# igf1 DES pinned IM + humalg Pre-workout



## Standard Donkey (Feb 15, 2013)

I've heard this is pretty sick, im just now starting to research DES and so far the reviews are pretty astounding.. can't believe i havent heard about this.



thoughts?


----------



## heckler7 (Feb 15, 2013)

i heard igf can promote growth of cancer cells which kinda scared me off. hows it working for ya


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 15, 2013)

heckler7 said:


> i heard igf can promote growth of cancer cells which kinda scared me off. hows it working for ya





havent done anything yet, this is the point of the thread, to collect thoughts


----------



## BlueJayMuscle (Feb 15, 2013)

Very expensive.. is it worth it? I guess I'll follow this and see what you think.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 15, 2013)

BlueJayMuscle said:


> Very expensive.. is it worth it? I guess I'll follow this and see what you think.




typical dose is 50mcg pinned bilaterally only pre-workout.. ergopep supposedly sells quite a des product at $24 a mg. if you use the typical dose and train 5x a week that's $12 a week... typical cycle is 4 on 4 off like humalog.


not that pricy IMO


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

well.. since no one wants to give me info/opinions on it, i guess i have no choice but to give it a shot _and let all of you know_! haha


will place an order tommorrow and will start a log as soon as it gets here




oh yeah, and it does speed up cancer, but anything that can cause cell proliferation will do that.. you just have to look at your genetics i suppose. Not a single case of cancer in my entire chain-smoking/alchoholic family


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> well.. since no one wants to give me info/opinions on it, i guess i have no choice but to give it a shot _and let all of you know_! haha
> 
> 
> will place an order tommorrow and will start a log as soon as it gets here
> ...



It actually causes cell differentiation..not proliferation.  It basically assigns new cells as muscle cells.  MGF causes proliferation.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> It actually causes cell differentiation..not proliferation.  It basically assigns new cells as muscle cells.  MGF causes proliferation.




well i guess that's that  


have u ever used DES before bro? if so, what'd u think?


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> well i guess that's that
> 
> 
> have u ever used DES before bro? if so, what'd u think?



Yes..have a fridge full..lol.  I'm pretty impressed with it.  I've been using 200mcgs split bilat preworkout. The pumps are killer.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

send me some



ive read that it's best to do a small warm up at the gym of the muscles ur going to pin, then pin em.. what say you to that? (thanks for your input btw)


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> send me some
> 
> 
> 
> ive read that it's best to do a small warm up at the gym of the muscles ur going to pin, then pin em.. what say you to that? (thanks for your input btw)



If you could do a log.. I could probably set something up with Labpe.

I've seen guys pin pre and intra workout.  I've never personally tried it to attest to it's effectiveness...but being that DES has such a short halflife, I would have to assume it would be very effective that way.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> If you could do a log.. I could probably set something up with Labpe.
> 
> I've seen guys pin pre and intra workout.  I've never personally tried it to attest to it's effectiveness...but being that DES has such a short halflife, I would have to assume it would be very effective that way.




yeah im definitely down to do a log bro, was gonna do one for the folks here combining it with Mike Arnold's humalog protocol.


if there's something you can do for me with Labpe let me know because im going to place an order with EP on monday if nothing happens by then


thanks a ton for your input btw


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

I'll get with Labpe now and let you know.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> I'll get with Labpe now and let you know.




sweet bro thanks a ton. im gunna get on this stuff ASAP one way or another


----------



## BlueJayMuscle (Feb 16, 2013)

Hell yeah. Hope this happens.

I am very down as well to try out DES. Looking into PEG-MGF front load then igf-1 LR3 soon


----------



## cottonmouth (Feb 16, 2013)

Ive been wanting to try some DES preworkout and mgf post, Ive heard and read this is supposed to be killer with some humulin r preworkout. Maybe my next slin cycle..


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

just had another "slinsane" workout, chest/shoulders/triceps following Mike Arnold's pre-workout humalog protocol + 10Iu peri-workout.
i am finding the additional peri-workout humalog causes me to go hypo once i get home and am eating my post workout meal (chicken and white rice), so i am adjusting my carb/protein intake to compensate.

