# How long my off-cycle be after 4 weeks of 1-AD



## Deadly13 (Jul 20, 2004)

Sup,, I was wondering how long should I wait until.. I start my second cycle off 1-AD. Aslo should I even take 1-AD cause I'm 17 I know it slows down natural hormone production but how long does it take to be on the OK


----------



## madden player (Jul 21, 2004)

No...stay away from the stuff.  It is best for middle age men not 17 yr olds.


----------



## trHawT (Jul 21, 2004)

Hell yeah!  I could just see 40-year-olds popping Andro.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 21, 2004)

Deadly13 said:
			
		

> Sup,, I was wondering how long should I wait until.. I start my second cycle off 1-AD. Aslo should I even take 1-AD cause I'm 17 I know it slows down natural hormone production but how long does it take to be on the OK


LISTEN! Taking any prohormone or prosteriod at your age is a HUGE mistake. It will screw up your hormones for life. It could stunt your growth (for good), and many other things you don't want to think about--imagine your nuts never doing there job right for the rest of your life. Wait until you are 21. Yes, they will be illegal then, but there will be great products to replace prohormones. Until then, focus on whey and creatine for supplementation. With a good workout, diet, and lots of patience, you will have the body you want without screwing yourself up for life. At your age, it isn't even a gamble, it is a given: prohormones or prosteriods WILL cause irreversible damage.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 21, 2004)

trHawT said:
			
		

> Hell yeah!  I could just see 40-year-olds popping Andro.


 It is better for them then a teenager


----------



## madden player (Jul 21, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> It is better for them then a teenager


Yup...testosterone starts to drop off as you get older.  When I was 17 I could train all day everyday.  If you need a testosterone boost at 17 perhaps you were neutered at birth.


----------



## trHawT (Jul 22, 2004)

GH levels steadily decline after 25 as well.  I'm 25.  lol


----------



## madden player (Jul 22, 2004)

trHawT said:
			
		

> GH levels steadily decline after 25 as well. I'm 25. lol


Yup...I'm 26 and the difference b/t 17 and 26 is like night and day.  At 17 all I had to do was think about a 45 lb plate and I would grow, now I have to do everything perfect to make my training as productive as possible.


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 22, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> LISTEN! Taking any prohormone or prosteriod at your age is a HUGE mistake. It will screw up your hormones for life.



Can you show me any study where it says that taking PS when you???re 17+ years of age will mess up you???re natural test levels for life?


----------



## trHawT (Jul 22, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> It is better for them then a teenager



Sorry about that.  Had to do it!  I wouldn't necessarily say any type of pro-hormone is better for any type of individual.  You're manipulating your own test levels, changing your body's natural functioning.


----------



## trHawT (Jul 22, 2004)

madden player said:
			
		

> Yup...I'm 26 and the difference b/t 17 and 26 is like night and day.  At 17 all I had to do was think about a 45 lb plate and I would grow, now I have to do everything perfect to make my training as productive as possible.




I hear ya, dude, trust me!  I'm the same way.  I wish I had started to train in my youth, instead of in my early - mid twenties.  At least I'm trying to live a healthy lifestyle (now) by eating right and utilizing resistance training/cardio.  That's the way I see it.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 22, 2004)

KataMaStEr said:
			
		

> Can you show me any study where it says that taking PS when you???re 17+ years of age will mess up you???re natural test levels for life?


 No, I can't. Then again, I said "hormones", not natural test. Who is going to experiment with a teenager to see if he gets screwed up permanently? If the hypothesis is that PH or PS  can cause hormonal imbalances or stunt growth, etc for the rest of your life, who is going to sign up their budding kid to see if it is true? Sure, there are some. Either way, the results wouldn't be in for at least 20 years. Looks like we won't know for sure until then. I don't keep references on hand, but there have been many documented cases of steroids causing these types of problems when used by high school athletes. . But, they were not scientifically controlled studies--because of the ethics issue. PS are not much different in the way they effect hormone levels and your body's response to the elevated levels. We don't need to give pregnant women crack, then monitor the baby to see what happens. It is down the road that people attribute current problems or deficiencies with earlier drug use. But you are right, I shouldn't have said "will". I should have said "could".


