# Short blast cycles



## Night_Wolf (Jul 24, 2011)

1. Is anyone doing/done short (4w) cycles?

2. Idea is:
-4 week cycle + 4 weeks off + repeat
-using fast acting injectables and orals
-PCT after each cycle
-no cortisol problems
-some AI during cycle (Arimidex 0.5mg eod)
-induce max muscle gain when receptors are fresh
-side effects minimized due to short cycle length
-no long cycles, cortisol problems, crash in long between cycle time, easier to keep gains

Something like this:
 W          GEAR
1-4 T Prop 150mg /eod
1-4 Winstrol 30mg /ed
1-4 Arimidex 0.5mg /eod
1-4 HCG 500IU /e 5 days
5-7 PCT (Clomid)
1-4 Liv52

This would be 1st cycle.
-Hardcore training+nutrition+supplements+sleep
-Training seriously for 4 years
- Age: twenty something
- Planing to compete


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## Dannie (Jul 24, 2011)

Yeah, buddy I've read some good articles about short cycles. However most people are very sceptic about them. 
 I will start series of short cycles in September. On 4-5wks ON, 4wks OFF basis. 

Test P as a base + other fast acting inj or oral.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

I think it could work out well.. perhaps even better than long 12-16week cycles for recovery.


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## Night_Wolf (Jul 24, 2011)

Dannie said:


> Yeah, buddy I've read some good articles about short cycles. However most people are very sceptic about them.
> I will start series of short cycles in September. On 4-5wks ON, 4wks OFF basis.
> 
> Test P as a base + other fast acting inj or oral.



Nice.
What do u think about cycle that I've outlined? Maybe 2nd would be same as 1st?


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

When Ben Johnson got caught breaking the Canadian Olympic Teams drug protocol in the Olympics there was a 2 week long 8 hour a day TV show in Canada on how the worlds top track teams use steroids. It was called the Dubin Inquiry. Dr. Jamie Estaphan, Team Canada's drug guru and Charlie Francis the coach of team Canada (which has had 3 different world record holders in the 100 meters) shared the protocol they used for their athletes. It was protocol perfected by the russians and eastern europeans.

In a nutshell the offseason was 3 weeks on Test Suspension and Stanozolol. hit the weights extremely hard....go off for 3 weeks and try to retain 90% of the strength gains from the cycle. Then hit it again and again. Always trying to solidify the gains made on drugs and make them real. It was a stair step approach to making gains and then making them your own.

That information certainly shaped how I utilized drugs while helping bodybuilders train and wincompetitions in the 80's and 90's. 

The theory was that you were never on long enough to shut down, get sides or burn out receptors. Drugs were a supplement to intense training and perfect nutrition. Gains had to be real or they were insignificant.

I see lots of guys on here running 750mg to 1000mg of test for 12 to 16 weeks plus a ton of other drugs. Nothing made me happier than seeing those guys show up all distended with swollen nipples and nice acne against my guys.

Night Wolf....Your on the right track.


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## sofargone561 (Jul 24, 2011)

this made me curious


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## Dannie (Jul 24, 2011)

Night_Wolf said:


> Nice.
> What do u think about cycle that I've outlined? Maybe 2nd would be same as 1st?





> 1-4 T Prop 150mg /eod
> 1-4 Winstrol 30mg /ed
> 1-4 Arimidex 0.5mg /eod
> 1-4 HCG 500IU /e 5 days
> ...



Spot on. I will be running Test P and Winny as well as my 2nd short cycle, 1st will be Test P and NPP. 
Also you will need 5000IU of HCG so you may as well run it at 500IU e4d for 6 weeks. If you choose to run it for 6 weeks run Armidex for 6 weeks as well.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

_Not my own writing but very good info on short cycles here._

As many of you already know I have had decent success with short cycles.  I, along with some of my friends and clients, have had good results  with cycles as short as 14 days long.

I no longer do cycles longer than 4-6 weeks as I am simply sick of the  sides that build up after 4-6 weeks and I no longer feel comfortable  walking around with a shitty lipid profile for months on end.


WHAT QUALIFIES AS SHORT

"In my book" any cycle 6 weeks or less is a short cycle. Personally I  now think that 4 weekers give the best gains to sides ratio.

You can do 2 weeks "on" 2-4 weeks "off"
You can do 4 weeks on and 4-6 weeks off
Or you can do 6 weeks on with 6-8 weeks off.
4 weeks on and 4 weeks off, year round, gives excellent results and you are only "on" half the year. 

WHY DO THEM

#1.
If you are one of those bro's that does longer cycles, of say 10-12  weeks or more, and then wisely takes an equal amount of time off, and  you are tired of loosing so much of your gains post cycle due to the  length of the time off...the yoyo affect....then why not try doing  shorter cycles with their corresponding shorter off times......  obviously you don't gain as much with a short cycle but then again you  don't loose as much post cycle either due to the shorter off time.

Now... over say a year of doing 4 on 4-6 off you are gong to get very  similar results as that seen from doing longer cycles of say 12 "on"  12-14 off but with less yo-yo affect and less sides. In fact most of my  clients that do 4-6 week cycles tell me that they are actually getting  better gains over a years use.

#2.
Do them to have less of a negative impact on ones lipid profile and to have less total time per year with a poor lipid profile.

Some of you may not know that androgens, taken at even newbie  bodybuilding doses, alter everyones lipid profile. Everyone sees their  hdl(good cholesterol) take a huge "nosedive" and most also see their  ldl(bad cholesterol) go up to some degree but not to the same degree  that hdl decreases. Generally hdl decreases 40-70% in as little as 2  weeks and ldl increases an average of 36% in 4 weeks. In my experience  this reduction in hdl puts all bro's hdl WELL below the pathological  minimum of 35. My ldl does not elevate above the pathological level of  160 but others see ldl's well above 160.
Lipid levels typically normalize within 3-10 weeks after discontinuation.
( details taken from article in Medscape)

Here are my "numbers" from the last long cycle of test 750mg/week and tren  75mg/day. A powerful stack but not a huge dose of gear. It's been as  bad with less powerful gear and lower doses. Blood work done after week  7.

Total cholesterol 181...not bad.
ldl 160...not very good
hdl 11.6! CRAPPY big time
Cholesterol to hdl ratio 15.7 to 1...ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE! This is when my doc and I had a COW at the same time.
Triglycerides 50...good.

