# Phil and Kai 2012 O Pics-side by side



## heavyiron (Sep 30, 2012)

Phil was not quite as sharp during prejudging but more than made up for it at finals.













































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## KILLEROFSAINTS (Sep 30, 2012)

never seen it so close


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## Ezskanken (Sep 30, 2012)

Both are beast!  Congrats to Phil, but I wish Kai wold have won...


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## hypo_glycemic (Sep 30, 2012)

One point separated the two! Rhoden is unreal to have held condition and got fuller after PBW and Europa shows. Chris Aceto did a awesome job.


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## Ezskanken (Sep 30, 2012)

1 point!  WOW!  I wish I could have stayed up and watched the whole thing.  I'll be watching the replay for sure!


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## Standard Donkey (Sep 30, 2012)

if kai's traps were on par it would have been his


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## KILLEROFSAINTS (Sep 30, 2012)

I also noticed he had sloping shoulders and looked depressed when relaxed

nit picky but true


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## hypo_glycemic (Sep 30, 2012)

He faded at night when they brought the top 6 into a pose down. Phil was ready to battle him and you could tell Kai wasn't ready to battle. They had ice packs on Kai right after they went into the crowd. I could tell Kai was fading when they brought them back for placings. I think Phil mentally beat him as well...


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## jshel12 (Oct 1, 2012)

Kai is my man but phil just has that flex wheeler levrone body which is impossible to beat unless your name is ron coleman.  I give it uo to both of them phil for killing it and kai for making neccesary improvements to push him over the edge, there both winners in my book.  congrats on both


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## ctr10 (Oct 1, 2012)

Wow that was close


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## dieseljimmy (Oct 1, 2012)

Its a coin toss everywhere but the arms. Phil has EVERYONE, all day long, on his arms.


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## bjg (Oct 1, 2012)

i don't like both of them and neither coleman, but it was a pretty close call, phil had better fuller biceps and triceps and deltoids,kai better chest and back, both are smooth an balooned lacking the feel of strenght behind what is supposed to be shredded muscles but both have good symmetry


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## Standard Donkey (Oct 1, 2012)

phil was standing in front of the line the whole time... that's what kai was smiling about 

kai should have won


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## Intense (Oct 1, 2012)

Standard Donkey said:


> phil was standing in front of the line the whole time... that's what kai was smiling about
> 
> kai should have won



I noticed that too, phil wanted it more tho. Kai could have been a cheeky cunt but thats not kai. Phil also had the better physique that night.


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## Standard Donkey (Oct 1, 2012)

Intense said:


> I noticed that too, phil wanted it more tho. Kai could have been a cheeky cunt but thats not kai. Phil also had the better physique that night.





idk man.. i feel like phil was beat in everything except arms and traps.. sure his waist is smaller, but kai's shoulders are wider

when you consider the amount of resources that phil has compared to kai, kai is definitely the better bodybuilder


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## Arnold (Oct 2, 2012)

I was there and IMO Kai beat Phil.


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## sityslicker (Oct 2, 2012)

From these pics alone, I have to say that Kia was harder and had better lines then Phil.


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## Showstopper1969 (Oct 2, 2012)

That's 2 huge dudes! Holy shit...close contest indeed.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 2, 2012)

Kai was harder at pre judging but faded Saturday night and didn't have the energy to compete with Phil. IMO--in that O-- it could of went either way!


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## Arnold (Oct 2, 2012)

I thought Phil was unbeatable until seeing this show, I did not see prejudging but at the finals Kai was harder and has a more pleasing physique, e.g. smaller waist, better taper, better quads and hams.


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## bjg (Oct 2, 2012)

the whole Mr O should be reconsidered: judges and judging criteria, it is a shame that after 30-40 years the level at the Mr O has dropped down while other sports have all advanced. there are even better Bodybuilders than that in the 60's.
something is going wrong in the whole system


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 2, 2012)

bjg said:


> the whole Mr O should be reconsidered: judges and judging criteria, it is a shame that after 30-40 years the level at the Mr O has dropped down while other sports have all advanced. there are even better Bodybuilders than that in the 60's.
> something is going wrong in the whole system



Negged



Just kidding


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## bjg (Oct 2, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> Negged
> 
> 
> 
> Just kidding



no really hypo i'm serious if look carefully you will agree with me


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 2, 2012)

bjg said:


> no really hypo i'm serious if look carefully you will agree with me



I disagree. I'm not going to argue the "opinion"! 

I have 2 friends on the judging panel. Take it up with Jim Manion


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## Curt James (Oct 2, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> Negged
> 
> 
> 
> *Just kidding*



I'm not. lol

*NEGGED!*


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## Curt James (Oct 2, 2012)

Prince said:


> I thought Phil was unbeatable until seeing this show, I did not see prejudging but at the finals Kai was harder and has a more pleasing physique, e.g. smaller waist, better taper, better quads and hams.



