# My Test Cycle Journal



## The Prototype (Oct 28, 2010)

Well gear arrived today just one day past schedule but it's here so thank you to my source. Did my first shot of Test E today. I was so nervous I shaked the entire time but all went well so far. A little soreness but I'm using heat pad for 15 minutes and massaging. My cycle will go as follows:

Test E 500 mg per week for 10 or 12 weeks depending in where at I'm at in Week 10. I truly don't want more than 20 lbs.  

Still waiting on Turanabol. I'll be doing four weeks at 40 mg per week probably starting in Week 2 and thru Week 5 if it arrives within the next week. Otherwise I might finish the cycle with the tbol.  

Arimidex Weeks 3-15 (assuming 12 week cycle) 0.5 mg eod.

Clomid for PCT 100/75/50/50 Weeks 16-19

I'd be happy to hear any feedback. First shot done!


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## Buzzard (Oct 28, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Well gear arrived today just one day past schedule but it's here so thank you to my source. Did my first shot of Test E today. I was so nervous I shaked the entire time but all went well so far. A little soreness but I'm using heat pad for 15 minutes and massaging. My cycle will go as follows:
> 
> I'd be happy to hear any feedback. First shot done!


 
Congrats on the first injection... Have you noticed any gains yet? 

Seriously though... Looking forward to hearing about your progress. Can you post up stats, etc...?


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## The Prototype (Oct 28, 2010)

5'10"
170 lbs
30 years old
Lifting since 21 years old so about nine years
10% bf

I'd be happy if I put on 20 lbs and kept 15 of it. As you can see in my name, I'm a golfer and being too bulky isn't too conducive for a golf swing. But at 170 lbs, I have a decent amount of muscle on me. Most people are pretty surprised to hear I only weight 170 lbs, which I guess is a good thing. But considering I weighed 130 lbs nine years ago when I started lifting, I guess I haven't done so bad. I think 170 lbs is pretty much my genetic max. In the past nine years, I never got past 173 lbs which I achieved while doing a cycle.


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## underscore (Oct 28, 2010)

Sounds like a good cycle bro. Make sure you take some progress shots before you start. I weighed about 182 when I started and used the same cycle you are and hit 195 after 8 weeks. Pretty ripped as well. You should like it.


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## The Prototype (Oct 29, 2010)

Surprisingly, injection site feels fine today. I was expecting some pain but I'm quite happy with the lack of it. My first injection ever was Durateston Sustanon from Brazil and I limped for a week and couldn't sleep b/c I could never get my leg in a good position. I'm using Norma Test E for those interested.


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## pyes (Oct 29, 2010)

sounds good, all your doses are spot on as with your timelines.


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## Del1964 (Oct 29, 2010)

Good luck!


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## The Prototype (Oct 29, 2010)

Tbol was received today. Will be doing 20 mg twice a day for first 25 days to jump start cycle. I'll keep you posted on any results. Does anyone know how long it takes for the tbol to kick in? I've heard up to 2.5 weeks.


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## The Prototype (Nov 1, 2010)

2nd shot done today. This time things went a lot smoother and I wasn't as nervous or shaking as badly. One thing I would suggest to others is to always change the pin after drawing the gear. I mistakenly ordered the wrong number of pins and will be 5-10 short. I read somewhere that it's not necessary to change the pin after drawing for amps as long as you keep the pin from hitting the bottom of the amp. The pin did tap the bottom of the amp a few times to get the last few drops so I didn't change the pin. I could definitely tell the pin wasn't as sharp or I may have tried to inject in some scar tissue b/c I had to push and push. Or it may have been that my glute wasn't totally relaxed, not really sure. I ended up having to pull out and inject in another spot. Overall, shot went very well but I'm finding it hard to twist around to aspirate and push in plunger. I'm considering maybe doing a quad or delt shot next time. I tried practicing on my delt but I can't seem to figure out a way to aspirate with one hand. Any suggestions? 

I've been on the Tbol for three days now and I don't know if it's just in my head but I feel harder and muscles feel fuller. I was taking two 10 mg pills in the AM and PM but it made me feel lethargic. I'm not sure if it's from the creatine I use or the Tbol so I've been taking it 4x a day, one pill at a time, to see how that works instead. That's all for now. Thanks for reading.


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## fredlabrute (Nov 1, 2010)

I don't know where you heard that,but always 2 pins for each AAS injections, a 18ga to draw the stuff out of the vial and another pin with a 23 to 25 ga to make the shot!I.E, i inject in gluteus muscle with a 23ga 1in pin but for delts i use a 25ga 5/8 in pin.


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## blazeftp (Nov 1, 2010)

Do an outer thigh shot.

You can see what your doing and control whats going on.


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## The Prototype (Nov 4, 2010)

Ok, Week 1 complete and I just did third pin. I'm starting to think maybe a quad shot will be better next time. I'm having a hard time turning around to aspirate. I've got 23g 1" pins on the way so quad may be the way to go next time.

Got on the scale yesterday and I'm up 2.5 lbs in one week. The tbol must be kicking in. My muscles feel fuller and always feel pumped. I did chest yesterday and I got insane pumps while doing incline dumbbell presses on my right shoulder. I thought I tore a muscle b/c the pain was so bad (I've torn my shoulder before while doing flys). So I just let my arm relax as though it was in a sling and after the pump went down, I finished my sets and workout. My strength is up as well. Not a ton but it's definitely noticeable. I'm pretty happy with my results so far and the Test hasn't even kicked in yet. Thank you to Anabolic Temple for supplying the Tbol. It arrived in 7 days. I wasn't sure about using the Tbol to kickstart the cycle but I'm glad I did.


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## Life (Nov 4, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I thought I tore a muscle b/c the pain was so bad (I've torn my shoulder before while doing flys). So I just let my arm relax as though it was in a sling and after the pump went down, I finished my sets and workout.



I know muscle recovery time should be a non-issue for you but keep in mind the tendon stress, it isn't going to grow along the same line as muscle growth will occur.


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## The Prototype (Nov 4, 2010)

This wasn't a tendon issue. I was just getting really big pumps which made it painful. Trust me, I've had tendon issues in the past. I very rarely lift to my max. I try to stay in the 70-85% range as far as weight b/c I was getting injured a lot in my earlier years of lifting. Appreciate the input though.


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## The Prototype (Nov 5, 2010)

Weighed myself today. Up 5 lbs after only one week. This tbol is good stuff. Test hasn't even kicked in. It's gonna be scary to see my gains in a few weeks. People are already noticing that I'm getting bigger.


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## underscore (Nov 5, 2010)

Just tell them that creatine has really kicked in. Don't tell a soul.


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## The Prototype (Nov 5, 2010)

underscore said:


> Just tell them that creatine has really kicked in. Don't tell a soul.



I don't plan on telling anyone, not even my gf. Deny, deny, deny


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## Buzzard (Nov 5, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I don't plan on telling anyone, not even my gf. Deny, deny, deny


 

I like to joke and just say "It's the juice!"

My buddy always says I'm on HGH and I joke with him telling him "I can't afford HGH."


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## underscore (Nov 5, 2010)

The juice is loose


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## The Prototype (Nov 6, 2010)

Update: Gained 6lbs but nipples are sensitive and face feels like it's getting bloated. Started Arimidex with 1 mg today then 0.5 mg eod thru PCT. I'll update on any differences from Adex.


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## Hell (Nov 6, 2010)

5lbs in a week...Damn!  Im going to be doing my first cycle like yours mainly minus the tbol.

Keep it up man!


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## The Prototype (Nov 6, 2010)

Hell said:


> 5lbs in a week...Damn!  Im going to be doing my first cycle like yours mainly minus the tbol.
> 
> Keep it up man!



Thank you. Just remember to eat, eat and eat.


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## OutWhey (Nov 6, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Weighed myself today. Up 5 lbs after only one week. This tbol is good stuff. Test hasn't even kicked in. It's gonna be scary to see my gains in a few weeks. People are already noticing that I'm getting bigger.


 Congrats bud! Sounds like your doing well. It may be a good idea to post you diet and training. Some guys may provide some professional insight which would assist in your results from the cycle.


