# Minimum recommend test-e dose??



## evanps (Jul 8, 2011)

Assuming an experienced lifter at 5'8", 165lb wanted to drop a couple % points in BF and AT LEAST maintain lean mass (recomp maybe, if advisable). Also assuming this was said person's first cycle outside PHs, what would u geared lot recommend as a minimum dose for a 10wk test-e only cycle?


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## TGB1987 (Jul 8, 2011)

What are your stats?  Age, BF%, years training?  It seems that you can't be too overweight when you weigh what you do at your height.  I am not sure what you going for here.  Even if you only use a small amount of test it is still going to suppress your natural Test levels.


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## WantsWidth (Jul 8, 2011)

I wouldn't do it for less than 12 weeks


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## evanps (Jul 8, 2011)

TGB1987 said:


> What are your stats?  Age, BF%, years training?  It seems that you can't be too overweight when you weigh what you do at your height.  I am not sure what you going for here.  Even if you only use a small amount of test it is still going to suppress your natural Test levels.



Age: 24
ht: 5'8"
Weight: 165lb
Bf: 8-9%
Experience: 10yrs lifting/weight training, couple PH cycles. 

I self measure with calipers to get the BF% I stated and consistently its just under 9%. But in all honesty I only use 3 measurements because I can only reach my anterior self lol, and I don't trust the accuracy of this.... But I am most definitely not overweight. 

I've researched AAS for yrs, literally 4-5 yrs. I'm at the point now I want to at least see how I'm going to react and finally give myself the extra edge. I'm pretty content with where I'm at physically but I'm obsessive and really want to be VERY lean. Eventually I can see myself with another 20 or so lbs of lean mass but its summer and I'm happy with my mass just not appearance BF wise. So at this point I imagine the aim of my cycle to be a cut but I absolutely do not want to sacrifice any significant amount of lbm.


And ss Far as suppression goes that isn't my concern for establishing a minimum dose....... I'm of the philosophy that the lower I can start and find results the more room I have to gain without adding higher and higher dosages in the future.


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## JCBourne (Jul 8, 2011)

If you've searched for 4-5 years you surely should know exactly what would be a good dose, and what would be too low unless you were on TRT.


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## teepee (Jul 8, 2011)

Read the stickies bro.

500mg a week for 12 weeks is pretty much ur best bet


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## Dannie (Jul 9, 2011)

250mg/wk would be minimum effective dose.  
Make sure you buy legit pharma grade product and you shouldn't be disappointed. 


The average male (18-35) produces somewhere in the range of 4-7mg of testosterone a day. That's 28-49mg per week, therefore minimum dose of test will be anything above that. However in some cases (alpha male ) your natural test production may be as high as 120mg/wk.

250mg of Test E yields around 165mg of testosterone.


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

GymRat4Life said:


> If you've searched for 4-5 years you surely should know exactly what would be a good dose, and what would be too low unless you were on TRT.



You would think so. And I'm not being a smart ass gymrat, I can post a cycle and PCT based on 30 diff schools of thought I've seen on internet forums. I know what most are going say.

I guess I should have been clearer in the beginning. I'd just like to know how many have used doses below the typical 500mg/wk cycle with good results. 

I look at it this way.... If I were a first time drinker I could get shit faced on a fifth of vodka... or I could pace myself with a six pack and feel a lot better later........ I wish I had known that the first time I drank.

I've seen ppl talk about smaller doses on OTHER forums...... Personally I'm a little partial to the ideas of you IM bros, just like to know what some of the experienced ones here think.


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## Anabolic5150 (Jul 9, 2011)

Here is my suggestion, if you have decided to use AAS, start with the smallest dosage possible to gauge results. Many can and do grow on 500mg a week and some even less. But make sure you have everything you need before you start, PCT, AI's etc.

Now to the other side of it, at 24 I think you are too young to consider AAS unless you have blood work to back up lower then average test levels. Spend a few bucks and get blood work done, see where you stand. You are placing yourself at great risk of needing TRT later in life, shutting yourself down with over use etc. There is always time to stick that first needle in your ass, but once it's done, it's done. Get all your ducks in a row, do it right if you choose to do it.


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Here is my suggestion, if you have decided to use AAS, start with the smallest dosage possible to gauge results. Many can and do grow on 500mg a week and some even less. But make sure you have everything you need before you start, PCT, AI's etc.
> 
> Now to the other side of it, at 24 I think you are too young to consider AAS unless you have blood work to back up lower then average test levels. Spend a few bucks and get blood work done, see where you stand. You are placing yourself at great risk of needing TRT later in life, shutting yourself down with over use etc. There is always time to stick that first needle in your ass, but once it's done, it's done. Get all your ducks in a row, do it right if you choose to do it.



Thank you! and yea I'm going to get a physical here shortly when my sched opens up. It's been a while since I've had a good set of labs drawn so I intend to assess things at that point. I'm not in any rush to jump into this, just toying with ideas and collecting some first hand info. By all means keep it comin.


