# Question about religion?



## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

What religion would I belong to if I only believe in god?

I was born a Catholic but I don???t follow that.

Would that make me an Atheist?

Now please I know how you religious folks get bent out of shape???so take it  easy.


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

Another thing, would it change my relationship with you?


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

_Chef: Stan, sometimes God takes those closest to us, because it makes him feel better about himself. He is a very vengeful God, Stan. He's all pissed off about something we did thousands of years ago. He just can't get over it, so he doesn't care who he takes.Children, puppies, it don't matter to him, so long as it makes us sad. Do you understand.	

Stan:	But then, why does God give us anything to start with?	

Chef:	Well, look at it this way: if you want to make a baby cry, first you give it a lollipop. Then you take it away. If you never give it a lollipop to begin with, then it would have nothin' to cry about. That's like God, who gives us life and love and help just so that he can tear it all away and make us cry, so he can drink the sweet milk of our tears. You see, it's our tears, Stan, that give God his great power.

Southpark 

_


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

What religion do they follow?


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## Arnold (Dec 22, 2004)

atheists do not believe in god.

you would not "belong" to any religeon.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> What religion do they follow?


_Why do you need to decide now? Follow Vieope´s principle of religion. It´s fun, you just decide when you die.
You do bad things in life then you die, if you go to hell you are a christian, if you born again as a cat you are a buddhist and so on.. _


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

I See, I was asked once if I go to church and I told them no. They say that if I don't go to church then I don't believe in God. 
I will now call you Reverand Vieope. 
What are your 10 commandments Vieope?


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## Minotaur (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> What religion would I belong to if I only believe in god?
> 
> I was born a Catholic but I don???t follow that.
> 
> ...



If you believe in God as a Supreme Spirit, one who created the universe and you leave it at that, and don't follow any church's teachings or religion, you'd be a Deist (dee-ist).


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

Minotaur said:
			
		

> If you believe in God as a Supreme Spirit, one who created the universe and you leave it at that, and don't follow any church's teachings or religion, you'd be a Deist (dee-ist).


Cool, so I am Deist..... Hey! that's not another word for Dyke is it?


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## Minotaur (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> Hey! that's not another word for Dyke is it?



Uh... no.  Not to worry.  Deist is from Latin 'deus', god, as is the word 'deity'.  A Deist is one who believes in _*a*_ deity, _*a*_ god.


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## Arnold (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> I See, I was asked once if I go to church and I told them no. They say that if I don't go to church then I don't believe in God.



whether you go to church or not, and whether you believe in god or not is your choice, who cares what anyone else thinks?


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

True........Wow, spoken like a True God...


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> I See, I was asked once if I go to church and I told them no. They say that if I don't go to church then I don't believe in God.
> I will now call you Reverand Vieope.
> What are your 10 commandments Vieope?


_If you find them, let me know. _


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

Robert DiMaggio said:
			
		

> atheists do not believe in god.
> 
> you would not "belong" to any religeon.


_I bet Anabolic-Matrix Rx is good for finding a religious path.

 _


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 22, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _I bet Anabolic-Matrix Rx is good for finding a religious path.
> 
> _


 Only if you buy it in bulk ...


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## QuestionGuy (Dec 22, 2004)

*Lmao!!*



			
				Vieope said:
			
		

> _I bet Anabolic-Matrix Rx is good for finding a religious path.
> 
> _


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## Candy (Dec 22, 2004)

I thought there was a term, agnostic.  Its means you believe in god, but you are not sure about anything else.  I'm not sure about that either.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

Candy said:
			
		

> I thought there was a term, agnostic.  Its means you believe in god, but you are not sure about anything else.  I'm not sure about that either.


_Agnostic is when you believe in something that can be proved. _


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## Witmaster (Dec 22, 2004)

Don't know what to believe????  Try this!!
http://www.beliefnet.com/story/76/story_7665_1.html


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

Witmaster said:
			
		

> Don't know what to believe???? Try this!!
> http://www.beliefnet.com/story/76/story_7665_1.html


This is me! 

*Unitarian Universalism** (100%) *


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## Arnold (Dec 22, 2004)

Agnostic is when you do not believe or disbelieve, so one would say I do not know if there is a god, I cannot prove there is or prove there is not.


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## BritChick (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> This is me!
> 
> *Unitarian Universalism** (100%) *



Me too min0.


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

BritChick said:
			
		

> Me too min0.


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## Pepper (Dec 22, 2004)

Witmaster said:
			
		

> Don't know what to believe???? Try this!!
> http://www.beliefnet.com/story/76/story_7665_1.html


*Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant** (100%) *


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 22, 2004)

Witmaster said:
			
		

> Don't know what to believe????  Try this!!
> http://www.beliefnet.com/story/76/story_7665_1.html


 *1. **Unitarian Universalism  (100%) 
*    What ever that is ...


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 22, 2004)

Deleted double post


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## min0 lee (Dec 22, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> *1. **Unitarian Universalism (100%) *
> What ever that is ...


That means your a Transvestite like me you See.


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## Crono1000 (Dec 22, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> What religion would I belong to if I only believe in god?
> 
> I was born a Catholic but I don???t follow that.
> 
> ...


It's OK if you're a Christian, a muslim, or a jew

It's OK if you're *agnostic* and you don't know what to do


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## WATTS (Dec 22, 2004)

Crono1000 said:
			
		

> It's OK if you're a Christian, a muslim, or a jew
> 
> It's OK if you're *agnostic* and you don't know what to do


So is it okay if im atheist?


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## Witmaster (Dec 22, 2004)

WATTS said:
			
		

> So is it okay if im atheist?



Well I suppose it all depends.... To another Atheist, sure.  But I'm thinking God might have certain reservations about it.


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## busyLivin (Dec 22, 2004)

WATTS said:
			
		

> So is it okay if im atheist?


no, you're fucked.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

WATTS said:
			
		

> So is it okay if im atheist?


_Sure it is.  _


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## busyLivin (Dec 22, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Sure it is.  _


looking for company in hell?


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> looking for company in hell?


_

If I don´t believe in God and the rules of christianity but I am a good person, am I still going to hell? _


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## busyLivin (Dec 22, 2004)

no, im just messing around V.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> no, im just messing around V.