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## The Prototype (Nov 6, 2010)

My diet is not scientific like some people. I'm generally a lean person and have a fast metabolism so I can get away with eating a lot of things without putting on fat, fortunately. My diet is rarely consistent as far as specific meals but I do eat about the same time everyday. 

7 am Breakfast. Usually two eggs, 2-3 strips of veggie bacon, 1-2 pieces of wheat toast and water or whole milk 

11 am muscle milk shake with whole milk

1 pm varies. Typically something high calorie but lean

4 pm snack deli sandwich or almonds, fruit

7 pm dinner. Varies. Typically high calorie such as steak or whatever the gf cooks

9-10 pm muscle milk shake whole milk

that's pretty much a quick run down. I basically try to keep my stomach full at all times. Gallon a water a day 

Supplements: 10 g glutamine; fish oil; gnc multi; one airborne for vit c; joint support, etc. 

I think that's it. I try not to think about it too much. Just eat every few hours with high protein but lean is my key. If it doesn't look good for you then I don't eat it.


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## The Prototype (Nov 6, 2010)

As far as training, I've done pretty much the same workout for over five years. Typically two body parts per day doing four sets of four exercises per part. Here's a general idea:

Monday: 4 sets Shoulders/2 sets tris
Tuesday: 4 sets back/2 set Bis
Wednesday: 4 sets chest
Thursday: rest
Friday: legs
Saturday: 4 sets tris/4 sets bis
Sunday: rest

I do abs everyday and stretch 15 min before every workout. I also ride my bike for cardio 3-5x a week. I know I can improve in some areas but I've used this set up for a long time and it works for me. I will switch out an exercise every few months to keep muscles shocked.


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## The Prototype (Nov 7, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> As far as training, I've done pretty much the same workout for over five years. Typically two body parts per day doing four sets of four exercises per part. Here's a general idea:
> 
> Monday: 4 sets Shoulders/2 sets tris
> Tuesday: 4 sets back/2 set Bis
> ...



The exercises were meant to say four exercises of four sets each not just four sets. I'd never grow if I only did four sets. I do four sets no matter what for each exercise.


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## The Prototype (Nov 7, 2010)

Update: Okay, nipples feel sensitive, especially when I get in and out of the shower and it itched a little today. And they are usually really hard (is that a sign of gyno?). It's starting to worry me so I'm taking 20 mg of Nolva until symptoms go away. I also started taking Arimidex yesterday at 1 mg and today 1 mg. Once symptoms go away, I'll run it at 0.5 mg eod unless symptoms come back b/c I only have 50, 1mg pills. Let me suggest to the novice users to buy a lot more AIs and PCT than you expect b/c you never know when you'll need more and it's not always easy to get really fast. Also, most sources have a minimum order so now I have to buy something else to fulfill the minimum order. I never thought I'd be gyno prone though b/c I always thought it was for people with higher body fat. I'm pretty lean and never had issues like this before. I really am starting to think my tbol is actually dbol b/c tbol is supposed to be very mild with little water retention and aromotization. Well I've put on 6 lbs in a little over a week already, I feel like I'm retaining water and I have mild signs of gyno. I'm considering dropping the tbol dose to 20 mg ed rather than the 40 mg I'm doing now. I'm hoping these symptoms go away once I stop taking the tbol and Test starts kicking in, probably in a week or two. I've taken Test before and never had gyno symptoms so I'm hoping I'll be okay.


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## brandon123 (Nov 7, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Tbol was received today. Will be doing 20 mg twice a day for first 25 days to jump start cycle. I'll keep you posted on any results. Does anyone know how long it takes for the tbol to kick in? I've heard up to 2.5 weeks.


 took me just a week to notice, but im sure you know by now


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## brandon123 (Nov 7, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> My diet is not scientific like some people. I'm generally a lean person and have a fast metabolism so I can get away with eating a lot of things without putting on fat, fortunately. My diet is rarely consistent as far as specific meals but I do eat about the same time everyday.


When you start adding mass don't forget to adjust you calories. because your original amount won't suffice for the new amount of muscle that you have to feed.  so you have to feed your original muscle, the new muscle mass, and your trying to gain more new muscle mass.  so EAT EAT EAT.  otherwise at week at your goin to plateau.  and plateau on cycle means your not eating enough.



rippedgolfer said:


> I've taken Test before and never had gyno symptoms so I'm hoping I'll be okay.


If you caught it fast enought then you will be ok.  Its not a problem to get rid of gyno symptoms.  But it is hard to get rid of established gyno, if not impossible (without surgery)


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## The Prototype (Nov 7, 2010)

I'm going to pin my quad tomorrow which is a virgin muscle. I've been doing a lot of reading and everyone says a virgin muscle always causes pain. It's starting to worry me since my first injection about eight years ago had me hobbling for a week but that was Sust which is known for pain. Am I worrying about nothing? I'll be injecting 1ml of Norma Test E. Hoping this goes well bc it's getting really hard to pin my glutes now.


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## brandon123 (Nov 7, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I'm going to pin my quad tomorrow which is a virgin muscle. I've been doing a lot of reading and everyone says a virgin muscle always causes pain. It's starting to worry me since my first injection about eight years ago had me hobbling for a week but that was Sust which is known for pain. Am I worrying about nothing? I'll be injecting 1ml of Norma Test E. Hoping this goes well bc it's getting really hard to pin my glutes now.


 hahaha. of course its going to be sore.  But might be a little sore to me, may be a day off of work in bed to you.   Just depends on your tolerance.  When i inject a virgin mucsle it feels like someone punched the crap out of that leg.  Just gotta walk it off


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## BigBoiH (Nov 7, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Thank you to Anabolic Temple for supplying the Tbol. It arrived in 7 days.


Enjoy! Glad you got it in time.


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## The Prototype (Nov 8, 2010)

brandon123 said:


> hahaha. of course its going to be sore.  But might be a little sore to me, may be a day off of work in bed to you.   Just depends on your tolerance.  When i inject a virgin mucsle it feels like someone punched the crap out of that leg.  Just gotta walk it off



You are a very knowledgeable person. Good to have you on the forum. I've seen you around quite a bit and you always give very good advice. As far as my quad shot, all went well except while changing the needle tip, I dropped the barrel. I wiped it off with an alcohol swab and went on as usual. Quad was so much easier to inject but I kinda have a charlie horse now. I've been massaging it but it's nothing anyone can't handle. I guess we'll see if it gets better or worse in the next day or so. Also, a half inch doesn't sound like much but you'd be surprised when you're pushing that pin in, how much of a difference a half inch makes. The one inch pin was a lot better than the one and a half inch and it even looks a lot smaller although only being a half inch. I generally never feel the oil going in but this time I could actually feel it. Probably b/c of a virgin pale white muscle . Got a question on aspirating. How far do you need to pull out? Everytime I aspirate, it doesn't do anything. I guess that might be a good thing. Also, there's always a little oil left in the tip of the barrel. Is that typical? It's not a whole lot but enough to make me think I'm wasting some but I've pushed the plunger in the whole way and it won't come out unless I manually pull it out. Anyone else experience this?

As far as the gyno issue, nipples feel a little less sensitive and aren't itchy anymore. I think the Nolva took care of the gyno. I'm going to take one more 20 mg pill today then discontinue and continue on with the Arimidex at 0.5 mg eod unless symptoms creep back. Overall, almost two weeks into it, things are going good. Other than the minor gyno issue, I haven't experienced any other sides that I've noticed. Libido is up some. I'm going to weigh myself today and see where I'm at. As of Saturday (11/6/10), I was up 6 lbs. Strength was way up on Saturday while doing bis and tris. I'm expecting good things today in the gym. Today is shoulder day but I'm going to try to take it easy and not push too hard b/c of the shoulder issues I've been experiencing. That's all for now.


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## underscore (Nov 8, 2010)

The pain in your quad will get worse over the next day or two. Then it will rapidly get better. usually takes like 2-3 days to be back to normal for me.   When you dropped the barrel it didn't have the pin exposed on it right?   When you aspirate you need to pull it back far enough so that you see air bubbles in the barrel. If you don't see this, then you are not pulling back far enough.   The left over oil is the pin is normal. I just consider it "wasted". But others might try to save it.   Glad to hear the nips are clearing up.