Agreed!


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## btex34n88 (Oct 2, 2012)

Prince said:


> I thought Phil was unbeatable until seeing this show, I did not see prejudging but at the finals Kai was harder and has a more pleasing physique, e.g. smaller waist, better taper, better quads and hams.



I agree, i honestly thought when they were announcing the winner that Kai's name would be called. I like Phil, but i think Kai deserved it and earned it. Glad i went, truly an awesome experience.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 2, 2012)

I was 10 rows back at pre judging. I had Kai ahead by a point or two.

At the night show, Kai faded as they sent the top 6 out to pose down and after that, his lower back developed a film to the lower insertions, as Phil got better as he posed. After they posed down, Kai went backstage and had ice packs on him from exhaustion. With that, Phil's attitude changed and he got aggressive and beat him! Phil's physique is a lot more pleasing to the eye. Kai was dug out, but again, he faded at night and that score counts a lot now. Shows are no longer won in pre judging and not won from the back anymore. It's the ability to make changes in 24 hours and come back harder and the stage presentation is huge. Kai looked tired and scared when Heath was bullying the judges and Kai. I talked to Shawn Ray and he felt the same way! Kai ran out of gas athletically


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## Arnold (Oct 2, 2012)

*back shot*


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 2, 2012)

^ overlapping skin on lower Lats .. His back had deeper insertions but IMO Phil beat him by aesthetics and round muscle bellies and just overall genetics. Next year will be highly competitive. Look for Rhoden to up his game.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 2, 2012)




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## Goldenera (Oct 3, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> ^ overlapping skin on lower Lats .. His back had deeper insertions but IMO Phil beat him by aesthetics and round muscle bellies and just overall genetics. Next year will be highly competitive. Look for Rhoden to up his game.



Agreed. Kai's aesthetics look weird to me in almost all the poses. His back has a much different shape but looks very odd where his shoulders and traps meet.  Phil's bicep bellies are much fuller , and his arms are far better looking as a whole. Phil's shoulders are much fuller, and better looking ESP in the side tricep side chest pose. 

Kai has him on legs ill give him that. He also really trimmed his waist line up. His gut used to really hang, but looks better in all these shots.


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## charley (Oct 3, 2012)

[h=2]Phil and Kai 2012 O Pics-side by side 				........[/h]......  =  prefer Phil....waiting for Dennis Wolf to win..


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 3, 2012)

Goldenera said:


> Agreed. Kai's aesthetics look weird to me in almost all the poses. His back has a much different shape but looks very odd where his shoulders and traps meet.  Phil's bicep bellies are much fuller , and his arms are far better looking as a whole. Phil's shoulders are much fuller, and better looking ESP in the side tricep side chest pose.
> 
> Kai has him on legs ill give him that. He also really trimmed his waist line up. His gut used to really hang, but looks better in all these shots.



^ this. To the T!!!


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## Ezskanken (Oct 3, 2012)

I'm new to this, but did Phil's chest look like synthol, or does he just have that much mass?


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## KILLEROFSAINTS (Oct 3, 2012)

Lol
synthol chest
wtf


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## TrojanMan60563 (Oct 3, 2012)

I'm no judge but I dont see how it looks so close. My eyes see Phil as the clear winner. He looks sharper in those photos and most of his body parts look to more developed to me.


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## desmorris (Oct 3, 2012)

Very close content. Man look at them inch by inch and then really close fight...


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## bjg (Oct 4, 2012)

smooth muscle, bloated full of synthol, implants , you name it  , and by the way phil's chest is ridiculous...
there is no more MR Olympia...it is becoming Mr. ridiculous.
sorry guys but your idols are not impressive and surely did not impress me.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 4, 2012)

bjg said:


> smooth muscle, bloated full of synthol, implants , you name it  , and by the way phil's chest is ridiculous...
> there is no more MR Olympia...it is becoming Mr. ridiculous.
> sorry guys but your idols are not impressive and surely did not impress me.



Wtf are you talking about? Phil has the best genetics in the world , yeah he missed his mark, however there's not a drop of synthol in his body! Where do you get this from? I know his trainer VERY WELL and you don't know what you're talking about.. What a fucking hater!


