# short test prop cycle opinions.



## madmartigan (Mar 21, 2006)

Hello all!
I have done 2 deca only cycles in the past with good results, and now want to test the water with some short cycles of test only, so here are a couple of questions for some of you helpful guys...

1) Would 100mg eod of test prop for 3 weeks be effective for a relative novice who grew well off 400mg deca for only 7 weeks last cycle?

2) How harsh would this be for hair loss?.. i have a little frontal loss already and it is a concern.

3) Would adding propecia or duestride to block dht hinder the gains much?

4) would the gains retention post cycle be quite good? if i used nolva for 1month pct


Thanks for the help!


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## BigPapaPump68 (Mar 21, 2006)

you might want to run it longer than 3 weeks. The only reason why I dont like prop to much cuz it made me hairy as hell.


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## Pirate! (Mar 21, 2006)

Three weeks isn't long enough. Try 6 minimum. It will likely accelerate hair loss. Nobody can say how much. Propecia and Avodart likely hinder gains some. With the proper diet and exercise routine, you should keep the majority of gains beyond pct.


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## madmartigan (Mar 22, 2006)

The reason I was going to keep it to 3 weeks was to reduce the side effects, such as unwanted hair growth / hair loss.

And I read somewere that my own test production wont have such a hard time bouncing back after only 3 weeks. 

If succesful I was planning on doing 3,4 or 5 small ones a year as this would also improve motivation without the need for long periods without any improvement in the gym.

Would 3 weeks not yield any gains? ... how long does test p take to kick in?


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## Pirate! (Mar 22, 2006)

You can feel prop within a day, but your levels won't peak for a good week or so. Your dose is small. I guess you should try it and see if it is what you expected. Don't expect to make massive gains in 3 weeks, though.


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## madmartigan (Mar 22, 2006)

I am not expecting massive gains.... but maybe 5 or 6 pounds with a little fat loss and reduced chance of side effects. Over 4 or 5 cycles these little gains would add up. Am I not being realistic here at the dosage Im thinking of?

As I said, the aim was to have nice steady and keepable gains over a number of short cycles a year... instead of gaining a shed load of muscle in say 10 weeks and then losing a significant amount of it and being unmotivated for another 2 or 3 months.


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## Pirate! (Mar 23, 2006)

Your goals match your plan, but prop tends to have a fair amount of sides. The first cycle will be the best, then the next few will yield diminishing returns. You should change your doses every cycle. If you keep doing a low dose prop only cycle, you won't continue to grow as much.


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## madmartigan (Mar 23, 2006)

Prop has loads of sides? more than other test's?
This is so friggin confusing. I did deca as it has low sides... but everyone said you have to add test!
Now I want to try just test and you are warning me about the sides.

Would nolva and maybe propecia not limit the sides considerably?

What cycle would you suggest for someone who is concerned abouy hair loss?

Cheers for the input mate!


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## brogers (Mar 23, 2006)

Because of the quick rise in blood levels sides will come on quicker, test is test, but he release rate is different so your side effects will come on faster than they would with enanthate or cypionate.  Prop is also notorious for making a really sore injection site.


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## madmartigan (Mar 23, 2006)

If the sides are going to come regardless of the form of test, woudln't it be better to get them quicker?
I thought there were "slightly" less androgenic sides to prop anyway than other esters?

Would there really be that many sides at the dosages I am suggesting?


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## lnvanry (Mar 23, 2006)

If you want a quicker acting cycle run prop/tren...maybe some orals if water retention isn't an issue.


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## Pirate! (Mar 23, 2006)

This is very bad advice.


			
				lnvanry said:
			
		

> If you want a quicker acting cycle run prop/tren...maybe some orals if water retention isn't an issue.



At 100 mg EOD, your "sides" won't likely be bad at all. Nolva will help prevent gyno. Propecia or Avodart might mitigate the hair loss. If you are prone to stress, your anxiety may increase. What other "sides" are you concerned about? This is a pretty light weight cycle.