_So can you please tell me what I need to do get in all that fun of hell? 
Nah  _


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## busyLivin (Dec 22, 2004)




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## PreMier (Dec 22, 2004)

1.  Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (100%)  
2.  Unitarian Universalism (96%)  
3.  Liberal Quakers (91%)  
4.  Mahayana Buddhism (76%)  
5.  Theravada Buddhism (75%)  
6.  Neo-Pagan (70%)  
7.  New Age (65%)  
8.  Secular Humanism (64%)  
9.  Taoism (60%)  
10.  Bahá'í Faith (58%)  
11.  Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (57%)  
12.  Reform Judaism (56%)  
13.  Jainism (53%)  
14.  Orthodox Quaker (52%)  
15.  New Thought (50%)  
16.  Sikhism (50%)  
17.  Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (48%)  
18.  Hinduism (46%)  
19.  Nontheist (44%)  
20.  Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (43%)  
21.  Scientology (41%)  
22.  Orthodox Judaism (35%)  
23.  Jehovah's Witness (33%)  
24.  Seventh Day Adventist (32%)  
25.  Islam (25%)  
26.  Eastern Orthodox (22%)  
27.  Roman Catholic (22%)


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## busyLivin (Dec 22, 2004)

whats the list & percentages mean?


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## PreMier (Dec 22, 2004)

Its from that test on the first page.  Supposedly I am most like the 100%.. and then less like the others down the page.  However I show traits in all of those listed.

Its funny, because I was raised a mormon.  I believe that there is a god, but he is there for advice, and prayer.  I think as long as you live your life to the fullest without harming others, you will end up in a good place.


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## busyLivin (Dec 22, 2004)

ahh, I missed that post. I'll have to try the test.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

PreMier said:
			
		

> I think as long as you live your life to the fullest without harming others, you will end up in a good place.


_
I completely agree but that doesn´t work so much in reality. If you date someone really good that means that someone is not dating her, if you get a good job, somebody didn´t get it and so on ..
I never knew that you were a mormon when younger. _


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## PreMier (Dec 22, 2004)

No, I meant purposely harming them.  Like raping them, robbing them, killing their friend, stealing from them etc.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

PreMier said:
			
		

> No, I meant purposely harming them.  Like raping them, robbing them, killing their friend, stealing from them etc.


_Well I think it is the same thing, not as evil as killing someone but it is still harming someone.  
How many times in your life you got something because you were smarter then others and felt great about it?  _


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## PreMier (Dec 22, 2004)

All the time.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

PreMier said:
			
		

> All the time.


_Let´s talk now about your denial problem. _


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## PreMier (Dec 22, 2004)

What am I in denial about?  I already know I am superior to everyone else   I just dont hurt them lol


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

_So you think you are better than Vieope?  _


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## PreMier (Dec 22, 2004)

I dont think I am better than anyone..


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

_Yes, you do.  Confess, arrogant bastard. _


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## maniclion (Dec 22, 2004)

I am a Jedi.


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## Vieope (Dec 22, 2004)

maniclion said:
			
		

> I am a Jedi.


_Actually I confused Jodi with Jedi when I started at IM and we already have a Luke around here somewhere.  _


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## King Silverback (Dec 22, 2004)

Orthodox Judaism!!!


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## Chain Link (Dec 22, 2004)

PreMier said:
			
		

> No, I meant purposely harming them.  Like raping them, robbing them, killing their friend, stealing from them etc.


So is it ok if we kill someone with no friends?  
Same theory if a tree falls in the woods and nobody is around to hear it 
You would have to kill them very fast, mind you, so you dont get into trouble for hurting someone. But aside from that you should be OK IMO, Cuz hell be happy when he goes to heaven, so you helped him out. Plus his life on Earth probably sucked with no friends.

On the other hand, If he goes to hell he would be suffering because of you, so you would lose some serious brownie pointage with god on that one.. Damn, Religion sure is confusing.. We can kill good people but not *ssholes!


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## Candy (Dec 23, 2004)

Crono1000 said:
			
		

> It's OK if you're a Christian, a muslim, or a jew
> 
> It's OK if you're *agnostic* and you don't know what to do




Merry Chrimahanakwazima (??) to you!


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## Candy (Dec 23, 2004)

Chrimahanakwazima?  I dunno.


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## MagnumXL (Dec 23, 2004)

As one who teaches physics, I can say that the Holy Bible is the only religious writing that is 100% consistent with the latest findings of astronomy, cosmology, and most other sciences.  Check out www.reasons.com for much scientific proof.  Or read the book "The case for a creator" by Lee Stroble.  It is really eye opening for anyone with an open mind.  I believe that a personal relationship to the creator is what determines our salvation....what he does to save us and not what we do to save ourselves that is important.  MXL


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _
> 
> If I don´t believe in God and the rules of christianity but I am a good person, am I still going to hell? _


V, help me to understand how anyone would/could not believe in GOD. Maybe because I was raised to believe I do, just curious how anyone does not believe in GOD. Do you believe in Jesus? Not trying to stir up any crapshit, just curious!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

MagnumXL said:
			
		

> As one who teaches physics, I can say that the Holy Bible is the only religious writing that is 100% consistent with the latest findings of astronomy, cosmology, and most other sciences.  Check out www.reasons.com for much scientific proof.  Or read the book "The case for a creator" by Lee Stroble.  It is really eye opening for anyone with an open mind.  I believe that a personal relationship to the creator is what determines our salvation....what he does to save us and not what we do to save ourselves that is important.  MXL


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> V, help me to understand how anyone would/could not believe in GOD. Maybe because I was raised to believe I do, just curious how anyone does not believe in GOD. Do you believe in Jesus? Not trying to stir up any crapshit, just curious!


_I never saw a religion consistent with reality.  _


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Do you believe in Jesus?


_If he existed he was just a nice guy with good intentions. 
IMO  _


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

MagnumXL said:
			
		

> As one who teaches physics, I can say that the Holy Bible is the only religious writing that is 100% consistent with the latest findings of astronomy, cosmology, and most other sciences.  Check out www.reasons.com for much scientific proof.  Or read the book "The case for a creator" by Lee Stroble.  It is really eye opening for anyone with an open mind.  I believe that a personal relationship to the creator is what determines our salvation....what he does to save us and not what we do to save ourselves that is important.  MXL


How do you figure that one? What he does and not what we do??? If you believe in the bible like you say you do, then your last statement cannot be true. The bible says Faith without works is useless. So obviously We must do something to show GOD we believe and others also.


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## MagnumXL (Dec 23, 2004)

"Not by WORKS of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saves us." (Titus 3:4-6) "For by grace are ye saved through faith, and NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast."  (Eph 2:8-9)  "but to him who worketh not, but believeth on Him that justefiath the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness." (Rom 4:1-5)   Also see John 3:16-18


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

MagnumXL said:
			
		

> "Not by WORKS of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saves us." (Titus 3:4-6) "For by grace are ye saved through faith, and NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast."  (Eph 2:8-9)  "but to him who worketh not, but believeth on Him that justefiath the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness." (Rom 4:1-5)   Also see John 3:16-18


Agreed, however, you must still EXERCISE faith in him, hence do something, correct? Those who do not have been judged already.


