# Why is bread bad ?



## THEMYTH (Apr 19, 2004)

I have noticed that the board frowns on eating bread. Why ? I am bulking now so am I still ok to eat it. What the hell else do you make a sandwich with ?


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## Spitfire (Apr 19, 2004)

wheat


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## THEMYTH (Apr 19, 2004)

ok so what is bad about wheat ? I thought that was suppose to be good for ya


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## Spitfire (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by THEMYTH *_ What the hell else do you make a sandwich with ?



no I answered your question, wheat is much better than just white bread

And if you are bulking you should be ok with wheat, unless you are keeping you macros and stuff, or on the atkins crap

I have a tuna sandmich a day on wheat


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## atherjen (Apr 19, 2004)

bread is highly processed and lagging in nutrients.


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## Vieope (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by atherjen *_
> bread is highly processed and lagging in nutrients.



_ So, the only thing against it is the fact that it doesn´t have nutrients? _


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## LAM (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Vieope *_
> _ So, the only thing against it is the fact that it doesn´t have nutrients? _



Processed grains are crap when compared to all natural sources of complex carbohydrates like oats, beans, lentils, etc...


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## Vieope (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by LAM *_
> Processed grains are crap when compared to all natural sources of complex carbohydrates like oats, beans, lentils, etc...



_ What if I ask "Why?"..  _


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## Jodi (Apr 19, 2004)

One of the reasons is because they are high GI.  The higher the gi (such as bread) the more potential to store fat instead of using it for glycogen storage.  They have very little nutritional value.

If your going to have any bread - Whole Grain (not ww) is the best.  And make sure it has *NO* high fructose corn syrup as 99% of the "nutritous breads" out there have.


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## LAM (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Vieope *_
> _ What if I ask "Why?"..  _



processed carbohydrates are lacking in fiber and other nutrients. because of that  they cause a greater increase in serum glucose and serum insulin levels.  constantly elevated levels of both can cause a number of health problems...

I wouldn't go higher than 1 serving of processed grains a day.  whole grain breads are OK but natural sources of complex carbs are far superior...


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## Vieope (Apr 19, 2004)

_ I read somewhere that if you add "flax seed oil" or other type of food the G.I gets lower .. does that mean  the effects on my serum glucose&insulin levels will be lower too ? and the potential risk to turn into fat will be lower too ?_


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## JLB001 (Apr 19, 2004)

bread is yummy but goes to my


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## Jill (Apr 19, 2004)

Are the ww pitas or lc ww tortillas as bad as the bread Jodi for fat storing instead of glycogen storage?


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## Jodi (Apr 19, 2004)

They are better but still not the best.  Nothing will beat/replace oats, sweet potatoes and brown rice.    However we gotta live and so long as your not gorging on them all the time, the pita's and tortillas are fine on the occassion.


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## aztecwolf (Apr 19, 2004)

i find that if i eat bread i will eat less carbohydrate grams then i would if i ate rice or sweet potatoes


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## Vieope (Apr 19, 2004)

_ Anybody with an answer to my question above ? _


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## LAM (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Vieope *_
> _ Anybody with an answer to my question above ? _



yes...adding proteins and fats will decrease the glycemic load of the meal, but not neccesarily the insulin response.


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## Vieope (Apr 19, 2004)

_ Thanks  _


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## Skib (Apr 19, 2004)

right now i'm eating 2 tuna sandwiches a day... so 4 slices of whole wheat bread...  it's the easiest way for me to get my protein... any other meal suggestions that won't result in my mom losing it on me for cooking up all the chicken breasts?

i eat egg whites and oat meal for breakfast, and generally through out the day (every 3.5 hours or so) i'll eat tuna and celery, tuna and an apple, dinner varies and a protein shake or low fat cottage cheese before bed while drinking only water of course...


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## sentricyphen (Apr 19, 2004)

ive noticed ive even added a bit of extra bf from eating more b.rice... time to buy some gluten free pasta.