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 22, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> No, I can't. Then again, I said "hormones", not natural test. Who is going to experiment with a teenager to see if he gets screwed up permanently? If the hypothesis is that PH or PS  can cause hormonal imbalances or stunt growth, etc for the rest of your life, who is going to sign up their budding kid to see if it is true? Sure, there are some. Either way, the results wouldn't be in for at least 20 years. Looks like we won't know for sure until then. I don't keep references on hand, but there have been many documented cases of steroids causing these types of problems when used by high school athletes. . But, they were not scientifically controlled studies--because of the ethics issue. PS are not much different in the way they effect hormone levels and your body's response to the elevated levels. We don't need to give pregnant women crack, then monitor the baby to see what happens. It is down the road that people attribute current problems or deficiencies with earlier drug use. But you are right, I shouldn't have said "will". I should have said "could".



Exactly man, I believe there have been reported cases of teens fucking this body up due to the use of steroids so have adults, BUT those cases are most likely of teen that did not know what in the world they where doing. If you stay on a cycle for too long it will have a negative effect, if you don???t follow up with PCT it could screw with you. For adults is the same thing, but you will find more teens uninformed about things like this then you do adults. So at the end they pay the price for being stupid enough not to research and understand what they are doing to their body. I don???t have anything against any athlete who is 17+ and has done their research and understands the risk they are taking by doing a PS cycle.


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 22, 2004)

Also you can???t generalize; not every teen when they are 17 or so have the same development. If you???re 5???6??? tall 130lbs and want to grow a couple more inches, I would suggest against any PH/PS. If you???re 6??? tall 240lb been training for a few years and whant to do a cycle I will not against that person. At 17 I could easily grow a bear and pass myself as a 20 year old. And there are other kids that at 17 you would think they are in middle school b/c of that baby face. You know what I???m trying to say. I would say the majority of teens should not come near any PH/PS, but there are also those others that can do them successfully. So when someone comes in here asking for advice give it to them and also inform them of the risks. Instead of everyone jumping on the guy all at once, a lot of the time they have already made up their mind. So you can make sure they either do it right, or come out of here without any useful information and do it however they think it is and increase the risk further down the line.


----------



## redspy (Jul 22, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> No, I can't. Then again, I said "hormones", not natural test. Who is going to experiment with a teenager to see if he gets screwed up permanently? If the hypothesis is that PH or PS  can cause hormonal imbalances or stunt growth, etc for the rest of your life, who is going to sign up their budding kid to see if it is true? Sure, there are some. Either way, the results wouldn't be in for at least 20 years. Looks like we won't know for sure until then. I don't keep references on hand, but there have been many documented cases of steroids causing these types of problems when used by high school athletes. . But, they were not scientifically controlled studies--because of the ethics issue. PS are not much different in the way they effect hormone levels and your body's response to the elevated levels. We don't need to give pregnant women crack, then monitor the baby to see what happens. It is down the road that people attribute current problems or deficiencies with earlier drug use. But you are right, I shouldn't have said "will". I should have said "could".



I completely agree with Pirate.  Although we're on this forum to build muscle you have to put things in perspective.  Is it worth screwing with your endocrine system at such an early age just for a couple of inches on your biceps?  Lifting iron isn't just about body measurements and 1RM bench presses, it's also about a healthy, sustainable lifestyle.

If you came to us in 5 years + and trained to your full natural genetic potential we'd probably have a different viewpoint.  We don't say this stuff to drag you down, we say it help you.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 22, 2004)

KataMaStEr said:
			
		

> At 17 I could easily grow a bear and pass myself as a 20 year old.


 If you can grow a bear, you are the man.


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 22, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> If you can grow a bear, you are the man.




 same difference


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 22, 2004)

I do agree that a teenager is going to do whatever he wants, and the guy has obviously made up his mind. Therefore, to help him do it the most responsible way possible is more helpful than telling him he is wrong. Very good point, indeed Katamaster (not sarcastic). But, I feel like he should be aware of what the risks are. They are pretty serious risks in my opinion.