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

o olhar na tempestade que do crap este começou Vieope... Eu amo-o. Eu espero que você aprecíe este demasiado!!!


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## I Are Baboon (Dec 23, 2004)

Witmaster said:
			
		

> Don't know what to believe????  Try this!!
> http://www.beliefnet.com/story/76/story_7665_1.html




Reform Judaism (100%) 

Ha!  That'll make my Jewish wife happy.


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> o olhar na tempestade que do crap este começou Vieope... Eu amo-o. Eu espero que você aprecíe este demasiado!!!


que???


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> o olhar na tempestade que do crap este começou Vieope... Eu amo-o. Eu espero que você aprecíe este demasiado!!!


_I have no idea what you are talking about.  _


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## perfectbody (Dec 23, 2004)

MagnumXL said:
			
		

> "Not by WORKS of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saves us." (Titus 3:4-6) "For by grace are ye saved through faith, and NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast." (Eph 2:8-9) "but to him who worketh not, but believeth on Him that justefiath the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness." (Rom 4:1-5) Also see John 3:16-18


All you said are just average church propaganda.

if someone was born in a family who believes in God....he or she will probably believes in God. Everyone is entitled to a religion and the rest are Atheists. It is always as if we are born with a religion or without at all. And we kill each other in the name of God. There is no big deals in God-related religions. Just wait till u die and see there is next existence or there is God sending u heaven or hell or maybe there is no more existence. 

zzz i wont' read this thread again bb.


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## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

perfectbody said:
			
		

> zzz i wont' read this thread again bb.


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _If he existed he was just a nice guy with good intentions.
> IMO  _


if, IF? Why did he die for people like you?


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

perfectbody said:
			
		

> All you said are just average church propaganda.
> 
> if someone was born in a family who believes in God....he or she will probably believes in God. Everyone is entitled to a religion and the rest are Atheists. It is always as if we are born with a religion or without at all. And we kill each other in the name of God. There is no big deals in God-related religions. Just wait till u die and see there is next existence or there is God sending u heaven or hell or maybe there is no more existence.
> 
> zzz i wont' read this thread again bb.


2 things, if you wait till you die, it is too late!!! and as far as not reading this post again............


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> if, IF? Why did he die for people like you?


_Well I said IMO. How can you prove his existence? 
Why christianity can´t take criticism anyway? _


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

The only proof after thousands of years of the existance of the God of any ... ANY ... organised religion is what?


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Well I said IMO. How can you prove his existence?
> Why christianity can´t take criticism anyway? _


Not saying it to be ignorant, but he died so that people like you could have the chance for salvation. Thats what I meant, please do not take it the wrong way. I can take criticism. However I am a BELIEVER!!! Why must you prove his existance. Jesus himself said to Thomas, you believe because you see, but Blessed are those who believe but have not seen. "FAITH" that is what I have.


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> The only proof after thousands of years of the existance of the God of any ... ANY ... organised religion is what?


That man can't do it on their own!!!


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> That man can't do it on their own!!!


 Do what?


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> Do what?


Anything, why are there so many problems in the world today? possibly because of mans denial of a higher being, thinking they can do it all by themselves.


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

The political threads died down considerably... but it seems like there has been a lot of religious threads lately.


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Not saying it to be ignorant, but he died so that people like you could have the chance for salvation. Thats what I meant, please do not take it the wrong way. I can take criticism. However I am a BELIEVER!!! Why must you prove his existance. Jesus himself said to Thomas, you believe because you see, but Blessed are those who believe but have not seen. "FAITH" that is what I have.


_His story was written 200 years after he lived here. Science and knowledge were non-existent to everybody. Faith is the problem here, doesn´t matter the facts since you have faith. 
This technique of persuasion was always used. Politicians do this all the time, believe in me, doesn´t matter how many facts contradicts what I say, I am telling you the truth. Sorry but I can´t believe in something only because of faith.  _


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Anything, why are there so many problems in the world today? possibly because of mans denial of a higher being, thinking they can do it all by themselves.


_Yeah, religion has nothing to do with world problems. Come on, almost every war is because of religion._


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Anything, why are there so many problems in the world today? possibly because of mans denial of a higher being, thinking they can do it all by themselves.


 = Faith.  I have none nor will I ever.  Speak to me with answers based in reality and I will  join you.  Condem me with threats of eternal damnation and I will laugh at you.  Fear alone is not a reason to have faith.  When you remove all the conjecture ... what is left but fear of an unpleasant afterlife?


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> = Faith.  I have none nor will I ever.  Speak to me with answers based in reality and I will  join you.  Condem me with threats of eternal damnation and I will laugh at you.  Fear alone is not a reason to have faith.  When you remove all the conjecture ... what is left but fear of an unpleasant afterlife?


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> When you remove all the conjecture ... what is left but fear of an unpleasant afterlife?



Not at all.  If there's nothing left after we die.. what's to fear?  You seem to be missing the entire picture & a lack of understanding of faith.

You speak as if you're the only one with reason here & the rest of us are dilusional.  I don't give a rat's ass if you believe or not, but you sound pretty arrogant for a subject that can't be proved by your terms.

I think I'm right too, but I'm not going to "laugh" at someone or degrade them for not believing.


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Yeah, religion has nothing to do with world problems. Come on, almost every war is because of religion._


Because of MANS interpretation(sp) of religion, not what GOD had in mind, I'm sure!!!


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> = Faith.  I have none nor will I ever.  Speak to me with answers based in reality and I will  join you.  Condem me with threats of eternal damnation and I will laugh at you.  Fear alone is not a reason to have faith.  When you remove all the conjecture ... what is left but fear of an unpleasant afterlife?


Never once condemned you, that is not my call, Judge not, less ye be judged yourself!!! I have my beliefs, my faith if you will. Laugh if you must!!! what you spout off at the mouth about, has no bearing in my life. It's a shame you have no faith, you must not be truelly happy huh? Guess thats why you laugh!!!


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Not at all.  If there's nothing left after we die.. what's to fear?  You seem to be missing the entire picture & a lack of understanding of faith.
> 
> You speak as if you're the only one with reason here & the rest of us are dilusional.  I don't give a rat's ass if you believe or not, but you sound pretty arrogant for a subject that can't be proved by your terms.
> 
> I think I'm right too, but I'm not going to "laugh" at someone or degrade them for not believing.


