# Gun guys!



## Killermonkey (Aug 25, 2011)

I feel like discussing latest purchases from other people on the board as well as reviews. I just bought the new Lwrc M6a4 SPR and it is fucking beautiful!

What are your latest additions?


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## SloppyJ (Aug 25, 2011)

A broken guide rod on my Colt New agent... 


Thinking about getting another AK.


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## LAM (Aug 25, 2011)

picked up a bushmaster ACR a couple of months ago they are very similar to the LWRC M6a4.  now I need to get rid of one, not sure who's getting sold.


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## Evil Eagle (Aug 25, 2011)

Picking up my Marlin 338mxlr out of layaway next week for deer season.  

Sent from my Android device


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## SloppyJ (Aug 25, 2011)

Damn you guys have way too much cash layin around. ACR's and shit.


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## independent (Aug 25, 2011)

Last one I bought is a Colt AR-15 hbar competition with flat top receiver and a ACOG scope.


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## MDR (Aug 25, 2011)

Still like my old Sig P220.  Light, very accurate, and with plenty of stopping power.  I've been shooting it for so long, it feels like part of my hand.


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## LAM (Aug 25, 2011)

MDR said:


> Still like my old Sig P220.  Light, very accurate, and with plenty of stopping power.  I've been shooting it for so long, it feels like part of my hand.





my very first handgun was a P226. got it right after I turned 18 in '87 and still have it, nice weapon.


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## BillHicksFan (Aug 25, 2011)

I love shooting pistols therefore a part of me becomes envious when I hear Americans raving on about their gun collections and seeing guns actually endorsed by the majority of the population _with enthusiasm_ but then I imagine what it would be like to walk down the streets of your cities knowing that every mofo is potentially loaded and ready to kill at the first sign of trouble and it kinda takes the appeal away.

Just over 15 years ago we had one crazy mofo kill around 50 innocent people including many children at a tourist destination, and as a knee-jerk reaction, all semi automatic rifles were outlawed and destroyed by our government. Now if you have a gun license you get treated like a criminal nomatter how responsible you are.

If an intruder jumps my back fence or breaks into my house, the first thing I think about it either punching him or flattening him with a cricket bat. The idea of stalking that mofo with a gun and killing him simply for being on my property seems so extreme that its laughable.

Here we assume the tresspasser is not carrying a gun therefore we tend  not to want to kill him only to ask questions later but if we automatically assumed he  was loaded Im sure it would be a different story altogether.

Would you guys rather keep your guns and accept the staggering amount of  annual shootings or can you see the day when your gun laws become so  regulated that it makes owning a weapon extremely difficult in the hope  for less annual shootings?


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## LAM (Aug 25, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> Would you guys rather keep your guns and accept the staggering amount of  annual shootings or can you see the day when your gun laws become so  regulated that it makes owning a weapon extremely difficult in the hope  for less annual shootings?



it would not effect my life at all if I had to turn in my weapons as long as I was compensated for them financially since they were not free.  don't need a firearm to defend my home it just makes significantly easier.  I have an array of tactical knifes as well, some that will take off limbs very easily if needed.

after serving in the military in the gulf war and in columbia I value the life's of others much greater now and would prefer to not have to kill again unless absolutely necessary, it changes you.  

you can't stop the psychopath or rapist, etc. from killing but statics show that countries with low poverty rates have substantially less violent crime...the murder rate in Latin American which has been plagued with poverty for a long time has drastically decreased in recent decades as incomes have risen substantially.  

when the Japanese fleets came and over-fished the waters off the cost of Somalia there was no navy there to protect the waters for these people.  the Somalian pirates are all ex-fisherman, there way of life was destroyed and now they are desperate.


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## danzik17 (Aug 25, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> Would you guys rather keep your guns and accept the staggering amount of  annual shootings or can you see the day when your gun laws become so  regulated that it makes owning a weapon extremely difficult in the hope  for less annual shootings?



Heavy gun regulations just makes the law abiding population less well armed and easier targets for the criminals who by definition don't give a crap about the law.

I'm all for common sense regulations ( No, you don't need that rocket launcher.  No, paroled felons should not have a gun.  Etc...), however I think an armed, law abiding populace is a good thing.


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## sofargone561 (Aug 25, 2011)

bought a buddys mossberg 500. he recenetly joined the army bought the damn thing right before it and used it like 4 times. i got it so a steal! wish i had the bash laying around for more of the shiut big boys are playing with in this thread lol


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## LAM (Aug 25, 2011)

the US has the highest rate of gun related crimes and murders because there is easy access to firearms AND we are a very violent country.

there are numerous countries out there with more lax gun laws with substantially less violent crime and murder rates where guns were used.


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## MDR (Aug 26, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> I love shooting pistols therefore a part of me becomes envious when I hear Americans raving on about their gun collections and seeing guns actually endorsed by the majority of the population _with enthusiasm_ but then I imagine what it would be like to walk down the streets of your cities knowing that every mofo is potentially loaded and ready to kill at the first sign of trouble and it kinda takes the appeal away.
> 
> Just over 15 years ago we had one crazy mofo kill around 50 innocent people including many children at a tourist destination, and as a knee-jerk reaction, all semi automatic rifles were outlawed and destroyed by our government. Now if you have a gun license you get treated like a criminal nomatter how responsible you are.
> 
> ...


 
When I moved to my current state, I couldn't believe how regulated everything is here.  i just left most of my collection back home with my brother.  I had a concealed weapons permit for years, and when I moved here, I couldn't believe how difficult it is to maintain here, not to mention how expensive.  By the way, this (new) state leads the country in gun related deaths every year.  Gun laws don't work, they just take the gun out of the hands of the law-abiding citizen and put it in the hands of the criminal.


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## LAM (Aug 26, 2011)

MDR said:


> Gun laws don't work, they just take the gun out of the hands of the law-abiding citizen and put it in the hands of the criminal.



they would be much more effective if not being discounted by the masses amounts of weapons being sold by those with FFL's that end up on the streets.  far too many breaking the laws just to line their own pockets.  

almost 90% of violent crimes occur outside of the home according to the DOJ stats.  so while it is our constitutional right it offers very little protection in reality.


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## Killermonkey (Aug 26, 2011)

LAM said:


> picked up a bushmaster ACR a couple of months ago they are very similar to the LWRC M6a4.  now I need to get rid of one, not sure who's getting sold.



I didn't like the acr because of the push button for dropping mags, but I almost bought one myself. Did they ever come out with the others barrels yet?


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## Killermonkey (Aug 26, 2011)

MDR said:


> Still like my old Sig P220.  Light, very accurate, and with plenty of stopping power.  I've been shooting it for so long, it feels like part of my hand.



I haven't tried that one yet, I love my glock17c though.


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## Killermonkey (Aug 26, 2011)

The shootings you here about in the news are terrible and they happened slot last month. That Oslo thing, the incident in Washington, and the skating rink in Texas. 

I carry everywhere I go and so does my wife, so that we may be prepared for taking someone out that is relentlessly killing people in a public venue like a skating rink. Carrying in an incident like that will save innocent lives. But it is also what I do for a living, executive protection.

I like the laws the way they are currently, at least where I live. I am paranoid of being a victim to a ragin idiot with a gun.






BillHicksFan said:


> I love shooting pistols therefore a part of me becomes envious when I hear Americans raving on about their gun collections and seeing guns actually endorsed by the majority of the population _with enthusiasm_ but then I imagine what it would be like to walk down the streets of your cities knowing that every mofo is potentially loaded and ready to kill at the first sign of trouble and it kinda takes the appeal away.
> 
> Just over 15 years ago we had one crazy mofo kill around 50 innocent people including many children at a tourist destination, and as a knee-jerk reaction, all semi automatic rifles were outlawed and destroyed by our government. Now if you have a gun license you get treated like a criminal nomatter how responsible you are.
> 
> ...


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## Killermonkey (Aug 26, 2011)

LAM said:


> they would be much more effective if not being discounted by the masses amounts of weapons being sold by those with FFL's that end up on the streets.  far too many breaking the laws just to line their own pockets.
> 
> almost 90% of violent crimes occur outside of the home according to the DOJ stats.  so while it is our constitutional right it offers very little protection in reality.



They mainly end up in the wrong hands because they are not secured properly in the owners homes and they end up stolen.


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## Killermonkey (Aug 26, 2011)

sofargone561 said:


> bought a buddys mossberg 500. he recenetly joined the army bought the damn thing right before it and used it like 4 times. i got it so a steal! wish i had the bash laying around for more of the shiut big boys are playing with in this thread lol



How much?


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## Zaphod (Aug 26, 2011)

Got a Ruger P95.  Soon will be adding a Ruger SR1911.  Early Christmas present to myself.


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## Zaphod (Aug 26, 2011)

LAM said:


> they would be much more effective if not being discounted by the masses amounts of weapons being sold by those with FFL's that end up on the streets.  far too many breaking the laws just to line their own pockets.
> 
> almost 90% of violent crimes occur outside of the home according to the DOJ stats.  so while it is our constitutional right it offers very little protection in reality.



Legally owned firearms aren't the problem.  Those with FFLs aren't the problem, either.  The problem is the criminals.  Ban guns altogether and only the criminals will have guns.  Check out the UK.  Check out any other country that has done that.


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## Evil Eagle (Aug 26, 2011)

Take it from someone who sold guns for over 2 years for a living, there needs to be a little more regulation. I think if the general public knew how many gray areas there are in gun laws they would be shocked.


