# girl im friends with....



## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

girl im friends with, (possibly more down the road) just started 25mg of var for her show. I personally dont think she even needed it, but her coach insisted. this girl means alot to me, and shes already experiencing side effects. isnt 25mg a high dose for a chick? thought it was like 10mg?  shes doing figure, and without any supps besides her pre workout and her hardcore diet, shes dialed in. shes already lookin like she could take 1 week and be good to go on stage.   just frustrating i guess.... thoughts?


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## Big Puppy (Jul 4, 2014)

Pics for examination


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## IronAddict (Jul 4, 2014)

Yeah, 10mg safely. Hell yeah man, a couple that trains together stays together.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> Yeah, 10mg safely. Hell yeah man, a couple that trains together stays together.



man thats what i thought, and told her, but shes all, well my trainer says this..... im like, ok whatever im gonna shutup now.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

thats her like 3weeks ago. and she started var aweek ago. in 1 week before she started the var, her body changed even more for the good.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)




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## IronAddict (Jul 4, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> man thats what i thought, and told her, but shes all, well my trainer says this..... im like, ok whatever im gonna shutup now.



Love the do not print on those pants. I can only imagine what a good dosing of var would do, cause she wasn't too far off, bro.


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## IronAddict (Jul 4, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


>



I love when women take selfies, they sure do know how to turn a guy on!


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> Love the do not print on those pants. I can only imagine what a good dosing of var would do, cause she wasn't too far off, bro.


Yeh the pants r epic. Yeh, she isn't far off. Plus she has plenty of time before her show. A good dose of var would be what, 10mg? I don't get the 25mg dose he has her on. And there are other photos I shall not post as I like her and she likes me. Any ladies wanna ad their input?


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## IronAddict (Jul 4, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> Yeh the pants r epic. Yeh, she isn't far off. Plus she has plenty of time before her show. A good dose of var would be what, 10mg? I don't get the 25mg dose he has her on. And there are other photos I shall not post as I like her and she likes me. Any ladies wanna ad their input?



10mg is what I've learned, but maybe he figures a short blast wouldn't be bad. But you did say she's already experiencing sides?  Just keep an eye her man, that's your woman.

And I know exactly what you mean about those other pics.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> 10mg is what I've learned, but maybe he figures a short blast wouldn't be bad. But you did say she's already experiencing sides?  Just keep an eye her man, that's your woman.
> 
> And I know exactly what you mean about those other pics.


yeh i care a lot about her. she said something like 7weeks of var. im just like ughhhhhhhhhh. i try my best, and shes always asked me for advice up until this stupid trainer.  lol
i dont want her to lose that nice feminine face look lol. she already has the determination IMO to do it without the help of supps...esp since its her first show and from what shes said, the competition isnt that bad. 
and i tried giving u a rep but it said i had to wait.


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## IronAddict (Jul 4, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> yeh i care a lot about her. she said something like 7weeks of var. im just like ughhhhhhhhhh. i try my best, and shes always asked me for advice up until this stupid trainer.  lol
> i dont want her to lose that nice feminine face look lol. she already has the determination IMO to do it without the help of supps...esp since its her first show and from what shes said, the competition isnt that bad.
> and i tried giving u a rep but it said i had to wait.



That damn reputation thingamacounter, that's another can o' worms! 7 wks isn't too short..... Well she's motivated that's for sure. Just watch over her and let her know she's going to far. Because 25mg won't have the same effect next time.

Too be honest, sounds like he's relying on the var to make himself look good. But I don't know the guy, that's where you step in.


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## HeavyB (Jul 4, 2014)

Check ok KOS log on his lady she is running 10mg daily. My lady will run 10mg for 60 days starting in sept.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> That damn reputation thingamacounter, that's another can o' worms! 7 wks isn't too short..... Well she's motivated that's for sure. Just watch over her and let her know she's going to far. Because 25mg won't have the same effect next time.
> 
> Too be honest, sounds like he's relying on the var to make himself look good. But I don't know the guy, that's where you step in.


That's what I personally think.  She's done her own diet own training but for some reason she was recommended to this guy who does show prep diets. I've never met him, but I have a few choice words I would like to say



HeavyB said:


> Check ok KOS log on his lady she is running 10mg daily. My lady will run 10mg for 60 days starting in sept.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Will do thanks!!


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## bar_belle (Jul 4, 2014)

That's fantastic she's going to compete!  Yeah, 25 mg is a little high.  As Sassy69 says, it's always good start low and go slow when adding supplements.  Can always up dosage or increase frequency later once you are familiar with effects.  Hard to take away once you're down the road.