But i had insane pump/endurance/recovery, and good strength considering i am on an AAS cruise ATM.


notes about insulin use: 

-is it dangerous? yes, but you have to do it completely wrong. That being said, other examples of things that are dangerous if done absolutely wrong include: driving, swimming, eating, climbing shit, lifting, etc..

-be sure to take potassium, as insulin lowers blood concentrations of potassium and can lead to a potentially fatal condition called hypoalkemia..


-carry glucose tabs with you wherever you go while insulin is active in your system.. it's just plain stupid not to.


-limit your cycles to 4 weeks on, 4 weeks off (just to be totally safe), and only do insulin if you are considerably lean to begin with.


-All things taken into consideration, your biggest fear regarding insulin usage should be getting fat..




Im not going to be taking anymore orals after i have exhausted my current stash (and fulfilled my obligation to steelgear). This will promote my overall health and wellbeing, and i am going to greatly reduce the amount of AAS I use, and the duration of my cycles. 

Insulin has been the best decision I have made, drug-wise (besides tren), and i am really looking forward to adding IGF1 DES to the mix.


----------



## juicespringsteen (Feb 16, 2013)

ive read about DES and listened to a few podcasts with professor filimanov as he talked about DES, the way it works, and the way it should be used. According to him, it is an incredible peptide, but he stated the only way he could see it being effective is if it is administered during your workout while muscle tissue is being damaged. It is an interesting podcast if u find the time to listen to it


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

juicespringsteen said:


> ive read about DES and listened to a few podcasts with professor filimanov as he talked about DES, the way it works, and the way it should be used. According to him, it is an incredible peptide, but he stated the only way he could see it being effective is if it is administered during your workout while muscle tissue is being damaged. It is an interesting podcast if u find the time to listen to it




thanks for your post bro! do you have a link to the podcast? if you do please post it here


----------



## juicespringsteen (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> thanks for your post bro! do you have a link to the podcast? if you do please post it here



yea i'll find it for you if i can. got it on my ipod so it shouldnt be hard to track down


----------



## juicespringsteen (Feb 16, 2013)

http://www.superhumanradio.com/components/com_podcast/media/mp3s/SHR_Show_714.mp3

give that link a try.. he gets into the DES discussion after the calf training and igf lr3 talk


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

juicespringsteen said:


> http://www.superhumanradio.com/components/com_podcast/media/mp3s/SHR_Show_714.mp3
> 
> give that link a try.. he gets into the DES discussion after the calf training and igf lr3 talk




you're the man brobro


----------



## longworthb (Feb 16, 2013)

Looking forward to the log. Always interested in different compounds etc


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

longworthb said:


> Looking forward to the log. Always interested in different compounds etc




yeee


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

juicespringsteen said:


> ive read about DES and listened to a few podcasts with professor filimanov as he talked about DES, the way it works, and the way it should be used. According to him, it is an incredible peptide, but he stated the only way he could see it being effective is if it is administered during your workout while muscle tissue is being damaged. It is an interesting podcast if u find the time to listen to it




I don't know that the IGF has to be introduced as the muscle is being damaged.. as much as after the damage has occurred.  MGF is released as a first responder to begin repairing the damaged muscles.  MGF causes cell proliferation, but needs IGF to differentiate (assign) the cells before they can begin to grow.  


Here's my favorite way to run a pep stack.  Just my opinion of what works best.

IGF Des Preworkout (within 10 min to training)
MGF 15-20 minutes post workout
IGF LR3 15-20 minutes after MGF

And of course you can always add in a GHRP/GHRH combo to kick things up a knotch.


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

And the above is just my personal opinion.  No medical degree for this guy.


----------



## theCaptn' (Feb 16, 2013)

IGF and slin sounds like the ultimate stack- subbed


----------



## D-Lats (Feb 16, 2013)

I want to see how this works for SD. I'm running hgh and I'd like to get back on the slin I also have a bunch of igf des and ghrp6 anyone have a protocol for that combo. Sorry about the thread jack homie


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

D-Lats said:


> I want to see how this works for SD. I'm running hgh and I'd like to get back on the slin I also have a bunch of igf des and ghrp6 anyone have a protocol for that combo. Sorry about the thread jack homie




I'm sure I could help set you up with a protocol.  Hit me up everything you have and we'll figure out the timing.