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## LAM (Aug 26, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> Legally owned firearms aren't the problem.  Those with FFLs aren't the problem, either.  The problem is the criminals.  Ban guns altogether and only the criminals will have guns.  Check out the UK.  Check out any other country that has done that.



they are a big part the problem...dealers are selling people 10-15 A.K's "legally" then those people are selling them on the street.  there is not one logical reason for a person buy weapons like this in quantity.

we have gun shows all the time out here in Vegas.  anyone can buy a weapon there are no onsite-background check's.   it's all "faith" based


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## meow (Aug 26, 2011)

My latest addition is a Norinco 1911 commander size circa 1993


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## Zaphod (Aug 26, 2011)

LAM said:


> they are a big part the problem...dealers are selling people 10-15 A.K's "legally" then those people are selling them on the street.  there is not one logical reason for a person buy weapons like this in quantity.
> 
> we have gun shows all the time out here in Vegas.  anyone can buy a weapon there are no onsite-background check's.   it's all "faith" based



The FFLs are not the problem then.  The problem is the people selling the weapons after that.  

There may not be any logical reason for buying such quantities but why shouldn't someone buy however many they want?  In this country you can buy, in one single trip to the store, 1,000 rounds of ammo, a kiddie pool and enough frozen tacos to fill it and nobody will bat an eye unless your card gets declined.  

Why should there be background checks in the first place?  We have this thing called the 2nd Amendment.  I'm very pro-gun, BTW.


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## oufinny (Aug 26, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> Legally owned firearms aren't the problem.  Those with FFLs aren't the problem, either.  The problem is the criminals.  Ban guns altogether and only the criminals will have guns.  Check out the UK.  Check out any other country that has done that.



This is true.  Texas is proof you can responsibly own firearms though the amount that are here do lead to Criminals getting their hands on them.  I don't think the laws need to be any more lax then they are in TX, nor do they need to be any more severe.  I don't know exactly what the solution is but I do know that over-regulation does put them only in the hands of criminals.  Many people in TX have shot, sometimes killed, intruders or robbers in homes/businesses and I for one think they did the state a favor.  My gun sits under my bed and all I have to do is pull the level of that Marlin back and I can send 6 rounds though that dumb ass who comes in my home. Are you really going to keep coming into a room when someone has a rifle pointed right at their chest, I don't think so, you are going to run.  I will shoot you in the back and pull your ass back in my places .


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## Killermonkey (Aug 26, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> Legally owned firearms aren't the problem.  Those with FFLs aren't the problem, either.  The problem is the criminals.  Ban guns altogether and only the criminals will have guns.  Check out the UK.  Check out any other country that has done that.



Absolutely fucking correct!


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## sofargone561 (Aug 26, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> Legally owned firearms aren't the problem.  Those with FFLs aren't the problem, either.  The problem is the criminals.  Ban guns altogether and only the criminals will have guns.  Check out the UK.  Check out any other country that has done that.


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## 240PLUS (Aug 26, 2011)

Happy with my glock 22. Supposedly it's Colts 100 year anniversary for the 1911 ACP. They're coming out with some new models and retro guns. My local dealer was telling me about it. Maybe some Delta Elites are coming in. I don't have no 1200 dollars, but would do some trading for one at the gun store.


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## MDR (Aug 26, 2011)

I've been playing around with a 1911 .45 at the range. Tremendous weapon, but I have yet to master the same kind of control that I have with my Sig P220 nine mil. I also like my S & W 686 .357. Lot to be said for a good revolver. Grew up shooting rifles of all kinds, so much of my practice these days is with the handguns. I just bring along a rifle once in awhile to stay sharp. My brother just bought a beautiful 50 cal Sharps rifle. It is a thing of beauty, and he loves everything about it. Very jealous. Fucker is getting a very nice collection together.


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## Zaphod (Aug 26, 2011)

After the SR1911 an AR-style, probably a Bushmaster or DPMS, will be next on the menu.  Will probably see what the S&W M&P one runs at one of the shops about an hour away from me.


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## LAM (Aug 26, 2011)

MDR said:


> I've been playing around with a 1911 .45 at the range. Tremendous weapon, but I have yet to master the same kind of control that I have with my Sig P220 nine mil. I also like my S & W 686 .357. Lot to be said for a good revolver. Grew up shooting rifles of all kinds, so much of my practice these days is with the handguns. I just bring along a rifle once in awhile to stay sharp. My brother just bought a beautiful 50 cal Sharps rifle. It is a thing of beauty, and he loves everything about it. Very jealous. Fucker is getting a very nice collection together.



the 1911 is a great .45  and so dam easy to field strip.


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## LAM (Aug 26, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> The FFLs are not the problem then.  The problem is the people selling the weapons after that.
> 
> There may not be any logical reason for buying such quantities but why shouldn't someone buy however many they want?  In this country you can buy, in one single trip to the store, 1,000 rounds of ammo, a kiddie pool and enough frozen tacos to fill it and nobody will bat an eye unless your card gets declined.
> 
> Why should there be background checks in the first place?  We have this thing called the 2nd Amendment.  I'm very pro-gun, BTW.



only doing what is required by law is why the country is so fucked up right now.

and there should be background checks because w/o them felons can buy handguns then, like the kind of losers that shot up the football game in SF last week.  registered handgun owners don't do that kind of shit.


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## MDR (Aug 26, 2011)

LAM said:


> the 1911 is a great .45 and so dam easy to field strip.


 
I agree.  I've shot a number of different .45's and I like this one the best.  Very user friendly.  Does take a bit of practice to shoot it with a high level of control, but I like the challenge.  Few thousand more practice rounds and I should feel better with it.


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## MDR (Aug 26, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> The FFLs are not the problem then. The problem is the people selling the weapons after that.
> 
> There may not be any logical reason for buying such quantities but why shouldn't someone buy however many they want? In this country you can buy, in one single trip to the store, 1,000 rounds of ammo, a kiddie pool and enough frozen tacos to fill it and nobody will bat an eye unless your card gets declined.
> 
> Why should there be background checks in the first place? We have this thing called the 2nd Amendment. I'm very pro-gun, BTW.


 
I agree with all the basic laws, it's the nit-picky shit that drives me nuts.


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## Zaphod (Aug 26, 2011)

LAM said:


> only doing what is required by law is why the country is so fucked up right now.
> 
> and there should be background checks because w/o them felons can buy handguns then, like the kind of losers that shot up the football game in SF last week.  registered handgun owners don't do that kind of shit.



Were people allowed to carry in places like stadiums I'd wager that would not have happened.  Bad guys like easy targets.  If nobody can shoot back then they really have nothing to worry about.  

The legal guns are not the problem.  The guns the criminals are able to get illegally are.  You can put in place the strictest gun laws and the only people getting hurt by it are the law abiding citizens.  The bitch of it is that it doesn't stop, or even slow down, bad guys getting guns.  Because they don't obey the laws, which is why they are criminals.  Murder is illegal but that doesn't stop anyone.  What makes anyone think more gun control is going to stop the bad guys from arming themselves with guns?  Please explain how it is supposed to work. 

Convicted felons are not supposed to have guns but they still get them.  How is any gun law going to prevent that?  In the UK where handguns are banned outright the criminals STILL get handguns.  Banning handguns was supposed to bring about a utopian society where gun violence ended and everybody got together twice a day for a massive group hug.  But that doesn't happen because the bad guys still get their guns.  Only now the good guys are not armed and are easy pickings.


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## yurrdownfall (Aug 26, 2011)

I was thinking about getting a judge.....hear it great for home protection.


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## meow (Aug 27, 2011)

yurrdownfall said:


> I was thinking about getting a judge.....hear it great for home protection.



U should look into getting a s&w governer. It will shoot 410s, 45 acp, and 45 long colt.


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## troubador (Aug 27, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> Would you guys rather keep your guns and accept the staggering amount of  annual shootings...



Yes. I'll take liberty over safety.

Also the murder rate involving guns isn't necessarily important to me. It depends on who is getting shot. I really don't care if gangsters are shooting each other up in the ghetto if it has no affect on me. I'm not saying it won't but rather it is important to know in what context these shootings occur.


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## yurrdownfall (Aug 27, 2011)

meow said:


> U should look into getting a s&w governer. It will shoot 410s, 45 acp, and 45 long colt.



When I get back stateside, I will be checking the Governor out for sure!!! Thanks brother!


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## LAM (Aug 27, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> Were people allowed to carry in places like stadiums I'd wager that would not have happened.  Bad guys like easy targets.  If nobody can shoot back then they really have nothing to worry about.



do you honestly believe this bs?  there would be so many innocent people getting shot it would be catrostrophic. have you ever shot a person that is a moving target? because I have and it's much harder in reality than on tv and video games...

LE isn't even supposed to discharge their weapons crowded areas...couldn't think of a worst "world" to live in where this was a regular occurrence.  non-weapons experts shooting in public... brilliant

more violence to reduce violence you would only find this lack of logic in the US


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## Killermonkey (Aug 27, 2011)

yurrdownfall said:


> I was thinking about getting a judge.....hear it great for home protection.



I own one, it is the 3" stainless ultralite. I wouldn't carry it but it is great for close quarters home defense


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## Killermonkey (Aug 27, 2011)

I have the Kimberly 1911 custom tle II , but very accurate but try to speed reload is a real notch to do. I can jam a mag like a flash of lightning with my glock 19c. 

With the glock, there is no easier weapon to field strip


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## Killermonkey (Aug 27, 2011)

troubador said:


> Yes. I'll take liberty over safety.
> 
> Also the murder rate involving guns isn't necessarily important to me. It depends on who is getting shot. I really don't care if gangsters are shooting each other up in the ghetto if it has no affect on me. I'm not saying it won't but rather it is important to know in what context these shootings occur.