Here is my "baseline" without gear

Chol 152...great
ldl 106...great
hdl 45-48...good
tri 50..good 
chol to hdl ratio....3.16 to 1.....good

.As far as I and my endochrinologist are concerned this lipid altering side of gear use is the single worst side of steroid use.
In as little as a week hdl decreases. Personally my brother-in-law and I  really see a huge decrease after about 3 weeks "on' cycle. The last  time I did a long cycle my total cholesterol to hdl ratio plummeted to  15 to 1!...My doc had a cow and so did I!!

According to current medical thought ones total cholesterol to hdl ratio  is the single greatest LIPID indicator for assessing ones chances of  developing heart disease. Men with low total cholesterols but with  crappy hdl have gone on to develope heart disease WITHOUT ANY OTHER RISK  FACTORS such as smoking, or diabetes.

Ideally you want an hdl of at least 40 and a ratio of 3.5 to 1 or better.

My mentor, the late great MIKE MENTZER died of heart disease at age 50  and I know for a fact that ARNOLD had more than valve surgery(I am an  operating room nurse as well as a trainer)


#3.
Do them to decrease liver stress.
Generally long cycles with non 17aa roids are not that hard on the liver  but sometimes one can get into trouble. The short cycle allows for less  total stress on the liver and the frequent "off" times allows the liver  to regenerate very well.
Generally a healthy liver can take pretty big "hits" for short periods  of time without any problem ...it is long term stress that cause liver  damage(as seen with elevated GGT enzyme levels)

#4.
Do them if you want to "tone down" your use of steroids.

#5.
Do them if you do NOT want to use HCG during a cycle to prevent  testicular atrophy. HPTA shut down will be complete in as little as a  week "on" but testicualr atrophy is minimal due to the short length of  this shut down. This then allows for better HPTA recovery post cycle.
It is small testes that makes HPTA recovery slow because GnRH from the  hypothalamus and LH from the pituitary normally rebound pretty rapidly.
* There will be some testicular shrinkage in any cycle so if you do 4  "on" 4 "off" for several cycles in a row then it would be a good idea to  use hcg at 500iu's every 3rd day while "on" to prevent testicular  atrophy...the 4 weeks "off" may not be enough time to allow for complete  testicular recovery and over the span of several cycles this may impact  your HPTA recovery.

You certainly can use hcg while on any short cycle to prevent any  testicular shrinkage if you like but it really isn't necessary.

#6.
Do them if you do not want to see much in the way of water retention and  do not want to use an estrogen inhibitor or an ace inhibitor(diuretic) 


#7.
Do them if you get high blood pressure and do not wish to use the above mentioned ancillaries.

#8. Do them if you are sick of androgenic sides such as ance, prostate hypertrophy and hair loss(if prone to hair loss) etc etc.
Androgen sides come on for two reason...dose used and especially length  of time "on". I do not get acne until after 4 weeks on and then I get  hammered.....and I hate it.

#9.
Do them if you are tired of walking around with high estrogen levels for  months on end and do not wish to or cannot afford to use an estrogen  inhibitor. High estrogen levels are NOT good for the prostate at all!

You certainly can use estrogen inhibitors if you like if you want to  keep estrogen levels down and experience very little water retention.


WHY NOT TO DO THEM

Obviously if you compete at a high level then short cycles are probably  not the best for you, BUT I think they are the best way to use steroids  for the vast majority of bro's.
Top competitors need to be "on" either all the time or most of the  time....thats unfortunate but usually necessary in order to get freaky  huge which is now needed to win big.


WHAT TO EXPECT

If one is not yet at ones natural maximum level of muscular developement  then very good gains can be seen of up to 15 pounds and 10 pounds kept  after a 4 weeker...as long as you train correctly as a natural post  cycle.

If one is off gear and has dropped to ones natural max then a short  cycle can add up to 10 pounds. If you take no more than 6 weeks off  after each four weeker you will not loose much...then in each successive  cycle you can still gain but the gains will be smaller the further you  get from your natural max.

Those that are off cycle and have not yet shrunk down to their natural  max can still gain well with successive short cycles but don't expect to  win at the national level.

One of the things I like about short cycles is the short time "off"  between cycles.......muscular atrophy is minimal during the off time and  you are allowing for frequent bodily normalization after minimal time  "on". LESS SIDES IN GENERAL, LESS TIME WITH A SHITTY LIPID PROFILE and  LESS MUSCLE LOSS POST CYCLE.

NOTE: You cannot get "freaky big" in this way...that takes very big  doses and spending most of the year, for years on end, on steroids as  well as GH and slin, and that my freinds is simply not a good idea  unless you plan to make your living as a bodybuilder.

Getting pretty darn big in small steps is a safer way to use gear  IMHO...and it messes less with one head too. Some guys really get  depressed during "off" times of 12 or more weeks waiting to start their  next cycle.


GEAR CHOICE and RATIONAL

The idea behind short cycles is to "get in" quick, hit the androgen  receptors hard, get some gains, and then get the hell out as fast as  possible so as to minimize sides. So with this in mind one should only  use orals and rapid acting/clearing injectables. The limited time "on'  simply doesn't justify the use of the "slower" esterfied injectables  like deca etc. Also, these same roids take too long to clear the system and that too goes against the philosophy of short cycles.

The gear choosen should be powerful for best results and doses need to  be decent as well in order to get the most from the short time on.
You can use mild gear like anavar but your results will be reduced.

BEST Gear

d-bol
test prop
tren
anadrol

BEST stacks.

Personally I think d-bol/tren  cannot be beat. There is only one roid that is better than testosterone,  in the short run, IMHO and that is d-bol...too bad it's 17aa.

test prop/tren
test prop/tren/winny
test prop/anadrol
test prop/d-bol


STACKS AND DOSE EXAMPLES

I like tren and I like d-bol and especially for a shorty. YES NEWBIE you can use these strong androgens and NO tren is not hard on the kidneys(myth). 

Some guys think I am nuts for recommending tren for a first cycle and they say it is too harsh.... but most of the same bro's will recommend a long cycle of test/d-bol for a newbie and I can assure you that a long cycle of test/d-bol is going to give you more sides than a shorty with tren and d-bol. Bro's test is just as "harsh" as tren  and it causes a good deal of water retention, with resultant increase  in BP(bad in some bro's) unless you use an estrogen inhibitor....and  shit test/d-bol stacks are WAY "harsher" than tren.

The only issue with tren is the  frequent injecting required.....but I know some of you newbies have been  researching for a long time and are fine with the idea of frequent  injections(they aren't that bad!)