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## atherjen (Apr 19, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by sentricyphen *_
> ive noticed ive even added a bit of extra bf from eating more b.rice... time to buy some gluten free pasta.



rice is a gluten free grain


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## sentricyphen (Apr 19, 2004)

yep, thats why i was using it.
but is alot more glycemic than the oats, which is why i got fat.
( i have to eat some 4500-5000 cals now to gain 1-2 lbs a week)
so a changeover in my carb sources really messed up my body composition 

-still its a whole heckuva lot better than the "stomach related issues" heheh.


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## Akateros (Apr 20, 2004)

How can you generalize bread into "good" or "bad"?

INGREDIENTS:
Whole wheat flour, water, wheat gluten, high fructose corn syrup, contains 2% of less of: soybean oil, salt, molasses, yeast, mono and diglycerides, exthoxylated mono and diglycerides, dough conditioners (sodium stearoyl lactylate, calcium iodate, calcium dioxide), datem, calcium sulfate, vinegar, yeast nutrient (ammonium sulfate), extracts of malted barley and corn, dicalcium phosphate, diammonium phosphate, calcium propionate (to retain freshness). 

INGREDIENTS:
Organic kamut flour, salt, water, sourdough.

Both "bread". It's not like lining up even veggies and fruits into good and bad -- just read the frikkin' label and figure it out. If it fits into one's carb allotment and one is not sensitive/mildly allergic to any of the ingredients (e.g. wheat) then there should be no reason to ban bread.


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## sara (Apr 20, 2004)

What about Ezekiel bread? and Tortillas?


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## sara (Apr 20, 2004)

Ingredients:
Organic Sprouted Wheat, Filtered Water, Malted Barley, Organic Sprouted Rye, Organic Sprouted Barley, Organic Sprouted Oats, Organic Sprouted Millet, Organic Sprouted Corn, Organic Sprouted Brown Rice, Fresh Yeast, Lecithin (from soybean), Sea Salt. Certified Organic by QAI. 

per slice= 80 Cals, .5F, 15C, 4P


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## sara (Apr 20, 2004)

Better Tortillas?  

Ingredients:
*Organic Sprouted Wheat, Filtered Water, *Organic Unhulled Sesame Seeds, *Organic Sprouted Soybeans, *Organic Sprouted Barley, *Organic Sprouted Millet, *Organic Sprouted Lentils, *Organic Sprouted Spelt, Sea Salt. *Organically grown and processed in accordance with the California organic foods act of 1990. 


Ezekiel 4:9??? Sprouted Grain Tortillas are made from freshly sprouted Live grains and contain absolutely no flour! They are are inspired by the Holy Scripture verse: "Take also unto thee Wheat, and Barley, and Beans, and Lentils, and Millet, and Spelt, and put them in one vessel, and make bread of it" Ezekiel 4:9. The unique blend of freshly sprouted grains, beans and seeds provides superior nutrition and a complete protein that is 84.3% as efficient as the highest recognized source of protein (casein). No milk, baking powder, yeast, artificial colors or flavors are used. See the difference fresh sprouts really make and partake of the miracle. Your body and tastebuds will know the difference


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## kvyd (Apr 20, 2004)

i read some where brown rice is only lower by 3 on the glycemic index than white rice... if this is true what are the benifits of brown rice


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## LAM (Apr 20, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by kvyd *_
> i read some where brown rice is only lower by 3 on the glycemic index than white rice... if this is true what are the benifits of brown rice



more good fats, fiber, vitamins and minerals.  they are all in the husk.  

white rice is mostly all starches since the husk has been removed during processing...


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## kvyd (Apr 20, 2004)

but then this leads to many other debates....im taking multis,fish oils,and getting plenty of fiber...so what benefits does it have other than just extra nutrients.....not saying im going to start eating white rice...just dont understand the big deal plz explaqin


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## LAM (Apr 20, 2004)

it has been explained.  

eating white rice isn't much better than eating dextrose.  all you are getting out of it is carbs (starches)...


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## Akateros (Apr 20, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by sara *_
> What about Ezekiel bread? and Tortillas?


What about 'em?