Yeah, but I am sure you would care if your were caught up in a situation like the dallas skating rink shooting.


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## fisher4550 (Aug 27, 2011)

Here check this one out. Saiga .308


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## Zaphod (Aug 27, 2011)

LAM said:


> do you honestly believe this bs?  there would be so many innocent people getting shot it would be catrostrophic. have you ever shot a person that is a moving target? because I have and it's much harder in reality than on tv and video games...
> 
> LE isn't even supposed to discharge their weapons crowded areas...couldn't think of a worst "world" to live in where this was a regular occurrence.  non-weapons experts shooting in public... brilliant
> 
> more violence to reduce violence you would only find this lack of logic in the US



I never said violence to reduce violence.  When you have people that can fight back that is going to deter the violence in the first place.  You will still have violence from time to time but there won't be a stadium full of victims free for the pickings.  

In the SF case laws and security didn't stop the bad guys did it?  Because they don't follow the fucking laws in the first place.


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## Killermonkey (Aug 27, 2011)

fisher4550 said:


> Here check this one out. Saiga .308



What's the twist on that bad boy? 

My Remington ltr ( light tactical rifle) has a 1:11 so it works perfect with hornady amax 168 grain. Spot fucking on!


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## LAM (Aug 27, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> The legal guns are not the problem.



Last man sentenced for selling assault rifles in Mexico 
Last man sentenced for selling assault rifles in Mexico - News - ReviewJournal.com

"Romero; his brother, Marcos Romero, 22; their father, Abel Romero, 38; and a fourth man, Arnold Gutierrez, 24; were charged in August 2010 with illegally obtaining the assault rifles from licensed firearms dealers in Las Vegas."

U.S. Is Arms Bazaar for Mexican Cartels 
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/26/us/26borders.html

"When the shooting was over, eight agents were dead. Among the guns the police recovered was an assault rifle traced back across the border to a dingy gun store here called X-Caliber Guns.

Now, the owner, George Iknadosian, will go on trial on charges he sold hundreds of weapons, mostly AK-47 rifles, to smugglers, knowing they would send them to a drug cartel in the western state of Sinaloa. The guns helped fuel the gang warfare in which more than 6,000 Mexicans died last year."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States


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## Zaphod (Aug 27, 2011)

Why_Vermont_CCDW

Vermont enjoys the 49th lowest crime rate in the nation, according to the FBI

fla_model

Since adopting CCW (1987), Florida's homicide rate has fallen 21% while the U.S. rate has risen 12%.

Besides, what does Mexico have to do with crime in the US?


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## bio-chem (Aug 27, 2011)

MDR said:


> I've been playing around with a 1911 .45 at the range. Tremendous weapon, but I have yet to master the same kind of control that I have with *my Sig P220 nine mil.* I also like my S & W 686 .357. Lot to be said for a good revolver. Grew up shooting rifles of all kinds, so much of my practice these days is with the handguns. I just bring along a rifle once in awhile to stay sharp. My brother just bought a beautiful 50 cal Sharps rifle. It is a thing of beauty, and he loves everything about it. Very jealous. Fucker is getting a very nice collection together.



So is it a P220 or is it a 9mm?


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## bio-chem (Aug 27, 2011)

My last purchase was a Redfield 3x9 scope for my Winchester model 70 featherweight .308
love those new optics.

Last gun I purchased was my Springfield Armory Loaded 1911. that's a very nice 1911 for the money right out of the box. My next purchase I'm planning has to be a springfield scout squad M1A. I'm expecting to pick it up here pretty quick in the next couple weeks


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## LAM (Aug 27, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> Why_Vermont_CCDW
> 
> Vermont enjoys the 49th lowest crime rate in the nation, according to the FBI
> 
> ...



I found those articles in 5 secs after doing a search, that being the case I prob could have found dozens not related to Mexico.  you stated that people with FFL's are not a problem when obviously they are.

VT has one of the lowest crime rates because of the high per capita incomes just like where I grew up in PA, gun crime is almost zero.  people with money don't commit crimes.  gun crimes are the highest in places with high rates of poverty and low per capita incomes.

ATF CRIME GUN TRACE ANALYSIS REPORT
http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/ycgii/1998/cityreports/detroit.pdf

Brady Report: Illegal Gun Trafficking from Licensed Gun Dealers
http://www.bradycenter.org/xshare/pdf/reports/shady-dealings.pdf


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## .V. (Aug 27, 2011)

Nothing special or fancy for me.  Guns are tools to use for a specific need so the ones I've got are for the purpose they are used for (or hopefully, not used for).

I've only got a 
>Marlin Model 60 for small game (the newer one is not as good as my old one was)
>HP22 for deep concealed carry
>Springfield armory nearly box stock 1911 - my daily carry pistol
>Taurus .357 beside my bed
>Taurus .38 on my wife's side of the bed (I knew she was a keeper when I first made it to her bedroom and there was an M1 in the corner)
>Russian AK for more serious home defense needs and fun plinking (also meets my constitutional duty as a citizen to have a modern military type firearm in my home (actually says that in the constitution...read it some time)
>SKS - fun gun, plinking, hunting bigger game (nothing bigger than a whitetail deer here and I don't hunt bears so don't need more)

I need another Remington 870 express 12ga


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## MDR (Aug 27, 2011)

bio-chem said:


> So is it a P220 or is it a 9mm?


 
It is both. They were originally released in the U.S. as a Nine. Also as a .38 or .45. You can still find the Nine mil version around, however the .38's are VERY hard to find, and of course the modern version in a .45. I have owned it for many years (probably longer than most of the posters have been alive).

You can also easily convert the current .45 version into a nine.  Because of the design, the conversion process is very simple.


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## MDR (Aug 27, 2011)

Found this synopsis of the evolution of the Sig-Sauer P220 in the U.S and abroad, along with a few photos.

*SIG-Sauer P220 pistol (Switzerland)*






_Early SIG-Sauer P220 pistol in 9mm. It is same as Swiss service Pistole 75, and has a bottom magazine release._​ 



_Early SIG-Sauer P220 pistol in 9mm, right side view._​ 



_SIG-Sauer P220 pistol in .45ACP, with "American" style magazine release at the left side of the grip._​ 



_Recent production SIG-Sauer .45ACP P220 pistol with semi-custom "Equinox" finish and accessory rail._​ 



_The most recent version of the .45 caliber P220, with Single Action trigger and ambidextrous frame mounted safety; the version shown is the P220R carry SAO, with shortened barrel and accessory rail._​ 



_Early 9mm SIG-Sauer P220 pistol partially disassembled._​ 
Buy SIG-Sauer pistols at Impact Guns online store​*Trigger*: Double-Action
*Caliber*:9x19mm Luger and .45ACP; also .38 Super and 7.65mm Luger (both obsolete)*Length, overall*:198 mm*Barrel length*:112 mm*Weight unloaded *:800 g (aluminium frame)
1100 g (stainless steel frame)*Capacity*:8 rounds (7.65mm, 9mm. .38) or 7 rounds (.45)

The SIG-Sauer P220, often considered as the best “out of the box” .45 caliber double action pistol, started its life as the _9mm Pistole 75_, the new double action sidearm for Swiss army. Developed during the early 1970s by the famous Swiss company Sweizerishe Industrie-Gesellschaft or SIG in short, this pistol was intended to replace the extremely accurate, but overly expensive SIG P210 pistol then in service with Swiss and some other armies. The pistol was indeed a very promising design, but strict Swiss laws severely limited the export of war materiel, so SIG decided to move the manufacture of its newest pistol abroad. For this reason SIG Holdings AG in 1976 acquired significant stocks of the J.P. Sauer & Son Company, which was located in Germany, and during the late 1970s started the manufacture of the SIG-Sauer P220 pistol in Germany. 
The P220, as with most of its later siblings, was an instant and continuous success. Adopted by the Swiss and Japanese armies, and by a large number of European police organizations, this pistol also rapidly found its way into the USA, first thorough the Browning Arms Company of Utah, and, since the mid-1980s, through the SIGARMS Company of New Hampshire. Initially made in four calibers, today the P220 is manufactured only in .45 ACP, as its 9mm version has been largely replaced by the SIG-Sauer P226, a pistol of similar size but with a larger magazine capacity. Today the P220 is made in a number of versions which include both “service” and “sporting” modifications, the latter often fitted with extended barrels, compensators and adjustable sights. Service versions may have the Picatinny rail for accessories, as well as double-action or double-action-only triggers. Since the 2006, the PP20 also offered with Single action triggers and also in "Carry" configuration with shortened barrel. The P220 also could be made with an aluminium frame and steel slide, or with both frame and slide made from stainless steel. It is worth nothing that a high-capacity version of the .45 caliber P220 was developed during the early 1990s for the US market. Apparently designated P221, this gun was effectively killed by the so-called “Assault weapons ban”, the infamous legislation that limited the magazine capacity of civilian arms to 10 rounds, which was enforced in the USA between 1994 and 2004.
The SIG-Sauer P220 is short-recoil operated, locked-breech pistol. The locking is of modified Browning type, where the barrel engages the slide with single large lug entering the ejection window. The unlocking is controlled by a cam-shaped lug under the barrel, which interacts with the steel insert set into the aluminium frame. The slide is made from sheet steel by stamping and forming processes, with the separate breechblock pinned into the rear of the slide (machined slides are available on some current production .45 caliber models). The standard trigger is the double-action type, with an automatic firing pin block safety and a frame-mounted decocking lever. Double action only modifications do not have a decocker. Most recent SAO (Single action only) versions have ambidextrous non-decocking safeties located on the frame, which allow for "Cocked & Locked" carry. Magazines are single stack, with the magazine release located on the heel of the grip on early versions, or at the base of the trigger-guard on the .45 caliber versions made for the US market. The standard sights are fixed, with high contrast inserts, and the rear sight is dovetailed to the slide.
*How to field- strip (disassemble) P220*: 1) remove the magazine by pressing the magazine release button; 2) check that the chamber is empty; 3) pull the slide all the way back and lock it there with the slide stop; 4) rotate down the disassembly lever, which is located at the left side of the frame, above the trigger; 5) release the slide and carefully push it forward, and out of the frame; 6) remove the return spring assembly from below the barrel; 7) remove the barrel from the slide.
Reassemble in reverse order.