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## The Prototype (Nov 8, 2010)

underscore said:


> The pain in your quad will get worse over the next day or two. Then it will rapidly get better. usually takes like 2-3 days to be back to normal for me.   When you dropped the barrel it didn't have the pin exposed on it right?   When you aspirate you need to pull it back far enough so that you see air bubbles in the barrel. If you don't see this, then you are not pulling back far enough.   The left over oil is the pin is normal. I just consider it "wasted". But others might try to save it.   Glad to hear the nips are clearing up.



No, the pin wasn't on the barrel when I dropped it. I was in the process of changing the pin when I dropped it. But it didn't have any dirt or anything on it and I just wiped it with an alcohol swab so hopefully that was enough to keep it sterile.

Weighed myself today and I'm still at 176 lbs. which is an increase of 6 lbs. I was growing so fast, I thought I'd see some increase in weight over the past two days so I was kinda disappointed. Strength is up "some" but not great. I'm sure it'll be a lot more noticeable once the Test kicks in within the next week or two.


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## brandon123 (Nov 8, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> You are a very knowledgeable person. Good to have you on the forum. I've seen you around quite a bit and you always give very good advice. As far as my quad shot, all went well except while changing the needle tip, I dropped the barrel. I wiped it off with an alcohol swab and went on as usual. Quad was so much easier to inject but I kinda have a charlie horse now. I've been massaging it but it's nothing anyone can't handle. I guess we'll see if it gets better or worse in the next day or so. Also, a half inch doesn't sound like much but you'd be surprised when you're pushing that pin in, how much of a difference a half inch makes. The one inch pin was a lot better than the one and a half inch and it even looks a lot smaller although only being a half inch. I generally never feel the oil going in but this time I could actually feel it. Probably b/c of a virgin pale white muscle . Got a question on aspirating. How far do you need to pull out? Everytime I aspirate, it doesn't do anything. I guess that might be a good thing. Also, there's always a little oil left in the tip of the barrel. Is that typical? It's not a whole lot but enough to make me think I'm wasting some but I've pushed the plunger in the whole way and it won't come out unless I manually pull it out. Anyone else experience this?
> 
> As far as the gyno issue, nipples feel a little less sensitive and aren't itchy anymore. I think the Nolva took care of the gyno. I'm going to take one more 20 mg pill today then discontinue and continue on with the Arimidex at 0.5 mg eod unless symptoms creep back. Overall, almost two weeks into it, things are going good. Other than the minor gyno issue, I haven't experienced any other sides that I've noticed. Libido is up some. I'm going to weigh myself today and see where I'm at. As of Saturday (11/6/10), I was up 6 lbs. Strength was way up on Saturday while doing bis and tris. I'm expecting good things today in the gym. Today is shoulder day but I'm going to try to take it easy and not push too hard b/c of the shoulder issues I've been experiencing. That's all for now.


 THank you very much for the compliment.  Glad to hear your gyno is starting to fade away.  I know it can be a spooky thing.  If you are pushing the plunger all the way down, then the only oil that should be left is whatevers inside the needle.  When your aspirating and can't pull back on the plunger, don't worry, your in a muscle.  There are times when i can't pull back on it and see those little bubbles.   But always make sure to look for blood.  injecting into a vein is not fun.  I've passed through one before and got a little in it,  broke out into a pouring sweat in a matter of seconds. got a little dizzy and hot as hell.


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## suprfast (Nov 8, 2010)

Looks interesting, subscribed.


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## The Prototype (Nov 8, 2010)

brandon123 said:


> THank you very much for the compliment.  Glad to hear your gyno is starting to fade away.  I know it can be a spooky thing.  If you are pushing the plunger all the way down, then the only oil that should be left is whatevers inside the needle.  When your aspirating and can't pull back on the plunger, don't worry, your in a muscle.  There are times when i can't pull back on it and see those little bubbles.   But always make sure to look for blood.  injecting into a vein is not fun.  I've passed through one before and got a little in it,  broke out into a pouring sweat in a matter of seconds. got a little dizzy and hot as hell.



The "wasted" oil is at the tip of the barrel where the pin connects to the barrel. It's not much and probably nothing to worry about. I'll take a pic next time and post it so you can see what I'm talking about.


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## The Prototype (Nov 9, 2010)

Update: This may sound unusual and maybe not possible but I'm pretty certain the Test has kicked in. It's only been 13 days since my first shot but workouts are getting aggressive and my hormones feel like they're changing. My testicles have shrank a little and without getting too graphic, there was very little "product" after sexual relations with my girlfriend today. Is this even possible for the Test to be kicking in, in such a short period of time?

My quad shot yesterday has held up very well with little pain. I thought for sure I would be sore and limping today but its just a little sensitive but nothing severe. I did use a heat pad 2-3 times yesterday for 10-15 minutes at a time, massaged the crap out of the area, stretched and rode my bike to keep area moving. It seemed to work so far.

For some reason my kidney area (left side) is kinda bothering me. It may be nothing but do you guys think it would be a good idea to get some kind of liver/kidney support? And if so, what do you guys recommend?

My workout in the gym today was awesome. It's been the best workout since my first shot almost two weeks ago. Getting really good pumps and strength is going up. I took the advice someone gave me and purchased some Taurine for what I thought was pain from tremendous pumps in my right shoulder. I didn't have any pain in the shoulder today during my back and bi workout. I'm not sure if that's b/c of the Taurine. I guess we will see how it goes when I do chest tomorrow. That's usually when it's the worst. I'll update you guys on that.


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## paolo584 (Nov 9, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> The "wasted" oil is at the tip of the barrel where the pin connects to the barrel. It's not much and probably nothing to worry about. I'll take a pic next time and post it so you can see what I'm talking about.


 
i know what your talking about. Dont even worry about that.


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## underscore (Nov 9, 2010)

I would pickup some Liv 52 on amazon. The lack of product and shrinkage sounds about right on time. At least you know your test is good.


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## The Prototype (Nov 9, 2010)

Do you guys think I should discontinue the tbol since the Test is believed to be kicking in? I got some milk thistle for the liver. Started taking it today. I still have a little less than two weeks left on the tbol but liver and kidney issues scare the crap out of me.


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## ROID (Nov 9, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Do you guys think I should discontinue the tbol since the Test is believed to be kicking in? I got some milk thistle for the liver. Started taking it today. I still have a little less than two weeks left on the tbol but liver and kidney issues scare the crap out of me.




finish it. Nothing to be worried about. 

You aren't going to have liver issues or kidney problems at the dose you taking in such a short time.

Unless you want to save it for another cycle later on.


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## The Prototype (Nov 11, 2010)

Update: Pin #5 done today. While cracking the amp, I friggin smashed the entire amp in my hand so now I have a wasted amp. Good thing is I ordered an extra one and will have four extra if I decide to only run 10 weeks rather than 12. The pain from Pin #4 (first quad pin - virgin muscle) is all gone and overall it wasn't bad at all. I noticed after my pin today that I was dangerously close to a vein or may have gone thru one. But I aspirated and everything was fine. I'm writing this now. Otherwise, I'd probably be on the ground flopping like a fish.

I decided to drop the Tbol as of yesterday and maybe use for a future cycle since the Test appears to be kicked in. Plus, the Tbol just made me feel funny. I've been seeing pretty good gains thus far. My gf is always commenting about me getting bigger and eating like a maniac. As of yesterday, I was up 6 lbs in two weeks. I put on the 6 lbs in the first week but haven't seen an increase in weight in the last 4-7 days.

