# Strength vs Mass  (Why different reps?)



## erik150x (Jul 22, 2003)

I guess I would consider my self a new to weight training. I have done weight training before, but nothing very serious. Anyway, I am hoping someone here could explain something to me.

I have read on several sites that (in general) if you want to build mass, you should do like 8-12 reps, and if you want to build strength like 6-8 reps. Now, I have also read that in order to continue building mass, you must keep increasing the weight in any given excercise. Now wouldn't increasing your strength allow you to build more mass, becuase you can use more weight? So, why then not do the 6-8 reps as suggested for pure strength training? Of course I realise, it is not so cut and dry as this, and either range of reps will build some strength and mass over time. But, why is the best way of increasing strength not also the best way of increasing mass? :  I hope my question is clear.

Thanks.


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## Mudge (Jul 22, 2003)

You can still get stronger doing a mass building workout, and really powerlifters generally work from 8 reps DOWN to 1 rep, many bodybuilders have used 6-8 reps, Mike Francois and so on.

I like to sometimes throw in one or two heavy sets of 3-6 (whatever I end up doing).


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## erik150x (Jul 22, 2003)

Thanks you for the reply.  I'm not really sure this answers my question as to why for the most part 8-12 reps is recommended for mass, but not for strength.  I dont understand why there should be any difference in methods for strength vs mass.

I guess its not a very a exact science?


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## SkyDiver (Jul 24, 2003)

The strength training method is used by mainly athletes who want to get better at a sport, not bodybuilders. Doing strength training will increase you're speed in movement, and overall make the movements easier, but you will gain little mass. Bodybuilders are usually only interested in getting bigger.


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## Mudge (Jul 24, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by erik150x *_
> I guess its not a very a exact science?



There is such a thing as individuality to a point, which is why training is somewhat of a lifelong journey, you learn and grow with your diet and training as time goes on. But we know pretty much what gives a person endurance, hypertrophy, and strength.


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## ponyboy (Jul 24, 2003)

You also have to remember that there is a difference between power and strength.  Power is exerted over a shorter period of time and is more about force exerted.  Strength is more about time, I believe.  Please correct if I'm wrong...my physics is a little rusty.


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## Arnold (Jul 24, 2003)

The question is quite complex and cannot really be answered in a few posts, it would take a full length article at the least, maybe even a book. But a basic answer is muscle fiber types and which fibers are being stimulated, e.g. Type I, Type IIa, TypeIIb.

These two articles go in to some detail on the subject:

http://www.ironmagazine.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=44

http://www.ironmagazine.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=14


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## rburton (Jul 24, 2003)

Prince is correct, but from personal experience, I have found that 5-7 reps for upper body and 10-12 reps for lower body works best for me in developing a combination of strength and mass. I do train each set to failure, however, which, I think, plays a role in the preferred rep scheme.


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## erik150x (Jul 24, 2003)

Wow, this is a great forum.  I really appreciate all the feedback on my question.  I did a little research on my own, after reading another post on here which referred to sarcoplasmic hypertrophy.  It would seem to me that Prince is certainly right in saying that it is too complicated to answer in a few short posts.   It would seem there are several factors that come in to play.  Not only are different amounts and types of muslce fibers activated dependeing on the number of reps, but also the type of hypertrophic growth is different.  Then there is the whole nueromotor issue.  

I think its amazing how the more you try to understand about human physiology, th emore complicated it seems to get.

Anyway, thanks again all for your input.


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## bodyhard (Jul 24, 2003)

Erik where in NY are you at?


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## Mudge (Jul 24, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by erik150x *_
> I think its amazing how the more you try to understand about human physiology, th emore complicated it seems to get.



Which is EXACTLY what the first quote in my sig is trying to get at. The more you learn, the more you see that you yet dont know.

Truly wise people IMO are mentally humble, because they know this fact. Show offs usually dont know as much as they "think" they do.


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## erik150x (Jul 24, 2003)

I'm in Buffalo, NY.

Wisdom is knowing how much you don't know.


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## titans1854 (Jul 24, 2003)

i play football and i was wondering how many reps i should do on my bench press and squats to build strength? 

i'm more interested in strength at this point. i have tried doing less reps and more weight but i stopped because it feels like i'm not working as hard as i would for 10 reps. 

Also, should i do less reps and more weights on smaller muscles like the triceps and biceps?

thanx for the info.


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## Snake_Eyes (Jul 25, 2003)

Maximal strength is primarily neural and has to be trained as such, with heavy or fast movements.

Hypertrophy requires a level of fatigue to be achieved with a certain range of weights, in order to achieve the required biochemical signals.

Some rep ranges do both at once.


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## Mudge (Jul 25, 2003)

Start at 8-10 reps or so and work your way down through your sets.


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## Lean_Physique16 (Jul 25, 2003)

I say do 6 reps(the 6th should be near failure) for strength


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