# Does the Mirror Lie, or the Liar Mirror?



## JimSnow (Nov 26, 2006)

Some days I say to myself... "Man, keep it up... you're looking _gooood_ and _getting even better_!"

Other days I think, ... "Jesus, Christ, I look like... shit, shat, shatten - pathetic, who am I fooling other than myself?"


Curious if you all go through this cycle?


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## vortrit (Nov 26, 2006)

JimSnow said:


> Some days I say to myself... "Man, keep it up... you're looking _gooood_ and _getting even better_!"
> 
> Other days I think, ... "Jesus, Christ, I look like... shit, shat, shatten - pathetic, who am I fooling other than myself?"
> 
> ...



Yes.


Wait... No.


Maybe.


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## CowPimp (Nov 26, 2006)

Yes, all the time.


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## PWGriffin (Nov 26, 2006)

vortrit said:


> Yes.
> 
> 
> Wait... No.
> ...



   

   

perfect response.  Flawless


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## JimSnow (Nov 26, 2006)

CowPimp said:


> Yes, all the time.




So, it's common?

It's important in-so-much as it affects your attitude toward training. Yes, you realize these _fluxes_ are normal... but the "down days" really are anti-productive to overall mindset. 

Sometimes... I can't see the physical difference between myself and someone that's never touched a weight or exercised. I feel like I'm exerting way too much energy and food dollars for nothing. You can get so totally lost and absorbed.

?


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## fufu (Nov 26, 2006)

I go through times like that for sure.


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## vinceforheismen (Nov 26, 2006)

lol i go thru this all the time.
One day im like wow im doing great!
and 2 days later im like wow i think my bodyfat went up 3%. im loooking horrible..


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## Mudge (Nov 26, 2006)

Temperature changes and carb timing make me look different from one hour to another.


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## gsxrK3 (Nov 26, 2006)

Yeah me too. Only I never actually look good, just better than other days. I'm an ecto yet still have fat. It's so damn annoying that I do work out yet you would not know it by looking at me. I wanna be Big yet I'm not even average.


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## zl214 (Nov 26, 2006)

no. i dont do that, i always i think i look "shit" by the bodybuilding definition. but i dont care, proud of who i am.


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## JimSnow (Nov 26, 2006)

gsxrK3 said:


> Yeah me too. Only I never actually look good, just better than other days. I'm an ecto yet still have fat. It's so damn annoying that I do work out yet you would not know it by looking at me. I wanna be Big yet I'm not even average.




I can't see myself most (hell any) of the time. I look for others to make observations, generally by indirect comments. Rough gage of progress. 

Someone referred to my "guns" twice last week. He winked though, not sure?

Watching TV (a stupid dating show), on break at work, somebody commented, "he's even more buff than you Jim!" That was a great compliment! I didn't know I was "buff"! The guy in the show was an idiot.

I wore a razorback tee last week. This started the major influx I was fishing for.

The 6'5" meatcutter gal with shoulders 4 feet wide whistled at me and said, "bring it on, honey!" That was scary. Strangely, I've got a crush for this foul-mouthed, loud, obnoxious, hair-dyed big ass "thing". Always have. I wouldn't dare tell her.

What's the winking thing? A deli worker (about 99 years old) with painted on lips and eyebrows keeps winking at me. 

Basically, my ego is "pumped now!" YEAH!!!


Good work, Jim.


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## MCx2 (Nov 26, 2006)

JimSnow said:


> Some days I say to myself... "Man, keep it up... you're looking _gooood_ and _getting even better_!"
> 
> Other days I think, ... "Jesus, Christ, I look like... shit, shat, shatten - pathetic, who am I fooling other than myself?"
> 
> ...


 
The mirror lies, but the camera doesn't. 

I'll look in the mirror some days and see the same fat asshole I was 10 years ago Then I'll see a picture of myself, or a shot of me in a camera at the store and not even recognize myself. 

In the last 48 hours I've seen 2 people that I haven't seen in maybe 10 years. One said I was skinny and the other said I was big (muscular) looking. Both are better than hearing I'm fat. 

