# do you really need so much protein? ever see a prison wieght room?



## Rock405 (Feb 22, 2005)

i've been wondering why it's so important to eat 1 gram of protein per pound of body wieght, because i used to work in a prison, and the guys in there eat nothing but apple sauce and little beef paddies and slop every once in a while but they still grow like hell...i'd say on average a 200 pound guy in prison will get 50 grams of protein on a good day...but they still get muscles that look superior to some of these bodybuilders...why? and i don't know if any of you saw the documentary on A&E about lifting in prison, but some of those guys in their where benching 400-500 pounds and sqauting 600 on absolutley zero supplements..its truley amazing.


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## vegman (Feb 22, 2005)

Do you think they were taking roids?


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## Mudge (Feb 23, 2005)

If anyone is benching 500 raw, they are gifted IMO. Even 400+ raw, is impressive - and yes gear exists on the inside just as other drugs do. I'm sure this varies from prison to prison, I have not done time myself but am close to someone who has been in and out.

Beating up other people and stealing their food has been going on for probably thousands of years, its no different in prison. Mark Abene covered this when he was on the inside, and he doesn't lift a damn thing - yet he knew who the lifters were, because they were the ones farting eggs and beans all day while stealing your food.

If someone weighs 200 pounds it is clear they are not getting a lot of calories. I'd have to see that 500 bench to believe it, unless he is 5 foot tall and has horrible form.


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## LAM (Feb 23, 2005)

there have been plenty of studies done on repeat felons.  many of them has above average levels of test.  since you worked in a prison you would know that that most do next to zero work during the day, very low energy expenditure.  plus not only do they get 3 meals a day they also get to purcahse plenty of snack from the cantine.


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## Rock405 (Feb 23, 2005)

yeah, but little 50 cent snacks don't have any protein in them....and not all prisons allow inmates to purchase snacks...but there was a series on A&E about powerlifitng in prison...these guys where 100% natural, no supps, no roids, none of that.


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## LAM (Feb 23, 2005)

doesn't matter.  you only need more protein than it takes to keep the body in a positve nitrogen balance. and with a very low level activity level protein turnover is very low.  having a high carb intake is more important than a high protein intake when gaining mass is the main goal.

I am a firm believer in getting in slightly more 1 gram per lb of LBM not total body weight.  MOST people who weight train ingest far too much protein.  when I hear of 200 lb guys ingesting 350-400 grams of protein a day that shit makes me laugh !

plus since you have worked in a prison you also know that statistically there are not that many huge guys with low body fat.  getting to 270 lbs with 20% body fat is easy.


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## Purdue Power (Feb 23, 2005)

I have seriously always wondered about this question.


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## ASSPUNCTURE (Feb 23, 2005)

still all swoled up

bread and water


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## Rock405 (Feb 23, 2005)

LAM said:
			
		

> doesn't matter.  you only need more protein than it takes to keep the body in a positve nitrogen balance. and with a very low level activity level protein turnover is very low.  having a high carb intake is more important than a high protein intake when gaining mass is the main goal.
> 
> I am a firm believer in getting in slightly more 1 gram per lb of LBM not total body weight.  MOST people who weight train ingest far too much protein.  when I hear of 200 lb guys ingesting 350-400 grams of protein a day that shit makes me laugh !
> 
> plus since you have worked in a prison you also know that statistically there are not that many huge guys with low body fat.  getting to 270 lbs with 20% body fat is easy.




what is LBM?


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## brogers (Feb 23, 2005)

lean body mass


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## brian2440 (Feb 23, 2005)

Lean body mass


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## Rock405 (Feb 23, 2005)

how do you calculate it?


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## j rizz (Feb 23, 2005)

by finding out ur BF%...aka body fat percentage.
not racist or anything, but alot of prisons are full of black people and it seems that black people are usually more ripped. ive always wondered why they seem to be stronger and look more built. is it just cus the way the light hits their skin, almost like how body builders put on fake tan before a show to make their muscles show??


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## onamission (Feb 23, 2005)

to figure out lbm I believe it is weight - (%bf *weight) = LBM, something like that.

So I weigh 190 pounds and am around 13% (guessing) so 190 
- (.13 * 190=24.7)
=165.3 pounds of LBM.


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## PreMier (Feb 23, 2005)

LAM said:
			
		

> I am a firm believer in getting in slightly more 1 gram per lb of LBM not total body weight.  MOST people who weight train ingest far too much protein.  when I hear of 200 lb guys ingesting 350-400 grams of protein a day that shit makes me laugh !



Fawk.. 

In my defence, steak tastes a hell of a lot better thn brown rice.


