# What to eat before and after cardio WHEN BULKING?



## k.smith.4 (Apr 26, 2010)

I'm a beginner who's trying to bulk up. The thing is, I have a basketball training once a week. It's pretty intense and it lasts around 1,5 hour. Although I know you shouldn't do much cardio when bulking, I'm not planning to give it up, because I simply love basketball.

But I want to know what do you recommend me to eat before and after the training to minimize the loss of muscles?


----------



## Phineas (Apr 26, 2010)

Read the stickies for the basics on diet and bulking.

As for cardio, when I first started BB'ing I forsake cardio for a while, and I think that was a mistake. Even if you are a so-called "hard gainer" you're only going to burn something like 200-400 calories in a solid bout of cardio. That's so incredibly easy to replenish. If it doesn't interfere with your lifting (which it shouldn't...I don't but it when people whine about this...man up..15 minutes 3 times a week is nothing) and you eat to replace the lost calories than it's fine.

In fact, it will help you. The stronger your heart is the more oxygen-rich blood it can pump to your muscles when training (not mention all sorts of other benefits from cardio). I think it's ludicrous to cut out something so beneficial to your health just to make bulking easier. Despite what many non-lifters mistakenly believe, BB'ing involves the cardiovascular system a great deal. And so, why not take advantage of this link and increase your body's efficiency to exert itself?

Keep your cardio. It will do you good. Just make you eat enough.


----------



## Phineas (Apr 26, 2010)

Forgot to touch on the muscle loss thing.

This is blown way out of proportion to new lifters. I remember when I first started I was paranoid to even walk longer than a certain amount of time because, according to so many stupid web sites and articles from flashy supplements salesmen, you're entering the "muscle burning zone!" OOOHH NO!!

Really, unless you're running half marathons on a regular basis you're fine. It is better to keep your cardio short and sweet, but going as high as 30 minues 3 times a week is fine. I'd stick to 15-20, though, and focus on intensity.

Just eat like an hour before so you're not pushing on an empty tank. Muscle will be burned as a result of an poorly managed (or even worse an accidentaly) calorie deficit.

Also, you could invest in some glutamine. It's an amino acid supplement you take daily to prevent muscle degeneration (as well as improve recovery and help maintain immune system efficiency). It's often found in whey supplements, though in amounts of only a few hundred miligrams. Standard glutamine supplements, however, provide 5g per teaspoon (the daily dose).


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 26, 2010)

10oz Milk. Seriously. 
Clinically proven to rehydrate you faster and and help start initial repair and recovery.


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 26, 2010)

http://oakbrooksc.com/docs/stager_chocmilk_study.pdf


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 26, 2010)

Consumption of fat-free fluid milk after resistance exercise promotes greater lean mass accretion than does consumption of soy or carbohydrate in young, novice, male weightlifters -- Hartman et al. 86 (2): 373 -- American Journal of Clinical Nutritio


----------



## ceazur (Apr 26, 2010)

I have never heard that about milk.. Good shit bro


----------



## Merkaba (Apr 27, 2010)

I fucking LOVE milk when I'm thirsty after cardio.


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 27, 2010)

juggernaut said:


> 10oz Milk. Seriously.
> Clinically proven to rehydrate you faster and and help start initial repair and recovery.


 

milk is the shiznit . . the Capt still does cardio x 3/wk on a bulk. All early AM fasted state, he just drops 10g of BCAA before hand. That keeps the BF at a reasonable level . . plus it also shifts metabolism into overdrive.

pWO it's all about the milk  1/2L with 40g whey. All the Capt's shakes have milk over water. 

Mid-morning:

500ml low-fat milk
1 banana
4 whole eggs
2 egg whites
1 scoop whey
1 cup of oats


----------



## ceazur (Apr 27, 2010)

So whole milk mixed with my whey after my workout is the way I should go?


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 27, 2010)

meh, I stick to low-fat . . Im getting enough fats from other sources . . your call chief, just count your cals


----------



## ceazur (Apr 27, 2010)

haha alright, I haven't had whole milk in a year. Fat-free is the route i will take.


----------



## Merkaba (Apr 27, 2010)

ceazur said:


> haha alright, I haven't had whole milk in a year. Fat-free is the route i will take.



why not?  You're looking at probably 40 cals difference If I remember correctly...  If I'm really watching it I'll go skim, but otherwise its not worth it, plus milk fat has a few benefits.