Judging by your avatar, you're doing just fine Jim. Keep it up.


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## shiznit2169 (Nov 26, 2006)

I get the same thing dude. Some days i'll be like ... "wow, i look pretty good and i'm seeing improvements" but other days i'll be like "wtf, am i shrinking or something". It drives me nuts.


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## JimSnow (Nov 26, 2006)

FatCatMC said:


> The mirror lies, but the camera doesn't.
> 
> I'll look in the mirror some days and see the same fat asshole I was 10 years ago Then I'll see a picture of myself, or a shot of me in a camera at the store and not even recognize myself.
> 
> ...




Yep, you're right. The camera doesn't lie. End all. 

You measure how people see you by frequency of comments... the more, the better. Typically, your family notices a lot less than objective strangers.

I guess I'm sensitive now... working too hard, lost more BF... no muscular gains - sense I look better, but getting to a critical point.

Lord, being a bodybuilder is equatable to having a anorexia nervosa at times. It's a critical mass hysteria. A lot of investment. 

Okay, I'm freaking out! ROFL


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## the_general64 (Nov 26, 2006)

Do you ever notice how you look different depending on what mirror you look at. I look like shit in the bathroom mirror but if I look in the bedroom mirror i'm busting out of my shirt...........i agree that the best assesment of how your body looks is the comments from other people......you tend to be the worst judge


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## JimSnow (Nov 26, 2006)

the_general64 said:


> Do you ever notice how you look different depending on what mirror you look at. I look like shit in the bathroom mirror but if I look in the bedroom mirror i'm busting out of my shirt...........i agree that the best assesment of how your body looks is the comments from other people......you tend to be the worst judge



I look like Mike Mentzer in my bedroom mirror with overhead 100 watt light on.
I realize this... and it's fun to play around.

I hate store mirrors... I look like Barney Fife, without the hair.


LOL


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## RockSolid (Nov 26, 2006)

that happens to me all the time, but sometimes when I think I look like a weakling I will end up lifting harder that day.  I agree about the camera not lying though, I took some pictures and I was suprised how much bigger I am now than one year ago.  As far as people making comments my co-workers all noticed a huge difference over the summer and that really let me know my hard work and food dollars are paying off.


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## CowPimp (Nov 26, 2006)

JimSnow said:


> Yep, you're right. The camera doesn't lie. End all.
> 
> You measure how people see you by frequency of comments... the more, the better. Typically, your family notices a lot less than objective strangers.
> 
> ...



Some people call it bignorexia, heh.


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## Tatyana (Nov 26, 2006)

People do not actually see 'reality'. Neuroscientists and psychololgists have basically proven this.

We have a limited amount of 'brain space' to process all the incoming information so our brain fills in the details.

People go through this all the time, especially those that are working on the perfect physique

x
x
x

T


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## JonnyStead (Nov 27, 2006)

I found lighting is a big impact - if the lighting is right I look fantastic - if it aint I look skinny - and clothes make a big impact for me.  A fitted T-shirt works well - but a baggy one undoes all my good work. My avatar's have all been shot with flattering light! (secrets out!) 

Jim - I'm glad you raised this mate - you always come up with fun posts even though your life seems to be quite wacky and amazing! keep it up!


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## Plateau_Max (Nov 27, 2006)

I think it's a good motivator balance to tell you the truth.  If one day I'm looking in the mirror before bed and think "man I need to step it up" then the next day I'll train like a crazy person.

Then other times I'll look in the mirror and think "this stuff's really paying off!" and the next day I'll be so happy with my results that THAT alone will be my motivator to keep training hard.

Competition can be great if you're looking for a motivator, when I finished my first marathon I didn't care about all the people who finished before me... when I was walking it off and drinking my recovery drink - watching the never-ending flow of people who finished AFTER me - you couldn't have beaten the smile off my face with a pipe.


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## P-funk (Nov 27, 2006)

what's a mirror?


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## tucker01 (Nov 27, 2006)

P-funk said:


> what's a mirror?



Ah you're not tall enough to see in the mirror yet?