----------



## hypo_glycemic (Feb 16, 2013)

I'm in to see how this works for the OP .. SD!!


----------



## D-Lats (Feb 16, 2013)

Will do bro thanks!


----------



## HFO3 (Feb 16, 2013)

Interesting thread


----------



## Chrisotpherm (Feb 16, 2013)

D-Lats said:


> I want to see how this works for SD. I'm running hgh and I'd like to get back on the slin I also have a bunch of igf des and ghrp6 anyone have a protocol for that combo. Sorry about the thread jack homie



CJC/GHRP 100mcg 3 times a day has been the normal protocol by many but found these dosage to be worthless. Try 150-300mcg of CJC and 2-300 of ghrp and you see great benefits.  The most important pin is the one before bed.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

i was thinking something like this:

(Mike's insulin protocol + additional humalog peri-workout)

5 minutes into training (*200mcg IGF DES pinned IM bilaterally) *_focus will be on shoulders/arms/chest/traps lol_

immediately post training in bathroom (*200-400mcg MGF pinned into trained muscles*) _focus will be on shoulders/arms/chest/traps lol_

1 hour before bed, 10mg melatonin (for the sleepies and increased GH)

20 minutes before bed (*100-300mcg Ipamorelin) *for the sleepies and increased GH


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

im trying to stay away from the long-acting systemic stuff like PEG MGF and IGF1 LR3


don't want anything growing that i dont want growing.. ya know?


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> i was thinking something like this:
> 
> (Mike's insulin protocol + additional humalog peri-workout)
> 
> ...



Just keep in mind that the IGF will make you more insulin sensitive.. so you may wanna lower one or the other until you get a feel for how you respond.  Layout looks pretty good.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

ill get a little diabetic's bag so keep my preloaded Humalog, DES and MGF pins in, (with an ice pack of course) to take to the gym with me.


that will work to preserve the peptides right? IIRC, DES and MGF aren't extremely delicate like GH and LR3


----------



## juicespringsteen (Feb 16, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> I don't know that the IGF has to be introduced as the muscle is being damaged.. as much as after the damage has occurred.  MGF is released as a first responder to begin repairing the damaged muscles.  MGF causes cell proliferation, but needs IGF to differentiate (assign) the cells before they can begin to grow.
> 
> 
> Here's my favorite way to run a pep stack.  Just my opinion of what works best.
> ...



I agree with what you are saying Pitt. I was only giving filimanov's opinion on DES. i believe his reasoning was that DES would blunt your natural mgf response if administered post workout, but i cant remember what his reasoning was for why he wouldn't administer DES preworkout either; however, he did have a reason that made sense. According to him, intra workout was the only plausible way to use DES


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

think ill have to use 200-400mcg peg mgf on non workout days


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

juicespringsteen said:


> I agree with what you are saying Pitt. I was only giving filimanov's opinion on DES. i believe his reasoning was that DES would blunt your natural mgf response if administered post workout, but i cant remember what his reasoning was for why he wouldn't administer DES preworkout either; however, he did have a reason that made sense. According to him, intra workout was the only plausible way to use DES



Since they work off the same receptors...and Igf would beat out mgf for the receptor..but your mgf levels peak roughly 30 minutes post workout.  After that your good to go with IGF.

Again..just my opinion.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

the professor in the podcast said that DES binds best to muscles that have lactic acid building up in them


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 16, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> the professor in the podcast said that DES binds best to muscles that have lactic acid building up in them



Correct.  Since IGF is a natural response to muscle damage.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 16, 2013)

i think im going to just use the DES peri-workout and PEG MGF on off days at 2pm (about 200-400mcg)


i think this is the most cost-effective way, and more simple


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 17, 2013)

im going to lower my second dose of humalog to 6-8IU for this workout to see how things go. im only trying to cover the amount of carbs the protocol + my post wo meal prescribes me, not having to eat more..

cuz then ill get fat 

this DES seems to have a lot of promise, the big guys over at PM seem to love it


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 17, 2013)

Ok so today's workout was awesome

*
1arm BB rows *(with meadows handle) 4 plates (25lbs ea.) x 8 (hard squeeze and contraction at top of each rep, stretch at bottom)

*meadows Row *(angled body to target/emphasize rhomboids) 4 plates (25lbs ea.) x10

*Cable Low Row with rope *(40x20x5 squeeze to target middle/lower traps) *SS with BB Shrugs *(not going to do BB shrugs next time) The rows really hit my lower/middle traps, i really recommend trying these, but with low weight to really feel the contraction.