NEGGED


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## bjg (Oct 4, 2012)

^^^ chill out man no need to be so pissed off....sure i am not impressed at any current Mr O and will tell you why....,and i never said that phil did not have the genetics, in fact he has the best genetics , but i think all Mr Os now use synthol here and there, they use it in a very clever way so it does not show, they are not going to tell you they are using synthol.
and the abuse of GH gives them this thick waist and they all have smooth muscles and they look inflated somehow..just check Mr O in the 80's they look better. I think if PHil was born in the 70's he would have looked much better than now.
perhaps Phil is the best now , but it is ironic that he cannot compare to Mr O's 30-40 years ago.
i mean albert beckles for example looked better than Phil and kai and he was freaking 60 years old!


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 4, 2012)

bjg said:


> ^^^ chill out man no need to be so pissed off....sure i am not impressed at any current Mr O and will tell you why....,and i never said that phil did not have the genetics, in fact he has the best genetics , but i think all Mr Os now use synthol here and there, they use it in a very clever way so it does not show, they are not going to tell you they are using synthol.
> and the abuse of GH gives them this thick waist and they all have smooth muscles and they look inflated somehow..just check Mr O in the 80's they look better. I think if PHil was born in the 70's he would have looked much better than now.
> perhaps Phil is the best now , but it is ironic that he cannot compare to Mr O's 30-40 years ago.
> i mean albert beckles for example looked better than Phil and kai and he was freaking 60 years old!




Again, you shouldn't be in this section!




negged


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## Arnold (Oct 6, 2012)

*who is the winner in this shot?*


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## Ezskanken (Oct 6, 2012)

Kai Greene!  Is that today?  I hope Kai wins this one!  I was just wondering about this actually...


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

KILLEROFSAINTS said:


> Lol
> synthol chest
> wtf



There's not an ounce of synthol in Phil


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## Arnold (Oct 8, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> There's not an ounce of synthol in Phil



how do u know?


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

Prince said:


> how do u know?



Top secret Rob! 


Pro Creator himself , maybe?

I know the Evogen crew REALLY well. Be honest, do you think he has synthol with those bellies ?


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## Arnold (Oct 8, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> do you think he has synthol with those bellies ?



I don't know, but it's possible, it's a very commonly used tactic among pro bodybuilders to bring up a lagging bodypart for a show.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

Prince said:


> I don't know, but it's possible, it's a very commonly used tactic among pro bodybuilders to bring up a lagging bodypart for a show.



It shows.. if you know how that crap looks in the muscle. I'm 100pc sure he doesn't use it, and if he does, someone point out the body part he uses it in?


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

We were talking about synthol


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## Arnold (Oct 8, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> It shows.. if you know how that crap looks in the muscle. I'm 100pc sure he doesn't use it, and if he does, someone point out the body part he uses it in?



LMAO! why so defensive, do you want to fuck Phil Heath?


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## Arnold (Oct 8, 2012)




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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

Prince said:


> LMAO! why so defensive, do you want to fuck Phil Heath?



I'm not defensive Prince. Just know the facts. 


I'm not into fucking bodybuilders...

My wife would maybe take a ride on his little bone roller coaster??

I don't know?


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## Arnold (Oct 8, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> i'm not defensive prince. Just know the facts.
> 
> 
> I'm not into fucking bodybuilders...
> ...



lol


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## REDDOG309 (Oct 8, 2012)

Well it must be hard to choose between one perfect speciment and another perfect speciment. They both look fantastic.


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## bjg (Oct 8, 2012)

synthol is used by  most mr O's but it is used in a clever way , just a tiny little bit here and there , it won't show.......if it shows then the judges will not be very happy about it....i have seen really shitty synthol jobs and some  (actually one guy in my gym who admitted using it) that do no show at all because he is already very big and he just used a tiny bit on his calves. so if they use synthol, chances are at this advanced level (you are talking Mr O) nobody will be able to tell...... .unless your name is markus ruhl or there are some shots even of jay cutler that betray him. 
So about Phil i have suggested that he did use some synthol, but to be fair i really don't know ...
the first one who was really accused of synthol was flex wheeler 20 years ago and that was an enough reason for disqualification ...talking in 1884 samir bannout (Mr O 1983) was disqualified for using steroids!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! judging standards really changed through the years ...no shit.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

bjg said:


> synthol is used by  most mr O's but it is used in a clever way , just a tiny little bit here and there , it won't show.......if it shows then the judges will not be very happy about it....i have seen really shitty synthol jobs and some  (actually one guy in my gym who admitted using it) that do no show at all because he is already very big and he just used a tiny bit on his calves. so if they use synthol, chances are at this advanced level (you are talking Mr O) nobody will be able to tell...... .unless your name is markus ruhl or there are some shots even of jay cutler that betray him.
> So about Phil i have suggested that he did use some synthol, but to be fair i really don't know ...
> the first one who was really accused of synthol was flex wheeler 20 years ago and that was an enough reason for disqualification ...talking in 1884 samir bannout (Mr O 1983) was disqualified for using steroids!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! judging standards really changed through the years ...no shit.



