# HCG Question for TRT



## mr.magoo (Mar 7, 2011)

I am going to start TRT with plan listed below:

My question is regarding the 500IU HCG every third day.
Is there a problem of taking approx 175IU of HCG every day instead of the 500IU every day?

*Testosterone Treatment Dosages for Men*
*- 50mg Testosterone enanthate every third day.*
*- 0.25mg Arimidex every third day.*
*- 500IU HCG every third day.*

*All medications taken on the same day.*


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## SloppyJ (Mar 7, 2011)

Edit: Mis-read the OP.


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## heavyiron (Mar 7, 2011)

There is a rat study showing a refractory period with HCG so every 3.5 days is probably better.


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## mr.magoo (Mar 7, 2011)

Ok thanks.  If I understand you are saying in order for the hcg to remain effective for ongoing basis it is better to take the higher 500IU dosage twice a week...otherwise it loses its effectiveness with constant daily use.  Thanks.


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## HereToStudy (Mar 7, 2011)

You might want to read this article, E4D is certainly the ideal in my opinion. 

HCG – Unraveled | Primordial Performance Blog


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## heavyiron (Mar 8, 2011)

mr.magoo said:


> Ok thanks. If I understand you are saying in order for the hcg to remain effective for ongoing basis it is better to take the higher 500IU dosage twice a week...otherwise it loses its effectiveness with constant daily use. Thanks.


 When they administered HCG on consecutive days the second dose had no further effect at that time but when they waited a few days the effect of the follow up administration had an effect.


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## Mr.BIG (Mar 8, 2011)

heavyiron said:


> When they administered HCG on consecutive days the second dose had no further effect at that time but when they waited a few days the effect of the follow up administration had an effect.


 
Heavy, I been reading a lot on this forum and you always seem to know whats up! Not trying to bash ya or anything negative at all, just seems you know more than the average folk, are you a chemist or just do a lot of reading?


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## cutright (Mar 8, 2011)

When doctors prescribe HCG the protocol is your dose whatever it is every 3 days. 
I trust heavyiron when it comes to AAS he's been there done it and perfected it IMO. Doctors only read about it if they get bored.


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## SUPERFLY1234 (Mar 8, 2011)

mr.magoo said:


> I am going to start TRT with plan listed below:
> 
> My question is regarding the 500IU HCG every third day.
> Is there a problem of taking approx 175IU of HCG every day instead of the 500IU every day?
> ...



if you are on trt why run so much hcg? why not run 100mg of t e3d? running .25mg of arinidex e3d seem to be a waste. why not ed?


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## mr.magoo (Mar 8, 2011)

HeretoStudy...Great link to info on HCG!  Thank you....and Heavy's comments seem to confirm concept in this article that indeed there needs to be days off in between HCG shots to maintain effectiveness.

The article suggests 250iu every 4 days  starting 14 days after your first AAS dose. and to drop hCG about the same time as  last Testosterone Enanthate  shot. It goes on to provide more detailed info that is slightly different when ending if using orals.

Excellent and helpful information!  Thank you.


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## mr.magoo (Mar 8, 2011)

Superfly,your question on Arimidex dosage of .25mg e3D intrigues me. I got this is from a specific protocol I found online, and to varying degrees seems to align with other info I have located, but I would not call it pefect info.  You seem to think that this dosage of Arimidex should be ED?  Please explain....and thank you for your comment.


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## heavyiron (Mar 8, 2011)

mr.magoo said:


> HeretoStudy...Great link to info on HCG! Thank you....and Heavy's comments seem to confirm concept in this article that indeed there needs to be days off in between HCG shots to maintain effectiveness.
> 
> The article suggests 250iu every 4 days starting 14 days after your first AAS dose. and to drop hCG about the same time as last Testosterone Enanthate shot. It goes on to provide more detailed info that is slightly different when ending if using orals.
> 
> Excellent and helpful information! Thank you.


 The article isn't bad but I have had discussions with the author and we disagree on the dose. His dose is too low to restore ITT levels. I provided a study to prove it and he could not refute it with science. Just FYI.

You need about 500iu HCG twice weekly to restore ITT levels while on testosterone.


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## heavyiron (Mar 8, 2011)

mr.magoo said:


> Superfly,your question on Arimidex dosage of .25mg e3D intrigues me. I got this is from a specific protocol I found online, and to varying degrees seems to align with other info I have located, but I would not call it pefect info. You seem to think that this dosage of Arimidex should be ED? Please explain....and thank you for your comment.


 Arimidex has a short half life in males due to our T levels. Most guys rely on female studies to dose adex. However adex has a longer half life in females so we cannot use the data and apply it to men. Take the adex more often and get labs to see how it effects your E2.


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## BigBlackGuy (Mar 8, 2011)

heavyiron said:


> The article isn't bad but I have had discussions with the author and we disagree on the dose. His dose is too low to restore ITT levels. I provided a study to prove it and he could not refute it with science. Just FYI.
> 
> You need about 500iu HCG twice weekly to restore ITT levels while on testosterone.



Hmm...