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## Rock405 (Sep 17, 2005)

i still think a lot of protein is over rated.


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## CowPimp (Sep 17, 2005)

This is still one of the most highly debated topics in the nutrition world of athletes and bodybuilders.  I still don't know where I stand to be honest.  As of now, I take in quite a lot of protein because more evidence seems to show more positives and negatives of a high protein diet.


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## juggernaut2005 (Sep 19, 2005)

Rock405 said:
			
		

> i've been wondering why it's so important to eat 1 gram of protein per pound of body wieght, because i used to work in a prison, and the guys in there eat nothing but apple sauce and little beef paddies and slop every once in a while but they still grow like hell...i'd say on average a 200 pound guy in prison will get 50 grams of protein on a good day...but they still get muscles that look superior to some of these bodybuilders...why? and i don't know if any of you saw the documentary on A&E about lifting in prison, but some of those guys in their where benching 400-500 pounds and sqauting 600 on absolutley zero supplements..its truley amazing.



I was thinking the same exact thing.. I think it depends on what 'suppliments' you use.. If you use steroids then you need a ton of protein to grow with all that gear.. If you aint using steroids then I doubt you need 1g per lbs of LBM.

genetics also play a big part in gaining mass/muscles.. Some people eat 2gms/LBM and dont gain an ounce of muscle/weight.. and some people eat one steak/day and pack muscles..


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## Rock405 (Sep 27, 2005)

Some inmates at Sam Quintin
http://www.douglaskenthall.com/prison/lenaslove.html


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## min0 lee (Sep 27, 2005)

I did a week and a half at Rikers island when I was a teenager and my body just blew up. They say it's from the starchy food they serve at Rikers.


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## BuddyClubNeon (Sep 27, 2005)

its 1 gram per pound of body weight
but im sure more wont hurt
also im sure there is a reasonable limit
example
bodyweight= 200 lbs
protein intake= 400 grams


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## NeilPearson (Nov 9, 2005)

In the book "Power Eating" they suggested about 0.5 a gram of protein per pound of body mass was all that was needed to build muscle.  I did a little research and found a bunch of studies that confirmed eating more than that didn't help muscle grow faster.

They also suggested that eating a lot more (like 400 grams for a 200 pound person) was hard on the kidneys and not a very healthy thing to do.  They said get more calories from carbs instead and you will have more energy for workouts and probably grow faster


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## cpush (Nov 9, 2005)

in my nutrition class it was recommended .8g protein per KG of bodyweight..


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## GFR (Nov 9, 2005)

cpush said:
			
		

> in my nutrition class it was recommended .8g protein per KG of bodyweight..


That information is outdated and just wrong!!!!

1-1.25 grams per pound


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## cpush (Nov 9, 2005)

ForemanRules said:
			
		

> That information is outdated and just wrong!!!!
> 
> 1-1.25 grams per pound




where do you get these numbers from? I know it's like _the thing_ to do, pretty much a standard for body builders. what about normal athletes or healthy people, isn't 1-1.25 excess (even for BBs?)


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## aceshigh (Nov 9, 2005)

they get any sort of drug in gaol i would say mabye alot of them were juicers b4 they weant in or are getting it while there there,,,and u dont do alot else so not too many calories would be burnt


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## GFR (Nov 9, 2005)

cpush said:
			
		

> where do you get these numbers from? I know it's like _the thing_ to do, pretty much a standard for body builders.* what about normal athletes or healthy people, isn't 1-1.25 excess *(even for BBs?)



.75 is probably ok for them

The highest Medical Doctors opinion on protein I have read is .9 per pound for athletes training with weights for hypertrophy.....He wrote a book I read years ago...cant remember the name...


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## NeilPearson (Nov 9, 2005)

So if the highest doctors opinion is .9 per pound, why do the body builders suggest more than that?  Do you believe you know more than the medical community?


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## Big Smoothy (Nov 10, 2005)

More than 1-1.5 per lb. is hard on the kidneys and it's excreted, isn't it. 

And honestly, look at the cost.


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## THEUNIT(XXL) (Nov 10, 2005)

Mr_Snafu said:
			
		

> More than 1-1.5 per lb. is hard on the kidneys and it's excreted, isn't it.
> 
> And honestly, look at the cost.


haahah no man, nothing like that is bad for you kidneys, if you drink enough water.


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## cpush (Nov 10, 2005)

THEUNIT(XXL) said:
			
		

> haahah no man, nothing like that is bad for you kidneys, if you drink enough water.



I'd like to believe this, but often I feel BBs just use the water recommendation for justification.  I dunno   

I've also read so much protein is bad for your kidneys and depletes your supply of vitamin b6.  Other problems are also associated with excess protein intake.

