# local UGL vs Asia Pharm, Gen-shi..etc



## crab107 (Feb 14, 2013)

Which gear is better to run. I've noticed a large price difference between these..some local ugl have test for $35-40, the overseas sites have test for $100-150. Whts the difference? Is it human grade vs ugl? Is it better quality?


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## hoyle21 (Feb 14, 2013)

It's more consistent and better quality.   Especially the Asia Pharma.   Very high quality!


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 14, 2013)

UGL 
Underground Steroid Labs, UGL - YouTube

HUMAN GEAR
Anabolic steroids Injection manufacturing by ASIAPHARMA - YouTube


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## Laborer (Feb 14, 2013)

Asia pharm test cyp is very smooth, I can say the same for Euro Pharm that PSL carries.


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## nspaletta (Feb 14, 2013)

You find a good ugl that you can trust and the quality is just as good as from real human grade gear like icn and Watson. Asia pharma is nothing special especially for the price you pay. I get great anabolics for a third of the price that I would take anyway with no worries


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## Laborer (Feb 14, 2013)

nspaletta said:


> You find a good ugl that you can trust and the quality is just as good as from real human grade gear like icn and Watson. Asia pharma is nothing special especially for the price you pay. I get great anabolics for a third of the price that I would take anyway with no worries



I agree with you Bro there are some good local UGL's out there, I use to have one that was very consistent. Then one day POOF GONE! Sucked but I had other avenues to use but his price was killer and gear was awesome. AP gear is great, expensive yes but very smooth and no pip. Try some PSL Euro-Pharm, just like my watson smooth,no pip,priced right, also avail dom.


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## independent (Feb 14, 2013)

Asia pharma is an ugl btw.


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## nspaletta (Feb 14, 2013)

Yes Asia pharma is an ugl so everyone knows. A good one but not worth the money in my opinion. There are some great ugl that are consistent and cheap look around some boards and you'll find them.


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## Z499 (Feb 14, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Asia pharma is an ugl btw.



So is gen-shi


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## Standard Donkey (Feb 14, 2013)

don't be swayed by the bullshit scare tactics that WP is for some reason allowed to pull around here 


go with UGL or crash your natural production and get a script from your doc


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## Laborer (Feb 14, 2013)

No I fully understand ap is a ugl along with ep and others, just comparing to the watson I have used smooth and  no pip. Most of us have used a UGL that has given us some pip, left us dragging our leg, or sittin on one cheek.


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## ordawg1 (Feb 14, 2013)

AP gear is excellent-clean and properly dosed each and every batch.-OD
ADD-there are also very classy UGLS with integrity that do a stellar job. Do we want to talk about quality of raws at this point ?


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## nspaletta (Feb 14, 2013)

Ap is very good clean gear I never said they weren't. But I would much rather get maybe some defiant or stranger or mts at half the price and equal quality. That's all I'm saying


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## longworthb (Feb 14, 2013)

Chose a reputable ugl is all I can say. Better safe then sorry


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

*One more time for all who knwo who what is ugl or gmp and fda and who...

ASIA PHARMA IS NOT UGL AND ITS GMP MADE AND THAILAND FDA APPORVED!

hope Mike Arnold can explain to you as he already did few times...

But guys who are sponsors from UGL soruces,will always hate AP and talk AP is ugl,then also Organon,Norma is UGL *


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## crab107 (Feb 15, 2013)

Thanks guys. Ive been using one of the local sponsors from the board here...and so far everything is lookin ok 10 days in on tren a/dbol/test e cycle against suggetions not to..lol. been runnin the test e for a little longer, 3 weeks, feelin good, gettin killer pumps, strength and size starting to come on to.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

crab107 said:


> Which gear is better to run. I've noticed a large price difference between these..some local ugl have test for $35-40, the overseas sites have test for $100-150. Whts the difference? Is it human grade vs ugl? Is it better quality?



Whether or not the gear comes from overseas or domestic has nothing to do with its qaulity.  I am assuming you are looking at a particular overseas company called World-Pharma.  I am not going to spend a lot of time going into all the differences between the typical UGL and WP, but I will cover the basics.


First of all, there is a difference between a product being "FDA approved" and products which conform to FDA manufacturing guidelines.  Any product can be produced following FDA manufacturing guidelines, but that doesn't necessarily mean the product itself is FDA approved.  Before a drug can even be considered as an FDA approved product, it must be approved for human use by the country in which it produced.   Many steroids are not approved for human use in the U.S., such as Trenbolone and Dianabol (Dianabol was at one point, but no longer) and therefore, they can never be considered FDA approved products.  However, any steroid can be made under GMP guidelines, which means the product was produced in a manner accepted by the FDA as standard for all pharmacuetical drugs.  The U.S. government mandates that any product sold as a pharmacuetical drug must be produced under GMP guidelines.  It is a method of ensuring quality control.

WP sells a variety of brands, all of which are produced under GMP guidelines.  This includes AsiaPharma and others.  Some of his stock are sourced from foreign pharmaceutical companies, such as the Primobolan made by Schering-Plough (the best of the best) and Indian made Sustanon.  Regardless of brand, all products come from well known pharmacies or pharmaceutical compounding facilities. 

In contrast, UGL's can manufacurer steroids in any manner they choose.  OD is correct in stating that some UGL's do indeed run their business professionally, implementing strict quality control guidelines...but on the other hand, many do not.  I have known of some cookers (the person responsible for making UGL gear) filling capsules and filling vials while shitting on the toilet.  There is a reason so many people end up getting infections and abcesses (or worse) from some UGL gear.  In addition to contaminants, there is no gaurantee of proper dosing, as product quality is 100% dependent on the raw materials purchased by the UGL...and if you think every UGL is personally lab testing every batch for purity & potency, I will have a big laugh at that one.

So yes, WP does cost more than the typical UGL, but there is a reason for it.  The bottom line is that WP pays significantly more money to purchase a pharmaceutical drug from a foreign country, than it does for a UGL to purchase an equivalent amount of raw material from China.  Whether or not you choose to buy from WP will depend in many factors, finances being cheif among them, but you should at least know WHY you are seeing a price differetial between WP products and most UGL's.


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## nspaletta (Feb 15, 2013)

I definitely am not bashing them at or or would I ever I'm sure the products are of perfect quality. I'm just saying way over priced. 

For instance...why pay so much for eq when I can get peso pesado from the vet which is the purest eq for a third of the cost? Or I can get the actual amps for much cheaper. That's all I am saying. 

Either way I'm sure he has a great rep and line and that's good for him.


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## jay_steel (Feb 15, 2013)

this is one of the reason why i started going through SFY, i use to be good friends with an owner of a UGL until i watched my tren being cooked in a non steril environment while he was cooking beacon with greese flying all over the place and ect. Then he pulled the tren off and told me to look into it and check out the color. At that point I lost all interest in pinning the gear, due to if any shit has got into the gear.


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> So yes, WP does cost more than the typical UGL, but there is a reason for it.  The bottom line is that WP pays significantly more money to purchase a pharmaceutical drug from a foreign country, than it does for a UGL to purchase an equivalent amount of raw material from China.  Whether or not you choose to buy from WP will depend in many factors, finances being cheif among them, but you should at least know WHY you are seeing a price differetial between WP products and most UGL's.



When it come to pricing and quality, what you just said is completely false. I just paid 60.00 for a bottle of phizer depo-test. American pharm companies are the most expensive and have the strictest guidelines.
Now once again let me hear you justify why ap gear is so expensive?


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## hoyle21 (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> When it come to pricing and quality, what you just said is completely false. I just paid 60.00 for a bottle of phizer depo-test. American pharm companies are the most expensive and have the strictest guidelines.
> Now once again let me hear you justify why ap gear is so expensive?



Where at?   My Watson is 112 without insurance at rite aid.   Of course I get for 12 bucks.


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## jay_steel (Feb 15, 2013)

^^^ i need to do this... Your dr. allows your to pin at home? mine will only do office visits.


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

hoyle21 said:


> Where at?   My Watson is 112 without insurance at rite aid.   Of course I get for 12 bucks.



Costco. No insurance.


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

Here we go again 

where is the factory they produce it?


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## ordawg1 (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> When it come to pricing and quality, what you just said is completely false. I just paid 60.00 for a bottle of phizer depo-test. American pharm companies are the most expensive and have the strictest guidelines.
> Now once again let me hear you justify why ap gear is so expensive?



And we all KNOW the USFDA does a STELLAR job.They are govt workers like our post office.I feel safer now-lol-OD


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## hoyle21 (Feb 15, 2013)

jay_steel said:


> ^^^ i need to do this... Your dr. allows your to pin at home? mine will only do office visits.



Yup.  200mgs/week.   At home.