*Rack Deads *(2 inches above knee, trying to take emphasis off lower back and place it on traps) 405+4 chains (22.5lbs each)x3. DC stretch. more chains on the way from Elitefts, should be here before next back w/o

*2 pulldown variations *1 of them had independent handles, the other i did close grip supinated facing away from the machine for a great stretch (focused on stretch/contraction) DC stretch

*Banded hyperextensions, band behind head *3x failure, these killed my spinal erectors.. intense pump



insulin timing went like this:

Mike arnold's protocol + pinned an extra 8iu 1 hour after first pin, started going hypo right as i sat down to eat my post w/o meal, 7oz chicken cooked with 1 cup cooked white rice

will repeat post w/o meal (IE no fats) in 2.5-3  hours


did more DC stretch at home + foam rolled while my p/wo meal warmed up



yeeeee


----------



## BlueJayMuscle (Feb 17, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> Ok so today's workout was awesome
> 
> *
> 1arm BB rows *(with meadows handle) 4 plates (25lbs ea.) x 8 (hard squeeze and contraction at top of each rep, stretch at bottom)
> ...



Sick bro. Keep it goin. Kill it. Should I be lookin out for you on the ifbb stage soon?? Haha

Also what do you think of cerebrolysin? Looks too good to be true


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 17, 2013)

BlueJayMuscle said:


> Sick bro. Keep it goin. Kill it. Should I be lookin out for you on the ifbb stage soon?? Haha
> 
> Also what do you think of cerebrolysin? Looks too good to be true
> 
> ...






*Cerebrolysin* is a new and revolutionary drug 
which not treats the symptoms but also addresses the causes of alzhiemer?s 
disease to effectively treat this debilitating 
condition.

*Cerebrolysin* not only *improve the function and the 
quantity of neurons and brain transmitters*, cerebrolysin not only 
*decreases the rate at which brain cells die*, it?s known to block 
exitocins ? now believed to be one of the main causes of alzheimer disease. 
These excitocins enter the blood stream through the food that we eat, mainly MSG 
and sugar substitute aspartame present in our diet.

*Cerebrolysin* 
by blocking these exitocins not only *prevents damage*, but also appears to 
help *support and maintain neurons* including: serotonin, choline (related 
to Acetylcholine) and noradrenaline, thus treating and preventing the occurrence 
of alzhiemer?s disease.

As *cerebrolysin* (or CRB) appears to also 
*affect synaptic responses in the hippocampus* - the region of the brain 
*responsible for functions of memory*, cerebrolysin autism treatment has 
also been proven and studied in many of the clinical trials involving autistic 
and dyslexic patients. *In over 80 clinical trials with over 5000 patients 
with mild to moderate cases of the condition, using cerbrolysin was found to 
significantly improve cognitive powers.* Since cerebrolysin is derived 
from natural ingredient cerebrolysin side effects are from very few to 
nil.

Cerebrolysin dosage is about a 5ml ampoule injected either in the 
muscle or in the vein each day for 5 days, then repeated for a period of 4 
weeks. The cycle is repeated after a short break of two month treatment 
period.



looks interesting, might have to look into it for grad school lol


----------



## BlueJayMuscle (Feb 17, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> *Cerebrolysin* is a new and revolutionary drug
> which not treats the symptoms but also addresses the causes of alzhiemer?s
> disease to effectively treat this debilitating
> condition.
> ...