Thank you, well said!!!


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

Busy when I am trying to offend someone I am very up front about it.  I don't hide behind half said hints or allusions to a dilusional state of mind.  If you are offended by my comments it was not my fault for I intended no offense.  I asked a question after explaining my thoughts.  I would hope your ability to confine your anger is not so easily challenged by such a minor post ... rat's ass aside.


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## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

This is not what I had in mind with this thread.


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> Busy when I am trying to offend someone I am very up front about it.  I don't hide behind half said hints or allusions to a dilusional state of mind.  If you are offended by my comments it was not my fault for I intended no offense.  I asked a question after explaining my thoughts.  I would hope your ability to confine your anger is not so easily challenged by such a minor post ... rat's ass aside.



I have no anger & not offended, BC.   I was just responding to the fact that you reduced someone's most cherished beliefs down to an "antidote to the fear of death."


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> This is not what I had in mind with this thread.


they always end up like this


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> This is not what I had in mind with this thread.


My apologies!!!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> they always end up like this


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## Witmaster (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> What religion would I belong to if I only believe in god?
> 
> I was born a Catholic but I don???t follow that.
> 
> ...



Interesting thread to say the very least.  Funny thing though......

You started out by emploring the "religious folks" to not get "bent out of shape".  Interestingly enough, they have merely stated thier faith and thier reasons for it.... it appears the NON religious folks are getting bent out of shape.  Go figure.


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## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

You both ... Archangle and Busy ... had the chance to practice what you preach and missed it.



> Never once condemned you, that is not my call, Judge not, less ye be judged yourself* As you judged me!!!* I have my beliefs, my faith if you will. Laugh if you must!!! what _you spout off at the mouth about, has no bearing in my life. It's a shame you have no faith, you must not be truelly happy huh? Guess thats why you laugh!!!_  *Leveling your judgements ... *





> You speak as if you're the only one with reason here & the rest of us are dilusional * As you judged me!!!*. I don't give a rat's ass if you believe or not, but you sound pretty arrogant *Leveling your judgements ... *for a subject that can't be proved by your terms.
> 
> I think I'm right too, but I'm not going to "laugh" at someone or *degrade *them for not believing *Contridicting yourself in the same post.*


 I made a statement that if you offer me a possitive reason I will work with that but if you offer me a negative reason I will laugh at you. I posed a question that could be worked from two directions. Posative or negative. Give me something based in reality to accept God from ... something in which to base faith. Both of you chose the negative missing the chance at offering an honest religious based discussion on the existance of God. Instead I was called an arrogant unhappy person. I am neither ...


----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

Boy, I learned my lesson. 
From now on I'll just stick with politics where everyone agrees.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Because of MANS interpretation(sp) of religion, not what GOD had in mind, I'm sure!!!


_Let´s say there is a God. Religion is exactly that, mans interpretation of life and God. Christianity got it all wrong though. _


----------



## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

Witmaster said:
			
		

> Interesting thread to say the very least.  Funny thing though......
> 
> You started out by emploring the "religious folks" to not get "bent out of shape". Interestingly enough, they have merely stated thier faith and thier reasons for it.... it appears the NON religious folks are getting bent out of shape. Go figure.


 I was not and am not bent out of anything at all.   Show me where anyone of a "non-religious" persuasion posted something "bent out of shape" ...


----------



## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

Hiya min0 ...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> I was not and am not bent out of anything at all.   Show me where anyone of a "non-religious" persuasion posted something "bent out of shape" ...


_Yeah!  _


----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> Hiya min0 ...


  Hello Bonecrusher.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_We gonna have one happy and healthy christmas at IM.  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

BoneCrusher said:
			
		

> You both ... Archangle and Busy ... had the chance to practice what you preach and missed it.
> 
> I made a statement that if you offer me a possitive reason I will work with that but if you offer me a negative reason I will laugh at you. I posed a question that could be worked from two directions. Posative or negative. Give me something based in reality to accept God from ... something in which to base faith. Both of you chose the negative missing the chance at offering an honest religious based discussion on the existance of God. Instead I was called an arrogant unhappy person. I am neither ...



I never called you arrogant. I said your position on this was arrogant.  

You know as well as I do that faith is based on faith.  I can't convince God to come tap on your shoulder to show you He exists, and you know I can't.  I hardly see your comments as an 'invitation' as I do see it a chance you took to point out that we cannot provide you with physical evidence.


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Let´s say there is a God. Religion is exactly that, mans interpretation of life and God. Christianity got it all wrong though. _


Do you know enough about Christianity to make that statement though? 
What makes you say that?


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Do you know enough about Christianity to make that statement though?
> What makes you say that?


_I don´t know everything about it but so far everything that I heard doesn´t make sense.  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _I don´t know everything about it but so far everything that I heard doesn´t make sense.  _


interpretations & different denominations distort it.  I'm techically Catholic & go to Catholic church, but I regularly disagree with them. Reconciliation, for example, I think is ridiculous. 

The basic Christian tenets are very solid, though.


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

here's a thought... let's battle this out for another 10 hours & see if we've gotten anywhere... who's in?


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> interpretations & different denominations distort it.  I'm techically Catholic & go to Catholic church, but I regularly disagree with them. Reconciliation, for example, I think is ridiculous.
> 
> The basic Christian tenets are very solid, though.


_So tell me one thing in christianity that is consistent with reality. _


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _So tell me one thing in christianity that is consistent with reality. _


Have you read the bible?


----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

.


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _So tell me one thing in christianity that is consistent with reality. _


there's a ton, V!  If you're seriously interested, there are hundreds of books on it. They can tell you a lot more than I can!


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Have you read the bible?


_I didn´t even read Lord of the Rings, not a fan of mythology. 
Can you please tell me one thing that works in real life or can be proved?  _


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> .


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> there's a ton, V!  If you're seriously interested, there are hundreds of books on it. They can tell you a lot more than I can!


_Ok, if there is a ton, tell me just one.  _


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _I didn´t even read Lord of the Rings, not a fan of mythology.. _
> _Can you please tell me one thing that works in real life or can be proved? _


Better yet you tell me one thing that can't...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Better yet you tell me one thing that can't...


_You won´get out of this with reverse psychology.  
Tell me just one. _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Christianity isn't about proving God exists.  It is believing that Jesus is God & trynig to be like Him.  What kind of proof do you want? that Jesus is God?


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Christianity isn't about proving God exists.  It is believing in Jesus as God & trynig to be like Him.  What kind of proof do you want? that Jesus is God?


_No, I want something that is in the bible that actually works and can be proved. Tell me one tale from there that can be true. _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

You exist.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> You exist.