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

ordawg1 said:


> And we all KNOW the USFDA does a STELLAR job.They are govt workers like our post office.I feel safer now-lol-OD



I see you didnt answer the question. Because you cant.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

mike arnold said:


> whether or not the gear comes from overseas or domestic has nothing to do with its qaulity.  I am assuming you are looking at a particular overseas company called world-pharma.  I am not going to spend a lot of time going into all the differences between the typical ugl and wp, but i will cover the basics.
> 
> 
> First of all, there is a difference between a product being "fda approved" and products which conform to fda manufacturing guidelines.  Any product can be produced following fda manufacturing guidelines, but that doesn't necessarily mean the product itself is fda approved.  Before a drug can even be considered as an fda approved product, it must be approved for human use by the country in which it produced.   Many steroids are not approved for human use in the u.s., such as trenbolone and dianabol (dianabol was at one point, but no longer) and therefore, they can never be considered fda approved products.  However, any steroid can be made under gmp guidelines, which means the product was produced in a manner accepted by the fda as standard for all pharmacuetical drugs.  The u.s. Government mandates that any product sold as a pharmacuetical drug must be produced under gmp guidelines.  It is a method of ensuring quality control.
> ...



*
great read,smart guys will understand..kids and idiots will say bs! *


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

I keep hearing about all these abcesses.  With the amount of ugl Gear users on this site and given that "so many people end up getting infections and abcesses (or worse) from some UGL gear".  You would think that the Anabolic section would be riddled with people with abcess questions.  

Instead you get a lot of PIP questions and and false alarms? 

But wp *(no denying his gear is good)* would have you believe its alot more prevalant than it is.  I have nothing against WP and have almost pulled the trigger a couple times.........  That aquabolic has been calling my name for some time now.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> When it come to pricing and quality, what you just said is completely false. I just paid 60.00 for a bottle of phizer depo-test. American pharm companies are the most expensive and have the strictest guidelines.
> Now once again let me hear you justify why ap gear is so expensive?



Whooooah, buddy.  Slow down a bit.  First of all, I don't work for WP...and I wasn't justying anything.  I was simply sttating a basic fact, which is that pharm-grade/GMP made gear is more costly than Chinese powders...and that products which fall in this category have stricter quality control guidelines in place.  How you can argue with that is beyond me.  Obviously, you are making assumptions about things I never said.  Otherwise, you wouldn't be atempting to refute this basic truth.  

So, what I said about quality & pricing of pharm-grade/GMP gear in comparisn to UGL gear, is absolutely correct.  if you deny that, you're either no too smart...or you are a troll.  before I jump to conclusions, let me ask you if that's what you really believe.  Do you believe Chinese powders cost as much to make and purchase as pharm-grade/GMP produced gear?  If so, you're smoking crack, buddy!  Also, do you really think the Chinese powders are made with the same level of quality control as a phamarceutical grade drug...or any drug made under GMP guidelines?  Again, if so, you're smoking crack.  If you can't understand this basic truth, something is wrong with you.

Before I end, I just want to point out that the only thing you said in your entire post, which you apparently think contradicts my statement, is that you paid $60 for your vial of depo testosterone and American pharmacies have the strictest guidelines.  that;s all you aid.  For one, no one ever said American Pharmacies don't have the strictest guidelines...because they do, although several other European countries rival the U.S. in this respect.  So, I don't really understand how that contradicts my post.  Two, I can tell you with 100% certainty that most testosterone sold on U.S pharmacies (without insuarance), including generics, cost between $90-$130 dollars per 10 ml vial.  This includes numerous big-name pharmacies and stretches across several regions...perhaps even nationwide.  I have a prescription for Depo-testosterone...have for over 10 yars now...and I have checked numerous pharmacies all over my state (Ohio, not exactly know for extravagent living costs) in order to find the lowest price.  I have also contacted numerous compounding pharmacies in and out of state, almost all of which fell in that price range.  So, if you are getting your "brand-name" Phizer depo-testosterone (2 gram vial) for $60, that is awesome and I would ike you to tell me where you are getting it, so I can get it myself.  I have no problem ordering from out of state or using a compounding pharmacy.  If you want to confirm the average cost of testosterone at the typical pharmacy, I can provide phone numbers a dozen big-name pharms over the north-eastern United States, all of which will quote you a price within that range, including generics.

Just a little tip.  Next time, try to stay on topic...and when attempting to argue with someone, at least make sure your argument is applicable to the point at hand!  Otherwise, you are only doing yourself a disservice, as it makes you look like either a troll, someone who responds to posts before fully reading them, or someone who is lacking in intelligence.  Quite frankly, based on your irrelevant argument, I am leaing towards the latter, but this could just be an off day for you.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

hoyle21 said:


> Where at?   My Watson is 112 without insurance at rite aid.   Of course I get for 12 bucks.



Exactly,...this kid is talking out of his ass!  I pay $120 without insuarance...and I have checked pharmacuies and compounding pharms all over the country...and that includes generics!  I am glad you posted this...because if this kid is only paying $60 for his "name-brand" test (his mommy probably picks up his script each time and uses her insurance without him even knowing, which means he has shitty insusrance...LOL) i want to know where so i can get that deal too!


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> Whooooah, buddy.  Slow down a bit.  First of all, I don't work for WP...and I wasn't justying anything.  I was simply sttating a basic fact, which is that pharm-grade/GMP made gear is more costly than Chinese powders...and that products which fall in this category have stricter quality control guidelines in place.  How you can argue with that is beyond me.  Obviously, you are making assumptions about things I never said.  Otherwise, you wouldn't be atempting to refute this basic truth.
> 
> So, what I said about quality & pricing of pharm-grade/GMP gear in comparisn to UGL gear, is absolutely correct.  if you deny that, you're either no too smart...or you are a troll.  before I jump to conclusions, let me ask you if that's what you really believe.  Do you believe Chinese powders cost as much to make and purchase as pharm-grade/GMP produced gear?  If so, you're smoking crack, buddy!  Also, do you really think the Chinese powders are made with the same level of quality control as a phamarceutical grade drug...or any drug made under GMP guidelines?  Again, if so, you're smoking crack.  If you can't understand this basic truth, something is wrong with you.
> 
> ...



 You obviously didnt understand my post. The cost of ap gear cannot be justified because of its fda gmp quality. American made test doesnt even cost that much on the high end. You cant tell me gear made in thailand which is a shithole rivals the u.s.

Get your script at costco btw. Want me scan the reciept for you?


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> You obviously didnt understand my post. The cost of ap gear cannot be justified because of its fda gmp quality. American made test doesnt even cost that much on the high end. You cant tell me gear made in thailand which is a shithole rivals the u.s.
> 
> Get your script at costco btw. Want me scan the reciept for you?




Dear guy, Asia Pharma is not made in Thailand...
*My now offer buy 5 get 5 free come out 10ml gear from 75-88$ ...so..dont say expensive!*


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

jay_steel said:


> ^^^ i need to do this... Your dr. allows your to pin at home? mine will only do office visits.



You need to get a new doctor, buddy...right away!  Any doctor who will not allow a grown man on TRT to inject himself at home is ONLY intrested in maximizing his profits, as he knows he can charge you (or your insurance, rather) a small fortune by seeing him every week or two.  He is making a pretty penny off your ass (no pun intended), just to do 2 minutes or work.  It is completely unreasnable to expect a man who is on life-long TRT to see hin in the office every 2 weeks for your "shot".  That is pure hogshit and a completely selfish decision on his part.  In fact, I would go so far as to say it unethical.  It is VERY common and VERY normal for millions of people across the U.S, including TRT patients, to administer their own injects at home when using a life-long medication.  The ONLY doctors who would oppose that are the ones more concerned with their bank account than what is in your best interest.  I don't care how "nice" this guys seems to be when you speak with him.  He probably is "nice" because he knows he is more likely to continue fucking you up the ass each week if he treats you well...all the while charging your insurance the price of a regular office vist for 2 minutes of his time (or his assitant's time; even worse).


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> Whooooah, buddy.  Slow down a bit.  First of all, I don't work for WP...and I wasn't justying anything.  I was simply sttating a basic fact, which is that pharm-grade/GMP made gear is more costly than Chinese powders...and that products which fall in this category have stricter quality control guidelines in place.  How you can argue with that is beyond me.  Obviously, you are making assumptions about things I never said.  Otherwise, you wouldn't be atempting to refute this basic truth.
> 
> So, what I said about quality & pricing of pharm-grade/GMP gear in comparisn to UGL gear, is absolutely correct.  if you deny that, you're either no too smart...or you are a troll.  before I jump to conclusions, let me ask you if that's what you really believe.  Do you believe Chinese powders cost as much to make and purchase as pharm-grade/GMP produced gear?  If so, you're smoking crack, buddy!  Also, do you really think the Chinese powders are made with the same level of quality control as a phamarceutical grade drug...or any drug made under GMP guidelines?  Again, if so, you're smoking crack.  If you can't understand this basic truth, something is wrong with you.
> 
> ...






For someone who seems to enjoy writing your comprehension is lacking.  