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## raysd21 (Jul 4, 2014)

Trainers are....emotionally involved with a lot of their "clients progress." I think it's easy for them to develop a personal agenda in the process to a point of being biased and unhealthy. I think you need to smack your friend in the noggin and tell her to take your opinion more serious. There is a probodybuilder on here named sassy69. You could pm her. She is also on TID which has a much bigger female member base and article section bro.


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## s2h (Jul 4, 2014)

25mg is too high for a female first time user....she does appear that she would benefit from some added muscle...but 25mg of var isnt the immediate answer..

Then there is risk and reward consequences of any female using steroids..


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 4, 2014)

Guys and ladies thanks so much for you alls input. I'm gonna try and get her to join this forum and maybe learn a thing or too or three lol. And guys thanks for being respectful when I posted the pics.


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## IronAddict (Jul 5, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> Guys and ladies thanks so much for you alls input. I'm gonna try and get her to join this forum and maybe learn a thing or too or three lol. And guys thanks for being respectful when I posted the pics.



That's a really good idea! There are some super female trainers here, you' ll meet them...


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 5, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> That's a really good idea! There are some super female trainers here, you' ll meet them...


I hope so man. She's a real cool chick and could learn a shit ton on here. 
Check ur pm


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## IronAddict (Jul 5, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> I hope so man. She's a real cool chick and could learn a shit ton on here.
> Check ur pm



This place is golden, jon, really knowledgeable people here. And this place needs all the cool chicks it can get!


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 5, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> This place is golden, jon, really knowledgeable people here. And this place needs all the cool chicks it can get!



amen to that. I just got off the phone with her....shes headed to meet with her trainer. shes running 20mg of var, not 25. but still, i told her what all you guys said and shes caught in a rock and a hard place. two different groups of people telling her advice. ughhhhhhhh


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## IronAddict (Jul 5, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> amen to that. I just got off the phone with her....shes headed to meet with her trainer. shes running 20mg of var, not 25. but still, i told her what all you guys said and shes caught in a rock and a hard place. two different groups of people telling her advice. ughhhhhhhh




Not a fun place to be at all, something tells me that you know what I mean.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 5, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> Not a fun place to be at all, something tells me that you know what I mean.



yeh but what do i do? she says, "im just gonna listen to my coach."  my reply, ok baby, i just hope he knows what hes doing but im sure he does since he does it for a living." all the while im wanting to talk to this guy and tell him, ok, youre messing with a girls girlyness


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## bar_belle (Jul 5, 2014)

She's in a tough spot. Wants to believe in her trainer and she wants to please you. Ultimately, she's got to make the choice on her own. Ideally, it's an informed decision. You can support her in being smart. Researching herself. Ask her trainer his reasoning for dosage. Ask about his experience w it. Tell him her concerns. Sigh...ugh. Sorry you're in this spot, too.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 5, 2014)

bar_belle said:


> She's in a tough spot. Wants to believe in her trainer and she wants to please you. Ultimately, she's got to make the choice on her own. Ideally, it's an informed decision. You can support her in being smart. Researching herself. Ask her trainer his reasoning for dosage. Ask about his experience w it. Tell him her concerns. Sigh...ugh. Sorry you're in this spot, too.


ive yet to meet this coach/trainer. apparently his wife competes and he has a bunch of ladies running var and my girl sees them and is like, ok, i could do that without looking different. shes tiny to begin with. used to be overweight like crazy, and she did all the hardwork her self without AAS just a healthy diet, and diehard training. i admire her as much as i like her.


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## s2h (Jul 5, 2014)

airbornejonny18b said:


> yeh but what do i do? She says, "im just gonna listen to my coach."  my reply, ok baby, i just hope he knows what hes doing but im sure he does since he does it for a living." all the while im wanting to talk to this guy and tell him, ok, youre messing with a green berets girl, so u better knock your shit off or youll have all of 2batt 10th sfg on your fucking ass



oda??


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 5, 2014)

s2h said:


> oda??



