# fruit when cutting?



## premo (Mar 31, 2011)

is it ok to eat fruit when cutting - i feel like if i dont im missing out on important nutriants and vitamins? so as im currently trying to cut a bit of fat is it ok to have fruit either at breakfast or after working out?


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## thegeneral25 (Mar 31, 2011)

Simply, YES! Actually a lot of fruits help you lose fat.


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## AmM (Mar 31, 2011)

thegeneral25 said:


> Simply, YES! Actually a lot of fruits help you lose fat.



What? Explain your answer.


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## Built (Mar 31, 2011)

I'd limit it, personally. Stick to brightly coloured, lower-carb choices such as raspberries and blackberries. Higher-fructose fruits such as pineapples and pears can really mess with your appetite.


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## jimm (Mar 31, 2011)

forgive me if im wrong fruit is a essential part of the diet if your cutting or bulking! and as far as people who change there whole diets because they are "cutting" would it not be best to eat the same foods but just less of them resulting in less calories...


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## oufinny (Mar 31, 2011)

Fruit is dependent upon the rest of your diet.  If you are eating a higher fat, moderate protein with minimal complex carbs (or none like me), fruit is just fine though I agree with Built, keep it on the berry and apple side of things.  I throw in a mongo from time to time on workout days but my diet is of the primal variety so I have no complex carbs.


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## stylus187 (Mar 31, 2011)

premo said:


> is it ok to eat fruit when cutting - i feel like if i dont im missing out on important nutriants and vitamins? so as im currently trying to cut a bit of fat is it ok to have fruit either at breakfast or after working out?


I love watermellon, when curbing my cravings for sugar. The added fiber is also a bonus.


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## oufinny (Mar 31, 2011)

jimm said:


> forgive me if im wrong fruit is a essential part of the diet if your cutting or bulking! and as far as people who change there whole diets because they are "cutting" would it not be best to eat the same foods but just less of them resulting in less calories...



In my eyes diet macro and micro nutrient ratios are far more important that calorie counting.  I am dropping fat and don't count a single calorie at all, if I was more conscious of how much I took in it may speed things up but I am not in a race to be shredded.  More and more research is showing that the calorie in/calorie out conception is very diet dependent.  When complex carbs are involved it changes things, eliminate them and you should cut up on you normal food intake and some minor adjustments near the end can help get you that last few percent.  

Also, since I will get flamed and really don't care, I am not losing any strength and I am keeping all the cycle weight I gained (LBM, its not glycogen when your carbs are this low) along with continued strength gains.  People are deathly afraid of lower carb, no complex carb diets but don't see the benefits.  Read up on the Primal Blue Print, it is actually a very enjoyable way to live your life; especially since I eat what I want, when I want.


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## oufinny (Mar 31, 2011)

stylus187 said:


> I love watermellon, when curbing my cravings for sugar. The added fiber is also a bonus.



Very low on cals and full of goodness, I tear it up in the summer in TX since it is locally grown and tastes great!


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## premo (Mar 31, 2011)

i have been eating alot of protein and salad , snack on cashew or walnuts  cut out fruit breads pasta etc 

but have been doing this a while and im thinking i must need fruit? maybe i should swap the nuts for fruit ?


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## Built (Mar 31, 2011)

jimm said:


> forgive me if im wrong fruit is a essential part of the diet if your cutting or bulking! and as far as people who change there whole diets because they are "cutting" would it not be best to eat the same foods but just less of them resulting in less calories...


Sure - if you can control your appetite. Some foods make that harder to do than others. For some, fruit is one of those foods. 



oufinny said:


> In my eyes diet macro and micro nutrient ratios are far more important that calorie counting.


That may be how you see things, but the physical laws surrounding conservation of mass are not selective.  Health, how you feel, satiety - those are impacted by the mix you consume and the choices you make, but the only thing that impacts upon bodyweight is calorie intake. 


> I am dropping fat and don't count a single calorie at all, if I was more conscious of how much I took in it may speed things up but I am not in a race to be shredded.  More and more research is showing that the calorie in/calorie out conception is very diet dependent.