----------



## redspy (Jul 22, 2004)

Here's a post from BB.com from a 19 year old who ran a cycle and regretted it.  Posted 7/12.



> Not to keep whining or anything, but I think my life and future is pretty much done. I have done a 1 month prohormone cycle last year of December and have never ever seen my erection or sex drive ever since. I have never done a post cycle therapy and I think my all my hormones are messed up like high estrogen and low testosterone. I am 19 by the way. I dont know if there are even any therapy out there that can fix this. Guess there would be lots of test upcoming. I can't be more stressed than ever. I am pretty much by myself and got no where to go. I feel like giving up everything. I was planning to find a gf after I get into tip top shape but I guess this is out of my list now. In the future, I want kids and all but now I dont know I could've even mess that up. I just read every information on prohormones from this site today and now I totally regret on using them. I did look up side effects on prohormones before using them but I didnt take it to mind and thought nothing could happen. If my problems dont heal, I don't know how I can even go on with my life... Anybody with opinions or anything you could think of that could cheer me up??



http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?threadid=301510

Good luck man.  You might want to warn your girl


----------



## Luke9583 (Jul 22, 2004)

I'm 20, and just got off a cycle of M1T (1st time). Although it did diminish, I dont think I really lost my sex drive on cycle. Is that possible? And I wasn't even using any 4ad.  (20mg/day for 3 weeks)


----------



## NEW_IN_THE_GAME (Jul 22, 2004)

Hey You Might Have Sen This Before But I Have Asked To Take Andro They All Said No. Plus I Told A Story- When I Was 12 My Friend And I Were Out For Football. We Were Almost Top Ofthe Class, His Bro Also Played He Was 17, Playing Varsity. Well He Introduced My Friend To Roids. Bout A Month Later My Friends Bro Died, He Was Taking Like Half The Dose Of Andro, Half The Does Of Hgh, And Less Than Half Of The Test. Well 3 Months Later My Friend Died, 12 Fucking Years Old Man. He Was Taking Half What His Bro Was Taking. He Was Really Bad Looking When He Died- Bad Looking Skin - Very Pale With A Yellow Tint, Aggressive As All Hell. Even Beat Up His Gurlfriend And Her Sister. Sodont Mess With It. Plus Someone Asked If Anyone Could Show A Study. Well Guess What Search Naywhere For Teens And Prohormones And Prosteroids. Or I Could Send You A Fucking Copy Of My Friends Autopsy Report. Common Sense. I Know I Asked But The Only Reason Was Because Of My Size - And It Was Only To Ask As A Last Resort.


----------



## NEW_IN_THE_GAME (Jul 22, 2004)

Luke You Are 20 There Is A Difference There - I Know Just A Few Years But Still A Difference. Pplus The Drop In Sex Drive Will Not Happen On The Cycle- Your Test Is Through The Roof. But It Can Happen. Not Definetely But Can It May Take 3 Days May Take 6 Months Never Know.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 22, 2004)

Luke9583 said:
			
		

> I'm 20, and just got off a cycle of M1T (1st time). Although it did diminish, I dont think I really lost my sex drive on cycle. Is that possible? And I wasn't even using any 4ad.  (20mg/day for 3 weeks)


I'm 26 and almost done with my second week of M1T (now at 20 mg. a day). The only time I want to screw is during the first 3 hours after taking the 4-AD. Without the 4-AD, I would forget what an erection feels like. Luckily, that is not the case. I know at the end of my cycle, my test is going to be negative. I'm considering HCG. Luke, I guess you are still young enough to have that teenage test production going on. I can sure get the job done with the 4-AD, but it has gone from 10 times a week to 2, straight up.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 22, 2004)

Wait, I think I am 27. Holy shit, I forgot. Good night.


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 23, 2004)

12 years of age is pushing it, I???m not surprises. I???m sure if you dig far enough you will also find adult out there 20+ who have screwed themselves up because of PH/PS. This stuff is not for everyone, for some people it will do nothing. Other will regret it for the rest of their life; what can I say, tuff luck.