You clearly stated that WP gear cost more because of the guidelines used to make it and the cost of the operation.

He clearly stated that his US FDA approved gear cost significantly less.  And with your given explanation as to why asia pharm gear cost more his gear should cost even more possibly double cause the process, guidelines and cost of manufacturing are higher here.  Which should bamboozal you and your explanation.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> I see you didnt answer the question. Because you cant.



Not only do you have no idea who you are talking to...you also sound dumb as hell.  

What is with this board?  I have seen more retards over here in 2 weeks than I have on some other boards in a year...LOL.  However, the great members we do have balance it out for the rest of us.  :0.  Serioulsy though...it seems we attract a new retard every few days.  Haha.


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## jay_steel (Feb 15, 2013)

i dont get AAS from him, still get it from my source, but I have been thinking about doing it for my cruising dosage. I just think it would be a pain in the ass to get my test levels low again for blood work for him and ect when I want to compete and it might interfere with planned cycles.


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> Not only do you have no idea who you are talking to...you also sound dumb as hell.
> 
> What is with this board?  I have seen more retards over here in 2 weeks than I have on some other boards in a year...LOL.  However, the great members we do have balance it out for the rest of us.  :0.  Serioulsy though...it seems we attract a new retard every few days.  Haha.




Yeah there was this guy like last week suggesting tren to noobs.......WTF


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## hoyle21 (Feb 15, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> Dear guy, Asia Pharma is not made in Thailand...
> *My now offer buy 5 get 5 free come out 10ml gear from 75-88$ ...so..dont say expensive!*



Which is completely in range with other international suppliers.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> I keep hearing about all these abcesses.  With the amount of ugl Gear users on this site and given that "so many people end up getting infections and abcesses (or worse) from some UGL gear".  You would think that the Anabolic section would be riddled with people with abcess questions.
> 
> Instead you get a lot of PIP questions and and false alarms?
> 
> But wp *(no denying his gear is good)* would have you believe its alot more prevalant than it is.  I have nothing against WP and have almost pulled the trigger a couple times.........  That aquabolic has been calling my name for some time now.



I guess it depends on what you consider common.  Abcesses don't occur that frequently...and many people go their entire life injecting UGL gear without any major problems, but it does happen on occasion...and is more prevalent with the less professional (and less caring) UGL's.  Fortunately, we have several very good UGL's out there who go to great lengths to ensure their products approach pharma-garde to the best of theur ability.  By sticiking with tried & true UGL's over the years, I have NEVER had an infection or abcess in my life, depsite a ton of injections.  If you look into the scene a bit, it is relatively easy to find the good guys, drastically eliminating the possibility of ending up with an abcess/infection.  Lastly, we should not discount the fact that in many cases, abcesses and infections are due to improper injection practices (lack of proper sterilization prior to injecting).


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> You obviously didnt understand my post. The cost of ap gear cannot be justified because of its fda gmp quality. American made test doesnt even cost that much on the high end. You cant tell me gear made in thailand which is a shithole rivals the u.s.
> 
> Get your script at costco btw. Want me scan the reciept for you?



Yes, I completely understood your post.  You took my post out of context and put words in my mouth, which I don't apprecaite.  Everything I stated in my post was true, but you decided to start an argument which previously did not exist.


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> Dear guy, Asia Pharma is not made in Thailand...
> *My now offer buy 5 get 5 free come out 10ml gear from 75-88$ ...so..dont say expensive!*



Now were talking. So where is ap made?


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> Yes, I completely understood your post.  You took my post out of context and put words in my mouth, which I don't apprecaite.  Everything I stated in my post was true, but you decided to start an argument which previously did not exist.



Did you call costco yet? Dont want to look stupid again?


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## ordawg1 (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> I see you didnt answer the question. Because you cant.



I actually did answer you Moe.I am not into arguing or flaming-just giving my perspectiv for the OP to evaluate.I have NOTHING against UGL and have probably been around this since many of you were born.As for Thailand being a shit hole-I suppose parts are and other parts are not-just like the USA.I have no dog in this fight and my main concern is members get factual information.I DO know a "lil" about testing protocol both with bloodtest and other.I have also spent time in Thailand and other countries observing operations.
I am "assumming" you have used WP prods -tested-evaluated and are not happy ? That being the case-a prudent person would move on or settle up with the man.This is called " doing business" .At one time Hoyle had an issue with WP and was very vocal about said situation.It appears he has had a change of heart ? Perhaps PM him as he is an intelligent member and might be worth your time.Best of luck with your endeavors-Enough Said-Thank You-OD


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

ordawg1 said:


> I actually did answer you Moe.I am not into arguing or flaming-just giving my perspectiv for the OP to evaluate.I have NOTHING against UGL and have probably been around this since many of you were born.As for Thailand being a shit hole-I suppose parts are and other parts are not-just like the USA.I have no dog in this fight and my main concern is members get factual information.I DO know a "lil" about testing protocol both with bloodtest and other.I have also spent time in Thailand and other countries observing operations.
> I am "assumming" you have used WP prods -tested-evaluated and are not happy ? That being the case-a prudent person would move on or settle up with the man.This is called " doing business" .At one time Hoyle had an issue with WP and was very vocal about said situation.It appears he has had a change of heart ? Perhaps PM him as he is an intelligent member and might be worth your time.Best of luck with your endeavors-Enough Said-Thank You-OD



My point is the cost cannot be justified weather its human grade or a ugl.


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## hoyle21 (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> My point is the cost cannot be justified weather its human grade or a ugl.



Lets just say it's the best UGL around for arguments sake.   If you wait for a sale is $75 that out of line for a schedule III pharmaceutical with no prescription?


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> Dear guy, Asia Pharma is not made in Thailand...
> *My now offer buy 5 get 5 free come out 10ml gear from 75-88$ ...so..dont say expensive!*





hoyle21 said:


> Lets just say it's the best UGL around for arguments sake.   If you wait for a sale is $75 that out of line for a schedule III pharmaceutical with no prescription?


No. But there is another vendor that sells ap cyp for 60.00.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

*My comments are in bold, below...
*


skinnyguy180 said:


> For someone who seems to enjoy writing your comprehension is lacking.
> *I would counter by stating the opposite.
> *
> You clearly stated that WP gear cost more because of the guidelines used to make it and the cost of the operation.
> ...








*Like I said previously, I was not justfying the "price" of any products WP sells, I was ONLY stating why they cost more than chinese made powders. That's it....period.  Bringing up a botle of depo test is irrelevant as to whether or not pharm-grade/GMP made gear costs more than Chinese powders. 

Since vitrualy ALL 10 ml vials of test cost between about $100-$130 without insuarance in the United states, incluidng generics, I can only assume that he is buying his test from a place which runs a special program, much like Walmart nows offers Humulin R for only $24, while every other pharmacy still sells it for between $50-$60.  His $60 price does NOT reflect the averge price for testosterone in the U.S. and it certainly does NOT represent the average cost of other American made steroids...not by a FUCKING LONGSHOT!    So, if you want to compare gear...then start comparing the same gear...and let's begin to look at the prices of various American made steroids in comparison to WP gear.

Let's begin with Anadrol.  American-made Anadrol costs about $20 per FUCKING PILL!   Nandrolone Decanoate cost Hundreds of dollars per 10 ml vial.   Anavar costs many hundreds of dollars for just 500 mg's of gear.  Winstrol also costs hundreds for a 10 ml vial.  That is whole Lot more money than what WP charges for his pharm-grade/GMP gear.  Are you still following along?  I hope so, because by using that $60 price tag (wholly un-typical of American made gear) to argue that American steroids cost less than WP pharm-grade/GMP gear, you are showing YOUR idiocy! The typical American made steroid costs a mothefucking fortune...and this $60 price tag is in NO WAY reflective of the average cost of American steroids.  So, don't even begin to tell me that WP charges more than Amerian pharmacies...because you would be fucking wrong, son!

Now, WP sells several different brands of gear, all of which are either pharm-grade or GMP, but even then, the price fo different products can vary enomously.   For example, Schering made Primobolan is going to cost more to make and purchase than many other steroids.  Taking this into consideration, WP only charges about $70-$80 per vial, which is WAY fucking less than the average American made steroid equivalent.  There is no way in fuck you will find ANY American made steroids, aside from his special program $60 test, which even begin to compare to what WP charges. Quite honestly, this post of your surprises me.  I figured you had the ability to look at the bigger picture.  Instead, you use a solitary, non-typical example of American gear as the basis for stating that WP charges more than American pharms and you then used that example to slam WP's prices.  NOT smart. Get your shit together...I expect more out of you.