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 28, 2010)

I formed a company with my buddy and business partner and introduced a new product that I emulated the same physical structure of lowfat milk with an insane taste. It's called All in 1 by our company called Beyond Nutrition. I still think milk is best, but it doesnt contain what we put into it. If you want more information, find it at Beyond Nutrition . We've been making the rounds around the bbing shows in the tristate area and have found that when people actually taste it, they love it. 

Not trying to pimp it, but we filled a need with this product and it centers itself around the structure of milk.


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 28, 2010)

ceazur said:


> So whole milk mixed with my whey after my workout is the way I should go?


whole milk after? No. Contains fat which slows the process. 1% or skim is best. I also drink skim during my 1 hour of cardio.


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 28, 2010)

juggernaut said:


> I also drink skim during my 1 hour of cardio.


 
Please enlighten the Capt on this theory!


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 28, 2010)

CaptRichArund said:


> Please enlighten the Capt on this theory!


Better rehydration...this is merely the abstract, but you get the idea.

*Milk as an effective post-exercise rehydration drink*

Susan M. Shirreffsa1 c1,  Phillip Watsona1 and Ronald J. Maughana1
a1 School of Sport and Exercise Sciences,  Loughborough University, Loughborough, LE11 3TU, UK
Article author queryshirreffs sm 

 

watson p 

 

maughan rj 

 

*Abstract*

The effectiveness of low-fat milk, alone and with an  additional 20 mmol/l NaCl, at restoring fluid balance after  exercise-induced hypohydration was compared to a sports drink and water.  After losing 1·8 (sd  0·1) % of their body mass during intermittent exercise in a warm  environment, eleven subjects consumed a drink volume equivalent to 150 %  of their sweat loss. Urine samples were collected before and for 5 h  after exercise to assess fluid balance. Urine excretion over the  recovery period did not change during the milk trials whereas there was a  marked increase in output between 1 and 2 h after drinking water and  the sports drink. Cumulative urine output was less after the milk drinks  were consumed (611 (sd  207) and 550 (sd 141) ml  for milk and milk with added sodium, respectively, compared to 1184 (sd 321) and 1205 (sd 142) ml for the water and  sports drink; _P_ < 0·001). Subjects remained in net positive  fluid balance or euhydrated throughout the recovery period after  drinking the milk drinks but returned to net negative fluid balance 1 h  after drinking the other drinks. T_*he results of the present study  suggest that milk can be an effective post-exercise rehydration drink  and can be considered for use after exercise by everyone *_except those  individuals who have lactose intolerance.
(Received  July 14 2006)
(Revised January 19 2007)
(Accepted January 24 2007)


I'm speaking strictly as a keto dieter, as these are really the only calories I'll get, but it is just enough to help me until my next meal a half hour later.


----------



## maseco63 (Apr 28, 2010)

*I train intensely*

I train intensly so my diet before and after cardio is the same before and after weights!...
No spam


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 28, 2010)

maseco63 said:


> I train intensly so my diet before and after cardio is the same before and after weights!...
> 
> No spam


Not to bust your balls, but could you tweak your statement so that it is as convoluted as others are thinking it is? My initial reaction was who gives a shit who gives a fuck....explain further.


----------



## ectomorph141 (Apr 28, 2010)

Merkaba said:


> I fucking LOVE milk when I'm thirsty after cardio.


I am also bulking and I am not kidding when I say I go through about 2 gallons of milk a week. I drink the 2% milk.   Back when I went from 141lbs to 171lbs in 3 months I even put powdered milk into everything I ate. It was easy, quick, dry calories and was actually suggested by members on this forum (which clearly worked). 
Right now for this bulk period I am not using the powdered milk yet, but I am drinking a ton of regular milk.   Milk for breakfast, milk in my mid morning protein shake,  milk in my post workout shake, and milk for dinner.  Love it especially after an intense workout.


----------



## sassy69 (Apr 28, 2010)

I guess I don't see a pickup game of hoops as "cardio" per se - so I think I'd be fueling FOR that game and the fueling to replenish during / following that game. I.e. you're sort of breaking even on cals in vs cals out. 

Perhaps a Gatorade + protein drink during? And then a carb + protein meal following?


----------



## Phineas (Apr 28, 2010)

juggernaut said:


> Not to bust your balls, but could you tweak your statement so that it is as convoluted as others are thinking it is? My initial reaction was who gives a shit who gives a fuck....explain further.



FYI -- this guy has been posting this binge eating shit and random RC surgery stuff all over the diet section. If you follow the links it takes you to a page that, though containing some very basic information, is flooded with flashy ads and whatnot. Merkaba reported him.