----------



## LAM (Aug 27, 2011)

in general sigs are great guns in combat. that german steel stays cool, you can fire plenty of rounds with out having to worry about losing accuracy from a hot barrel.

surprisingly I can put a couple of 40 round clips through my glock 18 and the barrel doesn't get very hot.


----------



## Zaphod (Aug 28, 2011)

LAM said:


> I found those articles in 5 secs after doing a search, that being the case I prob could have found dozens not related to Mexico.  you stated that people with FFL's are not a problem when obviously they are.
> 
> VT has one of the lowest crime rates because of the high per capita incomes just like where I grew up in PA, gun crime is almost zero.  people with money don't commit crimes.  gun crimes are the highest in places with high rates of poverty and low per capita incomes.
> 
> ...



None of which changes the fact that guns do not cause crimes.


----------



## OnPoint88 (Aug 28, 2011)

I use to hunt deer with 30/30 pistol and now I just do target practice on a pole line with a Reminton 700 338 Magnum with 220 grain rounds. Almost like golfing a hole in one.


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 28, 2011)

Rem 870 is a fine shotgun, I will add that one next year. When o get back to the states I am finally buying the Barrett 82a1!! I wanted it for five years and this year is the year for it. So excited!





.V. said:


> Nothing special or fancy for me.  Guns are tools to use for a specific need so the ones I've got are for the purpose they are used for (or hopefully, not used for).
> 
> I've only got a
> >Marlin Model 60 for small game (the newer one is not as good as my old one was)
> ...


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 28, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> None of which changes the fact that guns do not cause crimes.



Anyone who thinks that guns cause crime and are a thorn to society is a fucking idiot, IMO. 

Hypothetically, if guns were unconstitutionally banned from the average citizen, things would potentially get way out of control. People would take alternate routes for slaying one another like homemade explosives, running people over with motor vehicles, shanking, strangling, or whatever else could come to mind. Guns are useful for catching criminals to detectives because of residues and other evidence left behind after the shot is taken. 

Guns don't kill, people kill. Let's get it right everyone!

Back to another point from a previous post, if guns were banned to the average citizen like in england, then only the criminals would have them and the rest of us would be fucked. 

What I think would help people, is more comprehensive classes on what would constitute a legal cause to engage an enemy in strict self defense.


----------



## OnPoint88 (Aug 28, 2011)

The authors of the Constitution wrote in the right to bear arms because of their experience with corrupt government. Once the government starts infringing on your rights you know they're corrupt. I know a guy that got falsely accused of domestic violence and was convicted on "excited utterance" even though there was no physically evidence, so now it's a federal crime for him to possess a firearm, a decorated Viet Nam Vet who had a gun collection that included his service 45, M16, and M60. Keep in mind most gunners who held the M60 never came home. Needless to say he got 5 years in Federal prison for not giving up his gun collection.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/tucson-swa...-iraq-marine-veteran/story?id=13640112&page=2


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 28, 2011)

I hate anti gun fuckers. They ruin this country.


----------



## big60235 (Aug 28, 2011)

Just picked up a WW II Nazi Germany MP40 that needs a little work but have not been able to find anyone that I feel comfortable to have it worked on yet. It is completely ready to run some rounds through it just needs a tune up and a heavy clean. Have been told that a fully functional MP40 is valued at around 15k.


----------



## LAM (Aug 28, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> None of which changes the fact that guns do not cause crimes.



nobody said they did but they sure make it a lot harder.  and were obviously dead wrong about those with FFL's not being a cause of gun crime.

the US is an extremely violent country and when you combing that intrinsic nature with easy access to firearms you end up with a country with a high death and murder rate by firearms.  

gun violence in the US will only get worst with time as the poverty rate in the US continues to increase thanks to neo-liberal economic policy and easy access to firearms.  but once again not many realize that this is simply another set-up by those "running the show"...


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 28, 2011)

I've yet to see any gun regulation here in the states effectively cut gun crime. Over a hundred years of gun laws in this country and not once has it shown to reduce gun crime. gotta be a clue.


----------



## Zaphod (Aug 28, 2011)

LAM said:


> nobody said they did but they sure make it a lot harder.  and were obviously dead wrong about those with FFL's not being a cause of gun crime.
> 
> the US is an extremely violent country and when you combing that intrinsic nature with easy access to firearms you end up with a country with a high death and murder rate by firearms.
> 
> gun violence in the US will only get worst with time as the poverty rate in the US continues to increase thanks to neo-liberal economic policy and easy access to firearms.  but once again not many realize that this is simply another set-up by those "running the show"...



The FFLs aren't the cause.  The people wanting to buy illegally are the cause.  The FFLs that sell illegally are criminals but had someone not wanted to buy illegally then the FFL wouldn't have committed a crime.  

You are blaming everything but the primary criminal.


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 28, 2011)

LAM said:


> I found those articles in 5 secs after doing a search, that being the case I prob could have found dozens not related to Mexico.  you stated that people with FFL's are not a problem when obviously they are.
> 
> VT has one of the lowest crime rates because of the high per capita incomes just like where I grew up in PA, gun crime is almost zero. * people with money don't commit crimes.*  gun crimes are the highest in places with high rates of poverty and low per capita incomes.
> 
> ...


Anything from the Brady group is full of shit. hands down. no matter how many statistics show them to be wrong they still press on with their battle. 

people with money don't commit crimes? LAM have you lost your mind


----------



## LAM (Aug 28, 2011)

bio-chem said:


> Anything from the Brady group is full of shit. hands down. no matter how many statistics show them to be wrong they still press on with their battle.
> 
> people with money don't commit crimes? LAM have you lost your mind



did you read the paper? because most of the stats are from the ATF

people with money, jobs, well functioning family's, mortgages, etc. mostly commit white color crimes, check the crime stats on the DOJ website.  the lower down the social economic ladder the more the type of crimes committed are related to violence, gun crimes, etc.  the lower down the social economic ladder the less a person has to lose financially as they already have nothing.  violent "street crime" is committed by those that have nothing

http://www.google.com/search?q=viol...gc.r_pw.&fp=b62454da27284b07&biw=1024&bih=588


----------



## Zaphod (Aug 28, 2011)

You trust the ATF?


----------



## LAM (Aug 28, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> You trust the ATF?



why wouldn't I?  I'm not an anti-government nut job.  government isn't the problem it's the company's that pull the strings of government that are the problem...


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 28, 2011)

government is absolutely the problem. the government should make sure we have clean water, open roads, sanitation, and a healthy military.  more than that and the government is too damn big. i don't care what political party is in power


----------



## troubador (Aug 28, 2011)

Zaphod said:


> You trust the ATF?



You mean the agency used to work on gun control under the radar? No, of course not.


----------



## LAM (Aug 28, 2011)

bio-chem said:


> government is absolutely the problem. the government should make sure we have clean water, open roads, sanitation, and a healthy military.  more than that and the government is too damn big. i don't care what political party is in power



why do only politicians spread the delusion of "limited" government?  where are the research papers from academia that support this rhetoric? 

what other countries in the world with large populations have implemented this model?


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 28, 2011)

this isn't about rhetoric. and it's certainly not a delusion. This is what i want out of my government. I don't believe that if we had that government life would be grand all of a sudden. there would still be plenty of shit in America. I believe people would get out of their life what they put into it. as it should be, and that's all there is to it. 

Show me a country where the more involved in peoples lives government is the better off they are? Show me where Big Government has been successful at any point in the history of the world?


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 28, 2011)

Back to the real topic at hand. The awesomeness of GUNS. I see a 325 WSM in my future. Anyone own a rifle of this caliber? What make and model. The browning X bolt has to be very high on my list, but the potential is there for others as well. I'm thinking stainless barrel and a synthetic stock. any suggestions?


----------



## Big Pimpin (Aug 29, 2011)

I just bought the wife a new G17 9mm and while I have a few Glock .40's, my next purchase is a G20 10mm.  

If you want a new Glock on the cheap, join the Glock Sport Shooting Foundation.


----------



## KelJu (Aug 29, 2011)

LAM said:


> picked up a bushmaster ACR a couple of months ago they are very similar to the LWRC M6a4.  now I need to get rid of one, not sure who's getting sold.



The bushmaster is sexy. You can bu y them damn things from Academy sports for $900. Then you can spend another $50 to turn it into a fully automatic. My buddy was infantry, and he modded his Bushmaster himself without a kit, but he knows rifles inside and out. 

I'm not sure how hard it is to do, because I have never done it. The only long guns I own is a mini-14 and a 11-87 shotgun. I have always enjoyed handguns more.