Exactly why I'm considering it. Limitless drug anybody?? I'd start at 1ml IM per day and observe effects but not go higher than 5ml per day


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## nspaletta (Feb 18, 2013)

Standard....just make sure the des you get is legit. American made peptide companies like southern and rui have great des but you pay the extra price for it. run it for 4 weeks on and 4 weeks off with igf as well to keep from creating antibodies for it. great product to use pre and post workout in my opinion and very effective.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 18, 2013)

nspaletta said:


> Standard....just make sure the des you get is legit. American made peptide companies like southern and rui have great des but you pay the extra price for it. run it for 4 weeks on and 4 weeks off with igf as well to keep from creating antibodies for it. great product to use pre and post workout in my opinion and very effective.



always a good call to get legit stuff..


ergopep is supposed to have a decent compound.. it's really cheap so i doubt it's completely legit, but hey.. if it makes training more fun then why not?


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 18, 2013)

BlueJayMuscle said:


> Sick bro. Keep it goin. Kill it. Should I be lookin out for you on the ifbb stage soon?? Haha
> 
> 
> 
> ...





lol even if i had the genes to be an IFBB pro, it's not the life i want to live.


anyways, crushed shoulders/arms in the gym today, Mike arnold's protocol + 11iu peri-workout humalog (i think im the only person who does peri-workout slin lmao).. 

my reasoning behind peri-workout humalog is this

Mike Arnold's protocol is like this

30 minutes pre-workout, pin 15iu Humalog and down first shake (fill body with nutrients as humalog hits)

1 hour later drink second shake (1st shot of humalog is peaking), take second shot and down second drink. second shot hits as second drink it downed

1 hour later drink 3rd shake (second shot of humalog is peaking, first is tapering down but still active)

1 hour later post workout meal (second shot of humalog is tapering down, but still active)

3 hours later, eat another fat free meal (humalog should be almost / completely worn off by now), but no sense in taking chances and eating a P/C/F meal

i dont think im exposing myself to insulin anymore than someone who is using humulin R would be.. using this method 5 days a week, 4 weeks on 4 off

using new methods to hit my triceps, they were killer.. can't wait to see what results they bring in time.


once again started going hypo as i sat down for my post-workout meal 1 hour post workout.. seems like i've timed everything perfectly... lol. hypo is unpleasant, but not nearly what most here have made it out to be


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 18, 2013)

think im gunna stay out of the peptide game for now..



these things just aren't priced accurately.. should literally be 10x what they are being sold for IMO, plus ive read that suppliers are putting insulin in their products so that their users get results..


not sure if that's true, but i do know for a fact these things can't be produced at the price they are being sold for..


so im sticking with Slin + AAS, for now at least


----------



## tinyshrek (Feb 18, 2013)

Just buy some rips or hyges


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 18, 2013)

tinyshrek said:


> Just buy some rips or hyges





maybe somewhere down the line when im more advanced/have more money.. slin is cheap, gear is cheap..


hgh is not


----------



## 5thou (Feb 19, 2013)

Well that sucks to hear about the DES. I am on my 2nd vial and have bought from two different sources. One source was like $85plus, the other was like $40. I hope I did not get screwed on either. I was pinning 100iu bi, 2hr post workout and I felt like I had a pretty good pump. Then the other day I did it 10min pre workout and I felt like the pumps were out of this world. Even today my legs were so thick and full after 3 sets of squats. I have been told it is best to pin 2 hrs post workout, but man the pumps are so much better pre....

 I feel like I would run into fake HGH if I went down that road that is why I wanted to try the peps first... Now I am just confused as hell.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 19, 2013)

5thou said:


> Well that sucks to hear about the DES. I am on my 2nd vial and have bought from two different sources. One source was like $85plus, the other was like $40. I hope I did not get screwed on either. I was pinning 100iu bi, 2hr post workout and I felt like I had a pretty good pump. Then the other day I did it 10min pre workout and I felt like the pumps were out of this world. Even today my legs were so thick and full after 3 sets of squats. I have been told it is best to pin 2 hrs post workout, but man the pumps are so much better pre....
> 
> I feel like I would run into fake HGH if I went down that road that is why I wanted to try the peps first... Now I am just confused as hell.




i might have to give DES a try.. from ergopep.


