# Dummies Guide to Overtraining



## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 9, 2002)

Ok...I guess that title will have to do.  Here are my fat stats:

Height: 5'7
Weight: 219 lbs
Waist: 38 in (supa fat, I know damn thing keeps growing)
Chest: 47.5 in (lat spread, cold)
Arms: 16.75 in (flexed, cold)
Quads: 28 in (flexed, cold)
Calves: 17 in (flexed, cold)

My obvious goal is to lose bodyfat while maintaining my lean mass as much as possible.

My workouts are currently set up like this:
Monday: Quads
Tuesday: Morning Cardio (45 mins, 70% MHR), Evening Chest
Wednesday: OFF
Thursday: Morning Cardio (45 mins, 70% MHR), Evening Back
Friday: Morning Cardio (45 mins, 70% MHR), Evening Shoulders
Saturday: Arms, Hams, and Calves

I use free weights as much as possible and sometimes mix in a machine or two for a different feel.  I've grown fond of the elliptical machine for my cardio because its easier to maintain my heart rate without feeling overwhelmed.  

My current diet consists of mainly lean beef (eye of round or top round with most fat removed before cooking), skinless chicken breasts, tuna, salmon, Kidney or pinto beans, whole oats, sugary instant oatmeal for post workout, some form of whole grain box cereal for breakfast, natural peanut butter, walnuts, cheese, and skim milk.

My supplements include: ISS Research Super Vitamin Paks, AST glutamine, Optimum Nutrition Creatine, Vitamin E & C, Acidophillus, Flax oil, some form of blended protien powder (currently VPX Micellean), and a fast absorbing whey for post workout.  I have ISS Research Zenotrope (fat burner) in my cabinet ready to go, but I'm hesitant to start taking it because my bf% is high in the neighborhood of 18-20%, I think.

My current maintenance requirement is at 3700 cals/day.  I know that is pretty high and I'll probably cut it today because I've been at that calorie level for 6 weeks and I'm starting to put on weight again.  I'm probably going to cut it to 3400 cals.  My current macros are 45p/35c/20f.  I drink about a gal of water daily.

For my workouts I'll document them like this:
Exercise: reps/weight

Any suggestions so far?

jeff


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 9, 2002)

Yesterday morning was leg day and this is how it went.  I replaced my usual leg press for hacks.

Cybex Leg Extensions (warmup): 20/75, 15/75

Barbell Squats (to parallel): 12/185, 12/275, 10/315, 10/315

Hack Squats: 15/90, 15/180, 15/270 (weights are plates only not including sled)

Cybex Leg Extensions: 15/150, 13/150, 11/150

I felt pretty good today in spite of getting only 4 hours of sleep.  I was trying to feel out the hacks because my left knee doesn't like them.  It got a little unstable with 270 on the sled but I kept an eye on it and cranked out a few more reps.

I won't post the diet because it was junky....had friends over from outta town.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 9, 2002)

This was taken last July 14th (I'm good with dates).  I think I was about 198lbs with a dumb "why do you want to take my picture" smile on my face.


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## butterfly (Jul 9, 2002)

Welcome aboard!!!  I know these guys will give you lots of great advice!!!


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## tgkfour1 (Jul 9, 2002)

Welcome to IM. Looking forward to your progress 

What do you hunt and How?


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## Fade (Jul 9, 2002)

Welcome aboard.

3400 still seems high to me. To loose the fat you'll need to cut your carbs.  

Don't forget about your hams on leg day.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 10, 2002)

Yeah I forgot to put in hams.  I usually do those on my calf and arm day.  I split my leg workout a few months ago and have seen some good progress in the hamstrings.  I just didn't put in the same effort on hams when I did them with quads.  

How many cals do you think I should cut from the 3700 I am eating now?  I am a little hesitant to drop too much.  I still have so much to learn about how my body is going to react while trying to lose bodyfat.  I can put on mass like a champ, but the bodyfat that I add in the process never wants to come off.

My chest day was Tuesday; didn't do cardio.