Synthol is not used by all Mr O's? Please show me proof?

Thanks


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

Ken Wheeler had calf implants. I trained at Gold's Venice my whole life. That wasn't synthol in his calves. They accused him of lying about his calves. 

Fuck


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## bjg (Oct 8, 2012)

hypo_glycemic said:


> Synthol is not used by all Mr O's? Please show me proof?
> 
> Thanks


perhaps i did not express myself correctly, i did not mean that all of them use it for sure , but rather that they will not refrain from using it if needed, it is becoming so casual that it is very hard to resist....it is very hard to find a proof unless it is really obvious like for example in the case of ruhl as i noted earlier.
as far as calves are concerned, it is the most widely corrected body part , either by implant or synthol , ..there were even rumors about arnold himself .....
but in any case synthol or not i still think that 30 or 40 years ago Mr O's had better physique than today, the quality of their muscle and their overall shape was much better. i just saw a comparison pic with Arnold and ronnie coleman facing each other with a front double biceps pose,...and besides his bigger legs , Ronnie could not come close to arnold.


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## hypo_glycemic (Oct 8, 2012)

bjg said:


> perhaps i did not express myself correctly, i did not mean that all of them use it for sure , but rather that they will not refrain from using it if needed, it is becoming so casual that it is very hard to resist....it is very hard to find a proof unless it is really obvious like for example in the case of ruhl as i noted earlier.
> as far as calves are concerned, it is the most widely corrected body part , either by implant or synthol , ..there were even rumors about arnold himself .....
> but in any case synthol or not i still think that 30 or 40 years ago Mr O's had better physique than today, the quality of their muscle and their overall shape was much better. i just saw a comparison pic with Arnold and ronnie coleman facing each other with a front double biceps pose,...and besides his bigger legs , Ronnie could not come close to arnold.



That's your opinion. The 2003 Ronnie Coleman's condition with mass and symmetry will never be matched. The only thing about Ron was his stomach, it was a bit extended. Markus Ruhl yes, I believe he reportedly was using some along with Nasser. But that's not bodybuilding and a Mr O caliber physique. I can tell from being a back up judge in the NPC.. 90's and 2000's that you can notice who has been using it. It was used more in the 90's in the NPC. I know Jon Lindsey would not let anybody compete if he noticed it on any competitors. He told me-- as a judge-- he would be dammed if someone was going to make a mockery of one of his shows! I'd bet only a few IFBB use synthol now-- if any! But you can't pose that Ruhl is anything built like I Mr Olympia like you claimed Mr O's use synthol?


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## bjg (Oct 8, 2012)

^^ hope they don't use it, i think it should be ground for immediate disqualification if i was the judge...
i like coleman the first 3 times he got the olympia , yes he was amazing but then he started getting this gut...not sure why most modern bodybuilders especially at the highest levels have this thick looking waist and gut, i mean they must be on something new other than gh, since gh was used long time ago.


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## Goldenera (Nov 26, 2012)

bjg said:


> ^^ hope they don't use it, i think it should be ground for immediate disqualification if i was the judge...
> i like coleman the first 3 times he got the olympia , yes he was amazing but then he started getting this gut...not sure why most modern bodybuilders especially at the highest levels have this thick looking waist and gut, i mean they must be on something new other than gh, since gh was used long time ago.



I talked to a high level trainer of many pros. He said that despite popular belief the huge gut is not from gh or insulin abuse as some think. However it is merely a distended stomach created from the inane amount of cals the gut has to be able to hold an process. 

Some guys just have better structures and proportions then others in the gut/torso area. Some guys hold in their guts all the time while others let it hang.


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## Curt James (Nov 26, 2012)

Wish Kai Greene had been more aggressive on stage. Lee Thompson, IFBB Pro judge, commented in interviews how Phil _owned the stage_ and how he admired his stage presence. 

Looking forward to next year's O already. Jay, Phil, Kai, and newcomer Shawn Rhoden battling it out. 

Will Dexter be there? Where do Branch and Wolf factor in?



heavyiron said:


> Phil was not quite as sharp during prejudging but more than made up for it at finals.


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## Curt James (Nov 26, 2012)

Very close contest though _Thompson _stated it was Phil without a doubt.


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## KILLEROFSAINTS (Nov 26, 2012)

not even priest had an arm like this
cannot be bought or trained for
its a gift


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## hypo_glycemic (Nov 26, 2012)

KILLEROFSAINTS said:


> not even priest had an arm like this
> cannot be bought or trained for
> its a gift



^ this exactly ....


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## hypo_glycemic (Nov 26, 2012)




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