Just stand on the counter.


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## P-funk (Nov 27, 2006)

IainDaniel said:


> Ah you're not tall enough to see in the mirror yet?
> 
> Just stand on the counter.



oh, you are fucking dead for that one.


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## tucker01 (Nov 27, 2006)

Leave the door open and I will walk in.


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## Witchblade (Nov 27, 2006)

At the start of this school year I got a lot of compliments. That really motivated me. "Are you on steroids?" "How does it feel to be the strongest kid in school?" "Wait... have you grown?" 

A lot of kids asked me to show my biceps or go armwrestling with them. That was fun too. The jocks of my school actually started working out to beat me, lol.

My newbie gains are slowing down now though and people are used to my posture. I'm a lot less motivated right now. The serious lack of sleep is really killing me. I stopped doing cardio, too tiring. I don't get psyched up before a workout anymore either.

Anyway, have you guys ever been criticised for 'walking macho'? Since I've gained some mass, my arms don't touch my body anymore in a rested state. I seriously don't do anything for that, but everyone thinks I'm showing off. It sucks really. Then again, I guess it's a compliment. Do you recognize that?


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## rmcfar (Nov 27, 2006)

Witchblade said:


> Anyway, have you guys ever been criticised for 'walking macho'? Since I've gained some mass, my arms don't touch my body anymore in a rested state. I seriously don't do anything for that, but everyone thinks I'm showing off. It sucks really. Then again, I guess it's a compliment. Do you recognize that?



It's called I.L.S (Imaginary Lat Syndrome) if you are in good shape and its actually the way your body sits then theres not much you can do about it. I think its pretty damn funny when people that are 130lbs and 5'11 look like they have barrels under theyre arms. It also depends on posture as well, you can hunch over and walk like a hermitt and then you wouldnt be called "macho" but whats the point, you are proud of what youve done so strut it up.


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## shiznit2169 (Nov 27, 2006)

Witchblade said:


> At the start of this school year I got a lot of compliments. That really motivated me. "Are you on steroids?" "How does it feel to be the strongest kid in school?" "Wait... have you grown?"
> 
> A lot of kids asked me to show my biceps or go armwrestling with them. That was fun too. The jocks of my school actually started working out to beat me, lol.
> 
> ...



I'm in the same boat as you dude. I received lots of compliments and i was growing like an animal. My newbie gains have slowed down and it's harder to gain weight and get bigger so my motivation has been lacking and my diet/sleep has been inconsistent. 

I did and still do get criticized every so often for trying to act "macho" just because i have good posture and my arms flare out a little bit. Not to mention, i carry my gallon of water around with me as well so that doesn't help either. I don't give a shit anyways.


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## katt (Nov 27, 2006)

I go through the up and down cycle all the time...   

Have any of the gals noticed that the mirrors at the higher-priced stores are considerably better - or make you look better - than bargain-basement shopping places??? Crazy


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## KataKlysm954 (Nov 27, 2006)

FatCatMC said:


> The mirror lies, but the camera doesn't.
> 
> I'll look in the mirror some days and see the same fat asshole I was 10 years ago Then I'll see a picture of myself, or a shot of me in a camera at the store and not even recognize myself.
> 
> ...



i disagree with that.... i think the camera lies because i look into the mirror and c my abs popping out as well as my other muscles and then i take a picture and i c nothing barely... maybe its the flash on the camera? after all im very pale so that + the flash might be affecting me....


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## JimSnow (Nov 28, 2006)

KataKlysm954 said:


> i disagree with that.... i think the camera lies because i look into the mirror and c my abs popping out as well as my other muscles and then i take a picture and i c nothing barely... maybe its the flash on the camera? after all im very pale so that + the flash might be affecting me....



Best to take photos without a main flash. Use hard lighting from a single direction, maybe early morning or late afternoon if outside. Stop down (underexpose) to show detail. A fill flash might be needed. Also, if light-skined, consider wearing white clothing for shoots. Automatic exposures will compose for this making your skin appear darker... if you are not good w/ cameras.

