# I need help with the bench press.



## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 22, 2002)

Im 15 and i can bench press 90 pounds 10 times. What is the best way i should go about trying to increase this? How many times a week should i do it? Sets? etc

if i work very hard at this what do you think i could get up to eventually? in 3 months? 6months?

thanks


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## gopro (Oct 23, 2002)

Good job my friend. You are off to a good start. I'm glad you want to increase your bench press, but please do not neglect the rest of your body. You don't want to have a disproportionate and unbalanced physique. My suggestion would be a 3 day per week routine...monday, wednesday, friday...

Mon:
-bench press
-squat
-bent row

Wed:
-deadlift
-military press
-skull crushers

Fri:
-bench press
-upright row
-barbell curl

These basics will build good size and strength throughout your physique and help your bench press to go up. How much? Well that depends on how well you eat, how hard you work, how consistent you are, and, how good your genetics are. Anybody though, can make HUGE improvements.


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## Mudge (Oct 23, 2002)

You should find that it goes up relatively quickly I would think. I was able to start out with a gain of about 5 and sometimes 10 pounds a week when I first started out.

Good luck!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 23, 2002)

*thanks*

thanks
i deffinetly dont neglect the other parts of my body though.

1. do you think it is better for me to only go 3 times a week than 4? right now i have been doing mon tues - off wed - thurs and fri - off sat sunday. is your way for me better?

2. by eating right do you mean not eating candy and stuff? cus i dont. plus i drink one shake a day from meso-tech. and usually have a nitro-tech bar. is this enough protein or not?

3. tell me if i should stick to what i was already doing or go to yours. 

mon:
arms - tri, bi

tues:
back, shoulders

wed:
-

thurs:
chest

fri:
legs

4. another thing im not trying to gain tons of weight though cus im doing this for basketball. but i am trying to be an unmovable and overpowering guy inside. so i want a low body fat %. im i doing this right for basketball?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 23, 2002)

*btw*

by the way im 6'4 220


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## Mudge (Oct 23, 2002)

Try to get some protein in each meal of the day, 1 gram per pound to 1.5


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 23, 2002)

*hello?*

hello?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 23, 2002)

*o ok*

ok i got your PM, thanks


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## gopro (Oct 24, 2002)

Well, now knowing that you are training for basketball  I need a few more questions answered.

-how many times per week do you play ball...how long per session...on what days?
-do you do any other cardiovascular training like running, biking, etc?

If you want to be a force under the boards in basketball than the bench press is only one of several basic exercises you need to be concerned with. You need power and strength through your whole body, from calves right up to your neck.

As for diet...you should be eating 6 times per day. There should be quality protein and carbs at each meal. You need the protein for muscle repair and carbs for endurance. I would look to get about 1 gram of protein per lb of bodyweight and 2 grams of carbs per lb...EACH DAY.

Answer the questions above and I'll get back to you about your program.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 25, 2002)

*hey*

I play about 5 times a week. Each for a little under an hour. The season hasnt started yet but im getting ready.  the tryouts start in about 3 weeks. i think im still fine to do the maximum training though.

right now im am not doing any other training, but basketball involves a lot of running so i usually dont continue to run after i play. i do want to get a tread mill for home though.

is it ok to eat a protein bar for breakfast?

i also heard that a really low body fat % can really help with your vertical. i think my % is over what it should be. so if i could get it down i could get some easy dunks which is a lot easier than layups.

thanks


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 25, 2002)

*bump*

bump


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## rage2132 (Oct 25, 2002)

Well since it's for bball here is my input.

I'm 22 now, and was a pretty big into basketball when I was in high school and before. First off, Make sure you keep the rest of your body healthy, I'm 6'7 now and was about your height at 15 too. 

For bench maybe some pyramids to gain power. But for me since I was a Forward/Center. I really concentrated on my legs, back, arms and chest. 

Legs are the most important IMHO for a bigman. I neglected them my Sr. year and lost my oppurtunity to play college ball when I completely tore apart my ACL,MCL, and cartilidge on one of my knees. Also, your legs are a big factor for boxing out, rebounding, posting etc.... Quads and calves are great for this. Even if you are undersized you can hold off bigger people with your legs and butt. 

I did mostly pyramid styles for power building and consistent bulking. My main mistake was my lapse in cardio always saying "that's what preseason is for". Do the cardio you lose some mass but gain a speed advantage. 

Don't forget stretching either. being 6'4 and being able to move and bend in other ways that bigger people can't is a huge help. 

Eat hearty meals. Don't skimp out on meals and rest. 