My workouts in the gym have been very good. Getting stronger and more aggressive in the gym. I typically bench 245 x 2 (I know, I'm weak). I got 245 x 6 yesterday which is a personal best. All exercises seem to be up but I try not to work out near my max due to tendon/joint issues. My shoulder was bothering me again yesterday. I noticed it only bothers me while doing incline dumbbell presses. I even tried just bringing the weight down about 50-60% of the way down but it still hurts my shoulder. And I noticed it ONLY hurts while doing inclines. Doesn't bother me a bit on flat bench, which I find odd. So I'm going to try doing the Hammer machine for inclines. If that doesn't work, I might have to do away with inclines altogether rather than risking getting injured. That's all...thanks for reading


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## rockhardly (Nov 11, 2010)

I developed the same kinda shoulder pain from doing very heavy inclines w/o a spotter.  I think I strained something laying back and trying to get the DB's up into position.  It hurt for along time on any flat, incline and vertical presses.  I found that the pain was greatly reduced by squeezing my scapulae together before mounting the weight and focused on keeping tight delts even after lockout.  Also, keeping my elbows from flaring out helped some too.


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## The Prototype (Nov 13, 2010)

Update: Strength is going thru the roof. Did tris today and was doing the whole stack at 10 reps. Everything feels really light. I just don't think this is sustainable even with a really good pct and diet after cycle. Weight seems to be at a stand still at 177 lbs, 7 lbs up since I started. I've noticed I've been a lot hungrier and I'm trying to down as many calories as possible right now but I'm eating 5-6 times a day with two shakes so I'm taking in close to 8 meals a day. I eat basically every 2-3 hours a day. 

I'm pretty certain I went thru a vein last shot but the pain was easily tolerable and I'm sure the pain will get better each and every shot, especially since my quads are virgin muscles. But I do enjoy the quad shot a lot better than glutes just b/c it's hard to turn where conversely I see everything with the quad and it makes for an easier pin. 

I think I've been showing signs of gyno. Nipples are really sensitive and always hard. They're not itchy or red. I stopped the nolva last week but started again three days ago. Taking 40 mg a day right now with 1 mg armex. Once signs of gyno go away, I'll stop nolva and go with .5 mg ed of armex. Other than the minimal gyno signs I haven't noticed any other side effects. I'm in Week 3 of my cycle and I could tell the Test has been working for at least a week now. Pretty surprising it kicked in so quickly. Maybe it's b/c I'm using pharm grade? Not really sure but it's def working. I've been off the tbol for 3-4 days now and haven't noticed any difference. My testes are somewhat smaller but not considerably. I hear they get down to the size of raisins in some cases. Overall, pretty happy with the gear I got and results in just 2-3 weeks. I think it'll only get better from here. Thx for reading


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## underscore (Nov 13, 2010)

Sounds like its going well. You don't want to be on nolva too long during your cycle has it can hinder your gains.


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## Hell (Nov 13, 2010)

Hell yea man!!


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## The Prototype (Nov 15, 2010)

Update: Okay...I need to be more careful while cracking amps. I friggin smashed another one while cracking it open so now I'm left with 11.5 weeks of Test E or will have a few extra if I do 10 weeks. Not sure at this point. I originally figured I would do 12 weeks but gains were really good starting off so I thought I'd shorten it to 10 weeks but now gains have kinda leveled off as far as weight so I might go back to 12 or 11.5. I also have four Sust amps that expired in 2006 but I hear I can use them as they probably didn't go bad as they were stored in room temp this entire time. I'd rather not use them though b/c it hurts like a bitch. Had some setbacks the past few days. Been pretty sick and just chilled around the house and took it easy. Diet probably wasn't where it should be. Hoping this week will be better.


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## Life (Nov 15, 2010)

Buy an amp breaker man. $10 shipped. Totally worth it.


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## The Prototype (Nov 15, 2010)

Life said:


> Buy an amp breaker man. $10 shipped. Totally worth it.



You know where I can find one? I googled it but all I get are electrical stuff.


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## rockhardly (Nov 15, 2010)

Can't you just file around the neck of the amp?


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## underscore (Nov 15, 2010)

You can get an opener from gpz services. Google it.


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## The Prototype (Nov 17, 2010)

underscore said:


> You can get an opener from gpz services. Google it.



Got it ordered and on the way. Thanks a lot Underscore. You've been a huge help this cycle. I'd rep you but I think I've already given you too many and I need to spread it out, so they say.


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## underscore (Nov 17, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Got it ordered and on the way. Thanks a lot Underscore. You've been a huge help this cycle. I'd rep you but I think I've already given you too many and I need to spread it out, so they say.



No problem bro. Glad its going smoothly.


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## The Prototype (Nov 18, 2010)

Finished Pin #7 today. I don't know why but I have to prick several times when doing my left quad. I think I tense up and tighten the muscles so it's harder to push in. I had to pull out three times and reinsert this morning. Also, just a suggestion, but when you are getting all the air bubbles out, let a small drop of oil fall down the pin. This helps lubricate the pin and helps it insert so much easier. I forgot to do that today, and didn't realize till afterwards but I did notice it was a lot harder to insert the pin.

I've just finished up Week 3 and the test seems to be in full effect. I'm up 9 lbs in 3 weeks. But I was in my work clothes with shoes and on a different scale so I'm not 100% sure if I'll weigh the same on the gym scale where I typically weigh myself. But overall, I look bigger (clothes are tighter), I'm a lot stronger and overall sense of well-being is very good. No side effects (knock on wood) noticed as of yet. I think I am a little more aggressive, at least mentally, but haven't acted on anything yet. My testes have shrunken more as well. They're probably at about 35% of their regular size. I decided to go without HCG this time. I may use it next time.

Strength is going thru the roof. I did 245 x 8 the other day and may have gotten more if I had a spot. My PB before that was 245 x 2. Sad to say but I don't do squats or deadlifts? Why? Because about 8 years ago, I herniated a disk in my back while doing squats and my back is still messed up from that incident. So basically, any movement I do, my lower back has to be stable or I'll be in a lot of pain for a few days. I do hack squats, leg extensions, etc. for legs which is enough for me. But good mornings, deadlifts and squats are out of the question. I can't even do bent over rows or rows on the machine. But strength is crazy right now. I just can't see how this can be sustained post cycle with just normal test running thru my body. Do you guys see a big decrease in strength even after a good PCT or do you keep most of your strength?

Just ordered 30 more amps of Norma Test E and a bunch of ancillaries.  I also received my amp opener today. I've been having to use 1 mg of arimidex ED b/c of gyno issues. I'll run  out before cycle ends if this continues so I figured I'd buy more  arimidex and pick up a second cycle while I'm at it. I really like this Norma Test and now that I purchased an amp opener (thanks Underscore), I shouldn't be smashing anymore amps in my hand. I've already wasted 2 mls this cycle! Next cycle will probably be Test E again at 500 mg a week but I may add some dbol or winny or anavar. Not 100% sure yet but that's still a long ways away. I'm shying away from the winny b/c I hear it's the worst on male pattern baldness. Can anyone confirm this? I used it before and never had any issues except a little bit of sore joints. Lastly, I have about 50, 10 mg tbol tabs left. I think I may throw this back in the mix after my last shot until PCT to tighten up some. You guys think that's okay or should I do it while I'm still pinning Test, or should I save for another cycle? I figured the two weeks from last pin to PCT would be a good time b/c I got right at about a 2 weeks supply and since the test will still be in my system. Thanks for reading. Sorry for rambling so much!


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## SloppyJ (Nov 18, 2010)

Hey man wanted to follow along. I have the same question about the dbol usage before pct. Keep us updated. I'm excited to get mine started.


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## The Prototype (Nov 23, 2010)

Update: I guess it's about time for an update. Just did my eighth pin yesterday and getting ready to wrap up Week 4. Quad pins are going really easy now with no soreness at all. Currently up 7-9 lbs depending on the scale and time of day I weigh myself but I can definitely tell I've gotten bigger. Not really retaining any water, probably b/c I'm taking 1 mg of adex a day. I felt like I was retaining some water a few weeks ago while on tbol. Strength is way up as well.

So far some sides I've noticed is my face broke out a couple of times with acne in small patches. Skin feels really oily all day and I've been showering 3x a day. Very little back acne so far. Maybe I'm being nervous but hair seems a little thinner but it may be just in my head. Blood pressure went way up but I started taking CO-Q10 and Hawthorne. I'll get it checked again soon. Feel a little more aggressive and irritable.