PMd u.... reply quick please


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## sassy69 (Jul 6, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> yeh but what do i do? she says, "im just gonna listen to my coach."  my reply, ok baby, i just hope he knows what hes doing but im sure he does since he does it for a living." all the while im wanting to talk to this guy and tell him, ok, youre messing with a girls girlyness



There are plenty of dipshit coaches who make a living at recommending steroid cycles for girls who "will do whatever it takes". Take a look around at the ten thousand bikini & figure competitors who are coming from "I just started lifting 3 months ago and I want to get my Pro Card!" and what a nice big fat cash cow that can be for someone who sells "prep services". Not saying this guy is, but there are plenty out there who don't really know shit but still sell it.  If he works w/ other women, then he may have experience, but at the end of the day it is still HER body. And SHE doesn't have experience and he's not a certified and insured medical expert in female hormonal / endocrine systems to be handing out recommendations for controlled substances. Welcome to the dark side. She needs to know what she's doing. 

Here's what I would do:

1) Ask him WHY 20 mg vs some other amount? (If he doesn't answer, then tell him he should be able to speak to why he says stuff like that.) Also this is not intended to be an accusatory discussion w/ this coach - the point also is that you should be able to ask your coach to explain himself when he recommends some sort of controlled substance. It aint' rocket science and plenty of people use the stuff, but it is still a scheduled drug (i.e. illegal w/o a script) and she is still the one who has to deal w/ the impact to her body.

2) Personally I consider var to be fairly consistent so I'd not be all that worried about it. HOWEVER, I would still say drop the dose down for another week or two and see how things go. You can always increase, but I don't like the higher dose right out of the gate. 

Certainly don't want to put extra pressure on her if she's going into her first competition, but I would certainly encourage her to do more research (not just ask you and you ask people on a muscle forum) so that SHE has some idea of what to expect and things to watch for. The stickie called "Women & Drugs" on this forum (or in the Anabolic forum) covers most everything I've come across or have seen asked over the years so I would consider that a decent place to start. This all about HER comfort and not the coach's.


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## oufinny (Jul 6, 2014)

Is she taking taurine, potassium and magnesium? 25 is not a high dose but it's up there.


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## IronAddict (Jul 6, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> yeh but what do i do? she says, "im just gonna listen to my coach."  my reply, ok baby, i just hope he knows what hes doing but im sure he does since he does it for a living." all the while im wanting to talk to this guy and tell him, ok, youre messing with a girls girlyness



Hey jon, you've met some of the people I was referring to. You get your girl in here, Sassy69 is who I would want to train my woman. Some of these guys too, they really  know their stuff.

But I know she wants someone to watch over her and tell her what to do. This is her 1st trainer, yes?  Not the only trainer! Tell her just like when you go to the Dr. and he tells you something you question, you'd get a 2nd or 3rd opinions.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 6, 2014)

sassy69 said:


> Here's what I would do:
> 
> 1) Ask him WHY 20 mg vs some other amount? (If he doesn't answer, then tell him he should be able to speak to why he says stuff like that.) Also this is not intended to be an accusatory discussion w/ this coach - the point also is that you should be able to ask your coach to explain himself when he recommends some sort of controlled substance. It aint' rocket science and plenty of people use the stuff, but it is still a scheduled drug (i.e. illegal w/o a script) and she is still the one who has to deal w/ the impact to her body.
> 
> ...


our schedules always seem to conflict and she sees him once a week or every 10days. he writes up her workout and boom done. shes a smart girl, who was already doing wonders with her workout without him. she told me last night shes just fed up with everyone telling or suggesting her on what to do "and all im gonna do is listen to my coach."   so, i just give her support. 



IronAddict said:


> Hey jon, you've met some of the people I was referring to. You get your girl in here, Sassy69 is who I would want to train my woman. Some of these guys too, they really  know their stuff.
> 
> But I know she wants someone to watch over her and tell her what to do. This is her 1st trainer, yes?  Not the only trainer! Tell her just like when you go to the Dr. and he tells you something you question, you'd get a 2nd or 3rd opinions.


yepppp, first coach/trainer. all i can do is give her positive support.  

oh, and he gave her clen to run as well with the var. im just shaking my head cuz shes already put it out there that shes only listening to her coach. i cant change that sadly. :/


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## IronAddict (Jul 6, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> our schedules always seem to conflict and she sees him once a week or every 10days. he writes up her workout and boom done. shes a smart girl, who was already doing wonders with her workout without him. she told me last night shes just fed up with everyone telling or suggesting her on what to do "and all im gonna do is listen to my coach."   so, i just give her support.
> 
> 
> yepppp, first coach/trainer. all i can do is give her positive support.
> ...



Not good at all, jon. So if her trainer wanted her to inject Tren, she would? And now we add Clen to the mix.... Is this Charles Glass or something?