As for a routine it depends on your practice schedule. Normally Summer time and Pre Season (depending if you are on traveling teams or not) I had practice 4 times a week. My shedule looked like this for working out:

Sunday: Off Day
Monday: Practice
Tuesday: Arms/Chest/Back (Incline, Bench, Preacher Curls, Hammer Curls, Pull Downs, Seated Row, Skull Crushers, Pushdowns/dips, Pullups)
Wed: Practice and Stretching
Thursday: Legs/Abs/Cardio (Medicine ball jumping, take a medicine ball hold it over your head jump with it and and try to touch it against the rim or back board, Lunges, Squats/Leg Press, Calves, Leg Extensions, Abs, Running)
Friday: Practice and Stretching
Saturday: Practice and Light Back and Arm (Pull ups, Dips, Concern. Curl, Skull crushers, seated row)

This might not work for you, and there are many different routines you can do, thats just what I did and I got some decent results, nothing great though. 

As for the Body fat, I liked having a little "cushioning" from the other guy. I never measured it, I based it on my performance during practices and games. If i was getting to tired and worn out, off to the cardio i went to shed some pounds and waved some of the carbs away.  Do what you feel comfortable with, and like Go Pro said don't neglect the rest of your body. 

Best of luck!


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## gopro (Oct 25, 2002)

*Re: hey*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> I play about 5 times a week. Each for a little under an hour. The season hasnt started yet but im getting ready.  the tryouts start in about 3 weeks. i think im still fine to do the maximum training though.
> 
> right now im am not doing any other training, but basketball involves a lot of running so i usually dont continue to run after i play. i do want to get a tread mill for home though.
> ...



Well your needs are twofold. You want to be strong under the boards so as not to be pushed around AND you want a good vertical. I think you should have a relatively low BF %, but not too low. You need your strength and going too low will leave you with low energy. You need to find a balance...around 10% would be good.

Yes, you can eat a protein bar for breakfast if you are short on time...just don't ever skip it!

You can stay with a 4 day per week schedule if you wish, but your training should revolve around basic compound exercises. You need a strong core (low back and abs) and strong legs and calves. Your chest and delts need power as well as your upper back and traps. Avoid the little isolation exercises like cable crossovers, tricep pushdowns, and leg extensions. Focus on deadlifts, squats, bent rows, bench press, incline press, military press, shrugs, cleans, upright rows, etc. These are functional movements that will cross over to the type of strength needed in your sport. You may also wish to learn to do some exercises on a swiss ball. The swiss ball will increase balance, core strength, and work your stabilizer muscles which tend to tire during sports.

Your workouts should last no more than an hour or so. You should train in a rep range of 4-6 for strength and 15-20 for endurance. You can switch off week to week or combine these rep ranges within one workout.

Does that help?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 25, 2002)

*thanks*

yeah thanks rage and gopro it helps a ton. im going to look up how to do a lot of the things you guys said like dead lifts and skull crushers etc ( i am not familiar with these).

right now with my legs i am doing 270 lbs w/ calf raises (30 reps) and 540 with the leg press(12 reps).

im really trying to increase my vertical and was wondering if you knew anything that was especially good for it. i will also be doing the air alert jump program. 

i found this on a vertical site:
Two foot jump
63% Quadriceps
20% Calves
2% Deltoids
15% Arms

One leg jump
50% Quadriceps
25% Calves
15% Hamstrings
10% Arms

is there a way to become more explosive through weight lifting? like do you do something differently?

ps: rage were you going to play d1 or d3, just wondering.

thanks a ton


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 25, 2002)

*o yeah*

i have been reading and i heard that some of the olympic lifters that do the dead lift and other things have great verts. like one guy who weighed 380 pounds had a 40 inch vertical. do you know any of these types of lifts that i might be able to do?


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## rage2132 (Oct 25, 2002)

*Re: thanks*



> _*
> 
> ps: rage were you going to play d1 or d3, just wondering.
> 
> thanks a ton *_


_*

Most of the D1's I got were general recruit letters (IE send it to show then know about you, follow up on you, and hope you come to their school and play their practice team, and maybe you up if you improve a great deal.) I would have gone D3 to Sewanee (School of the South) or Loyola.  

I was no where near good/tall/big enough to play Big Conference D1 ball *_


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## gopro (Oct 26, 2002)

*Re: thanks*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> yeah thanks rage and gopro it helps a ton. im going to look up how to do a lot of the things you guys said like dead lifts and skull crushers etc ( i am not familiar with these).
> 
> right now with my legs i am doing 270 lbs w/ calf raises (30 reps) and 540 with the leg press(12 reps).
> ...




There are certain weight training exercises that can help with your jumping ability. These include "quick, explosive" movements like jump squats, jump cleans, power cleans, clean and jerks, power presses, etc.