_Yes I do. Methane, nitrogen and electric discharge did the job billions of years ago. _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Yes I do. Methane, nitrogen and electric discharge did the job billions of years ago. _


give me proof.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> give me proof.


_Hundreds of science books and Titan. It may not be the exact truth but it is far more plausible than some made up God. 
Nature and math are beautiful. :bounce:_


----------



## BoneCrusher (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Better yet you tell me one thing that can't...


 C'mon bkc ...  ... you have better than that I'm sure.


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

In my science books, matter, time, & space don't "appear" out of nowhere :bounce: Science can't explain life. They never will be able to.  They can't explain how a simple rock came out of nowhere, much less a living organism.


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

my nutrition timing is screwed up now.. I took the creatine & protein 15 minutes ago & I should be lifting now


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> In my science books, matter, time, & space don't "appear" out of nowhere :bounce: Science can't explain life. They never will be able to.


_Science is based on facts, a theory is valid until it doesn´t go wrong, when it can be proved by evidence. Religion is so successful because it works with the subjective world, not the objective world.
We can´t explain life yet but we will, accepting religion is just giving up the search. 
IMO  _


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> my nutrition timing is screwed up now.. I took the creatine & protein 15 minutes ago & I should be lifting now


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Science is based on facts, a theory is valid until it doesn´t go wrong, when it can be proved by evidence. Religion is so successful because it works with the subjective world, not the objective world.
> We can´t explain life yet but we will, accepting religion is just giving up the search.
> IMO  _


no doubt... doesn't make it wrong, though.


----------



## Candy (Dec 23, 2004)

Does that make you feel better?  Believing there is no God?  No consequence for your actions?


----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> no doubt... doesn't make it wrong, though.


_Doesn´t make christianity wrong? Well it does because it is such a simplistic theory based on the imagination of bored men that didn´t have cable tv or videogames to fry their brains. So they came up with a cute story.  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope tonight... 






the dark blue fades away.. to a more heavenly color


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Candy said:
			
		

> Does that make you feel better?  Believing there is no God?  No consequence for your actions?


_Two separate subjects. Altthogh most people think that atheists are evil because they can´t go to hell, I think that God forgiving anybody would be just as bad. 
I am a good person, I don´t need mythology to respect others. I have ethics although I don´t tip.  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Doesn´t make christianity wrong? Well it does because it is such a simplistic theory based on the imagination of bored men that didn´t have cable tv or videogames to fry their brains. So they came up with a cute story.  _



The gospels revealed! 

I said just because religion in general isn't bothered with the scientific facts doesn't make it wrong. 

Christianity is another topic.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Vieope tonight...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> I said just because religion in general isn't bothered with the scientific facts doesn't make it wrong.


_It does make it not correct since we live in a world that follow standards and theories. What is that madonna song? 
"Living in a material world
And I am a material girl
You know that we are living in a material world
And I am a material girl" 
That is not a very masculine argument.  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

yes, but those standards & theories were created by God, and have always functioned with that premise.   God doesn't have to "break" a rule.. the rule works with Him. 

Like you said, you're battling on the physical world I battling on a whole other playing field.  We'll never come to a consensus! 

anyway, I'll be back in about an hour. gotta lift & I think min0 needs a popcorn refill


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_Bring Jesus with you if you find him around. Come on, he starts this and doesn´t say a word. It is not fair.  _


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _You won´get out of this with reverse psychology.  _
> _Tell me just one. _


Vieope the life of Christ is better documented than any man whom has ever lived. He is in the writtings of Ceasar, kings, rulers, etc. that have abosolutely nothing to do with the bible or Christianity... OK, now that we've established that He existed as a man let's move on...

The bible doesn't even begin to have comparisions with books, such as LOTR. While LOTR is entertaining it's a story... The story's of the bible are actual events that have take place. Things such as Sodom and Gamorrah have been found...(aka the Dead Sea) among other events... These seemingly unbelieveable events are the works of a soveirgn God. The fall of empires have also been told in the bible long before they have taken place. Fact is everything the bible speaks of has happened or being set in motion now... The fact that we're having this conversation says a lot. I don't have the full knowledge of the word but what I've been through tells me that God is real... Please let me explain.

I was raised in church but I was never really taught what life was all about... I had the seriously wrong impression that if you do good you'll go to heaven. Do bad and you'll go to hell. While somewhat true this is far from what life is made up of. In my eyes life is a lesson. A lesson that you more so than anyone control. A lesson that you'll write with your decisions and a lesson you'll control in the aspect of what you'll learn... We are given test and trials, some more than others, but all these things are meant to enable us not brake us... See even the Devil himself was once an angel the bible says. He fell into sin and in pride he tried to overthrow God Himself. Oops... Seeing as how God created him and yet he turned to bite the hand that feed him life God cast him down. Why here with us? Good question. Why do we pay for the sins of others? Even better question... I believe this may help explain it. We were given the power of free will. The ability to decide for ourselves. As I've already explain the Devil was a highly regarded angel and in his free will he chose wickedness. Maybe this life is to purify us. To test us now. Choose this day who you will follow sort of thing. If everything was always perfect then where is the test really? 

Now, my experience... I enjoyed the things of the world for quite some time. I was raised going to church but lacked understanding... To make a long story short life became heavy and filled with burdens. Burdens I had placed on my shoulders do to my decisions... In this weight depression weighted me down. I did my best to fill that void but I always needed more... Everything and everyone that surrounded me seemed to seek my demise. In my pain I had no where else to turn besides the God that I had know as a child. In my broken state for some reason He heard my crys. Things began to change. Not my situations but my outlook. I knew everything going on around me when I should have had no way of knowing... He told me. I knew the intentions and motives of others like they told me themselves. Honest to God it was as if I knew their thoughts like they were written down for me... These things I never knew were possible and wouldn't have believed otherwise. I thought I was going insane and I had plenty of reasons to do so, but I wasn't... God was touching my life for some unknown reason. I asked of Him,"Why Lord are you helping me... If these things that I hear are real confirm them to me." Exactly that would happen. Time after time He would confirm what I was told through the words and actions of others. It was as if it was written to happen. Perfection... I hadn't gone to church in six-seven years and the first time I walked back in those doors the message was for me. The pastor spoke of how he had wanted to preach this message for several weeks and the Holy Spirit wouldn't allow him to. All the while he was preaching it was my exact life and experience that he spoke of. He stated that this message is for one somebody. That's if that someone were to accept the call of God that all that had been taken from me shall be restored. ALL... Through all that I've typed it was the Holy Spirit that directed me. He is the One that helped me out of all my troubles and opened my eyes in a spiritual manner... It was as if I were a character in the bible. You say you want your proof... so do I... When my life is restored I'll be here for you... Nevertheless I know He is real. I've felt Him, fell Him now, and have seen His helping hand...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Vieope the life of Christ is better documented than any man whom has ever lived. He is in the writtings of Ceasar, kings, rulers, etc. that have abosolutely nothing to do with the bible or Christianity... OK, now that we've established that He existed as a man let's move on...
> 
> The bible doesn't even begin to have comparisions with books, such as LOTR. While LOTR is entertaining it's a story... The story's of the bible are actual events that have take place. Things such as Sodom and Gamorrah have been found...(aka the Dead Sea) among other events... These seemingly unbelieveable events are the works of a soveirgn God. The fall of empires have also been told in the bible long before they have taken place. Fact is everything the bible speaks of has happened or being set in motion now... The fact that we're having this conversation says a lot. I don't have the full knowledge of the word but what I've been through tells me that God is real... Please let me explain.
> 
> ...