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 23, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> I'm 26 and almost done with my second week of M1T (now at 20 mg. a day). The only time I want to screw is during the first 3 hours after taking the 4-AD. Without the 4-AD, I would forget what an erection feels like. Luckily, that is not the case. I know at the end of my cycle, my test is going to be negative. I'm considering HCG. Luke, I guess you are still young enough to have that teenage test production going on. I can sure get the job done with the 4-AD, but it has gone from 10 times a week to 2, straight up.



I went for 4 weeks of M1T. First two weeks 5 mg a day, last two weeks 10 mg a day. And I could get it up at will and keep it up, I???m also 18. So here is a case where this tuff shut you down worst then it did me and I???m younger. You did take way more than I did, but at 5 mg a day I saw great gains until my 3rd week when I bumped it up to 10mg. This stuff works wonder for me even at low dosages. The only bad side effect I felt this stuff had on me was some acne that came back and that???s it.  Also I slept less for a few days during the cycle than I usually did, but I think that was more mental than anything else.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 23, 2004)

No, I don't sleep as long. It is physical, not mental. Yeah, I am taking too much. I shouldn't be at 20 mg a day. I think I will back down. Not seeing the gains I had hope for. It's almost been two weeks. I know I got the diet and routine down solid. Maybe, I'll go with a different brand next time. I couldn't get to bed last night after taking 20 mg, but I felt fine. Managed to get 6 hours in, though. Not bad for me. I prefer 7-8. So, Katamaster, if you had a beard and could pass for 20 at age 17, now that you are 18 you must be graying and look 35.    Anyway, at your age, your natural test production is a tad higher than mine. I could feel mine changing in my young 20s. I am 27 now. Therefore, M1T would shut my nuts down faster than yours or the 20 yr old that chimed in earlier. It still works down there, but I can tell when my nuts are not too busy. They are trying to hibernate.


----------



## KataMaStEr (Jul 23, 2004)

LMAO I look older but not that damn much as to look like I???m 35  But I have always been that type of person that looked older than what I really am,  people always use to give that strange look every time I told them my age. What brand of M1T are you taking? I took the one 1fast400 makes and I saw gains come first week I started taking it.


----------



## madden player (Jul 23, 2004)

Personally I can't wait for over the counter steroids to be banned.  People/teens are always going to use drugs for a variety of reasons, but over the counter steroids are too much of a temptation to teens.  When I was a teen and lifting I was sucked in to the crazy marketing claims but there was no full page glossy ads for "steroids".  Personally I probally would have taken them if they were available to me as a teen, a teenager really doesn't know any better (most of them anyway).


----------



## Luke9583 (Jul 23, 2004)

KataMaStEr said:
			
		

> 12 years of age is pushing it, I???m not surprises.


If 12 yr olds are doing roids, they are most likely drinking and not eating properly..... probably drink coke all the time, and never drink water....... .




			
				PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> I would forget what an erection feels like.


I was HOPING for a decreased sex drive.  I have to sit through weekly internation *video confrences,*occasionally sitting next to the president of the company, and even on cycle..... I was pitching tents thinking about my past weekend excursion or something.


----------



## redspy (Jul 23, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> Wait, I think I am 27. Holy shit, I forgot. Good night.


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 23, 2004)

Anyone notice that the kid that asked the question didn't come back? He probably decided that one week was long enough to wait between 1-AD cylces since we never answered his first question. Katamaster, you never had the chance to see if he looks as old as you did last year. Maybe, if he puts enough strain on his endocrine system, he will look old enough to buy beer next year. That would be incentive to never go off cycle. He could pull off some social security fraud at 30 claiming to be a 65 year old woman if he stays on cycle until then. You teenagers...I was just as bad.


----------



## redspy (Jul 23, 2004)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> Anyone notice that the kid that asked the question didn't come back? He probably decided that one week was long enough to wait between 1-AD cylces since we never answered his first question. Katamaster, you never had the chance to see if he looks as old as you did last year. Maybe, if he puts enough strain on his endocrine system, he will look old enough to buy beer next year. That would be incentive to never go off cycle. He could pull off some social security fraud at 30 claiming to be a 65 year old woman if he stays on cycle until then. You teenagers...I was just as bad.