You must be far better-read than I.


> When complex carbs are involved it changes things, eliminate them and you should cut up on you normal food intake and some minor adjustments near the end can help get you that last few percent.
> 
> Also, since I will get flamed and really don't care, I am not losing any strength and I am keeping all the cycle weight I gained (LBM, its not glycogen when your carbs are this low) along with continued strength gains.  People are deathly afraid of lower carb, no complex carb diets but don't see the benefits.  Read up on the Primal Blue Print, it is actually a very enjoyable way to live your life; especially since I eat what I want, when I want.


When you eat foods that are more satisfying, you do indeed feel a great deal more comfortable on less food. I lost the weight I carried on the Atkins diet and I swore it was magic. Turns out it was still a calorie is a calorie - and killer appetite suppression. Really, that diet was a God-send to me. 



premo said:


> i have been eating alot of protein and salad , snack on cashew or walnuts  cut out fruit breads pasta etc
> 
> but have been doing this a while and im thinking i must need fruit? maybe i should swap the nuts for fruit ?


No need.


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## jagbender (Mar 31, 2011)

Built said:


> Turns out it was still a calorie is a calorie - and killer appetite suppression. Really, that diet was a God-send to me.


 
Me too


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## premo (Apr 1, 2011)

my problem is i can bulk really easy - if i were to eat alot of carbs i could get big quick so when i decide im lean enough and want to bulk i think just adding oats and rice daily will be enough for me to bulk! but while im trying to cut i have kept them very low ... 
i jut wasnt sure if me eating low carb and no fruit im missing out on important nutriants
im 5.10 weigh approx 196 ibs bf approx at a guess id say 15%


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## premo (Apr 1, 2011)

would love to get 6 pack abs b4 i bulk a bit my cuurent diet looks like this 

6 30 am -2 scoops protein shake - small handfull blueberrys
8am -handful of mixed nuts 
10 am -2 scoops protein shake -
1 pm -chicken and salad
3ish -handful nuts 
7 -chicken sald/veg
sometimes small handfull nuts
10/11 -2 scoops protein shake


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## premo (Apr 1, 2011)

oh i pretty much eat what i want on aturday and on sunday i eat cleaner then saturday but eat breads and my main meals are pretty varied between things like sandwiches chicken wraps to lasagne


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## sassy69 (Apr 1, 2011)

premo said:


> would love to get 6 pack abs b4 i bulk a bit my cuurent diet looks like this
> 
> 6 30 am -2 scoops protein shake - small handfull blueberrys
> 8am -handful of mixed nuts
> ...




This is a weird diet. It doens't look like much food at all, and is also a keto diet unless you put some fruit / carbs in your shakes. The problem I have with this is that if you're trying to do a keto diet, the fruit might be screwing up the total carbs (e.g. stay under 20 g or so / day). But at the same time if you're not doing keto, then your carbs are really too low to run on, but not low enough to go into ketosis. Then if you're eating whatever the hell on the weekends, you may or may not be getting a quailty carb up.

I'd also go w/ more real food and fewer shakes.

My general opinion of fruit in a cutter diet - it really depends on how strict you choose to be. When I talk about cutting diets, its for competition and there's no room to fuck around. On my diets, fruit is a waste of my calorie allocation. If you wanted to put fruit somewhere in a diet to get the value of the various enzymes and anti-oxidants, then I'd either do a detox diet after your cutting phase is over (e.g. if you're cutting for a specific goal), or just add fruit as part of a bulking phase. Otherwise you can get the same quality stuff that fruit offers from low GI green leafy veggies, and I tend to use a powdered greens supplement instead of spending my limited calories on fruit.


