# test e and npp?



## aussie1 (Jul 15, 2011)

what are your thoughts on running test e and npp, long ester and short ester

was thinking something like
npp 300mg -week 1-8
test e 500mg- week 1-10

reasoning is short ester will be out of system faster so i will find it easier to recover from the hard shut down, less bloat

might kickstart with some test prop or dbol


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## CigarMan (Jul 15, 2011)

aussie1 said:


> what are your thoughts on running test e and npp, long ester and short ester
> 
> was thinking something like
> npp 300mg -week 1-8
> ...



If you are going to stop using the npp 2 weeks before the test, why not just use deca?  It will clear your system before the test e will at 10 weeks and it will be a lot less pinning.  Your blood levels will also stay more consistent with the longer esters.

If I was going to pin npp ed or eod, I would go ahead and take test prop with it.  I do like to use both of these to kickstart a test e/deca cycle though.

For bloat, monitor e2 levels and if they are fine and you are still bloated, then take a diuretic.


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## aussie1 (Jul 15, 2011)

ediii


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## aussie1 (Jul 15, 2011)

CigarMan said:


> If you are going to stop using the npp 2 weeks before the test, why not just use deca?  It will clear your system before the test e will at 10 weeks and it will be a lot less pinning.  Your blood levels will also stay more consistent with the longer esters.
> 
> If I was going to pin npp ed or eod, I would go ahead and take test prop with it.  I do like to use both of these to kickstart a test e/deca cycle though.
> 
> For bloat, monitor e2 levels and if they are fine and you are still bloated, then take a diuretic.



yeh original plan was deca and test e, 

am worried about the bloat dont really know how to control it, I know  that the deca bloat is from the rise if prolactin and progesterone so  that cancels out all the other anti-e's? still

cycle will end at beginning of summer in aus, thats why i was thinking of changing cycle up a bit, bit more of a lean bulk

am also considering just running 650mg test ?


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## theCaptn' (Jul 15, 2011)

NPP is heralded as a good alternative deca. Kicks in a lot quicker and apparently drier as well. You'll need to pin it 3x a week or EOD.

Run your AI, get some caber or prami for the NPP (as you would deca).

Good choice mate, Im hoping to run NPP going into Summer too.


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## JCBourne (Jul 15, 2011)

theCaptn' said:


> NPP is heralded as a good alternative deca. Kicks in a lot quicker and apparently drier as well. You'll need to pin it 3x a week or EOD.
> 
> Run your AI, get some caber or prami for the NPP (as you would deca).
> 
> Good choice mate, Im hoping to run NPP going into Summer too.



This is good advice. Exactly the point of NPP.


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## CigarMan (Jul 15, 2011)

The sides from test estrogen is 80% greater than nandrolone estrogen (nor-estrogen) and I bloat a lot with test e but very little from deca, though I have never gone over 400mgs/pw.

When I combine the two into the same cycle, I take less test than I do when taking test by itself to offset the rise in androgenic/anabolic ratio that nandrolone has.

As for prolactin and progestine sides, well, we each react different to them.  I like the info from this site.  

I have not had any real problems with deca or npp, but I think that is because I have kept the weekly doses low compared to what others have posted in their cycles.  Also, I am 50yrs old, so I do not take high doses of test anyways.

I have had "sensitive nips" but adding an AI has always stopped that.


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## Dannie (Jul 16, 2011)

npp 300mg -week 1-10
test e 500mg- week 1-8


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## GMO (Jul 16, 2011)

Dannie said:


> npp 300mg -week 1-10
> test e 500mg- week 1-8



No...

You'll want to run both compounds for the same length of time.  The NPP is a short ester and will clear long before your enanthate does.

Wk 1-10 Test E 500-600mg (250-300mg x2/wk)
Wk 1-10 NPP 300mg/wk (Pin M,W,F)
Wk 1-10 Cagergoline 0.5mg/wk (To control progestin levels)
Wk 1-12 Aromasin 12.5mg ed or eod
Wk 1-11 HCG 250iu-500iu x2/wk

PCT: (Two weeks after your last shot)
Clomid 100/100/75/50
Aromasin 25/25/12.5/12.5

If you do decide to kick start with an oral, I would recommend D-bol as it has a pretty powerful synergistic effect with Nandrolone.


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## Anabolic5150 (Jul 16, 2011)

Great info as always from GMO.


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## theCaptn' (Jul 16, 2011)

Anabolic5150 said:


> Great info as always from GMO.


 
+1


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## james-27 (Jul 16, 2011)

Dannie said:


> npp 300mg -week 1-10
> test e 500mg- week 1-8



WTF bro? Dont give advice if you have no idea what your talking about.


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## Dannie (Jul 16, 2011)

GMO said:


> No...
> 
> You'll want to run both compounds for the same length of time.  The NPP is a short ester and will clear long before your enanthate does.
> 
> ....


Thats what I meant, if NPP clears faster, then why not run it for longer (at lower dose) so they both clear at the same time? 
Should have said in my initial post that, those last 2 weeks on NPP were to tapper down. Preferably with Test P as well. 
Why wait 20 days before PCT if you can still run cycle for another 2 week with a short easter. 



james-27 said:


> WTF bro? Dont give advice if you have no idea what your talking about.


I am sorry bro, this will never happen again.