Incline Barbell Bench: 15/45, 12/135, 7/185, 6/185, 8/135

Flat Barbell Bench: 12/135, 7/155, 7/155, 7/155

Dips: 9, 6 (bodyweight only)

Machine flyes: 10/150, 8/150, 7/135

It wasn't my best chest day.  I almost hate doing chest because I haven't been able to go up in weight like I can for other bodyparts.  Its been a little discouraging.  I think its due to a the fact that I can't seem to break through a mental block that I think I have.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 10, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by tgkfour1 *_
> Welcome to IM. Looking forward to your progress
> 
> What do you hunt and How?



I hunt big game the most.  Around here thats pretty much limited to deer and turkeys, but rumor has it that there are some elk stocked out in western NC.  When I hunt in VA (shotgun only counties), my cousins and I run dogs, which I know alot of people hate.  When in the mountains, l like to take in my treestand and .270.  My old man liked to rabbit hunt but it has been increasingly more difficult with all the deer hunters and their dogs.  Occasionally I go squirrel hunting and use them to make a hell of a brunswick stew.

How bout yourself?


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## Fade (Jul 10, 2002)

If you cut your carbs and take in mostly protein and good fats, your body will have no choice but to burn fat for energy.

You may not have the same amount of strength because of the lack of carbs but it'll burn fat.

Best bet is to cut a few hundred cals at a time and see how it does.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 10, 2002)

So you think I should cut carbs (mostly from beans) from my midday meals?  I don't want to cut carbs post workout.  My other high carb meal is breakfast other than that.  I'll post my typical diet tomorrow.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 11, 2002)

nevermind about posting the diet.  It was clean but I didn't eat as much as I thought I did and ended up cramming my ass full of food the hour or so before I went to bed...I think thats why I'm getting fatter despite all the cardio I've been doing.  
My food choices are decent, but my meal planning sucks these days and my timing while I'm at work is totally off.  

Anyhow, yesterday was my day off and this morning I took my 10g of l-glutamine and did my 45 mins on the elliptical at 73% MHR.  I like how when you do cardio in the morning, after about 10 mins its like your on autopilot and you just hum along for the next 35.  I got back to do tonight.

Romanian Deadlifts
Bent Barbell Rows
Close Grip Seated Rows
Wide Grip Pulldowns (my least favorite and weakest back movement)


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## Fade (Jul 11, 2002)

What did you eat before going to sleep?


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 11, 2002)

I guess it was about 8pm when I realized I was short on cals, so I had 1 serving of cracklin oat bran cereal with 2 servings of special K with skim milk (I figure that that was not the thing to be eating).  I think that amounted to 600 cals, 7g fat, 79g carbs, ~16g of complete protein.  Then I threw back 1 serving of micellean 105cals, 1g fat, 2g carbs, and 20g protien.  About an hour and a half later I had another serving of micellean, a tablespoon of flax oil, and a tablespoon of natural PB.  I went to bed about 11pm.

I know this wont kill me if it were a rare occurance, but its become routine...  what I need to do is get in my meals while I'm at work.  I used to carry some mrp's and 2 PB on whole wheat sandwiches with me to work in addition to my regular lunch and eat them a while after I came in and just before I left to go home.  When I decided to cut carbs, I switched up to walnuts and Nitrotech bars, but I ran out of bars about a week ago and thats when all hell broke lose.  I got mrps on order and they should be here on Monday.

Its discouraging because I went to michigan for a week in late May and since then everythings been screwed up.  Before I went I had lost 7 lbs and was leaning out about 2 pounds a week.  Since I got back, I gained all the weight I lost and look like I am retaining alot of water, so I look alot bulkier all around.


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## kuso (Jul 11, 2002)

Sorry man....haven`t read any of this yet, just saw it and thought I`d say "hi" 

Glad you feel at home over here buddy


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 11, 2002)

dont' feel sorry, feel fortunate that you don't have to read my crap.  Fade's probably thinkin' "Oh shit what have I gotten myself into?"


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## kuso (Jul 11, 2002)

LOL  wait til w8 gets in here and kicks your ass big time


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## w8lifter (Jul 12, 2002)

Hi Monster  Can I give you some tips? 