You may also want to buy a book on the basics of PLYOMETRICS. Plyometrics is a form of training that is aimed at producing explosive-reactive movements inherent in throwing, sprinting and JUMPING! Some basic plyo exercises would be quite beneficial to you...but you must learn to do them correctly!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 26, 2002)

*thanks again*

thanks again for the post. 
i have looked into plyometrics and i bought a book and the Air Alert program www.airalert.com

right now with my legs i am doing 270 lbs w/ calf raises (30 reps) and 540 with the leg press(12 reps).

is that ok for me right now?

i am also trying to find out how to do these deadlifts and cleans properly.

thanks


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## gopro (Oct 27, 2002)

*Re: thanks again*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> thanks again for the post.
> i have looked into plyometrics and i bought a book and the Air Alert program www.airalert.com
> 
> ...



Good...the plyometrics will help alot. As for your leg strength...that is all relative...just keep trying to improve. Just remember to lift "explosively!" This means that you control the negative portion of the movement and then push as hard and as fast as you can on the positive. The weight won't actually move very fast, but you will teach your muscles to move explosively...like a vertical jump.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 30, 2002)

*hey*

hey i was just wondering if it was ok to do the calfs three times a week along witht the other stuff? like mon wed fri??


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## Scotty the Body (Oct 30, 2002)

If your hittting them hard, twice a week should be more than enough. 2 days rest isn't enough rest for me.


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## gopro (Oct 30, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by Scotty the Body *_
> If your hittting them hard, twice a week should be more than enough. 2 days rest isn't enough rest for me.



I agree...2 days a week is enough.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 30, 2002)

ok then i guess ill go with mon and fri

How do you think i should work out my schedule cus i have this problem: my school doesnt have any good stuff for the shoulders and back and i do those on the same day. 

so do you think i should do something like this:
mon: Arms, calf
Tues: - 
wed: Chest
thurs: - 
Friday: legs
Saturday: back shoulders, i can go to a real gym with tons of stuff - i just get a much better work out of the shoulders and back there

**if you could arrange this better tell me 

thanks


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 31, 2002)

*bump*

bump


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## gopro (Oct 31, 2002)

That is fine...I would make one change...

mon...arms, calf
wed...legs
fri...chest, calf
sat...back and delts


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 31, 2002)

*thanks*

hey thanks but just wondering why the switch.  the reason that i did legs on friday was so i could rest for the weekend since there isnt much bball but thats ok, my legs dont get as tired as they used to the next day


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## gopro (Oct 31, 2002)

I wanted you to have a day off from the gym after legs. Also, I felt this arrangement to be better for your bench press.


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## Golds_Soldier (Oct 31, 2002)

Guys lets not forget that younger individuals seem to recover much faster than older ppl. Right now i lift 6days on 1 day off each body part i hit 2 times a week and heal wonderfully.

Dude, if u wanna increase your bench press you should definetelly try heavy close grip bench presses, those add at least 25lbs to your max bench if u do them regularly


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## BirdyBirdMan (Oct 31, 2002)

*question*

i  have a question. I see a ton of people at my school that bench press everyday of the week.  I always thought that they were going about this wrong. Am i right and are they not making the gains that they should by doing this?

also is one time a week for anything good enough, except calfs? any suggestions on anything else i should be doing more or am i good to go? 

by the way i wanted to leave you with what i was planning to do on my chest workout tommorow. tell me what you think
ps i will try the close grip.

1. bench press
2. incline bp
3. decline bp
4. close grip bp
5. decline machine

6. calf raise


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## Golds_Soldier (Oct 31, 2002)

i know a kid he benches 3 times a week, just bech press nothing else and by the time he was 17 he was doing 355 1x and sets of 225 he took the summer off from lifting so now he is down to about 300lbs max but he does amazing 255 7x. I am not saying i agree with the kid, just pointing out the facts


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## gopro (Nov 1, 2002)

*Re: question*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> i  have a question. I see a ton of people at my school that bench press everyday of the week.  I always thought that they were going about this wrong. Am i right and are they not making the gains that they should by doing this?
> 
> also is one time a week for anything good enough, except calfs? any suggestions on anything else i should be doing more or am i good to go?
> ...



Please don't fall into the "more is better" mindset! Benching every day of the week is moronic! Training each bodypart once per week INTENSELY is more than enough. If you have a particularly weak bodypart, you can occasionally give it an extra day, but not every week.

As to your routine for chest...too much work, and too much of the same thing. Don't do the decline machine and save CG bench for arm day (its mostly a tricep movement). I would like to see you do no more than 9-10 sets total for your chest (besides warmups). Do you have access to dumbells or a dip bar?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 3, 2002)

*thanks*

what is the best way to recover quickly from my workout. cus now that i have basketball everyday of the week i need to quickly recover so i can actually jump off the ground and pick up the ball with out shaking.

thanks.