Novice... tren/D-BOL....

tren 50mg/day for 4 weeks and d-bol 30mg/day in 4 divided doses per day(one right before bed) for 4 weeks.
Two days after last tren do clomid  at 200-300mg on day one in divided doses and then 50-100mg/day for a  week and then 50mg a day for 3 more weeks. OR...Nolva at 80mg on day one  in divided doses followed by 40mg/day for a week and then 20mg/day for 3  more weeks.
Have nolva or clomid on hand for gyno protection.

More advanced...200 of tren on day one as a front load to get tren levels up pronto and then 75mg/day for 4 weeks. D-bol 50mg/day in 4 divided doses for 4 weeks. SERMS as above

Novice...test PROP/tren

test prop 75mg/day for 4 weeks and tren 50mg/day for 4 weeks. Serms as above. Nolva on hand.

more advanced.....test prop 300mg on day one and then 100-200mg/day for 4 weeks. tren 75mg/day. An estrogen inhibitor might be needed.

MEGA STACK... ADVANCED
test prop 300mg on day one and then 100mg /day for 4 weeks, d-bol 50mg/day and tren  75mg/day......LOOK THE HELL OUT! Have the nolva on the tip of your  tongue he he he ...arimidex at 1-1.5mg/day would be wise even for the  short 4 week period.

SINGLE STEROIDS

D-bol really is an unreal roid and as I said it is even better than test in the short run IMHO.
One can get very nice results from d-bol alone at 50mg/day for 4-6  weeks. Don't take it for longer than 6 weeks though as it is a 17aa roid  and as such is somewhat hard on the liver.
D-bol for 6 weeks at a time was a favorite cycle length in the old days and produced excellent gains. 

test prop can be run all by itself at 75-200mg/day with great results too.



OKAY.....BUT YOU SAY YOU ONLY HAVE sust, EQ, cyp etc

Long chain esterfied roids and tests are not the best choice for the  shorty, as explained above, but they can work pretty well IF you do  pretty large front loads. FRONT LOADS simply help to get blood hormone  levels up more quickly.

ie: Intermediate user doing test cyp ...do a FRONT LOAD of at least 800mg on day one...then 2 days latter do 400mg and then every 4h day do another 400.
400 every 4th day is equal to 700mg per week.

Run the cyp for 4-6 weeks and you'll get some decent gains from it.

* Best to use tren with this cycle....or d-bol (1 mg of arimidex/day if using d-bol and test)

* After the last shot of cyp  you are going to have to wait for a couple weeks for androgen levels to  drop before you start PCT and this is akin to lengthening the cycle.



BLOOD LIPIDS

You might want to consider taking the worlds best hdl improver while "on" cycle...NIACIN!
Nothing even comes close to niacins hdl incresing powers. Personally it  has not helped my hdl while "on' nor has it helped my brother-in-laws,  but you might see some level of improvement(don't expect a great  improvement though since androgens do such a great job of messing with  hepatic lipaze)

Nicain comes in three forms...regular, extended release(Niaspan) and non  flush niacin. Niaspan is the best and works well at 1500mg/day taken  once daily. Regular niacin works well at 600-1000mg three times a day  but it gives a nasty ichy flush for a while after taking each pill.
Non flush works fairly well at 2-3 grams a day but not as good as the others IMHO.


Use nicain while "off" for sure as it will rapidly improve your shitty hdl level.
NOTE*** niacin can be hard on the liver so never use it with acutane  which is hard on the liver. You really should have liver panels done if  you use niacin for more than 6 weeks and be followed by a doctor(Swale  would be good) especially if you are on steroids as well.

ENTER POLICOSANOL

DrVeejay11(real doctor) introduced me to another great lipid  protector/improver and it too raises hdl BUT BONUS...it lowers ldl too..  and it's not liver toxic at all so you could use this stuff all the  time with no worries.
Do a search at www.medscape.com for abstracts on POLICOSANOL.


I recommed that all be followed by a doctor while on steroids or at the  very least educate yourself about the sides of steroid use and how to  avoid the pitfalls by following yourself with blood work at labs that do  not require a docs script(especially liver panels... and psa for us  older guys) And guys at a minimum also watch your blood pressure while  on gear at your local drug store monitoring station....keep the BP under  140 over 90 if you can especailly if you are "on" for months on end.


Best of gains and health to you all.


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## sofargone561 (Jul 24, 2011)

^^ very good reading


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## Dogoa12 (Jul 24, 2011)

I only do short burst cycles.
But I dont have an alternative, because of the job.

The best I found was a 4 week cycle. Ofcourse followed by PCT.

Test prop/Tren Ace/Tbol cycle.

This is doing a good job at changing the body comp.


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

I like these cycles. I ran a lot of 4 on 4 off cycles with athletes. Often doing two mass oriented cycles followed by a real hard cut for 4 weeks on and 4 weeks off. You can hit the dosages a little harder since the duration is shorter. So easy to stay nutritionally focused for shorter phases of training. Keeps it fresh and exciting all the time. Easier on the joints as well. 16 weeks of full bore strength and mass training can fry elbows, hips, shoulders...low back. you name it. 

I admit my knowledge of proper use of AI and PCT has been greatly enhanced by being on this forum. Us old schoolers had to be more cautious with dosages and durations as sliding off and keeping gains was far more difficult without access to PCT gear and the knowledge to use it. 

During the 4 weeks off


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

During the 4 weeks off hit creatine and preworkout pump enhancers to keep getting a good pump through the off weeks.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

Dogoa12 said:


> I only do short burst cycles.
> But I dont have an alternative, because of the job.
> 
> The best I found was a 4 week cycle. Ofcourse followed by PCT.
> ...



How long is your PCT and what do you use?


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## Night_Wolf (Jul 24, 2011)

Dannie said:


> Spot on. I will be running Test P and Winny as well as my 2nd short cycle, 1st will be Test P and NPP.
> Also you will need 5000IU of HCG so you may as well run it at 500IU e4d for 6 weeks. If you choose to run it for 6 weeks run Armidex for 6 weeks as well.



Yeah thx. I forgot to write that. 

I like your replies


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

Thats a great post Minimal!

I'd add Test Supension and TBol into the gear list.
There is a great post somehere on here by Heavyiron on Test Suspension.
I personally don't find Test Suspension as painful as real prop. I put a lot of guys on stage using Test Suspension. 