Low-Dose Human Chorionic Gonadotropin Maintains Intratesticular Testosterone in Normal Men with Testosterone-Induced Gonadotropin Suppression -- Coviello et al. 90 (5): 2595 -- Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism

Is this the study you're basing that off of?  Looks like your recommendation of 1000iu per week is around what they used (750-1000) to get within 7% of ITT baseline.


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## heavyiron (Mar 9, 2011)

BigBlackGuy said:


> Hmm...
> 
> Low-Dose Human Chorionic Gonadotropin Maintains Intratesticular Testosterone in Normal Men with Testosterone-Induced Gonadotropin Suppression -- Coviello et al. 90 (5): 2595 -- Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism
> 
> Is this the study you're basing that off of? Looks like your recommendation of 1000iu per week is around what they used (750-1000) to get within 7% of ITT baseline.


 
Yup,

250iu eod is 875iu HCG weekly. This was a bit short of baseline as you posted.


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## rocco0218 (Mar 11, 2011)

I have been prescribed hcg by my doctor and he recommends twice a week injections.


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## Mr.BIG (Mar 12, 2011)

mr.magoo said:


> I am going to start TRT with plan listed below:
> 
> My question is regarding the 500IU HCG every third day.
> Is there a problem of taking approx 175IU of HCG every day instead of the 500IU every day?
> ...


 
Personally I would NOT be doing this in the way you are planning! 

-HCG needs to be taken the day before you inject your Test E! Twice a week!

-Arimidex needs to be taken the day after you inject your Test E! I would try twice a week maybe even once a week cause you are taking such a low amount of Test!


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## mr.magoo (Mar 12, 2011)

Mr. Big thank you for your comments.  I am convinced HCG should be twice a week...and with your advice I will inject day before Test E taken. 

The Arimidex at .25mg was suggested to take ED.  Would this dosage and daily administration work against your thoughts on taking day after taking Test E?

(Lastly, I am awaiting my supplies to arrive so I can begin testing this TRT program!)


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## supperfly1977 (Mar 12, 2011)

here is how are doctor will prescribe HCG on HRT.
Complete HRT Medication Instructions:
Testosterone Cypionate 200mg:
10ml vial premixed, oil based solution.
No refrigeration needed, keep out of direct sunlight in a cool, dry place.

Dosage: 1.0 ml per week, once a week.
Use a 20 gauge 1 1/2 inch needle syringe to withdraw testosterone.
Use a 23 gauge 1 1/2 inch needle syringe to inject.

Injection Site: Intramuscular injection.
Gluteal posterior lateral, below your beltline in the area of the high hip pocket.

Anastrozole (Arimidex) 0.5mg:
Use 24 capsules of Anastrozole 0.5mg per each testosterone therapy.

Dosage: Take one (0.5mg) capsule every week. The day after your Testosterone injection.

Purpose: Blocks negative feedback caused by estrogen.


HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin):
10ml or 11ml vial of HCG / 10ml vial of bacteriostatic water.
*(MULTI-DOSE VIALS - MUST BE REFRIGERATED AFTER
RECONSTITUTING).
Mixing Instructions:
Using a 3ml / 20 gauge needle syringe, draw 5.5 ml (11.000 units) or 5.0 ml (10.000 units) of bacteriostatic water and load the water into the HCG vial. Swirl well and refrigerate vial after reconstitution.

Dosage: 25 units on insulin syringe 2X per week. T-1, T-2 days prior to your Testosterone injection

Injection Site: Subcutaneous injection. Use a 30 gauge 1/2" insulin syringe to
draw HCG for injection. Administer near the naval just below the skin, gently
pinch up the skin and inject at a right angle to the injection site using a quick
smooth motion.


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## Mr.BIG (Mar 12, 2011)

^This is exactly how the doctor will want you to do this! BUT, to keep blood levels accurate and stable you should inject every 3.5 days of the Test, for example, Monday morning and Thursday night, then inject the HCG Sunday morning and Wednesday night, and IMO I would take the Anastrozole Tuesday morning and Friday night, if you start to feel your nipples getting sensitive then up the dose, you want a little of the Estrogen for growth, sex and all around well being 

I hope this helps you and if for any reason you need more info please read this link:

http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/104658-first-cycle-pct.html


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## mr.magoo (Mar 12, 2011)

*Revised Plan After Input from the Forum:*

*- 100mg Testosterone Enanthate Monday Mornings & Thursday Nights
**
- 0.50mg Arimidex Sunday Morning & Wednesday Night*

*- 500IU HCG Tuesday Mornings & Friday Nights

Does this look better than original plan?*


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## Mr.BIG (Mar 12, 2011)

mr.magoo said:


> *Revised Plan After Input from the Forum:*
> 
> *- 100mg Testosterone Enanthate Monday Mornings & Thursday Nights*
> 
> ...


 
You want to switch the Arimidex and the Hcg days!

Arimidex needs to be taken between 24-48 hours after injection!

HCG gets your boys started a day before you inject your base (Testosterone)!

Therfore Arimidex the day after test! and HCG the day before test!


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## mr.magoo (Mar 13, 2011)

Mr. Big, thanks!  Got it ...get the boys going first!


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