If I do other recommendations, I would only need 50-60 grams of protein.  I would have to re-think my entire diet.  I get 50-60 grams in 2-3 meals


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## Tha Don (Nov 10, 2005)

i'm 190lbs and get a good 350g lean protein a day (40-50g in 7 meals, plus PWO shake)

..and what?


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## NeilPearson (Nov 10, 2005)

0.8 grams of protein per pound is all you need.  More than that doesn't offer any more muscle growth and may have health issues.

Maybe 1.0 grams if you are on a cut, doing cardio and want to make sure you don't lose muscle mass


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## devildog88 (Nov 10, 2005)

One thing prison weight lifters get plenty of and that is rest!  Hmmmmmmmmmm the importance of sleeping............plenty of time to recoup!


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## GFR (Nov 10, 2005)

NeilPearson said:
			
		

> So if the highest doctors opinion is .9 per pound, why do the body builders suggest more than that?  Do you believe you know more than the medical community?


For a *natural* person .9 or 1 is probably plenty.....its all I eat

But on Steroids and GH......you need to almost double that number....and thats not something most Doctors or Dietitians are taking into consideration..


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## NeilPearson (Nov 10, 2005)

ForemanRules said:
			
		

> For a *natural* person .9 or 1 is probably plenty.....its all I eat
> 
> But on Steroids and GH......you need to almost double that number....and thats not something most Doctors or Dietitians are taking into consideration..



People don't do steroids do they?  I thought they were illegal!


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## myCATpowerlifts (Nov 10, 2005)

I still want a huge documentary on the prison diets of the average huge guy, how they train, etc etc.

Rest has to have something to do with it.


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## Psch91 (Nov 10, 2005)

NeilPearson said:
			
		

> People don't do steroids do they?  I thought they were illegal!



Yeah, no one uses steroids


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## GFR (Nov 10, 2005)

Psch91 said:
			
		

> Yeah, no one uses steroids


I agree...
*plus nobody uses:* marajuana, cocane, herone, LSD, crack cocane, opium, hash, ecstasy, METHAMPHETAMINE, Barbiturates, Chronic, Cyclones (PCP)...ect......because they are illegal.


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## NeilPearson (Nov 10, 2005)

Psch91 said:
			
		

> Yeah, no one uses steroids



I didn't think so...


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## durk (Nov 10, 2005)

I know a guy that whent too jail at about 140 came out at about 230. Moral of the story he was jacked!!!! he admited he did alota roids in jail but wouldnt tell me how my guess hoobing some Vials up his ass during visits and using the same needle the whole time. nice and sanitary. Atleast they get bleach to sterilize stuff!!!


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## Big Smoothy (Nov 10, 2005)

THEUNIT(XXL) said:
			
		

> haahah no man, nothing like that is bad for you kidneys, if you drink enough water.



Yes, if someone is taking LOTS of protein, water will help the kidneys.

But I'm talking about people who are taking 3 grams of protein per _body weight_ pound.


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## cpush (Nov 11, 2005)

I'd like to know what one of the mods thinks about this topic.. if you have time


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## kenwood (Nov 13, 2005)

*shit my uncle went to prison for 6months and before he went in he was skin and bones and weighed around 145lbs height 6'1 and when he got released i didn't even reconize him he went from a 33 waist to a 48 waist and weighed 264lbs w/12%bf....he said everyday he lifted weights all day long b/c thats all you could do except sleep and eat, he said he ate as much as he could, and after he got out he stopped lifting and got down to 195lbs..well everynow and then he lifts but still he was retty big*


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## stucknsc2005 (Nov 13, 2005)

I have read this thread and it all sounds like CRAP to me...I have done a 4yr stretch and went to 4 different geographic locations while incarcerated and the prisons are not majority filled with BLACKS. I am white by the way. Also I know this guy that was in prison with me who entered at 160lbs and left out of there a lean 215lbs. This was over three years. He got big buy lifting his own weight. He would manipulate his cell to his advantage.  I was in 1 prison that had weights to lift. The other prisons did away with weights because the prisoners where getting stronger and able to over power the guards more easy.  You can by snacks from your cantine but they are not healthy at all. The food is horrible but they give you the basic food groups and the bare minimum at that. Of course people steal other people???s trays and they can trade food.  A lot of this I would suppose goes to Genetics???. Prisons do have more contraband in them that you would think but the majority of the contraband is cigarettes and weed.  People are not going to smuggle GEAR into a prison.  I have never seen that done.  



Of course I am no expert at this. This is just from my personal experiences. I dont know about the calories, carbs and amount of protein one would get in prison.