In conclusion, paying $70-$80 per vials is not bad AT ALL, especially when you take into consideration the fact that there ARE greater costs involved.  Anyone with any knowledge of this industry understands that chinese powders are the VERY cheapest way to buy and make steroids, which is why so many UGL's purchase from these chinese facilities.  Think about it...if it was cheaper to import gear from foreign pharmacies or produce steroids using GMP guidelines than it was to buy chinese powders, don't you think every UGL in the world would be doing it?  Damn...this is getting tiring...and this argument is about to come to a close, as I will not put up with anymore bullshit from people who don't have a clue what they are talking about.  No on else will be slamming WP anymore either...he is a paying sponsor and has abided within the rules of his sponsorship.  If you don't want to pay the $70-$80 dollars per vial he charges, then don't...but please refrain from spewing out these bullshit statements, asking why WP charges more for his gear than American Pharamacies do, when that is clearly a motherfucking joke.*


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

jay_steel said:


> i dont get AAS from him, still get it from my source, but I have been thinking about doing it for my cruising dosage. I just think it would be a pain in the ass to get my test levels low again for blood work for him and ect when I want to compete and it might interfere with planned cycles.




I hear ya'.  That is a decision only you can make.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Did you call costco yet? Dont want to look stupid again?



Read post above.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> My point is the cost cannot be justified weather its human grade or a ugl.




Sure it can...see post above.  You have simply been unable (or unwilling) to see the bigger picture.  $70-$80 per vial is really not bad at all, considering it does cost more to make/buy than steroida derived from Chinese powders.  Being that WP alays has sales running and is more than willing to make sure his customers are happy, prices like this pop up all the time.  You certainly don't expect pharm-grade/GMP gear to cost as little as gear made fom chinese powders, do you.  If you read my post above, you would see that Aerican steroids cost far, far more than WP gear...and WP gear costs just a bit more than most UGL gear.  it all line sup pretty well.  Well, at least it lines upo with Chinese powder and WP gear.  American steroids...now that is an absolute atrocity.  There is absolutely no way to justify the price of Amerian gear.  $20 per Anadrol tab...hundreds of dollars for a single vial of deca or Winstrol...many hundreds for 500 mg of Var....and I could go on.  Those prices are ridcululous, but at $70-$80 a pop, WP prices are pretty decent for what you get.  Now, whether someone feels it is worth paying those few extra dollars will depend on several factors, but this vendetta you have against WP is completely misguided.  Failing to see the bigger picture in this comparison has caused you to evaluate the situation incorrectly.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Now were talking. So where is ap made?




Now were talking?  It has ALWAYS been this way!  This entire time you have been blasting the hell out of WP, making these off the wall comparisons...and now you say..."now were talking" because you finally realize what the prices are?


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> Yeah there was this guy like last week suggesting tren to noobs.......WTF



Yeah, you took a hard ass-slamming in that thread...perhaps we should place the link here for others to read?  We should start at the top.  What do you say...would you like to re-open some of those arguments, specifically the one regarding trenbolone and prolactin?  I let it go and actually forgot you were even the one saying that stuff, but apparently your resentment over the ass-pounding you took still has you a little sore toward me?


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> Read post above.



Did you call costco. Didnt think so.


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## nspaletta (Feb 15, 2013)

Look simply put wp has good quality gear. We all get that. Us pharmacy gear is good quality as well I've ran Watson cyp for over a year before. Now the ugl I use right now his cyp is just as good as Watson and I pay $70 for 2ml. I was just saying you can't find good quality for cheaper we are lucky to have so many ugl around that take pride in there quality


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## vannesb (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> I see you didnt answer the question. Because you cant.



Are you kidding!  Since you have been around awhile I would think you would already have new that he knows his shit when it comes to AAS testing being one of them..


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Did you call costco. Didnt think so.



I did answer you...I typed out my response in the post above.  I already told you this.  Sorry that I didn't feel like re-typing the entire thing.  Jeeesh, cut me  a break. 

 However, I am wondering why you have COMPLELTLY ignored EVERY post I have put up in response to your comments?   Since you wanted to engage me in this debate, you should at least 'respond' to what I wrote, but you will never do that...just like skinny guy wouldn't last week...because you know damn well you will be holding your knees by the end of it.  

You have put up multiple posts now directed specifically towards me, asking me several questions, all of which I responded to...yet you have ignored every single response I posted up.  Telling, isn't it?  You can't play these games here and get away with it, kid.  We all see through it.  Ignoring someone response and then continuing to re-post the same question over and over as if the other person did not respond is an old-school tactic which does NOT work.  It shines a bright light on your brutal failure to win this argument.  You would have been better off posting nothing...at least then people "might" have thought you left the thread before seeing it.  Try again.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

nspaletta said:


> Look simply put wp has good quality gear. We all get that. Us pharmacy gear is good quality as well I've ran Watson cyp for over a year before. Now the ugl I use right now his cyp is just as good as Watson and I pay $70 for 2ml. I was just saying you can't find good quality for cheaper we are lucky to have so many ugl around that take pride in there quality




I too ran Wayson cyp for several years...love it...but you're right, in terms of potency, there are good UGL's out there who do dose their products correctly (or close) a good deal of the time.  Becaue of this, it wil be impossible to tell any difference in 'results" between the two.  Now, as you know, there are also many UGL products which don't come close to meeting label claims.  The UGL world is filled with dosing and sterility issues.  Assuming potency is not an issue, the primary difference between Watson cyp and a proplery dosed UGL would be in the area of purity and sterility.  Often, these issues go unnocticed because the user can't feel himself injecting heavy metals or other by-products.  Some UGL's have even been known to sub one steroid for another because it is either cheaper and/or readily available.  So, there are certainly differences between Watson test cyp and UGL's, but as long as the oppration is being run correctly, the user generally won't experience any problems from this stuff.


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> *My comments are in bold, below...
> *
> 
> 
> ...





Ohh your comparing the cost of powder to a finished product well that seems completely irrelevant.  Seeing as how the thread was about buying gear from a ugl  as apposed to wp ugl.

No one is talking about buying powders we are all talking about the *finished product* and the cost difference *OF THE FINISHED PRODUCT.*  Get on the same page.

no one cares that chinese powders cost less than a vial of finished product.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> Ohh your comparing the cost of powder to a finished product well that seems completely irrelevant.
> *Hell, please tell me that is not all you've got?  This is getting really fucking stupid now...and boring.  Of course I am NOT comparing the cost of raw Chinese powders to finished products.  I thought it was common sense, given the nature of the argument (all about comparisons), that we were comparing finished product to finshed product.  So, let me spell it out for you (ridiculous...sigh)..."Finsihed products using chinese raws cost less to make than finished pharmaceutical/GMP products.  Is that clear enough for ya'...LOL.
> *
> Seeing as how the thread was about buying gear from a ugl  as apposed to wp ugl.
> ...



*Are you able to move on now and stop this nonsense?  It has truly turned into a waste of my time...and everyone elses.  If you post up one more stupid ass question like this, I will henceforth respond with this...  

Anyway, I find it rather funny that out of my entire post, the only thing you could pull out of your ass in an attempt to avoid total humiliation, was this stupid ass question.*


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> Ohh your comparing the cost of powder to a finished product well that seems completely irrelevant.  Seeing as how the thread was about buying gear from a ugl  as apposed to wp ugl.
> 
> No one is talking about buying powders we are all talking about the *finished product* and the cost difference *OF THE FINISHED PRODUCT.*  Get on the same page.
> 
> no one cares that chinese powders cost less than a vial of finished product.






*...had to do it.*


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## theestone (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> When it come to pricing and quality, what you just said is completely false. I just paid 60.00 for a bottle of phizer depo-test. American pharm companies are the most expensive and have the strictest guidelines.
> Now once again let me hear you justify why ap gear is so expensive?



Only paying 60 bucks for pharmacy gear? From a pharmacy? How much can you get at once? This for trt? Your the probably exception, not the rule.


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## heavyiron (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Costco. No insurance.


Damn, the best I can get without insurance is $99. With insurance its like $45.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

heavyiron said:


> Damn, the best I can get without insurance is $99. With insurance its like $45.



99$..so then my prices are not bad at all!
with sales i have now are even more cheap. 
but hater will say again AP = UGL..omfg


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## NVRBDR (Feb 15, 2013)

Costco sells watson for 60 in my neck of the woods, so apparently you are getting Pfizer for a steal at 60. I have found Pfizer for 91 at a local ma and pop pharmacy.


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## theestone (Feb 15, 2013)

^^^^Disregard my last comment. Didn't realise the topic was already beaten to death ^^^^


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## heavyiron (Feb 15, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> 99$..so then my prices are not bad at all!
> with sales i have now are even more cheap.
> but hater will say again AP = UGL..omfg


US compounded I pay about $70 for 10ml no insurance but its not brand name.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

heavyiron said:


> US compounded I pay about $70 for 10ml no insurance but its not brand name.



but its good GMP,so its GREAT!


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> *Are you able to move on now and stop this nonsense?  It has truly turned into a waste of my time...and everyone elses.  If you post up one more stupid ass question like this, I will henceforth respond with this...
> 
> Anyway, I find it rather funny that out of my entire post, the only thing you could pull out of your ass in an attempt to avoid total humiliation, was this stupid ass question.*





Lets take a look at it then.  