> My current diet consists of mainly lean beef (eye of round or top round with most fat removed before cooking), skinless chicken breasts, tuna, salmon, Kidney or pinto beans, whole oats, sugary instant oatmeal for post workout, some form of whole grain box cereal for breakfast, natural peanut butter, walnuts, cheese, and skim milk.



So for the most part this is okay. If you're trying to cut fat though, the beans really have to go...you would do much better by replacing them w/ sweet potato or brown rice...or even some fat. Whole grain box cereal is not good for breakfast....switch it to  plain oats w/ cinnamon (made w/ water). I see you're utilizing a spike post W/O....lots of people do, just be aware that it stops fat-burning for several hrs! If losing fat is your main priority at the moment and you want it quickly, I would suggest foregoing the spike!



> (45 mins, 70% MHR) x 3



You would likely be better off doing 20 minutes of HIIT than 45 min of traditional cardio! It will increase your metabolism and you will burn more after your w/o than you will w/ the traditional cardio.



> *I think thats why I'm getting fatter despite all the cardio I've been doing.*



Well, this is a key statement! LOL Cardio is not as important in losing fat as your diet is! You really need to get your diet in order if you're serious about losing fat! 6 evenly spaced meals throughout the day....MAKE IT A PRIORITY! It's not going to happen unless you do. Cook your meals ahead of time, fill your house w/ only the food you should be eating, if you get your diet in order you will make faster progress than you would eating whatever you feel like and doing cardio all day.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 12, 2002)

I did back yesterday and things went ok and I'm gonna post my typical diet.

Bent Barbell Rows: 15/135, 12/155, 10/175, 9/175
Romanian Deads: 12/225, 10/315, 9/315, 6/315
Close Grips Seated Row: 15/11#, 11/11#, 9/11#
Wide Grip Lat Pulldown: 12/10#, 7/10#, 7/10#, 6/10#

It was a fairly good workout although the pulldowns are ticking me off.  I'm pretty sure it partially because I use too much weight and the placement at the end of my workout.

Meal 1: 16 oz of skim milk, 2 servings special K, 1 serving Cracklin Oat bran, 1 serving Micellean, 10g of flax oil

Meal 2: 33g walnuts, 3 oz roasted eye of round

Meal 3: Can of lima beans, 4.5 oz of eye of round

Meal 4: two cans of tuna, 1 oz of chedder, 33g walnuts

Meal 5: (Postworkout) 2 servings of nitrotech, 2 packets of instant Quaker Cinnamon roll flavored oatmeal, 1 serving of Cracklin oat bran

Meal 6: 1 tablespoon of Natty PB, 3.7 oz of Top Round steak, 10.4g of flax oil

Totals: 3500 cals, 126g fat, 283g carbs, 310g protien


Hey W8!  Since I live by myself, I usually only buy things that I'll eat, so making that change is easy.  I agree that I should dump the box cereal.  They are all pretty much candy disguised as a delicious, nutritious breakfast.  I used to eat whole oats, skim milk, with cinnamon and splenda for breakfast, but it got kind of old.  I'll switch back and see if I can make it work.  I used to eat brown rice religiously, but changed it out in favor of something I could just dump out of a can.  I'll try and get things back in order, but I have a question for ya.  What carbs should I go for postworkout instead of what I'm currently eating?  The stuff I ate for postworkout above is not normally what I eat.  Usually, I'll have the instant oatmeal, with another serving of plain oats, and a whey based protien shake.  Thanks for your help!!


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## w8lifter (Jul 12, 2002)

Well...switch back to the oats ....you just need to find some good recipes to make w/ them so you don't get bored. Check out the recipe section...there one for oatmeal pancakes that is always yummy.

As for post workout, if you're going for fat-burning and NOT an insulin spike, you can take a whey shake w/ cream or flax and some sweet potato, brown rice or oats.

And btw...you can use brown basmati rice


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 16, 2002)

I've been working out...just too lazy to post.  I did shoulders friday, Arms/hams/calves on sunday, quads monday.  I added a fat burner, Zenotrope by ISS Research on Monday and couldn't sleep worth a damn that night.  I fell asleep at 1:30am after laying down at 11pm.  Bummer.  I ended up popping a sleeping pill, then I fell right asleep.  I cleaned up the diet.  I deleted beans for brown rice, and dumped my box cereal for 4 egg whites, 2 whole eggs, old fashioned oats and a glass of milk.  I'm gonna go with w8's PW suggestion calling for a protien shake, oats, and flax oil.  The past week I lost 2 pounds to 216 and the waist I lost less than a quarter inch.  I'm still around 38....