If pale like me, consider a spray tan before a session. My 1st serious set of photos coming up this summer w/ include that.


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## KataKlysm954 (Nov 28, 2006)

JimSnow said:


> Best to take photos without a main flash. Use hard lighting from a single direction, maybe early morning or late afternoon if outside. Stop down (underexpose) to show detail. A fill flash might be needed. Also, if light-skined, consider wearing white clothing for shoots. Automatic exposures will compose for this making your skin appear darker... if you are not good w/ cameras.
> 
> If pale like me, consider a spray tan before a session. My 1st serious set of photos coming up this summer w/ include that.



yeah im actually pale. me and my brother were thinking about getting a spray tan to darken us up and show more detail and definition.


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## goob (Nov 28, 2006)

Ahhh...... vanity, the devil's favourite sin........

I think we all must do this, to me, someone not interested in growing massive, only toned and cut, it seems the best way to evaluate my progress.


Godamn, what a handsome devil.......


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## Plateau_Max (Nov 28, 2006)

Yes, I enjoy weighing 175lbs, because I'm still strong, and very well proportioned, plus you can not only see striations in my shoulders, but in my biceps as well... 

As a single guy it helps too, ladies do love the lean and cut.  Tanning really does help the visible definition factor.  There's some rub-on sunless tanning solutions that last for a couple weeks and are far less damaging to your skin than sun or especially tanning booths.


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## AKIRA (Nov 28, 2006)

Plateau_Max said:


> Yes, I enjoy weighing 175lbs, because I'm still strong, and very well proportioned, plus you can not only see striations in my shoulders, but in my biceps as well...
> 
> *As a single guy it helps too, ladies do love the lean and cut.  Tanning really does help the visible definition factor.*  There's some rub-on sunless tanning solutions that last for a couple weeks and are far less damaging to your skin than sun or especially tanning booths.



Agreed, but I do use tanning boothes.  I dont care if its considered "metro"sexual, the shit works.

Mirrors sometimes make me feel pretty good damn happy.  Other times, it makes me feel FAT.  Sucks too.  If I dont feel fat, then I feel skinny cuz I am "cutting."

I can never get a fucking picture of me from a camera that looks ok.  I bring my camera to most get togethers hoping to accidently get a good pic, but instead, I always goof off.  

Taking a pic of me with my shirt off makes ME feel cocky.


In any case, the mirror is the enemy cuz since we are working out and eating cardboard, we critisize every little fucking thing.  Shit, we might as well be models.


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## Mudge (Nov 28, 2006)

Uhh, if your arms aren't touching your lats then yes you indeed have I.L.S. I've been in the 260s and I dont see how you guys think that more mass means you are less likely to have meat rub. My thighs have rubbed since high school, do you say your legs get so big that they dont touch anymore? Not unless you are prairie doggin' some doody.

I love hotel room mirrors, I look bitchin'.

Look at Ronnie's back and tell me that shit isn't so huge its touching all over.


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## JimSnow (Nov 29, 2006)

AKIRA said:


> Agreed, but I do use tanning boothes.  I dont care if its considered "metro"sexual, the shit works.
> 
> Mirrors sometimes make me feel pretty good damn happy.  Other times, it makes me feel FAT.  Sucks too.  If I dont feel fat, then I feel skinny cuz I am "cutting."
> 
> ...



I feel like shit because I've just dropped below 200lbs. - after my last three weeks of hell at work. I've lost some of my BF hedge against starvation. I like the increased vascularity... but this does me no good in the longrun. Lifts are stagnant and beginning to become a struggle to maintain.

Honestly though, my diet has slipped a bit. Starting a diet journal to keep honest.

Spent $225 at the grocery store last week. 

BTW - I'll try to post some new photos by next week to see if you guys see the differences.

Damn, where's my bag of Reeses Cups, dammit!


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## Plateau_Max (Nov 29, 2006)

If there's one thing I miss about sugar it's Reeses Cups.... it's been over a year now.