Test Suspension, Winny and TBol.....nice short cycle. Quality gains.
I don't use UGL water based products.....I want HG for those.

I like Dog's Prop, Tren Ace, TBol blast as well!

I had a tough time keeping A50 gains on guys after 4 weeks. It's a very powerful drug...Blew guys up hard and crashed hard. I stopped using it in favor of TBol and DBol. Proper PCT may help to keep the gains but that stuff is really toxic. I know guys that took the real brown bottle, red label Anadrol50 and started to see blood in their stool in less than two weeks.

But then again Dianabol and then Methandrostenolone from europe used to come in little blue bottles with 100 little 5 mg tabs in it. 2 with BFast and 2 with supper would blow most guys up with just a little water retention and no other sides. You could slide right off it no problem. Who on here would ever dream of 20 mgs of DBol?


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## james-27 (Jul 24, 2011)

Dogoa12 said:


> Test prop/Tren Ace/Tbol cycle..



Why tbol? Don't it take 3-5 weeks to feel anything off tbol? Id run dbol with an AI


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## MDR (Jul 24, 2011)

I think anything less then eight weeks isn't worth it.  Even a few weeks will shut you down, so you might as well get some bang for your buck.  Eight on/eight cruise works well for a blast and cruise, IMHO.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

MDR said:


> I think anything less then eight weeks isn't worth it.  Even a few weeks will shut you down, so you might as well get some bang for your buck.  Eight on/eight cruise works well for a blast and cruise, IMHO.



I think the duration of suppression also matters.  There would be less testicular atrophy and degeneration of HPTA with shorter cycles.  With fast acting compounds, I feel that 4-6 weeks is still very reasonable.


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

I have never experienced an oral that took 3 to 5 weeks to kick in. That was real.

Blast and cruise. Is that just not a nice way to say "I can never stop taking gear." I wonder if all the guys on here on TRT that have totally destroyed their own endocrine systems from long duration, high dose cycles with no time off wish they had experimented with some shorter cycles with faster acting gear and real down time.

I felt the exact same way as MDR years ago. And there are drug choices that 8 weeks would actually be a little too short. All I can say now is that I beat a lot of long cycle guys with athletes doing shorter duration cycles and busting ass between cycles to keep the gains.

There isn't only one way to get it done. Experiment a little. Find what works for you. The goal is to get the desired gain from a cycle with the lowest exposure to gear and the least amount of side effects as possible. 

Or it could be the other Bodybuilder's goal....If your going to bury me in a box.....Make sure it's a big box!!


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

I agree completely Minimal!


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## MDR (Jul 24, 2011)

minimal said:


> I think the duration of suppression also matters. There would be less testicular atrophy and degeneration of HPTA with shorter cycles. With fast acting compounds, I feel that 4-6 weeks is still very reasonable.


 
Shutdown is still a problem at 4-6 weeks, and to me stretching it out to 8 weeks is about right for a short cycle. You end up spending about as much time in PCT running 4-6 week cycles as you do on. Not the best way to go, I don't think.  PCT is stressful on the system, too, and spending 1/2 the year in recovery sounds like a nightmare.  I much prefer to run a longer cycle, do 4 weeks of PCT and spend some time off completely so everything recovers.  The fact is, if you are either on or in PCT all the time, the body never gets a complete break.  I also think that maintaining gains during this time is very possible with proper training and diet.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

MDR said:


> Shutdown is still a problem at 4-6 weeks, and to me stretching it out to 8 weeks is about right for a short cycle. You end up spending about as much time in PCT running 4-6 week cycles as you do on. Not the best way to go, I don't think.



It's true that you will spend more time in PCT with shorter cycles, but the upside is that you will be able to jump back on another cycle quicker.  At least in theory that is.


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## MDR (Jul 24, 2011)

minimal said:


> It's true that you will spend more time in PCT with shorter cycles, but the upside is that you will be able to jump back on another cycle quicker. At least in theory that is.


 
I hear ya, I'm just not convinced that the theory works too well in practice.  The idea of all that time spent in PCT worries me.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

MDR said:


> I hear ya, I'm just not convinced that the theory works too well in practice.  The idea of all that time spent in PCT worries me.



What aspects of PCT are that stressful to the body?  Aren't we just blocking estrogen from pituitary gland to trigger FSH?


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

you guys know more about PCT than I do. Would there be the exact same PCT protocol required for a 4 week cycle as for a longer 8 to 12 week cycle?


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

Mavrik said:


> you guys know more about PCT than I do. Would there be the exact same PCT protocol required for a 4 week cycle as for a longer 8 to 12 week cycle?



In theory, you should be able to run shorter PCT with shorter cycles.  But that may also depend on the individual and only way to know for sure is blood work.


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

yeah bloodwork is the key to all of it no doubt. It tells the truth. The Canadian track team was running 3 week cycles of winny and aq test because that eliminated the need to run pct altogether. So stretch it out to 4 weeks or 5 weeks and add an ai and some clomid. I know a couple National Level Canadian bodybuilders that won't touch hcg because it affects their nipples worse than gear. Everyones an individual....


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## OldSchoolLifter (Jul 24, 2011)

IMO I have been cruising for some time, and I have run many "bump" cycles what I call them, If I weren't cruising I would hate to blast for 4 weeks, then pct and repeat each time.

But from my experience, I will cruise 4-6 weeks, then bump 4-6 weeks cruise 4-6 and repeat. Its been pretty effective thus far.


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

Old school.....what's an example of a cruise and a bump for you?


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## OldSchoolLifter (Jul 24, 2011)

Mavrik said:


> Old school.....what's an example of a cruise and a bump for you?




Cruise @ 250-300mg/wk 4-6 weeks

Bump
Test E 300mg/wk
Test Prop 150mg/eod
Tren Ace 100mg/eod
Dbol 50mg/ed

^^ 5 Weeks

Back to cruise,  Test E 300mg/wk

Or 

Test E 300mg/wk
Test Prop 100mg/eod
Test Suspension 100mg 3x per week before heavy days.
NPP 100mg/eod
Masteron 100mg/eod
Choice of Oral

^^^^
5 weeks. Back to cruise, Test E 300mg/wk

Alot of times Il bump,cruise bump, cruise Blast 12-15/wks cruise bump and so on


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## independent (Jul 24, 2011)

Is pct really needed for a short cycle?


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## Mavrik (Jul 24, 2011)

That's cool....It's very similar to what I do minus the cruise on Test.
I like to keep the natural endocrine system up and running.
Are you ever completely off and check your natural test levels?


