# Torem users please chime in



## bigbenj (Dec 27, 2011)

Im ordering some clen for my wife tonight. while surfing one of the sponsors site, torem caught my eye.

I wanted to get some feedback from the members before I snatch some up. Ive read of some people using it for pct, others say not to.

The most interesting thing I read is that it may be better than letro at reducing/eliminating gyno. This would be a huge bonus. Anyone with experience, please chime in with your experience using torem. Id greatly appreciate it.

Im going to post this in the research chem section as well.


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## bigbenj (Dec 27, 2011)

also, if you had a good experience, feel free to PM with what company you used. Want to make sure I get the good stuff. dont want to talk about it on the main board. thanks.


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## pieguy (Dec 27, 2011)

I have never heard of using torem as gyno removal or reduction. It's most synonymous with clomid and both are used for restarting hpta function. I'm on torem rite now in PCT and I haven't lost any weight, just some strength. However, it feels like my testicles are still a bit atrophied despite blasting 10,000iu HCG.


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## kbordner (Dec 27, 2011)

I have had great success with Torem. To the point that I don't use Nolva or Clomid anymore. I have Letro but haven't needed it.


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## Vibrant (Dec 27, 2011)

I'll post the article again. from what I read, it doesnt sound like its good for pct.


*(Toremifene citrate)*

            Fareston   is yet another SERM,  which  means Fareston   will display both estrogen antagonist / agonist   properties in the body. This puts Fareston   in the same category as Nolvadex and Clomid, the two most popular drugs in Farestons   category. This is, however very different, and you'll soon see why.

            Some scientists at a party were bored one day,  so they  hooked up some time-lapse video to breast cancer cell cultures  treated  with toremifene (the chemical in Fareston). Ok, the part about  them  being bored one day is made up, but they really did hook up  time-lapse  photography to breast cancer cell cultures treated with  Fareston.  Anyway, they observed this for 3 days, and Fareston   caused   approximately 60% of the cells to exhibit morphologic characteristics   typical of cells undergoing apoptosis or programmed death. The   significance of this to you and me is that this is roughly the same   thing that would happen to your gyno if you were taking Fareston.   Anyway, the number of mitoses gradually decreased to zero over only a 3-   to 4-day period. So this stuff causes growth inhibition of   estrogen-sensitive breast cancer cells by inducing some cells to die and   by inhibiting other cells from entering mitosis (i.e. from  replicating)  (1). This stuff will KILL your gyno, from everything I've  read (which  also means that I've had to read into everything Ive read,  if you kinda  follow me). Now where was I? Oh yeah kill, that's right.  This is  certainly good news for someone who wants to get rid of gyno,  but since  Fareston   also prevents the cells from replicating, it will  stop gyno  from progressing as well as kill existing gyno.

            Also of note is that Fareston   will reduce prolactin (2), and as you probably guessed, this may raise your  Testosterone levels, since prolactin can not only cause lactation, but Fareston   also has an inhibitory effect on your Test   levels. The unfortunate part about this potentially exciting new   compound is that Fareston   will also raise sex hormone binding globulin   (SHBG), which will in turn lower circulating levels of testosterone in   your body (3).

            Perhaps this drug, if  Fareston   can be found, may be used  successfully to treat existing  gyno, or as an adjunct during a cycle,  but certainly not for an  effective post cycle therapy. 



*References:* 

            1. Apoptosis in toremifene-induced growth inhibition of   human breast cancer cells in vivo and in vitro.J Natl Cancer Inst. 1993   Sep 1;85(17):1412-8. 
            2. Hormonal effects of toremifene in breast cancer patients. J Steroid Biochem. 1990 Jun 22;36(3):243-7.
            3. Influence of toremifene on the endocrine regulation in breast cancer patients. Eur J Cancer. 1994;30A(2):154-8.
 

here is also what wikipedia says:


*Toremifene citrate* is an oral selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) which helps oppose the actions of estrogen in the body. Licensed in the United States under the brand name *Fareston*, toremifene citrate is FDA-approved for use in advanced (metastatic) breast cancer. It is also being evaluated for prevention of prostate cancer under the brand name *Acapodene*.[1]
In 2007 the pharmaceutical company GTx, Inc was conducting two different phase 3 clinical trials; First, a pivotal Phase clinical trial for the treatment of serious side effects of androgen deprivation therapy (ADT) (especially vertebral/spine fractures and hot flashes, lipid profile, and gynecomastia)  for advanced prostate cancer, and second, a pivotal Phase III clinical  trial for the prevention of prostate cancer in high risk men with high  grade prostatic intraepithelial neoplasia, or PIN. Results of these trials are expected by first quarter of 2008[2]
An NDA for the first application (relief of prostate cancer ADT side effects) was submitted in Feb 2009[3], and in Oct 2009 the FDA said they would need more clinical data, eg. another phase III trial.[4]
* References*



