# Sustanon for definition/cutting???



## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

Hello,  I am new to steroids and am about to try my first cycle.  I have decent knowledge of them and have done ton of research, however obtaining them is hard for me.  I would have opted for Deca/winstrol or Deca/primobolan  cycle for more of a toning cycle than mass, however I was only able to get my hands on 10 amps of Sustanon.  

Can I use Sustanon in a way to rip up more than add mass?  Also, I cannot get my hands on any Nolva or Clomid, is there a OTC substitute?   I took the first dose of sust last week.  I plan on an 8 week cycle 1 amp/week for week 1,2,3 and 2 amps/week for week 4,5 and then back to 1 amp/week for weeks 6,7,8.  I may be able to get deca or winnie in a few weeks.  If I get one of them should I start it right in with the Sustanon?

Any help would be appreciated.

thanx, 

Little Hippo


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## Mudge (Apr 14, 2004)

If you diet down carefully yes you can use it for cutting, but it wont do anything to get you ripped. Cutting cycles are there to try and keep the muscle that you do have.


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## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

thanks, 

Thats what I thought....   I was going to do sust, a lower calorie diet, lots of cardio/weights, and also add a fat burner like Hydroxycut.  HOWEVER, From everthing I read.....  It says with sustanon you must eat a very high caloried diet.

any comments??


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## Just a guy (Apr 14, 2004)

Well u MUST eat high calories if u want to put on A shit load of muscle... its possible to cut and put on 5-10 pounds of Lean Muscle... the Sust is there to Hold the muscle you have so you can burn the fat off around it.   So low calories are fine if your cutting... but if you want to get Bigger you need to EAT EAT EAT


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## BCC (Apr 14, 2004)

Your first mistake was starting this cycle before gathering the proper ancillaries.

Your next mistake is pyramiding your doses. With the long chain esters in Sustanon your cycle is going to be over before it gets started the way you're using it.

Honestly, you don't have enough gear to get one cycle done correctly. 

Cut your losses after one ampule and stop right here. Do some more research, obtain some more gear and PCT ancillaries, and then get things done right.

I'm not trying to come across like an asshole, I would just rather see someone make satisfactory gains and actually keep them.


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## Mudge (Apr 14, 2004)

Gear works better on high calories but if you are using it to avoid losing muscle then you dont need that much gear and you aren't looking to add muscle.

Some people CAN add muscle during cutters but it depends on:

1) Genetics
2) Diet know how
3) Extremism of the diet

If you are going from 4k calories to 2k that is a massive change, if you are slowly scaling down your chances of actually gaining some muscle are probably better.

For me even to be on maintenance calories my bodymakeup wont change quickly at all on gear, its either BULK or CUT. So me personally I would not expect to gain anything on test only.

I agree with the pyramiding, thats old school. Pick a dose and stick with it, get your ancilaries in case the gyno fairy shows up, and this way you aren't left screwed in case you can't get them on time at the end of your cycle etc etc


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## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

thanks for the info guys...   BCC don't worry..  u r not an asshole, I am the same way....   honest, and straight to the point.  That was what I was looking for and why I wanted to be part of this forum.  

Well, It sounds good to cut my losses and wait to get the appropriate gear, however it may be a long time before I come across anything again.  So, I think I will stick with the Sust.  I will see gains either way I go (cutting or mass) because I have awesome will power and will work really hard.

REPLY QUESTION for MUDGE, BCC, or Just a Guy...

If not the pyramid dosing what would you recommend for my remaining 9 ampules?

Also, what do you think about adding an over the counter fat-burner (hydroxcut) towards the end of my cycle?

Once again, thanks for all the help.   This is a great website my buddy referred me to.


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## disinterment (Apr 14, 2004)

If you still have 9 amps of sust left just take 1 amp a wk which will be 250mg a wk of test which will be a 10wk cycle and you should see some good gains if your diet and training are correct.You should really try to get clomid for PCT atleast.


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## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

Oh yah,  last question I have is for obtaining PCT ancillaries??  Is there anything I can buy at GNC or a pro-hormone online that would be a good substitute for Clomid or Nolva..   

I am not sure what I should be taking with Sustanon during/after cycle?


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## Mudge (Apr 14, 2004)

There is 6OXO if you feel like trying it.


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## disinterment (Apr 14, 2004)

There really no substitute for clomid or nolva since you are using AAS and not a PH.I don't think those over the counter PCT and anti-estrogen products will work for AAS since there are made for PH.


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## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

thanks, and last but not least...j

what about adding a thermogenic like hydroxycut at the end of cycle to trim down and lose some water weight.


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## Power Rabbit (Apr 14, 2004)

i really dont think 250mg a week is gonna cut it...500mg a week is a solid test doseage....9 amps isnt enough to do anything .......at a 500mg doseage your cycle would last all of 4 weeks...the test wont even really "kick in" weeks 3-4 anyway...so by the time its really takeing effect you will be out....


you will be on just long enough for testicular atrophy but not long enough for real gains..... 

i really think you should shelf your stuff..


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## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

thanks power rabbit,  thats pretty much what everyone is saying....  Maybe I will wait till I can come across more gear.  I just thought for my first cycle lifting hard I could get at least something accomplished with 10 amps sustanon.


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## BCC (Apr 14, 2004)

Power Rabbit is right. There just really isn't much you can do with that amount of sust.

If it was me I would shelf the stuff. If I was being forced to use the stuff, I'd probably just pop myself every other day to take advantage of the prop (what little amount it is) and then just ride out the other esters for the remaining 4 weeks or so.

Either way, I don't see you getting far.


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## Just a guy (Apr 14, 2004)

but fellas... if he's cutting that will be enough to maintain muscle.  while he cuts calories.


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## Just a guy (Apr 14, 2004)

And too your question about OTC supp... im using Xtreme Trim with synephrine(like ephedra so they say) and so far so good... it raises your body tempereature so u sweat like a Son of a bitch in the gym.  i tried Hydroxycut and I did not like it... it dont have Synephrine in it neither


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## littlehippo (Apr 14, 2004)

Thanks Just a Guy,  

for now I will give X-treme trim a try and do a ton of cardio to rip up and shelf the sustanon until I can stack it with deca or winstrol.  Plus I will wait till I can get appropriate post cycle stuff.  

Thanks once again guys.....


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## BCC (Apr 14, 2004)

Just another suggestion; rather than getting deca or winstrol, you should make an attempt to either get more sust, or (preferably) some test enanthate or cypionate.

For your first cycle (hell, even first 2-3 cycles) 500mgs of test per week is all you need.


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## Mudge (Apr 14, 2004)

I think 250 is fine for a cutter, again though keep caloric cut in check, dont cut like 3000 calories or anything insane.


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## Just a guy (Apr 14, 2004)

since were on the concept of cutting... Mudge do you think me using 100Mg's of Prop ED for cutting is too much?  I dropped 3,000 Calories initially,  but it was a whole bunch of calories that i really didnt need.


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## Just a guy (Apr 14, 2004)

but goin good!  down to 210!! can u believe that shit... finally going to get below 20% body fat....


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## Mudge (Apr 14, 2004)

You dropped 3000 calories or you dropped down to 3000?

Shoot I was "bulking" off 700 prop, lots of guys run 100mg EOD (about 500 worth of cyp) when cutting, some guys run lots and some guys dont run  much. Seriously 700 prop is way, way over  normal you're talking about 10x higher than the average male, that should be enough to cut for anyone.


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