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## gopro (Nov 4, 2002)

*Re: thanks*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> what is the best way to recover quickly from my workout. cus now that i have basketball everyday of the week i need to quickly recover so i can actually jump off the ground and pick up the ball with out shaking.
> 
> thanks.



Before you train you should have a serving of whey protein in water with 1000 mg of vitamin C. After training you should have at least 40 grams of whey protein with 80-120 grams of simple carbs, along with 1000 more mg of vitamin C, 5 g of creatine, and 5-10 grams of glutamine. Have this AS SOON AS you are done training. 1-1.5 hours later have another protein/carb meal, but from food, along with a mulivitamin that contains anti-oxidants!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 4, 2002)

*thanks again*

thanks again. just wondering though what "serving of whey protein in water with 1000 mg of vitamin C" do you reccomend cus i dont have that right now. i guess i should go to gnc and pick one up. also can i get glutamine there?

if i followed that would that make me feel almost completely recovered the next day?

by the way what do carbs help with? also vitamin c.


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## Mudge (Nov 4, 2002)

Sleep, 8-10 hours a night if your still young. I still like to have 8-9 hours a night and I'm 26.


Carbs = energy source, oatmeal, brown rice, etc are good carbs, not sugary 'crap'.


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## gopro (Nov 5, 2002)

*Re: thanks again*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> thanks again. just wondering though what "serving of whey protein in water with 1000 mg of vitamin C" do you reccomend cus i dont have that right now. i guess i should go to gnc and pick one up. also can i get glutamine there?
> 
> if i followed that would that make me feel almost completely recovered the next day?
> ...



Yes, go pick some up. Get a good quality whey from a reputable company...Designer is great. A serving is about 2 scoops usually.

As for the vit C...just by some capsules that have 500-1000 mg per cap...I like Twinlab, but any reputable brand will do.

Yes, you can get glutamine there. Again, go with a "big name" brand.

The carbs help to refill glycogen (stored carbohydrate) stores...very important...and also they help keep cortisol (muscle destroying hormone) at bay. 

Also, as Mudge intelligently mentioned...proper sleep is ESSENTIAL!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 11, 2002)

*question*

i have a question. do you think i have to train in the weight room still. i have found that i have very little time with basketball. but i dont want to lose my strength. do you think i should stop and then pick it up again from spring till next winter? or what do you think. also i didnt want my muscles tired for practices and games. (this is the main problem).


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## gopro (Nov 13, 2002)

*Re: question*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> i have a question. do you think i have to train in the weight room still. i have found that i have very little time with basketball. but i dont want to lose my strength. do you think i should stop and then pick it up again from spring till next winter? or what do you think. also i didnt want my muscles tired for practices and games. (this is the main problem).



Absolutely DO NOT stop training with weights during the basket ball season! If you have very little time to train you can do the most basic routine and can still maintain your strength through the season. Then, after the season you can go back to a full routine and reach the next level. Here is what I suggest...

(pick 2 days during the week...monday and thurday or tuesday and friday for example)

Day 1:
bench press...3 x 6-8
deadlift...3 x 6-8
military press...3 x 6-8

Day 2:
squat...3 x 8-10
bent row...3 x 8-10
CG bench press...3 x 8-10

Thats it. 2 quick workouts and you will maintain and have energy to play B ball.


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## Arnold (Nov 13, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by Golds_Soldier *_
> i know a kid he benches 3 times a week, just bech press nothing else and by the time he was 17 he was doing 355 1x and sets of 225 he took the summer off from lifting so now he is down to about 300lbs max but he does amazing 255 7x. I am not saying i agree with the kid, just pointing out the facts



When I was a teen (and did not know what I was doing) I used to do bench press every Monday, Wednesday & Friday. I think back to those days now and think about how much better my gains would have been had I knew how to work-out.


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## kidda9 (Nov 13, 2002)

if it wernt for this place i wudnt have a clue wot to do,thanx alot for all the help guys really help a novice out(soz geg in on your thread birdman).


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 13, 2002)

*thanks*

thanks guys

ill do your routine gopro
thanks again


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## gopro (Nov 14, 2002)

*Re: thanks*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> thanks guys
> 
> ill do your routine gopro
> thanks again



Good I'm glad. You are quite welcome.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 25, 2002)

*question*

is the controlled bench press (the one where it slides up the bar) as good as the normal? also should the weight be the same?