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 29, 2011)

LAM said:


> we have gun shows all the time out here in Vegas.  anyone can buy a weapon there are no onsite-background check's.   it's all "faith" based



When was the last time you were at a gun show here?  They've had the background check station in place since the day the law took affect.  You buy from a FFL dealer, you WILL go through a background check or you won't be buying a gun that day.  They also enforce the three day waiting period on handguns.  If you're a first time handgun buyer you can purcahse one that day but, you can't take posession of it for 72 hours.


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 29, 2011)

I participate in Cowboy Action Shooting.  It's basically Tactical 3-Gun competition except we use single-action six guns, a lever action rifle and double barrel shotguns.  My latest purchase was a new set of pistols; Ruger Vaqueros in .357/.38


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 29, 2011)

Big Pimpin said:


> I just bought the wife a new G17 9mm and while I have a few Glock .40's, my next purchase is a G20 10mm.
> 
> If you want a new Glock on the cheap, join the Glock Sport Shooting Foundation.



The glock 17 is indissputably one of the best all around pistols to own


----------



## LAM (Aug 29, 2011)

ALBOB said:


> When was the last time you were at a gun show here?  They've had the background check station in place since the day the law took affect.  You buy from a FFL dealer, you WILL go through a background check or you won't be buying a gun that day.  They also enforce the three day waiting period on handguns.  If you're a first time handgun buyer you can purcahse one that day but, you can't take posession of it for 72 hours.



haven't been to one in years, but from all the ATF and DOJ reports this is still a big problem in the US.  I only buy my weapons new from brick & motar stores, less of a chance of anything funny going on with them.


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 29, 2011)

LAM said:


> haven't been to one in years, but from all the ATF and DOJ reports this is still a big problem in the US.  I only buy my weapons new from brick & motar stores, less of a chance of anything funny going on with them.



Just don't go here:

Air Force recovers stolen materials from Friday's raid - www.ktnv.com


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 29, 2011)

ALBOB said:


> I participate in Cowboy Action Shooting.  It's basically Tactical 3-Gun competition except we use single-action six guns, a lever action rifle and double barrel shotguns.  My latest purchase was a new set of pistols; Ruger Vaqueros in .357/.38



I want to get one but I don't know much about them.


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 29, 2011)

Killermonkey said:


> I want to get one but I don't know much about them.



These particular pistols come in pairs.  They're Single Action Shooting Society comemmoratives.  If you want just one, check out the Ruger Montado.  It was specifically designed for Cowboy Mounted Shooters.  It has a lower widened hammer spur for ease of cocking one handed.  In regular Cowboy Action Shooting I shoot my pistols one handed so I also need to be able to cock and fire as fast as possible, the lower hammer profile is great for that.  They come in .38/357 or .45 Colt


----------



## dogsoldier (Aug 29, 2011)

LAM said:


> the US has the highest rate of gun related crimes and murders because there is easy access to firearms AND we are a very violent country.
> 
> there are numerous countries out there with more lax gun laws with substantially less violent crime and murder rates where guns were used.




LAM, I would check that comment against stats out of Mexico.  They have the most gun related murders per capita than the USA.  And FWIW, there are NO countries out there anymore with more lax gun laws. ZIP.

Even gun friendly countries like Sweden, Denmark and Switzerland all signed off the the UN gun ban treaty and implemented very harsh regulations on even hunting rifles.


----------



## LAM (Aug 29, 2011)

dogsoldier said:


> LAM, I would check that comment against stats out of Mexico.  They have the most gun related murders per capita than the USA.  And FWIW, there are NO countries out there anymore with more lax gun laws. ZIP.
> 
> Even gun friendly countries like Sweden, Denmark and Switzerland all signed off the the UN gun ban treaty and implemented very harsh regulations on even hunting rifles.



many would argue how much of a "country" mexico really is...this is the path that the US is following as our poverty rate is only 3rd behind Mexico and Turkey


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 29, 2011)

any chance you boys would mind taking the off topic stuff somewhere else? I admit i have been part of the problem, but I absolutely hate to see a good Gun thread get bogged down in bullshit. This is not a thread about poverty rates in Mexico


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 30, 2011)

To get back on track, this wasn't my latest purchase.  Hell, I didn't even purchase it.  It was a Christmas present from my wife.  Boys, meet my friend Wildey:


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 30, 2011)

bio-chem said:


> any chance you boys would mind taking the off topic stuff somewhere else? I admit i have been part of the problem, but I absolutely hate to see a good Gun thread get bogged down in bullshit. This is not a thread about poverty rates in Mexico



I will open another thread for the battle of murders abroad


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 30, 2011)

ALBOB said:


> To get back on track, this wasn't my latest purchase.  Hell, I didn't even purchase it.  It was a Christmas present from my wife.  Boys, meet my friend Wildey:





What is it?


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 30, 2011)




----------



## ALBOB (Aug 30, 2011)

Killermonkey said:


> What is it?



.475 Wildey magnum.  If you've ever seen the Charles Bronson movie Death Wish 3, it plays a starring role.


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 30, 2011)

I miss that guy, those movies were corny but they bring me back. Ya know?

My wife bought me a gun while I am away and she won't tell me what it is. Three more weeks till I find out. I'm dying over here


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 30, 2011)

Killermonkey said:


> I will open another thread for the battle of murders abroad


----------



## bccs (Aug 30, 2011)

My little family of 1911's, from the top-

Kimber set up for off-hand bullseye
Springfield set up for steel plate competition 
Colt 1911A1 carried by my grandpa in WWII
Colt Commander 4"
Colt Defender 3" alloy frame, My carry pistol


----------



## littlekev (Aug 30, 2011)

bigmoe65 said:


> Last one I bought is a Colt AR-15 hbar competition with flat top receiver and a ACOG scope.



Nice, went for the rockra ar, first ar and didn't want to shell out colt price am broke too. Man they are sweet!


----------



## meow (Aug 30, 2011)

bccs said:


>



Sweet 1911 collection!


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 31, 2011)

I never carry 1911' s because for me, they are too heavy and I can't jam a fresh mag as fast as a regular combat pistol.


----------



## dogsoldier (Aug 31, 2011)

Killermonkey said:


> I never carry 1911' s because for me, they are too heavy and I can't jam a fresh mag as fast as a regular combat pistol.



That just tells me you need to practice tactical reloading.


----------



## Killermonkey (Aug 31, 2011)

No sir, not the case at all. I can jam a mag in a glock guaranteed faster than anyone in this forum and I say that with no hesitation. Even faster than all of my coworkers at my blackwater.

1911 were combat pistols for earlier wars like Vietnam and ww2, they are no longer practical as new and innovative pistols hit the market. I will put on me jamming amag in a glock to anyone with a 1911. High stakes or low stakes, I will win every time


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 31, 2011)

Killermonkey said:


> No sir, not the case at all. I can jam a mag in a glock guaranteed faster than anyone in this forum and I say that with no hesitation. Even faster than all of my coworkers at my blackwater.
> 
> 1911 were combat pistols for earlier wars like Vietnam and ww2, they are no longer practical as new and innovative pistols hit the market. I will put on me jamming amag in a glock to anyone with a 1911. High stakes or low stakes, I will win every time



Now hold on, you're talking a Glock reload vs. a single stack 1911 reload.  Yeah, my money would be on the Glock but, that's like racing a Top fuel dragster against a '77 Pinto.  Definitely apples to oranges comparison.

On the other hand, I carry either a double stack Para-Ordnance or STI 1911.  I'm not too shabby when it comes to reloads.  Not taking you up on your bet, just comparing apples to apples.


----------



## bccs (Aug 31, 2011)

I don't plan on having to reload


----------



## ALBOB (Aug 31, 2011)

bccs said:


> I don't plan on having to reload



And statistics support that plan BUT, plans don't always work out like planned.  Plan for the worst, hope for the best.


----------



## skinnyguy180 (Aug 31, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> Would you guys rather keep your guns and accept the staggering amount of annual shootings or can you see the day when your gun laws become so regulated that it makes owning a weapon extremely difficult in the hope for less annual shootings?


 
This is a terrible view point and just wrong.. statistcs on a couple different cities in the US showed that there is was less crime in cities where not requiring a liscense to carry a gun was the law than in cities that have had out lawed guns all together.  I believe it was chicago that just had its gun laws straighten out to legalize gun ownership.  And as far as stalking a dude and shooting him for being on my property... any day of the week.


----------



## skinnyguy180 (Aug 31, 2011)

sorry for the late reply but i hate that stand point that cause guns are more prevalent that more people are getting shot as if criminals are going around waiting 2 weeeks for there 1500 dollar pistol and then going to kill someone with it...


Ps i love guns ..my kimber gold combat is my baby i sleep with it!!!! really


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 31, 2011)

Killermonkey said:


> No sir, not the case at all. I can jam a mag in a glock guaranteed faster than anyone in this forum and I say that with no hesitation. Even faster than all of my coworkers at my blackwater.
> 
> 1911 were combat pistols for earlier wars like Vietnam and ww2, they are no longer practical as new and innovative pistols hit the market. I will put on me jamming amag in a glock to anyone with a 1911. High stakes or low stakes, I will win every time



The fastest clip you'll probably ever see. - YouTube

That ain't a glock. Mag changes are about repetition. My father competed in IPSC shooting and he was never hindered by the 1911 design. His wasn't a tricked out race gun either. It was carry able.  a beveled magwell lots of practice and you are good to go. I'd love someone to tell Will Brink that he is at a disadvantage to a Glock when he is using his 1911. LOL


----------



## BillHicksFan (Aug 31, 2011)

skinnyguy180 said:


> This is a terrible view point and just wrong.. statistcs on a couple different cities in the US showed that there is was less crime in cities where not requiring a liscense to carry a gun was the law than in cities that have had out lawed guns all together.  I believe it was chicago that just had its gun laws straighten out to legalize gun ownership.  And as far as stalking a dude and shooting him for being on my property... any day of the week.



