# vegans



## stepaukas (Aug 7, 2010)

just curious as to why people choose to be vegans. espically athletes.


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## sara (Aug 7, 2010)

they dont like animals to be killed


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## PushAndPull (Aug 7, 2010)

sara said:


> they dont like animals to be killed



Isn't more than that? I thought vegans didn't eat any animal products, even if the animals weren't killed in the process.


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## MDR (Aug 7, 2010)

I think it has to do with cruelty to animals.  Even if the animal is not killed, many vegans see the harvesting of animal products as cruel and immoral.


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## Muscle_Girl (Aug 7, 2010)

Was a little strange when I was looking for an apartment last month, and I came across an advertisement specifically just for someone who was vegan (to be a roommate). I found it a little strange that they required the person to be vegan, is it simply a choice, or is there a common set of guidelines which vegans abide by? The advertisement was clearly discriminatory, but, is it semi-justified?


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## PushAndPull (Aug 7, 2010)

MDR said:


> I think it has to do with cruelty to animals.  Even if the animal is not killed, many vegans see the harvesting of animal products as cruel and immoral.



Absolutely. Milking a cow doesn't hurt it. It's the treatment of the animal that pisses off the vegans.


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## stepaukas (Aug 7, 2010)

as hard as training is at a hig level, i often wonder why one would turn to being a vegan, missing out on top quality protein.


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## Built (Aug 7, 2010)

In addition to the protein issue are high carb intake and the absence of B-12 and EPA/DHA. B-12 you can take as shots or tablets, but EPA/DHA without fish means algae oil, and that's expen$ive.


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## gtbmed (Aug 7, 2010)

I could definitely do the vegetarian thing, but I could never cut milk and eggs out of my diet.

But most vegans diet that way because fighting animal cruelty is a cause they believe in.  I'm not a zealous member of that fight so I don't have to inconvenience myself that way.


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## 200+ (Aug 9, 2010)

MDR said:


> I think it has to do with cruelty to animals.  Even if the animal is not killed, many vegans see the harvesting of animal products as cruel and immoral.



That's what it is.  My wife and I have been vegetarians for over 8 years.  I now added fish to my diet for multiple reasons so I am not technically a vegetarian anymore.  When people ask me why I was/am a vegetarian, I simply tell them that I wouldn't eat my dog and I don't see a difference between a dog and any other mammal.  I used to get people telling me that bodybuilding and vegetarians don't mix, but I don't get that anymore.  I have respect for the people that truly know how and where their meat comes from and still eat it; it's the people that don't want to know that bother me...


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## Strom (Aug 9, 2010)

I couldn't do the vegan diet, love steak to much!


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## MDR (Aug 9, 2010)

200+ said:


> That's what it is.  My wife and I have been vegetarians for over 8 years.  I now added fish to my diet for multiple reasons so I am not technically a vegetarian anymore.  When people ask me why I was/am a vegetarian, I simply tell them that I wouldn't eat my dog and I don't see a difference between a dog and any other mammal.  I used to get people telling me that bodybuilding and vegetarians don't mix, but I don't get that anymore.  I have respect for the people that truly know how and where their meat comes from and still eat it; it's the people that don't want to know that bother me...



There have been a number of great bodybuilders who followed vegetarian diets.  It complicates things a bit, but it is by no means impossible.  Bill Pearl built a very impressive physique, and I believe he followed a vegetarian diet.


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## 200+ (Aug 9, 2010)

MDR said:


> There have been a number of great bodybuilders who followed vegetarian diets.  It complicates things a bit, but it is by no means impossible.  Bill Pearl built a very impressive physique, and I believe he followed a vegetarian diet.



That he did!  If I remember correctly I believe he wasn't a vegetarian from the beginning but rather some time later in his career ...


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## Built (Aug 10, 2010)

Yep, Pearl's a veggie, but he's not a vegan and he began his career eating meat.


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## boxingorilla (Aug 10, 2010)

stepaukas said:


> just curious as to why people choose to be vegans. espically athletes.




I can't speak for all vegans but I actually know a couple, they say its for their health...

In a some what related field, I do know of a vegan bodybuilder named Robert Cheeke who just came out with a new book that is supposed to be good for vegans.  Also I have a book called Raw Power that is about raw food body building that is pretty interesting.


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## MDR (Aug 10, 2010)

Built said:


> Yep, Pearl's a veggie, but he's not a vegan and he began his career eating meat.



Interesting. I thought it was something like that.  I would think the vegan deal would be even tougher.  Throws a lot more complications into the mix.  Diet is tough enough.  I shot a deer as a young teenager, and it just didn't feel right, so I understand the whole animal rights deal.  I suppose I'm a bit of a hypocrite.  I grew up eating venison, but I just didn't like the feeling of putting the breaks on a living, breathing animal.  Didn't stop me from eating the meat, though.


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## Nightowl (Aug 15, 2010)

PushAndPull said:


> Isn't more than that? I thought vegans didn't eat any animal products, even if the animals weren't killed in the process.


 
Great point and yes you are indeed correct.  What I found for our defense this being those that do induce any such animal products is the fact that we need the animals alive.  I further went on to commend their efforts with the  structure for those with farm animals and the inhumane treatment of such creatures.

So, I would love to hear the vegan on gear story...anyone


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## DOMS (Aug 15, 2010)

Save an cow, eat a vegan.

Humans are omnivorous.  We can, and must, eat meat.  Yeah, vegatarians can work around it with a very careful diet.  

Vegans, however, need to supplement, which has nothing to do with living healthy.

The power of being a vegan.