_Ok I give you that, Jesus existed, it is a good argument that others had written about him. I consider him no more than a "successful" philosopher though. 

What you experienced there was not God, Jesus or the power of christianity, it was self-awareness. When you start feeling somethings that you can´t describe until now, it is easier to run for the more simple and socially accepted version, God.
Life can be pretty damn difficult but humans are great and so far better than anything. Nothing can stop humanity and our creativity. We are so cool. 

I do appreciate that you took some time to share your experience.  _


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Ok I give you that, Jesus existed, it is a good argument that others had written about him. I consider him no more than a "successful" philosopher though. _
> 
> _What you experienced there was not God, Jesus or the power of christianity, it was self-awareness. When you start feeling somethings that you can´t describe until now, it is easier to run for the more simple and socially accepted version, God._
> _Life can be pretty damn difficult but humans are great and so far better than anything. Nothing can stop humanity and our creativity. We are so cool. _
> ...


I can't possibly do what I experienced any justice, but I know what self awareness is and that was much much more than what I or my self awareness could ever be... Thanks for reading it. It's food for thought...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> I can't possibly do what I experienced any justice, but I know what self awareness is and that was much much more than what I or my self awareness could ever be... Thanks for reading it. It's food for thought...


_So let´s get together and go to a satanic church to see "what the hell" do they talk about there? _


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _So let´s get together and go to a satanic church to see "what the hell" do they talk about there? _


I've dated a few witches... I already know... I'll pass, but enjoy.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)




----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

>


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

you get Vieope praying yet bkc?


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> you get Vieope praying yet bkc?


_No Sir  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)




----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> you get Vieope praying yet bkc?


It's not up to me. Hopefully he will when he's ready. It sure as hell wouldn't hurt...


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)




----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_I need to eat now. We will be right back with more religious talk. _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)




----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _I need to eat now. We will be right back with more religious talk. _


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

I'm an atheist.  Will always be.  I think that people who believe are weak and unable to deal with reality.  And as you've guessed it, I'm not a big preacher of tolerance.  My $0.02.  I'm out of this thread.


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> I'm an atheist. Will always be. I think that people who believe are weak and unable to deal with reality. And as you've guessed it, I'm not a big preacher of tolerance. My $0.02. I'm out of this thread.


Have a good one... 

I'll be benching 405lbs. here soon...


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Strong body, weak mind.


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Strong body, weak mind.


Glad to see you're back... Weak mind...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

>


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_I don´t think I wil debate any more religion tonight. I just took a shower and had a nice meal. What this thread should turn into now? _


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Of course it's weak.  If it wasn't, you would never side with a position that hasn't one iota of concerete evidence and indefensible without the use of circular arguements.


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

I'm a fool for getting sucked into this.. I concur...


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Of course it's weak. If it wasn't, you would never side with a position that hasn't one iota of concerete evidence and indefensible without the use of circular arguements.


Hope life gets better for ya bro...


----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _I don´t think I wil debate any more religion tonight. I just took a shower and had a nice meal. What this thread should turn into now? _


What did you eat?


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> What did you eat?


_Meat with rice. Nothing much, tomorrow will be great though. 
Btw, it took me a few good seconds to remember what I just ate.  _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> I think that people who believe are weak and unable to deal with reality.


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

This thread should be titled pick your brand of bullshit.  Sorry, but it's a hard sell.  





			
				bkc said:
			
		

> Hope life gets better for ya bro...



My life would be better if I there were no people who bench press 400lb and yet believe in X,XXX year old fairy tales about men with beards who live above earth.   


..and by the way bkc, let me tell you about this bridge I have for sale.


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Meat with rice. Nothing much, tomorrow will be great though.
> Btw, it took me a few good seconds to remember what I just ate.  _


say NO to drugs.


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> say NO to drugs.


:bounce:


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> This thread should be titled pick your brand of bullshit.  Sorry, but it's a hard sell.




Funny..I don't remember anyone forcing you into this thread   

Like you said.. you've stated your side. Thank you. You may leave now.


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> This thread should be titled pick your brand of bullshit. Sorry, but it's a hard sell.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You must be talking about Santa... He doesn't really live above the earth. The North Pole just looks that way on the globe... 

How much can the bridge hold?


----------



## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Funny..I don't remember anyone forcing you into this thread
> 
> Like you said.. you've stated your side. Thank you. You may leave now.


But why? He only helps prove the point...


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

If he wants to seriously talk about it, fine.  He's adding nothing to the conversation.


----------



## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Ok I give you that, Jesus existed, it is a good argument that others had written about him. I consider him no more than a "successful" philosopher though.
> 
> What you experienced there was not God, Jesus or the power of christianity, it was self-awareness. When you start feeling somethings that you can´t describe until now, it is easier to run for the more simple and socially accepted version, God.
> Life can be pretty damn difficult but humans are great and so far better than anything. Nothing can stop humanity and our creativity. We are so cool.
> ...


You honestly think it's easier and simpler to profess our FAITH in GOD and his son Jesus? Please, day in and day out we not only fight with the temptations of Satan, but comments and negativity from people like you, who the Bible tells us are all tools of the devil to cause us to fall off of our chosen path.


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Jesus did exist.  He was born by a virgin and fukkin PWND you guys.


----------



## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> I'm an atheist.  Will always be.  I think that people who believe are weak and unable to deal with reality.  And as you've guessed it, I'm not a big preacher of tolerance.  My $0.02.  I'm out of this thread.


Typical response,    , and then they are gone!!!