What do _you_ think?  

You've got enough knowledge to make the call, y'know, you don't necessarily need an "expert" to tell you what's "right" or "wrong".


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## kvyd (Apr 20, 2004)

but as the carbohydrates released into your bloodstream through white rice and the carbphydrates released into your bloodstream both have close to the same effect of raising insulin levels so other than more good fats, fiber, vitamins and minerals they are not a big deal different?


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## sara (Apr 20, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Akateros *_
> What about 'em?
> 
> What do _you_ think?
> ...



I know they good, better than other breads and tortillas in the markets.. but are they high in GI? that's all I want to know


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## sara (Apr 21, 2004)

Just had 2 slices of Ezikiel sprouted bread w. my breakfast! yummy.. taste like sugarless muffins


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## LAM (Apr 21, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by kvyd *_
> but as the carbohydrates released into your bloodstream through white rice and the carbphydrates released into your bloodstream both have close to the same effect of raising insulin levels so other than more good fats, fiber, vitamins and minerals they are not a big deal different?



no, not much different

if you need fairly instant energy then white rice is good for that.


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## OceanDude (Apr 21, 2004)

If you eat bread, even whole wheat, try to get the rough stone ground variety. The modern mills make the normal white flour into a very fine powder that converts to blood sugars very fast. The stone ground variety is less refined and is more coarse and has partial husks still (more fiber) and slows down the digestion rate. I like to use the analogy of sprinkling saw dust on a camp fire verses putting small branches on the fire. The saw dust immediately flashes into flame and burns hot whereas the small branches take much longer to burn and provide more moderated energy release over a longer period of time. It???s the same thing with insulin response and energy utilization. Another factor is that the body can only absorb a relatively small amount of fuel and demand a small amount of energy at a time before it has to shuttle it into fat cells to queue it all up. Its basically a bandwidth kind of problem ??? take in too much fuel at a low activity level and its nappy time as the body switches metabolic gears to break down the food and push it into fat cells. This is also why it is important to eat smaller meals (but more often) since from a total energy perspective anything more than about 400 calories ingested (for average man) at one point in time runs the risk of exceeding the body???s ability to assimilate and use it and go into fat stores unless already heavily depleted of glycogen levels. It would be better for most of us to have a ???just in time??? kind of energy intake (e.g. small meals but frequently) without ever shuttling any excess into fat and keeping the body in a constant state of fat burn. Every time we eat something with too many calories or which is too glycemic we run the risk of toggling off the fat burning cycle that we strive to keep active. 

Also, intermixing acids (e.g. vinegar mustard) and a small amount of good fat (olive oil) on bread can reduce the overall GI too. The presence of other foods also alters the ratios.

OD


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## OceanDude (Apr 21, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by LAM *_
> Processed grains are crap when compared to all natural sources of complex carbohydrates like oats, beans, lentils, etc...






> _*Originally posted by Vieope *_
> _ What if I ask "Why?"..  _



At some point in the process all food is crap...

Remember the old expressive curse "eat shit and die"? Apart from its vulgarity it is very true and is exactly what is cursing our country right now. Being healthy and fit is all about quality of nutrition. Anytime we eat we run the risk of poisoning ourselves or upsetting the metabolic balance. In a manner of speaking food is the biggest unregulated *drug* on the planet that does not require intelligent consumption or a prescription to take. If you have to eat, and we do to stay alive, try to minimize intake of foods that are poisonous or noxious to our physiology. The idea is to intake things that give us the most nutritional value (quality energy and essential nutrients) for the least amount of volume, caloric density and hopefully taste OK. The problem is that the deviant marketers are playing with the taste formulas to try and tempt you or force an addiction for things that produce a higher profit margin.  Not surprisingly the biggest profit margin comes from products that the government is subsidizing (e.g. corn and corn syrup) and will flat out kill you. Rather than make your waist line fat to fatten a food company exec???s wallet ??? develop a new taste for quality food. 

Feed the engine not the tongue.

OD


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## TheDude (Apr 21, 2004)

Grains and legumes contain "lectins".