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## firestorm (Nov 25, 2002)

Agrees with GOPRO.  He gave you a good beginners program and for the record your only 15 and your still growing.  I think you should also consult your local physician regarding weight training.  Being that your body is still growing,  heavy resistance training could have adverse effects on your joints and ligaments.  NOw I'm not saying not to weight lift but keep it in moderation and ask your doctor how much is safe.  I doubt he will condone a rigorous powerlifting or bodybuilding routine.
Good luck to you and train safe.
Fire



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> Im 15 and i can bench press 90 pounds 10 times. What is the best way i should go about trying to increase this? How many times a week should i do it? Sets? etc
> 
> if i work very hard at this what do you think i could get up to eventually? in 3 months? 6months?
> ...


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## Mudge (Nov 26, 2002)

*Re: question*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> is the controlled bench press (the one where it slides up the bar) as good as the normal? also should the weight be the same?



Thats a Smith machine, I like it for incline presses and nothing else, feels very odd on a flat bench for me, I end up benching less on it and it bothers my shoulders.

Many of these machines are assisted, easy way to find out is to just lift the bar, does it feel like 45 pounds + frictional drag, or does it feel like a feather?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 26, 2002)

*k*

thanks bump


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## gopro (Nov 27, 2002)

*Re: question*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> is the controlled bench press (the one where it slides up the bar) as good as the normal? also should the weight be the same?



Well, the real question is...is it as good for what? Generally, I would say no. The regular bench press requires the use of stabilizing muscles while the smith bench does not. However, in some cases the smith machine CAN be superior! In a situation where you have no spotter available, it is not safe to train to failure on a regular bench press. However, on a smith you can more safely train to the point where no more reps are possible. This can make it superior in this case for chest growth. Also, some people find regular bench press to be very hard on their shoulders, but have no problems on the smith...or, vice versa.

In general, if I only had the choice of one or the other, I would choose the regular bench press, however, given the choice of either, there is no reason why you can't change it up now and again. Smith bench press can be especially effective when used later in your routine when you are fatigued and your stabilizers are shot.

Ok, did I confuse you or help you, LOL?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 27, 2002)

*thanks*

yeah that deffinetly helps. but what are the stablizer muscles and what do they help with?


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## Scotty the Body (Nov 27, 2002)

Synergist
A muscle that assists another muscle to accomplish a movement. 

Stabilizer
A muscle that contracts with no significant movement. 

Dynamic Stabilizer
A biarticulate muscle that simultaneously shortens at the target joint and lengthens at the adjacent joint with no appreciable difference in length. Dynamic stabilizion occurs during many compound movements. 

Antagonist Stabilizer
A muscle that contracts to maintain the tension potential of a biarticulate muscle at the adjacent joint. The antagonist stabilizer may be contracted throughout or at only one extreme of the movement. Also see active insufficiency. 

For something like Bench press:
Muscles
Target
Pectoralis Major, Sternal 

Synergists
Pectoralis Major, Clavicular 
Deltoid, Anterior 
Triceps Brachii 

Dynamic Stabilizers
Biceps Brachii, Short Head


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## gopro (Nov 27, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by Scotty the Body *_
> Synergist
> A muscle that assists another muscle to accomplish a movement.
> 
> ...



Scotty...where do you think you are, WBB??


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 27, 2002)

*.*

does weightlifting stunt growth?


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## Wolfpack22 (Nov 27, 2002)

If you are 6' 4" 220 pds. you need to get back down to about 190 or so.  I wouldn't worry about your strength so much right now.  I guess it depends on whether you want a chance at college ball.  If you remain at your current height you will have to lose weight.  Basketball ball is more about leg strength and endurance.  Repetitions would be your best bet right now IMHO.  At 220 pds you are carrying too much weight.  How many basketball players do you see that look like body builders?  They are lean and some are cut.  You won't see any massive body builders on a basketball court.


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## bigss75 (Nov 27, 2002)

What  they would love a kid with speed, height, and size.


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## Scotty the Body (Nov 28, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> Scotty...where do you think you are, WBB??



 HEY, thats not funny!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Nov 28, 2002)

*hey*

I have started planning my offseason workout. Tell me what you think and what changes i should make etc...

This is the schedule you gave me awile ago.
One question though. I see calfs on Mon and Fri, but do i include them in Wed with legs? or just quad and ham?

mon...arms, calf
wed...legs
fri...chest, calf
sat...back and delts

This is what my plan is:

Monday: Arms, Calf
1. Biceps:
    Machine Curls
    Preacher Curls
    Bar Curls
2. Triceps
    Press Downs (bar)
    Press Downs (rope)
    Skull Crushers
3. Calf
    Calf Raises

Wednesday: Legs (This is by far my strongest part.)
1. Quadricep
    Leg Press - I start with 2 45 pounders, then every set I add  one more until I get up to 6. Eventually I will do 7. I can but I think it is really hard on me though.
2. Hamstring
    Leg Curls
3. Calfs?
    Calf Raises?