I wasn't talking in relation to political morality and ethics. I was asking a hypothetical question that if, on the assumption that all handguns could be somehow removed from the country would the American public still choose to keep their handguns at the cost of the annual population that are murdered or would you surrender them. Nevermind, I already have my answer 

I'm not going to argue about the stats and laws. Its a no brainer when you take the emotion out of the argument. As long as there are a fuckload of guns everywhere you are going to experience a fuckload of shootings. The fact that they are criminals doing the shootings is beside the point.

Shitload of guns = Shitloads of shootings
No access to guns = No shootings


----------



## bio-chem (Aug 31, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> I wasn't talking in relation to political morality and ethics. I was asking a hypothetical question that if, on the assumption that all handguns could be somehow removed from the country would the American public still choose to keep their handguns at the cost of the annual population that are murdered or would you surrender them. Nevermind, I already have my answer
> 
> I'm not going to argue about the stats and laws. Its a no brainer when you take the emotion out of the argument. As long as there are a fuckload of guns everywhere you are going to experience a fuckload of shootings. The fact that they are criminals doing the shootings is beside the point.
> 
> ...



And by doing this, even if it was possible you are completely missing the point of why the founders felt it necessary to give us the 2nd amendment. a reason i still find absolutely still viable today as it was then. The purpose of having an armed populace is so that the civilian population can protect itself from it's own government.

The bill of rights is a blue print for keeping people free from a dictator. If you want to control your populace you start by limiting their access to information, control the views they are allowed to publish, disarm them, limit their ability to congregate......

the 23,000 gun deaths we experience each year, while tragic, are not worth loosing the ability to protect ourselves from a tyrannical government

If it meant that it would save lives would you give up free speech, or allow the government to quarter troops in your home whenever they felt like it?


----------



## independent (Sep 1, 2011)

anyone here watch topshot?


----------



## ALBOB (Sep 1, 2011)

bigmoe65 said:


> anyone here watch topshot?



Yep, love it.  I wish that Morelli bitch had gone home last night.


----------



## independent (Sep 1, 2011)

ALBOB said:


> Yep, love it.  I wish that Morelli bitch had gone home last night.



yup.


----------



## troubador (Sep 1, 2011)

BillHicksFan said:


> No access to guns = No shootings



Obviously but gun control doesn't necessarily equal no access to guns. Without a total ban on guns you have a similar problem that the French had in WWII. After WWI the French built a line of defenses called the Maginot Line to guard against a German offensive. The problem was that these defenses only extended so far and the Germans simply went around the Maginot Line which effectively wasted resources. In the US with so many guns available criminals have no need to legally buy weapons. Waiting periods, limited magazine capacity, gun free zones and many other gun control measures are Maginot Lines.

After the UK banned handguns in '97, gun crime went up. At one point it was nearly double. 

The more important point is the 2nd amendment isn't for the assurance of your safety it is to secure our free state.


----------



## dogsoldier (Sep 1, 2011)

How can someone claim a Glock reloads faster than a 1911?  I have both. I do things the same way when doing a fast mag replacement.  You orient the mag on the mag holster, you drop you hand to the mag, index finger running down the mag front of the mag, you pull up, rotate the mag into the up position (bullet facing forward), you stab the mag.  So what would be different between a Glock and 1911?  I also can reload my High Powers and, Berettas in a blink.  It simply is not the gun for fast mag changes, it is the user.  I shoot 3 gun and IDPA regularly and practice a lot.


----------



## Ichigo (Nov 8, 2012)

I want this for Christmas, Santa better give it to me


----------



## Paranoid Fitness (Nov 8, 2012)

I just acquired a quad 50 mount circa 1942. Much like this one:





It is in need of repair and refinishing before I can mount "the girls" to it and actually use it.
I've been waiting a while for the right deal. Built the M2's from parts kits and my own right side plates.
Unfortunately, they're non-transferrable under NFA so don't ask...


----------



## Paranoid Fitness (Nov 8, 2012)

troubador said:


> Obviously but gun control doesn't necessarily equal no access to guns. Without a total ban on guns you have a similar problem that the French had in WWII. After WWI the French built a line of defenses called the Maginot Line to guard against a German offensive. The problem was that these defenses only extended so far and the Germans simply went around the Maginot Line which effectively wasted resources. In the US with so many guns available criminals have no need to legally buy weapons. Waiting periods, limited magazine capacity, gun free zones and many other gun control measures are Maginot Lines.
> 
> After the UK banned handguns in '97, gun crime went up. At one point it was nearly double.
> 
> The more important point is the 2nd amendment isn't for the assurance of your safety it is to secure our free state.



Our 2nd amendment right to keep and bear arms it what protects ALL of our other rights.


----------



## HeavyLifter (Nov 8, 2012)

Ichigo said:


> I want this for Christmas, Santa better give it to me



Now this is one sexy truck! Go big or go home


----------



## Paranoid Fitness (Nov 8, 2012)

HeavyLifter said:


> Now this is one sexy truck! Go big or go home



HL,

Guess it should read Gun guys and gals!


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## rage racing (Nov 10, 2012)

Just picked up a Sig Scorpion 1911 and finished up my SA M1A in a JAE-100 chassis with Vortex glass.


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## LAM (Nov 11, 2012)

I need to get a shoulder/folding stock for the glock-18 so my girl can shoot it.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Nov 11, 2012)

I just successfully negotiated a deal for my third GE mini-gun.
I am going to have to put the quad 50 on hold for now.
*My next project will look something like this:
*






*or this:*






*Everybody at the next Knob Creek shoot will be drooling...
Some of them may even get erections.*​


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## LightBearer (Nov 11, 2012)

How about just toughen the penalty for thoes caught with an illegal firearm.  I guarantee that if you start sentencing raheem and shameek with 20years for possessing a stolen/illegal/unlicensed firearm, their friends would start thinking twice about doing It.


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## Zaphod (Nov 11, 2012)

LightBearer said:


> How about just toughen the penalty for thoes caught with an illegal firearm.  I guarantee that if you start sentencing raheem and shameek with 20years for possessing a stolen/illegal/unlicensed firearm, their friends would start thinking twice about doing It.



Probably not.  They are indeed that stupid.


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## LightBearer (Nov 11, 2012)

Zaphod said:


> Probably not.  They are indeed that stupid.



Youre right


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## jay_steel (Nov 12, 2012)

ALBOB said:


> Now hold on, you're talking a Glock reload vs. a single stack 1911 reload.  Yeah, my money would be on the Glock but, that's like racing a Top fuel dragster against a '77 Pinto.  Definitely apples to oranges comparison.
> 
> On the other hand, I carry either a double stack Para-Ordnance or STI 1911.  I'm not too shabby when it comes to reloads.  Not taking you up on your bet, just comparing apples to apples.



The 1911 is by far the best handgun to operate in a controlled environment. It is the most accurate and bad ass guns among pistols, however I would NEVER carry one into combat, There are just to many operating parts that can get jammed up. I have NEVER had a malfunction with a glock or "glock style" weapon. However, I have had many malfunctions with a 1911. Not enough to write about and bitch, but 1 malfunction is 1 to many when your being shot at. 

I want an STI 1911 bad for competition target shooting. 

Fact my grouping with a 1911 is practically through the same hole and I could never do that on purpose with a glock, but when you want to kill some one center mass is center mass no matter if they are 1 or 2 inches apart.


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## LAM (Nov 12, 2012)

LightBearer said:


> How about just toughen the penalty for thoes caught with an illegal firearm.  I guarantee that if you start sentencing raheem and shameek with 20years for possessing a stolen/illegal/unlicensed firearm, their friends would start thinking twice about doing It.



and on the other side of that they also need to hammer the licensed gun dealers that funnel those weapons to the streets.  there is only a handful of them in the States that provide the vast majority of guns used in street crimes and this is per the ATF and DOJ.  

remember the Pareto Principle or the 80/20 Rule.  20% of the criminals commit 80% of the crimes.


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## Paranoid Fitness (Nov 12, 2012)

As stated over and over by responsible gun owners, gun rights advocacy groups, licensed FFL dealers and conservative politicians across the country...

*Stop writing gun-control legislation, quit passing new gun-control laws, just do something to actually ENFORCE the laws that are already on the books.*

There are way more gun-control laws than are needed. Unfortunately, prosecutors, judges and parole boards keep letting offenders back onto the streets well before they've served their sentences putting everyone at risk in the process.

*Fuck three strikes and you get life...I say three strikes and you get death.*


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## 240PLUS (Nov 12, 2012)

Your full of shit to LAM. That piece is going for about 3 grand black market. Your talking beyond 3 grand if you purchase it lagit with a class 3 license. 

Just sayin


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## 240PLUS (Nov 12, 2012)

Paranoid Fitness said:


> I just successfully negotiated a deal for my third GE mini-gun.
> I am going to have to put the quad 50 on hold for now.
> *My next project will look something like this:
> *
> ...



God I'm getting a hard on.


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## 240PLUS (Nov 12, 2012)

Over priced


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## LAM (Nov 12, 2012)

240PLUS said:


> Your full of shit to LAM. That piece is going for about 3 grand black market. Your talking beyond 3 grand if you purchase it lagit with a class 3 license.
> 
> Just sayin



when you know people in the NSA, CIA, FBI and sell arms you can get anything.  I have tons of shit i'm not supposed to have, you don't go through security when you are active SF at least we didn't back in the early 90's.  when I found out the government doesn't abide by it's own rules I stopped obeying their rules.  you think I give a fuck about a class 3 license?