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## madmartigan (Mar 23, 2006)

shit, I didn't know test made you more anxious... Im pretty edgy already and would consider myself an anxious person.
That might put me off test completely if that is a common side.


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## kraziplaya (Mar 23, 2006)

i have very slight anxiety issues and dont feel like test makes them any worse..

i dont see anything wrong with running a short mini cycle(4 weeks)

ill be trying that my next cycle


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## lnvanry (Mar 23, 2006)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> This is very bad advice.
> 
> 
> At 100 mg EOD, your "sides" won't likely be bad at all. Nolva will help prevent gyno. Propecia or Avodart might mitigate the hair loss. If you are prone to stress, your anxiety may increase. What other "sides" are you concerned about? This is a pretty light weight cycle.



why?  What else is going to give you results is 3wks?

Tren is a very fast acting agent.  I don't even need to explain the orals.


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## Pirate! (Mar 25, 2006)

lnvanry said:
			
		

> why?  What else is going to give you results is 3wks?
> 
> Tren is a very fast acting agent.  I don't even need to explain the orals.


It is his first cycle, and he wants no sides. Having him start prop/tren/dbol is asking for almost every side in the book. Horrible advice.


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## ZECH (Mar 25, 2006)

Tren is for very experienced users IMO. Not for a newbie.


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## GFR (Mar 25, 2006)

PirateFromHell said:
			
		

> It is his first cycle, and he wants no sides. Having him start prop/tren/dbol is asking for almost every side in the book. Horrible advice.


I agree 100%


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## LAM (Mar 26, 2006)

the fact that you have done 2 deca only cycles means you need to do a LOT more research before continuing to use steroids...


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## madmartigan (Mar 26, 2006)

Not really mate, I have done a lot of research... and subsequently came to the conclusion that my choice of substances was the best for me. 

I currently have a full head of hair and want to keep it that way so hair loss and other side effects were a big concern of mine, deca was the best choice when weighing up the risk/reward equation. 

I know many would say to add in some test. as deca is very supressive of natural T for some.... I honestly didn't find it too bad though. I reasoned that test was perhaps overkill for my initial steps into the world of steroids, and the risks of side effects were too great considering my goals. 

Whilst on both deca only cycles I admitidly did experience a slight loss of libido. But on the whole I have gained 20 ibs of permanent muscle and 2 inches on my arms. Having experience no other side effects I feel I have been very succesful and with hindsight made the right choice. 
Running 400mg of deca per week with the usual prescription of adding 400mg test p/w I believe I would have put on more mass than I wanted to. 

If I decide to go further down the chemical route I may indeed try Test or another substance (which is what my original post is about)...
 but trust me I did a load of research and would advise anyone to do so before sticking chemicals in their bodies. I am in a good position in that I belive I have built a solid base on which to build, and having kept my initial cycles fairly prudent I will be able to make decent gains on my 3rd cycle too without needing loads of gear.

 Just out of interest mr. research which roids and at what dosages would you suggest for someone who is worried about hair loss?


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## GFR (Mar 26, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> Not really mate, I have done a lot of research... and subsequently came to the conclusion that my choice of substances was the best for me.
> 
> I currently have a full head of hair and want to keep it that way so hair loss and other side effects were a big concern of mine, deca was the best choice when weighing up the risk/reward equation.
> 
> ...


 Not a chance, steroids do not give you permanent muscle gains...unless you are lazy  and use them before you have built up to your natural limit. Then you just get what you would have if you worked hard naturally and put in the time...except you also get the possible medical problems and criminal problems you don't get when you train naturally.

Only an idot would use steroids if they have hair loss problems.....why give up your hair for some temporary muscle..that is just stupid.


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## madmartigan (Mar 27, 2006)

Ok perhaps I hadn't reached my natural limit... I must be lazy! Personally I don't see an issue here... I trained naturaly for 10+ years using many training protocols, my first deca only cycle 2 yrs ago put loads of muscle on me and I kept the majority of it for 2 years until my second cycle. I didn't have the patience to put on a couple of lousy pounds a year... I want it now! and I am fairly happy with what I have achieved so whats the problem?