*^*  Price N, Sartor O, Hutson T, Mariani S. Role of 5a-reductase inhibitors  and selective estrogen receptor modulators as potential chemopreventive  agents for prostate cancer. _Clin Prostate Cancer_ 2005;3:211-4. PMID 15882476
*^* "GTx's Phase III Clinical Development of ACAPODENE on Course Following Planned Safety Review" 
 (Press release). GTx Inc.. 2007-07-12. Retrieved 2006-07-14.
*^* ""GTx Announces Toremifene 80 mg NDA Accepted for Review by FDA"" 
 (Press release).
*^* "GTx and Ipsen End Prostate Cancer Collaboration due to Costs of FDA-Requested Phase III Study" 
. 2 Mar 2011.
​


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## Vibrant (Dec 27, 2011)

here is something else thats interesting. Im quoting a guy known as swifto :

In a recent study done on Tamox , Tore and Rolax comparing HPTA restoration. Tamoxifen  can out on top. In 8 weeks, 20mg/ED of Tamoxifen  increased LH from 4.54 to 7.73 (+70%) and Test  from 496.59 to 835.06 (+71%). After two months, 60mg/day of Toremifene increased LH from 4.05 to 5.05 (+25%)  and Test  from 496.59 to 709.79 (+42%). 

One thing I will say though, is that the Tore dose is at 60mg/ED for 6-8 weeks, which IMHO is a low dose fo PCT  . If you've read above? You'll see that I suggest a fair bit more  (120/100/60/60/60) is what I suggest now. So although this study states Tamox  is superoir to Tore, take the doses into account. 

Again, even recent research on Tamox  doesnt raise serum T by 146% as Clomid  dose at 25mg/ED for 4-6 weeks.


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## ~RaZr~ (Dec 27, 2011)

Vibrant said:


> here is something else thats interesting. Im quoting a guy known as swifto



IIRC, Swifto has been around for a while. I am sure he has thoroughly researched the various PCT supps


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## pieguy (Dec 27, 2011)

So clomid still best at raising serum T?


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## Vibrant (Dec 27, 2011)

pieguy said:


> So clomid still best at raising serum T?



yup, looks like you cant beat the clomid/aromasin combo for pct.

I just ordered some torem, so I'll keep everyone updated on how it works for me.


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## waterstill (Dec 27, 2011)

I've had nothing but good experiences with torem. Had my boys back in full swing within a couple days every time. Also helped with any gyno flares. It's pretty cheap, why not pick some up.

Clen for the wife? you must hate her, clen is the devil.


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## bigbenj (Dec 27, 2011)

LOL. We're going to start slow, see how she reacts, and work up from there. 
Have some winny on hand too.


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## suprfast (Dec 27, 2011)

Are you moobs still all fucked up?


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## bigbenj (Dec 27, 2011)

No, they're better, I just want to try and get rid of the lumps. My MANmaries have always been more of a cone shape, at least since I can remember. I want these bitches flat(er)!

BTW, I went with letro for now, until I read more and get more user feedback on torem.


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## Vibrant (Dec 27, 2011)

I guess I'll be the guinea pig for now. Im going with pills though, Im not messing around with liquid stuff anymore.


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## bigbenj (Dec 27, 2011)

How do you plan on running it?


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## pieguy (Dec 27, 2011)

I've been on torem for almost 4 weeks now at 120/120/120/60, and so far and I'm still pretty suppressed. However, in week 3, I switched from precision pep to manpower so maybe my first 3 weeks was pointless cause I was running bunk crap. Either way, i'm going to add in 50mg clomid or 20mg nolva on top of my 12.5mg aromasin and 60mg torem for a few weeks to see if it gets better.


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## suprfast (Dec 27, 2011)

pieguy said:


> I've been on torem for almost 4 weeks now at 120/120/120/60, and so far and I'm still pretty suppressed. However, in week 3, I switched from precision pep to manpower so maybe my first 3 weeks was pointless cause I was running bunk crap. Either way, i'm going to add in 50mg clomid or 20mg nolva on top of my 12.5mg aromasin and 60mg torem for a few weeks to see if it gets better.



Holy PCT batman.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 27, 2011)

I'm interested in this shit. After coming off of PCT and having ZERO sex drive I want to do something different. It's kinda scary.


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## suprfast (Dec 27, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> I'm interested in this shit. After coming off of PCT and having ZERO sex drive I want to do something different. It's kinda scary.



Let her stick her thumb...Oh you mean PCT different.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 27, 2011)

suprfast said:


> Let her stick her thumb...Oh you mean PCT different.


 

We tried that....


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## Vibrant (Dec 27, 2011)

I'm gonna dose it 60mg ed to start, I may bump it if I feel it's not doing anything. I'm not using it for pct when I finish my current cycle though.


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## suprfast (Dec 27, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> We tried that....



This has to be the weirdest feeling(sex drive not thumb, that feels cool).  Maybe we can inject pedophiles with a bunch of shit that kills their sex drives.  For everyone else that has this issue im sorry.


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