# What are your opinions on HIT



## fantasma62 (Jan 28, 2005)

While I have been out with a shoulder injury and an allergy, I have been studying on training that is effective but at the same time is safe for my shoulder problem.  Some mentioned HIT, so I began reading about it.  In fact I even went as far as buying The New High Intensity Training book by Dr. Ellington Darden.
Although the routines seem pretty basic and some of the results have been amazing, I am an old style lifter.  I trained 3-4 times a week and I would train body parts rather than full workouts.
In my case it'll be good to do full body workouts because I am also looking to shed fat or cut.
Now, I need to know from ya'll my internet family, what you folks think about HIT and about the results that it could bring.  I also would like to know how it can also hurt me.  
I respect the opinions from the members of this community and would be hard pressed to not ask for those before I decide to or not to embark in such a training regime...
The floor is yours.......


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## soxmuscle (Jan 28, 2005)

It takes a very ballsy/tough person to properly complete HIT.  I think it is an absolutely brilliant program, and even went as far as to buy the Darden book you too bought.  There are some excellent stories in there, and some excellent tips aswell, but personally I like to seperate what I do on each day.

Duncan Donuts is probably the biggest HIT advocate around, you should check out his journal, very informative.


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## King Silverback (Jan 28, 2005)

I used HIT to get ready for my first ever contest. I decided about 10 months out that I was going to do it. This was no easy task though as I was almost 280 pounds of pure blubber. Never really worked out consistantly. A month here, a month there. A week here a, week there. I followed HIT like this. I worked out 3 times a week
Mon-Uppers
Wed-Lowers
Fri-Uppers
and alternate the following week. I did cardio on Tu, Th, and Sat.
Look at my gallery, not exactly much, but I felt and feel much better about myself.


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## fantasma62 (Jan 28, 2005)

Sox: So whatcha think about the team this year. They kept them pretty intact. You'll see that losing Pedro (The turncoat) will not hurt the Sox much. In fact, I'd say that no matter what the Spankmees try to pull, they will still lose. I am also happy because I am a Marlin fan and we took Pedro's buddy away from him (Delgado)
Regarding the HIT, I will definitely keep your comments in mind. I'll check Duncan's journal....

Archangel: Cool Nick by the way....You weighed 280 pounds? and then you looked like that? with HIT? Man, you really did great. What was your competition weight? Thanks for the input, I am really stoked about this....
By the way, Phil. 4:13, a very strong verse....


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## Luke9583 (Jan 28, 2005)

Tony, 

HIT/Rest pause made me *noticably* stronger in 2 months.


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## King Silverback (Jan 28, 2005)

fantasma62 said:
			
		

> Archangel: Cool Nick by the way....You weighed 280 pounds? and then you looked like that? with HIT? Man, you really did great. What was your competition weight? Thanks for the input, I am really stoked about this....
> By the way, Phil. 4:13, a very strong verse....


Thanks on the nickname!!! Yes right at 280. All with HIT. My competition weight was 213. No problem, glad to be of assistance!!! Thanks alot for the compliment.
Phil. 4:13, My favorite in the bible!!!


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## Duncans Donuts (Jan 28, 2005)

Arch, you look great man


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## King Silverback (Jan 28, 2005)

Duncans Donuts said:
			
		

> Arch, you look great man


Thanks Brother!!!


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## fantasma62 (Jan 28, 2005)

Duncans Donuts said:
			
		

> Arch, you look great man


I am glad you came by here.  I really couldn't find your journal.....
I'll get to reading...


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## fantasma62 (Jan 28, 2005)

Luke9583 said:
			
		

> Tony,
> 
> HIT/Rest pause made me *noticably* stronger in 2 months.


Thanks Lucky Luke, you know your input is always welcome and expected....


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## fantasma62 (Jan 29, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> I used HIT to get ready for my first ever contest. I decided about 10 months out that I was going to do it. This was no easy task though as I was almost 280 pounds of pure blubber. Never really worked out consistantly. A month here, a month there. A week here a, week there. I followed HIT like this. I worked out 3 times a week
> Mon-Uppers
> Wed-Lowers
> Fri-Uppers
> ...


Now, did you follow the "One set to failure" doctrine?  Or did you do it differently.  Everything that I have read so far, says that if I have proper form and do my reps slowly, I will be close to fatigued in my last rep.
Whatcha think?


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## fantasma62 (Jan 29, 2005)

Well, I was reading Duncan's journal, which by the way was extremely interesting, and he did one set.  He's huge.....