I don't have a hair loss problem, but there is baldness in my family and I do not want it to happen to me...or at least I don't want to bring it on quicker if I am destined for it.... hence my initial choice of deca and my susequent consideration of using test with propecia. 

The medical problems you mention are also one of the reasons I chose Deca as it it widely regarded as fairly safe compared to say testosterone. 

As for the crimial problems... there are none as posession of steroids is not illegal here in the UK! ha ha!

And following your logic, why risk any unwanted side effect for the gain of temporary muscle?


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## LAM (Mar 27, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> I know many would say to add in some test. as deca is very supressive of natural T for some.... I honestly didn't find it too bad though.



DECA suppressess EVERYBODY's natrual test production just like EVERY OTHER steroid does.  there is no steroid that does not greatly effect natural test production


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## GFR (Mar 27, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> Ok *perhaps I hadn't reached my natural limit*... I must be lazy! Personally I don't see an issue here... *I trained naturaly for 10+ years *using many training protocols, my first deca only cycle 2 yrs ago put loads of muscle on me and I kept the majority of it for 2 years until my second cycle. I didn't have the patience to put on a couple of lousy pounds a year... I want it now! and I am fairly happy with what I have achieved so whats the problem?
> 
> I don't have a hair loss problem, but there is baldness in my family and I do not want it to happen to me...or at least I don't want to bring it on quicker if I am destined for it.... hence my initial choice of deca and my susequent consideration of using test with propecia.
> 
> ...


It's clear you didn't even come close, steroids will not give you permanent gains past what your genetics allow. As for the rest of your post good luck with the hair and the health.




			
				madmartigan said:
			
		

> Hello everyone.
> Just thought that it might be interesting to post my first cycle experiences over the comming weeks just incase anyone is interested. *I am 25*, currently *weigh about 178* *have trained since I was 17. *
> I have decided to go for a deca only cycle of 400mg/week for 8 weeks. I have read opposing views on this, some say its a waste, others say they gain 20 pounds. The reason I didn't stack first time is because I don't want any hair loss (a lot of the blokes in my family are complete slap heads). and truith be told I am a bit of a pussy. I got some organon yellow tops from holland off a site on the net (in the uk we can import steroids legally, which is nice)
> I took my first injection a week ago which freaked the fu*$ out of me, but the second one was easier. I plan to alternate my ass
> ...


*10+*  *more like 7+ son.....*.*.Try to keep your BS stories the same.
*


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

17 through to 25 is 9 years fool and I trained sparodicaly for a couple of years prior to 17. Pretty pathetic that you have to check through my old posts for small and irelivant inconsistencies - have you nothing better to do?. Sorry I don't fucking fact check and cross reference every post I make. 
I have better things to do than to come on here and make up stories, everything I have written is truthful bar that one fucking small difference between this post and one I wrote 2 years ago. If I was sad enough Im sure I could find errors in you posts. Unless they are all bashing others and pretending you know it all. 

 One misstatement does not mean everything I wrote was B.S. If you read my historical posts fully they all corroborate with my "B.S" story as you call it. 
 Im just here looking for some helpful advice off some more experienced people, You are a cock for trying to knock me. 

Who cares if I wasn't at my natural peak. I look good now and bar a couple of pounds of fat I am nearly at my ideal. My "natural limit" does not bother me... I just want to improve my body when I am young enough to enjoy the benefits (more pussy etc.) my reasons for doing steroids no doubt differ from yours... this does not mean mine are any less valid. 



I don't want to get massive, as in my opinion, and the majority of the general public it looks ridiculous and is abhorrent to women. 

You are pretty hypocritical chastising me on the health risks I took with deca... I have read post where you have recomended test to newbies which is much more side-effect prone. 

p.s I saw a picture of you a while back and you just look like a fat old twat.
Why risk doing steroids to look so shit?


p.s.s. Foreman was shit.


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

I agree with you LAM... the Test is needed to add some androgens as Deca is mainly anabolic.