Friday: Chest, Calf
1. Chest
    Flat Bench Press (Smith Machine)
    Incline Bench Press (Smith Machine)
    Decline Bench Press
2. Calf
    Calf Raises

Saturday: Back, Shoulders
-This is the day I can go with my dad to a bigger gym as opposed to my school gym. At my school they dont have much stuff for shoulders and back. I wish i could go to the good gym all the time but i guess it wont work out like that. But then again I could go over the summer everytime.

As for the routine my dad will usually tell me what to do.


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## rebel (Nov 29, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> Good job my friend. You are off to a good start. I'm glad you want to increase your bench press, but please do not neglect the rest of your body. You don't want to have a disproportionate and unbalanced physique. My suggestion would be a 3 day per week routine...monday, wednesday, friday...
> 
> Mon:
> ...


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## rebel (Dec 1, 2002)

i want to go on a mass training program to put on some size but i'm not too concerned about increasing bench, what type of program, training 3 days week, would you recommend?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 1, 2002)

*gopro?*

gopro???


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 3, 2002)

*bump*

bump


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## gopro (Dec 4, 2002)

I didn't respond originally b/c you mentioned that your dad was going to tell you what to do. What is the goal of your offseason plan? Are you looking for mass, looking to improve the "look" of your physique, or some other goal? How many days per week can you train and for how long?


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## Mudge (Dec 4, 2002)

Strength and diet come together generically to = size, so getting stronger is generally part of the game, although with two seperate individuals you cannot always compare two equally large/small persons and find that they are the same strength, especially if the height is different.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 4, 2002)

*noo*

noo my dad was going to take care of the day i go with him which is saturday. all the other days im at my schools. 

i want to get really strong, but have low body fat for jumping and running. i wrote out my plan a couple posts back. what do you think of it.  i can train as many as i want but i thought 4 was good and thats how you and me set it up earlier. i can train as long as i want. 

basically i will have between 6-10 hours a day devoted to improving myself for basketball including weight lifting. this is over the summer. in the spring i will just weight lift as long as i need and then practice some.


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## rebel (Dec 4, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by rebel *_
> i want to go on a mass training program to put on some size but i'm not too concerned about increasing bench, what type of program, training 3 days week, would you recommend?




what about me?


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## gopro (Dec 5, 2002)

*Re: noo*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> noo my dad was going to take care of the day i go with him which is saturday. all the other days im at my schools.
> 
> i want to get really strong, but have low body fat for jumping and running. i wrote out my plan a couple posts back. what do you think of it.  i can train as many as i want but i thought 4 was good and thats how you and me set it up earlier. i can train as long as i want.
> ...



Since your focus is mostly on strength...actually "functional strength," meaning you need your strength to apply to a sport, you don't need an elaborate program. Your program needs to be simple and basic, and formulated from compound exercises. Your focus needs to be on the larger muscles of the body...chest, shoulders, back, hips, and legs. Here is my suggestion:

MONDAY/THURSDAY: CHEST, BACK, DELTS
-bench press...3-4 x 4-7
-incline press...3-4 x 4-7
-dumbell pullover...2 x 7-10
-chin up (overhand grip)...3-4 x 6-8 (use weight if you can)
-bent over row (underhand grip)...3-4 x 6-8
-military press or upright row...2-3 x 6-8

TUESDAY/FRIDAY: QUADS, HAMS, LOW BACK, CALVES, ABS
-squats...3-4 x 4-7
-leg press...3-4 x 7-10
-deadlift or stiff leg deadlift...3-4 x 4-7
-leg curl...2-3 x 7-10
-seated or standing calf raise...3-4 x 10-12
-crunches or leg raises...3-4 x 15-25


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## gopro (Dec 5, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by rebel *_
> what about me?



Would I forget you my friend! What do you need? A 3 day program for mass and strength? Tell me and I'll tell you!


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## rebel (Dec 5, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> Would I forget you my friend! What do you need? A 3 day program for mass and strength? Tell me and I'll tell you!



wanting to go on a 3 day per week program for overall mass and strength.
thanks gopro!