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## King Silverback (Jan 29, 2005)

fantasma62 said:
			
		

> Now, did you follow the "One set to failure" doctrine?  Or did you do it differently.  Everything that I have read so far, says that if I have proper form and do my reps slowly, I will be close to fatigued in my last rep.
> Whatcha think?


Yes Sir I did!!!   I picked 3 exercises from each bp. And did one set to failure for each. Trust me Brother, you will be fatigued!!!


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## Pylon (Jan 29, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Yes Sir I did!!!   I picked 3 exercises from each bp. And did one set to failure for each. Trust me Brother, you will be fatigued!!!


 Forgive me for jumping on, but I'm gonna.

 How many reps are the target for 1 set?  Also, from your journal, it looks like you changed up from this style.  Any reason?


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## King Silverback (Jan 29, 2005)

Pylon said:
			
		

> Forgive me for jumping on, but I'm gonna.
> 
> How many reps are the target for 1 set?  Also, from your journal, it looks like you changed up from this style.  Any reason?


Jump on Brother  8-12 for uppers, and 12-20 for lowers!!! I changed my routine because I know how HIT affects me, now I want to see how another program does, and then go with the one I got the best results on. Plus it keeps my body guessin'!!!


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## Rocco32 (Jan 29, 2005)

C'mon Tony, do HIT!!!!!!! You won't be disappointed. It may take a few w/o's to really get the intensity and the weights where you should be but you'll do great on it.


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## Rocco32 (Jan 29, 2005)

Damn Angel, I didn't know you weighed 280. I used to weigh about 290 a few years back. You look great now, what you accomplished is just awesome!


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## King Silverback (Jan 29, 2005)

rock4832 said:
			
		

> C'mon Tony, do HIT!!!!!!! You won't be disappointed. It may take a few w/o's to really get the intensity and the weights where you should be but you'll do great on it.


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## King Silverback (Jan 29, 2005)

rock4832 said:
			
		

> Damn Angel, I didn't know you weighed 280. I used to weigh about 290 a few years back. You look great now, what you accomplished is just awesome!


Thanks Brother. Much appreciated


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## Pylon (Jan 29, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Jump on Brother  8-12 for uppers, and 12-20 for lowers!!! I changed my routine because I know how HIT affects me, now I want to see how another program does, and then go with the one I got the best results on. Plus it keeps my body guessin'!!!


 OK, so...and sorry if this was done somewhere and I missed it...what was a typical HIT routine and split?  (If it is in your journal, Arch, let me know and I'll go find it.)


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## King Silverback (Jan 29, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> I worked out 3 times a week
> Mon-Uppers
> Wed-Lowers
> Fri-Uppers
> and alternate the following week. I did cardio on Tu, Th, and Sat.



3 exercises for each bp (1 set each exercise to failure)
Is this what you where askin for? It's not in my journal. Just started one with P/RR/S this month!!!


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## Pylon (Jan 29, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> 3 exercises for each bp (1 set each exercise to failure)
> Is this what you where askin for? It's not in my journal. Just started one with P/RR/S this month!!!


 I was looking more at 1 set of this, 1 set of that, 3 days cardio, etc etc etc...


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## j rizz (Jan 29, 2005)

is this just in reference to HIT style lifting or lifting and cardio.
if so, what are some good types of HIT cardio that worked for any of you, if you do use HIT cardio


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## P-funk (Jan 29, 2005)

lifting HIT sytle, one set to failure is great.  the only problem with it is that most people are not mental enough and to big of pu$$ys to do it properly.  Sorry, sad but true.


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## fantasma62 (Jan 29, 2005)

P-funk said:
			
		

> lifting HIT sytle, one set to failure is great. the only problem with it is that most people are not mental enough and to big of pu$$ys to do it properly. Sorry, sad but true.


I agree with you Patrick, you have to have a pair of brass balls to try it.  I have been reading that you get to puke if done right....
I have puked before (right after drinking  ), so I'm not worried.....


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## fantasma62 (Jan 29, 2005)

j rizz said:
			
		

> is this just in reference to HIT style lifting or lifting and cardio.
> if so, what are some good types of HIT cardio that worked for any of you, if you do use HIT cardio


For cardio it's called HIIT, one really good cardio style is Max-OT cardio, I read it's murder.....


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## fantasma62 (Jan 29, 2005)

rock4832 said:
			
		

> C'mon Tony, do HIT!!!!!!! You won't be disappointed. It may take a few w/o's to really get the intensity and the weights where you should be but you'll do great on it.


Oh believe me, I am stoked about doing this.  I was just getting all the information I can gather to do this right...