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## GFR (Mar 28, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> 17 through to 25 is 9 years fool and I trained sparodicaly for a couple of years prior to 17. Pretty pathetic that you have to check through my old posts for small and irelivant inconsistencies - have you nothing better to do?. Sorry I don't fucking fact check and cross reference every post I make.
> I have better things to do than to come on here and make up stories, everything I have written is truthful bar that one fucking small difference between this post and one I wrote 2 years ago. If I was sad enough Im sure I could find errors in you posts. Unless they are all bashing others and pretending you know it all.
> 
> One misstatement does not mean everything I wrote was B.S. If you read my historical posts fully they all corroborate with my "B.S" story as you call it.
> ...


 *
17 you begin workoing out so at 18 that is one year....lets do the math Einstein*
17: 0
18: 1
19: 2
20: 3
21: 4
22: 5
23: 6
24: 7
25: 8

Now it can be 7+-8+ years depending on when you exactly started...if you started on your 17th Birthday then by your 25th birthday you have 8 years of training....but if you started at 17 years and 11 months and you just turned 25 then it is 7 years and one month. The bottom line it is not 10+ years as you said son.


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

If I started training on my 17th birthday, by the end of my 25th year that would be 9 years old man (with a small amount of rounding as most poeple arn't pedantic sad losers) 

Is this forum just about nit picking and belittleing people just because your opinions differ to those of others and to "prove" how clever you are?
Im not even sure what your point is... that Im a liar?, That I don't know as much as you? That im numerically challenged? that I shouldn't have done steroids?, that I should have done harsher/more steroids? Please elaborate

I was being approximate in both the mail I posted 2 fucking years ago and my more recently posted one, to be quite honest I cant remember how old I was when I started training as I said it was quite on-off for a while - so not sure when day zero was.
And to be honest it makes no fucking difference anyway. It does not negate my whole question or cast doubt on my results or b.s story as you so elequently called it.


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## GFR (Mar 28, 2006)

No it can not be 9 years but it could be close.....however I doubt that, probably 7.5 years or so at best and clearly most of those years you were training and eating wrong. Still at a tiny 178 you are yeras away from needing steroid use.

Try not to lie on this site son....you have been caught once and will be again.


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

I whole hartedly agree my diet and training were not spot on by any means.
I can't cook for shit, I get drunk at least twice a week, and have smoked a load of weed in my time... though I did cut this out whilst on steroids. 

Perhaps I would have grown without the need for steroids given time and cutting out my vices. But for some of us weight training is not all there is to life, I am young and like to party...I also want a nice body so steroids have helped me a long way towards this. I could have my dream body in a year, still young  enough to enjoy having it and I would have saved myslef a load of years effort in the gym. whats the problem?


I didn't lie old man, I made a small error in a single post 2 years ago.. Didn't realise people were so fucking sad as to check. _ Wont happen again sir.


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## GFR (Mar 28, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> I whole hartedly agree my diet and training were not spot on by any means.
> I can't cook for shit,* I get drunk at least twice a week, and have smoked a load of weed in my time.*.. though I did cut this out whilst on steroids.
> 
> Perhaps I would have grown without the need for steroids given time and cutting out my vices. But for some of us weight training is not all there is to life,* I am young and like to party*...*I also want a nice body so steroids have helped me a long way towards this. I could have my dream body in a year, still young  enough to enjoy having it and I would have saved myslef a load of years effort in the gym. whats the problem?*
> ...


I can see you want a nice body, pot and alcohol are a great way to achieve that. It is simple, you are a stupid child who is destroying your body with illegal and legal drugs and now you want to throw another class of drugs into the mix. In 10 years you will look 47 and I guarantee your body will look like it has never been fit.....Pathetic.


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

I am just having fun... more fun than some "know it all" who spends so much time slagging off other peoples opinions on a forum... you are sad mate.

My body is far from destroyed mate, I am about *balance*. I am fit and healthy, exercise 4 times a week (weights and aerobic)  and also use chemicals (occasionally) and alcohol in an intelligent and measured way to enhance my life.

