# Non grain carbs



## Josh99 (Nov 18, 2011)

What are some non grain carbs that I can use on my refeed for CKD? And also I keep on reading that grains are bad on some forums like marksdailyapple, is this true?

I know potatoes are one non-grain carb, are they good for once weekly carb up?


----------



## SloppyJ (Nov 18, 2011)

Potatoes, Yams, and a lot of other vegetables have carbs. 

This isn't my specailty but people are probably refering to "Bad" carbs like bread and other things when they say that.


----------



## ~RaZr~ (Nov 18, 2011)

Yea I was about to say that grains are really good for you. Now bleached white flour like white bread, tortillas, etc are fast-digesting carbs that have had all the nutrients processed out of them.


----------



## juggernaut (Nov 18, 2011)

Josh, are you a keto dieter? Because if you are, it's best to start out with processed carbs in the first one or two meals and move gradually over to complex carbs such as potatoes and yams. The reason why is that you'll have a much more comfortable and non-gassy/bloating experience.


----------



## Josh99 (Nov 18, 2011)

Thanks for the responses. I forgot yams were a good source of carbs, are they any good lol never had. 

And the reason why I asked if grains were bad is because I have read alot if paleo/caveman diet articles and stuff and those say not to eat grains because our body cannot digest them propery because those are not edible in nature without being processed. But idk if I believe that.

And juggernaut I am doin keto I love it. What first two carb meal would you suggest and how many grams of carbs? I'm at 2000 calories a day about but I zigzag it and on Sunday I'm goin to do carb up and have about 3000 calories that day. I was just wondering if grains were healthy cause all this stuff I have read has me confused lol. And also I'm doing a 24 hour fast before carb up cause I like fasting, that ok?


----------



## juggernaut (Nov 18, 2011)

Josh99 said:


> And juggernaut I am doin keto I love it. What first two carb meal would you suggest and how many grams of carbs? I'm at 2000 calories a day about but I zigzag it and on Sunday I'm goin to do carb up and have about 3000 calories that day. I was just wondering if grains were healthy cause all this stuff I have read has me confused lol. And also I'm doing a 24 hour fast before carb up cause I like fasting, that ok?



I wouldnt do 24 hours-more like 18 hours is just fine. Start out  the day with a tension workout, but before you do that, you'll need to eat 1-2 pieces of fruit about an hour before training to refill your liver glycogen. It makes sense to do it this way. Liver holds, I believe 50g of glycogen. After that, it will mostly shuttle into your muscle. 
After the workout, best to use 5g of creatine, a scoop of whey and finally I'd go as much as 100g of dextrose. 
Second, try rice krispies, a good sized portion, or maybe a few slices of white bread and jelly with a smallish amount of protein and some more creatine. 
Next meal, try some instant rice or some quick oats with a protein source. 
This is the meal where you start transitioning over. Have a baked potato or two with some peach jam. It's really good. 
After that meal, a sweet potato or two, or brown rice. Possibly some macaroni. Yes, I know it has grain but to nail the carbs, this might be a great idea. 
Repeat this meal a few hours later. 

Digestive enzymes really help a lot with this. There's also some anecdotal evidence that R-Ala will help as well when ingesting carbs. A good product is AST R-ALA. Take in extra water-30-40oz more. This will help the carbs get to where they need to be. Load with 20-25g of creatine mono throughout the day to help reglycogenation. PM me if you need some help.


----------



## AmM (Nov 18, 2011)

Now I'm looking forward to my pancakes and fat free ice cream breakfast this sunday!!! Get creative refeeds are fun.


----------



## Josh99 (Nov 18, 2011)

Thanks juggernaut


----------



## sassy69 (Nov 18, 2011)

I'm still interested in understanding the context of how grains are "bad" carbs? Oatmeal helps make my competition existence doable. 

My guess is the primary context is gluten allergies?


----------



## Josh99 (Nov 18, 2011)

If you want to read more of why people think grains and oats are bad you can go to marksdailyapple.com and type in grains and there are many articles about it. They say that for millions of years humans didn't eat grains and we only started eating them when we developed agriculture (don't know if I spelled that right) which wasn't that ling ago is you look at how old humans are. They say that our body hasn't adapted to digest grains or something like that yet. I'm pretty sure I'm missing somethings but if u want u can check it out.


----------



## juggernaut (Nov 18, 2011)

Josh99 said:


> If you want to read more of why people think grains and oats are bad you can go to marksdailyapple.com and type in grains and there are many articles about it. They say that for millions of years humans didn't eat grains and we only started eating them when we developed agriculture (don't know if I spelled that right) which wasn't that ling ago is you look at how old humans are. They say that our body hasn't adapted to digest grains or something like that yet. I'm pretty sure I'm missing somethings but if u want u can check it out.



I'll pass. I do know that some people are gluten intolerant/allergid to grains, as I happen to be one of them. But, dont think all grains are bad. Just be careful. Bread is the biggest bitch for me. If I eat anything bread-related, I get stomach pains. I love pizza, but I do gluten free dough (I make it from scratch). Also, some carbs are better than others for glycogen loading.


