# Best Nutritional Threads



## w8lifter (Mar 9, 2002)

Human Dietary Needs

Metabolism Boosting Foods 

Mod Fat, High Protein, Low Carb Diet 

Insulin 

Carbohydrates 

Sugar 

Protein Bars are Evil

Male Cutting Meal Plan 

Fat Loss Primer 

Bulking w/ Slow Burners

Female Cutting Meal Plans

Carb-ups!


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## Fitgirl70 (Mar 14, 2002)

HI W8 ---- just wanted to pop over and say hello....hehehe
I'm here too now!!!


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## w8lifter (Mar 14, 2002)

Good to see you here Fitgirl!


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## tigress (Mar 14, 2002)

Excellent! Fitgirl is here too.


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## mrcrowley (Mar 15, 2002)

hello


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## mrcrowley (Mar 15, 2002)

excellent site w8lifter


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## mrcrowley (Mar 15, 2002)

just wanted some advice . The body doesnt respond as fast to training and diet as well as it did a couple years back.Want to make the most of my training time.


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## w8lifter (Mar 15, 2002)

Welcome to the site 

What kind of advice do you need? What are your goals, etc.


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## mrcrowley (Mar 15, 2002)

Just hit 40 , and I trained 5 days a week for 2 years , prior to that I trained 4-5 days a week for 6 years. I stopped training regularly about august 2001 and I need to lose the soft stuff around the waist.I don't need to be huge , but I do want the size and definition back as soo as possible. I can not run , I have a foot that didnt heal properly after a break a while back.


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## mrcrowley (Mar 15, 2002)

I am 5'9" and currently 210 lbs. My best condition was 215 , w/ a 33 inch waist , a year ago.Cant seem to lose the fat, I eat a pretty clean diet and drink occasionally.


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## mrcrowley (Mar 15, 2002)

have to leave , if you can email me with a few suggestions about increasing size and strength , and if there is any other activities I can add to my training to get better results. I have been walking at a fast pace for a half hour to 1 hour before or after working out.I use a lot of basic movements for all body parts and usually gor for 7-10 reps , with the last 3 reps becoming difficult.I train at home  and have a 10 in one bench, high and low pull lat, squatrack and a t bar.I do legs once a week and everything else twice.I work back, tri's and biceps, on day 1 , back and shoulders on day 2 , legs and traps on day 3 and start over.I added deadlifts recently because it seems to help boost my squat weight.I take 60 seconds or so between sets.This is what I did before , and it doesnt seem to bring results as fast as it did.I get at least 120 grams of protein a day, mostly fish and eggs , some dairy and powders.I eat very few carbs.


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## w8lifter (Mar 16, 2002)

Well, you've presented quite a few variables....you want size, strength and fat loss all at once and unfortunately that's near impossible to accomplish all at once.

I would suggest you focus on fat loss to begin w/, unless you feel you only have a small amt to lose. Once you lose some bf and harden up your physique a bit, you can begin a slow bulking program, which will also aid in increasing your strength levels.

If you have specific questions about training, you can post a thread in the training forum, but just a few quick notes....

You will probably see faster fat loss results if you increase the intensity of your cardio sessions and do them after your w8 w/o, not before.

Your split needs work....you're working your back two days in a row?

You will need to drastically increase your protein intake if you're serious about gaining muscle...I suggest at least 1 gm of protein per lb of LBM. It would be helpful if you could post a sample days diet.


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## Orange357 (Mar 17, 2002)

thanks.


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## mrcrowley (Mar 19, 2002)

typo, I train chest tri's and bi's on day one . Thanx for the response . Did the cybergenics workout years ago . Very effective , but not available .Thanx again , you look great!


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## CDWetzelberger (Apr 15, 2002)

Awesome information Here.

I have been on low carb, high fat and protein diet before and I had difficulty with energy and concentration.  Not good at the time because i was in school, so I had to drop it after about 3 weeks.  I was just wondering if one of you guys or gals on this type of diet will post some meal ideas.  Sure there is lots of things one could eat if they were not worried about saturated fats but if that is a concern then the list drops considerably.  I know W8lifter posted some different foods she suggests but how about a few of the different meal ideas and ways you doctor common foods so they are more palatable.   For example tuna is disgusting to me except if one puts Ranch Dressing (which wouldn't work in the diet?) or A-1 on it.  Another example in the article Insulin he says that range feed animals are much lower in Saturated Fat if they are Range feed as opposed to grain feed.  Well how are we as consumers supposed to tell the difference.   Any Ideas would be appreciated.