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## fantasma62 (Jan 29, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Jump on Brother  8-12 for uppers, and 12-20 for lowers!!! I changed my routine because I know how HIT affects me, now I want to see how another program does, and then go with the one I got the best results on. Plus it keeps my body guessin'!!!


Brother, P/RR/S is the shiatzu......Gopro has a very good plan and it works, no question.  I was doing it, but I stopped because I hurt my shoulder, so after therapy ended, I wanted to find something good for cutting and quick (20 min. to 30 min.) since I need to play with my kids daily before they go to bed, and what I have been reading so far about HIT is that there is barely any rest and that I need to have good form to do it, so it will also be a re-learning experience......
I love P/RR/S and I am sure I'll be back on as soon as I am properly healed and have found out how HIT affects me and need to try something else, although not new to me.....


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## King Silverback (Jan 29, 2005)

fantasma62 said:
			
		

> Brother, P/RR/S is the shiatzu......Gopro has a very good plan and it works, no question.  I was doing it, but I stopped because I hurt my shoulder, so after therapy ended, I wanted to find something good for cutting and quick (20 min. to 30 min.) since I need to play with my kids daily before they go to bed, and what I have been reading so far about HIT is that there is barely any rest and that I need to have good form to do it, so it will also be a re-learning experience......
> I love P/RR/S and I am sure I'll be back on as soon as I am properly healed and have found out how HIT affects me and need to try something else, although not new to me.....


Thats ideal for your schedule. You'll have plenty of time to play with your kids. I understand you there!!! And as far as the rest between sets goes. I only rested enough to get to the next exercise. With the exception of squats, I rested till I almost got my wind back!!! Keep a journal. Would like to see your progress along the way and help out if I can!!!


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## camarosuper6 (Jan 29, 2005)

HIT rocks... I use a slightly higher volume HIT routine and Im extremely happy.  I would do the one set to failure if I had a good spotter (which is really needed for HIT style training).

I use more of a Max OT approach ... between 4-6 sets per bodypart, 4-8 reps per bodypart, to failure.


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## fantasma62 (Jan 30, 2005)

Archangel said:
			
		

> Thats ideal for your schedule. You'll have plenty of time to play with your kids. I understand you there!!! And as far as the rest between sets goes. I only rested enough to get to the next exercise. With the exception of squats, I rested till I almost got my wind back!!! Keep a journal. Would like to see your progress along the way and help out if I can!!!


Oh I am definitely keeping my journal.  Did a good enough job with my P/RR/S journal...I'll accept all the help offered and all the pointers given...I may be older, but I can still learn from the young folks....


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## fantasma62 (Jan 30, 2005)

camarosuper6 said:
			
		

> HIT rocks... I use a slightly higher volume HIT routine and Im extremely happy. I would do the one set to failure if I had a good spotter (which is really needed for HIT style training).
> 
> I use more of a Max OT approach ... between 4-6 sets per bodypart, 4-8 reps per bodypart, to failure.


I have seen your results in your gallery, you are definitely benefitting from HIT and it shows, congrats....


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## j rizz (Jan 30, 2005)

hey fantasma..what does the Max OT HIIT consist of.. please explain
and what is p/rr/s ??
as much as i hate asking questions that prolly make you say ( why is this kid so dumb ) i still just gotta ask and be informed.
thnks.


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## BigDyl (Jan 31, 2005)

Another alternative to HIT, if you can't hand the intensity is Semi-High Initensity Training or SHIT.


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## fantasma62 (Jan 31, 2005)

j rizz said:
			
		

> hey fantasma..what does the Max OT HIIT consist of.. please explain
> and what is p/rr/s ??
> as much as i hate asking questions that prolly make you say ( why is this kid so dumb ) i still just gotta ask and be informed.
> thnks.


It's Ok, we weren't born knowing everything. Ask questions and don't forget research....
Max OT is a form of HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training). Check this article: http://www.ast-ss.com/articles/article.asp?AID=97

P/RR/S is a training routine that one of our trainers here in IM, Gopro, has designed. If you want to find out more about it go to the training forum, where we are now, and the very top sticky is called Power/Rep Range/Shock, the basics. It is a great tool to find out a little more information about this type of training. 
There is also another very good training method called Westside. If you want a very good gauge on how to do that type of training, one of the best people for that out there is Saturday Night Fever. Look at his diary......

I hope this was helpful....


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## j rizz (Feb 1, 2005)

thnaks man.. that link was very helpful.
the best ive had Max-OT explained to me.