Right shoulder is still giving me problems but only on inclines so I skipped them this week. Since I'll have four days off the gym, I figured it would be a good time to take it easy and let it heal. I can do flat bench, hammer machine, and flys with no issues. I think I injured it by going too low on incline dumbbell presses and probably injured something. It's not serious so I've been able to work around it. That's all for now.


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## jstnelson2006 (Nov 23, 2010)

Did you take any before pictures? I'd like to see some good before/after pics on just a test cycle. I've been following your log. Keep up the good work : )


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## SloppyJ (Nov 23, 2010)

Yes. I would like some pics too. no homo.

But I'm more intrested in how much i'm going to blow up on the dbol. I guess you took a bunch of AI though.


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Nov 25, 2010)

Nice log bro. My first 2011 cycle is is going to be quite similar to yours. I'm subbed.

I feel your pain with your shoulders. I hurt mine doing inclines as well, and it put my out of pressing for a week. Laying off the inclines did the trick.


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

Photo of about Week 4. I don't think I have any pre-cycle photos but if I come across some, I'll post them so you can see any difference.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 6, 2010)

Looking good man. You're farther in than week 4 though right?


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Looking good man. You're farther in than week 4 though right?



Yes currently wrapping up Week 5. Weighed myself today and I'm at 181.5 lbs so I'm up 11.5 lbs. I also got a personal best on bench today. Did 285 x 6 and probably could have gotten a few more. Previous best was 245 x 2. I attribute the increase in bench to a few things. I've been doing no more than 6 reps to get my bench up. This helps as my muscles aren't as fatigued as I get into the later sets. I also started doing close grip bench, which I hear is good for mass and increasing your bench. I also ate a whole pot of pasta this weekend so that may have contributed to some of the weight gain. I'll update my journal soon to share my progress.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 6, 2010)

Awesome! Congrats. I hope to have the same results. I'm sitting here twiddling my thumbs waiting until I can start. I remember reading that when you quit with the dbol you kind of lost the intensity. Is that picking back up yet? And are you going to finish out with any other compounds like you were talking about? I'm thinking of trying some winny at the end of mine.


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

I was doing tbol not dbol. I started taking it again about 4-5 days ago but I only have about another 4-5 days supply so the effects won't be for long. I was considering finishing up with anavar or super dmz but I probably will skip them. I've done winny in the past but I didn't stack it with anything. I put on about 10 lbs and got really hard. Only thing that worries me about winny is that it's hard on your hair line. I didn't know that when I used it.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 6, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I was doing tbol not dbol. I started taking it again about 4-5 days ago but I only have about another 4-5 days supply so the effects won't be for long. I was considering finishing up with anavar or super dmz but I probably will skip them. I've done winny in the past but I didn't stack it with anything. I put on about 10 lbs and got really hard. Only thing that worries me about winny is that it's hard on your hair line. I didn't know that when I used it.


 

Ohh well that's my bad I thought you were on the dbol. I've heard great things about the winny from a friend and I don't have hair problems in my family. The achy joints has got me on the fence though. 

BTW, how are your injects going? And the gyno?


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Ohh well that's my bad I thought you were on the dbol. I've heard great things about the winny from a friend and I don't have hair problems in my family. The achy joints has got me on the fence though.
> 
> BTW, how are your injects going? And the gyno?



You know, I never thought I had hair issues myself. I've always had a full head of hair which was really thick. I did the winny about five years ago so I was 25 at that time and I had no issues. But I swear my hair has been falling out this cycle on the Test but I'm 30 now. I'm finding hair everywhere. Not trying to scare you, just my experience. But I liked the winny, just use something for your joints. Something OTC should be fine.

Injections are going really good. I have nearly zero pain or discomfort and I don't even use a heat pad anymore. First few suck but not bad at all and after that it's no prob at all. I recommend quad injections. It's ten times easier than the glute. You can see everything you're doing and have full use of both hands. I had a hard time turning around when doing glutes.

I think the tbol was causing the gyno issues. I started getting itchy nips again once I resumed the tbol but it went away when I stopped it a few weeks ago. I only have a few days left so I'm going to take nolva and my usual dose of adex until I discontinue the tbol. I like the tbol though. Makes your muscles feel fuller and pumped all the time.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 6, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> You know, I never thought I had hair issues myself. I've always had a full head of hair which was really thick. I did the winny about five years ago so I was 25 at that time and I had no issues. But I swear my hair has been falling out this cycle on the Test but I'm 30 now. I'm finding hair everywhere. Not trying to scare you, just my experience. But I liked the winny, just use something for your joints. Something OTC should be fine.
> 
> Injections are going really good. I have nearly zero pain or discomfort and I don't even use a heat pad anymore. First few suck but not bad at all and after that it's no prob at all. I recommend quad injections. It's ten times easier than the glute. You can see everything you're doing and have full use of both hands. I had a hard time turning around when doing glutes.
> 
> I think the tbol was causing the gyno issues. I started getting itchy nips again once I resumed the tbol but it went away when I stopped it a few weeks ago. I only have a few days left so I'm going to take nolva and my usual dose of adex until I discontinue the tbol. I like the tbol though. Makes your muscles feel fuller and pumped all the time.


 


Well everyone on both sides of my family has full heads of hair so hopefully i'll be okay. If not ill shave it all off! I was actually going to do a quad inject the first time. Not really sure where though. Some say up high but my biggest muscle mass is right in the middle outside. I got some 25g 1" for quads and i'll have my buddy do glutes for me if I can't reach. 

I wanted to stick with the basics and go with the dbol for the first run. Plus i've seen/heard so many good things about it I am very curious. I've only seen smaller guys (160lb~) run the dbol but they looked good. I'm curious as what it will do to me. 

Keep us up to date on your log. I enjoy reading it. Everytime I read it I just want to check my order status haha.


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

I do mine on the outer thigh probably a little higher than the halfway point from my knee to my hip. Check out spotinjections.com. They have pics for illustration.


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## Caretaker (Dec 6, 2010)

I shoot high outside thigh and it seems to work best for me.


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## Life (Dec 6, 2010)

I do the same as ripped but found a 1.5" hurts less (Not injecting, after a few days) when I do inject there.


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

Life said:


> I do the same as ripped but found a 1.5" hurts less (Not injecting, after a few days) when I do inject there.



Man 1.5" in the quad is brave. I use 1". I really don't like using the 1.5" but it works best for the glutes, for me.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 6, 2010)

Yeah 1.5 is crazy for glutes. I looked at my pins the other day and that damn 1.5" looks pretty nasty.


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## Life (Dec 6, 2010)

Dude I'm telling you 1.5" in the quads hurts less. I don't know why. Also do the 1.5" in the glutes and never get any pain, just a little soreness. Maybe I'm just superman though, who knows.


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## Life (Dec 6, 2010)

You guys are damn jinxes. Soon as I posted that I went to pin and hit a nerve. Never took a pin out so fast.


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

Lol... Sorry bro. You pin the glute or quad?


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## Life (Dec 6, 2010)

Glute. I don't pin quad unless its some time of ED or EOD injection. Bio availability is higher when you pin glute so I wanna get my moneys worth even though its more annoying to pin compared to quads.


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## The Prototype (Dec 6, 2010)

I read a study on that. For me, it's worth the small difference to pin the quad. I don't think I'll ever go back to glutes unless I need to do ed or eod.


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## Life (Dec 6, 2010)

Have you tried pinning while you lay on the bed? That helps a lot of people with glute injections.


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## bknoxx (Dec 6, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Photo of about Week 4. I don't think I have any pre-cycle photos but if I come across some, I'll post them so you can see any difference.




looking good bro keep it up ...


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## Anabolik (Dec 7, 2010)

Life said:


> Have you tried pinning while you lay on the bed? That helps a lot of people with glute injections.


 

Is that true? How do you do that unless you have someone else do it?  I usually pin delts and quads but reading that gets me curious.


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## The Prototype (Dec 7, 2010)

Life said:


> Have you tried pinning while you lay on the bed? That helps a lot of people with glute injections.



I do mine in my office so I don't have that option but good idea.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 7, 2010)

Heard some say that they sit on the toliet.