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## CDWetzelberger (Apr 15, 2002)

Never mind I just realized there is a  "Recipes" section.


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## w8lifter (Apr 15, 2002)

Welcome CDWetzelberger 

You've been reading I see  You're saturated fat question was edited, did you find your answer okay?

You can also check my journal for examples of meals that I used/am using for my cut...I would start at the last page and work back a few pages, it might be easier.

As for the meat...I believe it will say on the package of meat/poultry, it's also usually more expensive. You might be able to ask your butcher as well.


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## CDWetzelberger (Apr 15, 2002)

Nice Web site w8lifter.  I like your Recipes.  As far as my saturated fat question, no I haven't found an answer for that yet.   I realize its not an easy question to answer.  I was just wondering if anybody had a link to a list of foods which would be extremely low in carbs, with high protein and good fats but realitively low in Saturated fats.   I plan on trying a type of Keto diet again.  I have the book The Ketogenic diet by Lyle McDonald which I read during my first atempt at Ketosis based weight loss.  I lost my Atkins book which I also read and it had a lot of suggestions about food. I would rather not go buy another one I was hoping there was a site with a summation of good items to eat while on this type of  diet.  Last time I did it I ate some god Awful stuff this time I want to try to do it while eating more healthy.


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## w8lifter (Apr 16, 2002)

Read this link 

Sorry, I've got to go again, still trying to answer your questions....read these on saturated fat and I'll be back when I can!


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## CDWetzelberger (Apr 18, 2002)

I actually found a great site for people on low carb diets. www.lowcarbgrocery.com/carb.html


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## isenbcc (Apr 30, 2002)

What would somebody suggest to me about losing a few pounds and keeping it off.

I am trying to lose some weigth and it seems to be harder then it used to be for me.

I exersize about three times a week and I work odd hours as you can see, since I am the only one here tonight.

I eat three times a day once about 2:00 p.m. once about 10:00 p.m. and about 4:00 a.m.


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## w8lifter (May 1, 2002)

Welcome isenbcc ...I think you'll find you have to eat a bit more frequently in order to lose weight. Why don't you make a post w/ a sample diet and some stats about yourself and we'll see if we can help


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## rks1969 (May 1, 2002)

Since being on the hi fat/protein lo-carb diet I've noticed that a couple days after carb-up I drop 2-3lbs & don't gain any back(this is great!!!).Is this normal??
   I've modeled my diet very closely to w8's journal w/ additions to the totals since I weigh more.
    Any help will be appreciated


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## w8lifter (May 1, 2002)

Well right after a carb up, you should weigh a little more due to the stored glycogen/water, and then your weight should stabilize again as you deplete....anything else is probably due to the increase in metabolism from the carb up...a good thing


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## isenbcc (May 2, 2002)

Well I kinda have a bad eating habit because I work nights ( 6 to 6 ) so I eat during the night and I believe that has something to do with my weight problem


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## isenbcc (May 2, 2002)

Most of the time I eat at about 2 in the afternoon then about 9 in the evening and the third time a about 3 in the morning. I work out sometimes three times a week but not always. I normally go to bed as soon as I get home from work. Do you think this could cause me to gain weight?


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## stam (May 14, 2002)

very nice info!


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## Mudge (Jun 6, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by isenbcc *_
> What would somebody suggest to me about losing a few pounds and keeping it off.
> 
> I am trying to lose some weigth and it seems to be harder then it used to be for me.
> ...




Wow, tons and tons of reading through these links!

Most of the really lean people with or without large amounts of muscle (including Little Hercules), generally say that the secret is not large amounts of cardio or funky workout tricks, just LOW CARB DIETS, and of course lots of water, and the other 'norm' stuff.


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## Emmon (Aug 3, 2002)

which one of the above diet types would you suggest for someone who wants...

- bulking ability
- healthy foods ( fruits and such )
- not definition
- foods helping keep the body full of energy and able to help when using stamina on long runs

Thanks


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## Mudge (Aug 3, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by Emmon *_
> - not definition
> - foods helping keep the body full of energy and able to help when using stamina on long runs



If you litterally mean running (long runs) then I would think you would want to not be bulky, and you would end up being defined, not definitionless...