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## jonnybravoSA (Jul 24, 2011)

Short cyles, awesome! Recovery is just so much better, also less people talk S*>? as gains are more gradual and i found i kept more of my gains!


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## OldSchoolLifter (Jul 24, 2011)

Mavrik said:


> That's cool....It's very similar to what I do minus the cruise on Test.
> I like to keep the natural endocrine system up and running.
> Are you ever completely off and check your natural test levels?



No I'm already technically on TRT, so I dont really care about my natural levels anymore. I just found a way to make the best out of my trt, and its been fiun


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

jonnybravoSA said:


> Short cyles, awesome! Recovery is just so much better, also less people talk S*>? as gains are more gradual and i found i kept more of my gains!



whats your PCT protocol?


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## MDR (Jul 24, 2011)

minimal said:


> What aspects of PCT are that stressful to the body? Aren't we just blocking estrogen from pituitary gland to trigger FSH?


 
You need a SERM to recover from even a short cycle, and using a SERM that often would undoubtedly be very stressful on the system.


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## minimal (Jul 24, 2011)

MDR said:


> You need a SERM to recover from even a short cycle, and using a SERM that often would undoubtedly be very stressful on the system.



So how is SERM stressful to the body?


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## JCBourne (Jul 24, 2011)

So basically, you can do 4-6 weeks on, 4 weeks off, on, off, on, off? Seems like something my rat would try a few times after one more heavy cycle. Rats never used prop and don't like to pin a ton, but my rat would like to try and see what results. prop/dbol for 6 weeks seems 2-3 times and see what results I get would be interesting.


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## MDR (Jul 24, 2011)

minimal said:


> So how is SERM stressful to the body?


 
It is a drug after all. Despite being relatively safe, there are multiple side-effects. For example, many people have issues with sight on Clomid, along with emotional issues, dizziness, headache, ect. Clomid is designed for female fertility problems. I know I don't enjoy being in PCT, but it is a necessary part of any cycle, unless of course you are doing a blast and cruise.


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## JCBourne (Jul 25, 2011)

The more I read about short cycles, the more it makes sense for newer users. Minimal you have opened a gate I would have never researched. Thank you. Hope other guys have input.


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## Dogoa12 (Jul 25, 2011)

minimal said:


> How long is your PCT and what do you use?



I normally use arimidex for PCT.
But in the same time I am on ZMA all year round. It really helps me to raise my own test production fast.
So it looks something like this

1 - 4 150mg Test prop EOD
1 - 4 150mg Tren Ace EOD
1 - 4 60mg Tbol ED
1 - 7 0,5mg Arimidex ED

And if the balls shrink I do have HCG ready.

I would like to change Tbol with Oral trenbolone in the future, and maybe add some proviron to the mix.


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## Mavrik (Jul 25, 2011)

The blast and cruise concept presented on this forum "a lot" is something to be careful of if you care about maintaining your own testicular functioning. Old School uses a cool system of blasts, bumps and cruises but as he says... he is already onto TRT. 

I agree with Gym Rat and Mininal it's good to hear something other than "you have to run 1000mgs of Test E for 12 weeks or your wasting your time and then cruise." Someone may not choose to use shorter duration cycles for themselves but it is good to discuss options that may not basically guarantee the need for TRT in the future.

I've always been more cautious with the athletes I advised (and myself) than throw caution to the wind. Maybe I put too much emphasis on keeping testicles working. I'm weird like that! What the hell.....there is always cialis!


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## JCBourne (Jul 25, 2011)

Bump


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## Night_Wolf (Jul 26, 2011)

As I wrote in my first post, this would be my 1st cycle:

W          GEAR
1-4 T Prop 150mg /eod
1-4 Winstrol 30mg /ed
1-4 Arimidex 0.5mg /eod
1-7 HCG 500IU /e 5 days
5-7 PCT (Clomid)
1-4 Liv52

1.Is this enough Winstrol?

2. Can someone brainstorm and write 2nd, 3rd and 4th cycle ideas (4 week cycle, mass cycle)? Just curious what r u gonna come up with hehe


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## Night_Wolf (Jul 26, 2011)

Bump


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## minimal (Jul 26, 2011)

Night_Wolf said:


> As I wrote in my first post, this would be my 1st cycle:
> 
> W          GEAR
> 1-4 T Prop 150mg /eod
> ...



Don't use HCG during your PCT.  Use arimidex during PCT also.  

I personally don't think you'd need HCG for a 4 week cycle though.


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## Dannie (Jul 26, 2011)

Night_Wolf said:


> As I wrote in my first post, this would be my 1st cycle:
> 
> W          GEAR
> 1-4 T Prop 150mg /eod
> ...



1. I start to feel winny at 50mg/day

2. 
Test P + Dbol
Test P + NPP
Test P + Tren A

To those last 2 you may also add Anavar (at least 70mg/day) to keep as much gains as possibly


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## Night_Wolf (Jul 26, 2011)

@Dannie

1. Cool, I'll probably bump it.

2. I must look out for gyno (I have pubertal gyno). That's why I will be taking Arimidex 0.5mg /eod.
Test P + Tren A will probably be my 3rd cycle.
Insulin anyone?


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## bishop22 (Jul 26, 2011)

MDR said:


> I hear ya, I'm just not convinced that the theory works too well in practice. The idea of all that time spent in PCT worries me.


 
I agree, if half the year is spent "On" and the other half is spent in PCT..

Where the time needed were your off everything so your body can regulate and return to homeostasis?

There is always a basic thumb rule.

Time "On+PCT" = Time OFF.


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## Night_Wolf (Jul 26, 2011)

bishop22 said:


> I agree, if half the year is spent "On" and the other half is spent in PCT..
> 
> Where the time needed were your off everything so your body can regulate and return to homeostasis?
> 
> ...



Some guys r doing PCT with stuff like high dose of Tribulus, T-boosters like Novedex-XT and so on.

U can do 4w on-4w off or 4w on-6w off or whatever, it doesn't need to be 4-4.


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## Dogoa12 (Jul 26, 2011)

I normally do 4 weeks on and then 12 weeks off.
It is my personal experience that when I hit the max during the last week of my cycle I will go a little down during my PCT.
Then the next 12 weeks after the cycle I try to find my max without gear. And If I push my self hard enough it will be the same as when i finished my cycle.
This is where I think that muscle-memory plays a role. (just my thoughts)
So I just boost my strenghts for 4 weeks and stabilize the next 12 weeks.
this has been really good for me in the past.