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## The Prototype (Dec 8, 2010)

You guys have any idea based on the pic I posted above what by bf is about? I had it checked a few years ago with calibers and the lady told me about 8% but no more than 9%. But I was about 20 lbs lighter than. My abs don't show as much back than so I'm guesstimate it around 10-12% but probably toward the higher end.


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## The Prototype (Dec 8, 2010)

Just ordered some super dmz. Heavyiron got me intrigued. I'm wrapping up Week 6 today. If I receive within the next week, I'll start it asap thru the end of my cycle. I've decided to do 12 weeks. I've kinda been back and forth on 10 or 12 weeks but this will give me some time to experiment with the super dmz. I'll keep you all updated bc I know there's a lot of people interested in this product.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 8, 2010)

Whats up with the super-dmz? Is that what you are going to use to end it with? I'm still on the fence. 

Sorry man no idea on the BF% we're close though so I want to know. There isn't a legit place to go get checked around here.


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## Life (Dec 8, 2010)

ripped I'd definitely have a good liver support program planned out for after your cycle. With that DMZ you'll have been pretty hard on it.


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## The Prototype (Dec 8, 2010)

The trainers at your gym can test it. They usually have the calipers to do it and have enough knowledge to do it right. Yeah I've been wanting to really try the Super dmz. I get a 15% discount for being a member so I figured for $80, it's worth three bottles of it to try. Plus it may get banned in the future so who knows how long it'll be around.


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## The Prototype (Dec 8, 2010)

Life said:


> ripped I'd definitely have a good liver support program planned out for after your cycle. With that DMZ you'll have been pretty hard on it.



Good idea. I already have milk thistle. I'll start taking it immediately to get it going in my system.


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## Life (Dec 8, 2010)

I would get some liver-x and NAC. But thats just what I do. Some people add grape seed extract (Walmart) as well.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 8, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Good idea. I already have milk thistle. I'll start taking it immediately to get it going in my system.


 

Damn ripped! I figured you had already started the liver care with the tbol.


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## The Prototype (Dec 8, 2010)

Yeah I did but I stopped taking it so I figured I didn't need the milk thistle anymore even though I did start taking the tbol again. I only have one more days worth anyways. I'm already taking so many pills, I wanted to limit what I took. Between multi vitamin, Hawthorne x2, co1q, fish oil x3, and some others I can't think of off the top of my head, it was just getting to be too much so I stopped the milk thistle. My livers gotta be pretty tough though. I drank heavily on a daily basis for a good ten years or more. I don't drink at all anymore so my liver is probably happy now lol.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 8, 2010)

Hah! Yeah man i understand the pills. I take almost the same as you do with calcium, ala, and others. 

Just trying to look out for ya man. Keep it going!


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## The Prototype (Dec 8, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Hah! Yeah man i understand the pills. I take almost the same as you do with calcium, ala, and others.
> 
> Just trying to look out for ya man. Keep it going!



Thx bro. Appreciate the concern and feedback. I'll let you know how the dmz goes. If it does as heavy describes, I think I'll like it to tighten me up some to finish up the cycle. I can't believe I'm 6 weeks into my cycle already. I can feel the difference from week 2-3 to now. Def feels stronger now.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 8, 2010)

You have any links on the dmz? Just wondering why you would take that over a real steroid. Isn't it a PH? And isn't it like $80?


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## bknoxx (Dec 9, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> You have any links on the dmz? Just wondering why you would take that over a real steroid. Isn't it a PH? And isn't it like $80?




 No its not a PH its the real deal it is a steroid there is a sticky abt it


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 9, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I'm already taking so many pills, I wanted to limit what I took. Between multi vitamin, Hawthorne x2, co1q, fish oil x3, and some others I can't think of off the top of my head, it was just getting to be too much so I stopped the milk thistle.



Ever look at Anabolic Innovations' Cycle Support? Worked great for me. Eliminates the need for so many pills. You just mix it into your shake.


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## The Prototype (Dec 16, 2010)

Update: Today is the start of Week 8. I started taking Super DMZ on Sunday and will take thru the end of cycle. Currently up 12 lbs. Kinda disappointed at my weight gain but I've had some unforeseen issues during this cycle such as my mom going to the hospital, one of my best childhood friends passing away, my car catching on fire, etc. I have 6 weeks left until PCT. Hoping to add another 8 lbs. I can't believe I'm 2/3 of the way thru my cycle already. Where has time gone?

Today while pinning, I hit a nerve. Never done that before. Overall, pins are going very smooth. Strength is way up in the gym. I've noticed it kinda comes in spurts. One week my chest will go way up and everything else will be about the same. Then the next week my back will be way up.

Side effects experienced so far include some back acne, hair has been shedding some, libido is way up, and my boys are about the size of almonds. I'll have my blood pressure checked tomorrow but it seems fine. I think when the Test started kicking in, my body was adjusting to the foreign substance so I felt a lot more sides toward the beginning but most of the sides have lessened in the past few weeks. Also, I've been taking Hawthorne and CoQ10 for bp. Gyno issues have been gone for the most part. I've been using 1 mg of adex daily. But I have nearly zero water retention.

My bf has gone up quite a bit based on my waist size. I've noticed a lot more fat on my ab and lower back area. Once the cycle is over, I'll start increasing the cardio but I should be able to shed the fat pretty fast since I am an ecto.

I've been starting to plan my next cycle already. Probably will incorporate some EQ and Anavar with the Test. I'm considering the pyramid cycle by Heavyiron b/c I can tell gains are slowing some. I can definitely see where it can help at this point of the cycle.

At this point things I would have done differently are, I would have ordered more ancillaries to start with. I only purchased the minimum adex based on the protocol generally provided here. But you never know how much you're gonna need, especially for first and second cycles, so it's best to order a lot more than you think you need to have on hand. I would have ordered some 18 or 20 gauge pins to draw from. I've been using 23 g to draw and it's pretty slow.

That's all for now. Thanks for reading.


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## Life (Dec 16, 2010)

Your next cycle will be a cutting cycle? EQ you need to run for 16 weeks, I'd suggest Masteron instead if you're going to cut. EQ will make you a hungry hungry hippo. Well hungry at least, for most people.


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## The Prototype (Dec 16, 2010)

Yeah it'll be a cutting cycle. I planned on going 16 weeks. I just heard Masteron is most effective for people with really low bf, like single digit bf. I've gotta be up near 15% now. I was probably closer to 12% when I started.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 16, 2010)

Damn chubbers! Haha j/k im on the big side too. Good tips about the chems. I have enough shit on hand for two or three cycles just in case. On ordering bigger pins to draw with, screw that. Go to your local Tractor Supply and get some 20g pins to draw with. They are on the shelf. BTW where did you hit a nerve? 

Thanks for the update!


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## The Prototype (Dec 16, 2010)

SloppyJ said:


> Damn chubbers! Haha j/k im on the big side too. Good tips about the chems. I have enough shit on hand for two or three cycles just in case. On ordering bigger pins to draw with, screw that. Go to your local Tractor Supply and get some 20g pins to draw with. They are on the shelf. BTW where did you hit a nerve?
> 
> Thanks for the update!



I hit a nerve in my left quad. Just a quick sharp pain. Pulled it out pretty quick. And it bled a lot more than normal.


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## cutright (Dec 16, 2010)

I know what you mean trying to draw with a 23g I had to do it once...I use the amps of test e so I got 18g filter needles to draw with...it cuts down on the very small chance of pulling shards of glass up with ur juice. By the way..thanks for the info on the amp opener...works nice.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 16, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I hit a nerve in my left quad. Just a quick sharp pain. Pulled it out pretty quick. And it bled a lot more than normal.


 

Great, that's where i'm shooting next. That puts my mind at ease.


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## The Prototype (Dec 17, 2010)

Just wanted to update my blood pressure. I reported in another thread about four weeks ago that my blood pressure shot up to 149/96. Historically, I've always been in the 120/80 range and never had a history of high bp. The only variable that I believe caused the increase in my bp was the test kicking in about that time. Had my bp tested today and it came in at 125/97 which isn't great but much better than a month ago. I immediately started taking Hawthorne and coq-10 which appears to have helped considerably. I also think my bp shot up as my body was getting adjusted to the foreign substance in my body and sudden high amounts of test running thru my system. Just sharing my experience. Hope it helps someone with their cycle.