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## Evil Eagle (Apr 1, 2011)

oufinny said:


> In my eyes diet macro and micro nutrient ratios are far more important that calorie counting.  I am dropping fat and don't count a single calorie at all, if I was more conscious of how much I took in it may speed things up but I am not in a race to be shredded.  More and more research is showing that the calorie in/calorie out conception is very diet dependent.  When complex carbs are involved it changes things, eliminate them and you should cut up on you normal food intake and some minor adjustments near the end can help get you that last few percent.
> 
> Also, since I will get flamed and really don't care, I am not losing any strength and I am keeping all the cycle weight I gained (LBM, its not glycogen when your carbs are this low) along with continued strength gains.  People are deathly afraid of lower carb, no complex carb diets but don't see the benefits.  Read up on the Primal Blue Print, it is actually a very enjoyable way to live your life; especially since I eat what I want, when I want.



I just started following the Primal BluePrint, and I'm really digging it! 

Sent from my Android device


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## premo (Apr 1, 2011)

Iv only added the bluberrry recently. Iv lost about 20 ibs so far I've been doing this 6 months. But iv lost a lot of muscle too that's why I kept tjhe shakes in. Usually I eat carbs for dinner on a wednesday. Sat is my cheat day and ill eat a sandwich for lunch pizza for diner with ice cream after. Becuase it was working iv carried it on I'd say I'm about bf14/15. So I'd like some help to get to 10 without loosing muscle


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## sassy69 (Apr 1, 2011)

premo said:


> Iv only added the bluberrry recently. Iv lost about 20 ibs so far I've been doing this 6 months. But iv lost a lot of muscle too that's why I kept tjhe shakes in. Usually I eat carbs for dinner on a wednesday. Sat is my cheat day and ill eat a sandwich for lunch pizza for diner with ice cream after. Becuase it was working iv carried it on I'd say I'm about bf14/15. So I'd like some help to get to 10 without loosing muscle



Try just swapping out some of those shakes for real food. You want to not keep losing muscle but you just said that diet made you lose a lot of muscle. Your cheats are sloppy too. Do a cheat MEAL instead of a bunch of meals and make it better quality carbs.

You're not getting optimal results because most of your protein is coming from shakes - they should be for convenience or supplement but not as your primary source of protein. I'd also be very interested to see what your total cal intake is - it looks low. if you're just starving yourself, sure you lose weight, but an amount of that weight is going to be your muscle mass too. You gotta eat to lean out. The whole point is to fuel your body for your energy demands - when you fuel w/ quality foods and then burn it off, your body will set up a burn rate that will blow your mind - you'll be doing better than just going catabolic to "lose weight".


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## premo (Apr 2, 2011)

What do you suggest. If I add oatmeal in the morning. What options do I have for snacks or should I cut out any snacks like nuts totally


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## premo (Apr 2, 2011)

I am not cutting to compete just to look as good as I can. I also like my cheat half day sometime it spills over the whole day or weekend as I try not to allow it to rule my life to a certain extent. So if there is a way I can keep a cheat meal in there once a week I'd be happy


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## Built (Apr 2, 2011)

premo, I personally don't snack at all. I try very hard to only eat three or at most four times a day - less frequent meals that are larger are more satisfying to me than eating multiple small meals. I have a small whey shake before each of my meals. Seems to keep me comfortable longer.


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## premo (Apr 2, 2011)

So how about if I have 3 main meals and 3 shakes a day? No snacks


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## Built (Apr 2, 2011)

Have the shakes with your meals - knock it back, then eat your meal, then brush your teeth. No snacks.


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## premo (Apr 2, 2011)

Ok so basically I'm adding oatmeaL loosing the nuts and blueberrys


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## gamma (Apr 2, 2011)

Built said:


> Have the shakes with your meals - knock it back, then eat your meal, then brush your teeth. No snacks.[/QUOT       So damn brushing ur teeth is the key to a good cut..... jk....


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## premo (Apr 4, 2011)

ok so i have 
shake 
workout
oatmeal with shake
chicken salad (lunch)
shake/chicken salad/vg (diner)
shake or egg white b4 bed


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## premo (Apr 5, 2011)

why the shake b4 meals not in between? 


Built said:


> Have the shakes with your meals - knock it back, then eat your meal, then brush your teeth. No snacks.


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## Built (Apr 5, 2011)

Because that way you get more calories - and more protein - in at once, and you avoid eating multiple small meals. You'll probably feel fuller, longer.