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## Night_Wolf (Aug 1, 2011)

Yo

I spoke to some friends, and we came up with this (possible) plan:

(priming b4 cycle)

Cycle 1
  W           Gear
1-4 T Prop - 150mg /eod
1    Proviron - 50mg /ed
2-6 Arimidex - 0.5mg /eod
5-7 PCT (Clomid)
8-9 Off

Cycle 2
  W           Gear
1-4 T Prop - 150mg /eod
1-4 Tren Ace - 80mg /eod
1    Proviron - 50mg /ed
2-6 Arimidex - 0.5mg /eod
5-7 PCT (Clomid)
8-9 Off

Cycle 3
  W           Gear
1-4 T Prop - 150mg /eod
1-4 Tren Ace - 80mg /eod
1-4 Insulin - slowly up to 10IU
1-4 T3 - up to 75mcg
1    Proviron - 50mg /ed
2-6 Arimidex - 0.5mg /eod
5-7 PCT (Clomid)
8-10 Off

Between Cycle 3 and summer cutting:

1-3 Insulin - slowly up to 10IU



Regarding orals, don't want to take dbol, ad50 cuz of my gyno. Andriol, primo, anavar are not cost effective and decided not to take winny cuz it won't help much, want to put my money better into perfect nutrition.

p.s. perfect nutrition, training and supplementation are considered.

Opinions?


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## Night_Wolf (Aug 1, 2011)

Bump


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## Dannie (Aug 1, 2011)

All good, your balls may suffer thus you may wanna run HCG through the 3rd cycle, so you hit the summer cut with big balls  jk


Also I prefer to run tren for cutting as it rises my body temp and gives me morning sweats (most ppl I know sweat during the night, I am fine at night,  I start sweating when I get to work!) 
So perhaps 3rd cycle may be your cut cycle. 

Test P + NPP + Slin is great mass building stack. You may wanna consider that as your 2nd or 3rd cycle (and perhaps you could run Test + Tren as your 4th one  )


Its also very easy overeat and gain fat while on slin, you may wanna run 75mcg T3 2days on 2 days off.  Or just avoid any fats 2-3h after shot (2 for novorapid, 3 for humalog).


Good luck, If you'll have some spare time do a summary thread after each cycle and PM me, I will be looking forward to read it.


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## ted8541 (Aug 1, 2011)

sofargone561 said:


> this made me curious



^^^  x2


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## Night_Wolf (Aug 1, 2011)

Dannie said:


> All good, your balls may suffer thus you may wanna run HCG through the 3rd cycle, so you hit the summer cut with big balls  jk
> 
> 
> Also I prefer to run tren for cutting as it rises my body temp and gives me morning sweats (most ppl I know sweat during the night, I am fine at night,  I start sweating when I get to work!)
> ...



Ups, I forgot to write HCG 

NPP is great, but I would like to skip on nandrolones, for now.

Regarding slin, I'm VERY strict with my diet, so fat gain should be at minimum.

I think I'm gonna add 1 extra off week after 2nd cycle and 2 extra off weeks after 3rd cycle and than start cutting. (this can change, is a long way till next summer)


I'm gonna post summary here, will let u know.


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## ted8541 (Aug 27, 2011)

Bump.

Great thread.


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## Usealittle (Aug 27, 2011)

Shic's are tits! 4-6 wks on and the same off.

First shic I did was 1sust 250ed for 7 days gained 17lbs in 4wks... Some water but not much never lost striations in my shoulders, so it wasn't to much.

Second time I ran 1sust 250 for 7days and 350mg prop for the last 3wks..... Very simple, easy on the body... Easy to come back from.


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## Mkpaint (Aug 27, 2011)

i have yet to do a cycle thinking about it and this thread has me thinking of trying short 4-6 week especially since i'm nervous about sides. good info


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## _LG_ (Aug 27, 2011)

Very interesting.  Thanks Minimal.  Mind sharing where your post info came from?


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## ted8541 (Aug 27, 2011)

minimal said:


> _
> 
> STACKS AND DOSE EXAMPLES
> 
> ...


_


I don't see NPP mentioned anywhere.  What about a 4-6 week test prop, NPP or test prop/NPP/d-bol stack?  What are your thoughts about NPP for short blasts?_


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## Usealittle (Aug 27, 2011)

Any short ester is perfect for shic's.... 2-3oils with and oral, and you have a bitchin cycle.


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## JCBourne (Aug 28, 2011)

Bump for more advice/input from people who have done this.


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## Digitalash (Aug 28, 2011)

What about short blasts while on a cruise?


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## JCBourne (Aug 28, 2011)

Digitalash said:


> What about short blasts while on a cruise?



I'm not sure. But this thread is about guy's who are doing short cycle. If you don't mind bro making a new thread. 

Not trying to be a jerk, but trying to stay on topic here.


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## Digitalash (Aug 28, 2011)

GymRat4Life said:


> I'm not sure. But this thread is about guy's who are doing short cycle. If you don't mind bro making a new thread.
> 
> Not trying to be a jerk, but trying to stay on topic here.


 

No problem bro, I made a thread and it hardly got any responses 

My input though, it's not worth spending that much time in PCT.


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## existone (Aug 29, 2011)

Bump for more info on experiences people have had with this style of running gear?


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## Night_Wolf (Aug 29, 2011)

@GymRat4Life

Why u gave me negative rep points? I started this thread. wtf


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## JCBourne (Aug 29, 2011)

Night_Wolf said:


> @GymRat4Life
> 
> Why u gave me negative rep points? I started this thread. wtf



My bad, I got you mixed up with someone. I'll send some positive rep your way asap. Sorry about that.


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## Beckman818 (Aug 29, 2011)

I'm in my 40's, and a newbie to gear, even though I've been a gym rat for 20 years. Over the lady year I've ben learning all I can from forums like this. I'm leaning towards short cycles myself because of the health issues,  ie. Sides, hdl, etc. Mavrik, I'd like to hear more about your "cut cycles.


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## Usealittle (Aug 30, 2011)

existone said:


> Bump for more info on experiences people have had with this style of running gear?



Shic's are fun and easy.... 

Take 1-3 fast esters with or without 1 oral run then all at 2-3x the normal dose for 4-6 wks then drop off or back to a cruise dose of 2-250mg test wk.


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## Mavrik (Aug 30, 2011)

Hey Beck....I sent you a PM.