1. Raw material- where do they get there raws?  I would guess a factory in china or one similar unless your saying they manufacture thier own raws inwhich case it should be even cheaper cause they dont have to reach a profit of just raws like other factories-  and there is no proof out there that the raws that they use are of any better quality than ugl-  so not sure where the cost difference comes there especially since they more than likely buy in bigger amounts than the UGLS.  Meaning they would pay less.

2 Manufacturing process- They have a building, employees and really expensive equipment(supposedly)-  This is the only difference between UGL and UGL WP-  but the problem with this arguement is that Real FDA approved gear in the good ol US of A cost less tha 150 dollars a 10ml vial and they have this exact same over head.  and higher paid employees MUCH higher and higher cost of rent elctricity ECT.  

3 profit margin-  I would wager a good amount that WP has alotted for a much greater profit margin......the reason why EVERYTHING IS ALWAYS ON SALE

So please where is the cost difference again??????  I hope you know more about steroids than business.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

Guy,,why are are so big hater for my shop? what is wrong with you,what i did wrong to you or anybody..If you dont like my shop prices,live me alone...better go to gym,train hard,make muscles and have fun in your life..


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> Lets take a look at it then.
> 
> 1. Raw material- where do they get there raws?  I would guess a factory in china or one similar unless your saying they manufacture thier own raws inwhich case it should be even cheaper cause they dont have to reach a profit of just raws like other factories-  and there is no proof out there that the raws that they use are of any better quality than ugl-  so not sure where the cost difference comes there especially since they more than likely buy in bigger amounts than the UGLS.  Meaning they would pay less.
> 
> ...


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

Problem is that you are lying about your brands! false advertising on your producst that is why people hate the way you are running your biss

what about saying our brands are manufactured in strict control but its not humangrade im sure you will get more respect that way





World-Pharma.org said:


> Guy,,why are are so big hater for my shop? what is wrong with you,what i did wrong to you or anybody..If you dont like my shop prices,live me alone...better go to gym,train hard,make muscles and have fun in your life..


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

euroking said:


> *Problem is that you are lying about your brands! *false advertising on your producst that is why people hate the way you are running your biss
> 
> what about saying our brands are manufactured in strict control but its not humangrade im sure you will get more respect that way



See bold avove:  Please explain, although I have to run, so I will not be able to respond right away.  Thanks.

Of course, there are plenty of great UGL's out there who make their gear with a high level of qualuty control...not equivlaent to a U.S pharmacy quality control, but still very good none the less.  I work for a UGL and have used primarily UGL my entire life...never had an issue...had a few bunk and under-dosed products, but by and large, things have been good.  Knowing where to look makes a big difference.


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

There is no need to explain!

the best way for you to explain is give me the addy where the production is and ill have it check it right away if its true ore not

if its humangrade there is no need to be afraid of anything right? 



Mike Arnold said:


> See bold avove:  Please explain, although I have to run, so I will not be able to respond right away.  Thanks.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 15, 2013)

euroking said:


> There is no need to explain!
> 
> the best way for you to explain is give me the addy where the production is and ill have it check it right away if its true ore not
> 
> if its humangrade there is no need to be afraid of anything right?



Me to explain?  Didn't you hear me say I don't work for WP?  I am asking you to explain because I don't know the details of his operation or where his products are manufacured.  My argument is based on the assumption that WP's products are what he says they are.    My intention was not to 'defend" WP...he will tell you that himslef.  I was only speaking about the differences in quality & price between pharm-grade/GMP prodycts and products made from chinese raws.  So, if there is something you know...out with it.  You are clearly trying to make a different point than myself.


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## OfficerFarva (Feb 15, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> Lets take a look at it then.
> 
> 1. Raw material- where do they get there raws?  I would guess a factory in china or one similar unless your saying they manufacture thier own raws inwhich case it should be even cheaper cause they dont have to reach a profit of just raws like other factories-  and there is no proof out there that the raws that they use are of any better quality than ugl-  so not sure where the cost difference comes there especially since they more than likely buy in bigger amounts than the UGLS.  Meaning they would pay less.
> 
> ...




He can give every IM member a 30% discount right off the bat.  Obviously if he's doing that he's still making a profit so he's definitely marking his prices up.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

euroking said:


> There is no need to explain!
> 
> the best way for you to explain is give me the addy where the production is and ill have it check it right away if its true ore not
> 
> if its humangrade there is no need to be afraid of anything right?





Dear EK,you are a joke..all info you need,see Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Home   see videos and see all, go to Thailand and ask in pharmacy's if they sale Asia pharma and if its Thai FDA approved! As you can also contact Thai FDA,etc You think Thai government play games to put UGL and approved it..come...you are long time in business and you know that!


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## Chrisotpherm (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> My point is the cost cannot be justified weather its human grade or a ugl.



My brother OD wouldn't waste his breath on something unless its valid. You talk about price well I will talk about free will. No one is begging anyone to buy anything here or any other source because free will gives us our own choice. Your point on pricing?  If that is what WP sales it for then why do you care?  Heck I would even be willing to bet if you pm'd him he would send you some to test for free. 

I've know OD forever and if he says its gtg, then count on it. Enjoy your free will.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

GUYS...WORLD-PHARMA.ORG AKA WP IS MY SHOP...LICENSED PHARMACY SHOP And i can sale only gmp made prods...so i sale all prods like Norma,Schering,Organon,Illi,Asia Pharma, Galenika,British dispansery,British dragon! I do not own any of this companys..if i own any.you know i was not need to post on forums,boards,etc ...


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

Im a joke?

Seriously? you do not know its illegal to sell UGL? asia pharma and british dragon is UGL tren e tren h mast e mast p etc is humangrade? did you fall a sleep in the medical school? give me your license number that you are verified seller of pharmaceuticals producst and in wich country!

tell me where asia pharma and british dragon is being produced so i can have people check them out if its a real company ore not they should have a office right?

as far i know all medical companies have some sort of a phone number and a adres where their main office is? 



World-Pharma.org said:


> Dear EK,you are a joke..all info you need,see Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Home   see videos and see all, go to Thailand and ask in pharmacy's if they sale Asia pharma and if its Thai FDA approved! As you can also contact Thai FDA,etc You think Thai government play games to put UGL and approved it..come...you are long time in business and you know that!


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

What is the wrong with chinese raws? 90% of everything you buy is chinese 

big pharmaceutical companies buy their raws from china

and how do you know they are gmp and manufactured in strict control? have you seen their factory? i guess not the only thing he have done is to post a video about production other then that nothing else

lets see some proof dont you agree? 



Mike Arnold said:


> Me to explain?  Didn't you hear me say I don't work for WP?  I am asking you to explain because I don't know the details of his operation or where his products are manufacured.  My argument is based on the assumption that WP's products are what he says they are.    My intention was not to 'defend" WP...he will tell you that himslef.  *I was only speaking about the differences in quality & price between pharm-grade/GMP prodycts and products made from chinese raws.*  So, if there is something you know...out with it.  You are clearly trying to make a different point than myself.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 15, 2013)

Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Home
Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Thai FDA Asia Pharma Products check


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

Not ONE SINGLE INFORMATION ABOUT WHERE THEY ARE LOCATED?

Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Contact



World-Pharma.org said:


> Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Home
> Asia Pharma Pharmaceuticals LTD - Thai FDA Asia Pharma Products check


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

Lets take a look at it then.  

1. Raw material- where do they get there raws?  I would guess a factory in china or one similar unless your saying they manufacture thier own raws inwhich case it should be even cheaper cause they dont have to reach a profit of just raws like other factories-  and there is no proof out there that the raws that they use are of any better quality than ugl-  so not sure where the cost difference comes there especially since they more than likely buy in bigger amounts than the UGLS.  Meaning they would pay less.

*Where does WHO gets their raws?  Bro...I can't continue to do this.  Am I am now supposed to guess who you are referring to?(just follow along who are we talking about? WP UGL and UGLs! Thought you were smart.  This topic was beaten to death. (Cause you dont understand business and cost of doing it unfortunately) The bottom line is that finished UGL products cost less to produce than finished pharmaceutical/GMP products....end of story.   (Yes exactly finally and what Bigmoe is comparing is what it cost himm to buy his GMP USA FDA gears whish is less than 150 dollars a bottle shit even you state you get it for 95) You are now going off into an entirely different topic, which I don't have the time or patenece for anymore(you really cant follow your own topic sad) (not to mention the question has already been answered), especially being that there has been no challenege.  (are you completely dense we multiple people have tried to explain this to you and you have not answered it)  Its old..its boring...move on and let the members decide for themslves based on what was already written.  God knows they have read plenty from both of us. 


