# Clen+T3...off cycle, before, or after?



## VictorZ06 (Apr 12, 2012)

There are so many different protocols out there, I'm curious as to what methods you use to run clen/t3/keto.

Do you run it before, during, or after an AAS cycle?  Do you taper the T3 and clen?  How do you use it?

I know that recent studies have shown that you don't have to taper the T3, but I have also come across some studies that say there is no need to taper the clen as well (as long as you take keto).  I'm curious to hear what everyone's thoughts are on how to best run these compounds.  A friend of mine is getting ready to run a cycle, and he asked me how to best take clen and T3 as he wants to lose some fat.  I just wanted to check what the newer protocols for the stuff are, as mine may be outdated.  If I had to guess, these compounds would work better if he's ON cycle?  What say you??





/V


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## rage racing (Apr 12, 2012)

I wouldnt run T3/Clen unless I was ON. I would be affraid of loosing to much muscle.


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## PappyMason (Apr 12, 2012)

Those two together caused me massive weight loss even while i was on. I most definitely wouldnt do it without aas


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## Kirk B (Apr 12, 2012)

well clen gives you strength and it's an anticatiboli too , so i run it like that 3 weeks after my last shot i do long esters tho and it leans me out nice i don't lose muscle at all really and i use benadryl helps me sleep better too and you can go 3 week if you take it on your 3rd week , 2 weeks on 2 week off  so i say after for me thats my opinion.  T3 never used so i'm assuming he want's to lose weight so def after imho I never tapered clen before i was fine 



wow VIC I thought you knew every thing lol jk bro but I really did most people go to you for answers i know i have before


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## VictorZ06 (Apr 12, 2012)

Kirk B said:


> wow VIC I thought you knew every thing lol jk bro but I really did most people go to you for answers i know i have before



FAR from it brother....just looking to see who has newer/better/safer protocols.  I rarely run the stuff myself.




/V


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## OfficerFarva (Apr 12, 2012)

Victor's old school, he still believes in that dieting and training stuff..


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## rage racing (Apr 12, 2012)

Kirk B said:


> well clen gives you strength and it's an anticatiboli too , so i run it like that 3 weeks after my last shot i do long esters tho and it leans me out nice i don't lose muscle at all really and i use benadryl helps me sleep better too and you can go 3 week if you take it on your 3rd week , 2 weeks on 2 week off  so i say after for me thats my opinion.  T3 never used so i'm assuming he want's to lose weight so def after imho I never tapered clen before i was fine
> 
> 
> 
> wow VIC I thought you knew every thing lol jk bro but I really did most people go to you for answers i know i have before



Yeah but T3 is very catabolic


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## Caretaker (Apr 12, 2012)

OfficerFarva said:


> Victor's old school, he still believes in that dieting and training stuff..



The way it should be.....but we all cheat a little. LOL

I usually run clen and T3 the last 2 weeks of a cycle and cruise test e for 6 weeks while using clen(2 on, 2 off) and T3 for a total of 8 weeks. Leans you out nice especially if during the 8 weeks you concentrate more on shaping excercises and hardcore cardio(hiking/running with weighted vest, running stadium stairs, etc) and getting hard. 

I`ve never done it but that infomercial on tv(P90x?) or whatever it is looks like it would be great to try during these 8 weeks I just typed about. Just for the cut.


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## VictorZ06 (Apr 12, 2012)

OfficerFarva said:


> Victor's old school, he still believes in that dieting and training stuff..



Yes...I do! 

But, this guy I'm trying to help really isn't that heavy....he wants just wants to use it just to help him get rid of his beer gut...otherwise he's in good shape.  I told him diet and cardio....make those abs/obliques burn and sweat like crazy.  Well, he still isn't happy so he's going to take clen/t3 combo for 4 weeks on/off.  All in spite of my advice....but, I told him I would look into what the best and most effective protocols are now a days.  Now that I think about it, he could lose a few extra pounds.  Maybe tell him to try some intensive cardio work outs...



/V


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## Vibrant (Apr 12, 2012)

I run clen whenever. I use it until I still have a higher temp from it, which is usually around 10 days, then the effects start to diminish for me. I dont taper down at all.

planning to run t3 starting week 4 of my next aas cycle.


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## VictorZ06 (Apr 13, 2012)

Anyone care to post up their protocols??




/V


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## VictorZ06 (Apr 14, 2012)

VictorZ06 said:


> Anyone care to post up their protocols??



I guess not? 




/V


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## littlekev (Apr 14, 2012)

Heres mine=

t3 25mcg day 1-3 just to introduce the chem to my body then bump to 50mcg. I dont go above 50, have before and didnt like sides. usually run day3 50 mcg through week 8 then back to 25mcg for a week then off. 