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## Glycomann (Jul 9, 2011)

Not really sure what you're looking for since you are already 8%. Anyway I've done well with 200 mg test C and AI and a little anavar.  Then the rest is diet.


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

Glycomann said:


> Not really sure what you're looking for since you are already 8%. Anyway I've done well with 200 mg test C and AI and a little anavar.  Then the rest is diet.



Idk, BDD maybe lol..... but thanks for the input, I respect ur experience/info


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## SloppyJ (Jul 9, 2011)

You state that you want to drop some BF but then you say you want to gain 20lbs of mass. I'd say start with 500mg.


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## LightBearer (Jul 9, 2011)

What's the reasoning to drop below your already supper low 9pct bf? Are you sure Ur 9pct? If so you must have some sort of 8 pack goin on and shit, any lower will be too tough to maintain. And you won't put on 20lbs LBM with a lower dose.  I think you could get 10 lbs out of 250mg test a week which isn't bad.


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> You state that you want to drop some BF but then you say you want to gain 20lbs of mass. I'd say start with 500mg.





evanps said:


> *Eventually (as in the future, not now)* I can see myself with another 20 or so lbs of lean mass but its summer and I'm happy with my mass just not appearance BF wise.





LightBearer said:


> What's the reasoning to drop below your already supper low 9pct bf? Are you sure Ur 9pct?  I think you could get 10 lbs out of 250mg test a week which isn't bad.





evanps said:


> I self measure with calipers to get the BF% I stated and consistently its just under 9%. But in all honesty I only use 3 measurements because I can only reach my anterior self lol, and I don't trust the accuracy of this


Aside form that thanks for the suggestion!! I've been thinkin 250-300mg per week... Kinda thought maybe 250 could be too low but that's why I started this thread.​


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## Rambo88 (Jul 9, 2011)

250 mg is super low but ur first cycle id say do it as long as u got AI's and pct in place u will c results, dont expect too much at that dose but u will b able to tell if u want to jump into a 500mg cycle, if u jus want a little more, if u want to keep it the same, add something else etc... Keep Us posted on when u plan on doing what and what the results r


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

Startin to seem like maybe my idea is feasible..... I've searched trying to find some evidence on the levels of natural test production per week and find a lot of varying numbers.... obviously it makes zero f**kin sense to run a dose equivalent or below natural production, but taking into consideration everyone is diff I'm just trying to pinpoint a dose that's going to be supraphysiologic for a broad range of ppl but still as low as possible.

Believe me I'm full aware of the risks, I've seen it first hand and I'm willing to face those but I want to minimize as much as possible and again give myself more room to adjust dosages and such later on.


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## heavyiron (Jul 9, 2011)

300mg T weekly is the lowest I would go.


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

heavyiron said:


> 300mg T weekly is the lowest I would go.



Ah, an answer from the all-mighty Heavy. Thank ya sir!


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## heavyiron (Jul 9, 2011)

No problem, read this;

http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/104658-first-cycle-pct.html


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## evanps (Jul 9, 2011)

heavyiron said:


> No problem, read this;
> 
> http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/104658-first-cycle-pct.html



Oh I have, over and over lol. Read basically every article uve posted heavy and the other stickies as well. I realize what I'm getting at is outside the norm here that's why I've asked outright about the feasibility.


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## independent (Jul 9, 2011)

Dannie said:


> 250mg/wk would be minimum effective dose.
> Make sure you buy legit pharma grade product and you shouldn't be disappointed.
> 
> 
> ...



Great post.





Glycomann said:


> Not really sure what you're looking for since you are already 8%. Anyway I've done well with 200 mg test C and AI and a little anavar.  Then the rest is diet.



Another good post from someone whose experienced. 

My first cycle was 250mg's of test-e with a oral kickstart of methyl test, gained 15 pounds. That was with a shitty diet and no pct.


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## LightBearer (Jul 9, 2011)

Also remember the ester has weight so if yure doing test e, only 72mg out of 100 pmg is testosterone, the other 28 is the enanthate ester. So if you're. Figuring doses based on natural t production, and u decide 300mg of test e per week is high, remember its actually 216mg per week after you discount the ester.


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## GFR (Jul 9, 2011)

heavyiron said:


> 300mg T weekly is the lowest I would go.


^^^ This.

My first cycle was 300mg test a week for about 6 weeks and I made great gains.


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## Anabolic5150 (Jul 9, 2011)

GeorgeForemanRules said:


> ^^^ This.
> 
> My first cycle was 300mg test a week for about 6 weeks and I made great gains.



Think I started at 250-300mg a week as well, and you are right. It was plenty and I noted a significant difference in just a few weeks.


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## Glycomann (Jul 9, 2011)

LightBearer said:


> Also remember the ester has weight so if yure doing test e, only 72mg out of 100 pmg is testosterone, the other 28 is the enanthate ester. So if you're. Figuring doses based on natural t production, and u decide 300mg of test e per week is high, remember its actually 216mg per week after you discount the ester.



For a rough estimate most guys I know that TRT get a blood level of 1300 - 1500 ng/dL with 200 mg/w of test C.  That's roughly 2x the top of normal range.


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