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## motiv8ed (Nov 29, 2006)

JimSnow said:


> I can't see myself most (hell any) of the time. I look for others to make observations, generally by indirect comments. Rough gage of progress.
> 
> Someone referred to my "guns" twice last week. He winked though, not sure?
> 
> ...



Man, I'd be weary of judging your results by uneducated people... You should find people with the same goals/study habbits as you to help you judge progress... 

If you use other peoples comments/oppinions as a yardstick to gague your  progress you may find your-self self-concious and (fill in the blank with aanother perfect word that I cant think of right now... not depressed, but overly sensative to other people... dunno) 

Anyway man. dont stresss. just follow your plan _regardless_ of results.. adjust your plan at pre-determined times... (and put those times in your plan). That is, by far, the most powerfull goal based advice that I've ever recieved. 

=) You look great though man! theres my comment
J


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## rmcfar (Nov 29, 2006)

Mudge said:


> Uhh, if your arms aren't touching your lats then yes you indeed have I.L.S. I've been in the 260s and I dont see how you guys think that more mass means you are less likely to have meat rub. My thighs have rubbed since high school, do you say your legs get so big that they dont touch anymore? Not unless you are prairie doggin' some doody.
> .



I think what i was referring to is not when your triceps are touching your lats but when your wrists are about a foot away from your hips at standing rest position. If you look at shots of the BB'ers they have this going on but a lot of people percieve it as making you look bigger and "macho". Kinda like the guys that walk around with theyre chin tuked in and hands in fists looking like they are ready for a boxing match at anytime of the day.

Thats off topic though. I think everyone has off days when they look in the mirror and feel like a piece of shit and days when they think they're the incredible hulk. In the end comments that people make are really helpful and motivating. I know that when i tell some of my friends they are looking bigger they get pumped up and work even harder, it helped me so i try and spread the good will a little bit.


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## Mudge (Nov 29, 2006)

rmcfar said:


> I think what i was referring to is not when your triceps are touching your lats but when your wrists are about a foot away from your hips at standing rest position.



A foot away? You must be huge because that has never happened to me. I'm a little immobilized if I am seriously pumped up, but nothing like that, and my back is my pride and joy.

Standing immediately next to Jay Cutler, I didn't notice him doing that either.


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## rmcfar (Nov 29, 2006)

haha no it was an exaduration, it seems like thats how far away some people hold they're arms when like you said even jay's arms arent like that.


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## AKIRA (Nov 29, 2006)

Witchblade said:


> Anyway, have you guys ever been criticised for 'walking macho'? Since I've gained some mass, my arms don't touch my body anymore in a rested state. I seriously don't do anything for that, but everyone thinks I'm showing off. It sucks really. Then again, I guess it's a compliment. Do you recognize that?



Not to hijack the thread here, but this does bring up a serious problem.

Now I know what imaginitive lat syndrome looks like and yes its pretty bad.  Jesus christ, is it fucking bad!

But I walk worse.  I do NOT walk macho, but I cant seem to walk even decently.  I looks like I take short steps and I slam my feet down when I walk.  Surely, I am not, but on video I do.  I fucking hate it.

I wouldnt even know where nor how to START walking normally.


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## gsxrK3 (Nov 29, 2006)

I walk like a freak with a big ass don't feel bad.  =/


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## Brachiisaurus (Nov 29, 2006)

JimSnow said:


> I look like Mike Mentzer in my bedroom mirror with overhead 100 watt light on.
> I realize this... and it's fun to play around.
> 
> I hate store mirrors... I look like Barney Fife, without the hair.
> ...





Yea sometimes I'll catch myself with really good light, and it'll make me feel good.


Other times, I'll see myself in the bathroom mirror, and I cry myself to sleep that night.


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## JimSnow (Nov 30, 2006)

_Walking Macho_... LOL

I "puff up" when this 21 year-old bobybuilder kid shows for work as I'm leaving.

I've seen him "eyeballing" me, measuring. He's actually very serious about this... getting more massive and much better developed than I.

Kind of a throughback to animal nature when men "postured" to display dominance to other males or viability to females?

Hey, I'm an old monkey... let me have fun while I still can!


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