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## Emmon (Aug 3, 2002)

I want strength and superb stamina with the capability of quite fast speeds, while keeping the right vitamins etc stocked.


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## w8lifter (Aug 3, 2002)

If you want strength you're going to need to eat enough calories to compensate for the running you do. What exactly are you doing...you say speed and then you say long runs...usually ya don't mix the two


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## Emmon (Aug 3, 2002)

well i guess im not usual then k.. im doing both


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## tomas (Sep 23, 2002)

*Dam that`s a great site*

and you are not half bad


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 1, 2003)

so how many grams of carbs would i need if i want to reduce my body fat % from 21.5 to 14%? i also do resistant training 3 times a week and cardio 4 times a week . my fat and protein intakes are ok. im only considerd to my carb intake?


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## Dr. Pain (Jan 1, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by oceangurl01 *_
> so how many grams of carbs would i need if i want to reduce my body fat % from 21.5 to 14%? i also do resistant training 3 times a week and cardio 4 times a week . my fat and protein intakes are ok. im only considerd to my carb intake?



Welcome to the board 



So let's assume that you have read most of the posts here in Best Nutritional Threads a few times....especially about insulin resistance.  





> _*Originally posted by oceangurl01 *_
> I also have a question. im 5'4 129lbs female. my body fat % is 21.5 %. i do resistant training 3 times a week, working on different body part a day for about an hour. and i do cardio 4-5 times a week for 30-45 minutes. i take in fair amount of protein and watching my carbs and fats. do you guys know how long it would take me to reduce my fat percentage to 14%??? I would want it fast! do you have any suggestions? (meal requiremnts) my carb intake is about 150 grams a day and fat about 20 grams a day protein varies from 80 grams to 120 grams aday?????/ do i need to change my nutrition or workout to get to my 14 % goal as soon as possible???




I'm gonna assume what you are doing IS NOT WORKING!  So...

1) Search cardio here.......I would increase your resistance traing to 45-50 minutes 4-5 times a week and decrease cardio to no more than 2.   YES 2!!!

you want to add LBM to improve your metabolism...each pound requiring 30-50 more caloires a day (potentailly burning (oxidizing) more BF.....NOT lose LBM from excessive cardio......BW doesn't matter.....body composition does!

2) So you are 129 lbs with roughly 100 pounds of LBM

you currently eat 

100 (ave P) 150 C and 20 F (worst thing you do)....hopefully over 4-5 meals a day

That is 1180 calories a day..so your metaboism is extremely compromised

Before you can cut BF effectively....because we can't lower your calories (you have nowhere to go)...we have to reset your metabolism....at a minimum of 12 caloires per pound per day...with a major shift in macronutrients...AND WE HAVE TO DO THIS GRADUALLY


3)  So here are your immediate (next 2 week goals)

Eat 5 or 6 times a day.......not more at first....just more spread out.....unless you do so already

Gradually raise protein to 1 gr/# or 130 grams per/day...then 1.25 gr/#/d...and finally 1.5 grams per pound per day....Drink at least 4-5 L of water as you do this per day....

as you do that, lower carbs  to about 60-70 grams per day  (see slow burners...we only suggest certain carbs)........so maybe in steps....120....100...80...along with the protein increase.

Finally, raise fat.....maybe 2 grams per meal, again in steps till you are at about 10-12 grams per meal

So at the end of two weeks....and if you try to do this too quickly....you WILL accummulate BF...we want you at

1540 calories

180 P
70 C
60 F

3 meals 30 P 20 C 10 F
2 meals 30 P 15 C 10 F
1 meal.  30 P 00 C 10 F

(we don't count greens and veggies)....

Start a Journal..and we can talk about meal planning.




