# dangers of ECA stack...am I at risk?



## businissc (May 1, 2006)

Hi everyone.  I have been lurking this board for about a year now, but usually just learned off of others' posts.  Now for once, I have a wierd question that I cant find the answer for...

I am 5' 6" and 180 lbs.  I am down from 260 lbs from July of 04 (Yea, i was huge).  I have a great diet and workout schedule (Push/pull/legs).
This summer, i was planning on taking a EC stack to help me out with the wieght loss.  From what I understand on this board, it is pretty safe to take it 3x a day.  To prepare for the summer, I bought the 200mg caffiene pills and the 25mg vasopro ephedrine in advance.  

Now Last Thursday I was studying for an exam at about 4pm.  I am on concerta due to ADD.  Two hours after i took the concerta i decided to try taking one of the 200mg caffiene pills to see how it affects me.  The bottle says that one 200mg pill has as much caffiene as a normal cup of cofee, so i dindt think it should be too bad...boy was i wrong.
My heart was pounding like i was running on a treadmill for hours...i felt like i was going to have a heart attack.  I dont understand what happened...I didnt even take the ephedrine, jsut caffeine!!!
I was jittery for over 8 hours and had alot of trouble sleeping that night.  My heart kept beating fast and i felt a wierd lightened feeling on my chest...

I really dont know what to think of this...hell i just took caffiene!!  From the looks of this caffiene + epedrine will kill me!!
I am hoping it was the concerta...is it bad to combine caffiene with concerta?  Over the summer i wont be needing the concerta, so will it be ok for me to take the EC? or does this experience mean that EC is dangerous for my body?


Honestly, i dont understand how people die from taking EC combinations.  Do people OD, or dies it just affect some people differently?
http://www.uml.edu/student-services/health/alc_drug/eph.html
http://www.guarana.com/deadly_cocktail.html

those 2 articles make it seem like those people took regular doses, but died...does this mean that it has the potential to kill some people even if taken in moderation?  
And how do i find out if I am at risk for this?
Should people who get palpitations from caffiene pills stay away from the EC?

If i do take the EC stack, i will probably start off with just ephedrine, then after one week add 100mg caffiene.
Then in one month i will up it to 200mg caffiene.  I dont know what to think...am i just overworrying?


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## nsimmons (May 1, 2006)

A pill gives will give me the shakes while a few cups of coffee wont. You need to build up your tolerance over a week. Use 50mg caff. and 8mg ephedrine for a week and ramp up. Cut the pills up if neccesary. After a couple weeks the full dose will be mild.

Also dont ramp up over the course of a month, you should be on the stack 6 weeks tops and then take time off for the receptors to recover.

Anything can kill anyone of they have a freak reaction.


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## businissc (May 1, 2006)

Thanks, if i do take it i will slowly build up to it.
I am hoping that the caffiene + concerta was just a bad combo...
And by the way, i have normal BP and bloodwork (for anyone thats interested)

I really hope i dont have a freak reaction...


on a side note, will just ephedra alone help cut fat? how much of a difference does adding the caffiene make?


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## nsimmons (May 1, 2006)

Depends on the person, ephedrine alone doesnt do much for me..most of the extra energy i get is from the caffiene. The ephedrine does raise my temp a bit.

Also some brands i react bad too. I tried some from walmart and didnt notice they also had a small amount of ginseng and they made me grumpy as hell. Ginseng alone doesnt, neither does pure ephedrine. Neither do taking seperate ginseng and ephedrine. Something weird with that brand.


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## businissc (May 1, 2006)

I have vasopro ephedrine, which also has guaefinesin(sp?).

I dont really care about the energy, just want to accelerate the weight loss.


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## businissc (May 1, 2006)

and for some added info, noone in my family has had a history of heart conditions
..but my grandfather did have a stroke (at 70...i dont know if this counts as family history of heart conditions)


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## nsimmons (May 1, 2006)

Youre being paranoid now. If youre the 1 in 20 million who drops dead. It was your time.


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## brollickby06 (May 3, 2006)

just try a low dose and if u feel fine then up it later
i doubt youll die lol


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## businissc (May 3, 2006)

ok heres the problem....i bought vasopro ephedrine HCL 25mg.......
Its lone of those gel pills, so i cant break it apart....should i just take the whole 25mg? 
idk why im so scared of this ECA...if anything ill probably die of a panic attack because i think its gona kill me lol


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## nsimmons (May 4, 2006)

its not crack..and its cheap.if its gel just poke it open and squeeze half out. This isnt very complicated?!


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## BigDyl (May 4, 2006)

I disagree.  Some people are more sensitive to stimulants are can be prone to complications from them.  I, for example can't handle more than 50 mg caffeine.


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## 40-yard dash_2 (May 4, 2006)

BigDyl said:
			
		

> I disagree.  Some people are more sensitive to stimulants are can be prone to complications from them.  I, for example can't handle more than 50 mg caffeine.


Exactly, and if an individual has a family history of cardiovascular issues, then I definitely not mess with ephedrine.


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## nsimmons (May 4, 2006)

He states there is no hx of heart problems in his family, quit freaking him out. He had the typical reaction to a 200mg pill of caff. The same as me and a lot of others. Tolerance needs to be built it.

???the U.S. FDA is aware of at least 15 deaths and 400 lesser incidents due to *chronic use or overdoes *of ephedra-containing products???(1997). ???Products containing ephedrine can cause serious adverse effects particularly for those individuals with underlying heart disease, hypertension, and diabetes, who may self-medicate with ma-huang (White et al, 1997)???. 

15 people?? Get over it.


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## 40-yard dash_2 (May 4, 2006)

nsimmons said:
			
		

> He states there is no hx of heart problems in his family, quit freaking him out.





			
				40-yard dash_2 said:
			
		

> Exactly, and *if an individual* has a family history of cardiovascular issues, then I definitely not mess with ephedrine.



Can you read?   I stated an individual, not him.


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## businissc (May 4, 2006)

ok ill just squeeze some of the gel out of each pill for the first week i take it

thanks for the feedback  (i woudlve thought u shoudlnt mess with it like that because now all the gel will be absorbed at once)
thanks again..


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## nsimmons (May 4, 2006)

not constructive..edited


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## 40-yard dash_2 (May 4, 2006)

nsimmons said:
			
		

> Can you use a logical thought process? This discussion is soley on one individual, no one cares about your speculation of the general population.
> 
> Gee people with heart issues shouldnt use stimulants? Thanks for the deep insight professor. Try addressing the specifics of this thread rather than rehashing the other 1000 ephedra threads on this site.
> 
> Go back to pimping your supplements.


Yes sir!


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