Lectins are substances that combine proteins and carbohydrates together.   Plants have evolved them to ward off insect predators.

The carbohydrates in lectins prevent them from being broken down in the digestive processes that break down proteins.

The result is that they can cause intestinal permeability, autoimmune disorders and many other health problems.

Why haven't you heard this before?   What major media outlet is is going to allow a story "90% of food sold in markets causes health problems"?

PS   Supposedly sprouting destroys the lectins, and so if you can develop a taste for the Ezekiel products mentioned in this thread, they should be okay.


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## aggies1ut (Apr 21, 2004)

Never liked Ezekiel bread.


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## sara (Apr 21, 2004)

so Ezekiel bread... tortillas are low in GI?


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## kvyd (Apr 21, 2004)

so what happens when you eat chocolate brownies and then eat some peanuts and take fish oil?  would the peanuts and fish oil slow down the digestion rate?  to an extent?


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## aggies1ut (Apr 21, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by kvyd *_
> so what happens when you eat chocolate brownies and then eat some peanuts and take fish oil?  would the peanuts and fish oil slow down the digestion rate?  to an extent?


And ya, how does this relate to bread?


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## Akateros (Apr 21, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by sara *_
> so Ezekiel bread... tortillas are low in GI?


No way to know for sure, unless they are one of the foods that have been specifically tested. My impression, looking at the lists of the (sometimes unlikely) foods that _have_ been tested (and why, exactly, did they pick some of them, I wonder) is that occasionally the GI of ingredients in combination ends up being not quite what (I at any rate) would expect, looking at them singly.

At the very least, I would _guess_ that it'd be round a moderate GI, like other mixed whole-grain breads on the list -- but am I an expert? No, I am not.


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## kvyd (Apr 21, 2004)

.....brownies are chocolate bread.....heh


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## sara (Apr 21, 2004)

Yes, I think eating the Ezikiel bread/tortillas would be counting (as  GI level) like eating brown rice .. correct me if I'm wrong


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## sara (Apr 21, 2004)

I'm thinking of 2 ezikiel bread and shake with strawberries would be my PWO meal for tomorrow!!!


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## sentricyphen (Apr 22, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Akateros *_
> No way to know for sure, unless they are one of the foods that have been specifically tested. My impression, looking at the lists of the (sometimes unlikely) foods that _have_ been tested (and why, exactly, did they pick some of them, I wonder) is that occasionally the GI of ingredients in combination ends up being not quite what (I at any rate) would expect, looking at them singly.
> 
> At the very least, I would _guess_ that it'd be round a moderate GI, like other mixed whole-grain breads on the list -- but am I an expert? No, I am not.



Well the fact is, its still processed. So keep it moderate, thats all


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## sara (Apr 22, 2004)

yes, 1-2 servings  a day would be ok


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## Alaric (Apr 24, 2004)

During  a bulk, would it be alright to consume whitebread postworkout for a spike?  That's what I've been doing so far, because they are high in GI I'm just getting some simple carbs into my system.


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## sentricyphen (Apr 25, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Alaric *_
> During  a bulk, would it be alright to consume whitebread postworkout for a spike?  That's what I've been doing so far, because they are high in GI I'm just getting some simple carbs into my system.


Well its not going to create much of a spike.


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## Alaric (Apr 27, 2004)

oh, but it is ok to consume postworkout because its simple carbs right?


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## sentricyphen (Apr 27, 2004)

its not simple carbs, jusy  low quality complex carbs.
eat it pre workout if you have to use bread, and lower glycemic carbs for your post solid meal


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## sara (Apr 27, 2004)

why would you eat the low quality carbs for a pre-workout not a post?


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## sentricyphen (Apr 28, 2004)

pre b/c of the glycemity, not carb quality...and i wouldnt use white peroid, but thats what alaric said he wanted.


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## sara (Apr 28, 2004)

oh, white bread is a big No No!


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## sara (Apr 28, 2004)

I'm just concerned on some of the whole wheat crackers, organic cereals if they not a good carb quality


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