I'm so fucking sick of his random comments and links.


----------



## SilentBob187 (Apr 28, 2010)

Complex carbs and protein pre cardio (90min-2hrs works best for me, minimizing cramping/sloshing in the tummy)  Complex or Quick carbs (your choice,) and some protein afterwards.  I suppose if you're trying to bulk, the quick carbs would be fine.

Just make sure you're eating.  Liquid calories would be the easiest to keep up with around your cardio, but don't rely solely on them.  As sassy pointed out, protein powder and powdered gatorade.  It's cheap and gets the job done.

I may have to try this milk idea...I just hope I don't pull a Ron Burgundy.





YouTube Video


----------



## Built (Apr 29, 2010)

juggernaut said:


> whole milk after? No. Contains fat which slows the process.



Not to put too fine a point on it, but for us fatties - you bet, no point in cranking up the fat pwo. 

For k.smith.4 though, who's trying to keep his mass after a game? Bring on teh fats! Seriously, his need for calories exceeds his need to keep post-game "pure", kwim? 

k.smith.4, chocolate milk will do a body good. No need for anything else in there, just the chocolate milk. Drink lots of it. 



juggernaut said:


> I also drink skim during my 1 hour of cardio.



Especially if you've done something to mobilize FFAs before your cardio (such as lifting intensely, or HIIT), you'll reglycogenate while you burn off the mobilized FFAs. It has long been my contention that moderate post workout cardio while consuming pwo carb is an excellent way to encourage reglycogenation, since you're translocating GLUT4 in the process.


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 29, 2010)

Built said:


> Especially if you've done something to mobilize FFAs before your cardio (such as lifting intensely, or HIIT), you'll reglycogenate while you burn off the mobilized FFAs. It has long been my contention that moderate post workout cardio while consuming pwo carb is an excellent way to encourage reglycogenation, since you're translocating GLUT4 in the process.


 
interesting


----------



## dsc123 (Apr 29, 2010)

How much milk a day do you recommend for bulking?


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 29, 2010)

it's up to how you fit it into your diet calorie-wise. 

I aim for 1-1.5L/day, but my requirements may be more or less than yours mate


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 29, 2010)

MA, what about an individual who is on PSMF as a category 1 dieter and does an hour of cardio? Can that person still hit the moo juice?


----------



## Built (Apr 29, 2010)

Nope.


----------



## juggernaut (Apr 29, 2010)

crap


----------



## k.smith.4 (Apr 29, 2010)

As I see, you recommend complex carbs and/or milk before and after cardio.

So I guess it's all right to cook and eat *pasta or rice* before and efter training. I've got a few more questions for you on the subject 

- Which meal should be bigger - the one before cardio, or the one after?
- I read you should reduce carbs in the afternoon. But my training ends around 9 pm. Should I eat complex carbs afterward anyway?
- Also, should I worry about portions of rice or pasta before/after cardio being too big? I've no idea how much calories I burn during the training ...


----------



## Built (Apr 29, 2010)

k.smith.4 said:


> As I see, you recommend complex carbs and/or milk before and after cardio.
> 
> So I guess it's all right to cook and eat *pasta or rice* before and efter training. I've got a few more questions for you on the subject


Yes it is. In fact, one of my favourite post workout snacks is Indian style rice pudding, kheer: 

Got Built? » Kheer – it’s not just for bodybuilders anymore…


k.smith.4 said:


> - Which meal should be bigger - the one before cardio, or the one after?


You might get a gut ache if you eat a substantial meal before you train. Better to wait an hour or so. After is fine though. 


k.smith.4 said:


> - I read you should reduce carbs in the afternoon.


This myth needs to die. Seriously. 


k.smith.4 said:


> But my training ends around 9 pm. Should I eat complex carbs afterward anyway?


Unless you're on a keto diet, yes. 


k.smith.4 said:


> - Also, should I worry about portions of rice or pasta before/after cardio being too big? I've no idea how much calories I burn during the training ...


Just stay comfortable. The individual meals don't matter nearly as much as the daily total.


----------



## theCaptn' (Apr 29, 2010)

I have always had good results tapering my carbs throughout the day . .  workout/cardio early AM, refeed during the day, but dinner is purely vegetables/meat (if dieting) or vegetables/meat/minor amount of complex carbs (if bulking) .  . . .generally I go to bed within 1hr of eating, so want to minimise insulin output


----------