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Jesus did exist.  He was born by a virgin and fukkin PWND you guys.


and the knowledge flows...  Thanks for the insight!


----------



## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> I'm a fool for getting sucked into this.. I concur...


_No...Your not a fool._
_You're travelling to another dimension, a dimension not only of sight and sound... but of mind. A journey into a wondrous land, whose boundaries are only that of the imagination... you're entering... *the Religion Zone*... _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)




----------



## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Of course it's weak.  If it wasn't, you would never side with a position that hasn't one iota of concerete evidence and indefensible without the use of circular arguements.


Do you believe in the wind? Can't see it, just it's effects on it's surroundings, yet you still believe there is wind right? If weak is what you think we (I) am, so be it, I am stronger than you will ever know!!!


----------



## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> I'm a fool for getting sucked into this.. I concur...


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> You honestly think it's easier and simpler to profess our FAITH in GOD and his son Jesus? Please, day in and day out we not only fight with the temptations of Satan, but comments and negativity from people like you, who the Bible tells us are all tools of the devil to cause us to fall off of our chosen path.



_Am I a tool of the devil? _


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

> _No...Your not a fool._
> _You're travelling to another dimension, a dimension not only of sight and sound... but of mind. A journey into a wondrous land, whose boundaries are only that of the imagination... you're entering... *the Religion Zone*... _


_http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/showthread.php?t=27558_


----------



## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> let me tell you about this bridge I have for sale.


Will it take me to the Promised Land?


----------



## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Do you believe in the wind? Can't see it, just it's effects on it's surroundings, yet you still believe there is wind right? If weak is what you think we (I) am, so be it, I am stronger than you will ever know!!!


_I can prove the wind exist with facts. Can you do that with Jesus or God? No. _


----------



## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _I can prove the wind exist with facts. Can you do that with Jesus or God? No. _


Yes, but I wouldn't recommend dying at such a young age.


----------



## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Nobody forced me into this thread.  I came in uninvited and I have ZERO respect for your beliefs.  Why?  Because I believe in separation of church and state.  A SECULAR (GASP) GOV'T.  Nothing I can do will change your minds.  I'm just merely giving you a taste of your own medicine.  I hope you choke on it.


----------



## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> and the knowledge flows...  Thanks for the insight!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Yes, but I wouldn't recommend dying at such a young age.


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Nobody forced me into this thread.  I came in uninvited and I have ZERO respect for your beliefs.  Why?  Because I believe in separation of church and state.  A SECULAR (GASP) GOV'T.  Nothing I can do will change your minds.  I'm just merely giving you a taste of your own medicine.  I hope you choke on it.



You could use some religion!   What a nice guy

Thanks for the respect.


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Yes, but I wouldn't recommend dying at such a young age.


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## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Do you believe in the wind? Can't see it, just it's effects on it's surroundings, yet you still believe there is wind right? If weak is what you think we (I) am, so be it, I am stronger than you will ever know!!!



You have the reasoning skills of a 3 year old.  Sorry, I didn't mean to insult the 3 year olds. 

If you put dye in the air you will see the wind and you will see it moving.  Aerial spray.  ALA Crop dusting...for you bible thumpers.


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> You have the reasoning skills of a 3 year old.  Sorry, I didn't mean to insult the 3 year olds.
> 
> If you put dye in the air you will see the wind and you will see it moving.



And name calling is the skills of an adult?


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Nobody forced me into this thread.  I came in uninvited and I have ZERO respect for your beliefs.  Why?  Because I believe in separation of church and state.  A SECULAR (GASP) GOV'T.  Nothing I can do will change your minds.  I'm just merely giving you a taste of your own medicine.  I hope you choke on it.


Sorry you feel that way, see that door over there? BUH - BYE!!!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_Do you really believe in the devil Archangel? _


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## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Are you saying I'm wrong in my appraisal?


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> You have the reasoning skills of a 3 year old.  Sorry, I didn't mean to insult the 3 year olds.
> 
> If you put dye in the air you will see the wind and you will see it moving.  Aerial spray.  ALA Crop dusting...for you bible thumpers.


You arent that intelligent, you will not see the wind flowing, but the item you put into it!!! Why do you have to try and insult us for our beliefs? Sounds like you need the Lord in your life extrenely bad!!! Please remember, Jesus loves you, it's just everyone else who thinks your an ass!!!


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Do you really believe in the devil Archangel? _


Yes I do, one cannot believe in GOD, and not the devil!!!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_Knock, knock.. _


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Are you saying I'm wrong in my appraisal?



His point was that proof is not always easy to see or grasp.  Makes sense to me.


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Yes I do, one cannot believe in GOD, and not the devil!!!


I don't think I believe in the devil or hell.


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Yes I do, one cannot believe in GOD, and not the devil!!!


_Have you ever had any contact with it? _


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Am I a tool of the devil? _


A tool...yes of the devil


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## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)




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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Have you ever had any contact with it? _


I have...


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

I stole min0's link


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

min0 lee said:
			
		

>


I'm just glad you're sticking around...


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> I have...


_Can you tell us about it? _


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> I don't think I believe in the devil or hell.


GOD created the devil, not in the condition he is now, he was an Angel of Light according to the Bible. I do not believe in a fiery torment "Hell". As I believe hell to be the grave, or the resting place.


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## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

VS.


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_Knock, knock .. _


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## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Sounds like you need the Lord in your life extrenely bad!!! Please remember, Jesus loves you, it's just everyone else who thinks your an ass!!!



That's exactly the problem.  

You stand for institutionalized homogenizing.  If I don't see eye to eye with you then I'm bad and need fixing.  

I stand for freedom.  If you don't see eye to eye with me then I shit upon you two times but you still have the freedom to do what you want.  

Now, on the grand scheme of things, who are the real assholes?


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Knock, knock .. _



oh.. who's there?


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Knock, knock .. _


I'll bite, who's there?


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## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> I stole min0's link


Don't eat all the popcorn.


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Can you tell us about it? _


Pretty simple actually. He comes for nothing but to kill and destroy. He wears an attracive offer and offers pleasures but he hides his true motives... I've seen a demon and felt their presence more than once. Like I said I "dated" a witch.


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> I'll bite, who's there?





			
				busyLivin said:
			
		

> oh.. who's there?



_You two trying to sell me a bible.  _


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> That's exactly the problem.
> 
> You stand for institutionalized homogenizing.  If I don't see eye to eye with you then I'm bad and need fixing.
> 
> ...