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## gopro (Dec 6, 2002)

Well rebel. Here is a good 3 day mass program:

MONDAY:

-bench press...4 x 6-8
-deadlift...4 x 4-6
-military press...3 x 6-8
-barbell curl...2 x 8-10

WEDNESDAY:

-squats...4 x 6-10
-incline press...4 x 6-8
-bent row...4 x 6-8
-upright row...3 x 6-8

FRIDAY:

-CG bench press...3 x 6-8
-leg press...4 x 6-10
-stiff leg deadlift...3 x 6-8
-weighted chin...4 x 4-6


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 6, 2002)

*question*

i have a question for you gopro. im just wondering why do you combine all body parts into 2 days instead of work one or two each day. like each one or two a different day of the week? just wondering


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## rebel (Dec 7, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> Well rebel. Here is a good 3 day mass program:
> 
> MONDAY:
> ...



looks good, but i need a substitute for leg presses on friday cause i don't have access to a leg press machine.  i really appreciate your help.


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## gopro (Dec 7, 2002)

*Re: question*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> i have a question for you gopro. im just wondering why do you combine all body parts into 2 days instead of work one or two each day. like each one or two a different day of the week? just wondering



For a more "bodybuilding" oriented routine, I would just work 1 or 2 bodyparts per day as many more exercises are needed to sculpt the physique. For a more basic, strength oriented program like yours you only need a few compound movements to get the job done. This means less overall exercises and a program wherein you can practice these movements more than just once per week.


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## gopro (Dec 7, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by rebel *_
> looks good, but i need a substitute for leg presses on friday cause i don't have access to a leg press machine.  i really appreciate your help.



Front squat, barbell hack squat, or barbell lunges.


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## james_75 (Dec 8, 2002)

this is my input go shoot after you are done workin out helps keep your shoton i found this to hlep w/ that


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 8, 2002)

*thanks*

thanks


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## firestorm (Dec 8, 2002)

Barbell Hack squats?  What do these be?  I know what Hack squats are but only the machine version.  I never heard of barbell Hack squats.  I must know how to do these there thingys.
fire



> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> Front squat, barbell hack squat, or barbell lunges.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 8, 2002)

*gopro*

gopro: do you think i will benefit more from a 5 day or 4 day schedule?


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## gopro (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: gopro*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> gopro: do you think i will benefit more from a 5 day or 4 day schedule?



4 day.


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## gopro (Dec 9, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by firestorm *_
> Barbell Hack squats?  What do these be?  I know what Hack squats are but only the machine version.  I never heard of barbell Hack squats.  I must know how to do these there thingys.
> fire



(SPEAKIN IN "FIRESTORM" LANGAUGE): this is what barbell hack squat thingies be...

Hold a barbell behind your back and squat down while keeping your back as straight as possible. Simple, isn't it! In the beginning it can be a little awkward to do, however, this is a very effective exercise! The "oldtimers" did this exercise quite a bit to build their thighs. Since it is very hard to hold a large amount of weight in this position, I recommend that this exercise be used as the second half of a pre-exhaust superset with leg extensions, or, that it be done last in your quad routine when your thighs are tired.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 9, 2002)

*hey*

hey can you tell me what your power rep shock workout is all about?


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## firestorm (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: hey*

Go to the "Sticky" on this Board titled "GoPros Workout"  2nd post down will give you his workout.  
To give you what I believe the Key to this program is:
1. overtraining will not occur yet you will work your azz off.
2. Variation all the way around.  Excercises, Rep counts, resistence.
3. Muscle confusion: One of the best tools in bodybuilding.  Your muscles will not get accustomed to a stringent program because Your hitting the muscles differently every week and with different excercises and poundage, and rep counts.

This program in my opinion is one of the Best training phylosopies I've seen in quite some time.  GoPro  took all the best excercises, best training techniques and encorporated them all together to give you the best of everything.  Outstanding job but don't tell him I said all this. I'll deny it and blame someone else for using my signon and password.




> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> hey can you tell me what your power rep shock workout is all about?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 9, 2002)

*..*

thanks for the overview. what is the difference between the one you gave me and the power rep shock? just wondering 
thanks


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## firestorm (Dec 9, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> (SPEAKIN IN "FIRESTORM" LANGAUGE): this is what barbell hack squat thingies be...
> 
> Hold a barbell behind your back and squat down while keeping your back as straight as possible. Simple, isn't it! In the beginning it can be a little awkward to do, however, this is a very effective exercise! The "oldtimers" did this exercise quite a bit to build their thighs. Since it is very hard to hold a large amount of weight in this position, I recommend that this exercise be used as the second half of a pre-exhaust superset with leg extensions, or, that it be done last in your quad routine when your thighs are tired.



Ok that sounds like a normal squat.  I don't get the difference.  I'm assuming it has to do with placement of the bar on the back.  Where on the back?


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## firestorm (Dec 9, 2002)

He gave you a Mass "specific" program.


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## gopro (Dec 9, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by firestorm *_
> Ok that sounds like a normal squat.  I don't get the difference.  I'm assuming it has to do with placement of the bar on the back.  Where on the back?