Clen is a diff story for me. Day 1 60mcg, day 2 80mcg, day 3-6 100mcg, day 6-9 120mcg, day 9 through day 18 140mcg. then day 18-20 80 mcg, day 21 60mcg then off for 2 weeks then back on same protocol. I do the slight drop to 80mcg then 60mcg because if i go from 140 to 0 I feel like hammered shit.

usually run 500 mg test e or p. and some winni 4 weeks on 4 weeks off then repeat. also run 1mg adex ed to keep estro very low and combining that with winni and clen and t3 is a shredding inferno.


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## celticthug (Apr 14, 2012)

i did 25 week 1,50 week 2,and 100 week 3-5.pulled it in week 5.lost 5 lbs that week,and felt weak. i'd bump everyone that says you want to be on when u run it.I used 2 bottles from 2 different reasearch company's.The one i started out with id think was underdosed.Then when i was hitting 100mcg's per day with the 2nd bottle,shit seemed to hit the fan.I let my body recover and gain a couple pounds back.I'm about to try a happy medium this week.I'm thinking no higher than 50mcg's.I have about 8 more weeks of cycle.Thats my first run with it.It works,that's for sure.But it can turn u catabolic.I'm on 2g's a week of gear,and 4,500 cals.You do not want to be too aggresive with it! LOL!


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## Standard Donkey (Apr 14, 2012)

Kirk B said:


> it's an anticatobolic too



highly debated.


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## fsoe (Apr 14, 2012)

VictorZ06 said:


> Anyone care to post up their protocols??
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Here is Mine ...

*Clen* -- start at 40mcg for 2 days - then 80mcg for 2 days - then 100mcg for 2 days - then hit 120mcg for 2-4 days - then 160mcg -- till end of week two --- take 2 weeks off and start back at 120mcg and stay there --- I love Clen ... Use it at start of cycle ---- *use it on my cruises every time the first 2 weeks *--- 

*T3* --- on it now --- Start at 25mcg, stay there for abt 2-3 weeks --- then bump it to 50mcg for about 4 weeks --- then hit 75mcg for a few more weeks --- when I run T3 I usually run it ... T3 works wonders for me, just makes me lethargic sometimes.


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## Zane (Apr 14, 2012)

I ran the super clen GD! 2 wee built up too 150mgs and then dropped down to for a couple. I drank 1-2 galloms a day and did pottasium and taurine? Cramps when lifting were unbelievable glad it was over. Maybe after my blast?


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## msumuscle (Apr 14, 2012)

Do most of you go the research chem route for clen and t3?


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## littlekev (Apr 14, 2012)

msumuscle said:


> Do most of you go the research chem route for clen and t3?



not me, pharma grade t3 and clen or good ugl clen. t3 only pharma grade, dont trust research sites with my thyroid


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## VictorZ06 (Apr 15, 2012)

littlekev said:


> not me, pharma grade t3 and clen or good ugl clen. t3 only pharma grade, dont trust research sites with my thyroid



Yeah....the only T3 I use is Cytomel.  I know a few good research labs that make some damn good clen though.  But I agree, when it comes to T3....I won't use RC or a UGL.




/V


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## OnPoint88 (Nov 4, 2012)

VictorZ06 said:


> Yeah....the only T3 I use is Cytomel.  I know a few good research labs that make some damn good clen though.  But I agree, when it comes to T3....I won't use RC or a UGL.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just found this in a google search, I wonder how accurate it is?

If you are using the (60mcg T3/20mcg T4) pills you should take them like this.

Days 1, 2 & 3 - Take a 1/2 a tablet per day
Days 4 ,5 & 6 - Take a whole tablet per day
Days 7 - 15 - Take 1.5 tablets per day
Days 16, 17 & 18 - Reduce to 1 tablet per day
Days 19, 20 & 21 - Reduce to 1/2 a tablet per day

Then stop for three weeks.

If you are using the 100mcg Tablets you should take them like this.

Days 1 & 2 - Take 1/4 of a tablet per day
Days 3 & 4 - Take a 1/2 of a tablet per day
Days 4, 5 & 6 - Take 3/4 of a tablet per day
Days 7 - 14 - Take 1 tablet per day
Days 15, 16 & 17 - Reduce to 3/4 of a tablet per day
Days 18 & 19 - Reduce to 1/2 of a tablet per day
Days 20 & 21 - Reduce to 1/4 of a tablet per day

Then stop for three weeks.

Of course if you are using the expensive 25mcg Tablets the you can use this same cycle, but each 1/4 tablet = 1 x 25mcg tablet.

Remember? even if you are using Ketotifen (which allows longer use of Clenbuterol) the maximum cycle of T3 is three weeks.


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## overburdened (Nov 4, 2012)

VictorZ06 said:


> There are so many different protocols out there, I'm curious as to what methods you use to run clen/t3/keto.
> 
> Do you run it before, during, or after an AAS cycle?  Do you taper the T3 and clen?  How do you use it?
> 
> ...