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## DaMayor (Apr 5, 2011)

Built said:


> Have the shakes with your meals - knock it back, then eat your meal, then brush your teeth. No snacks.



Okay, I've got to ask  (since you've said this more than once) Other than the obvious reasons (e.g., tooth decay, halitosis, etc.) why is brushing one's teeth included in the meal ritual? Purging the taste buds, perhaps? Removing resdiual flavor from the mouth to decrease future cravings maybe? Just wonderin'....


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## Built (Apr 5, 2011)

Makes everything taste bad.


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## premo (Apr 7, 2011)

if i have oatmeal in morning can i still have a handfull of nuts at night b4 bed? or does the carbs and fats mix not go well


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## Lysphen (Apr 7, 2011)

your diet is awful lol

healthy fat are definitely needed, even when cutting


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## premo (Apr 7, 2011)

i was eating cashew and almonds alot? but last couple of days i have cut them out? this is what i have been doing
2 scoops protein
training
oatmeal mixed with protein shake
lunch - chicken and salad
protein shake
dinner- chicked or steak with salad and veg
b4 bed - protein shake ... cashew nuts??


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## premo (Apr 7, 2011)

i only added the oatmeal in a few days ago as i felt i was prob loosing to much muscle but this diet was actually recomnded to me from a bb... except intead of so many shkes he eats , i do not have time to eat as much as him due to my work and personal commitments


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## sassy69 (Apr 7, 2011)

premo said:


> i only added the oatmeal in a few days ago as i felt i was prob loosing to much muscle but this diet was actually recomnded to me from a bb... except intead of so many shkes he eats , i do not have time to eat as much as him due to my work and personal commitments



I don't know what the details are of your daily schedule but I know many people who regularly do contest prep and have busy lives manage to find ways to get in their meals. We know that shakes are convenient but are not the best or most complete form of protein, so relying on them as your primary protein source is only better in terms of convenience, but not nutritionally or for quality of results.

It takes a little bit of planning and food prep ahead of time. For example, I work a desk job but, especially during my contest prep I leave my house at 5 am to do cardio, then go to work, then back to the gym + cardio and then home often after 9-10 pm. Also keeping in mind that my recovery time (i.e. enough sleep) is critical to my ability to compete successfully, so I don't have a lot of time to screw around getting food. I rarely leave my desk during the day and there is literally no such thing as "lunch break" in my life. And this is a lifestyle I've followed for more than 15 years. It takes some time to decide what food you enjoy eating that meets your nutritional needs for your goals, and then time to plan ahead and prepare foods. Many people I know take time on Sunday to do a mass cooking and food prep for each week so you can just grab your food, throw it in a cooler and go.

Shakes are great, but over time I think they will take a toll on the quality of your food and your digestion - a lot of the same thing (particularly w/ the fillers that are in so many protein powders) can sort of build up in your system - i.e. the byproducts of processing that "food" and limited amount of other stuff to provide variety and the things our bodies use (because they don't produce themselves) to support daily functions.


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## premo (Apr 7, 2011)

ok so which shakes would you replace? im thinking egg whites would be easy enough for me to make up , thats why i had the nuts in there because i thought they were high in protein and good fats


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## Built (Apr 7, 2011)

Nuts are low in protein. They are high in healthy fats though. Eggwhites are not very filling.


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## premo (Apr 8, 2011)

im mixing protein iwth my oatmeal should i be having some blueberrys with this or not?

how about the nuts b4 bed? 

im around 14% maybe 15 at a guess would like to get to 10 beofre i look to bulk clean


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## Built (Apr 8, 2011)

premo, eat whatever and whenever you like - the individual meals don't matter; it's how the day totals up. The rest just comes down to comfort and personal preference. The one codicil: you may wish to be less cavalier about your pre and or post-workout nutrition, but even this is far less critical than was once believed.


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## premo (Apr 9, 2011)

Thanks. I will try and work out the macros.


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## elbkind (Apr 9, 2011)

Most def, lemon works good


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