*

2 Manufacturing process- They have a building, employees and really expensive equipment(supposedly)-  This is the only difference between UGL and UGL WP-
*Yes, pharmacuetical companies have the ABILITY to produce drugs which are gauaranteed to be both pure & potent...UGL's do not.  What's your point?  You do know that WP sells many "pharmacy-grade" drugs, right (Schering primo is one example)?  WP is tehnically a UGL...the operation itself is, but their products aren't.  They sell many products sourced directly from pharmacuetical companies, as well as other non-pharmacy products made under GMP guidelines.  In the old days, all UGL's sold products diverted directly from pharmacies...prior to the laws getting harsh and the goverment cracking down on it.  Today it is different, with most UGL sourcing their raw materials from China (everyon gets there raws from china!!!! name a company that makes its own raws?.  So, whether a comopny is a UGL or not doesn't really matter.  Today, few UGL's sell only pharm-grade/GMP made products.  WP is one of them.--- again your post shows that you completely missed the point so let me spell it out for you again....

WP sells his gear for more than it is worth and not because of cost of production but because he wants more money.  This is the point that is it that is what bigmoe myself and any one else that aposed your view was saying.
*
  but the problem with this arguement is that Real FDA approved gear in the good ol US of A cost less tha 150 dollars a 10ml vial
*I think you're mising the bigger picture.  You need to READ my prior post which talks about the price of American steroids...not just testosterone.  It's true that most American pharms sell a 10 ml vial of test for between $100-$130, while WP sells it for around $70-$80(wrong check the site 150dollars- no ones talking about his supposed deals sales by definition are temporary we can only compare listed price)...but when it comes to all the many other steroids BB'r use, American pharm-grade steroids are incredibly expensive.  Anadrol is $20 per pill...Deca & Winstrol cost hundreds of dollars for a single 10 ml vial.  Anavar costs many hundreds for 500 mg.  Halotestin is atrocious.  I won't go any further, because it doesn't get any better.  There is no doubt at all that American gear is WAY more expensive than WP gear- all the latter drugs that you mention are almost impossible to get a script for so now your trying to compare apples to oranges cause its reall not that feesible to go to a pharmacy in the us and buy drols there for there is much less available so when comparing two with the same availability some how the US cost less HMMMM.  supply and demand is part of business.  The only american pharm AAS which even comes close is testosterone, but WP still sells it for $150(fixed for accuracy), compared to an American pharm's $100-$130 (on average).---I could easily get it for less.
*
 and they have this exact same over head.  and higher paid employees MUCH higher and higher cost of rent elctricity ECT.  
*Like I said, the question of finished cost has already been answered, making this a pointless question.  You are still trying to argue a point which already been put to bed.   I guess we could use the following anaolgy to describe your reluctance to admit defeat.  I say the sky is blue...you say it is red....then we both look up and see that the sky is blue...the question has been answered...but you continue to argue that the sky is red because of atmospheric pollution.  Doesn't make much sense, does it?  So stop doing it.  Man how do people respect you when you cant grasp simple concepts like why what cost what.  I have already stated why your wrong here and you just dont understand.  If you compare one gmp to another we'll call the first one "US"
 and the second one "AP" well US has a higher cost of production and over head but AP products cost more to buy what is the explanation.....Greed 
*
3 profit margin-  I would wager a good amount that WP has alotted for a much greater profit margin......the reason why EVERYTHING IS ALWAYS ON SALE
*Every AAS company has a high profit margin.  (exactly so why is he so greedy than his margin obvioulsy has to be higher than that of american pharmacutical companies cause as i explained his over head is less and his products cost more)These guys are trying to make a "profit" after all...LOL.  I mean, we already determined that WP gear only costs about $70-$80 per vial(false this is a sale his cost 150 dollars), while the typical UGl vial is between $40-$50.  The difference is relatively small...certainly small enough to justify the slightly greater cost when we consider that pharmacy-grade/GMP gear COSTS more.(again we are comparing it to  a us gmp fda so it does not cost more it cost less  What don't you get about this?  I seriously feel like I am either arguing with a retard or the most stubborn person in the world.  Now, I can relate to the stubborness, but I typically only allow that personality train to take sway when I am right...as I am now.  I will say it again...the question has bee answered!  Here it is again for good measure..."Finished pharm-grade/GMP gear costs more to purchase than finished chinese made UGL gear". Understand yet? you really dont read do you let me explain for a fourth time. We are comparing fda gmp to fda gmp wow you read one post and then do not address the different issues with your statements.
*
So please where is the cost difference again??????  I hope you know more about steroids than business.

*Hhahahahahahaha.  I also answered this question IN DEPTH in a previous post.  Can your new screen name be "wall"?  I'm out...I have to pick up my daughter.  
HOPE THIS HELPS!!!!*


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

euroking said:


> What is the wrong with chinese raws? 90% of everything you buy is chinese
> 
> big pharmaceutical companies buy their raws from china
> 
> ...



Thank you thats what I am saying everyone is using raws from china!!!


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## skinnyguy180 (Feb 15, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> Guy,,why are are so big hater for my shop? what is wrong with you,what i did wrong to you or anybody..If you dont like my shop prices,live me alone...better go to gym,train hard,make muscles and have fun in your life..



I am seriously sorry about this i have no issue with your shop.  I have considered buying from you many times.  and I know you have GREAT gear.  and you can charge what you like its not up to anyone to tell you what to charge.  Its up to us to decide if we want to buy.  


Its "mike the mod" I am slowly growing to dislike.  Solely cause he cant follow a simle thread or comprehend simple explanations?  then writes back a fuckin book that explains nothing and expects you to re-argue all your points.  after insulting you.


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## bodybuilder13 (Feb 15, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> Guy,,why are are so big hater for my shop? what is wrong with you,what i did wrong to you or anybody..If you dont like my shop prices,live me alone...better go to gym,train hard,make muscles and have fun in your life..



I absolutely agree with you wp, its so rediculous how some of these guys follow you around, wp is a great source which has some of the best gear on the net and has never to my knowledge scammed anyone. If you dont like his prices or think his gear is not worth it then let it be.


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## euroking (Feb 15, 2013)

Who is talking about bad producst ore skyhigh prices ?

We are talking about how he is making false  advertisement on producst that are not humangrade



bodybuilder13 said:


> I absolutely agree with you wp, its so rediculous how some of these guys follow you around, wp is a great source which has some of the best gear on the net and has never to my knowledge scammed anyone. If you dont like his prices or think his gear is not worth it then let it be.


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## bodybuilder13 (Feb 15, 2013)

euroking said:


> Who is talking about bad producst ore skyhigh prices ?
> 
> We are talking about how he is making false advertisement on producst that are not humangrade



All the same, why make it a point to attack this guy over and over, just looks like there is some kind of hidden agenda. I would understand if he was sending out bunk gear, then by all means fire away. I have actually had the chance to try out this guys stuff, were and how its made idk, what i do know is the gear is some good shit.


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## pieguy (Feb 15, 2013)

bodybuilder13 said:


> All the same, why make it a point to attack this guy over and over, just looks like there is some kind of hidden agenda. I would understand if he was sending out bunk gear, then by all means fire away. I have actually had the chance to try out this guys stuff, were and how its made idk, what i do know is the gear is some good shit.



Probably because he makes the most annoying plugs about his products in threads he has no business posting while bashing UGLs every chance he gets saying they'll give you a terrible abscess. But that's just my observation.


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## longworthb (Feb 15, 2013)

This is gettin good


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

euroking said:


> Im a joke?
> 
> Seriously? you do not know its illegal to sell UGL? asia pharma and british dragon is UGL tren e tren h mast e mast p etc is humangrade? did you fall a sleep in the medical school? give me your license number that you are verified seller of pharmaceuticals producst and in wich country!
> 
> ...



Exactly. We dont care about his quality or prices because hes a liar.


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## Vibrant (Feb 15, 2013)

I'm gone for a few months, glad to see the same topics, feels like coming back home.


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

+1 818-597-3901 call them.

Its $64.65 for 10ml vial of depo test. They gave me 5.00 off for being in their pharmacy plan.

I called for mike arnold because he cant dial a phone.

Subbed for his next novel.


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## Valkyrie (Feb 15, 2013)

*dying laughing*

Here we go again.

UGL prices: UGLs pay for way more than you or your bro at the gym brewing up a batch.  SOURCES: Mine is great, reliable, and i am his number one customer he bends over backwards to kewp us gloriously overjoyed with his product - and he has mass spec. Tested and proved anavar and primo.  Does some no one buying 300grams have any pull with him?  CUSTOMS:  we assume the risk of importing kilos at a time.  We lose a shipment it is thousands and thousands of dollars gone. EXPERIENCE: my CHEMIST YES HE IS A CHEMIST WITH A DEGREE Has seven years of AAS producing experience. RISK:  What is the consumer risking it his pack gets seized?  I hope it is known what we face distributing class III substances.  ADVERTISING: SHIT AINT  heap yo.  TIME:  Even smaller UGLS like mine is the equivallent of five or six full time employees working well over forty hours a week.  RESHIPPING: IF the error is mine I reship the.entire order free.  WP RESHIPS ALL SEIZED PACKS.  DO YOU THINK THAT IA CHEAP?  CAPTIAL:  Have any clue how much capital it takes to build up a 30 item list with most things always in stock? LOGISTICS:  WE HAVE to be ready to close and be gone no trade in less than 24 hours can you do that?  Can a home brewer do that?  CASH LOGISTICS.  Do you know how to rransact thousands of anonymous dollars?  Lol figure out an easy way and you are mother fucking hired.