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## GreatWhiteTruth (Dec 18, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> Just wanted to update my blood pressure. I reported in another thread about four weeks ago that my blood pressure shot up to 149/96. Historically, I've always been in the 120/80 range and never had a history of high bp. The only variable that I believe caused the increase in my bp was the test kicking in about that time. Had my bp tested today and it came in at 125/97 which isn't great but much better than a month ago. I immediately started taking Hawthorne and coq-10 which appears to have helped considerably. I also think my bp shot up as my body was getting adjusted to the foreign substance in my body and sudden high amounts of test running thru my system. Just sharing my experience. Hope it helps someone with their cycle.



I've always wondered this. If BP spikes hard at the beginning of a cycle or not, and then levels out. Maybe pre-load hawthorne 2 weeks before the cycle to mitigate this?


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## The Prototype (Dec 18, 2010)

Update: This Super DMZ is the real deal. Been on it for six days now taking 1 capsule every 12 hours so 20 mg daily. I noticed an increase in strength in my back workout during the week but didn't think anything of it. But today, my strength was thru the roof while doing shoulders and tris. This is the strongest I've been in my life and I've been lifting for nearly ten years and have done two previous cycles. I did 6-8 reps of db presses with the 90 lb dumbbells. I generally use the 70 lb dumbbells on my last set. This is an incredible increase and I'm pretty sure it's from the Super DMZ. Everything else was up at least 20-30% in strength and everything I usually workout with felt super light today. The Super DMZ hasn't really put any weight on me. Just seeing gains in strength. Heavyiron described this compound as a dry dbol. I've never used dbol before but I hear the strength gains are incredible so without direct knowledge of dbol it's hard for me to say. Overall, it hasn't even been a week and strength is ridiculous. So far I haven't noticed any negative side effects either. I highly recommend this product. If I keep seeing gains like this, I'll incorporate this into every cycle from now on and pass on the dbol. I was skeptical at first and I have nothing to gain by promoting this product. Just sharing my experience with it for those interested. Trust me, I would tell you if the product wasn't good. Best part is the product is legal!


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## bknoxx (Dec 18, 2010)

Nice bro  seems like things are going good


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## SloppyJ (Dec 18, 2010)

Hell yeah. I'd like to throw some 90's around on shoulder press. I normally stick to the 65's to end with so we'll see. I guess we can compare the dbol to the dmz.


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## Fordf150 (Dec 19, 2010)

sorry to barge in and shoot you this message.

Hey im trying to plan out a cycle for a lot of muscle gain.


from my research i was going to do .

Halvor / hdrol
Pmag 
D plex
or Epi

I recently came across this forum and now realized you could like oral basically Test. like you did in your jounral i think..

any suggestions?

I figure if you could take oral testosterone basically.. that would be the best right.

Keep me posted, any info would be gratefully appreciated!

Thanks again


I just went through your journal and realized you injected... so my message may be alittle off.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 19, 2010)

Fordf150 said:


> sorry to barge in and shoot you this message.
> 
> Hey im trying to plan out a cycle for a lot of muscle gain.
> 
> ...


 
Wrong. Do more research and maybe start your own thread after you've done said research. Everyone will reccomend taking injectable test as a base for anything else you take or run it by itself.


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## The Prototype (Dec 19, 2010)

I've been using injectable Test and from what I hear, Test creams, gels and orals are garbage for bodybuilding purposes. Not trying to flame you. Just trying to give some insight on any Test other than injectables. I'm sure nearly every member here and on other boards will frown upon any Test other than injectable. If you have a question like this, I'd suggest starting your own thread to get the best responses. Most people reading this thread are just following my cycle so you'll get better answers by starting your own thread that is specific to your question. Good luck.


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## Fordf150 (Dec 19, 2010)

rippedgolfer said:


> I've been using injectable Test and from what I hear, Test creams, gels and orals are garbage for bodybuilding purposes. Not trying to flame you. Just trying to give some insight on any Test other than injectables. I'm sure nearly every member here and on other boards will frown upon any Test other than injectable. If you have a question like this, I'd suggest starting your own thread to get the best responses. Most people reading this thread are just following my cycle so you'll get better answers by starting your own thread that is specific to your question. Good luck.



What did you do as your first cycle ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## The Prototype (Dec 22, 2010)

Update: Okay tomorrow is the start of Week 9. Can't believe it's almost over. It's been a fun ride but I'm not quite ready to let it end and I'm still short about five lbs of my goal of 20 lbs. SOOOO....after cafeful consideration, I've decided to up my test to 750 mg per week starting tomorrow and increasing the dmz to 30 mg daily. I'm even considering extending my cycle from 12 to either 14-15 weeks. Haven't decided yet. I'm putting everything into overdrive starting tomorrow. One reason I want to increase the test is to see how much my body can handle for my next cycle. I'm feeling 500 mg won't be sufficient next cycle and 750 mg sounds like a good number to me. I also want those last five lbs and I think this might just do the trick. Some of you may think I'm crazy but screw it. I'm shut down already and I feel I can handle a little more test as the sides have been mild and i've been feeling things are just stalling. I still see a gain here and there but it feels like I'm in neuteral and I want to get things kickng up again. So here we go. Going to jam 375 mg tomorrow and continue with this until at least Week 14.

Now that I got that off my chest, I've been seeing more and more acne popping up on my chest, shoulders and back. I ordered some accutane and will take a low dose of 20 mg a day. My skin always feels oily. Even after I shower, my skin feels oily in just a few hours. We'll see how this works. Right now, i'd say the acne is mild to moderate. 

Other than that, pins are going well with no pain. Gains have slowed as I mentioned. Diet has been good. Training sessions are really good amd aggressive. Bp appears to be better but not quite in the good range. Hair loss has lessened and I still have a full head of hair. No gyno issues. Zero water retention. Probably why my weight gain is slower in increasing than say someone taking dbol. Sleeping well. Appetite good. Overall sense of well being good. Im just unhappy with the sudden stall in weight gain so i have to take desperate measures. Ill keep you all posted! Thx for reading! I'd appreciate your feedback on this. If you guys think I absolutely should not increase the test then please say it and why so I can hear your opinion.


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## scaryclown34 (Dec 22, 2010)

maybe u gotta eat more. dont know what youve been eating lately


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## The Prototype (Dec 23, 2010)

scaryclown34 said:


> maybe u gotta eat more. dont know what youve been eating lately



That might be the problem but I eat quite a bit already and I'm over 4k calories daily. Cycles are known to flatten out around Week 8, which is right around where I'm at. I've put on about 13-15 lbs but none of it is water. It's all lean muscle and fat as my waist has grown some. My goal was 20 lbs. But I think a lot of people that gain 20+ lbs put on a lot of water weight so I think it's hard to compare. I think if everyone didn't retain water, they'd probably be somewhere in the range I am, or maybe a little more. Plus, I've been taking 1 mg of adex daily, which is quite a bit. Gyno issues have been non-existent so I think I'll lower it to 0.5 mg daily and see what happens. I should have started the adex from Week 1 to let it get into my system but I waited until I felt gyno issues coming on so it didn't work immediately. Now that it's been in my system, it's working great but I may be over doing it some. But I do like the fact I'm not retaining water and don't have fat face. That is the easiest way to tell if someone is on "juice". After the cycle though, I'm gonna get on the cardio big time. My bf has gone up at least a few %.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 23, 2010)

I'm doing .25ED and I think .5 would be too much. I don't think my face has gotten bigger either. I'm trying to pound water all day to keep me flushed out though. Fuck it man, go for the 750mg. I'll be curious to see how it affects you.


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## BigBoiH (Dec 24, 2010)

Are you still going to go for 14 weeks? If so, I think you should bump it up. If your only going for 10 forget about it. You wont notice a difference until about week 10. Or grab some prop and run the Test E until week 12 and use the prop until the 14th.