*Shopping list! *

sugar-free low carb protein powder
lean beef
chicken breast
turkey breast
fresh fish
canned tuna
canned salmon
eggs
creamed cottage cheese** 
hard cheese **
sweet potatoes
yams
long grain brown rice
old fashioned oats
steel cut oats
eggplant
squash
romaine lettuce
spinach
asparagus
avocado
broccoli
brussels sprouts
cabbage
cauliflower
cucumbers
celery
peppers (any color)
mushrooms
string beans
zucchini
apples
bananas**
fresh or frozen (w/o syrup) berries
peaches
grapefruit
heavy whipping cream (35% ....NOT whipped cream the dessert topping)
olive oil
safflower oil
flax seed oil
walnut oil
almonds
walnuts
natural sugar-free peanut butter

** Not all foods on this list should be used at all times...the banana for instance should only be used during a carb up and/or a bulk.

DP


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## Dr. Pain (Jan 1, 2003)

OOPS and to answer your question:  

After this 2 week  reset (and preferably more...to start you from a higher level).. and the shift from cardio to resistance training ....

If you are 100% consistant, don't cheat ( AT ALL), tweak your program every 3-5 weeks, have no underlying metabolic issues, and are not compromised by HRT, Birth control issues, other meds, esp thyroid and SSRI's......

Then between 12 and 16 weeks. 

(that aslo assumes  your training program is adequate)

DP


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 6, 2003)

you guys dont count veggies and fiber as a carb source when you count your daily carb intake . so would i count oatmeal and brown rice with my carb intake ?


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## P-funk (Jan 6, 2003)

For things like oatmeal and brown rice I personaly only count the active carbs (all carbs other that fiber).  I think for oatmeal  there is 27g of carbs total.  Four of those grams are dietary fiber so I count only 23g of carbs.   That is just how I look at it though, some may do it differently.  And I never count veggies.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 7, 2003)

so carrots dont count? even though they kinda sweet???


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## Mudge (Jan 7, 2003)

As carbs? I never even thought of them as a carb type veggie, are they even a veggie, they are roots? eh... I can't recall seeing alot of fibrous carb info when looking at the label of mini-carrots. Most fibrous carbs are greens, like green beans etc


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 7, 2003)

so why arent they on Dr pain's shopping list?? is it ok to eat lots of carrots then when you on the low carb???


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## Jodi (Jan 7, 2003)

All you need to remember is  Green Veggies!


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 7, 2003)

you dont recommend carrots then???


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## Jodi (Jan 7, 2003)

Its not on DP's list and its not Green.  So Nope


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 7, 2003)

so they bad just like drinking milk?


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## Jodi (Jan 7, 2003)

> The glycemic index is a measurement of the effect a food has on your blood sugar level. Some foods, which have a high amount of sugar in them such as, maple syrup, honey and candy, as well as, foods, which are "starchy"  - carrots, potatoes, corn, milk and most cereals are rated high on the gycemic index. They are rated this way because when you eat these foods you will experience a rapid rise in your blood sugar level.


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## Mudge (Jan 7, 2003)

doh


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 8, 2003)

thanx mudge!


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## Mudge (Jan 8, 2003)

For the "doh"? Thank Jodi


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 8, 2003)

why jodi?


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## Mudge (Jan 8, 2003)

She posted the correct carrot info


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 8, 2003)

ok.... thanx jodi
some people have fiber one. what is that stuff?


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## Hammerlynn (Jan 8, 2003)

Fiber one is bran cereal.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 8, 2003)

would you count it with you'r daily carb intake or just like veggies dont count it???
how many grams of carbs do you take in daily?


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## Hammerlynn (Jan 8, 2003)

No. You would add it into your daily totals. The amount you eat would completely depend on your daily needs. For me, I follow the plan and DP described to you.  I keep carb intake low and only eat 1/4 cup of oats daily so I would probably have the same amount of cereal.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 8, 2003)

so i can intake 80 grams of carb daily (not including veggies) 
but how come some people here have days that they have 40 or 20 grams of carbs a day and the day they carb up is 80 grams. would i do what they do? or just have 70 - 80 grams of carbs a day no matter what???


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## Mudge (Jan 9, 2003)

Its going to be hard to add cereal and not get alot of carbs from it, you'd have about 3 spoonfulls and be all done with your carbs right there 

Cereal is a great weight gainer though, remember the milk adds up those carbs FAST.


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## w8lifter (Jan 9, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by oceangurl01 *_
> so i can intake 80 grams of carb daily (not including veggies)
> but how come some people here have days that they have 40 or 20 grams of carbs a day and the day they carb up is 80 grams. would i do what they do? or just have 70 - 80 grams of carbs a day no matter what???