I am not obsessed with size , as big dudes look like ridiculous self obsessed freaks to me. I just want to look "buff" and I do thanks to steroids.  

Even Arnie drank and smoked pot occasionaly, you need to lighten up a bit old man. 

You can't "guarantee" anything mate, as you don't know everything.
I have been partying for over 10 years mate and I still look young for my age and am in the best shape of my life.
You look (and talk) like a fat old kill joy know it all... to me you are pathetic.


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## GFR (Mar 28, 2006)

Like I said in 10 years you will look and feel like you are almost 50, sad but typical of most Americans.


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

That maybe true of most americans ... but Im from England.
In 10 years I will look 37... And I would have fully enjoyed my youth.


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## GFR (Mar 28, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> That maybe true of most americans ... but Im from England.
> In 10 years I will look 37... And I would have fully enjoyed my youth.


You should move to America in 10 years, you will fit right in with most fat 50 year old people.


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

Only time will tell. Loads of people binge drink over here, and those people don't look 10 years older.
Who wants to live forever.
There is more to life than bodybuilding.


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## GFR (Mar 28, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> Only time will tell. Loads of people binge drink over here, and those people don't look 10 years older.
> Who wants to live forever.
> There is more to life than bodybuilding.


I could give a shit about Bodybuilding, it's all about staying young as long as you can. At 40 I will be in the best shape of my life and will be loving it. Nothing more funny then to see guys my age who did drugs and partied for 20 years and now look like hell. Guess they didnt realise that when you turn  40 or 50 or 60+ you still want to look and feel good...


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## madmartigan (Mar 28, 2006)

As I said, im all about balance... having fun and keeping healthy, it is possible to do both you know.


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## crimp1 (May 31, 2006)

What's with all the American comments?


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## GFR (Jun 1, 2006)

madmartigan said:
			
		

> As I said, im all about balance... having fun and keeping healthy, it is possible to do both you know.


It is not!


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## pengers84 (Jun 1, 2006)

Foremans a cyberbully


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## 19-chief (Jun 2, 2006)

i'm going to chime in b/c my best friend is extremely concerned about hair loss and he has now run 3 different cycles with measurable success... i know i usually advocate testosterone as the base of any cycle but if you insist on going without for said reasons the 3 best compounds for you would be primo, eq, and anavar. you're not gonna grow like you would from other compounds, but when combined with proper nutrition and training these will yield good results.
his first cycle: 400mg primo ew for 10 weeks. second: 400mg primo, 400mg eq ew for 12 weeks. and the current one: 40mg anavar ed for 6 weeks, 400mg primo and 600mg eq for 12 weeks. he looks f*cking jacked right now.





			
				madmartigan said:
			
		

> Not really mate, I have done a lot of research... and subsequently came to the conclusion that my choice of substances was the best for me.
> 
> I currently have a full head of hair and want to keep it that way so hair loss and other side effects were a big concern of mine, deca was the best choice when weighing up the risk/reward equation.
> 
> ...


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## 19-chief (Jun 2, 2006)

i think he is going to experiment with turanabol stacked with primo next.


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## Dylann (Apr 26, 2011)

Just came across this post and this may be of help.

I am running 75mg eod of test propionate for 4 weeks to get ready for a comp.
It is short acting, and after 1 week even at this low dosage I definitely looked bigger and fuller and water retention was non existent. 
The other benefits are that a 4 week cycle is easy to recover, and from doing quite a bit of research a 4 week cycle doesnt allow for significant side effects.
I am concerned with hair loss as well, so if you do see any the test prop will be out of your system in much quicker time 
I do compete as a fitness model so it is different from bodybuilding, but for me it is about great conditioning on stage and preperaing for photo shoots.

In relation to keeping the gains from a 4 week cycle, I haven't used HCG and personally I dont know if it will keep them or not with proper PCT.

If anyone has had experience with short cycles of test prop  i'd be interested in your feedback and how you found it


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