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 6, 2014)

IronAddict said:


> Not good at all, jon. So if her trainer wanted her to inject Tren, she would? And now we add Clen to the mix.... Is this Charles Glass or something?



i told her if your body starts to hurt and u pass out, your trainer is going to meet some bad guys. she laughed and said "oh i have no doubt in my mind you guys would find him"


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## HeavyB (Jul 6, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> our schedules always seem to conflict and she sees him once a week or every 10days. he writes up her workout and boom done. shes a smart girl, who was already doing wonders with her workout without him. she told me last night shes just fed up with everyone telling or suggesting her on what to do "and all im gonna do is listen to my coach."   so, i just give her support.
> 
> 
> yepppp, first coach/trainer. all i can do is give her positive support.
> ...



I personally don't put much faith in a coach that sees the person one time a week. When I have a trainer I saw them 3 times a week and we worked out then. How can someone train you without seeing what you can do. Sounds like a waste, I ask of advice on here and give it also but when it comes down to it all me. I would never do anything or take anything until I research it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## IronAddict (Jul 6, 2014)

Airbornejonny18b said:


> i told her if your body starts to hurt and u pass out, your trainer is going to meet some bad guys. she laughed and said "oh i have no doubt in my mind you guys would find him"



Hope it doesn't come to that not for him but for your woman. Whatever happens, he's not the one that kisses her goodnight.




HeavyB said:


> I personally don't pt much faith in a coach that sees the person one time a week. When I have a trainer I saw them 3 times a week and we worked out then. How can someone train you without seeing what you can do. Sounds like a waste, I ask of advice on here and give it also but when it comes down to it all me. I would never do anything or take anything until I research it.




This right here ^^. And I bet he isn't cheap, quite the gig.


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## s2h (Jul 6, 2014)

i can see the 25mg var being a bit much for a first timer...the clen part i don't find as odd or uncommon for a first time competitor...also seeing a coach once a week who doesn't train her live is pretty normal and actually once a week is more then the norm in most cases..


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## sassy69 (Jul 6, 2014)

s2h said:


> i can see the 25mg var being a bit much for a first timer...the clen part i don't find as odd or uncommon for a first time competitor...also seeing a coach once a week who doesn't train her live is pretty normal and actually once a week is more then the norm in most cases..



I agree it's at least at the top of the ballpark that I would suggest. From previous postings, it was corrected to 20 from 25. General opinion is that 25 mg /day starts to get into the range of "if you want to go that high, then why not look at a different compound". It starts to leak into the range where sides become more aggressive, and I'd venture that additionally internal sides become more aggressive as well - meaning - this is why you don't see guys running long cycles of orals because at the doses guys find them to be useful (50-100mg/day), they become more liver-toxic. Women typically run them at less than half of that so the impact is less and can be a longer running cycle. But when you start pushing into that range, it can become a factor.  Also from a financial standpoint, if you're ok w/ dealing w/ more aggressive sides from higher dose var, then why not suck it up and go to an injectable - it becomes much cheaper.

At the end of the day, the biggest message I would want all women to take away from a discussion like this is that they should absolutely be able to ask their coach or whoever is recommending they self-medicate w/ controlled substances the reasoning behind their recommendation. If they can't or won't then I'd be suspicious of said coach. If they have no reasoning behind the recommendation they for all you know, they are parroting what they read on some forum or they are pulling it out of their ass. The most important thing is that the competitor feel empowered to ask questions and expect reasonable and accountable answers such that SHE can make a reasonable decision about what she puts in her body. If you experience bad sides and don't even know why, for all you know, this coach may just go "I dunno. Sucks to be you I guess." and go on his merry way. Whose fault was that? No one held a gun to your head to do what he said.

Knowledge is power.


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## sassy69 (Jul 7, 2014)

oufinny said:


> Is she taking taurine, potassium and magnesium? 25 is not a high dose but it's up there.



For context, I'm assuming this is to supplement w/ the clen?

There is a section in the women & drugs stickie that goes into that for clen. Please see: http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/threads/136316-Women-and-Drugs


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## oufinny (Jul 8, 2014)

sassy69 said:


> For context, I'm assuming this is to supplement w/ the clen?
> 
> There is a section in the women & drugs stickie that goes into that for clen. Please see: http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/threads/136316-Women-and-Drugs



That and the var. Keeping electrolytes in balance is key to success and less sides.


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## Airbornejonny18b (Jul 26, 2014)

she went off grid awhile back. i believe she got rotated out. havnt spoken since begin of july


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