When I say hold the barbell behind the back, I mean ACTUALLY HOLD IT...LIKE, IN YOUR HANDS...NOT RESTING ON YOUR BACK LIKE A REGULAR SQUAT! This is a very unique movement that will force more work into your quads, sort of like a front squat.


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## gopro (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: hey*



> _*Originally posted by firestorm *_
> Go to the "Sticky" on this Board titled "GoPros Workout"  2nd post down will give you his workout.
> To give you what I believe the Key to this program is:
> 1. overtraining will not occur yet you will work your azz off.
> ...


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## gopro (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: ..*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> thanks for the overview. what is the difference between the one you gave me and the power rep shock? just wondering
> thanks



P, RR, S is more bodybuilding/physique specific. Your program is more for functional strength that is important to your sport. (It will, however, add much mass to your frame as well).


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## firestorm (Dec 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: hey*

The BASTARD!!! Don't you Worry GP, I'll straighten him out and when he is lying there in a puddle of his own blood and guts, I'll bend down and whisper in his ear you said thank you.  I'm sure his response will be:
"Hey I calls it the way I sees it. the man knows his business"



> _*Originally posted by gopro *_


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 9, 2002)

*...*

ok great cus i do want to add lots of mass actually too so i can have my way with people in the post. 

is this routine good for football as well?


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## firestorm (Dec 10, 2002)

mass is great for line and linebacker.  If your a wide receiver, hummmm Lean and mean is the way to go.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 10, 2002)

*yeah*

yeah im line, maybe te


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## gopro (Dec 10, 2002)

*Re: yeah*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> yeah im line, maybe te



I play defensive line in my football league...so yes, the workout I gave you is ACES for that too!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 10, 2002)

*...*

is it possible for me to get really big like ricky williams and jamal lewis and terrel owens you think as long as i work on it for the next 4+ years. 

what kind of strength do you think i could get from working really hard on it by next winter?


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 10, 2002)

*...*

o yeah really want to have a body like julius peppers since he played both sports.


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## firestorm (Dec 10, 2002)

don't know what you look like now.  If you need to put on 75 lbs to look like them then no way.  Also, your genetics may have something to say about it all.


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## gopro (Dec 10, 2002)

*Re: ...*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> is it possible for me to get really big like ricky williams and jamal lewis and terrel owens you think as long as i work on it for the next 4+ years.
> 
> what kind of strength do you think i could get from working really hard on it by next winter?



Use those guys as inspiration and then be the best YOU can be. Stay positive, work your ASS of, and do this consistently! Only then will you know what you can accomplish.

(side note: when I started training at age 16 I weighed 125 at my current height of 5'11"...I currently weigh 265! I AM NOT a genetic freak...I just worked my ass off for years and years. You can do it too!)


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 10, 2002)

*...*

well i have really strong legs, but my upper body is kind of weak but has gotten much much stronger since i started. i used to weigh 268, but then over the summer i played basketball all day long every day and now im like 220 or maybe 215. i want to get to 8 percent body fat or so to help me with running and jumping. i also wont to gain lots of pounds in muscle to help me with football and with low post play and rebounding. i want to over power everyone i play by a lot.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 10, 2002)

*...*

plus i need to get taller since im only 6'5 now


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## firestorm (Dec 10, 2002)

yea ya short bastard. hahaha  Well then hearing your stats, your no ectomorph(small frame) (Narrow bone structure)  You sound like you can be a monster.  You have great potential there.  I'm certain if you train hard and SMART, you can be a force to deal with.


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 11, 2002)




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## gopro (Dec 11, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by firestorm *_
> yea ya short bastard. hahaha  Well then hearing your stats, your no ectomorph(small frame) (Narrow bone structure)  You sound like you can be a monster.  You have great potential there.  I'm certain if you train hard and SMART, you can be a force to deal with.



I agree with fire, although I hate to admit that! Stick with me and you WILL be a force!!!


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 11, 2002)

ill deffinetly stick with you


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## gopro (Dec 11, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> ill deffinetly stick with you


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## BirdyBirdMan (Dec 11, 2002)

*quesiton*

is it better to run before or after a workout?


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## gopro (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: quesiton*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> is it better to run before or after a workout?



If you must run, do it after the weights.


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## Arnold (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: quesiton*



> _*Originally posted by BirdyBirdMan *_
> is it better to run before or after a workout?



better off doing it on a off work-out day.


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## firestorm (Dec 15, 2002)

> _*Originally posted by gopro *_
> I agree with fire, although I hate to admit that! Stick with me and you WILL be a force!!!



     :


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## gopro (Dec 16, 2002)




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## firestorm (Dec 16, 2002)

hahahahahaha


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