I would def run the t3 only if on cycle....  I prefer ECA over clen, but it's all a matter of choice... you don't need to taper the clen, I would like to see the study you are referring to regarding the t3(not having to taper) cause It is one of those compounds that is VERY important TO taper it in order to avoid any chances of thyroid storm, and if you just drop it(and you are taking a decent dose) you can cause all the hair on your body and head to fall out...  It's one of those strange sides that T3 can have...   It is not necessary if you are only using ed, but anything over 50, I would taper... even if it is a short taper, it should still be done.

The keto def helps with making the clen work better, it makes some people a little lethargic(as it is an antihystamine), the t3 can also make you lethargic to a degree(largely dose dependent) especially on caloric deficit....

I've found a simple cycle containing test/EQ/drol tends to work VERY well when using t3, to avoid losing any muscle... If calories aren't too low, you can actually gain muscle with that combo of comps even...  Drol is one of the best orals to diet on(it doesn't give the 'finished' look, but it is awesome at helping maintain lean mass, and even gain lean mass while dieting...).. Then you can switch to one of the more 'common' dieting orals, such as var or winny or halo at the end of the cycle to attain the 'finished' look...

Just my $.02


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## overburdened (Nov 4, 2012)

rage racing said:


> Yeah but T3 is very catabolic


t3 is actually ANABOLIC(in the right dose... which is FAR lower than the dose used to cut up quickly)... but, in higher doses(50mcg+/day), it does become quite catabolic, simply because it causes a massive deficit in calories that are usable by the body(it burns off a ton, leaving less for muscle to survive with)...  when running t3, it is best to actually keep a caloric excess, and use cardio to make the deficit... this will keep it from burning off muscle....

Check out the PDR(physicians desk reference... it's the book  that contains all the info on EVERY prescription medication), it is listed as being 'anabolic'...  this is the main reason dr's prescribe t3 to women only and they generally prescribe t4 to men that are hypothyroid(because god forbid they give a man anything anabolic.. they might get too big, and have a performance enhancing 'edge' over someone else!!!), this has nothing to do at all with the type of hypothyroid problems a man or woman may have, it is just one of those precedence that was set back in the day(when they taught Dr's that anything anabolic should NEVER be prescribed to a man!  yet they can prescribe halotestin to a woman....go figure!)


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## overburdened (Nov 4, 2012)

Here is a good protocol for a person like you are describing....

t3(5weeks)(I would recommend running anabolics with it.. highly recommend it!... start the t3 AFTER blood levels are saturated with the anabolics..... so week 3-4 if using enanthate... if he starts with prop and enanth, to take advantage of the beginning of the cycle, he could start at beginning of week 2(esp if he uses drol the first 6 weeks of the cycle... this would get him a week on drol and carry the drol through the entire t3 protocol)
50mcg ed/75mcg ed/75mcg ed/50mcg ed/25mcg  ed

clen/keto
2 weeks on, 1 week off, 2 weeks on(start at same time as starting t3)
with the clen, I would start at 20-40mcg and run it up till he starts to see sides, then pull it back by 20mcg.... then every 5 days add 20mcg, so he will add 40mcg by the time the two weeks is up....
the second two weeks, he can start at 20mcg higher than he used as titrated dose(the dose right below the sides....), then add each 5 days like first time...


anabolics...
week 1-2
prop 100mg ed
enanth 100mg ed
drol 100mg ed(can go higher if wants, but probably not necessary unless he is trying to gain some lean mass at the same time)
EQ 2000mg(frontload first two weeks)

week 3-6
enanth 800-1000mg
drol 100mg ed
EQ 800-1000mg

week 7-9
enanth 800mg
EQ 800mg

week 10
enanth 800mg
EQ 800mg
var 100mg ed

weeks 11-12
prop 100mg ed or 200mg eod
var 150mg ed

then start pct one week after last prop inj.... you can carry the var til the day before pct...

If he is a novice user, he doesn't really need that high of dosages on the injectables...  I would keep them reasonably high though, just so he doesn't lose ANY muscle!  He should lean out VERY well doing something like this and having a clean diet, as well as doing cardio(fasted in morning, and again post workout... 45 min in am, 30min post workout)

AI and serms should be used as well as liver supps......  I didn't line them out in there, I'm sure you are plenty capable of taking care of that part for him....

Good luck Vic.. hope this helps a little


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## OnPoint88 (Nov 4, 2012)

overburdened said:


> Here is a good protocol for a person like you are describing....
> 
> t3(5weeks)(I would recommend running anabolics with it.. highly recommend it!... start the t3 AFTER blood levels are saturated with the anabolics..... so week 3-4 if using enanthate... if he starts with prop and enanth, to take advantage of the beginning of the cycle, he could start at beginning of week 2(esp if he uses drol the first 6 weeks of the cycle... this would get him a week on drol and carry the drol through the entire t3 protocol)
> 50mcg ed/75mcg ed/75mcg ed/50mcg ed/25mcg  ed
> ...



I wouldnt use EQ to cut and over 100mg of drol seems to be a waste. I think var and dbol together are better than drol alone.


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