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## joecamp4 (Jul 16, 2002)

Based on the info I've received from the good folks here at IM, you are on the right track with the changes to your diet...keep up the good work...

Joe


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 17, 2002)

Thanks for the encouragement, joe!

My past three workouts have gone ok

Last Friday (7/12) Shoulders:
Barbell Seated Shoulder Press: 10/145, 6/145, 5/145, 4/145
Hammer Strength Shoulder Press: 10/140, 7/140, 4/160, 9/110
Rear Delts (sitting backwards on a chest flye machine): 15/120, 12/120, 12/120
Seated Side Laterals: 10/25, 10/25, 10/25
Shrugs on a HS Deadlift Machine: 12/270, 12/270, 10/270

Last Sunday (7/14) Arms, Hams, Calves:
Standing Leg Curl: 12/40, 10/50, 10/50
Donkey Calf Raise Machine: 3 sets x 15 reps x 400lbs
Seated Alternating Curls: 12/20, 10/35, 8/35, 7/35
Hammer Curls: 1 Drop Set (6/35, 6/30, 6/20)
Hammer Strength Preacher Curls: 12/45, 10/55
Tricep Pulldowns: 15/8#, 12/11#, 9/11#, 5+4/11# (last set was rest-pause)
Overhead Cable Tricep Extensions: 10/8#, 7/9#, 5/9#
Rope Pulldowns: 10/7#, 10/7#

Last Monday (7/15) Quads:
Leg Extensions (warmup): 20/75, 15/75
Barbell Squat: 12/185 (ATF), 12/275(ATF), 10/315(ATF), 10/315(parallel), 10/315(Parallel)
Hack Squat (to Parallel): 12/180, 10/270, 8/320 
Leg Extensions: 15/150, 12/150, 12/150

Tuesday (7/16) Chest:
Incline DB Bench: 15/50, 12/70, 8/80, 6/80, 4/80
Flat DB Bench: 9/75, 5/75, 5/75, 5/75
DB Flat Flyes: 15/30, 12/40
DB Incline Flyes: 12/40, 8/50
Hammer Strength Incline Bench: 12/90, 5/180, 5/180

I didn't feel too good about my chest workout, but I hardly ever do.  However, I felt completely fatigued by the end of it.  If any of you guys reading this have any suggestions of how to get my bench up, let me know.  I think my max is about 255, but I have no endurance.  For instance, if I want to do 10 reps, I can bang out 8 with ease and can hardly move the bar above my sticking point on #9.

My diet has been fairly clean and hovering around 3400 cals.  I got my order of supps in yesterday and in it were Dorian Yates Propeptide, Dorian Yates ProMR and Metrx o2fx.  O2fx, I've never tried and wasn't real impressed with it last night, but I thought I'd give it a shot since it was only $20.  I used Dorian Yates products from January to June and had good results so I went back to them.  Right now in my supps cabinet I have those I mentioned in my first post except for the Micellean.  Probably won't go back to that one because I didn't really feel to confident in it.  I can't say it was any better or worse than any other protien I've had, I just like Propeptide better.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 22, 2002)

Thursday (Back) 7/18
Bent Barbell Row: 15/45, 15/135, 12/155, 9/175, 8/175
Romanian Deadlifts: 12/225, 10/315, 8/315, 6/315
Wide Grip Lat Pulldown: 12/8#, 12/8#, 8/9#, 7/9#
Close Grip Seated Row: 10/11#, 9/11#, 7/11#

Friday (Shoulders) 7/19
Smith Machine Shoulder Press: 12/105, 9/155, 7/155, 6/155, 8/125
Rear Delt (Reverse Chest Flye Mach): 15/127.5, 12/135, 10/135
Seated Side Laterals (1sec Pause at top): 12/20, 10/25, 8/25
Seated Dumbell Shoulder Press: 10/45, 8/55, 7/60
DB Shrugs (holding slightly out to the side, not resting on quads): 12/85, 12/85, 12/85