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## pieguy (Aug 30, 2011)

Usealittle said:


> Shic's are fun and easy....
> 
> Take 1-3 fast esters with or without 1 oral run then all at 2-3x the normal dose for 4-6 wks then drop off or back to a cruise dose of 2-250mg test wk.



So something like 750 test, 500 tren, 50mg dbol everyday for 6 weeks ? Sounds like fun.


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## Night_Wolf (Aug 30, 2011)

pieguy said:


> So something like 750 test, 500 tren, 50mg dbol everyday for 6 weeks ? Sounds like fun.



That would be advanced dosage, and u would need aromasin/arimidex with that for sure.
4 weeks max is a short cycle.

I hope that I will be starting a series of short ones in 6-8 weeks. My first will probably be Test Propionate 100mg ED for 4 weeks. (thinking of adding 30mg of dbol).


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## ted8541 (Aug 30, 2011)

I've got another long cycle (12 wk) coming up in November.  I've already geared up for it.  But I'd like to run a series of short blasts next year.

For a first short 4 week blast, I'm thinking 150 test prop EOD, 100 NPP EOD, 35mg dbol ED.  I'll add HCG, Aromasin and Caber throughout the cycle and finish with Aromasin and Clomid for PCT.

Any comments?


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## Usealittle (Aug 30, 2011)

pieguy said:


> So something like 750 test, 500 tren, 50mg dbol everyday for 6 weeks ? Sounds like fun.



Yeah you could do that. Shic's are 4-6 wks but 4 is optimum. Useing all short esters, not enth esters use prop or ace esters. As for the oral I would go 75-100mg..... I know that sound like alot but the amount of time is short.


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## Usealittle (Aug 30, 2011)

ted8541 said:


> I've got another long cycle (12 wk) coming up in November.  I've already geared up for it.  But I'd like to run a series of short blasts next year.
> 
> For a first short 4 week blast, I'm thinking 150 test prop EOD, 100 NPP EOD, 35mg dbol ED.  I'll add HCG, Aromasin and Caber throughout the cycle and finish with Aromasin and Clomid for PCT.
> 
> Any comments?





For a blast.... I would double it. Everything.

I'm not a big fan of using more then needed but iv done them and they work well. Get on get off..... Easy on the body to come back.


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## Night_Wolf (Aug 31, 2011)

ted8541 said:


> For a first short 4 week blast, I'm thinking 150 test prop EOD, 100 NPP EOD, 35mg dbol ED.  I'll add HCG, Aromasin and Caber throughout the cycle and finish with Aromasin and Clomid for PCT.



Really nice. I would substitute NPP for 75mg of Tren A EOD. Ancillaries are perfect!

Don't double it lol, but it depends on your size and cycle history.


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## Usealittle (Aug 31, 2011)

It's a blast.... Not a normal long cycle. 150mg prop eod is only just over 500mg, witch for most is nothing! (not me). 500mg is a cycle not a blast......

So if you want a blast double it for 4wks.


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## renohawj (Aug 31, 2011)

Good read!


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## Chrisotpherm (Aug 31, 2011)

I have really enjoyed this thread gents.  A lot of great information here. Any ideas on a test only short blast? Just curious?


V/R
Chris


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## Usealittle (Aug 31, 2011)

Prop or ace ester at 2-3 x your normal dose. But I think 2 oils or 1oil with 1 oral would be much better then 1huge dose of test.

JMO


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## Chrisotpherm (Aug 31, 2011)

^^^Hmm something to think about.


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## Night_Wolf (Sep 1, 2011)

Test P
Test P/Dbol
Test P/Anadrol
Test P/Tren A
Test P/Tren A/Winny

Another idea is to let estrogen run wild for first 15 days and watch for signs of gyno and female pattern fat deposits (have Nolva on hand) and than introduce AI starting day 15.
(estrogen can increase IGF-1 production, it also increases androgen receptor-site sensitivity)


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## Chrisotpherm (Sep 1, 2011)

Night_Wolf said:


> Test P
> Test P/Dbol
> Test P/Anadrol
> Test P/Tren A
> ...



Just the mention of gyno makes me shutter.  I want nothing to do with that business.  


V/R
Chris


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## mr.giggles (Sep 1, 2011)

-I remember hearing/reading that receptor site stimulation is maximum around weeks 3-8, so if cycles were 4 weeks some may say that would be a little too short.. ?  Anyone hear of this..? 

-I think this is why Ronnie Rowland aimed his literature aorund 8wk blast and cruises..


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## Usealittle (Sep 1, 2011)

The body does need to have estrogen flowing to get proper muscle growth. You don't want to much be your body does need some.

Only time u want to cut it all is leading up to a show or for pics.


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## rjd (Sep 1, 2011)

What is an example of a short burst cycle to lean out? Not trying to bulk up.


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## pieguy (Sep 1, 2011)

rjd said:


> What is an example of a short burst cycle to lean out? Not trying to bulk up.



test P + tren ace would be the ideal cutting cycle. It's technically best as a recomp cycle, but essentially, recomp is just cutting and gaining a few lbs of lean mass. Best of both worlds. Tren increases feed efficiency meaning it takes all that protein you ingest and puts them to work for you, even in a reduced calorie setting.


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## rjd (Sep 1, 2011)

pieguy said:


> test P + tren ace would be the ideal cutting cycle. It's technically best as a recomp cycle, but essentially, recomp is just cutting and gaining a few lbs of lean mass. Best of both worlds. Tren increases feed efficiency meaning it takes all that protein you ingest and puts them to work for you, even in a reduced calorie setting.


 
Thanks bro. I have some Testoline (test e & test cyp blend). Will that be ok to run with the tren ace?


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## pieguy (Sep 1, 2011)

Yeah, test c and e are almost identical. However, if we're talking short blast cycles, test c and e aren't really ideal. Most don't feel test C/E till at least week 4 so by the time you've started to feel it, you're already done. You can frontload, but it's still not great.

Hell, test p doesn't even kick in for some until week's 3 and 4. Tren is up and running usually in 1-2 weeks for most if not all. Shit's really strong if dosed correctly and dosed daily.


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## Chrisotpherm (Sep 1, 2011)

This is a great thread and a lot of wisdom going on here.  My hats off to you gents for sounding off.  Lot of younger guys can learn so much here.  


V/R
Chris


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## Usealittle (Sep 1, 2011)

rjd said:


> What is an example of a short burst cycle to lean out? Not trying to bulk up.