He'll probably head over to bodybuilding.com forums and pose the same question.  He'll get flamed to hell and will take them anyway.  If he comes back a mess post-cycle you must promise not to say "I told you so!", okay?


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 23, 2004)

redspy said:
			
		

> He'll probably head over to bodybuilding.com forums and pose the same question.  He'll get flamed to hell and will take them anyway.  If he comes back a mess post-cycle you must promise not to say "I told you so!", okay?


 He won't get flammed to hell by other teenagers who want scientific studies that provide solid proof before they will believe that they may be putting themselves at considerable risk. People believe what they want to hear.


----------



## Deadly13 (Jul 23, 2004)

I made my desion to not take 1-AD our they any productz good for me now


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 23, 2004)

Deadly13 said:
			
		

> I made my desion to not take 1-AD our they any productz good for me now


There are lots of good supplements, but the most important thing is that you get your diet and training routine down first. Supplements can help, but don't make up for problems in the diet and training areas. You need to learn when to eat what and why, but since you asked about supplements I will address that (as will others). I am glad you came back to read the thread by the way. Whey Protein is a must. Creatine done right can help a lot. Definately get at least 1200 mg of calcium a day in your diet or through supps. Take a multi-vitamin. For the vitamin, every grocery store or pharmacy as a generic equivalent to Centrum for half the price of Centrum. They will say on the bottle something like "compare ingredients to Centrum". These are great. If you have some extra dough to throw around, ZMA works well if used as directed and not taken in a meal with calcium. At 17, you should focus on learning about how to eat right first, though. Go to the diet section of the forum for a plethera of info on that. Another important thing at your age: get plenty of sleep, preferably 8-9 hours at a time. So, the essential supps for you are:

-Whey
-Multi-vitamin
->1200 mg of calcium

Optional, but suggested are:

-Creatine
-ZMA

If you have more $$ to thow around, there are more. For now, stick with basics 1) Workout right 2) Eat right 3) Sleep right. Others will suggest more stuff, so you must prioritize. Let us know how things go.


----------



## Deadly13 (Jul 23, 2004)

Well, I do all those thing besides creatine and ZMA I get all the Protein I need on avg 1.2 grams per body weight and on routines I've being workout out for a long time so I'm on this advance program my personal trainer set up for me its attached to this message but Im on a search for the best product I can buy that wont hurt me??? Thankz everybody for your help


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 23, 2004)

Well, Creatine is certainly the next step. Some people like vasodilators. I use NOX3, and like it a lot. Some people don't get the results I do from it. Read about it here: http://www.massnutrition.com/products.cfm?cur_man=UNIVERSAL NUTRITION&item=UN074 Very safe.


----------



## Deadly13 (Jul 23, 2004)

Thankx I plan on buying that Nox3 Its cheaper then No2 and I heard It works better and i never liked creatine, I've heard great things on ZMA but I dont know if I should buy it because It may be a waste of money since I use Nirto-Tech Nightime


----------



## Pirate! (Jul 24, 2004)

Deadly13 said:
			
		

> Thankx I plan on buying that Nox3 Its cheaper then No2 and I heard It works better and i never liked creatine, I've heard great things on ZMA but I dont know if I should buy it because It may be a waste of money since I use Nirto-Tech Nightime


 At your age, and considering the other supps you take and your program, I'd say don't bother with the ZMA. Why don't you like creatine? Maybe you are not using it right. It is probably the most effective of all the "safe" supplements for mass and strength gains. Yeah, NOX3 is much cheaper than the others. You must take it on an empty stomach. Follow the directions on it, or it doesn't work nearly as well.


----------



## Kirk B (Aug 21, 2010)

*17*

wow just eat eat eat lift lift lift whey protein and kreakalyn   nothing elese dude wat to young i didnt do anything like a prohormone till i was 27


----------