Comparing the cost of brewing the most amazing immaculate batch of homebrew to RU.Kong an actual AAS distribution business is a goddamn joke.

You dont like the Price?  Awesome.  Shut the fuck up and don't buy any.  I don't drive a jag.  You can't use my test.  Get over it.

And picking a fight with OD who I have NEVER een flame anyone and clearly states he has no bone to pick is pretty fucking low too.

Shame on you silly whine baby.g


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## independent (Feb 15, 2013)

Agentyes said:


> Here we go again.
> 
> UGL prices: UGLs pay for way more than you or your bro at the gym brewing up a batch.  SOURCES: Mine is great, reliable, and i am his number one customer he bends over backwards to kewp us gloriously overjoyed with his product - and he has mass spec. Tested and proved anavar and primo.  Does some no one buying 300grams have any pull with him?  CUSTOMS:  we assume the risk of importing kilos at a time.  We lose a shipment it is thousands and thousands of dollars gone. EXPERIENCE: my CHEMIST YES HE IS A CHEMIST WITH A DEGREE Has seven years of AAS producing experience. RISK:  What is the consumer risking it his pack gets seized?  I hope it is known what we face distributing class III substances.  ADVERTISING: SHIT AINT  heap yo.  TIME:  Even smaller UGLS like mine is the equivallent of five or six full time employees working well over forty hours a week.  RESHIPPING: IF the error is mine I reship the.entire order free.  WP RESHIPS ALL SEIZED PACKS.  DO YOU THINK THAT IA CHEAP?  CAPTIAL:  Have any clue how much capital it takes to build up a 30 item list with most things always in stock? LOGISTICS:  WE HAVE to be ready to close and be gone no trade in less than 24 hours can you do that?  Can a home brewer do that?  CASH LOGISTICS.  Do you know how to rransact thousands of anonymous dollars?  Lol figure out an easy way and you are mother fucking hired.
> 
> ...



Negged for being a whiney drug dealer.


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## keith1569 (Feb 15, 2013)

christ


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## Valkyrie (Feb 15, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Negged for being a whiney drug dealer.



Do you know how I know that you're gay?


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## HFO3 (Feb 15, 2013)

60 bucks for Pfizer is a great deal


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## kobefan234 (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> don't be swayed by the bullshit scare tactics that WP is for some reason allowed to pull around here
> 
> 
> go with UGL *or crash your natural production and get a script from your doc*



Can you explain this process? Wouldn't the endocrinologist be suspicious of the lh & fsh being extremely low?


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## srbijadotokija (Feb 16, 2013)

Euroking, first of all, not 90% raw material is produces in China.
Second, you can not buy legaly raw material in China for anabolic steroids, what you have is illegal trades that sell Chinese home made powders by grams, quality is poor.

Guy like you ( Euroking) - buy from Alibaba cheapest powders, import to Turkey (Turkey is not Europe BTW, I don't know what you nickname is Euroking, reason is Euro sound better for selling pharmaceuticals), payoff Turkish customs offitial and bring home.
In your bedroom in Turkey you have no option to lab test your powders, so just you take a word from Chines supplier and make vials at you best. That is why you can offer vial for 50$ and still profit 44$.

Saying AP is UG because is it not made in Europe or USA and was not EU or US FDA approved is Childish. Turkey FDA is for me same as Thailand FDA where AP products are legally imported to and registered. I am sure you checked in past on Thai FDA website.


AP prices are higher because those products are produced in GMP factory in India with all licenses. Prices are higher as volume for transport of finishing products is much higher than as in UG option just powders.

legal production is not cheap and that is why end product prices are higher that UGL shit you are pushing.
Go to real pharmacy in Turkey ( for a change) and ask price for Primobolan, it is 8 liras something for 1 ml amp, that is 4 Euros or 6 US$ in pharmacy, here you have reference for prices.










euroking said:


> What is the wrong with chinese raws? 90% of everything you buy is chinese
> 
> big pharmaceutical companies buy their raws from china
> 
> ...


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## theCaptn' (Feb 16, 2013)

In over 2 years I've never seen issues with sterility of any UGLs from IM, but I have seen issues with dosages.

WP has never had complaints on underdosed gear that I have seen. TD is always pretty damn quick as well. Some might see that as value worth paying for. 

Personally I have never used sponsors gear, and only pay less than $20 for test (in bulk) and its always been dosed properly


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## euroking (Feb 16, 2013)

Again you dont know what you are talking about

FDA Approved medical compay should have a contact adres in a country where they are licensed right? like balkan pharma! there you can and visit their factory and main office but asia pharma aka british dragon is nowhere to find them

and how do you know that we cant test powders? you think its only ugl like asia pharma who can do that? 

and you are talking about shipping is the reason for high prices? remember you got into the prices not me 

dont come and tell me that shipping is the reason for asia pharma prices because that is bullshit 



srbijadotokija said:


> Euroking, first of all, not 90% raw material is produces in China.
> Second, you can not buy legaly raw material in China for anabolic steroids, what you have is illegal trades that sell Chinese home made powders by grams, quality is poor.
> 
> Guy like you ( Euroking) - buy from Alibaba cheapest powders, import to Turkey (Turkey is not Europe BTW, I don't know what you nickname is Euroking, reason is Euro sound better for selling pharmaceuticals), payoff Turkish customs offitial and bring home.
> ...


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## euroking (Feb 16, 2013)

Want to see a real approved company

Balkan pharmaceuticals | Distributors

Can you tell me why Asia pharma aka british dragon isnt posting their office and factory adres?

cant you see the issue here with you if you cant then there is something wrong

give me evidence that asia pharma aka british dragon is a real medical factory  give me their adres where they produce and where their office is and ill have it check it 



srbijadotokija said:


> Euroking, first of all, not 90% raw material is produces in China.
> Second, you can not buy legaly raw material in China for anabolic steroids, what you have is illegal trades that sell Chinese home made powders by grams, quality is poor.
> 
> Guy like you ( Euroking) - buy from Alibaba cheapest powders, import to Turkey (Turkey is not Europe BTW, I don't know what you nickname is Euroking, reason is Euro sound better for selling pharmaceuticals), payoff Turkish customs offitial and bring home.
> ...


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

skinnyguy180 said:


> Lets take a look at it then.
> 
> 1. Raw material- where do they get there raws?  I would guess a factory in china or one similar unless your saying they manufacture thier own raws inwhich case it should be even cheaper cause they dont have to reach a profit of just raws like other factories-  and there is no proof out there that the raws that they use are of any better quality than ugl-  so not sure where the cost difference comes there especially since they more than likely buy in bigger amounts than the UGLS.  Meaning they would pay less.
> 
> ...



Look, if you continue IGNORING most of the  points I make, there can't be any further duscussion. 90% of what you said here was previously addressed, yet you either didn't read all my posts...or you are playing a game.  I will also state that you have brought several new arguments to the forefront over the last 2 pages of text....many of which I never took issue with.  Initially, we were dicussing a couple of very pointed questions, but you have now branched so far out, that I truly am not even sure what you'e trying to get at anymore.  The main thing I see you trying to say now is you think WP charges too much, but this was not what we were duscussing originally...somewhow you got away from the original point and started gradually bringing other issues into the conversation.

So, if you would like to continue, we need to do it more efficiently and get on the same page.  Tell me EXACTLY what you take issue with.  List them out...and I will tell what I disagree with and why....because a this point, you have made a LOT of assumptions about what I think or feel...things I have never stated of inferred.  Intially , I posted in this thread for one purpose....to point out the differences in manufacturirng/purchase costs between pharm-grade/GMP gear and low-qaulity chinese raws.  At this point, I need to know that we're both actually on the same page....because we are clearly both going in different directions.  I don't think a single topic ever got fully addressed before a new topic was brought into the picture...and it continues to hapoen over and over again.  An argument gets bogged down and uncler when this begins to happen.  Too much has been ignored (or not read) and quite frankly, we need to start fresh, with a clear pciture of what the real debate actually is.  If you can do that...and STICK with each topic until it is DONE, then we can proceed.  If you want to tackle a dozen different topics...fine...we can do so, but one at a time. It is not a smart move to argue 10 different things at once, while skipping all over the place and ignoring relevant responses.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Exactly. We dont care about his quality or prices because hes a liar.