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## The Prototype (Dec 24, 2010)

Yeah I'm going either 15 or 16 weeks now and I bumped the test to 750 mg. I'm not ready to end my cycle quite yet.


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## The Prototype (Dec 24, 2010)

Checked yesterday's diet on fitday and came just over 4k calories. My diet is pretty consistent everyday so I'm pretty sure i'm staying at a minimum, over 3,500 but prob over 4k easily. Diet seems to be okay. Not really site why else gains have stalled except that they just do around this time of the cycle so I think the increase in Test is warranted to keep gains going. Training is good as well. Working out five days a week with two days rest. Workout each body part once a week except arms which I try to do twice a week but sometimes I only end up doing once. My arms recover surrpringly fast so twice a week is fine for me.  

I ordered accutane from researchstop. Unbelievably fast delivery. Ordered it Wednesday and got it last night. Now that's fast! They have all kinds of ancillaries. You guys should check them out.


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## SloppyJ (Dec 24, 2010)

Glad to hear they came through for you. Your sten's order should take a week or so. But who knows with Christmas.


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## Hell (Jan 11, 2011)

Hey Ripped......How did your cycle turn out, weight and strength wise?


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## SloppyJ (Jan 12, 2011)

I'd like to know more about what happened also if you want to share with us. And how you plan to prevent it if you cycle again.


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## The Prototype (Jan 12, 2011)

Sorry I haven't been keeping up with this. I ended my cycle early, 10 weeks instead of 12. I had some bloodwork done and my cholesterol was very high and my blood pressure was Stage 2 hypertension. The doc advised I immediately discontinue use, as I told her about my gear use b/c I got freaked out by my results and wanted a true diagnosis and not one she couldn't help with. My prior blood tests were all fine so she was confused as to the sudden change but I think she suspected something as I've put on about 15 lbs of muscle. So long story short, my cycle has ended and I started pct Monday. 

So far, I've dropped 3-5 lbs and strength is already down some. If I can maintain where I'm at I'd be happy. But this week I haven't eaten nearly as much as I have been as I had a crowned replaced in my mouth so that put a damper on my diet. 

Overall, I was quite happy with the results I had. This was my first cycle in five years and I experienced a lot of sides this time around, where my previous two cycles I didn't hve any at all. Sides range from acne, high Bp and cholestrol, some hair loss, etc. But I made significant improvements in the gym and strength went up substantially. All of my clothes fit a lot tighter and I was given big compliments from nearly all my friends. I gained about 13-15 lbs altogether. 

I had my bp checked yesterday and it was 131/81 which is a huge improvement so I'm convinced the Test was giving me high bp. I think going forward, I'll incorporate my cardio in my training, as I've ceased most cardio during cycle in order to gain as much weight as possible. I also took nearly every supplement from Hawthorne, coq-10, celery seed, and a cycle support with a variety of organ protectants. But apparently it wasn't enough. 

I will most definitely cycle again. I think your motivation and mindset change once you lift from all natural for many many years and gaining nearly the same amount in just a few short months. I'm just in the third day of pct but fortunately, haven't felt much of a change. I started taking creatine again hoping it'll help me keep my gains. Well that's all. Thanks for reading.


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## Life (Jan 12, 2011)

Could have been diet man.


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## The Prototype (Jan 12, 2011)

Nah, my diet has changed much. Just added a few more calories while on. I'm certain it was from the Test bc my bp has slowly declined as the esters have been clearing. I'm going to check it again Friday. I also have my bp checked regularly and only when the Test started kicking in did my bp go thru the roof. It actually got a little better during cycle but when I upped my dose to 750 mg, my bp just went crazy.


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## SloppyJ (Jan 12, 2011)

Maybe you should have ramped it up slower? That's a 33% jump. Probably not too good for the ol blood levels.


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## cutright (Jan 12, 2011)

I've just ramped mine up to 750mg in week 6..I'm rolling pretty good...that's strange though ripped I've been following your cycle and it seems you had every side possible..correct me if I'm wrong..hair thinning, acne, sore nips, high bp, high cholesterol, testicular atrophy..man..do you think you will cycle again? And if so how do you plan on minimizing sides?


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## The Prototype (Jan 13, 2011)

Not sure at this point what I'll do to minimize sides. I took a cycle of Sust at 500 mg per week and had zero sides. That was about 9-10 years ago. I then did a Winny only cycle at 50 mg ed and had zero sides. That was five years ago. Maybe it's just the Test I'm using.  It's human grade stuff so maybe it's overdosed or just dosed a lot stronger than some UGLs. I'd imagine the Sust didn't give me any sides as I pinned twice a week so I was probably only using the long esters effectively, which amounts to 320 mg per week. I had decent gains with the Sust but this cycle blew that one away. I plan to hit the cardio pretty hard the next few months, lean out some, and cycle again when I'm around 10% bf or lower. I started this cycle around 13-15% bf so that may have played a role in the bp issues, cholesterol, gyno symptoms, etc. I also will take some cycle support from the BEGINNING, not when sides start to get out of hand.  Cycle support as in supplements for liver, heart, etc.  I still have over 30 amps of Test E and a ton of clomid, aromasin and adex so I definitely plan to cycle again.  Just chill for a while and let my body recover.


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## BigBoiH (Jan 14, 2011)

Man......those sides suck bro. For me the most I got was back acne on my last. Try going back to sustanon since you had no sides. You will probably have a pretty productive cycle with sustanon now that you understand the mechanics of the esthers. Maybe even better than your most recent. Just a thought.


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## The Prototype (Jan 14, 2011)

Not a bad idea bigboi. But I hated pinning sust. Hurts like a bitch. Plus I have 30 amps of Norma test. Gotta do something with it. I might try to lower the dose to 375 mg per week and adding some primo and see what happens.


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## skizzbomb (Jan 15, 2011)

Hey dude i just finished up a norma test cycle 2 months ago and loved it. I was also doing 500 a week and my strength was threw the roof. If you decide to do something differnt next cycle hit me up as i would love to take those norma's off your hands.


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## The Prototype (Jan 15, 2011)

skizzbomb said:


> Hey dude i just finished up a norma test cycle 2 months ago and loved it. I was also doing 500 a week and my strength was threw the roof. If you decide to do something differnt next cycle hit me up as i would love to take those norma's off your hands.



I think I'll hold on to them. Norma makes one hell of a product IMO. 

PCT Update: I'm 6 days into PCT and recovery is going better than expected. Haven't had any depression, my boys are coming back to normal size, my weight is stable at the moment and strength is down a little but I still feel strong in the gym. I was expecting a tough recovery b/c I felt like I was shut down hard but all is going better than expected (knock on wood). With my luck, once I talk about how good pct is going, I'm sure I'll shrink and get depressed lol.


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## The Prototype (Jan 15, 2011)

Btw, I forgot to mention this but does anyone else get acne from orals? I got acne when I was on the tbol and even more on the dmz but when I stopped either one and was just on Test, I didn't get any acne. I'm starting to think maybe the orals are causing acne.


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## Life (Jan 15, 2011)

Oh I meant to say earlier. Its probably all those orals you took that got your bp fucked up and a lot of what lead to the sides. 

Does DMZ convert to DHT? If the orals are putting more DHT in your system then you're going to get more acne, thats pretty cut and dry.


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## The Prototype (Jan 15, 2011)

Life said:


> Oh I meant to say earlier. Its probably all those orals you took that got your bp fucked up and a lot of what lead to the sides.
> 
> Does DMZ convert to DHT? If the orals are putting more DHT in your system then you're going to get more acne, thats pretty cut and dry.



I took the tbol from the beginning and bp was fine. My bp increased at about Week 4 when tests was kicking in hard and I was off the tbol by that time. I took the dmz for about two weeks and well after the dmz cleared, my bp was still thru the roof. I just checkedtot today and it was 133/87 so it's getting better each time I check it. I'm not sure about the dht and acne. I suppose that can be the cause but acne started popping up quite a bit one week into dmz.


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## tomy2 (Jan 16, 2011)

GOTTA SAY LOOKING AWESOME BRO ..

to be honest I never expected ur body like that man due to ur shoulder issues ..

keep it up my friend ..


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