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## min0 lee (Nov 13, 2005)

How was the sex?


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## GFR (Nov 13, 2005)

When I went to Rikers for 8 years  I had a cell mate called min0 lee.
The first thing I did was make him sit when he went pee.
That was the beginning of a beautiful friendship.


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## min0 lee (Nov 13, 2005)

ForemanRules said:
			
		

> When I went to *Rikers* for 8 years  I had a cell mate called min0 lee.
> The first thing I did was make him sit when he went pee.
> That was the beginning of a beautiful friendship.


How did you know about that?


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## min0 lee (Nov 13, 2005)

ForemanRules said:
			
		

> When I went to *Rikers* for 8 years  I had a cell mate called min0 lee.
> The first thing I did was make him sit when he went pee.
> That was the beginning of a beautiful friendship.


How did you know about that?


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## GFR (Nov 13, 2005)

True story


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## stucknsc2005 (Nov 13, 2005)

Common misconception of prisons. Inmates are more homophobic than you can possibly imagine. That???s why pedophiles have such a hard time in jail... Never had to worry about being poked and prodded.


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## aceshigh (Nov 13, 2005)

stucknsc2005 said:
			
		

> I have read this thread and it all sounds like CRAP to me...I have done a 4yr stretch and went to 4 different geographic locations while incarcerated and the prisons are not majority filled with BLACKS. I am white by the way. Also I know this guy that was in prison with me who entered at 160lbs and left out of there a lean 215lbs. This was over three years. He got big buy lifting his own weight. He would manipulate his cell to his advantage.  I was in 1 prison that had weights to lift. The other prisons did away with weights because the prisoners where getting stronger and able to over power the guards more easy.  You can by snacks from your cantine but they are not healthy at all. The food is horrible but they give you the basic food groups and the bare minimum at that. Of course people steal other people???s trays and they can trade food.  A lot of this I would suppose goes to Genetics???. Prisons do have more contraband in them that you would think but the majority of the contraband is cigarettes and weed.  People are not going to smuggle GEAR into a prison.  I have never seen that done.
> 
> 
> 
> Of course I am no expert at this. This is just from my personal experiences. I dont know about the calories, carbs and amount of protein one would get in prison.


i have read that post and it sound like crap to me,,,,,,,,,,,,,,never heard of prison where cigerettes were contraband ,,,,i have done prison time and i knew of 3 juicers,,,,,,,,one of them was massive and worked in the kitchen ,,so had access to all the food ,,,,,u get any drug in prisons


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## stucknsc2005 (Nov 13, 2005)

Depends on the geographic location I suppose. And you havent ever been to Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama or Florida prison obviously. Not that it is a cool place to be. But those places cig's are contraband. might want to research before you make yourself look stupid brotha..


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## aceshigh (Nov 13, 2005)

stucknsc2005 said:
			
		

> Depends on the geographic location I suppose. And you havent ever been to Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama or Florida prison obviously. Not that it is a cool place to be. But those places cig's are contraband. might want to research before you make yourself look stupid brotha..


im in australia "brotha" and smokes arent contraband here,,,,,,,as for being a cool place to be ,,,without even being there i think i could think of a lot of places that would be cooler


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## stucknsc2005 (Nov 13, 2005)

LMAO...Yeah no joke...Australia...Man what a place to be...Everything is damn near legal there..hehe....


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## aceshigh (Nov 13, 2005)

the aboriginals get hold of petrol too,,somehow i dunnno


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## ASSPUNCTURE (Nov 17, 2005)

you do realize


you can get juice in the joint right?


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## Skate67 (Nov 17, 2005)

stucknsc2005 said:
			
		

> Common misconception of prisons. Inmates are more homophobic than you can possibly imagine. That???s why pedophiles have such a hard time in jail... Never had to worry about being poked and prodded.



 I haven't been even close to going to jail.  But i framed houses with guys and they had all been in jail for 3-6 years apiece.  They said this exact same thing.


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## bob1984 (Nov 18, 2005)

from my time inside i found it best to take my protein rectally through a straw this ensures that it is absorbed more efficiently as the rectum is rich in blood supply. the strength gains are breath taking!


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## aceshigh (Nov 18, 2005)

big bubba will give u a dose of test rectally,,in the joint


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## FishOrCutBait (Nov 19, 2005)

NeilPearson said:
			
		

> People don't do steroids do they? I thought they were illegal!


I move to nominate this for quote of the year for 2005


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## ASSPUNCTURE (Nov 22, 2005)

aceshigh said:
			
		

> big bubba will give u a dose of test rectally,,in the joint


lol


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