My vote is still you. I did no name calling until who........... oh yeah that would be YOU started flinging insults just to make yourself feel powerful. I do feel sorry for you. Good luck in life, may the good Lord see fit to help you!!!
Would be nice now if you just went your own way


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Pretty simple actually. He comes for nothing but to kill and destroy. He wears an attracive offer and offers pleasures but he hides his true motives... I've seen a demon and felt their presence more than once. Like I said I "dated" a witch.


_Did you really date a witch? Wicca?_


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _You two trying to sell me a bible.  _


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## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> My vote is still you. I did no name calling until who........... oh yeah that would be YOU started flinging insults just to make yourself feel powerful.



Yeah, I said some impolite things about you.  But your kind has voted religious zealots into power and now they're forcing their will on me.  And I refuse to dance to your shitty tune.


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Did you really date a witch? Wicca?_


Unfortunately...


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _You two trying to sell me a bible.  _


Listen, bunny.. I don't preach. I answer questions.


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Yeah, I said some impolite things about you.  But your kind has voted religious zealots into power and now they're forcing their will on me.  And I refuse to dance to your shitty tune.


this is about Bush? get over it, man... nothin you can do! 

And you won't get very far hating the religious.  We greatly out-number you.


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> My vote is still you. I did no name calling until who........... oh yeah that would be YOU started flinging insults just to make yourself feel powerful. I do feel sorry for you. Good luck in life, may the good Lord see fit to help you!!!
> Would be nice now if you just went your own way


Dude would you care if I used the pic of the dude holding the ax on another site?


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Unfortunately...


_What did she do wrong? Did she kill something for the rituals? Tells us about it with more details man.  _


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

iMan323 said:
			
		

> Yeah, I said some impolite things about you.  But your kind has voted religious zealots into power and now they're forcing their will on me.  And I refuse to dance to your shitty tune.


Trust me, they where not my kind. My kind follow the Bible, and NOT for their personal benefit at the expense of others!!! I understand we will not see eye to eye, however you have your opinions, I have mine. Lets just leave it at that. No need for name calling right?


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> Listen, bunny.. I don't preach. I answer questions.


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Dude would you care if I used the pic of the dude holding the ax on another site?


Go for it, it's supposed to be Conan, do a google search for Conan, alot better pics than that one!!!


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## busyLivin (Dec 23, 2004)

ok, my friends.. I'm heading out for the night. min0, the popcorn is yours


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

_Talk to you later busy. _


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## iMan323 (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> this is about Bush? get over it, man... nothin you can do!
> 
> And you won't get very far hating the religious.  We greatly out-number you.




Bush is one,the people in power who helped push him along are many.  Of course, you outnumber us.  That's why it my moral duty to resist you every way I can.


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## min0 lee (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> ok, my friends.. I'm heading out for the night. min0, the popcorn is yours


Thanks


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

busyLivin said:
			
		

> ok, my friends.. I'm heading out for the night. min0, the popcorn is yours


Thanks for your input Busy. GODspeed!!!


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _What did she do wrong? Did she kill something for the rituals? Tells us about it with more details man.  _


OK. She'll probably be dead soon...


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

I used to work with 2 High Preists I think they called themselves from the Wiccan religion!!!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> OK. She'll probably be dead soon...


_It must be great to be one of your ex-girlfriends 
Tell us what she did. _


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _It must be great to be one of your ex-girlfriends _
> _Tell us what she did. _


Anything that moved and I'm like a too-too train...


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)




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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

>


So you know her too huh...


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> So you know her too huh...


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _It must be great to be one of your ex-girlfriends _
> _Tell us what she did. _


No seriously bro this whore followed me around for about five years after I told her to go to hell! She is wack! I called her the headmonster...


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> So you know her too huh...





			
				Archangel said:
			
		

>



_Sorry but when I am the only atheist on the table, I can´t share a laugh with christians. _


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## King Silverback (Dec 23, 2004)

I'm off, Merry Christmas to all!!!


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Sorry but when I am the only atheist on the table, I can´t share a laugh with christians. _


Yep. You know her...


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> I'm off, Merry Christmas to all!!!


_Merry christmas to you and your family. _


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Archangel said:
			
		

> I'm off, Merry Christmas to all!!!


Merry CHRISTmas Arc!


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> No seriously bro this whore followed me around for about five years after I told her to go to hell! She is wack! I called her the headmonster...


_Was she hot? Not in a hell kind of way. _


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Merry christmas to you and your family. _


Merry Christmas to you too Vieope. Enjoy bro... I'm out of here as well.


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## SuperFlex (Dec 23, 2004)

Vieope said:
			
		

> _Was she hot? Not in a hell kind of way. _


Hot enough to make your peter melt... But who gives a rats hinny... There are other chicks minus Satan that look just as good...


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Merry Christmas to you too Vieope. Enjoy bro... I'm out of here as well.


_You too, enjoy christmas.  _


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## Vieope (Dec 23, 2004)

bkc said:
			
		

> Hot enough to make your peter melt... But who gives a rats hinny... There are other chicks minus Satan that look just as good...


----------



## Newt (Dec 23, 2004)

God is not a building and he can't be found in a building.  He is found inside of yourself!


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## zl214 (Dec 23, 2004)

*1. **Secular Humanism (100%) **2. **Unitarian Universalism (100%) **3. **Liberal Quakers (85%) **4. **Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (82%) **5. **Nontheist (80%) **6. **Theravada Buddhism (80%) **7. **Neo-Pagan (60%) **8. **Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (57%)* 

*1. **Secular Humanism (100%) *is jesus humanist since he atoned for ancient human (no, not us)??? would that make me a secular jusus?

btw , im on vieope's side, an atheist too  .


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## pumpthatiron (Dec 23, 2004)

*1. **Islam (100%) **2. **Orthodox Judaism (100%) **3. **Sikhism (83%) **4. **Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (81%) **5. **Bahá'í Faith (81%) **6. **Eastern Orthodox (79%) **7. **Orthodox Quaker (79%) **8. **Roman Catholic (79%) **9. **Reform Judaism (77%) **10. **Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (70%) **11. **Seventh Day Adventist (70%) **12. **Hinduism (66%) **13. **Jainism (66%) **14. **Liberal Quakers (65%) **15. **Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (57%) **16. **Mahayana Buddhism (57%) **17. **Neo-Pagan (53%) **18. **Unitarian Universalism (53%) **19. **Jehovah's Witness (52%) **20. **Scientology (45%) **21. **Theravada Buddhism (44%) **22. **New Age (40%) **23. **Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (34%) **24. **New Thought (34%) **25. **Secular Humanism (18%) **26. **Nontheist (15%) **27. **Taoism (15%) *

hollla (i'm muslim)


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## busyLivin (Dec 24, 2004)

that test is bogus.


----------