----------



## BlueJayMuscle (Feb 19, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> i might have to give DES a try.. from ergopep.



agreed


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 19, 2013)

BlueJayMuscle said:


> agreed




actually not going to go with ergopep, just saw a thread on another forum where former EP reps were talking about negative experiences with the company, it's products, and PH.

apparently there is a cloud of BS surrounding that place, think ill search around here.


if any supplier wants to hit me up with freebies ill log em


----------



## BlueJayMuscle (Feb 19, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> actually not going to go with ergopep, just saw a thread on another forum where former EP reps were talking about negative experiences with the company, it's products, and PH.
> 
> apparently there is a cloud of BS surrounding that place, think ill search around here.
> 
> ...



x2 for real though. Down for any logged peps


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 19, 2013)

tommorrow im going to pin my peri-workout humalog IM instead of Subq


doing this makes it hit way faster. Will be following mike arnold's protocol otherwise 



im also going to change my post workout meal protein source from chicken breast to egg whites


----------



## theCaptn' (Feb 19, 2013)

Nothing wrong with bunk peptides. Just think of the placebo effect


----------



## 5thou (Feb 20, 2013)

Can someone PM me so I can see if my source is legit for IGF-1 DES??


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 20, 2013)

5thou said:


> Can someone PM me so I can see if my source is legit for IGF-1 DES??




if it doesnt cost several hundred dollars per mg, it's not legit


----------



## 5thou (Feb 20, 2013)

WOW, that just makes me wonder about all the other peps!!


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 20, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> if it doesnt cost several hundred dollars per mg, it's not legit



And what makes you believe that?  I can provide the mass spec report that labpe does on every batch if you wanna see it.  They don't charge hundreds of dollars per mg.  Truth is.. the manufacturing used to be extremely limited...making the demand high.  Manufacturing has caught up to demand, and prices are an obvious reflection of that.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 20, 2013)

had another slinsane workout


a couple interesting notes


-Did mike arnold's protocol, this time with a hydrolyzed protein blend instead of Peptopro, the blend was 45% whey hydrosylate, 45% casein hydrosylate, and 10% glutamine peptides per serving

-the gylcerine monosterate tastes shitty, but wow pumpz!

-used karbolad instead of karbolyn for my intra workout shakes, it's half the price of karbolyn, and tastes shitty

-pinned my second dose IM instead of subq, into my bicep..

-decided im going to start doing 50mg of dbol pre-workout on training days that don't involve my lower back.. so this is 3x a week + liver support, got wicked pumps from the slin + dbol combo.

-no signs of hypo this time, not sure why this is.. perhaps the glutamine peptides are helping keep me out of it? I figured pinning the insulin IM would make it hit like a Mack truck.. does pinning IM mess up the insulin? because i havent read that :/ (i pinned it with a .5 inch slin pin, rubbed it, and flexed my bicep to get some extra blood flow, ive read this all helps with absorbtion)... or am i just somehow really insensitive after 2 weeks of 5x a week preworkout use? lol.. ill take my fasted BG tommorrow morning


very solid training session though, post workout meal in 10 minutes (egg whites and 1 cup cooked white rice)


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 20, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> And what makes you believe that?  I can provide the mass spec report that labpe does on every batch if you wanna see it.  They don't charge hundreds of dollars per mg.  Truth is.. the manufacturing used to be extremely limited...making the demand high.  Manufacturing has caught up to demand, and prices are an obvious reflection of that.




sorry about my blanket statement.. it's just what i've read/been told by a couple IFBB pros.. i suppose it makes sense though, that as supply increases, the price would go down.

my bad, knocked it before i tried it


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 20, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> sorry about my blanket statement.. it's just what i've read/been told by a couple IFBB pros.. i suppose it makes sense though, that as supply increases, the price would go down.
> 
> my bad, knocked it before i tried it



No worries.. I wasn't offended by it.. just disagreed with the notion.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 20, 2013)

i spoke too soon, holy fuck hypo


downed my post-workout rice and egg whites, sitting here with glucose tabs ready


EDIT: took one glucose tab (really trying to avoid sugar at all costs.. but whatever), feeling better already though i am completely covered in sweat.. damn..



