.


----------



## SloppyJ (Feb 18, 2011)

CT said:


> that myostatin acts as a chalone ??? a
> counter-regulatory hormone ??? to restrain skeletal muscle growth​in response to an anabolic stimulus.


 

From the article ^^


That's awesome information. Baiscally the article states that with when test is introduced, mystatin levels increase. They peak around day 56 (week 8) and then start to decline to base levels. 

From the quote you see that it acts as a catylist to muscle growth. But they can also limit muscle growth when the levels decline. 


Major reps and mad respect CT.


----------



## Diesel618 (Feb 18, 2011)

Well aint that about a bitch. Surely there is the benefit of making gains more maintainable by keeping anabolic hormones flowing for a full 12-16 weeks however? Right? Or should I just save the rest of my test for my next cycle?


----------



## XYZ (Feb 18, 2011)

Yeah, sorry for hi-jacking your thread but this is the REASON you shouldn't run a cycle more than 8 weeks.  Cutting is another story though because you're just trying to preserve LBM.  Glad to help out.


----------



## SloppyJ (Mar 2, 2011)

Update:

219# and I finally got my BF% measured. I'm sitting at 12.8%. I'm really happy about that. My diet has been pretty heafty (3.5k+) but I still managed to drop some BF. I guess I could stand to eat a little more. I think I under estimated exactly how important diet is. It's something you have to experience before you really know. Everyone says DIET, DIET, DIET. Almost to the point where it goes in one ear and out the other, but it really is the *single most important aspect of the cycle.   *

I'm on the last week of my test right now. The last two weeks I bumped up to a 1,000mg/test just to judge sides and see what it feels like. Not going to lie. I feel like a man amongst boys right now. 

The winny is in full effect and I'm also loving that. I'm getting quite vascular in places I've never been before. My muscles feel hard and I have more definition than before. Joints are very achy while working out. Just have to work thorugh the pain though. Strength has pretty much peaked. I finally broke my goal of 300lb bench also. 

All in all this has been one of the best experiences I've ever had. I'm not looking forward to PCT just because of the fact that it's depressing to stop. I plan to hit a few peptides during my off cycle and drop down to atleast 10.5 BF% before I start back in June/July. 

I will post a few more updates during PCT and probably a final post to close the thread and sum everything up.

I'd really like to thank everyone who has followed along or just popped in to give me advice or just shoot the shit. Not trying to get sentimental here but this almost feels like a home away from home sometimes. Thanks again guys!


----------



## hackskii (Mar 2, 2011)

Have you been taking HCG during your cycle bro?


----------



## Hell (Mar 2, 2011)

Fuck Yea Man!! 

Hell~


----------



## SloppyJ (Mar 2, 2011)

hackskii said:


> Have you been taking HCG during your cycle bro?


 

No and it's really one of the biggest regrets I have. I decided when I started that being my first cycle I wanted to experience it without it so I know both sides of the spectrum. Honestly I didn't do enough research on it before I started to include it in my cycle when I made this order.

With that being said, I do plan to include it in every cycle from here on out. But being test only for the most part, I think I will be okay. I mean there were many before me who never used HCG and did fine.


----------



## hackskii (Mar 2, 2011)

Let me know if you need some help down the line.
I have seen stuff that would almost make you cry.


----------



## ATyler (Mar 2, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Update:
> 
> 219# and I finally got my BF% measured. I'm sitting at 12.8%. I'm really happy about that. My diet has been pretty heafty (3.5k+) but I still managed to drop some BF. I guess I could stand to eat a little more. I think I under estimated exactly how important diet is. It's something you have to experience before you really know. Everyone says DIET, DIET, DIET. Almost to the point where it goes in one ear and out the other, but it really is the *single most important aspect of the cycle.   *
> 
> ...



What was your bench before the cycle?


----------



## SloppyJ (Mar 2, 2011)

ATyler said:


> What was your bench before the cycle?


 

Never really maxed but I'd say mid 200's. My chest has been the weakest part of my body for ever. But that has changed. That was my main goal on this cycle.


----------



## bknoxx (Mar 2, 2011)

congrats bro looks like u had a good experience


----------



## ATyler (Mar 3, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> Never really maxed but I'd say mid 200's. My chest has been the weakest part of my body for ever. But that has changed. That was my main goal on this cycle.



I see I hope I gain 50+ pounds on my bench once I start my cycle


----------



## ManInBlack (Mar 3, 2011)

you da man sloppy! im trying to get on your level bro, call me crazy (probably just my mind fucking with me) but it feels as if the test has already kicked in for me (4 pins in). who knows, i doubt it but whatever


----------



## SloppyJ (Mar 3, 2011)

MIB, I'd say the mental aspect of being on cycle is one of the strongest side effects. Those first few weeks you're just waiting for it to happen and you're going really hard in the gym pushing yourself naturally. And then you get in that mindset and it actually starts to kick in and every workout is like a challenge trying to out-do yourself....Then you peak and add more test. hahaha 

The best thing you can do for yourself is focus on that diet. TRACK your food to ensure you're getting enough calories and protein. You simply will not grow without it.


----------



## ManInBlack (Mar 3, 2011)

hey man i hear ya, thanks for the tips.....yeah im really trying hard not to miss any meals and to get my 4k cals in daily...so far so good brotha


----------



## malfeasance (Mar 4, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> MIB, I'd say the mental aspect of being on cycle is one of the strongest side effects. Those first few weeks you're just waiting for it to happen and you're going really hard in the gym pushing yourself naturally.


  I dunno, man, I had D-bol, too, but three pins in and I was sweating like a pig at night, balls a little smaller, something was going on - definitely stronger, and pushing past where I had been stuck naturally for years.

Not as strong as I was in my late 20s, but stronger than I had managed to become for a long time now training naturally. 

Something was going on early.


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## Hell (Mar 4, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> MIB, I'd say the mental aspect of being on cycle is one of the strongest side effects.
> 
> The best thing you can do for yourself is focus on that diet. TRACK your food to ensure you're getting enough calories and protein. You simply will not grow without it.



Totally agree on both!!

Hell~


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## ManInBlack (Mar 4, 2011)

yeah guys, i tell ya what, i am convinced after today's workout that the test has already begun to kick in. strength was definitely up and im just looking thicker


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## SloppyJ (Mar 4, 2011)

You on dbol or anything else? Cause on week 2 that would be coming into full effect.


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## ManInBlack (Mar 4, 2011)

nope, just test cyp 500mg a week.....i do, however, have some dbol...thought about possibly adding in later in the cycle like, i think it was Hell, did.....


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## ManInBlack (Mar 4, 2011)

more than likely though i will just stick with the test alone


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## SloppyJ (Mar 4, 2011)

Yeah if you haven't started the dbol yet, just run test by itself. It sucks coming off the dbol cause you feel like nothing is happening for a few weeks. It feels like you're stuck. I kind of wish I would have just done test by itself so I know exactly what was going on. But oh well, orals are fun. Probably my favorite part.


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