> A vegan couple was sentenced Wednesday to life in prison in the death of their malnourished 6-week-old, who was fed a diet largely consisting of soy milk and apple juice.
> 
> Judge L.A. McConnell imposed the sentences on Jade Sanders, 27, and Lamont Thomas, 31, for starving the boy, who weighed just 3 1/2 pounds when he died.
> 
> ...


Great job not harming any animals...


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## 200+ (Aug 15, 2010)

DOMS said:


> The power of being a vegan.
> 
> Great job not harming any animals...



Your implication that their being vegan killed the baby is inaccurate.  Those people are just stupid and should not be reproducing


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## DOMS (Aug 15, 2010)

200+ said:


> Your implication that their being vegan killed the baby is inaccurate.  Those people are just stupid and should not be reproducing



The baby was the real vegan.  He didn't use supplements.

Here's another story.



> A couple who kept their five children on a strict raw foods diet was cleared of aggravated manslaughter Monday for the death of their 6-month-old baby, but convicted of four counts of child neglect.


Being vegans might not been _the_ cause of the deaths, but their actions are inline with the mentality that of the vegans that I've seen in Los Angeles.  Which played a central role in the deaths of those two infants.


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## MDR (Aug 15, 2010)

I think these stories are unfortunate examples of ignorance.  I do think that being vegan and eating healthy is possible, but that it takes a lot of time and effort to do things correctly.  I've been around many vegans who are not inline with the mentality in your examples.  I don't think this is an accurate representation of vegans in general.  It is unfortunate that this has been your experience.


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## danzik17 (Aug 15, 2010)

Fine, stay vegan.

More steak for me.  I just got done slow cooking a 4LB roast today.  It's red on the inside and delicious.


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## suprfast (Aug 15, 2010)

I have quite a few vegetarian and vegan friends.  Some do it for the animals, others do it for environmental impact reasons. I see no problem with them doing it.  It irritates me when people get mad at vegetarians and vegans because they do not eat meat, but at the same time it irritates me when they(vegs and vegans) do the same.


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## Purecutting (Apr 25, 2011)

My wife and I are vegan. We have a six month of baby! Which we are raising vegan! He eats organic vegan soy formula  plus we make our own organic baby food for him! He is healthy and gaining weight! We work closely with his doctor in making sure his diet it perfect!


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## Built (Apr 25, 2011)

He'll be deficient in B-12 and EPA/DHA. Be sure to supplement those; flax oil won't cut it, he'll need actual EPA/DHA or his brain won't develop properly. Invest in algae-based, it's expensive relative to fish oil, but you're vegan so that's not an option. 

Be careful with the soy - not only does it suppress testosterone, its metabolism competes with the thyroid for iodine. I don't think I'd want to feed a child soy, much less a male child.


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## Marat (Apr 25, 2011)

Purecutting said:


> My wife and I are vegan. We have a six month of baby! Which we are raising vegan! He eats organic vegan soy formula  plus we make our own organic baby food for him! He is healthy and gaining weight! We work closely with his doctor in making sure his diet it perfect!



Please have your wife breastfeed your baby, if you're not doing so already. 

I'm not going to get ideological or really bother defending my point but I figured I would be remiss to not throw in my two cents.


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## Built (Apr 25, 2011)

Nice catch, Marat. I thought it, but hoped perhaps he meant the infant formula was a supplement. If these guys are so vegan they don't believe in breastfeeding, they don't deserve to have a baby.


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## Jodi (Apr 25, 2011)

OMG!  Yeah, do not feed your baby soy.  Breastfeed.  It's your wifes own milk and there is no reason what so ever that you shouldn't be breastfeeding. 

There are so many things wrong with this I don't even know where to begin.

I agree Built, if they didn't breastfeed and are feeding him soy formula instead they don't deserve to be parents.


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## Marat (Apr 25, 2011)

Purecutting, how do you define the term "organic"? That is, when you say you are making "organic baby food", what makes it organic?

I'll cut to the chase and mention that if you are buying the foods from a grocery store, you would be well served to ensure that they aren't being sprayed with organophosphates and shit like that. You would be well served ask the grocery manager where the food is grown and what happens to it each step of the way. Even if you are purchasing it from the "organic" sections of Whole Foods or places like that, they are still generally getting blasted with organophosphates, etc. 

I don't particularly mind GMO food at the moment, but you might as well verify the food your are buying is treated in the way you think it is. "Organic" is not a regulated term. 

If you're getting your food straight from a grower that doesn't spray anything, then that's nice. I've heard some decent arguments against 'pesticeded'/GMO food -- so as an adult, go nuts. The same rules do not apply for your child.

You should reconsider your feeding and consider solely breastfeeding your kid until he's about a year old. You can get a breast pump for your wife and store excess milk in the freezer. 

For the sake of the kid, I urge you to reconsider as it doesn't sound like you are doing any breastfeeding at the moment. Step outside of your comfort zone and check out the research in favor of breastfeeding.


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## Purecutting (Apr 26, 2011)

How do you get off telling us we don't deserve a kid! Do you hold a phd! His doctors are fine with him being raised vegan! Is it because I different beliefs then you! I don't see how you can judge weather or not I can have a kid I have nothing but the best intention for my son!


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## Marat (Apr 26, 2011)

Can you enlighten me on why you feel that breastfeeding is not the route you chose to take with your baby?


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## Purecutting (Apr 26, 2011)

We tried breast feeding and he rejected it we bought a breast pump and he still wouldn't take even through a bottle


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## Marat (Apr 26, 2011)

It's common for babies to reject breast milk and it's also common for babies to reject the nipple on a bottle, especially if it's introduced before a month or two old. 

What kind of strategies has your pediatrician offered in order to perhaps help your baby take?


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