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## KarlW (Feb 1, 2005)

BigDyl said:
			
		

> Another alternative to HIT, if you can't hand the intensity is Semi-High Initensity Training or SHIT.


I do Semi-High Initensity Training every morning.


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## fantasma62 (Feb 1, 2005)

j rizz said:
			
		

> thnaks man.. that link was very helpful.
> the best ive had Max-OT explained to me.


Any time


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## ALBOB (Feb 1, 2005)

I'm gonna add to a couple of points that have already been mentioned.

1)  High Intensity Training requires absolute, 100% mental committment.  There are very few people on the planet who can push their bodies hard enough to reach momentary muscular failure.  And only with true momentary muscular failure can you call it a maximum set.  That's why you hear people like camarosuper6 mention "higher volume HIT".  This, in my mind, would be a better way to go because it increases the likleyhood of truely exhausting the target muscle 100%.  You're still limiting the time you're in the gym, but you're guaranteeing you get a complete workout.  Instead of one "maximum" set, do two.

2)  You mentioned you're recovering from a shoulder injury.  One of the downfalls of HIT is that it is VERY hard on your joints.  I myself have had knee surgery from getting stupid with squats so I'm speaking from experience here.  I firmly believe in HIT because it's done wonders for me, but you have to be careful and pay attention to your body.  By being careful, I mean you have to use PERFECT form.  During HIT you're dealing with much more weight so you can hurt yourself faster than you can blink an eye.  Perfect form is your only protection against injury.  By paying attention to your body, I mean you have to pay very close attention to every little twinge and tweak.  There's a huge difference between giving yourself sore muscles and doing damage to your joints.  Pay attention to which is which and know when to back off.  Once your joints start to hurt they will NOT stop until you give them a chance to recover.  That means ditching the HIT routine for a while and going to lower weights and higher reps.  Dorian Yates did that a few years back and discovered he made tremendous gains during his "recovery" periods.


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## fantasma62 (Feb 1, 2005)

ALBOB said:
			
		

> I'm gonna add to a couple of points that have already been mentioned.
> 
> 1) High Intensity Training requires absolute, 100% mental committment. There are very few people on the planet who can push their bodies hard enough to reach momentary muscular failure. And only with true momentary muscular failure can you call it a maximum set. That's why you hear people like camarosuper6 mention "higher volume HIT". This, in my mind, would be a better way to go because it increases the likleyhood of truely exhausting the target muscle 100%. You're still limiting the time you're in the gym, but you're guaranteeing you get a complete workout. Instead of one "maximum" set, do two.
> 
> 2) You mentioned you're recovering from a shoulder injury. One of the downfalls of HIT is that it is VERY hard on your joints. I myself have had knee surgery from getting stupid with squats so I'm speaking from experience here. I firmly believe in HIT because it's done wonders for me, but you have to be careful and pay attention to your body. By being careful, I mean you have to use PERFECT form. During HIT you're dealing with much more weight so you can hurt yourself faster than you can blink an eye. Perfect form is your only protection against injury. By paying attention to your body, I mean you have to pay very close attention to every little twinge and tweak. There's a huge difference between giving yourself sore muscles and doing damage to your joints. Pay attention to which is which and know when to back off. Once your joints start to hurt they will NOT stop until you give them a chance to recover. That means ditching the HIT routine for a while and going to lower weights and higher reps. Dorian Yates did that a few years back and discovered he made tremendous gains during his "recovery" periods.


Albob, thanks for the wisdom, as I have said before, I am a good listener (reader in this case) and I definitely listen to the advice of those who have been there and done that....
Thanks again...


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## CowPimp (Feb 1, 2005)

ALBOB said:
			
		

> One of the downfalls of HIT is that it is VERY hard on your joints.  I myself have had knee surgery from getting stupid with squats so I'm speaking from experience here.



Are you sure that it's HIT that caused the need for surgery, and not long-term wear and tear?  In theory, HIT should be easier on one's joints because you place them under stress for a much small number of repetitions and subsequently and much shorter amount of time.


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## Duncans Donuts (Feb 1, 2005)

> ne of the downfalls of HIT is that it is VERY hard on your joints. I myself have had knee surgery from getting stupid with squats so I'm speaking from experience here.



How is one set to failure any more hard on your joints than multiple set marathon-esque sessions?


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## Duncans Donuts (Feb 1, 2005)

> In theory, HIT should be easier on one's joints because you place them under stress for a much small number of repetitions



In theory and in practice.