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## GMO (Jul 18, 2011)

Dannie said:


> Thats what I meant, if NPP clears faster, then why not run it for longer (at lower dose) so they both clear at the same time?
> Should have said in my initial post that, those last 2 weeks on NPP were to tapper down. Preferably with Test P as well.
> Why wait 20 days before PCT if you can still run cycle for another 2 week with a short easter.


 

You stop the Nandrolone at the same time as the test E because you want your receptors COMPLETELY clear of any 19-nor compound before starting PCT.  Otherwise it makes recovery much more difficult.  If it were a long ester like Nandrolone Decanoate, you would want to stop it's use AT LEAST 2 weeks prior to the last shot of test E.


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## SloppyJ (Jul 18, 2011)

Here's what I would do: (Note: "I")

1-12 Test E 750mg 1ml MWF
1-10 NPP  350mg .75ml MWF  (NPP would be at 150mg/ml)
1-4 Test P 300mg 1ml MWF
5-9 Dbol 50mg ED
Caber and Aromasin


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## malfeasance (Jul 18, 2011)

GMO said:


> Wk 1-10 Cagergoline 0.5mg/wk (To control progestin levels)


  You and SloppyJ both recommend caber, instead of prami.  Any reasons?  I am not issuing a challenge, I am genuinely curious.  Please elaborate if you can, so that I can learn.


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## SloppyJ (Jul 18, 2011)

From what I gather prami can give you quite the sides. You can use either.


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## BIGBEN2011 (Jul 18, 2011)

yea i think i am going to do similiar tes e,npp 400mg a week trying to decide between anadrol or d-bol for the first 6 weeks of the cycle and prov for the last part of cycle.does this look ok.and of cource i have my pct and ai in a row.


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## GMO (Jul 18, 2011)

SloppyJ said:


> From what I gather prami can give you quite the sides. You can use either.



^^^This


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## malfeasance (Jul 19, 2011)

What kind of sides?  I am having a hard time finding this information.  Also, are there any sides with Caber?


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## XYZ (Jul 19, 2011)

GMO said:


> No...
> 
> You'll want to run both compounds for the same length of time. The NPP is a short ester and will clear long before your enanthate does.
> 
> ...


 

  Only thing I would do different would be to pin the NPP EOD, but that's just me.  Otherwise, perfect.


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## XYZ (Jul 19, 2011)

malfeasance said:


> You and SloppyJ both recommend caber, instead of prami. Any reasons? I am not issuing a challenge, I am genuinely curious. Please elaborate if you can, so that I can learn.


 

Parmipexole is stronger than cabergoline mg vs. mg, hands down.  It is better with gyno issues and increases your body's natural GH release (A VERY good thing for weightlifters).  The problem is people do not know how to dose it correctly or know how to increase the dose.  It's powerful and needs to be used in the correct way.  Those who don't know how to dose it and increrase the dose correctly seem to have sides while taking it.  If you do it right from the beginning, you'll be fine.

Cabergoline isn't as strong and in large doses or prolonged exposure it's been shown to cause damage to heart valves.

That is the majority of the differences.


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## malfeasance (Jul 19, 2011)

CT said:


> To answer your question, the most effective of the three you mention is pramipexole. Cabergoline has been shown to cause damage to heart valves over time in lagre doses.
> 
> .125mg a day for 4 days and then up the dose by .125 every 4 days from that point. Once you get above .5mg you will need to split the dose to a morning and evening dose schedule. Start on a Friday evening as it will knock you out within an hour of taking it. Insomnia is also an issue at first.


 


CT said:


> Parmipexole is for progestin sides and should always be used with any 19nor. no matter what dose.
> 
> Think of it this way, why wait for a gyno problem? using the proper tools makes sure a problem isn't going to even exist.
> 
> ...


 


nd2bhge said:


> hey guys we have talked alot about these compounds just an update im taking prami @.50mgs about 2hrs before bed. started @ .25mgs for a week and up it .50mgs. as far as my cycle i just came off prop ten mast winny, starting pct on thurs.and i was planning on staying on the prami as it is performing as described. im wearing my wife out!!!LOL do you think i could back it down to .25mgs and still have the same results? just save some $$.
> thanks!!


 This was from another thread you posted in 2010.  Have your recommendations changed since, and would they be different if somebody was taking only 300 mg of Deca a week?


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## XYZ (Jul 19, 2011)

I would run it at .25mg ED at the most for 300mg deca a week.

Be sure to run it three weeks after the last injection to be sure you don't have issues.  Deca has a very long half life.

Yes, I would still stick with those guidelines.  Measure it with an insulin pin.


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## malfeasance (Jul 19, 2011)

Thanks, CT! 


Can't rep you again, but I appreciate the advice.


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## aussie1 (Jul 20, 2011)

hey thanks for the info, a lot of good advice on here

still asking source about npp, i have a feeling it will be a little more expensive then deca so still deciding on what cycle to run, also need to sort out Cagergoline

i want to lean bulk on this cycle, i know diet will pay a large role in this so diet will be strict and clean, but high cals, my bf is roughly 11-12% atm
-these are my other proposed cycles if any 1 can offer some feedback and advice in terms of what is best for my goals

-test e 625mg/week x 12 weeks  
-possibly winstrol at end of cycle?

-test e 500mg x 12
-deca 300mg x 10

may run clen after pct

thanks


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