Saturday (Hams, Calves, Arms) 7/20
Standing Leg Curls: 12/40, 12/50, 10/50
Superset with Donkey Calf Raises: 15/400, 13/400, 15/400
Seated Alternating Curls (w/ supination): 15/20, 10/35, 8/35, 8/35
Hammer Curls (dropsets): 6-4-3/35-30-25, 6-4-4/30-25-20
Close Grip Bench: 15/45, 15/135, 7/185, 5/185, 11/135
Skullcrushers: 10/85, 7/85, 6/85
Tricep Pulldowns: 7/11#, 7/10#, 7/9#

Monday (Quads) 7/22:
Leg Extension: 20/75, 15/75
Squats: 12/185, 12/275, 10/315, 10/315, 9/315
Hack Squat (plates weight only): 12/180, 10/270, 10/270
Hammer Strength Isolateral Leg Ext.(plate weight only): 12/25, 9/35, 9/35
I really don't care for HS Leg Extensions because momentum tends to take over the movement unless you go slow...some old lady was taking up my usual leg extension machine.

My diet has been completely on target.  I've been eating clean and maintaining my cals at 3400 at 30%fat/30%carbs/40%protien.  I added an ECA stack to the mix and lost 2.5lbs down to 213.5 without doing but one day of cardio last week.  Lost a half inch on my waist also to 37.5.  I feel good and look better in the mirror, so I am pretty pleased with my progress.  I think it is about time that I set a due date and some goals.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Jul 24, 2002)

Tuesday started good enough.  Got my morning cardio and abs in before 6am.  Then I went to work where the shit hit the fan and I ended up pissing about 3 people off and lashed out at my boss and told him the TRUTH about how they run things here.  The thing is the administration comes up with come cockbrained idea and tries to market it to us and asks (reluctantly) for suggestions.  When we tell them that we think their plan stinks, they proceed to do it anyway.  If they are going to operate in this manner why the hell do they even bother to ask??  Just send me a damn email about it and let me do my job.  Assholes.  Anyway, after being pissed off for 8 hours, I went to the gym in the evening to do chest and it was probably the worst chest day I've ever had.  I was so stressed and drained that I couldn't get a good pump, couldn't lift heavy, and all I mannaged to do is get a numbness in my shoulder that ran down my arm.  I'll post what I managed to do later.  My journal is in the truck.

Incline Barbell Bench Press
Flat Barbell Bench Press
Flat Dumbell Bench Press
Cable Flyes
Incline Dumbell Flyes


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## MONSTER4X4 (Aug 23, 2002)

ok...I've been keeping everything in check, but have been to lazy to post.

I'm leaning out pretty good, but I've been stuck at 208-209 for the last 3 weeks despite cutting cals again.  I did start taking San's V12 (similar to swole) so that may be the reason I am not losing according to the scale.  I think I am still leaning out, but my weight isn't changing.  I began alternating my cardio a week ago.  Right now I am taking in about 3100 cals on a 30/30/40 ratio f/c/p.  I think I am gonna cut carbs again to 150 and dump some fat intake from my diet next week to get another 300 cal deficit.  That'll put me down to 2800 cals per day.  Next time I cut I think I am gonna go on a calorie and carb cycling diet.  We'll see what happens.


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## MONSTER4X4 (Nov 12, 2002)

Ok....here's an update after 16 weeks of dieting.  I've managed to get from 219 to 198 and lost 4 inches off the waist.  I lost some strength but that's expected.  Its hard for me to figure out whats going on with my bodyfat, but i am showing some 4-pack at the moment and I'm finally showing some good cuts in my quads and hamstrings.

I was sick about a month ago and didn't do any cardio for a month in addition to taking a little vacation time.  Overall, I'm pleased, but I feel like I can stay on it for a few more weeks.  I know 20 weeks of dieting is a long time, but I am so close to the six pack I can taste it.


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## kuso (Nov 12, 2002)

Nice to see an update buddy, and congrats


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