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## LAM (Nov 12, 2012)

and the G-18 was a gift, but I would pay double that any day of the week.  if you know the right people getting full auto arms is as easy as a phone call.  I know dudes in the secret service down to the hells angels in Philly and MS-13 in Minnesota.


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## jay_steel (Nov 12, 2012)




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## ALBOB (Nov 12, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> The 1911 is by far the best handgun to operate in a controlled environment. It is the most accurate and bad ass guns among pistols, however I would NEVER carry one into combat, There are just to many operating parts that can get jammed up. I have NEVER had a malfunction with a glock or "glock style" weapon. However, I have had many malfunctions with a 1911. Not enough to write about and bitch, but 1 malfunction is 1 to many when your being shot at.
> 
> I want an STI 1911 bad for competition target shooting.
> 
> Fact my grouping with a 1911 is practically through the same hole and I could never do that on purpose with a glock, but when you want to kill some one center mass is center mass no matter if they are 1 or 2 inches apart.



Yep unreliable due to too many moving parts, that must be why all the SpecOps forces carry them.


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## 240PLUS (Nov 13, 2012)

LAM said:


> when you know people in the NSA, CIA, FBI and sell arms you can get anything.  I have tons of shit i'm not supposed to have, you don't go through security when you are active SF at least we didn't back in the early 90's.  when I found out the government doesn't abide by it's own rules I stopped obeying their rules.  you think I give a fuck about a class 3 license?




ATF will my friend. Be careful with that shit. If you do have that Glock 18, awesomeness. I would love to own one, but I don't have that kind of cash.


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## 240PLUS (Nov 13, 2012)

SPAS 12, Love to love it long time.


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## Zaphod (Nov 13, 2012)

ALBOB said:


> Yep unreliable due to too many moving parts, that must be why all the SpecOps forces carry them.



They do?  SEALs have been using Sigs.


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## LAM (Nov 13, 2012)

240PLUS said:


> ATF will my friend. Be careful with that shit. If you do have that Glock 18, awesomeness. I would love to own one, but I don't have that kind of cash.



only 3 people have seen that weapon since I got it in '89 it doesn't come out from it's "secret spot" much.  in terms of US gov agency's I've been around folks that work in the my entire life, and I'm not scared of a single one of them nothing but goons with badges and guns big deal.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

ALBOB said:


> Yep unreliable due to too many moving parts, that must be why all the SpecOps forces carry them.








I serve and continue to serve and have deployed with MANY "SpocOps" including AUS SAS... I can tell you this just because some one carries it does not make it more reliable. Saying that just proves how little you know about guns. I never once said they are horrible gun, but on my last tour no one carried a 1911 due to jamming issues. I can tell you the only reason my most seals, sf, rangers, and ect carry them purely out of preference, not because of reliability. Many personally feel more comfortable with a gun they know they can shoot better and equally know it is not as reliable. It has been proven time and time again that the 1911 is the perfect competition gun, but not the perfect combat gun. I have tested this in kuwait under those conditions many times.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

LAM said:


> only 3 people have seen that weapon since I got it in '89 it doesn't come out from it's "secret spot" much.  in terms of US gov agency's I've been around folks that work in the my entire life, and I'm not scared of a single one of them nothing but goons with badges and guns big deal.



There are many rumors of farmers that have secret rooms underground in their shops loaded with guns. It is one of those wise tails that many of them are stashing cash and guns under machining equipment. Even as far fetched as this sounds, many of the farmers I work with I would not hold it past them.


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## ALBOB (Nov 13, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> I serve and continue to serve and have deployed with MANY "SpocOps" including AUS SAS... I can tell you this just because some one carries it does not make it more reliable. *Saying that just proves how little you know about guns*. I never once said they are horrible gun, but on my last tour no one carried a 1911 due to jamming issues. I can tell you the only reason my most seals, sf, rangers, and ect carry them purely out of preference, not because of reliability. Many personally feel more comfortable with a gun they know they can shoot better and equally know it is not as reliable. It has been proven time and time again that the 1911 is the perfect competition gun, but not the perfect combat gun. I have tested this in kuwait under those conditions many times.



 Whatever you say.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

^^^ your the one that says the 1911 is the best combat and carry gun... just saying... I do believe it is the best made gun to shoot and the most beautiful pistol period, but would never enter combat with it. If I am going into combat I do not want a safety on my pistol period, being in many combat related instances, luckily never had to use my pistol. I would never even want to think about having to take the spit second to worry if the dirt that I am covered in is going to affect my gun, or if I am going to be able to engage quick enough due to having a safety. 

Home defense 1911 is perfect or for target shooting. Just bad ass and every man should own one.

The gun i carry will be able to withstand ANY THING... bad weather, dirt, mud, water, impact. period.


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## ALBOB (Nov 13, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> ^^^ your the one that says the 1911 is the best combat and carry gun...



You'd be hard pressed to show where I ever said that.  I was simply disputing your claim that it's unreliable due to too many moving parts.

In reality this is nothing more than a Ford vs. Chevy argument.  The "best" gun is whichever one you can hit your target with.  I've trained with 1911s for 25 years.  I'm comfortable with them and can hit my target so that's my weapon of choice.  If you're more comfortable with another platform then that's what's right for you.  I just hope that if shit ever hits the fan you and I are fighting on the same side.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

i agree, now hitting a target in a controlled environment like a home with no dirt or ect. I own a 1911 and LOVE it, it is my favorite gun to shoot. However, i would never buy a 1911 built to conceal, or take on deployment. When it comes down to my life I want to know my best odds of my gun firing. Even my brother in laws 3k$ STI malfunctions a few times when we first start shooting. I have never had an XD, Glock, or Khar have a single issue.


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## ALBOB (Nov 13, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> i agree, now hitting a target in a controlled environment like a home with no dirt or ect. I own a 1911 and LOVE it, it is my favorite gun to shoot. However, i would never buy a 1911 built to conceal, or take on deployment. When it comes down to my life I want to know my best odds of my gun firing. Even my brother in laws 3k$ STI malfunctions a few times when we first start shooting. I have never had an XD, Glock, or Khar have a single issue.



I've had a lot of back up carry guns but, the only gun I've ever had as my primary has been a Para Ord P-12 that I bought and started carrying in 1993.  I've put multiple thousands of rounds through it in the past 20 years and have not had one single malfunction.  

Again, I'm not trying to say one is better than another, simply what I'm comfortable with if my life is on the line.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

i am getting ready to buy the para ord warthog to keep in my car when driving out of town.


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## ALBOB (Nov 13, 2012)

If you do, go to Wolff Gun Springs and get a set of extra power magazine springs.  The only bad thing I've ever heard about Para has been the crappy steel they use for their mag springs.  I have the P-12 and a P-14.  I've replaced the springs in all my mags and they've always run flawlessly.  I don't know if the factory springs are/were as bad as I was told but, I figured the few $$$ for upgraded springs was worth the extra insurance.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

yea, this is after I finish my newest AR... I got a VLTOR upper and Charles daly lower i need to finish. Just thinking about the configuration. 16 noveske barrel and trigger still doing work on. I am going to be using this in a 3 gun contest.


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## ALBOB (Nov 13, 2012)

SaWEET!!!!  I just picked up a Wilson Combat Super Sniper with a Leupold 3.5 x 10 tactical scope.  It'll do nothing but punch holes in paper a LONG way away for the rest of its life but, that's what makes me smile. 

What other guns you using in 3-gun?

Besides the cowboy competitions I do, I occasionally shoot in a local steel plate match.  STI Eagle 5.0 .45 ACP.


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

I haven't started yet, trying to get every thing built for it. We have our own 3 gun course though that I just run through with a basic spike tactical AR (nothing fancy but eotech and stuff) Remington 870 autoloader, and a colt 1911. 

I want to get this AR finished, Benelli super sport, and a nighthawk 1911. I have to see how much money I owe for taxes this year, before i buy any more guns.