----------



## suprfast (Nov 18, 2011)

My wife has a gluten allergy and its been a damn blessing in disguise.  Basically no breads in the house and zero wheat dishes.  We still eat white and brown rice but even I feel less bloated having dropped the wheats.  Oats and brown rice are a damn staple though.

On the plus side, check out canned pumpkin(like they use in pumpkin pie obviously).  Its so damn good for you.  







9 grams of carbs with 5 being fiber.  WTF.  Okay, so ive been on a damn pumpkin craze lately, I guess its Thanksgivings fault.


----------



## ~RaZr~ (Nov 18, 2011)

I would hate to be born with Celiac disease (gluten intolerance). To those who live with it, MAD props to you.


----------



## Hubauer (Nov 18, 2011)

Josh99 said:


> And juggernaut I am doin keto I love it. What first two carb meal would you suggest and how many grams of carbs? I'm at 2000 calories a day about but I zigzag it and on Sunday I'm goin to do carb up and have about 3000 calories that day. I was just wondering if grains were healthy cause all this stuff I have read has me confused lol. And also I'm doing a 24 hour fast before carb up cause I like fasting, that ok?



Mind posting up your macros on a low carb day?


----------



## Josh99 (Nov 18, 2011)

This is what I had Tuesday it varies everyday but basically the same but I switch around calories

Fat-131g
Pro-233g way to high right
Carbs-58 this was highest all week had to many veggies lol and almonds

2287 cals about


----------



## Merkaba (Nov 18, 2011)

juggernaut said:


> ... Liver holds, I believe 50g of glycogen. After that, it will mostly shuttle into your muscle.
> ....



The liver actually holds about 150 to 200g of glycogen.


----------



## juggernaut (Nov 19, 2011)

Merkaba said:


> The liver actually holds about 150 to 200g of glycogen.



Oh shit. I made an error. thought I hit the 1 key


----------



## Merkaba (Nov 19, 2011)

juggernaut said:


> Oh shit. I made an error. thought I hit the 1 key



Yea that might make a big difference when deciding how many bowls of cereal I want to bash on a carb load.


----------



## Josh99 (Nov 19, 2011)

Aight I did my carb load today and it makes me love the keto diet cause I feel like crap lol.
I totally lost track of how many calories I ate cause I just ate till I felt my muscles get that full feeling. I'm goin to do like a modified UD2 diet thing that fits my schedule and see how it goes.
Tomorrow starts my depletion with a 60min jog at good pace (I love cardio don't call me weird) I'm also goin to do a upper day of depletion weights and a lower day. This sound ok?
Also had like 30g of creatine today


----------



## juggernaut (Nov 20, 2011)

Josh, what exactly is your training protocol of choice for this? I was going to say to get the best bang for the buck, Lyle McDonald says a high rep depletion workout works beautifully.


----------



## Josh99 (Nov 20, 2011)

Ya I'm goin to do lyles type of workouts. But on carb up should I do str training?
MONDAY: Chest, Back, Abs

High intensity workouts with 60 sec rest between sets, 90 sec rest between

each exercise

(this excludes all warm up sets)

Bench 3 sets, 6-10 reps

T-bar Row 3 sets, 6-10 reps

Incline bench 3 sets, 6-10 reps

Latpulldown to front 3 sets, 6-10 reps

Dips or Decline bench 3 sets, 6-10 reps

Shrugs 3 sets, 6-10 reps

Flys (any type) 2 sets, 10-12 reps

Reverse flys 2 sets, 10-12 reps

Stiff-leg deadlift 3 sets, 10-12 reps

Rope ab crunch 3 sets, 10-15 reps

Reverse crunch 3 sets, 10-20 reps

TUESDAY: Shoulders, Arms

Same intensity mentioned before

Behind the neck shoulder press 3 sets, 8-10 reps

Military press 3 sets, 8-10 reps

Preacher curls 3 sets, 8-10 reps

French press or "skull-crushers" 3 sets, 8-10 reps

Shoulder raises (any type) 2 sets, 8-10 reps

Hammers 3 sets, 8-10 reps

V-bar tricep press 3 sets, 8-10 reps

Forearm curls 2 sets, 8-10 reps

Reverse forearm curls 2 sets, 8-10 reps

Wednesday: Rest or Cardio

Thursday morning: Rest or Cardio

Later on Thursday: Legs

Same intensity mentioned before

Squat or Leg press 4 sets, 6-10 reps

Lying leg curl 4 sets, 6-10 reps

Standing calf raise 4 sets 6-10 reps

Leg extensions 4 sets, 10-12 reps

Seated leg curl 4 sets, 10-12 reps

Seated calf raise 4 sets, 10-12 reps

Friday night: Final Workout

Same intensity mentioned before

Bench 2 sets, 6-10 reps

T-bar Row 2 sets, 6-10 reps

Incline bench 2 sets, 6-10 reps

Latpulldown to front 2 sets, 6-10 reps

Behind the neck shoulder press 1 set, 8-10 reps

Military press 1 set, 8-10 reps

Either curl exercise 2 sets, 8-10 reps

Either tricep exercise 2 sets, 8-10 reps

Stiffleg deadift 1 set, 8-10 reps

Normal floor ab crunch 2 sets, 10-20 reps

Reverse crunches 2 sets, 10-20 reps

Start the carb up for 24-30 hours!


----------