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## fantasma62 (Feb 2, 2005)

Duncan and Cowpimp:  You know I was about to post that I have absolutely no pain in my joints.  I woke up yesterday with 0 pain in my shoulder (I had tendonitis and I am still recovering, but therapist gave me the Ok for training) or my knees, which are really a problem area for me.  I know for a fact that my form in some of the routines was deficient at best, and still I got no pain in the shoulder or knees.  My back is a little tight, but I did do the bent over rows with an underhand grip, however I didn't have good form and still the pain (soreness) is right where it's supposed to be.
The only pain that I felt yest. and even some today was in my legs, biceps, shoulders, hair, toes, even my car hurt, but it's just plain soreness from working out.  I am looking forward to part 2 today....


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## Pylon (Feb 2, 2005)

I just finished my first cycle (upper and lower split) with HIT.  I'm not sure if it really counts, since I am trying to zone in on the weights to use, but still like it a lot.  I find I get as much if not more exertion in shorter time, which is always good.

 I found it interesting the trainer at my gym wasn't familiar with the program.  He looked at my set list and said "you're doing too much."  When I explained the idea to him, he said "Where did you hear about that?"  I explained a little more and he said "Well, whatever you want to do, I guess.  I've never heard of it."  I'm starting to think I have overestimated him...Oh well.


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## fantasma62 (Feb 2, 2005)

Pylon said:
			
		

> I just finished my first cycle (upper and lower split) with HIT. I'm not sure if it really counts, since I am trying to zone in on the weights to use, but still like it a lot. I find I get as much if not more exertion in shorter time, which is always good.
> 
> I found it interesting the trainer at my gym wasn't familiar with the program. He looked at my set list and said "you're doing too much." When I explained the idea to him, he said "Where did you hear about that?" I explained a little more and he said "Well, whatever you want to do, I guess. I've never heard of it." I'm starting to think I have overestimated him...Oh well.


It is amazing that this is such an old principle and that the trainer didn't know about HIT......You should train him....


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## King Silverback (Feb 2, 2005)

Pylon said:
			
		

> I just finished my first cycle (upper and lower split) with HIT.  I'm not sure if it really counts, since I am trying to zone in on the weights to use, but still like it a lot.  I find I get as much if not more exertion in shorter time, which is always good.
> 
> I found it interesting the trainer at my gym wasn't familiar with the program.  He looked at my set list and said "you're doing too much."  When I explained the idea to him, he said "Where did you hear about that?"  I explained a little more and he said "Well, whatever you want to do, I guess.  I've never heard of it."  I'm starting to think I have overestimated him...Oh well.


Of course it counts!!! Keep it up Brother!!!


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## King Silverback (Feb 2, 2005)

fantasma62 said:
			
		

> It is amazing that this is such an old principle and that the trainer didn't know about HIT......You should train him....


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## King Silverback (Feb 2, 2005)

fantasma62 said:
			
		

> Duncan and Cowpimp:  You know I was about to post that I have absolutely no pain in my joints.  I woke up yesterday with 0 pain in my shoulder (I had tendonitis and I am still recovering, but therapist gave me the Ok for training) or my knees, which are really a problem area for me.  I know for a fact that my form in some of the routines was deficient at best, and still I got no pain in the shoulder or knees.  My back is a little tight, but I did do the bent over rows with an underhand grip, however I didn't have good form and still the pain (soreness) is right where it's supposed to be.
> The only pain that I felt yest. and even some today was in my legs, biceps, shoulders, hair, toes, even my car hurt, but it's just plain soreness from working out.  I am looking forward to part 2 today....


That was a huge benefit for me as well!!! If my shoulder and elbow problems come back, I will seriously consider going back to HIT!!! Keep it up Brother!!!


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## KarlW (Feb 2, 2005)

Question re HIT:

Some are saying that it is hard because you use such heavy weights. Is there any rule as to what rep range one should use with HIT? Could you not also periodize the rep ranges (and hence weight) over the weeks all the time training to absolute failure?


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## Duncans Donuts (Feb 3, 2005)

Yes, there is no definitive rep range in regards to HIT.  I typically do 6-8 for upper body and 8-12 for lower; however, I change this up periodically to shoo away neurmuscular issues that might come up from doing the same rep range.


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## BigDyl (Feb 3, 2005)

Duncans Donuts said:
			
		

> Yes, there is no definitive rep range in regards to HIT.  I typically do 6-8 for upper body and 8-12 for lower; however, I change this up periodically to shoo away neurmuscular issues that might come up from doing the same rep range.




How many days a week do you train?  2 or 3?  Like Monday/Thursday.  Or Monday/Wednesday/Friday.  Etc.


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