I am glad you posted this....because it shows how many different directions this thread is being pulled at once.  You say no one cares about his prices or quality, but 3/4 of this thread was ALL about that topic, which skinny guy continues to harp on.  Then we have you and EK are calling him a liar and saying his products are not legit.  Of course, you are free to have your opinion on the matter and by all means, please post up any info confirming this belief, but regardless, we need to consolidate this thread and get it back on track.  Everyone is arguing different shit and I bet many guys got lost in the shuffle a while back.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> +1 818-597-3901 call them.
> 
> Its $64.65 for 10ml vial of depo test. They gave me 5.00 off for being in their pharmacy plan.
> 
> ...



Bro...this is now the 3rd time I have answered you on this.  If you refuse to read my responses to your question, what else can I do?  I acknowledged MULTIPLE times that you do get it for that cheap, but I also stated that this price does not reflect the average price for an american made vial of pharmacy grade test....and it certainly does NOT represent the average price of the rest of our American made steroids. Costco, much like WalMart, runs a special program, where they sell their testostrone for less than every other pharma in America.  Walmart does the same with insulin. Every pharm in American seels slin foir about $50-$60 now, but WM only charges $24!  That is much lower than everyone else...a special program for insulin users.  It is the same with your $60 Phizer test.  Understand?  Now, this is great for the customer, but you can't say that it accurately reflects the price of American pharma-grade gear in general....because it certainly does not.  Americvan made phama gear costs WAY more than WP.  Just Anadrol alone is $20 per pill! Other steroids, like Deca, Winstrol, Halotestin, etc....all cost a fortune! 

So, please go back and read the response I posted for you, which talks all about this.  You have tried to use this single, unordinary example as a basis for stating that American pharm-grade gear costs less than WP gear, when that statment is way, way off base...just completely untrue.  Sure, WP sells his test for about $70-$80 on average with a sale price (which is basically always available)...and your $60 is a bit cheaper than his.  It is a great deal, but wholly utypical of the general comparison.  If you compare the cost of EVERY single America-made steroid sold in our pharmacies (aside from your special deal), they all cost way, ay more than whhat WP charges.  It would cost you $1,000 just to buy 50 tabs of Anadrol from an American pharmacy...do you realize that?  Do you realize Deca is a few hundred dollars per vial...and Anavar costs many hundred dollars for only 500 mg?  It is the same with Winstrol, halotestin, and evertvother AAS...they all cost hundreds of dollars for a single vials of a small amount of pills.  

Look, in your original statement, you said that WP costs more than American made gear...and you based this blanket statemnt off of a single vial of special program testosterone.  As you can now see (even though I am now saying this twice), that statment is 100% wrong!  It only...and I mean ONLY applies to that single Costco product...NOTHING else....not by a long shot.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

Agentyes said:


> Here we go again.
> 
> UGL prices: UGLs pay for way more than you or your bro at the gym brewing up a batch.  SOURCES: Mine is great, reliable, and i am his number one customer he bends over backwards to kewp us gloriously overjoyed with his product - and he has mass spec. Tested and proved anavar and primo.  Does some no one buying 300grams have any pull with him?  CUSTOMS:  we assume the risk of importing kilos at a time.  We lose a shipment it is thousands and thousands of dollars gone. EXPERIENCE: my CHEMIST YES HE IS A CHEMIST WITH A DEGREE Has seven years of AAS producing experience. RISK:  What is the consumer risking it his pack gets seized?  I hope it is known what we face distributing class III substances.  ADVERTISING: SHIT AINT  heap yo.  TIME:  Even smaller UGLS like mine is the equivallent of five or six full time employees working well over forty hours a week.  RESHIPPING: IF the error is mine I reship the.entire order free.  WP RESHIPS ALL SEIZED PACKS.  DO YOU THINK THAT IA CHEAP?  CAPTIAL:  Have any clue how much capital it takes to build up a 30 item list with most things always in stock? LOGISTICS:  WE HAVE to be ready to close and be gone no trade in less than 24 hours can you do that?  Can a home brewer do that?  CASH LOGISTICS.  Do you know how to rransact thousands of anonymous dollars?  Lol figure out an easy way and you are mother fucking hired.
> 
> ...



Awesome post.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Negged for being a whiney drug dealer.



Serioulsy, guy...WTF is wrong with you?   Is this really how you're going to debate?  If so, just stop now. She puts up a well thouht out, informative post and you have no response (like a lot of dumabasses in this thread) to anything she has said, aside from calling her a whinny drug dealer?  You sound like a fucking jackass...a stupid MF'r who has nothing to say because he doesn't know shit...so you just sit back throwing stones.  GTFO!


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

HFO3 said:


> 60 bucks for Pfizer is a great deal


Yes, it is...and wholly untypical of the average cost for a vial of phizer test cyp, nationwide.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

srbijadotokija said:


> Euroking, first of all, not 90% raw material is produces in China.
> Second, you can not buy legaly raw material in China for anabolic steroids, what you have is illegal trades that sell Chinese home made powders by grams, quality is poor.
> 
> Guy like you ( Euroking) - buy from Alibaba cheapest powders, import to Turkey (Turkey is not Europe BTW, I don't know what you nickname is Euroking, reason is Euro sound better for selling pharmaceuticals), payoff Turkish customs offitial and bring home.
> ...



Thank you.  

Somehow, there are still guys in this thread arguing that it doesn't cost any more money to manufacture pharm-grade/GMP gear, than it does to make gear from low-quality improted chinese powders.  I mean, who really fucking believes that the products that WP buys from various pharmacies costs him less than it would to make AAS with cheap chinese powders?  Only a dumbas.  I am glad you mentioned the Primo, which WP sells.  It is as legit as it gets, 100% pharm-grade...and it costs a lot more for WP to purchase, than it would to buy some primo raws from a Chinese manufacurer.  All these guys have to do is look on WP's site and they will see a bunch of products which were made at various pharmacies around the world...then purchased by WP and imported inro his shop.


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## gamma (Feb 16, 2013)

Thread should be closed now ! Good read , I for one am more of a reader than a poster if more people would do this it would prevent worthless info on the borads .


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## westb51 (Feb 16, 2013)

I always enjoy a good read where someone drops some knowledge. Thanks Mike Arnold


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 16, 2013)

*great posts and i am sure everybody who is smart and not stupid kid will understand what guys say and post...GREAT POSTS! all 100% true!*


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## theCaptn' (Feb 16, 2013)

WP gear is way still cheaper than most black market gear in Australia. 

If WP could find a way to beat customs, he'd become a very rich man


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## Valkyrie (Feb 16, 2013)

bigmoe65 said:


> Negged for being a whiney drug dealer.



Know how else I know you're gay?

You got your feelings hurt on the internet.  That makes you the "dumb cunt."  Not to mention negging?  That is not an activity real men participate in.  I suggest you spend more time in the gym and less time announcing you're too broke too afford good gear 

Shit boy you did  give me a good laugh at least.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 16, 2013)

theCaptn' said:


> WP gear is way still cheaper than most black market gear in Australia.
> 
> If WP could find a way to beat customs, he'd become a very rich man




i have some customers there and i deliver ok! amps (Sustanon 250) always come safe and anti E too!


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## theCaptn' (Feb 16, 2013)

World-Pharma.org said:


> i have some customers there and i deliver ok! amps (Sustanon 250) always come safe and anti E too!



Good for you WP - I can't get a damn thing through


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## independent (Feb 16, 2013)

Agentyes said:


> Know how else I know you're gay?
> 
> You got your feelings hurt on the internet.  That makes you the "dumb cunt."  Not to mention negging?  That is not an activity real men participate in.  I suggest you spend more time in the gym and less time announcing you're too broke too afford good gear
> 
> Shit boy you did  give me a good laugh at least.



This is coming from a man pretending to be a woman.


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## Mike Arnold (Feb 16, 2013)

theCaptn' said:


> Good for you WP - I can't get a damn thing through




Thinsg are very rough in Aus...I feel for you.


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## crab107 (Feb 16, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> I am glad you posted this....because it shows how many different directions this thread is being pulled at once.  You say no one cares about his prices or quality, but 3/4 of this thread was ALL about that topic, which skinny guy continues to harp on.  Then we have you and EK are calling him a liar and saying his products are not legit.  Of course, you are free to have your opinion on the matter and by all means, please post up any info confirming this belief, but regardless, we need to consolidate this thread and get it back on track.  Everyone is arguing different shit and I bet many guys got lost in the shuffle a while back.



You got it buddy. Its my post and I was lost on the first god damn page..lmao!!! So from what i can gather my best bet would be to stick with my ugl which is a sponsor btw. Im a noob but i can tell the shit is workin..lol.  If i wanna order different shit then i can do that to. I guess its all about what i choose to pay for.


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## World-Pharma.org (Feb 17, 2013)

Mike Arnold said:


> Thinsg are very rough in Aus...I feel for you.



yes its tru..there is 100% lottery..but for now i always deliver sustanons,that one that heavyiron love..


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