Some people are on different plans. Generally, if you keep your carbs below 30-40g per day, you'll need a carb up twice a week. If you keep your carbs around 80 per day...you won't need a carb up.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 10, 2003)

if i do 30-40 carbs per day, and then carb up, is it a better result than just keeping it to 80 grams (everyday?)


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## P-funk (Jan 10, 2003)

I think that depends on the person.  I have no problem losing wieght at 70-80g of carbs per day so I don't see a need to drop it down to 30-40g.  You should try both for a while and see which one works for you.


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## w8lifter (Jan 10, 2003)

> _*Originally posted by oceangurl01 *_
> if i do 30-40 carbs per day, and then carb up, is it a better result than just keeping it to 80 grams (everyday?)




OG, the thing w/ our bodies is that they are very smart....our bodies adapt very quickly to what we make it do...whether it be a training program or a diet...which is why we always need to tweak (change) things...in the gym, we strive to add more w8, add reps, change exercises, etc....in our diets, we do the same thing...so there is no best thing..especially when you consider how different we all are. Each person will be different and each cut for that person will be different. What you need to do is get some consistency going w/ your diet....pick what you want to do and do it, you're spending too much time trying to find the best way w/ the fastest results when all this time you could have followed DP's original suggestions and been half way to your first tweak already. Just pick something and do it, log your food intake, everything that goes in your mouth including serving sizes and times...start a journal so we can help you make those little tweaks and small improvements....nothing's going to happen overnight, it's all the small things we do that make a difference.

Please...start a journal and let us help you get to 14%, it can be done but not w/o a plan...if you try to wing it, your results will show...you may hit it or you may not.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 10, 2003)

i started doing that about 5 days ago. before i used to eat 150 grams of carbs that was full of raisins, prunes, dates and 4 cups of milk daily. now i dont eat any more of these food and my carbs are no more than 80 grams a day. i dont count veggies. but i count carrots! plus i work out on my upper body 2 times a week and twice a week on my lower body and cardio 2 times a week. i try to do my abs everytime i workout. but sometimes i crave for ice cream or some sweets. can i still eat some like small portions? if yes how small of a portion can i have ???


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## w8lifter (Jan 10, 2003)

Those are good improvements!   Why don't you set aside one meal per week where you can eat whatever you want...not the whole day, but one meal...eat whatever you've been craving...but you have to make sure you stick to healthy meals the rest of the week.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 10, 2003)

Thanx!so that day of the week i can eat how many table spoons of ice cream (chocolate ice cream)


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## w8lifter (Jan 10, 2003)

Just have a 1/2 cup or so...I suggest you do it near bedtime so you don't go crazy and blow your diet the rest of the day...keep it in your final meal.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 10, 2003)

but isnt it true you should eat no carbs before bedtime?


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## w8lifter (Jan 10, 2003)

Well, first off...on a normal day (not a cheat day) when you're eating proper foods, it doesn't matter so much when you take your carbs....you're talking about the myth that if you eat any carbs after 6 o'clock or so they "turn to fat".  Not so...assuming you're within your desired and required carb and calorie intake for the day. Now by taking your cheat meal in the final meal, you're sort of taking pre-cautionary measures. Imagine eating a cup of ice cream in the early afternoon...will you stop there? Not likely...once you have a taste of sugar, you want more. Not only that, but you're more likely to consider the day "shot" and continue eating cheat foods.....possibly consuming far more sugar and calories than intended. If you take it in the last meal right before bed, you finish your cup of ice cream, feel satisfied and get to go to sleep...not craving more sugar.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 10, 2003)

thanx, that makes sense. 
is peanut butter ok to eat on carb down days? i eat like 3 table spoons


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## w8lifter (Jan 10, 2003)

It has carbs in it...3 tbsp is a little excessive...try for one per day, and make sure it's part of a full meal...not just on it's own.


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## oceangurl01 (Jan 10, 2003)

hey again! is it better to cut down on peanut butter? and try something else. i cut down on milk well i dont drink milk anymore till i see results and i will drink one glass a week. no more raisins or prunes, dates like i used to eat unlimted. would that help to reduce it?


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## oceangurl01 (Feb 22, 2003)

1 table spoon of peanut butter (natural) or 1 table spoon of peanuts a day is ok then?


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