i train with pretty serious intensity and i dont sweat, but wow hypo and i sweat buckets.. hungry as a mother fucker, i can really see how people get fat using insulin


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 20, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> No worries.. I wasn't offended by it.. just disagreed with the notion.



i may have to try DES/other peptides down the line, but as it is.. im getting great gains with what im doing, and im loving every moment of it


----------



## Pittsburgh63 (Feb 20, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> i may have to try DES/other peptides down the line, but as it is.. im getting great gains with what im doing, and im loving every moment of it



No doubt.  I usually use most of this stuff once gains start to stall.  IGF des, MGF, Peg MGF, Myo inhibitors...etc.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 20, 2013)

Pittsburgh63 said:


> No doubt.  I usually use most of this stuff once gains start to stall.  IGF des, MGF, Peg MGF, Myo inhibitors...etc.




if only i were a rep for Labpe


----------



## MattPorter (Feb 21, 2013)

DES igf-1 is my preferred igf variant.

Des-igf-1 pre workout bilaterally (100 mcg)  EOD

Next day GH + SLIN EOD

DES (short acting) always made more sense than Lr3 -- igf-1 floating around for 8-12 hrs seems like potential negative results waiting to occur.

-Matt


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 21, 2013)

MattPorter said:


> DES igf-1 is my preferred igf variant.
> 
> Des-igf-1 pre workout bilaterally (100 mcg)  EOD
> 
> ...




stop tempting me bro, really wanna try it but i dont know a solid source and dont wanna fork out cash for placebos


----------



## theCaptn' (Feb 21, 2013)

MattPorter said:


> DES igf-1 is my preferred igf variant.
> 
> Des-igf-1 pre workout bilaterally (100 mcg)  EOD
> 
> ...



Matt - what sort of negative results are you referring to?


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 21, 2013)

theCaptn' said:


> Matt - what sort of negative results are you referring to?





intestinal growth would be my guess.. lot of receptors there. not sure if "receptor" is the right word tho, kinda hypo at the moment lol


----------



## theCaptn' (Feb 21, 2013)

Standard Donkey said:


> intestinal growth would be my guess.. lot of receptors there. not sure if "receptor" is the right word tho, kinda hypo at the moment lol



I've just had 2 weeks off training and slin. Come in a few pounds heavier and still benching my max - stoked! 

Definately don't have that peri-WO recovery you get with slin.


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 21, 2013)

theCaptn' said:


> I've just had 2 weeks off training and slin. Come in a few pounds heavier and still benching my max - stoked!
> 
> Definately don't have that peri-WO recovery you get with slin.




yeah i figured recovery would decrease dramatically, will likely tone down my volume/frequency a bit while off of it even though ill be back on AAS


----------



## Standard Donkey (Feb 23, 2013)

had an amazing chest/shoulders/triceps training session today


decided to give DB floor presses a try, and all i have to say is, they are incredible! definitely going to be the staple in my chest training from now on. amazing isolation, and no strain on shoulders (don't have any shoulder injuries and im trying to stay that way). You can also place a slight arch in your back to give them a decline angle.

im focusing on a lot more decline pressing now (slight angle), and dips... as i feel, and have been told by numerous IFBB pros, that they are superior for developing your chest to it's greatest genetic shape and potential, even the so-called "upper chest"

also focusing on training my rear dets first, laterals second, and saving pressing (which so far has been "cage Pressing" (a la John Meadows) for last.. gotta hit those weak points hard if you want them to grow right?

hit some new movements for triceps as well which felt fantastic



decided to pin both of my humalog shots IM this time around, started feeling a bit hypo during my training session (first time this has happened) i would likely have been able to "hold out" until the next shake, but decided i wasnt going to let the quality of my workout suffer in order to avoid eating sugar.. so i popped a glucose tab that i keep in a ziploc bag in my waistband, and it brought me back instantly... which i found surprising... especially considering it was only 4 grams.

im really failing to understand the fear that surrounds insulin... but i suppose to each their own 


it's an excellent tool, and i mean _excellent_



that is all for now


----------