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## Swiper (Nov 13, 2012)

*Why Obama Wants Your Guns And The Rest of Your Freedoms*

Second Amendment in the crosshairs
*Paul Joseph Watson & Alex Jones*
Infowars.com
November 13, 2012?What we need to do is change the way in which people think about guns, especially young people?.We have to be repetitive about this?.We need to do this every day of the week, and just really brainwash people into thinking about guns in a vastly different way.?​*Attorney General Eric Holder*
?We must get rid of all the guns.?
*Sarah Brady*
?The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subjected people to carry arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subjected peoples to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing.?​*Adolph Hitler, Edict of March 18, 1938*​Gun control advocate Sarah Brady?s infamous vow to ?get rid of all the guns? has never been more prescient as we enter a second term of the Obama administration ? 18 months after Obama assured Brady during a White House meeting that gun control was ?very much on his agenda.?​Gun sales surged before the election and panic buying continues to proliferate, with stocks of gun manufacturers like Ruger and Smith & Wesson going parabolic, as Americans prepare for an all out assault on the second amendment.​Obama himself publicly signaled his intention to re-introduce the assault weapons ban during the second presidential debate.​?What I?m trying to do is to get a broader conversation about how do we reduce the violence generally,? Obama said during the debate at Hofstra University. ?Part of it is seeing if we can get an assault weapons ban reintroduced.?​Obama?s anti-gun record clearly suggests he will use his lame duck term as a tool with which to eviscerate the second amendment.​As an Illinois state senator Obama attempted to limit sales of handguns to one per month and even voted against a bill that protected firearms manufacturers from lawsuits over misuse of their products by others. Obama has consistently supported the assault weapons ban and even ridiculed gun owners during an April 2008 speech when he said small town people ?cling to guns? to express their frustration.​Obama?s March 2011 meeting with Brady, during which he assured her that he was working ?under the radar? to assault gun rights just months before the Fast and Furious scandal broke clearly indicates that Americans may ?cling to guns? for a very salient reason ? the fear that an Obama administration with nothing to lose is set to take a huge bite out of the second amendment.​Gun rights are already being whittled away through regulatory procedures that operate outside of the law, with the ATF last year issuing a letter ordering firearms dealers in border states to report sales of two or more semi-automatic rifles, and following it up by harassing gun owners with intimidating home visits as well as threatening gun dealers to spy on their customers.​The ATF?s regulatory backdoor assault on gun rights is also opening the door for shotguns to be banned under the justification that they can hold more than two rounds, a move Dudley Brown, Executive Director of Rocky Mountain Gun Owners, said ?will be the most dangerous interpretation of the 1968 Gun Control Act ever envisioned and will outlaw thousands of perfectly legitimate home defense shotguns.?​Americans who buy a few boxes of ammunition are also being treated as suspicious individuals and questioned by police.​Senator Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) has already resolved to push a new piece of anti-gun legislation that would, ?Ban pistol grips and ?high-capacity? magazines, eliminate any grandfathering and ban sales of ?weapons in possession?.​The fact that Barack Obama has occasionally promised not to target the second amendment is completely meaningless., Indeed, if you look at all the other liberties his administration has savaged, the assurance that he won?t dismantle gun rights should almost be taken as a threat that he will.​- As part of his 2008 campaign pledge, Obama promised to close down Guantanamo Bay. The Obama administration not only failed to close the infamous prison camp, they expanded its use.​- Last year (after campaigning to protect Habeas Corpus before he was elected), Obama promised not to sign the National Defense Authorization Act, with its provisions for the indefinite detention of American citizens, yet put his signature on the bill in the dead of night on New Year?s Eve. Indeed, it was the Obama administration itself which argued for the removal of language that would have protected Americans from the provisions and then had them re-instituted after a court had struck them down.​- As part of his campaign pitch, Obama promised to ?not use signing statements as a way of doing an end run around Congress.? Obama has issued no less than 19 signing statements since he took office.​- In 2008, Obama promised ?no more illegal wiretapping of American citizens.? Just months after he took office, Obama expanded Bush?s warrantless wiretapping program. The invasiveness of illegal wiretapping is worse under Obama than it was under Bush.​*The History of Gun Control is the History of Tyranny*​The history of gun control tells us that state seizure of firearms is habitually used as a precursor to impose a power monopoly of the state.​Right back to Roman times, the lower orders were disarmed of all their weapons in a bid to suffocate the political power of the people and limit their ability to voice grievances.​Japanese warrior Toyotomi Hideyoshi was candid in explaining why the population of that country was disarmed in what came to be known as Great Sword Hunt in 1588 when he decreed: ?The possession of unnecessary implements [of war] makes difficult the collection of taxes and dues, and tends to foment uprisings.?​Communist mastermind Chairman Mao echoed a similar sentiment when he stated, ?Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.?​Fast forward 250 years and some of the first gun control laws in the embryonic United States were against black people, to ensure they remained slaves. Blacks were prohibited ?to keep or carry any firelock of any kind, any military weapon, or any powder or lead.?​Adolf Hitler was also abundantly aware of the fact that the one thing which stands in the way of a repressive dictatorship is an armed population. In 1938 the Nazis banned Jews ?from acquiring, possessing, and carrying firearms and ammunition, as well as truncheons or stabbing weapons.?​In the 21st century, the primary vanguard of gun control has been elevated to the international level. Hours after Obama?s re-election victory, his administration joined with 150 other governments to renew its support for the United Nations Arms Trade Treaty, a process which critics have warned will set the stage for Americans to have their gun rights voted out of existence by the global body with no involvement from the US Congress or Senate.​Whether Obama chooses to characterize his second term by declaring war on the second amendment remains to be seen, but it?s almost inevitable given that virtually every one of Obama?s promises before his 2008 election success has been broken, we will once again witness the lurching advance of big government over the next four years as cherished rights are chewed up and spat out with wanton disregard for the Constitutional foundation of the country.​


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## jay_steel (Nov 13, 2012)

This is why I am retiring to Alaska, they can do their best to try to find me up there.


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## 240PLUS (Nov 13, 2012)

ALBOB said:


> Whatever you say.



I would NEVER I mean NEVER rely on a 1911 for combat. I never cared for glock until I owned one. I'll never go back. They are great relaible handguns especially if your life depeneds on them. Why do you see LEO's with glocks and sigs.


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## Zaphod (Nov 14, 2012)

Friend of mine was in Force Recon.  His pistol of choice is the 1911.


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## jay_steel (Nov 14, 2012)

I am just saying if I had a guy pointing a gun at me and their are two guns in the dirt 1911 and glock... I am grabbing the glock. If they are on a clean table I am grabbing the 1911


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## ALBOB (Nov 14, 2012)

240PLUS said:


> I would NEVER I mean NEVER rely on a 1911 for combat. I never cared for glock until I owned one. I'll never go back. They are great relaible handguns especially if your life depeneds on them. Why do you see LEO's with glocks and sigs.



As I told jay_steel, it's a Ford vs. Chevy argument.  You're comfortable trusting your life to a Glock, I'm comfortable trusting mine to a 1911.  This is one of those ultra rare occasions where we can both be right.


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## jay_steel (Nov 14, 2012)

^^^ disagree because ford is the best car out there


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## Zaphod (Nov 14, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> I am just saying if I had a guy pointing a gun at me and their are two guns in the dirt 1911 and glock... I am grabbing the glock. If they are on a clean table I am grabbing the 1911



I'd grab the closest one.  Same distance away?  I'd grab one at random rather than look at the name on the gun.


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## 240PLUS (Nov 14, 2012)

Well shit, now you got me thinking. 1911 worked well in WW2, and that was a lot of trench warfare...mmmmm


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## jay_steel (Nov 14, 2012)

I am curious to talk to some vets now about this, Hard to find a WWII vet I think there are a few in our VFW chapter I will have to talk to.


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## ALBOB2 (Nov 15, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> ^^^ disagree because ford is the best car out there



Careful now, you wouldn't want the world to know we agree on stuff.  (I've been a hard core blue oval man my whole life. )

My current baby is an '07 F-250 Super Duty Crew Cab.  I added a Volant cold air intake, MBPR exhaust and SCT Excellerator power program.  She's a beast.


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## jay_steel (Nov 15, 2012)

2005 mustang GT with a 2004 cobra 5.0 stroker block w/ custom 3.4l whipple, methenol injection, trunk mounted 5 gallon intercooler, 4 fordgt supercar fuel pumps, 22lbs of boost. Still finishing it putting in a chevy transmission in it though  they are cheaper and bolt in with a conversion kit (TH400, 3spd auto manuel valve body and a transbreak) Car use to have a procharger making 14psi @ 620rwhp. So we are expecting 800+rwhp.

Next truck is either going to be a F-250 diesel or a Lightning for the tow vehicle


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## jay_steel (Nov 15, 2012)

^^^ sorry correction 3 ford supercar fuel pumps... Before any car guys get on and say there is no quad pump set up  type...


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## ALBOB (Nov 16, 2012)

jay_steel said:


> 2005 mustang GT with a 2004 cobra 5.0 stroker block w/ custom 3.4l whipple, methenol injection, trunk mounted 5 gallon intercooler, 4 fordgt supercar fuel pumps, 22lbs of boost. Still finishing it putting in a chevy transmission in it though  they are cheaper and bolt in with a conversion kit (TH400, 3spd auto manuel valve body and a transbreak) Car use to have a procharger making 14psi @ 620rwhp. So we are expecting 800+rwhp.
> 
> Next truck is either going to be a F-250 diesel or a Lightning for the tow vehicle



JeeeeeZUS.  That thing must be an absolute monster. 

Diesel for towing.  ALWAYS diesel for towing.


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## jay_steel (Nov 16, 2012)

ALBOB said:


> JeeeeeZUS.  That thing must be an absolute monster.
> 
> Diesel for towing.  ALWAYS diesel for towing.




Its going to be a 9 second street car when we are finished. I want to be able to run 10's with street tires... (18 inch mickey thompson drag radials are my street tires). I guess this is what you get when you deploy a shit load of times and was single during that time.

Yeah a diesel would be sweet, but I have all ways wanted a twin turbo 1200hp lighting.


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## Swiper (Nov 30, 2012)

*SEE THE NEW ?INTELLIGENT? RIFLE THAT CLAIMS TO GIVE YOU A PERFECT SHOT EVERY TIME*

A new Texas-based company is developing a shooting system that could turn even the least skilled marksmen into a sniper-quality shooter.
TrackingPoint calls its system the ?world?s first precision guided firearm.?
President Jason Schauble explained in a YouTube demonstration of the technology that what the company did is ?put jet fighter lock-and-launch technology into a firing system.?
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/see-the-new-intelligent-rifle-that-claims-to-give-you-a-perfect-shot-every-time/


[video=youtube;LvbyAcYjzlc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=LvbyAcYjzlc[/video]


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## vicious 13 (Nov 30, 2012)

Trying to get an xd for Christmas


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