Test pro/ tren/winni/mast prop for a oral tbol or var.... Something like that 2 or 3of the oils..... 

But no matter what your gonna gain size.


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## Usealittle (Sep 1, 2011)

Chrisotpherm said:


> This is a great thread and a lot of wisdom going on here.  My hats off to you gents for sounding off.  Lot of younger guys can learn so much here.
> 
> 
> V/R
> Chris




If and when I bite the bullet and go on HRT, other then my dose I WILL only do shic's. Less drama with my body, skin and anger wise.


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## Usealittle (Sep 1, 2011)

pieguy said:


> Yeah, test c and e are almost identical. However, if we're talking short blast cycles, test c and e aren't really ideal. Most don't feel test C/E till at least week 4 so by the time you've started to feel it, you're already done. You can frontload, but it's still not great.
> 
> Hell, test p doesn't even kick in for some until week's 3 and 4. Tren is up and running usually in 1-2 weeks for most if not all. Shit's really strong if dosed correctly and dosed daily.




If your prop ain't kickin in till wk 3 or 4 then what u got ain't what u think it is.


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## Chrisotpherm (Sep 2, 2011)

Usealittle said:


> If your prop ain't kickin in till wk 3 or 4 then what u got ain't what u think it is.



^^^^Agreed.


V/R
Chris


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## nickg923861 (Sep 2, 2011)

How about a 4 week blast using test prop/ tren ace/ mast prop and replacing the oral with some suspension preworkout? Im going to be trying this out in the upcoming weeks.


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## pieguy (Sep 2, 2011)

^^^ I think your dosing protocol is what's most important for how effective your blast will be. You going to be running 75mg daily? 50mg daily? 100/50/50?



Usealittle said:


> If your prop ain't kickin in till wk 3 or 4 then what u got ain't what u think it is.



That's what I was worried about honestly. I'm pretty sure my source is reputable, but I'm wondering if they sent me test e instead of p. it's either that or I didn't notice the effects because I don't know what to look for. Increased libido started to happen around week 2 and maybe I shoulda took that as the first sign.


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## Usealittle (Sep 2, 2011)

nickg923861 said:


> How about a 4 week blast using test prop/ tren ace/ mast prop and replacing the oral with some suspension preworkout? Im going to be trying this out in the upcoming weeks.




If u have run any of these esters before, for a shic u SHOULD double the dose of all of them. That's a blast not a cycle. That's why it's only 4wk time span..


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## Usealittle (Sep 2, 2011)

pieguy said:


> That's what I was worried about honestly. I'm pretty sure my source is reputable, but I'm wondering if they sent me test e instead of p. it's either that or I didn't notice the effects because I don't know what to look for. Increased libido started to happen around week 2 and maybe I shoulda took that as the first sign.



with prop I feel in in 4days... Not 2wks, but then again some just don't respond to prop well. I know pantera have the same issues with prop as you do so..... How knows?!?!


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## pieguy (Sep 3, 2011)

Yeah honestly my first impression of aas hasn't been what I thot itd be. I expected massive strength gains and so far haven't seen them. Maybe this week they'll kick in cuz I really wanna reach a 315 bench. Even started dbol for a boost. Up 7-10 lbs after 3 weeks though so I'm still happy.


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## Chrisotpherm (Sep 3, 2011)

pieguy said:


> Yeah honestly my first impression of aas hasn't been what I thot itd be. I expected massive strength gains and so far haven't seen them. Maybe this week they'll kick in cuz I really wanna reach a 315 bench. Even started dbol for a boost. Up 7-10 lbs after 3 weeks though so I'm still happy.



It takes time though bro and at least 3-4 to really know if they are right for you and your body.  Also finding the best stack or combo plays a huge part along with diet and exercise regime.  I'm sure you will be taking off soon with your gains bro.   Good luck!


V/R
Chris


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## gmta99 (Sep 7, 2011)

nickg923861 said:


> How about a 4 week blast using test prop/ tren ace/ mast prop and replacing the oral with some suspension preworkout? Im going to be trying this out in the upcoming weeks.



DOOOO ITTTTTT...  lol
see ya at the gym,, pick things up and throw them down


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## jdawg5349 (Jul 3, 2022)

Night_Wolf said:


> 1. Is anyone doing/done short (4w) cycles?
> 
> 2. Idea is:
> -4 week cycle + 4 weeks off + repeat
> ...


I have no idea if anyone will see this but I hope this helps someone...
I have personally been experiencing with the Run N Gun method but with a twist on the dosages as I've been following guys like Victor Black and really like their approach on a "safer" approach to gear use. I feel like today's society we got a lot of new guys that rely too much on the drug use and not proper training, recovery, sleep, and most importantly PROPER NUTRITION. I'm a big advocate for using the least amount possible to get the most out of it while keep side effects at a minimal. Please keep in mind, what works for one person may not for another. I always use bloodwork to help create my cycle layouts and have been experimenting this past year and have always kept my health in check along with full recovery, meaning full recovery from PCT. So to get to it, ive incorporating the Run N Gun method with Victor Blacks conservative take on dosages and compounds. So here's my next cycle layout to cap off the end of the year. I'm not saying you can use this method to step on stage, but im also not saying you possibly cant.
So for my next layout itll be a total length of 16 weeks, broken up into two 4 week blasts with two 4 week cruises then pct.

Weeks 1-4: Blast One
Test Prop: 250mg 
Npp: 300mg
Mast Prop: 200mg 
Anadrol: 25mg PWO 
Winstrol: 25mg PWO
*Total Load: 1,000mg*

Weeks 5-8: Cruise
Test Prop: 150mg 
with add ons

Weeks 9-12: Blast Two
Test Prop: 300mg 
Tren Ace: 250mg
Mast Prop: 200mg
Anavar: 25mg PWO
Winstrol: 25mg PWO
*Total Load: 1000mg  *

Weeks 13-16: Cruise 
Test Prop: 150mg 
with add ons

*Add ons: Proviron will be ran throughout whole cycle 25-50mg, hcg 250 IUs x3 a week, Hgh 1-2 IUs daily or Mk677 10-20mg; metformin 500mg, injectable carnitine 200-300mg, for second blast will add t3/clen as it will be my cutting portion of the plan.

I've been researching and experimenting and this has worked for me and kept me healthy and allowed full recovery. We're all built different so use your body and experiment. I wanted to throw my two cents out there on a possible 'safe' yet effective way to cycle and enjoy the process along the way!


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