# Where to begin . . . .



## Veridicality (Apr 22, 2004)

I've been working out for two years, with good gains.  I started as the skinny white boy that anyone (even your little eight year old sister) could whopp up on.  I was in my mid-30's, and decided to get healthy.  It has gone very well.  My arms are up 3", chest increased 4 inches.  Calves 2 1/2 inches.  Am I where I want to be?  Not by a long shot.  So, where to from here?  I've done so much research on steroids, that sometimes I get so damn confused, I don't know what to do or who to listen to.  I still don't know what cycle to begin with, what to use, and so on.  Can anyone offer help to someone that wants to make the necessary gains, but doesn't necessarily want to enter any competitions.  Im dedicated, and lovin' it.  I wish I had gotten motivated earlier in life.  As to stats:  I'm 36, 6' 1", 185, great health.  Thanks in advnace for any info you could share with me.  -JP


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## Just a guy (Apr 22, 2004)

Good to hear that someone Actually researches before they Start wanting to juice.  Well brother... for your 1st cycle i would recommend a Testosterone ONLY cycle... so you can see how your body responds to it.  You will love it because the Test will improve your quality of life also(at a reasonable dose).

But i would get some Testosterone cypionate or Enthanate... and use about 500mg's a week... 250mg's Twice a week.   GEt your diet in check and you should be good to go brother.


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## Veridicality (Apr 22, 2004)

12 week cycle?


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## GSXR750 (Apr 22, 2004)

Try 8-10.


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## Just a guy (Apr 22, 2004)

its up to you Verid... just keep your BP checked... and BLood work.

But usually Beginners do 8-10... i did 16 weeks for my 1st.. but I wasnt that bright then.


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## Veridicality (Apr 22, 2004)

Thank you.


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## Mudge (Apr 22, 2004)

If you end up buying a 10cc vial (or two 10cc vials) a 10 weeker is perfect.


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## JerseyDevil (Apr 22, 2004)

Welcome to IM Verid.  You've come to the right place.  As the others suggested, a 10 week 500 mg/wk test enanthate cycle would be perfect. Don't know where you started, but if you were skinny and now up to 185, you must be doing something right.  What is your approximate bodyfat?


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## Veridicality (Apr 23, 2004)

I'm at 11% body fat currently.  A few years ago, when I started all of this, I was at 145 lbs, which was THIN on a 6'1" guy.  I started with 9.5" arms and 34.5" chest just to give a couple of measurements.  (Sad when your upper arm is the same as your lower arm . .. . . LOL) And I'm currently no where near where most of you are, but I figure if I set the goals, do the research, follow the plan and stick to it, I'll be there one day.  In two years my arms are now at 12.5 and my chest is at 39.  By no means huge, but it's better than where I was and at least I feel I'm headed in the right direction. Getting there is half the fun is how I see it.  I appreciate everyone's advice.  -JP


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## Veridicality (Apr 23, 2004)

On my first cycle, what would you recommend as far as diet.  I'm currently at 3200 cals a day, with a 40-35-15 ratio of carbs, prot, and fat.  8 meals a day.  And 2-64 oz of water.  Should I up the cal's?  Or just eat with no regard while cycling?


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## Mudge (Apr 23, 2004)

Damn I wish my waist was 34.5" 

You are doing well already to track calories and ratios, I dont even really monitor my ratio right now. I look at protein and calories.

If you want to gain weight yes you need to increase the calories. I would add 1000-1500, you can do it in two steps if you like, but I would not add less than 750 to start with. Eating with no regard leaves too much room for error, I did it my first time (the see-food diet) but really its not a smart way to go about things.


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## usntoothfairy (Apr 23, 2004)

Verid, is that 50/35/15? This is my current  ratio I love it not eating as much cals but plan on an increase to bulk-up. Thanx in Advance


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## Veridicality (Apr 23, 2004)

Mudge - my waist has gone from a 32 to a 33 in two years.  Hopefully it will stay around that size.  I will increase the cal's by 750 and then by another 750 two weeks later.  I eat so much tuna, chicken, and beef already, can't wait to eat more of it. . . . LOL

usn - 50-35-15 is correct.  Sorry for the typo.


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## Just a guy (Apr 23, 2004)

yehp... definently slowly scale your calories up... i did the See food diet also and i turned into a Fat pig...


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## Mudge (Apr 23, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Veridicality *_
> Mudge - my waist has gone from a 32 to a 33 in two years.  Hopefully it will stay around that size.



I haven't seen 34.5" for many a moon. When I was last 37" I felt f#cking lean   Im' 6'2"


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## Just a guy (Apr 23, 2004)

my ratio is 65/15/20


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## Veridicality (Apr 23, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Just a guy *_
> my ratio is 65/15/20



What is your cal count?


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## Just a guy (Apr 23, 2004)

right now 2200... im cutting


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## BUSTINOUT (Apr 26, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Veridicality *_
> Mudge - my waist has gone from a 32 to a 33 in two years.



YOU SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!lol


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## Mudge (Apr 26, 2004)

Seriously I'd look pretty good if I had a waist like that, I am doing cardio to try and get my own down and I need to pull back some of my nasty carbos.


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## JerseyDevil (Apr 27, 2004)

> _*Originally posted by Veridicality *_
> I will increase the cal's by 750 and then by another 750 two weeks later.  I eat so much tuna, chicken, and beef already, can't wait to eat more of it. . . .



That's a good plan.  I increased mine by about a 1,200 right away and put on too much fat in the first couple of weeks.  I would increase by 750 the first week, then gradually raise them to 1,500 by week 4.

Your diet looks great.  Keep in mind though the goal is to put on some mass.  It is ok to throw in the occasional double cheeseburger, and other high fat foods since they are calorie dense.


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## Veridicality (Apr 30, 2004)

Don't worry, once a week I eat my fav:  A Wendy's Double cheese burger, fully dressed.  It's my one "treat" that I give myself every Sunday afternoon.  I eat the other six days worth of meals to get to that one!  LOL

As to size gains, I realize everyone is different, but when do you first notice any gains once starting the cycle?  And what is considered an average gain by the end of the cycle?  And once done with the cycle, how much is lost?

Have a good one.  JP


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## Mudge (Apr 30, 2004)

On dbol and prop a couple days, the other stuff takes too long for my tastes.


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